All Episodes Discussion

[cooksdelight]

Tonight’s case... the podiatrist convicted of killing his wife... OMG.....

Mr. Cooks said when he was telling the investigator that they made love, and it was wonderful, etc., “Oh, that is total bullshit, he’s making it up. Too vivid and graphic about where they did it, when, how.”

I think he’s guilty, and the fact she was in the water screwed up the time of death. If anyone had been in the neighborhood that didn’t belong there, the security cameras at the gate would have caught them.

And we wished the prosecutor had asked the neighbor if he walks the same time every day. It seemed too convenient that he saw someone that might have been Sam. Again, if someone was in the neighborhood that didn’t belong there, the camera would have caught their vehicle. Same as if a prowler had been there, as her mother wrote.

[RedheadZombie]

On ‎10‎/‎7‎/‎2017 at 10:09 AM, truebluesmoky said:

I thought Curtis was guilty until the EMT explained why her arms were raised. Once that issue was accounted for, I started thinking about the whole picture and came to the conclusion that he probably didn’t kill her. If he had killed her the night before, then when he left to drop the older kids off at school, he was knowingly leaving his 4 year old son home alone. Even if the child was in bed, I just don’t believe a dad of four would do that. While Curtis was gone, the child could have hurt himself, set the house on fire, messed with the mom’s body, etc. I just don’t think he would have left the child home alone, especially if he was concerned enough to take the child to his grandmother’s once he got home. I also think that the fact that it was Valentine’s Day makes it less likely that the older kids were having false or influenced memories about their mom from that morning. Because they had cards and valentine boxes and all that makes it unlikely they would have mixed the morning up with a different morning. Also, it sounds like Cory ran the house... I have a hard time believing a flustered Curtis who had killed his wife the night before and probably not slept after that could successfully make breakfast and help the kids get all their stuff ready for school on a day that wasn’t even quite the normal routine because of Valentine’s Day if it wasn’t his habit to be in charge of the morning routine. I think this is a case of the defendant not being particularly likeable but being innocent. She probably did die of something related to her liver/alcohol exacerbated by her weakened immune system. The daughter probably never got over how quickly her dad moved on and replaced her mother twice - as the oldest and a 12 year old girl at the time her mother died, it would certainly have a different effect on her than the younger boys. So when faced with police telling her that her mom was murdered, I can see her getting confused and not trusting her memory and not knowing what to think.

Dad of four O.J. Simpson left his two young children home alone when he butchered their mother.  It was sheer luck that the children weren't the ones who discovered the dead bodies.  He had no concern about his children.

[RedheadZombie]

Re:  At the Bottom of the Pool -

I really need these narrators to stop with the hyperbole.  Every dead woman is beautiful.  But this woman tonight is incredibly beautiful.  This sets my brain off in such a way I'm irritated by the entire show.  First off, she's not incredibly beautiful, she's attractive.  Second of all, it gives the impression that a beautiful women's death is so much more horrific than an unattractive one.  When men are murdered, their looks are not salivated over like women (on these shows).

The FIL tries to frame the "stupid" dog.  Fuck off old man.

Too odd that a French woman who can't pronounce her "H"s would name her daughter an H name.

I can't stand people who pimp out their kids.  A baby is the "the perfect TV star"?  How ridiculous.  She was treated like a prop by a mother who couldn't make a living as a model or singer, and an indulgent, but just as negligent father.  The baby's one year birthday was absolutely revolting.  She is not a goddess, she's a little baby.  Samira was a budget Kris Jenner.

Edited October 14, 2017 by RedheadZombie
Words

[Lizzing]

40 minutes ago, RedheadZombie said:

Second of all, it gives the impression that a beautiful women's death is so much more horrific than an unattractive one. 

I can't watch On The Case with Paula Zahn for that very reason.  She's all over how damn gorgeous every murder victim is, as though that makes the crime noteworthy or more tragic.  Drives me up a damn wall.

So, between this Florida podiatrist and the one who tried to hire a hit man to off his wife and rough up medicare/medicaid investigators in NY state, does Dateline have a fixation on the profession, or is podiatry attracting some big scoundrels lately?  Admittedly, I have no experience with podiatrists, beyond watching Bob & Margaret, and I don't remember Margaret offing Bob at the end of that series. ;)

[biakbiak]

I think he is guilty but I don't believe the prosecutor didn't read the letter before she read it in court.

[cooksdelight]

3 hours ago, biakbiak said:

I think he is guilty but I don't believe the prosecutor didn't read the letter before she read it in court.

What the hell was she thinking, that letter gave him huge grounds for appeal. But again, they need to show camera evidence of someone coming into the gated neighborhood. And that house had to have had cameras all around. Which, I’m guessing he cut off when he killed her.

5 hours ago, RedheadZombie said:

Re:  At the Bottom of the Pool -

I really need these narrators to stop with the hyperbole.  Every dead woman is beautiful.  But this woman tonight is incredibly beautiful.  This sets my brain off in such a way I'm irritated by the entire show.  First off, she's not incredibly beautiful, she's attractive.  Second of all, it gives the impression that a beautiful women's death is so much more horrific than an unattractive one.  When men are murdered, their looks are not salivated over like women (on these shows).

The FIL tries to frame the "stupid" dog.  Fuck off old man.

Too odd that a French woman who can't pronounce her "H"s would name her daughter an H name.

I can't stand people who pimp out their kids.  A baby is the "the perfect TV star"?  How ridiculous.  She was treated like a prop by a mother who couldn't make a living as a model or singer, and an indulgent, but just as negligent father.  The baby's one year birthday was absolutely revolting.  She is not a goddess, she's a little baby.  Samira was a budget Kris Jenner.

You sound just like my husband, he was saying the very same things while the show was on.

[biakbiak]

24 minutes ago, cooksdelight said:

But again, they need to show camera evidence of someone coming into the gated neighborhood. And that house had to have had cameras all around.

The cameras only appeared to be at the gate allowing cars in, as a teenager myself and my friends snuck in and out of gated communities defying curfews and people not wanting their parents to know there were having  parties in their absence enough to know it's really very easy and crimes are committed by outsiders into gated communities all the time that aren't documented by cameras. This neighborhood didn't even appear to have a guard station at the gate which indicates even more lax security than many.

Also curious who was driving the handyman's car. The son was only 14 but the person who got out of the car to get buzzed in got out of the backseat righthand side. There is clearly a third person in the car driving and wearing white and  the son, also wearing white, is seated in the front passenger seat. Seems weird he wasn't mentioned or questioned. There is also a car waiting behind him to be buzzed in so one wonders about the due diligence accounting for every person in every car coming and going that morning and ruling out everyone who lived in the neighborhood. Again,I think he is guilty but there are legit questions about the case and I do find the golf club which only had touch DNA and no blood or hair and being ruled out as the murder weapon being found only after the informant mentioned it propped up so prominently inthe bedroom when police had already searched that tacky ass house numerous times questionable.

[JudyObscure]

6 hours ago, RedheadZombie said:

I really need these narrators to stop with the hyperbole.  Every dead woman is beautiful.  But this woman tonight is incredibly beautiful.  This sets my brain off in such a way I'm irritated by the entire show.  First off, she's not incredibly beautiful, she's attractive.  Second of all, it gives the impression that a beautiful women's death is so much more horrific than an unattractive one.  When men are murdered, their looks are not salivated over like women (on these shows).

 

55 minutes ago, biakbiak said:

tacky ass house

Yes, yes, yes!  I'm so used to all the incredibly beautiful women being murdered that when they failed to call a victim that a few episodes ago I was hurt and insulted on her behalf.  I really have no idea if last night's woman was beautiful because she was usually so overloaded with faux jeweled clothes and head dresses I never though I was really seeing her. The baby was very pretty but so rarely smiling, I wondered if her loving mother was sedating her somehow in order to keep her docile while she was dressed in those ridiculous outfits and paraded through the streets.

I could have watched an hour of footage of that tacky house.  Where on earth do they buy crap like that?

[cooksdelight]

1 hour ago, JudyObscure said:

Where on earth do they buy crap like that?

It’s Florida. There are tons of estate sales with tacky stuff like that so there’s bound to be stores selling it there.

[AZChristian]

When they showed the video of the inside of the house, I said to Mr. AZC, "That looks like the set they use on Trinity Broadcast Network."

Tacky doesn't even begin to describe it.  And WHERE does one buy a $1,500 pacifier?

Medicare rip-off artists.

And I wondered if the "prowler" was one of the doctor's girlfriends, sneaking out of one of the many entrances.

Edited October 14, 2017 by AZChristian

[cooksdelight]

1 hour ago, AZChristian said:

And I wondered if the "prowler" was one of the doctor's girlfriends, sneaking out of one of the many entrances.

Ohhh, that’s a good thought, it probably was.

These are pricy pacifiers, but....

https://marketplace.secondlife.com/p/Pacifier-Ruby-Redblack-Truest-Blood/1269354?id=1269354&slug=Pacifier-Ruby-Redblack-Truest-Blood

[teebax]

This may sound awful, but this is one of the rare times when I think children are better off without their parents. Both of them seem vile to me. Your daughter is a child, not a meal ticket. And he was financing that bullshit and indulging her with stolen money. I hated both of them. I hope their girls are with a relative who has some sense.

I generally don't care how people blow their money, but he was stealing from all of us so he could have 80 cars, four houses, and tons of gaudy furniture.  He should've been caught for Medicare fraud much sooner than all this happened. As far as I'm concerned, he should rot in jail if only for the Medicare fraud. It pisses me off because he would've been successful anyway without being a thief. There's so much greed, and it sickens me.

Edited October 16, 2017 by teebax

[AZChristian]

Just now, teebax said:

This may sound awful, but this is one of the rare times when I think children are better off without their parents. Both of them seem vile to me. Your daughter is a child, not a meal ticket. And he was financing that bullshit and indulging her with stolen money. I hated both of them. I hope their girls are with a relative who has some sense.

I generally don't care how people blow their money, but he was stealing from all of us so he couldn't have 80 cars, four houses, and tons of gaudy furniture.  He should've been caught for Medicare fraud much sooner than all this happened. As far as I'm concerned, he should rot in jail if only for the Medicare fraud. It pisses me off because he would've been successful anyway without being a thief. There's so much greed, and it sickens me.

If I'm not mistaken, the voice-over said they were living with an aunt/uncle, and living a very different lifestyle.  

I agree with you - the fact that he was buying those cars and houses WITH OUR MONEY makes it hard to drag up an ounce of sympathy for him or his wife.  Surely she knew something was going on.  Those offices where he practiced were not "Beverly Hills Plastic Surgeon" plush places.  I suspect he opened the second office in Georgia so he could double his income more easily.

[sinycalone]

I agree with all of you:  he was guilty.  However, all of the weaknesses in the case and presentation made me shake my head..  But then again, I'm wondering if we really heard all of the evidence/facts the prosecution offered.  That jury didn't waste any time deliberating!  

Sooo....no one thought about Medicare fraud when a podiatrist had two offices (and not lavish, as others pointed out)....but had so freaking many cars, houses, etc?  The inside of their primary home was absolutely bizarre.-- and creepy.  

Yep, the girls are better off away from those self-indulgent, greedy, totally self-centered parents.

[Tipsymcstagger]

This is one of the first stories where I actively disliked both the suspect AND the victim. Between the vile exploitation of her child and the ridiculous over the top fame-whoring - I found it pretty gross. And I agree about the attractive thing. She was striking for sure. But tbh (and at the risk of going to hell in a hand basket) for the first few minutes of the story when they talked about her background I truly though they were going to say she was born a boy. And her husband proves the credo that ANYONE who wears Ed Hardy is a complete and utter douche.  I just hope the little ones aren’t completely scarred by all of this.

[bubbls]

I watched the Rusty Sneiderman one yesterday. Hemi Neumann killed him at a daycare. Aside from Hemi being the shooter, holy cow, that wife was guilty as sin! I've never seen such a bad liar. And fugly as sin as well. Hemi wasn't a bad looking guy, so what he saw in her....I'm clueless. She certainly wasn't worth throwing himself on the sword for, which I believe he did.

 

Ok, I'm wading out of the shallow end. I'm beginning to play a game with these crimes. At the beginning of each episode I predict there will be an affair. If the wife is cheating she's convinced her luvvah her husband is abusing her or the kids. If the husband is cheating he does it for the insurance $$ so he can start a new life with his young lovely.  

[AZChristian]

I've always assumed that Mrs. Sneiderman was teaching Hemi things that he had never learned before. It's the only way that she could attract him. She was not good looking, inside or out. 

 Whenever a show comes on with a crime that I had not yet been aware of, I tend to Google early in the episode to find out "who done it," because I like to watch the police process as it unfolds. 

[ridethemaverick]

The only person I liked was the handyman, because as an avid true crime viewer, I imagine I too would likely refuse to move or touch an obviously dead body. 

The husband and wife were tacky and greedy, the best friend gave me really bad vibes, the dad was full of it, and the supporting players seemed to be enamored of the doc and his (funny) money.

Given the evidence we saw in the show, I wouldn't have been able to convict because there seemed to be reasonable doubt. But I'm sure Dateline left out a lot.

[bubbls]

57 minutes ago, AZChristian said:

I've always assumed that Mrs. Sneiderman was teaching Hemi things that he had never learned before. It's the only way that she could attract him. She was not good looking, inside or out. 

 

 

Haha! I thought the same thing. As ugly as she was in every way she must've been a hot potato in other ways. 

[hoosiermom]

I would have had a hard time convicting the doctor on evidence presented too. Not saying he was innocent....

Edited October 14, 2017 by hoosiermom

[teebax]

1 hour ago, ridethemaverick said:

The only person I liked was the handyman, because as an avid true crime viewer, I imagine I too would likely refuse to move or touch an obviously dead body. 

The husband and wife were tacky and greedy, the best friend gave me really bad vibes, the dad was full of it, and the supporting players seemed to be enamored of the doc and his (funny) money.

Given the evidence we saw in the show, I wouldn't have been able to convict because there seemed to be reasonable doubt. But I'm sure Dateline left out a lot.

I could relate to the handyman. He's a black man in Florida who found the body of a rich woman. I don't blame him a bit for not touching her.

[cooksdelight]

3 hours ago, ridethemaverick said:

 

The only person I liked was the handyman, because as an avid true crime viewer, I imagine I too would likely refuse to move or touch an obviously dead body.

 

This, a hundred times. And the friend who said if he could, he’d have strangled her to death. No one who’s guilty talks like that, but it gave the detectives an insight into what kind of shrew she was. And why her husband wouldn’t hesitate.

[glowbug]

I haven't seen the latest episode but I had to weigh in on the Curtis Lovelace one. 

I lean towards the camp that he didn't do it mostly because the kids saw their mother in the morning, which means the state's theory of the crime was wrong, and her hands had been moved by the EMT, which explains the weird position they were in (also the fact that they could move her hands means rigor mortis hadn't set in further disproving the state's case). I think it's possible he killed her (although if he did it would have had to have been in the morning), however, even if he did the state didn't prove it beyond a reasonable doubt so I think the acquittal was the right decision. 

I don't think the fact that Cori was an alcoholic was in dispute. Even her mom didn't deny it and admitted she drank. She was also bulimic and had been suffering from the disease for many years (mother confirmed it). Bulimia can cause sudden death so if it wasn't murder then I believe that might have been the reason she died, probably in conjunction with the alcoholism. I also think the daughter had an ax to grind with her dad, which is why she later changed her story to not being able to remember seeing her mother that morning. She told the police at the time and then when they questioned her again in college that she had seen her mother that morning. I trust those recollections more. That said, I can understand why she is having issues with her father. She lived in a very dysfunctional and conflict ridden household for the first twelve years of her life (both parents were alcoholics and there was horrible fighting between them), and probably also witnessed some of the dysfunction between her father and his second wife. Then her father chose to send her away to live with relatives when she didn't get along with wife number two. I'm sure she has a lot of issues from her childhood and I hope she's dealing with them in therapy.

Curtis Lovelace, regardless of whether he killed Cori, obviously has psychological issues. He is an admitted alcoholic and the speed at which he remarried shows he has emotional problems. His first two wives both had serious mental issues (Cori being an alcoholic and bulimic and the second wife being off her rocker) and he picked them so that says something about him too.

I didn't have an issue with the third wife adopting the children though. Adoption is a wonderful thing when the biological parent can't be there for a child for whatever reason (death in this case). If the third wife loves the kids and is not abusive or neglectful, and the children agreed to the adoption (the older ones probably had to give their consent) then I don't see the issue. It also gives wife number three some legal entitlements. For example, if Curtis had been convicted then she might have lost custody of the boys had she not adopted them. 

Edited October 15, 2017 by glowbug

[Ohmo]

I'm not saying that Adam Frosh is a great guy, but I also don't believe that he was proven guilty.

The golf club, which they already said had no blood or hair on it.  If he had killed Samra, he's not going to take the golf club with him?  Right.  If it had been the weapon and he had used it, he could have dumped it in any lake, pond, or wherever on his way out of town.  Plus, it was dusty, which meant that no one had used it for anything.  I believe a prowler is a possibility (and I'm frankly floored that Adam was actually taken into custody after that revelation.  I figured that piece of information would void the entire proceeding.)

But you know what else?  A part of me believes that it could have been a fluky accident.   I heard what the prosecutor said, but there was crap all over that pool deck.  What if she did stumble and hit her head, try and right herself, and stumble again?  The lack of rigor or wrinkling is big for me.  I think that points to her only being in the pool for minutes, which means we've got an intruder who just managed to miss the handyman or a fluky accident of some kind, which have been known to happen.  I also believe the neighbor, so unless the prosecutors can prove to me that someone else was driving Adam's car, I remain unconvinced that he did it, and I'm certainly unconvinced with the evidence that was presented.  I didn't even think the case was that strong before the letter was read.  It came across as the DA thought Adam was an asshole and decided to charge him with murder.  An asshole he may be, but that's not evidence.

Edited October 14, 2017 by Ohmo

[ari333]

Did you guys see the one with the atty killed, Melissa IIRC. Her best friend's husband was found guilty? I think the ponzi guy did it.

[LadyHam]

22 hours ago, RedheadZombie said:

Dad of four O.J. Simpson left his two young children home alone when he butchered their mother.  It was sheer luck that the children weren't the ones who discovered the dead bodies.  He had no concern about his children.

I think OJ is as guilty as they come. I've read numerous books on the case. I've only heard this little tidbit in one of the books on the case, I think it was the book written by his former agent who stood by him for many years, but now believes he's guilty. Anyway, I don't know if it's really true or not, but he wrote in his book that OJ was under the impression that the children had stayed the night with Nicole's parents. It was theorized that is why he picked that particular night of all nights. 

22 hours ago, RedheadZombie said:

Dad of four O.J. Simpson left his two young children home alone when he butchered their mother.  It was sheer luck that the children weren't the ones who discovered the dead bodies.  He had no concern about his children.

[LittleIggy]

22 hours ago, RedheadZombie said:

Re:  At the Bottom of the Pool -

I really need these narrators to stop with the hyperbole.  Every dead woman is beautiful.  But this woman tonight is incredibly beautiful.  This sets my brain off in such a way I'm irritated by the entire show.  First off, she's not incredibly beautiful, she's attractive.  Second of all, it gives the impression that a beautiful women's death is so much more horrific than an unattractive one.  When men are murdered, their looks are not salivated over like women (on these shows).

 

Thank you. They do the same thing on “Inside Edition.” It drives me nuts.

[Ohmo]

4 hours ago, glowbug said:

Adoption is a wonderful thing

Adoption is indeed a wonderful thing.  The concept of adoption doesn't bug me.  This specific adoption bugs me.   As has been stated, Christine is the third wife.  Curtis was also married to second wife Erica for five years.  Not an insignificant amount of time, and she also had a child.  Yet, there was no discussion or mention of anyone being adopted until the third marriage---by which time Lindsay had already passed the age of 18, and the two oldest boys were likely not that far behind her.  As I said upthread, it seems like an effort was made to make Cori disappear.  The adoption has the feeling of being a maneuver or an angle of some kind...not a genuine act,  Something is amiss in that family, and whatever Lindsay's issues may be, I find her to be more credible than either her father or Christine.

[LakeGal]

At the Bottom of the Pool

My DH immediately thought the husband was guilty when he heard the kids left dressed in their pjs.  He was sure the wife would never let those children travel like that. 

[teebax]

1 hour ago, LakeGal said:

At the Bottom of the Pool

My DH immediately thought the husband was guilty when he heard the kids left dressed in their pjs.  He was sure the wife would never let those children travel like that. 

Great point! 

[biakbiak]

That was mentioned on the show but he said she was still in bed when he left so I didn’t find it that compelling. The fact that there was a court order in place that he couldn’t be take the children anywhere and had never done so before.

[cooksdelight]

He grabbed those kids and ran with them after he killed her. My take on it, anyway. She’d never have let him in the house... and never would have let him spend the night after making love on a chair...??? LOL, that was his first blunder, making up that story. 

[Josette]

On 10/14/2017 at 6:24 AM, AZChristian said:

And I wondered if the "prowler" was one of the doctor's girlfriends, sneaking out of one of the many entrances.

 I thought the husband might be the prowler.  He wasn't living at the house anymore.  

[JudyObscure]

12 hours ago, ari333 said:

Did you guys see the one with the atty killed, Melissa IIRC. Her best friend's husband was found guilty? I think the ponzi guy did it.

When Tony's son testified about all the hate he had for Melissa I began to think he might have done it.  Anyone nasty enough to say he didn't like flies on his meat is weird and hateful enough to blame a wife's friend for ruining his marriage.  How many times do we hear people blame their spouse's friends for leading them astray?

However, I  agree with you that the smarmy Ponzi guy could well have done it.   What if Melissa had discovered the scheme and was going to go to the authorities?  I was sorry the office manager got so much time when she was probably afraid to refuse to sign the fake loans.  He might have killed her if she had refused.  Billions of dollars lost and facing jail time would be  a serious motivation for murder.  Just looking at that guy with his big cigar stuck in his fat face made me want to blame him for stuff.

[biakbiak]

2 hours ago, cooksdelight said:

He grabbed those kids and ran with them after he killed her. My take on it, anyway. She’d never have let him in the house... and never would have let him spend the night after making love on a chair...??? LOL, that was his first blunder, making up that story. 

Well since they never mentioned him coming by earlier in the morning she clearly did let him in the house.

[ari333]

ponzi guy had way more motive than other guy being mad at his ex's friend. Plus something about him.... i think she knew about ponzi and was going to tell. He has enough money and clout to make stuff happen.. And he was a little too "there" paying for things and the funeral. bah. 

[ari333]

I never know whether to believe the jail snitches. I know they get bored, but would the dr be that stupid to tell someone he did it and to go get the golf clubs? And the dude didn't even get the clubs. I think the husband  did it, but the jail guy did not convince ,me. Other stuff did.

Edited October 15, 2017 by ari333

[cooksdelight]

34 minutes ago, ari333 said:

I never know whether to believe the jail snitches. I know they get bored, but would the dr be that stupid to tell someone he did it and to go get the golf clubs? And the dude didn't even get the clubs. I think the husband  did it, but the jail guy did not convince ,me. Other stuff did.

It was recorded, wasn’t it? Or am I getting my cases mixed up? I will never understand the stupidity of some people.

[Ohmo]

8 hours ago, biakbiak said:

That was mentioned on the show but he said she was still in bed when he left so I didn’t find it that compelling

I agree, and in terms of the court order, if they had supposedly agreed that he could take them, who's to say that he trusted her to keep her word and thus had no qualms about leaving with the kids? She would have to be the one to report a violation of the order, and if they had come to an understanding the night before, there's no reason for him to have thought that she wouldn't honor that and just left.

The PJs thing is a non-starter for me.  That's a total "dad" move, particularly if he's trying just to get the kids out of Mom's hair because it's easy.  Just get the kids in the car and go.  I remember a couple of those trips as a kid, and my dad wasn't guilty of anything.  He was just a dad.  No one's gonna look sideways at a 1 year-old and 3-year old in their PJs.  He ended up at his beach house.  (My trips usually involved doughnuts or Mickey D's, but I digress.)  If they were headed to the beach house, maybe it was likely that they'd end up in the water.  So, why not take the kids in their PJs and then change them into swimsuits at the beach house?  Less work, which is usually another "Dad" choice.

Edited October 15, 2017 by Ohmo

[partofme]

I was convinced the husband was guilty but was surprised they arrested him on the evidence they had.    She was a really unlikeable victim.

[UsernameFatigue]

I fell asleep during the episode on the podiatrist and his wife, so may have missed some important info. But agree with others who have posted as to how unlikable they both were. I kept wondering about the footage that Dateline continued to show of the two of them. Most of it appeared to be taken in Las Vegas. But who was taking it, and why? Did they have someone follow them with a camera to make it appear that they were being followed by paparazzi - as if they were famous? Very bizarre. 

And yes, Dateline was OTT as to how beautiful she was. Without all the make up and ridiculous clothes, I doubt she would get a second look. In the mug shot they showed, she looked like any other person usually looks in a mug shot. Ordinary to sub par. 

Hubby and I both laughed when (I think it was his father?) bragged about  Adam's million dollar income. It was obvious that a million dollar income would not pay for his lifestyle, and he was getting his money from less than legit means. I think he likely did kill his wife (who else would have a motive?) but not sure that I could have convicted him. (Unless Dateline left a lot out of the story, which they often do). OTOH I am not at all sad that he was convicted. 

[biakbiak]

1 hour ago, cooksdelight said:

It was recorded, wasn’t it? Or am I getting my cases mixed up? I will never understand the stupidity of some people.

They didn't play any recording and I don't recall them mentioning but according to the ME the golf club wasn't the murder weapon so the story didn't add up.

 

5 minutes ago, UsernameFatigue said:

about  Adam's million dollar income.

The million dollar income was only from medicaid payments so one would assume he also had patients who weren't on Medicaid 

[UsernameFatigue]

27 minutes ago, biakbiak said:

They didn't play any recording and I don't recall them mentioning but according to the ME the golf club wasn't the murder weapon so the story didn't add up.

 

The million dollar income was only from medicaid payments so one would assume he also had patients who weren't on Medicaid 

I was referring to - was it the father? - who seemed to say his son had a million dollar income. (I could be wrong as I did fall asleep). That is when hubby and I laughed as several houses, dozens of cars, etc. did not come from a million dollar income.  Wasn't it after that that Dateline talked about the medicaid fraud? And that he was billing for seeing two people at the same time, etc.? Which was my point - his income was obviously (quite a bit) more than a million dollars, and quite likely was not from legitimate means. 

Edited October 15, 2017 by UsernameFatigue

[AZChristian]

26 minutes ago, biakbiak said:

The million dollar income was only from medicaid payments so one would assume he also had patients who weren't on Medicaid 

My thought process was the opposite - the (legitimate) million dollar income was more likely from non-Medicare/Medicaid patients.  A LOT more than a million a year was being billed to the government.  Someone on the show said that he'd have had to be seeing two patients at a time, 24/7/365 to have that level of Medicare billings.

[cooksdelight]

What is it with podiatrists and Medicaid fraud? I went to one in Richmond who ended up being indicted for the same thing.

[rwgrab]

On 10/14/2017 at 3:16 AM, biakbiak said:

Also curious who was driving the handyman's car. The son was only 14 but the person who got out of the car to get buzzed in got out of the backseat righthand side. There is clearly a third person in the car driving and wearing white and  the son, also wearing white, is seated in the front passenger seat.

Yeah, I had that same question about who was with the handyman.  Who else was in that car?  For me, that makes it less likely that anybody from that group did it, though.  The father and the son could definitely be covering for each other, but is there really a random co-worker out there who wouldn't have turned on them if something had happened in the 10 minutes between the gate and the house?

The gate that they showed didn't look like an impenetrable fortress to me, but it did leave me wondering how the handyman was allowed in if Sam was already dead at that point.  If they just took down the license plate and let the car in, then there could be other cars who came in that same way who would have then had access to the house without being "suspicious" vehicles that came through the gate that day.  If they did have an attended gate house, then did they not get an answer when calling Sam but let the car in anyway?  In those two hours we got to see what felt like hours of a baby's first birthday party which had nothing for the actual child, but they couldn't spend 30 seconds explaining that?

All that said, I'm pretty sure the husband is guilty but that the case left enough room for reasonable doubt to avoid a conviction.  The neighbor's testimony and the condition of the body would need to be explained to me to get me to vote to convict.  Maybe the prosecution did explain that and Dateline just didn't show it.  I mean, with only 90 minutes of deliberation the jury must have been pretty convinced.

I also didn't leave the story feeling all that great about the law and order side of that county in Florida.  The golf club story just seemed so made up to me.  Like they told the jailhouse snitch (who had FORTY prior felony convictions and got off with probation in exchange for his testimony??)  to say something about a golf club, then got a search warrant, then collected it, then showed Sam't touch DNA on it.  I can believe that she used that club to help reach and dust off her giant crystal zebras and stuff, but I'm not buying that somebody hit her in the head with it.  That investigator sure thought he was hot stuff for having collected a golf club MONTHS after they searched the house.  Nice work, ace!  And then the prosecutor saying "oh, I totally didn't read this letter before after the conviction, whoops!".  Sorry, not buying it.  

[Ohmo]

7 hours ago, AZChristian said:

My thought process was the opposite - the (legitimate) million dollar income was more likely from non-Medicare/Medicaid patients.

I thought he was making more than a million dollars legitimately.  There were allegations of fraud, but didn't Dateline also say that he had pioneered (or been involved with) the development of some sort of skin-grafting technique?  I figured he got a chunk of change from that and he gambled.  So, I think his income was a combination of legit funds, gambling, and fraud---but it had to be somewhere in the tens of millions a year if he was able to collect actual cars like children collect toy ones.

[LakeGal]

Oh he was so wonderful to the woman that also had a child of his.  He even bought her a car.  I laughed when they said that.  He loved to car shop so that was probably fun for him.  

[glowbug]

Regarding the Florida Podiatrist:

The victim in this case was so unlikable. Exploiting her children like that is despicable. Dateline annoyed me by trying to show her actions in a positive light. I also didn't think she was at all attractive let alone beautiful but that sort of thing is subjective.

The husband was also extremely unlikable and I totally believe that he did it. His story about them reconnecting with her (making love) and her asking him to take the kids didn't sound believable in the least, especially since the kids left in their pajamas instead of being dressed to the nines. That said, from what Dateline showed us, I don't know that I would have convicted him. The jailhouse snitch wasn't credible at all. He had a motive to lie in favor of the prosecution since they were letting him out of jail because of his testimony. The story he claimed the husband told him wasn't supported by the evidence either. The club only had touch DNA, which would be expected since the clubs were hers, and the medical examiner testified that a club wasn't consistent with the injuries she sustained. The neighbor's testimony and the fact that her body didn't show signs of being in the water long needed to be explained. I believe there is an explanation because I think the husband did it, but the prosecution would need to give me something for a conviction. The neighbor may have been confused about the dates but the lack of wrinkling needs explaining. 

Edited October 18, 2017 by glowbug

[The Closer]

When they went on about how the French don't pronounce the letter "h", I really thought it was a setup to a joke about how Samira therefore told everyone she lived in Talla "Assie".  I guess I'm really in touch with my inner 12 year old.