S04.E09: Rubicon

[paulvdb]

Quote

Captain Burnham and the U.S.S. Discovery race to stop Book and Ruon Tarka from launching a rogue plan that could inadvertently endanger the galaxy.

Premiere date: February 17, 2022

[thuganomics85]

Cool seeing Nhan again, even though it sounds like she is only sticking around for this episode.  I kind of like the idea of having a crew member who initially started out on another ship and captain (Enterprise and Pike), and seeing them trying to fit in with the Discovery crew that has been here since the beginning.  Hope she comes back at some point.  I did get a kick out of them giving her a new, simpler breathing apparatus, because I wouldn't be surprised if that was a case of Rachel Ancheril not wanting to wear that stuff around her mouth again.  Reminds me of The Next Generation films when they gave Geordi contacts because Levar Burton was likely sick of that damn visor!

Other than that, no real surprises here.  I knew Booker wasn't going to die and no way that they were going to have Michael actually give that order to do so.  And as soon as we saw Booker was coming around to her deal, I knew Tarka was going to screw all that up.  Honestly, after his first rebellious act (shooting torpedos with the intent to do actual damage), Booker really should have just locked him out of the console or something.  And in the end, it looks like no one came out ahead and they're probably just pissed off this mysterious alien species.

At least Reno got mentioned this time, even if she was still off screen.

Continue to be strangely invested in Saru pursuing an actual relationship with President T'Rina.  Glad Culber was around to prevent him from ending it before it actually began! 

[paigow]

That power source was a hologram? Or some other decoy / projection? Maybe the kid that caused The Burn constantly generates huge amounts of Boronite. Ship him off across the barrier as Federation Emissary...

[ottoDbusdriver]

This show could be about a half hour long if they removed all the passing reaction shots of each and every bridge crew member after every time Burnham says something.

"Let's Fly" is just not working. Please quit trying to make it catch on.

The episode was just confusing.

Targa wants the DMA controller power supply so he can return to his universe -- when is someone going to tell him that Discovery can already do that.

[cdnalor]

1 hour ago, ottoDbusdriver said:

Targa wants the DMA controller power supply so he can return to his universe -- when is someone going to tell him that Discovery can already do that

Everyone's waiting for Michael to say it first, she's the only one allowed to solve things.  Maybe Saru can feed her a leading question, but that's it.

[DrScottie]

14 hours ago, thuganomics85 said:

Other than that, no real surprises here.  I knew Booker wasn't going to die and no way that they were going to have Michael actually give that order to do so.  And as soon as we saw Booker was coming around to her deal, I knew Tarka was going to screw all that up.  Honestly, after his first rebellious act (shooting torpedos with the intent to do actual damage), Booker really should have just locked him out of the console or something.  And in the end, it looks like no one came out ahead and they're probably just pissed off this mysterious alien species.

Seriously, Michael, as if Tarka was going to agree that whole wait a week deal. While Book might escape more serious charges, Tarka stole a spore drive and fired a volley of quantum torpedoes. He's in deep trouble. 

Hell, I would have locked him out after he installed that security system.

I remember when Nhan was the one to eject Airiam from an airlock after she was taken over when Michael couldn't bring herself to it. That could be why they sent her as Michael has a soft spot for that. If it weren't for the storyline, the two of them are freaking dead. 

[MissLucas]

15 hours ago, thuganomics85 said:

Continue to be strangely invested in Saru pursuing an actual relationship with President T'Rina.  Glad Culber was around to prevent him from ending it before it actually began! 

That's not strange at all. It's the most interesting plot right now.

Burnham's eye rolling whenever the President is not simply giving her free reign to do whatever she pleases is getting really old. It makes the character look petulant and childish. 

[tennisgurl]

2 hours ago, MissLucas said:

Burnham's eye rolling whenever the President is not simply giving her free reign to do whatever she pleases is getting really old. It makes the character look petulant and childish. 

Its like the show is going for "does what's right no matter what the cost and what authority figures say" but they're ending up with "petulant teenager who keeps stealing her moms car and scraping it up". Especially because the president has been a mostly reasonable person who has legit reasons for what she does, even if Michael thinks her plans cramp her style. At least when Kirk when regularly decide to break protocols, he wasn't rolling his eyes right in the presidents face while he did it. 

Congrats Tarka, you accomplished nothing other then possibly escalating the problem and getting on The Federations shit list. Who probably would have tried to help you get home if you had just asked. 

Get it Saru!

[paigow]

Book is the only person that knows about Mirror!Tarka... But maybe it is Mirror213... That is, nothing to do with Mirror!Lorca

[Chyromaniac]

On 2/18/2022 at 6:33 AM, ottoDbusdriver said:

Targa wants the DMA controller power supply so he can return to his universe -- when is someone going to tell him that Discovery can already do that.

Tarka designed the second spore drive- presumably he should know that the technology can potentially jump between universes.  Regardless, I would agree that the show should have had him explain why that’s not possible In this case.  For instance, have him say that they could go to the Mirrorverse because they knew how to lock on to it- but he doesn’t know the right spore frequency (or signature or whatever) for where he wants to go.  He only knows what his other pal did, and that it requires a DMA-size power source to work.  Speaking of which- at this point, I’m ready to predict that 

Spoiler

by the finale, they’ll reveal that Tarka had somehow lured the DMA to this galaxy to get the power supply, and that he’s ultimately responsible for the destruction of Kweijan as a result.

Otherwise, I’m pretty happy with this one.  I liked the showdown between Michael and Book, with Tarka and Nahn as the voices in their ears.  It also felt like another solid week for the bridge crew - it’s interesting to hear everyone continue to discuss the ethical questions surrounding the DMA.  With an episode called Rubicon, it’s expected that someone would cross a line - I’m amused to see Tarka’s move blow up in his face so spectacularly.  He didn’t get what he wanted, and the DMA was replaced almost immediately.  Very curious to see what comes next.

Edited February 19, 2022 by Chyromaniac

[Joimiaroxeu]

Saru, go get you some. I love how Culber was all, "Boy, bye" with him. President T'Rina is gonna rock Saru's world, lol.

Ditto comments upthread, AFAIC "Let's fly" needs to be jettisoned into the nearest black hole.

My favorite comment from reddit:

Quote

I love how book and Tarka's big plan ended up being completely useless - "We'll destroy the DMA and I can go home!"
10c: Hey our roomba just stopped working
10c: Factory reset
10c: There we go!

[Chit Chat]

On 2/18/2022 at 6:33 AM, ottoDbusdriver said:

This show could be about a half hour long if they removed all the passing reaction shots of each and every bridge crew member after every time Burnham says something.

"Let's Fly" is just not working. Please quit trying to make it catch on.

The episode was just confusing.

Yes. Yes. And yes!!  I've hated "let's fly" from the get-go.  How about, "let's kick ass?"  I'm so tired of everybody discussing their feelings too.  I'm find these episodes incredibly boring.  

[Frozendiva]

I enjoyed Saru's pursuing a relationship with T'Rina. 

Also didn't think Book was in any danger of dying. Tarka wants to go back to his Universe? Just ask and not come up with some convoluted plan that ultimately didn't work.

I did like Book and Michael's remember strategic moves they have used. Michael does need to curb her impetuousness and not roll her eyes at the President. Uh, he lets you have the ship and you are captain. You can be demoted.

Also will add my voice to the 'let's fly' not working. It has no energy, makes no sense, not engaging. Just lifeless.

[paigow]

1 hour ago, Frozendiva said:

Also will add my voice to the 'let's fly' not working. It has no energy, makes no sense, not engaging. Just lifeless.

• Jump It [Zora. play Salt N Pepa]
• Bring The Lightning
• Spin It [Zora, play Dead Or Alive]

[Chyromaniac]

I don’t mind “Let’s Fly”- but it’s really hard to just declare a catchphrase.  For some people it’s always going to feel forced.  On top of that, the show already did it- it may not be Michael’s originally, but “Black Alert” is awesome.

[Chit Chat]

34 minutes ago, Chyromaniac said:

I don’t mind “Let’s Fly”- but it’s really hard to just declare a catchphrase.

It's too wimpy, especially when you're going headfirst into a conflict.  

[MissLucas]

The fact that I've never noticed 'let's fly' as supposed catchphrase says a lot about its impact (or my attention) 😁

Edited February 20, 2022 by MissLucas

[Chyromaniac]

1 hour ago, ChitChat said:

It's too wimpy, especially when you're going headfirst into a conflict.  

For me it feels positive and hopeful- I don’t see it being any different than Picard saying “let’s see what’s out there.” No, it’s not what you’d say heading into conflict (but again, they also have “black alert” to work with) - but I also don’t get that conflict is what they are looking for.  The ship and the show are called Discovery- ideally, they’re looking to discover things (planets, peoples, creatures, scientific breakthroughs, and the like), and they’re bringing the philosophy of the Federation with them.  They’re setting out into the unknown, carrying a message of peace and cooperation- so sure, “let’s fly.”  To me that’s not wimpy, but ymmv.

[Chit Chat]

The show is becoming so focused on the exploration of everybody's feelings that it's getting to be like a soap opera to me!  I'm not in it for that.  I don't like a lot of touch-feely sentiment in Sci-Fi.  It bogs the show down.  

[paigow]

Situational catchphrases are fine... Picard is all-in, ass kicking mode, with Engage

Burnham needs a combat purposed signature that inspires the bridge crew... since we get to see ALL their reactions now

Georgiou was her mentor... seems like some lessons were unlearned / forgotten

[starri]

On 2/19/2022 at 8:05 AM, paigow said:

Book is the only person that knows about Mirror!Tarka... But maybe it is Mirror213... That is, nothing to do with Mirror!Lorca

Either Kovich or the Guardian of Forever (possibly both) said that the Mirror Universe and the Kelvinverse had drifted far enough a part to no longer allow crossovers with the Prime universe.  So wherever Tarka is from, it's not either of those.

I can't help but think the only reason we don't see Nhan more is that Rachel Ancheril has a hard time with the make-up.  Producers and audience both seem to really like her.  

I'm going to be contrary and admit that I like "Let's Fly."  

[Pallas]

Oops: Batteries Not Included. 

Why would Tarka assume that a machine made by a civilization of unimaginable technical prowess would come with a physical, pluckable power pack?

[millennium]

Probably Burnham's actions in this episode should result in her being relieved of command.   She was sent there with express orders to stop the destruction of the DMA at all costs.   Instead, she ignored duty and played lovesick girlfriend, puppy-eyeing Nhan and the crew into letting her royally botch the mission.   One half measure after another.   And this after she lost a shuttle and nearly its whole crew.

"But I know Book's a good man ..."  It is so demeaning to see a woman in command making excuses and pleading with her superiors for the guy she's sleeping with, especially when his actions demonstrate that he's not a good man.   Booker and Tarka have committed crimes against the Federation.   He and Tarka have endangered the Federation and all of its species because they deemed their personal agendas more important than anything or anyone else.   In this regard, they are no different than Tolian Soran trying to get back to the Nexus.

Booker's ship should have been destroyed while Discovery had the chance.  Star Trek has often been about hard choices.  But this show doesn't know what a hard choice is.  Apparently you can feel your way out of any situation in the 32nd century.  

Imagine Kirk letting Edith Keeler live because he "knows she's a good person."

 

Edited February 22, 2022 by millennium

[Chyromaniac]

On 2/21/2022 at 10:00 AM, starri said:

Either Kovich or the Guardian of Forever (possibly both) said that the Mirror Universe and the Kelvinverse had drifted far enough a part to no longer allow crossovers with the Prime universe.  So wherever Tarka is from, it's not either of those.

I’d have to go back and rewatch to be certain, but the impression I got was that Tarka is from this reality (he’s got the scar that shows he was an Emerald Chain slave).  However he and his scientist friend/partner somehow discovered a paradise-like universe which they could escape to.  He thinks the partner is there now- he just needs the DMA power to get there too.

20 hours ago, millennium said:

Probably Burnham's actions in this episode should result in her being relieved of command.   She was sent there with express orders to stop the destruction of the DMA at all costs.   Instead, she ignored duty and played lovesick girlfriend, puppy-eyeing Nhan and the crew into letting her royally botch the mission.   One half measure after another.   And this after she lost a shuttle and nearly its whole crew.

"But I know Book's a good man ..."  It is so demeaning to see a woman in command making excuses and pleading with her superiors for the guy she's sleeping with, especially when his actions demonstrate that he's not a good man.   Booker and Tarka have committed crimes against the Federation.   He and Tarka have endangered the Federation and all of its species because they deemed their personal agendas more important than anything or anyone else.   In this regard, they are no different than Tolian Soran trying to get back to the Nexus.

Booker's ship should have been destroyed while Discovery had the chance.  Star Trek has often been about hard choices.  But this show doesn't know what a hard choice is.  Apparently you can feel your way out of any situation in the 32nd century.  

Imagine Kirk letting Edith Keeler live because he "knows she's a good person."

 

I don’t know how Michael is responsible for the shuttle failure- honestly, I thought that was a really solid plan.  They sneak over, get on board, try to talk them down, but be ready to incapacitate.  It didn’t work because Book’s ship had a defense that she couldn’t have known about - hell, Book didn’t even know about it.

With the standoff, I guess I’m willing to cut her slack for basically the same reason.  She doesn’t know about Operation: Universe Jump- the only person who’s heard Tarka’s hidden agenda is Book.  If anything, it was Book’s responsibility to realize that he wasn’t going to agree to the delay, and take steps to neutralize him.  Instead, Book just let him monologue.  I will say that I would have preferred Tarka to pull an Ozymandias, and launch the weapon while they were negotiating - but again, that’s on Book, not Michael.  As far as hard choices- all I can say is that the season ain’t over yet.  This is just my speculation, but this whole season started with the question of whether she could let certain people die in order to save the ship.  She faced that question again this week- I don’t think it will be the last.

Edited February 22, 2022 by Chyromaniac

[paigow]

TNG!Troi had her command skills tested by ordering Holo!LaForge to certain death so Enterprise could be saved.

Not exactly the Kobayashi Maru script, but it seems like Burnham wants to save everyone, even if it kills everyone... Like a twisted version of Peacemaker

Edited February 23, 2022 by paigow

[Starchild]

 

On 2/21/2022 at 9:18 PM, millennium said:

Probably Burnham's actions in this episode should result in her being relieved of command.   She was sent there with express orders to stop the destruction of the DMA at all costs.   Instead, she ignored duty and played lovesick girlfriend, puppy-eyeing Nhan and the crew into letting her royally botch the mission.   One half measure after another.   And this after she lost a shuttle and nearly its whole crew.

"But I know Book's a good man ..."  It is so demeaning to see a woman in command making excuses and pleading with her superiors for the guy she's sleeping with, especially when his actions demonstrate that he's not a good man.   Booker and Tarka have committed crimes against the Federation.   He and Tarka have endangered the Federation and all of its species because they deemed their personal agendas more important than anything or anyone else.   In this regard, they are no different than Tolian Soran trying to get back to the Nexus.

Booker's ship should have been destroyed while Discovery had the chance.  Star Trek has often been about hard choices.  But this show doesn't know what a hard choice is.  Apparently you can feel your way out of any situation in the 32nd century.  

Imagine Kirk letting Edith Keeler live because he "knows she's a good person."

 

This. So much this.

Michael and Nhan FAILED THEIR MISSION. The one the Admiral and President said had to be accomplished AT ALL COSTS. Are there no consequences for that, for either of them? Or is it mitigated because 10C just ignored them all, "What was that, did you see the lights flicker? Ah never mind, generator kicked in."

And Book defied the Federation, putting everyone and everything at risk, for personal revenge. He's a wanted fugitive who's demonstrated that he's dangerous to the safety of all Federation people. If he doesn't end up in prison for this (or whatever the humane 29th century equivalent is), I call shenanigans. 

Ha just kidding he'll be back on the team in no time. Wonder if they'll even bother to handwave some explanation for not punishing him.

Geez, show, follow your own f'in rules.

[millennium]

8 hours ago, Starchild said:

 

This. So much this.

Michael and Nhan FAILED THEIR MISSION. The one the Admiral and President said had to be accomplished AT ALL COSTS. Are there no consequences for that, for either of them? Or is it mitigated because 10C just ignored them all, "What was that, did you see the lights flicker? Ah never mind, generator kicked in."

And Book defied the Federation, putting everyone and everything at risk, for personal revenge. He's a wanted fugitive who's demonstrated that he's dangerous to the safety of all Federation people. If he doesn't end up in prison for this (or whatever the humane 29th century equivalent is), I call shenanigans. 

Ha just kidding he'll be back on the team in no time. Wonder if they'll even bother to handwave some explanation for not punishing him.

Geez, show, follow your own f'in rules.

I was completely blown away towards the end of the episode where Burnham tries to convince Booker and Tarka to hold off for a week because the star charts show the DMA (which btw sounds like some kind of music award) wouldn't be moving on till then.  Just stand down and give us a week to make contact, Burnham pleads, and if after a week we haven't succeeded, you can go ahead with your plan ...

On my planet, this is called NEGOTIATING WITH TERRORISTS.  Is this what Starfleet has come to?  Begging the terrorists not to use their weapons?   To please give us a week and if that doesn't work, then, yeah, okay, have at it?

[Starchild]

Never mind, how do all these conversations between Michael, Nhan and Saru only take Book into account? How are they not even considering Tarka? He's already proven himself a wild card, but they never once mention the risk he poses beyond Book's own actions. 

Every time they talked about what Book would do, I kept thinking "but what about Tarka?" And what do you know, boom

Gah

[Affogato]

On 2/21/2022 at 11:00 AM, starri said:

I'm going to be contrary and admit that I like "Let's Fly."  

I don't mind it, either. Flying is freeing, I like the image.

[Affogato]

On 2/24/2022 at 3:47 AM, millennium said:

On my planet, this is called NEGOTIATING WITH TERRORISTS.  Is this what Starfleet has come to?  Begging the terrorists not to use their weapons?   To please give us a week and if that doesn't work, then, yeah, okay, have at it?

According to what I've read, when interrogating, what works is establishing a relationship of like minds and then discussing your points of contention. Negotiating with terrorists is close to an existing job title and not inherently a bad thing and it takes time, which is what Burnham is asking.  What people proudly and stubbornly refuse to do is 'give in to terrorists', that is immediately give the terrorists what they ask for, and even then that is sometimes necessary (like when cyberterrorists ask you to give them money to unlock your businesses harddrives).

[Affogato]

On 2/22/2022 at 11:02 PM, paigow said:

TNG!Troi had her command skills tested by ordering Holo!LaForge to certain death so Enterprise could be saved.

Not exactly the Kobayashi Maru script, but it seems like Burnham wants to save everyone, even if it kills everyone... Like a twisted version of Peacemaker

More work for Cronenberg

[GreyBunny]

On 2/21/2022 at 6:18 PM, millennium said:

Probably Burnham's actions in this episode should result in her being relieved of command.   She was sent there with express orders to stop the destruction of the DMA at all costs.   Instead, she ignored duty and played lovesick girlfriend, puppy-eyeing Nhan and the crew into letting her royally botch the mission.   One half measure after another.   And this after she lost a shuttle and nearly its whole crew.

"But I know Book's a good man ..."  It is so demeaning to see a woman in command making excuses and pleading with her superiors for the guy she's sleeping with, especially when his actions demonstrate that he's not a good man.   Booker and Tarka have committed crimes against the Federation.   He and Tarka have endangered the Federation and all of its species because they deemed their personal agendas more important than anything or anyone else.   In this regard, they are no different than Tolian Soran trying to get back to the Nexus.

Booker's ship should have been destroyed while Discovery had the chance.  Star Trek has often been about hard choices.  But this show doesn't know what a hard choice is.  Apparently you can feel your way out of any situation in the 32nd century.  

Imagine Kirk letting Edith Keeler live because he "knows she's a good person."

 

I would have booted her out of Starfleet. If she’s just going to be some drip who makes excuses for her criminal boyfriend and blows mission after mission because if her fee-fees, then she doesn’t belong there. Kirk, Picard, Sisko, and Janeway wouldn’t have hesitated to pull the trigger and get the job done. Burnham is a weak captain and I hate the writers for making her suck.

”Let’s Fly” ugh! Stop trying to make fetch happen!

[Paloma]

On 2/21/2022 at 9:18 PM, millennium said:

"But I know Book's a good man ..."  It is so demeaning to see a woman in command making excuses and pleading with her superiors for the guy she's sleeping with, especially when his actions demonstrate that he's not a good man.   Booker and Tarka have committed crimes against the Federation.   He and Tarka have endangered the Federation and all of its species because they deemed their personal agendas more important than anything or anyone else.

I agree that this is not a good look for a woman in command (or really anyone in command), and Burnham should not be in charge of this mission if she can't make the hard and necessary decisions. I also agree that Booker has committed crimes against the Federation and endangered all, but (as weird as this sounds) I don't think that means he's not a good man. He's been acting out of grief beyond what any of us viewers can imagine--not just the loss of family and community, but of our entire planet--and the determination to not let it happen to other planets and their inhabitants. He may be misguided, but Burnham's insistence that she and the Federation can communicate and make an agreement with a species that is completely unknowable so far seems equally misguided. 

Maybe the reason I'm not willing to see Book as a bad man is that he loves and protects a cat!  

[Affogato]

On 2/1/2023 at 10:36 AM, Paloma said:

I agree that this is not a good look for a woman in command (or really anyone in command), and Burnham should not be in charge of this mission if she can't make the hard and necessary decisions. I also agree that Booker has committed crimes against the Federation and endangered all, but (as weird as this sounds) I don't think that means he's not a good man. He's been acting out of grief beyond what any of us viewers can imagine--not just the loss of family and community, but of our entire planet--and the determination to not let it happen to other planets and their inhabitants. He may be misguided, but Burnham's insistence that she and the Federation can communicate and make an agreement with a species that is completely unknowable so far seems equally misguided. 

Maybe the reason I'm not willing to see Book as a bad man is that he loves and protects a cat!  

I don't think Book is a bad man, I think he is currently a traumatized one. I do wonder if she does not overcompensate for her time with Lorca and his assessment of her. But she certainly has a streak of genuine arrogance that makes her leap into the unknown and decide to fix it on the fly. It is possible that given any normal circumstances and chain of command that would have been addressed.