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S19.E12: Fight or Flight

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I can't wait for all the fun, undercover scenarios the writers can put Parker in since Gary Cole is so versatile: senior citizen grandpapa, elementary school teacher, drug kingpin, etc!

I'm not surprised they made angry-Torres the one who can't move on from the Gibbslessness (as a mirror to certain vocal viewers), instead of McGee who had been there since day one, because those two seem like 1 or 2 note actors and that seems more their range (angry and easygoing/submissive, respectively).

It's shocking how chilled out Parker is about everything because Gary Cole has quite a "stern appearance" with that facial hair, sharp dress sense, and lean figure. It's nice when he shows protectiveness over the team in recent episodes (by trying to call off the undercover op before the fight began).

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I think Torres cannot move on from being undercover for so long, and Bishop. And Gibbs.

He, imo, has never matured even when given opportunities to do so. Small attempts, but not success.

Disclosure - have not seen this episode yet.



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Parker really is a man of mystery, isn't he?

I did not enjoy the cage fight beat-down.  I couldn't help but think that was a vanity project for Wilmer Valderrama.

Palmer is becoming the glue that (literally) is holding this team together.  I liked his gentle counseling session with Torres.  Wilmer Valderrama is never going to be my favorite actor, but his incredulous reaction to Jimmy being angry at Breena for dying was really good.

Who is the new guy?  Torres's replacement?

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I have to agree with Hurricane Val above - Wilmer Valderrama vanity project indeed!  We got to see how ripped he is and Torres got to take a beating and keep on ticking.  Seems Torres is getting lots of beatings on this show lately.   If this was a kinkier show they'd show him flogging himself with a horsewhip or something.    I didn't enjoy the cage fighting scenes at all and frankly don't understand how anybody can watch stuff like that.   You'd think as human beings we'd get beyond that (bring back feeding Christians to the lions and Gladiator Battles) but I guess that isn't the case.  

Yeah, I had to wonder if the new guy (actually I think we've seen him before) is going to be the newest add to the team.  Between this season's story arc for Torres and reading about all the projects the actor has going on, methinks he's going to be calling it quits fairly soon.  

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1 hour ago, HurricaneVal said:

Who is the new guy?  Torres's replacement?

Considering Valderrama is leaving to do a reboot of Zorro, I'd think so.

Didn't care the fighting match but did appreciate the interactions the team had with trying to help Torres out and yes, I did like Palmer talk with him.

And yes, Parker is constantly pulling something or someone else out that he knows.

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I liked how the show addressed Torres feeling abandoned by a father figure and that it wasn’t swept under the rug, and that Palmer was the one to get it out of him. I agree that he’s the heart of the show.

Watching Torres getting his ass kicked was not fun to watch at all. 

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The writing for Palmer has really improved and I'm quite happy about it. I did some multi-tasking during the cage fighting scenes, not interested in that sort of thing. It really looks as if they're paving the way for Torres/Valderrama to leave the show. So far all we've seen of Sawyer is that he gets easily infected by testosterone poisoning, I'm not impressed.

Knight had some great coats this episode - Ziva also had good coat game, I still remember a navy colored one with bright red lining that gave me coat envy. Can't remember a single coat Bishop was wearing.

Who's Doctor Grace?

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5 hours ago, 12catcrazy said:

Yeah, I had to wonder if the new guy (actually I think we've seen him before) is going to be the newest add to the team.

I don't know if he's been on NCIS before (too lazy to look it up) but I did recognize him from Make It or Break It. He played the hotshot male gymnast who dated one of the women gymnasts (Kaley?) and then got jealous because she received so much more attention.

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I found this episode rather dull - the case wasn’t great and Torres’ crybaby tendencies were on full display. Torres’ whining can get tiresome and he was at it the whole hour.

The case itself was just average, it just kind of felt underwhelming that the victim had gotten killed by accident in an underground fighting ring because he was trying to help the foster brother, I don’t know exactly but it just didn’t hold my attention much.

Torres is my least favorite character on the show, I don’t hate him but his whining gets old and I didn’t fully get why he was acting the way he was, what all had changed, it’s been a little while since both Bishop and Gibbs left.

I like Parker and I find it refreshing to have someone more laid back as a team leader than the super uptight Gibbs. Jimmy was good as well, I agree with the others who say he’s the heart of the show now, much like Ducky was when he was a regular. 

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Yeah, this wasn't my cup of tea. Torres really was whiny and that made the show drag. Anytime he wasn't in the scene the show was decent. Although the episode wasn't all that memorable.

I loved that Jimmy snapped Torres out of his whiny phase buy reminding him what real loss truly is.

I must say that I've enjoyed this season more than the past few but this ep was dull. Torres can leave any day now...

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50 minutes ago, Xeliou66 said:

I like Parker and I find it refreshing to have someone more laid back as a team leader than the super uptight Gibbs.

In early seasons, Gibbs was waaaaay more laid back.  I remember a lot more chuckling, the headslaps were almost good-natured, and--I swear to you--he occasionally could be found sitting cross-legged on his desk, or a table while listening to the case progress report.

Parker reminds me a little of early seasons Gibbs.  Though that Gibbs would never think of bringing in baked goods.  Gibbs got ultra-focused with the search for Ari after he terrorized their whole team and killed Kate.  He shut down more after he got blown up, went to Mexico, then returned from Mexico.  He got downright grim after being shot and nearly died.  I wish the writers and Harmon himself could have found a different character arc than the depressing one they did.

Parker reminds me of what could have been.  In fact, he's had almost the opposite arc, extremely accelerated that is.  When we first met Parker he was inflexible and humorless in his relentless pursuit of Gibbs.

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52 minutes ago, HurricaneVal said:

In early seasons, Gibbs was waaaaay more laid back.  I remember a lot more chuckling, the headslaps were almost good-natured, and--I swear to you--he occasionally could be found sitting cross-legged on his desk, or a table while listening to the case progress report.

I remember that Gibbs. He of the devil may care grin and and would have a mysterious  woman pick him up at crime scenes in a convertible. Then they gave him the dead wife and child back story.

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I think Sawyer was one of the agents that filled in for the regular team when the team were all on suspension after lying about Gibbs' assault on that guy that was running the dog-fighting ring and killing the dogs for whom he had no further use.

Couldn't stand Torres this episode.  One of the reasons was that I really couldn't accept that he'd been pining that much for Bishop ever since she left.  It really didn't seem that that potential relationship had gotten to the point where either one of them would have considered it a serious thing.  Torres just kind of reminded me of a sulky and resentful adolescent, actually.

If/when Torres does leave, I wouldn't mind another female agent being brought on board, instead of Sawyer, if only just to even the numbers on the team.  After all this time, it kind of seems as if the female agent is just a token.

Continuing to enjoy Parker.  Seems quite creative in his approach to solving the case/catching the bad guy(s)/saving the day, in that he knows what he wants the outcome to be and just kind changes methods according to the obstacles he encounters on the way.

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Agree this ep was a Wilmer V. vanity project, maybe a Torres-specific ep was in his s19 contract! He had made at least 2 self-congratulatory posts on instagram about this ep. Imo, Torres is the most expendable character. Whiney and ho-hum.

Anyone feel that this cage-fighting episode should have aired first, followed by (last week's ep) "All Hands" later (where the whole team sans mcgee was hostage on-board that ship and had some bonding)?

To show the conflict, then a bit of bonding hope. Because it will be at least 3 weeks (4?) before the next new episode, due to the nbc winter Olympics February 4-20. Casual viewers won't remember bratty Torres and Parker having to deal with that when we return.

Also seems to me that Jimmy's acting has improved this season (more "realer" as a character who feels things), less two-dimension sunshine and chipper voice only. Maybe he is absorbing Gary Cole's "real" character actor portrayal style.

Edited by Poohpoohpooh
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So, so, so, SICK AND TIRED of Torres's wah, wah, wah, wah, waaaaaaaaaah.

Suck it up, Buttercup.

While I love Gary Cole, and I do like his character, Parker, without Harmon/Gibbs, this is like a totally different show.

Maybe I should just post this in the unpopular thread, but I prefer Gibbs, warts and all.

Granted, I skipped seasons 17-18 mostly, but I watched this show for Harmon.

Back to the episode. So frickin' frackin' boring.

If Valderamma is leaving at season's end. GOOD.

So I guess we have a break for the next two weeks due to Winter Olympics?

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On 1/25/2022 at 1:19 PM, 12catcrazy said:

 Seems Torres is getting lots of beatings on this show lately.    

Yeah, but I think it fits with his "nobody cares if I'm here or not" mental state. He's careless and reckless because he believes it doesn't matter anyway.

What bothers me about it is that they always seem to be going the self-destructive route. Ziva went through it twice (once in the episode where she went undercover with the serial killer and more extensively at the end of S6). But there are more ways that mental health issues can present than a downward/self-destructive spiral. I appreciate that they're addressing it, I don't appreciate that they seem to always go the same route.

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