S01.E06: Saints

[Pallas]

The Yellowjackets tangle with the birds and the bees, navigating love, lust and DIY surgery; in the present: blackmail, bunnies and an icy reunion, while Misty prepares for a surprise(d) houseguest.

[Armchair Critic]

Sammy is going to need a lot of therapy.... Tai is the woman in the tree! YIKES

[Dminches]

As someone alluded to earlier, Misty did go all Misery on the reporter.

I really like the crash survival storyline with all the teenagers and the coach.  I am finding the adult stories to be a bit boring, even the blackmail parts.

 

[WaltersHair]

I expected some personality changes for Tai, but not a crazed, dirt-eating-tree-climbing mute. That was supposed to be Lottie's job.

And go Coach! We may be starving to death, but I got condoms for days here.

I believed Jeff when he said he loved Shauna. I think the show is punking us with that other woman. Maybe he's trying to find an investor.

Or, I guess, he could be the blackmailer, which is why Shuana didn't get a postcard.

[MCMLXXVII]

Who schedules brunch on a Wednesday?

Sooo much wicker in Jackie’s room. Ooof, always hated white wicker, and that whole Laura Ashley look.
I’m assuming Jackie was an only child from the way her parents have kind of fixated on Shauna? It seems all the girls been shown to be onlies so far, a bit unusual.

Edited December 19, 2021 by MCMLXXVII

[Tatum]

So Jackie's mom is quite the master of the passive aggressive insults, isn't she? I thought gifting Shauna Jackie's soccer uniform roughly 22 years after she last wore it was weird enough, and I am further convinced after this episode she invites Shauna over only to undermine her. Whether she holds her responsible in some way for Jackie's death or is just bitter Shauna is alive while Jackie is dead is unclear.

 

A few things she said were really weird though. Especially the part about Jackie always wanting more. I get it, she was burning Shauna for living such an ordinary life, but Jackie was a high school student. It's not like she was gunning for CEO while raising kids or anything like what the mom was hinting at. Also, her comment that Jackie always worried about Shauna finding someone. Even if Jackie thought Shauna had no love life so far, she was 18. There was plenty of time for that; it's not like people become spinsters at age 18. It sounds more like things Jackie would say or do as an adult. I guess we don't know that she died at 18-19, but given that she always appears that age in Shauna's interactions with her as an adult, it seems a reasonable assumption.

 

At first I thought it was great that Jeff jumped in to praise Shauna, but then he did the same thing the mom did  while they were in the car. When he said all he was ever going to be was Jackie's high school boyfriend, but made a life with Shauna, the implication might have been that Jackie was too good for him (or maybe that regardless, he wasn't enough for Jackie) but he suits Shauna just fine. I am sure he meant it be reassuring, but I don't think I would have taken it that way, especially in Shauna's shoes.

2 hours ago, MCMLXXVII said:

Who schedules brunch on a Wednesday?

Sounds like they traditionally have it on Jackie's birthday, whatever day that happens to fall on.

[Anela]

Jackie’s mother was awful, and I liked that Jeff stood up for Shauna - until he did the same thing in the car.  Sounding as though he settled, because Jackie didn’t want him. 

I wonder if Tai was getting minerals from the dirt.  

 

[BitterApple]

Agree with all the above. The dialogue at brunch was odd. I'm assuming Mrs. Taylor meant "finding someone" in terms of a high school boyfriend, but that type of phrasing is usually associated with an adult finding a spouse. It's understandable the Taylors have never gotten over Jackie's death(?), but the mom was clearly taking her anger out on Shauna, as if it wasn't right the "lesser" half of the duo got to make it to middle age. I was totally psyched when Jeff jumped in to defend Shauna, but that convo during the car ride turned me off. Maybe he didn't realize how backhanded his words came off, but his bitterness was obvious.

Tai is the lady in the tree. Holy shit. I don't even know how to process this. 

So is Lottie a schizophrenic or a prophet? 

Jackie can be a total bitch, but she was right with regards to Travis/Nat. The group's survival depends on them. They can't spend all their time banging in a burned out fuselage. Travis' talk with Coach Scott was painfully awkward and funny at the same time.

Misty and her show tunes. Gotta love her. What exactly are her plans with Jessica Roberts?

Also, when the women were discussing the blackmailer, Nat said maybe it was someone from the team. Is that confirmation of other survivors? Who else would've known about the symbol? Unless it was documented when investigators photographed the cabin and crash site? 

I like that we're starting to see the dynamics fracture. Food is getting scarce and tempers are flaring. I wonder if next week marks the official split between the group who seeks rescue and those that stay in the cabin. 

[calliope1975]

So Tai is definitely supernaturally intuitive or a bit precognitive. She's also disassociating. And Lottie is either off her meds, or as was said upthread, a prophet. Now that I know this is a multiple season show and not a limited series I'll temper my expectations of how much will be revealed. 

I don't think Jeff is having an affair anymore but I do think that convo in the car wasn't the great speech he probably thinks it was. Honestly, if that plane has made it to Seattle it's likely both Jackie and Shauna wouldn't have given Jeff a 2nd thought until they saw him 20 yrs later at their high school reunion.

Misty is still a crazy bitch, lol. I'm doing a rewatch and I was starting to think Misty sent the postcards but now I'm thinking she didn't but is super siked this is happening and, as Nat said in ep 1, has found her new purpose.

I'm curious if the camp splits perhaps one set was found and didn't mention the others. 

ETA I mistook young Lottie for young Tai which makes no sense and explains why I was wondering why her hair was so straight. Don't multitask while watching a mystery show! 

Edited December 20, 2021 by calliope1975

[BitterApple]

Are we thinking that collection of rabbit figurines in Shauna's house were all gifts from Jackie's mom? Because if so, then that jives with Jackie dying or being left in the woods at some point during those 19 months. That would also back up why Shauna only sees the teenaged version of her in the present. 

I'm also wondering if Jeff is possibly the blackmailer? His business isn't doing well and it's interesting how Callie's college fund was brought up two episodes in a row. 

I know Young Shauna is scared, but I think I'd rather take my chances and give birth than risk a DIY abortion. The conditions suck, but women have survived worse. 

I'm going to rewatch later to pick up on more things, but this episode is going to keep me up at night. 

[Tatum]

43 minutes ago, calliope1975 said:

 

I don't think Jeff is having an affair anymore but I do think that convo in the car wasn't the great speech he probably thinks it was. Honestly, if that plane has made it to Seattle it's likely both Jackie and Shauna wouldn't have given Jeff a 2nd thought until they saw him 20 yrs later at their high school reunion.

 

Yeah, the worst part is, unlike Jackie's mom, who was deliberately trying to be hurtful (seriously, she was at first aiming for plausible deniability with her whole, "I think it's so great you can be content being so ordinary and having achieved so little- I mean that in a good way!", then she gave up all pretense of a compliment), I think Jeff thought he was saying something that would really make Shauna feel better. I think all he meant was, he doesn't idealize Jackie as this one perfect soulmate to which no other woman can possibly compare, and he is realistic that he and Jackie would not have made each other happy in the long term, with or without Shauna in the mix, but it came out pretty ham fisted.

1 hour ago, BitterApple said:

I'm assuming Mrs. Taylor meant "finding someone" in terms of a high school boyfriend, but that type of phrasing is usually associated with an adult finding a spouse.

Yeah, at first I thought it was a hint that Jackie actually didn't die in the wilderness (ie she came back with Shauna, but died at a later date) but then I remembered Shauna got married at 22-23 which even for 2001 was on the young side for brides, and I think it was just another dig, like, Shauna you're such a sad sack marrying your best friend's sloppy seconds, but Jackie would be gracious enough to just be glad someone wanted to be with you. Also, have I told you lately how much you suck? If not, let me remind you.

 

ETA: If Jackie's mom pulls this on Shauna every year, I can't believe Jeff and Shauna still agree to go.

 

25 minutes ago, BitterApple said:

I know Young Shauna is scared, but I think I'd rather take my chances and give birth than risk a DIY abortion. The conditions suck, but women have survived worse.

That scene was horrifying and I am so glad she changed her mind. I am not even sure how many 18 year olds would even know the correct way to complete the procedure in 1996.

 

I am not sure what Shauna feels like Jackie finding out she's pregnant will mean Jackie will find out who the father is. I mean, I get she doesn't want to keep lying, but that's something that can be deferred until after they're rescued, you know?

Edited December 19, 2021 by Tatum

[Whimsy]

36 minutes ago, BitterApple said:

Are we thinking that collection of rabbit figurines in Shauna's house were all gifts from Jackie's mom? Because if so, then that jives with Jackie dying or being left in the woods at some point during those 19 months. That would also back up why Shauna only sees the teenaged version of her in the present. 

 

100% they’re from Jackie’s mom. 

54 minutes ago, calliope1975 said:

 

I don't think Jeff is having an affair anymore but I do think that convo in the car wasn't the great speech he probably thinks it was. Honestly, if that plane has made it to Seattle it's likely both Jackie and Shauna wouldn't have given Jeff a 2nd thought until they saw him 20 yrs later at their high school reunion.

 

As soon as I saw Jeff with the woman in the lobby, I changed my mind on him having an affair. There was absolutely nothing about their body language that said “romance”. Maybe the woman is some sort of investor from out of town- hence the hotel. I think Jeff is trying to do something “big” with his business. I don’t think it’s going to succeed, but I think he thinks it’ll be a wonderful surprise and that’s why it’s a secret. 

12 minutes ago, Tatum said:

 

ETA: If Jackie's mom pulls this on Shauna every year, I can't believe Jeff and Shauna still agree to go.

I thInk Shauna is still carrying tons of guilt and thinks she deserves all the hate from Jackie’s mom.

 

The way that Shauna talked to Tai and Natalie in the motel room, I think she had to be the “boss” out there. She was taking CHARGE.

[BitterApple]

9 minutes ago, Tatum said:

 

Yeah, at first I thought it was a hint that Jackie actually didn't die in the wilderness (ie she came back with Shauna, but died at a later date) 

Somebody posted the screenshots of Jackie's diary. If this isn't a production/continuity error, then holy fuck:

https://www.reddit.com/r/Yellowjackets/comments/rjqzx3/jackies_journal_includes_possible_proof_she/

The details are a bit spoiler-y, but I'm putting it in this thread because it was shown in the episode. 

[WaltersHair]

51 minutes ago, BitterApple said:

Somebody posted the screenshots of Jackie's diary. If this isn't a production/continuity error, then holy fuck:

https://www.reddit.com/r/Yellowjackets/comments/rjqzx3/jackies_journal_includes_possible_proof_she/

The details are a bit spoiler-y, but I'm putting it in this thread because it was shown in the episode. 

Spoiler

Continuity or maybe Shauna spent some time over at Jackie's house when she got back to appease those awful parents. Wrote in her journal what Jackie would have written?

It's anyone's guess.

Edited December 20, 2021 by WaltersHair

[BitterApple]

1 minute ago, WaltersHair said:

Continuity or maybe Shauna spent some time over at Jackie's house when she got back to appease those awful parents. Wrote in her journal what Jackie would have written?

It's anyone's guess.

I could see that. Shauna is the one who's been depicted as an avid journal keeper, not Jackie. 

It's funny though how last week (or the week before?) we were wondering about the girls' families and then this week we get both Lottie's and Jackie's parents. 

[Tatum]

46 minutes ago, BitterApple said:

Somebody posted the screenshots of Jackie's diary. If this isn't a production/continuity error, then holy fuck:

https://www.reddit.com/r/Yellowjackets/comments/rjqzx3/jackies_journal_includes_possible_proof_she/

The details are a bit spoiler-y, but I'm putting it in this thread because it was shown in the episode. 

Spoiler

Ohhh man. I can't imagine that's an error. If someone took the time to identify characters Jackie might have liked, I can't believe they wouldn't check things like release dates.

(Spoiler tagged just in case, even though this was from this episode).

 

I like the Reddit comment that Jackie wanting to be Angela from American Beauty needs a whole thread of its own. I mean, that honestly makes ZERO sense. The whole point of her character arc was that she was so desperate to avoid being ordinary, which she absolutely was. I mean, you could draw parallels between Angela and Jackie, but who would actually want to be Angela?

 

ETA: Screenshot actually says movie characters I would be, not movie characters I want to be. But I don't know what she'd have in common with Mia Wallace from Pulp Fiction nor why anyone would want to be this character. For that matter, Pulp Fiction doesn't really fit in with most of the chick flicks Jackie listed. That would be so typical of a teen girl to pick her because her boyfriend made her watch the movie and said Uma Thurman was hot. I swear, I think all these characters are at least loosely based on people the writers knew in high school.

Edited December 19, 2021 by Tatum

[calliope1975]

This is probably too convoluted but now I'm wondering if Taissa is sabotaging/gaslighting herself. Did she write spill on the door and not remember? I don't think she's blackmailing everyone, but I do think Sammy is protecting her in the way kids do. Maybe the postcard triggered her disassociation. Just spit balling here. 

[Cinnabon]

1 hour ago, BitterApple said:

Somebody posted the screenshots of Jackie's diary. If this isn't a production/continuity error, then holy fuck:

https://www.reddit.com/r/Yellowjackets/comments/rjqzx3/jackies_journal_includes_possible_proof_she/

The details are a bit spoiler-y, but I'm putting it in this thread because it was shown in the episode. 

How is this a spoiler? Speculation is not the same as spoilers.

[blixie]

Quote

I don't think Jeff is having an affair anymore but I do think that convo in the car wasn't the great speech he probably thinks it was.

I don't think he thought it was a great speech and I think they both have a lot of issues based on building a life on cheating on a dead girl I think he was trying to convince himself as much as Shauna, that their entire life hasn't been a mistake/waste of time. We still don't know if either Jackie or Shauna was really into Jeff and he was more of a pawn between the two of them. I am also thinking the affair may be a red herring. When you think about all Shauna is lying to him about well, I guess I think he's not unjustifiably alienated from his wife.

Tai being the woman in the tree is a trip, but yeah I still think supernatural ish is afoot both with her and Lottie, I think the pairing of Lottie to Laura Lee is going to be a big disaster. It seems like our main four are in the 'non believers' camp that maybe sets out to be rescued, while they go looking Lottie turns the home base into a wood witch cult. No way Misty leaves her secret boyfriend, so there must be some girls who switch sides or equivocate. 

I am still loving the show but I wish more genre serials were like The Vampire Diaries, having more confidence in letting the plot move along and handing out reveals/payoffs more. The woman in the tree is a great one, but we need to just get to knowing who is threatening them in the present, get that plot racing like a rollercoaster. 

[Kristi800]

Quote

ETA: If Jackie's mom pulls this on Shauna every year, I can't believe Jeff and Shauna still agree to go.

Agree with the following poster that Shauna feels guilty and that she doesn't deserve more. Glad she's starting to realize that she does. At first I thought those were Jeff's parents, especially about giving them money for Callie's college. I'm glad Shauna turned them down. What a-holes. And Tuna quiche? Glad to see Jeff stepping up a notch standing up for Shauna, and thought the conversation in the car was a bit ham-fisted, but not as much of a knock-down. He didn't seem to have regrets being with her, but I"m sure Jackie will always be between them regardless just because of the circumstances.

Now we know where Jackie gets her prissy attitude. I had some white wicker in my room, but it wasn't the whole princess look to go with it.

Interesting with the car ride in the beginning with Lottie and the later on with Sammi being so similar. I do wonder if Simone is behind the painting. She's throwing off some serious strange vibes, maybe throwing Taissa into some state to get her to drop out of the election? Who was it that Taissa saw doing the same thing in the woods, Lottie?

I loved Nat's response to Travis asking her how many guys she'd slept with. You go, girl. 

It was nice to see Taissa help Shauna. 

[Dowel Jones]

Can someone explain how a deer can walk around with a gut full of maggots in place of its organs?

[Tatum]

13 hours ago, Whimsy said:

I thInk Shauna is still carrying tons of guilt and thinks she deserves all the hate from Jackie’s mom.

I get, but 20 years worth? I am surprised Jeff would continue to indulge this.

I think Shauna's visions lately of Jackie kind of indicate that she assumes Jackie would forgive her for whatever happened.

 

8 hours ago, Kristi800 said:

Now we know where Jackie gets her prissy attitude. I had some white wicker in my room, but it wasn't the whole princess look to go with it.

For some reason this cracks me up. The word prissy just doesn't get used enough anymore.

 

I do find it a bit unusual that Jackie and Jeff were together for 3+ years (albeit with short breakups with some regularity) and apparently never said I love you to each other. That's a long time to date someone you're not sure you are that serious about. Especially in high school. 3 years in high school is like 15 years in adult time. Jackie may have liked the idea of Jeff a lot more than she liked Jeff, but given how fickle teens are you'd think someone else would have caught her eye during that time.

[Dminches]

If Jeff isn't having an affair then the show is working really hard to convince us that he is.  He has been seen at a hotel with a woman (who Shauna doesn't seem to know) and repeatedly goes to the store at night to "fix" an inventory database issue (hard to believe this can't be fixed during normal business hours).  I really hate when shows do that.

 

[TVMovieBuff]

16 hours ago, Tatum said:

I think Jeff thought he was saying something that would really make Shauna feel better. I think all he meant was, he doesn't idealize Jackie as this one perfect soulmate to which no other woman can possibly compare, and he is realistic that he and Jackie would not have made each other happy in the long term, with or without Shauna in the mix, but it came out pretty ham fisted.

I agree with you & this. Jeff isn't a great orator. I think he meant, that he & Jackie were really nothing special together, just a marker during high school that would have ended when she went to college. Shauna is the real deal for him.

[blixie]

Quote

Can someone explain how a deer can walk around with a gut full of maggots in place of its organs?

Apparently this is reasonably common for white tail, but also it doesn't make the  meat inedible and the parasites aren't a threat to humans, it is disgusting to think about but every part of dressing a deer seems disgusting to me.  But again I am baffled why we keep showing  a lake and these bitches ain't fishing, it is literally the one source of food that wouldn't go away in the winter, and it's easier and way less gross to gut/clean/cook. And the lack of small prey/deer in the deep woods (before winter) is just not a thing I'm buying without something supernatural afoot. They should have crashed in late spring, high school soccer is a spring sport, so that means they only had to face a single winter. 

[BitterApple]

2 hours ago, Dminches said:

If Jeff isn't having an affair then the show is working really hard to convince us that he is.  He has been seen at a hotel with a woman (who Shauna doesn't seem to know) and repeatedly goes to the store at night to "fix" an inventory database issue (hard to believe this can't be fixed during normal business hours).  I really hate when shows do that.

 

I agree. I've seen speculation that Jeff hired Bianca to organize a surprise anniversary party, but that doesn't make much sense. They don't have the money for that sort of thing, especially one so fancy it requires an event planner. Plus, it doesn't seem like Shauna has any friends. Who would Jeff invite? Misty and Caligula? 

They're definitely pushing the affair so hard it can't be an affair, but I can't see any other reason for Jeff meeting Bianca regularly at a hotel. If she was a potential client, why wouldn't Jeff just tell Shauna that? You could argue he's trying to conceal their financial problems, but Shauna is smarter than he is. Surely she's aware. 

[WaltersHair]

47 minutes ago, BitterApple said:

They're definitely pushing the affair so hard it can't be an affair, but I can't see any other reason for Jeff meeting Bianca regularly at a hotel. If she was a potential client, why wouldn't Jeff just tell Shauna that? You could argue he's trying to conceal their financial problems, but Shauna is smarter than he is. Surely she's aware. 

I was thinking Jeff has a second, embarrassing job to try and make ends meet. And say what you like about them not 'having it all' but Shauna has a huge kitchen.

 

And that brunch was supposed to take place in November (the previous episode featured Halloween). New Jersey is that green, bright and pleasant in November? Just a minor quibble.

[heatherchandler]

 

18 hours ago, Tatum said:

  Reveal spoiler

Ohhh man. I can't imagine that's an error. If someone took the time to identify characters Jackie might have liked, I can't believe they wouldn't check things like release dates.

(Spoiler tagged just in case, even though this was from this episode).

 

I like the Reddit comment that Jackie wanting to be Angela from American Beauty needs a whole thread of its own. I mean, that honestly makes ZERO sense. The whole point of her character arc was that she was so desperate to avoid being ordinary, which she absolutely was. I mean, you could draw parallels between Angela and Jackie, but who would actually want to be Angela?

 

ETA: Screenshot actually says movie characters I would be, not movie characters I want to be. But I don't know what she'd have in common with Mia Wallace from Pulp Fiction nor why anyone would want to be this character. For that matter, Pulp Fiction doesn't really fit in with most of the chick flicks Jackie listed. That would be so typical of a teen girl to pick her because her boyfriend made her watch the movie and said Uma Thurman was hot. I swear, I think all these characters are at least loosely based on people the writers knew in high school.

I don't think any of this is a spoiler - we all saw the diary, on the show, and we all know when some of the movies came out.  I do wonder if the show made a mistake but that seems off for them to make a point of showing the pages and not make sure it would make sense.

I remember everyone wanted to be Mia Wallace.  So many Mia Wallaces at Halloween that year.  I liked her, not because a boyfriend thought she was hot.  She was cool.  

 

13 hours ago, Kristi800 said:

 

Now we know where Jackie gets her prissy attitude. I had some white wicker in my room, but it wasn't the whole princess look to go with it.

 

Jackie's room is my high school room, it's like someone took a picture of my room and re-created it.  The pink walls, the wicker, the ballerina "art" in a gold frame.  It wasn't prissy, it was the "look" of the time!

I also had a "diary" that was exactly like Jackie's where I wrote my favorites in different colored markers.  So this is actually getting creepy.  

 

[Whimsy]

2 hours ago, BitterApple said:

I agree. I've seen speculation that Jeff hired Bianca to organize a surprise anniversary party, but that doesn't make much sense. They don't have the money for that sort of thing, especially one so fancy it requires an event planner. Plus, it doesn't seem like Shauna has any friends. Who would Jeff invite? Misty and Caligula? 

They're definitely pushing the affair so hard it can't be an affair, but I can't see any other reason for Jeff meeting Bianca regularly at a hotel. If she was a potential client, why wouldn't Jeff just tell Shauna that? You could argue he's trying to conceal their financial problems, but Shauna is smarter than he is. Surely she's aware. 

What makes it seem like they “regularly” meet at the hotel? I’m genuinely asking. I couldn’t read the text because of my old eyes. I just know the trope, so I figured right away it was some ambiguous text to make Shauna think affair. Could it be the first time they met there?    

[calliope1975]

1 minute ago, Whimsy said:

What makes it seem like they “regularly” meet at the hotel?

I think the text said to meet at their usual spot, but I may be misremembering.

[Whimsy]

Just now, calliope1975 said:

I think the text said to meet at their usual spot, but I may be misremembering.

You could be right, I literally couldn’t read it. 

[TVMovieBuff]

5 minutes ago, Whimsy said:

I’m genuinely asking. I couldn’t read the text because of my old eyes.

I really hate that, when they have a phone with a text, and I am supposed to be able to read that? 

I have seen where the body of the text shows in a separate graphic, in big print, so it is readable.

[BitterApple]

13 minutes ago, heatherchandler said:

 

I don't think any of this is a spoiler - we all saw the diary, on the show, and we all know when some of the movies came out.  I do wonder if the show made a mistake but that seems off for them to make a point of showing the pages and not make sure it would make sense.

I remember everyone wanted to be Mia Wallace.  So many Mia Wallaces at Halloween that year.  I liked her, not because a boyfriend thought she was hot.  She was cool.  

 

Jackie's room is my high school room, it's like someone took a picture of my room and re-created it.  The pink walls, the wicker, the ballerina "art" in a gold frame.  It wasn't prissy, it was the "look" of the time!

I also had a "diary" that was exactly like Jackie's where I wrote my favorites in different colored markers.  So this is actually getting creepy.  

 

Mine too, lol. The ballerina picture is still hanging in my childhood bedroom. Remember those multi-colored markers that were scented? I can still conjure the purple grape smell when I think about them. 

With regards to the movies, I could give a pass on the ones released in late '96, but Bring It On was released in 2000. That would be a really sloppy (not to mention, lazy) production error. I'm choosing to believe it's deliberate. Either Jackie was rescued and alive for several years, or it's a misdirect and we'll eventually find out Shauna wrote it. 

17 minutes ago, Whimsy said:

What makes it seem like they “regularly” meet at the hotel? I’m genuinely asking. I couldn’t read the text because of my old eyes. I just know the trope, so I figured right away it was some ambiguous text to make Shauna think affair. Could it be the first time they met there?    

The text Bianca sent Jeff said, "Four p.m., same place."

[blixie]

Quote

With regards to the movies, I could give a pass on the ones released in late '96, but Bring It On was released in 2000.

I guess, but having heard a show runner talk about this minutia, it's probably a production error. The alternative is that now 20 or 21 year old Jackie post extreme trauma is still writing in pink pen about her favorite movies in her high school journal and or still living at home? That seems unlikely. But also I'm one of the olds how hasn't been able to read a single shot of a text or make out most of what was in the diary and I don't think it's playing fair to have expected that the audience would register it much less that one of the  movies or bands was post 96. I am not saying that Jackie is absolutely dead but what I am saying is everyone in the her world behaves as if she never came back from the crash. 

[Tatum]

10 minutes ago, blixie said:

I guess, but having heard a show runner talk about this minutia, it's probably a production error. The alternative is that now 20 or 21 year old Jackie post extreme trauma is still writing in pink pen about her favorite movies in her high school journal and or still living at home? That seems unlikely. But also I'm one of the olds how hasn't been able to read a single shot of a text or make out most of what was in the diary and I don't think it's playing fair to have expected that the audience would register it much less that one of the  movies or bands was post 96. I am not saying that Jackie is absolutely dead but what I am saying is everyone in the her world behaves as if she never came back from the crash. 

That's a good point, but not only is the writing something a 20-21 year old wouldn't write, it's not really something I think an 18 year old would write either. It seems more in line with a 12-13 year old writing. You'd think an 18 year old would be writing about her boyfriend, her friends, her college plans, her parents, etc. I suppose given that Shauna's flashback was probably them as freshman, it could be around that time, but then the list would be even further off time wise. They also could have just shown Shauna flipping through the diary while looking nostalgic, I mean nothing she read really advanced the story line. It seems really deliberate to have them zoom in on a series of lists Jackie ostensibly kept.

 

Shauna as the real author is interesting, but the cutesy-ness of the pages (with popcorn drawings and multi colored coded lists) just seems very at odds with her personality and if she's trying to replicate Jackie...she's making her look pretty vapid. It's not exactly a flattering imitation.

 

eta: Reddit suggested Jackie had extreme emotional regression due to stress/trauma, but I don't think there's going to be enough episodes left for them to work that in. I know there is a season 2 slated now, but they wrote this season already, correct?

 

Edited December 20, 2021 by Tatum

[heatherchandler]

34 minutes ago, BitterApple said:

Mine too, lol. The ballerina picture is still hanging in my childhood bedroom. Remember those multi-colored markers that were scented? I can still conjure the purple grape smell when I think about them. 

With regards to the movies, I could give a pass on the ones released in late '96, but Bring It On was released in 2000. That would be a really sloppy (not to mention, lazy) production error. I'm choosing to believe it's deliberate. Either Jackie was rescued and alive for several years, or it's a misdirect and we'll eventually find out Shauna wrote it. 

 

Yes, I loved those markers.  I also had the metallic paint markers (silver and gold) that would somehow leave an outline in red, if I remember correctly... but I wouldn't use those on paper, they bled through.

I believe it had to be deliberate, too.  

[TVMovieBuff]

I want to know more about this Season 2 coming. I hope it is a new storyline. As I want this one wrapped up in the 10 episodes we were told about. I don't want a cliffhanger waiting for Season 2 to start in a year or so!

[Tatum]

26 minutes ago, TVMovieBuff said:

I want to know more about this Season 2 coming. I hope it is a new storyline. As I want this one wrapped up in the 10 episodes we were told about. I don't want a cliffhanger waiting for Season 2 to start in a year or so!

I am a little worried about that as well. I would assume all episodes were filmed and can't be changed at this point, but you never know.

 

I saw an article that the actress playing teen Jackie is signed on for season 2. That makes me a little nervous that they might try and stretch out the storyline but she could also be a continued presence in adult Shauna's life. I really don't care for season ending cliffhangers either.

[BitterApple]

Some things I picked up on rewatch:

I had the same My Little Pony that childhood Lottie was brushing in the car.

Screw you, Val. Misty may be crazy, but what sort of sick person doesn't get excited for cronuts? 

The scenes between Young Shauna and Young Tai were so beautiful and poignant. I loved when Tai told her not to risk doing the abortion just to spare Jackie's feelings. I also liked her not being judgemental when she found out Jeff was the father.

The brunch was even creepier on rewatch. One thing I didn't pick up the first time was Jackie's father referring to Callie as a "special child." I wonder why? There's been no mention of her having artistic, athletic or academic prowess. She seems like a perfectly average teenager. 

Another catch: I paused the screen when Shauna pulled that picture of Jeff and Jackie out of the journal, and Jeff looks noticeably older. His hair is longer on top with thin blonde streaks, reminiscent of late 90s boy bands. 

With regards to the deer, Travis didn't kill it. At the 51:00-ish minute mark, you can see it's being dragged along the ground. My guess is it died on its own and whatever found it got scared off when Travis and Nat approached. 

 

Edited December 20, 2021 by BitterApple

[WaltersHair]

11 minutes ago, BitterApple said:

Screw you, Val. Misty may be crazy, but what sort of sick person doesn't get excited for cronuts?

I wouldn't judge Val too soon. If Misty can poison the man she loves, who know what she capable of putting in a cronut? /kidding. Mostly.

[blixie]

Quote

It seems really deliberate to have them zoom in on a series of lists Jackie ostensibly kept.

I guess that's my point I don't think it was a ZOOM it was a deliberate shot for sure, but I think it was meant for Shauna to remember how they were while growing up (the pre trauma versions) not some lynchpin Easter egg in a mystery box game the showrunners are playing with savvy reddit viewers. I could definitely be wrong as the show is very Lost adjacent. 

 

Quote

Travis didn't shoot it.

The stopped banging Nat, told her to be quiet, and to get the gun. I don't think he saw an already felled deer, and I think we can assume he shot it. 

Edited December 20, 2021 by blixie

[Tatum]

45 minutes ago, BitterApple said:

The brunch was even creepier on rewatch. One thing I didn't pick up the first time was Jackie's father referring to Callie as a "special child." I wonder why? There's been no mention of her having artistic, athletic or academic prowess. She seems like a perfectly average teenager. 

Another catch: I paused the screen when Shauna pulled that picture of Jeff and Jackie out of the journal, and Jeff looks noticeably older. His hair is longer on top with thin blonde streaks, reminiscent of late 90s boy bands.

Interesting! Although Jackie has the duck lips plus the peace sign. Yeesh. I can't tell if he looks older. I recall the longer bleached hair for guys was popular throughout the 90s- the frosted spiked tips is more what I think of when I think late 90s boy hairstyles. Jeff is channeling Zach Morris for sure in that pic.

 

23 minutes ago, blixie said:

I guess that's my point I don't think it was a ZOOM it was a deliberate shot for sure, but I think it was meant for Shauna to remember how they were while growing up (the pre trauma versions) not some lynchpin Easter egg in a mystery box game the showrunners are playing with savvy reddit viewers. I could definitely be wrong as the show is very Lost adjacent. 

It could just be a mistake, but such a weird one to make. Someone had to compile that list- they didn't think to check release dates? Also, I think the main writers are around the ages of the main characters and probably remember when these movies came out. Sure, they could just be thinking, who's really going to look, but as long as you have to do it anyways, why not do it accurately? I mean, it would be one thing if Jackie and Shauna were in a flashback and something was in the background that wouldn't have been around in 1996, then I might argue that a set designer just made an oopsy. But to take the time to make a diary page (even one you assume no viewer is actually going to see) and make it incorrect is weird. But not impossible. If it is a clue, it is indeed an insanely subtle one.

 

ETA: went back and watched the brunch scene again to see if there were any clues to pick up about when Jeff last saw Jackie, and there really aren't any. But oh man, the look on Mama Taylor's face when Jeff says that Shauna got into Brown. That probably pissed off Mama more than Jeff's admission that he was sleeping with Shauna while dating Jackie.

Edited December 20, 2021 by Tatum

[BitterApple]

24 minutes ago, blixie said:

 

The stopped banging Nat, told her to be quiet, and to get the gun. I don't think he saw an already felled deer, and I think we can assume he shot it. 

You can see the body of the deer being dragged along the ground before Nat and Travis stepped out of the plane. It's at the time stamp I mentioned. I actually didn't notice it until I re-watched because it's such a quick shot. 

 

[tennisgurl]

That brunch with Jackie's mom and Shauna/Jeff was almost as cringe as the deer filled with worms. I guess I have to cut Jackie's mom some slack, she did lose her daughter, but she is clearly taking it out cruelly on Shauna, like she has to keep going on about how inferior Shauna is in every way possible to Jackie because she's pissed that Jackie died instead of Shauna. I am really glad that Jeff stood up for her, and while his speech in the car wasn't perfect, he did seem to be trying to reassure Shauna that she isn't a cheap replacement for Jackie and that what they have is more then the high school relationship he had with Jackie. The show is trying so hard to make us think he's having an affair that it makes me think its a misdirect, and the woman he met is a business contact or something. 

Everything with Shauna being haunted by teen Jackie will certainly take on a different meaning if Jackie really did get left behind. I am also concerned about where these visions are going with Lottie and Laura Lee, whether Lottie is actually psychic or psychotic, this seems like it could escalate really quickly into something cult-y. Things are getting more tense now, the sleepover vibe that Jackie has been aiming for is dissipating as reality is sinking in and the situation gets more dire. Things are still pretty smooth, no major blow ups and they still have their coach around to be the resident adult (here for safe sex talks and all) but you can see cracks starting to form.

We have a lot up in the air, every week has even more questions even as we get more information. Is Lotte mentally ill or can she see the future? Does Tai have a split personality? I suspected at first that Misty could be behind the cards, but now I am pretty sure she isn't, but loves the fact that she can join up with the rest of "the team" again and feel useful. Her collection of melodramatic Broadway musical soundtracks still cracks me up. Old or young, Missy does love going all Misery on people. 

Watching teen Shauna and Tai try to abort the baby was super nasty, I am glad that they finally stopped, just go ahead and see how giving birth goes. Its not great, but its better then whatever that plan was. She doesn't actually have to tell anyone who the baby daddy is, she could tell Jackie she's pregnant without mentioning her boyfriend being the dad. 

Sammy is going to need all of the therapy. 

[BitterApple]

tennisgurl, yeah, I think the Lottie/Laura Lee pairing is going to go south very quickly. I think Lottie is legitimately mentally ill, and Laura Lee is going to misinterpret her visions as signs from God. Lottie thought her mind was playing tricks on her when she saw the mangy deer and Tai eating dirt, and then it turns out both were real. It's also possible young Lottie preventing the car accident was pure coincidence, not a premonition. I think that's why this show is so hard to figure out. For every hint of supernatural, there's also rational explanation. 

I've been thinking about the blackmail and the postcards, and here's what I find interesting. Nat, Tai and Misty got postcards, yet only Nat and Tai got ransom demands. Shauna got neither, as far as we know. Assuming she's not lying, I wonder why she hasn't been targeted? Tai is an obvious choice for blackmail because she has money, but Nat, not so much. She's living in a sleazy motel. Somebody would have to know she has a valuable car she could sell if necessary. Is it possible Jessica Roberts was trying to pull a double-cross?

Edited December 20, 2021 by BitterApple

[Tatum]

31 minutes ago, BitterApple said:

 

I've been thinking about the blackmail and the postcards, and here's what I find interesting. Nat, Tai and Misty got postcards, yet only Nat and Tai got ransom demands. Shauna got neither, as far as we know. Assuming she's not lying, I wonder why she hasn't been targeted? Tai is an obvious choice for blackmail because she has money, but Nat, not so much. She's living in a sleazy motel. Somebody would have to know she has a valuable car she could sell if necessary. Is it possible Jessica Roberts was trying to pull a double-cross?

Not really the point of your post, but just curious- has it been stated how Nat came to own the car?

[Cinnabon]

7 hours ago, TVMovieBuff said:

I agree with you & this. Jeff isn't a great orator. I think he meant, that he & Jackie were really nothing special together, just a marker during high school that would have ended when she went to college. Shauna is the real deal for him.

That’s how I heard it too.

[BitterApple]

11 minutes ago, Tatum said:

Not really the point of your post, but just curious- has it been stated how Nat came to own the car?

It hasn't, although general consensus is Nat bought it with settlement money. Nothing's been confirmed one way or another, though. 

[heatherchandler]

1 hour ago, tennisgurl said:

 

Everything with Shauna being haunted by teen Jackie will certainly take on a different meaning if Jackie really did get left behind. I am also concerned about where these visions are going with Lottie and Laura Lee, whether Lottie is actually psychic or psychotic, this seems like it could escalate really quickly into something cult-y. Things are getting more tense now, the sleepover vibe that Jackie has been aiming for is dissipating as reality is sinking in and the situation gets more dire. Things are still pretty smooth, no major blow ups and they still have their coach around to be the resident adult (here for safe sex talks and all) but you can see cracks starting to form.

 

I don't understand this theory.  I don't see people being left behind.  It's not like rescuers would find some of them and then just leave without searching the land thoroughly.  I have never been involved in a search and rescue but I doubt they would just take who they see and leave.

[blixie]

Quote

 it's such a quick shot. 

I finally had a chance to re-watch and yeah when he said look, I was like AT WHAT, I just heard the rustling. My multifocal lenses are getting a damn workout.
 

Quote

Shauna got neither, as far as we know. 

In the kitchen before Jeff reminds her about brunch, she's looking at what appears to be a postcard, before folding it up and putting it in her pocket.  Shauna lies a LOT so it wouldn't surprise me if it was the same postcard everyone else got.