Um, That's Not How It Originally Happened: Retcons Good & Bad

[Hiyo]

So what retcons has this show introduced that you either liked, disliked, or were pretty much indifferent to? It can include just about anything, revisionist history, long lost children, murders people committed that they forgot about, etc.

[WhitneyWhit]

Everything AJ/Carly related from the 90s and early 2000s. Especially the stair fiasco. AJ didn’t push her. No matter how many times it was repeated. 

[Hiyo]

I'm still trying to wrap my head around Ethan and how and when he was conceived/born...

[absnow54]

12 hours ago, Hiyo said:

I'm still trying to wrap my head around Ethan and how and when he was conceived/born...

Oh yeah, all the Luke being tortured with a domestic life.

Recently, they tried to retcon Carly and Jason's 90's relationship into his relationship with Robin.

[Cheyanne11]

3 minutes ago, absnow54 said:

Recently, they tried to retcon Carly and Jason's 90's relationship into his relationship with Robin.

By seeming to simply erase Robin from Jason's life.

I'm still like:

[GHScorpiosRule]

20 minutes ago, Cheyanne11 said:

By seeming to simply erase Robin from Jason's life.

I'm still like:

And I’m like

[Daisy]

I think one of the great storylines they had - and then walked it back was when they basically implied that Michael killed AJ.  I only think it was great because all the storybeats were there already. Michael was already used to using his body guards giving out "hits" like Sonny, he knew Sonny and jason were in the mob and killed people. he was kidnapped by AJ and learned about a lot of the stuff how AJ lost custody of him (pretty much a lot to unload on an eight year old) but imo going there would have opened a lot of doors for Qs vs. Carly about how Carly's choices of raising a child in the mob resulted in Michael being a murderer

But they walked it back and made it this shrink that Michael was seeing for some reason i can't remember. 

[Melgaypet]

An example of a good Retcon: Laura Has a Secret Cassadine Son! God, I loved all that Spencer vs. Cassadine shit in the 90s.

[Hiyo]

I've always been a bit iffy about the retcon itself, though I did like the stories it gave us.

[GHScorpiosRule]

1 hour ago, Melgaypet said:

An example of a good Retcon: Laura Has a Secret Cassadine Son! God, I loved all that Spencer vs. Cassadine shit in the 90s.

That was a good retcon because it was believable. Laura had been gone for over a year, and had been kidnapped by Stavros, forced into an illegal marriage (she was still married to Luke) and raped.

I don’t know if the introduction of Robin is a retcon since we didn’t really know much about Robert’s past other than that he was WSB. So bringing in Anna as a woman from his past, who he’d married was great. And then we got Robin.

I’m glad they walked back from the red-headed Demon Spawn SLS killing AJ. Otherwise we’d be saddled with years of him being praised for murdering the father he was stolen from and taught to hate and treated like the most EVUHLEST EVUHL who ever EVUHLED. Never mind that his mother is CUJO and white trash personified, who managed to make AJ fall off the wagon. And AJ was her friend. All so he wouldn’t ruin her PLAAAAAAANS.

Edited November 18, 2021 by GHScorpiosRule

[Melgaypet]

1 hour ago, GHScorpiosRule said:

And AJ was her friend.

Quoted because it can't be said enough. He was her friend! He trusted her, he confided in her, he liked her and she betrayed that horrendously. Not to protect her child from the Those Awful Quartermaines, but to hold on to the husband she stole from her own mother, who was tiring of her. Even Carly knew it, she felt genuine guilt over her actions (though not enough to stop, because Carly gonna Carly) at the time.

[racked]

5 hours ago, Melgaypet said:

An example of a good Retcon: Laura Has a Secret Cassadine Son! God, I loved all that Spencer vs. Cassadine shit in the 90s.

Rewatched this on YouTube last year and it still holds up. The dialogue writers back in the day were amazing and Tyler Christopher and Stefan Nichols sold that story so well. 

[jsbt]

10 hours ago, Daisy said:

I think one of the great storylines they had - and then walked it back was when they basically implied that Michael killed AJ.  I only think it was great because all the storybeats were there already. Michael was already used to using his body guards giving out "hits" like Sonny, he knew Sonny and jason were in the mob and killed people. he was kidnapped by AJ and learned about a lot of the stuff how AJ lost custody of him (pretty much a lot to unload on an eight year old) but imo going there would have opened a lot of doors for Qs vs. Carly about how Carly's choices of raising a child in the mob resulted in Michael being a murderer

But they walked it back and made it this shrink that Michael was seeing for some reason i can't remember. 

I get your feelings, though I disagree with them. I did want to mention since I think it's an interesting historical note: The Michael storyline got huge backlash and was part of the disaster (across many storylines) that was most of 2005, which led to a major retooling and the rehiring of Kimberly McCullough as Robin on contract with Jason Thompson as her love interest. They started bringing the hospital back into semi-focus at that point - it helped that Grey's Anatomy was also taking off around this time on primetime. I think it was the Michael story, though, that really cinched a major reset. Fans were livid that he killed his father.

IIRC, Dr. Thomas, Michael's shrink, killed A.J. because, we were told, A.J. had secretly tried to bribe him to kill Jason in the hospital after his accident in the '90s, in order to help A.J. escape blame. A.J. had the goods on him so Thomas 'killed' him. This is, of course, a disgusting retcon of its own which we can all ignore. (I remember vividly their attempt at a '90s flashback showing this, which had the shrink on one end of a phone discussing their deal, then clumsily cut to Billy Warlock stock footage from like 1998 hanging up a phone)

Speaking of insane retcons: As I mentioned not long ago I had a minor aneurysm when I discovered that, as they revisited the Rick Webber murder case in 2007 to exonerate Laura, they did this:

They're casually claiming here that Monica had renewed her affair with Rick when he returned in the summer of 2002. My brain imploded a bit, but I guess it's possible.

[Daisy]

19 minutes ago, jsbt said:

IIRC, Dr. Thomas, Michael's shrink, killed A.J. because, we were told, A.J. had secretly tried to bribe him to kill Jason in the hospital after his accident in the '90s, in order to help A.J. escape blame. A.J. had the goods on him so Thomas 'killed' him. This is, of course, a disgusting retcon of its own which we can all ignore. (I remember vividly their attempt at a '90s flashback showing this, which had the shrink on one end of a phone discussing their deal, then clumsily cut to Billy Warlock stock footage from like 1998 hanging up a phone)

oh yeah... that's what happened. which was dumb. 

I didn't realise that's what led to the advent of SCRUBS. that's kinda cool.

I figure most people would disagree with me(LOL i'm used to it). I didn't like the storyline either at the time, but i just think, looking back at it, I do see why they were going there, and you know, if people across all eras didn't let the Corinthii get away with anything this would have been a real watershed moment (and i thought it was kinda gutsy for them to even go there).

[jsbt]

12 minutes ago, Daisy said:

I figure most people would disagree with me(LOL i'm used to it). I didn't like the storyline either at the time, but i just think, looking back at it, I do see why they were going there, and you know, if people across all eras didn't let the Corinthii get away with anything this would have been a real watershed moment (and i thought it was kinda gutsy for them to even go there).

I think the closest they came to that was Michael's rape, where everyone and their brother went around for awhile basically admitting they'd totally fucked up raising Michael and destroyed his life. But yeah, I take the point.

[Hiyo]

Quote

we were told, A.J. had secretly tried to bribe him to kill Jason in the hospital after his accident in the '90s, in order to help A.J. escape blame.

Ugh.

[ffwbe]

11 hours ago, Daisy said:

oh yeah... that's what happened. which was dumb. 

I didn't realise that's what led to the advent of SCRUBS. that's kinda cool.

I figure most people would disagree with me(LOL i'm used to it). I didn't like the storyline either at the time, but i just think, looking back at it, I do see why they were going there, and you know, if people across all eras didn't let the Corinthii get away with anything this would have been a real watershed moment (and i thought it was kinda gutsy for them to even go there).

I’ll agree with you on this one. That Michael was a budding sociopath so while dark, I thought it made sense. There should have been some kind of realization of the ramifications of raising Michael in this world. Not just the danger, which we saw, but the behavior that he witnessed and was normalized. Even when they retconned the murder, DC’s Michael was still pretty messed up and seemed like he was groomed to jump into the mob life. They only pulled back on that once he was recast with CD and we ended up with this well adjusted, milquetoast CEO Michael. 

[GHScorpiosRule]

8 hours ago, ffwbe said:

DC’s Michael was still pretty messed up and seemed like he was groomed to jump into the mob life. They only pulled back on that once he was recast with CD and we ended up with this well adjusted, milquetoast CEO Michael. 

No, we had the talented Drew Garrett, who was the first SORASed SLS, and he had all that anger, and wanted to take over da bidnez; but was fired and Duell was recast because apparently, TPTB didn't think Drew could do "vulnerable" and play a rape victim. Which, his other performances on other shows, proved otherwise.

Red-Headed Spawn was already a thug in the making.

Edited November 20, 2021 by GHScorpiosRule

[Daisy]

24 minutes ago, ffwbe said:

I’ll agree with you on this one. That Michael was a budding sociopath so while dark, I thought it made sense. There should have been some kind of realization of the ramifications of raising Michael in this world. Not just the danger, which we saw, but the behavior that he witnessed and was normalized. Even when they retconned the murder, DC’s Michael was still pretty messed up and seemed like he was groomed to jump into the mob life. They only pulled back on that once he was recast with CD and we ended up with this well adjusted, milquetoast CEO Michael. 

and quite frankly, even well adjusted milquetoast CEO Michael kinda leaps at the chance to take over whenever the issue is that sonny can't do it and everyone has to talk him down. even if they wanna use the rape as the change that made him want to be less mobby...i just think basically until he stopped being Red Head Michael and Blonde Michael.. it was obvious that despite Carly's wishes for him "not to be mob" it was obviously heading that way

[yowsah1]

What the show did to A.J. Quartermain will always be the worst retcon in it's history.  Always.

[methodwriter85]

Watching Genie Francis trying her best to spin gold out of her p.o.s. 2002 exit storyline where she realizes that she killed Rick's mistress as a teenager and then "kills Rick" in the present was really disheartening to watch. Also, the Teenaged Laura was kind of hilarious because damn it, we know what she looked like as a teenager and it wasn't a bleach blonde tart with heavy eyeliner.

I can't think of anything GH has done that has been more offensive though than the "Unabortion" retcon storyline from AMC or "Jessica Buchanan, Kiddie Porn Star" retcon from One Life to Live. Those were so offensive on so many levels and just plain hurtful. I cannot believe they were actually allowed to do those storylines.

[Hiyo]

Yeah, there had to have been a better way to write out Laura that time than that retconned nonsense. Which the show must have realized on some level since they retconned her killing Rick a few years later anyway.

[KittenPokerCheater]

Wasn't there a storyline when Sam hired a Hooker to sleep with Michael after his awful assault in prison, but then they retconned it so that Sam asked her friend to hang out with Michael and she took it upon herself to sleep with him?

And then I think she died offscreen in some tragic accident.

[30 Helens]

That would be Flat Abby, crushed by crane. I don’t think that was really a retcon, though— I think she was always a friend of Sam’s,  and Sam asked her to help Mikey out because Sam knew Abby to be a kind and gentle hooker, capable of nursing psychically damaged young lads back to good sexual health. Or something like that. I guess the retcon might be that Sam had a hooker friend. Or that Sam had friends at all.

[methodwriter85]

On 11/18/2021 at 12:31 PM, absnow54 said:

Oh yeah, all the Luke being tortured with a domestic life.

Which makes zero sense, because everything about the 1993 return with Lucky indicated that Luke and Laura had lived vagbond seat of the pants kind of lives. They weren't domesticated until they lived in that gorgeous craftsman house set. Ethan really should have been Robert's or he should have just been a Lucky recast. I think it was all just to give Emma a storyline as well as yet again try to diminish Genie Francis.

Edited November 21, 2021 by methodwriter85

[dubbel zout]

18 minutes ago, 30 Helens said:

I don’t think that was really a retcon, though

It was more of an adjustment, IMO. Someone realized Michael being sexually healed by a hooker probably wasn't a good idea, so they made Abby a stripper instead. Which is also problematic as hell, but this is TFGH.

[Hiyo]

Quote

Which makes zero sense, because everything about the 1993 return with Lucky indicated that Luke and Laura had lived vagbond seat of the pants kind of lives.

Not to mention 1984 Luke was genuinely very happy when Laura told him she was pregnant. I guess we're supposed to think he was faking it...*rolls eyes*...

[absnow54]

5 hours ago, methodwriter85 said:

Ethan really should have been Robert's or he should have just been a Lucky recast. I think it was all just to give Emma a storyline as well as yet again try to diminish Genie Francis.

Also, Tony Geary hated Greg Vaughn, and wanted an insta-son replacement, so it was an FU to him too. 

[Hiyo]

Ironic, since JJ returned to the role of Lucky 9 months later...

[Hater]

The nobody knows who shot Hayden story this year.  Just awful. 

[GHScorpiosRule]

On 11/21/2021 at 2:55 PM, methodwriter85 said:

Ethan really should have been Robert's or he should have just been a Lucky recast.

Totally disagree about the bolded. Marble mouth could barely be understood when he spoke. This show has really sucked with the Lucky recasts: we had Yeller McYellerson (who apparently was "approved" by both Anthony and Genie), then Greg Vaughn who just wasn't Lucky. Dumbed down version, who wasn't cunning or had street smarts or even technology smarts, which Jonathan Jackson's Lucky did.

Edited November 23, 2021 by GHScorpiosRule

[absnow54]

1 minute ago, GHScorpiosRule said:

This show has really sucked with the Lucky recasts: we had Yelly McYellerson (who apparent was "approved" by both Anthony and Genie), then Greg Vaughn who just wasn't Lucky.

Which is why this board often calls GV's character Larry.

[GHScorpiosRule]

Just now, absnow54 said:

Which is why this board often calls GV's character Larry.

Yup!

[Hiyo]

I do agree though that Ethan would have worked better being the son of Holly and Robert, though.

[dubbel zout]

20 minutes ago, Hiyo said:

I do agree though that Ethan would have worked better being the son of Holly and Robert, though.

No one deserves that dope. That was a retcon I truly despised. I hate that it was done so Geary could slobber over Nathan Parsons. Yuck.

[jsbt]

I didn't mind Ethan initially, but ultimately his entire role became simply to be Off-Brand Lucky for Tony to lavish adoration upon for, uh, reasons. I heard (though can't confirm) that it was TG that insisted Ethan be his kid, which was ridiculous, but when JJ returned Ethan was completely superfluous.

They had half a dozen chances to make Ethan Robert and Holly's and didn't take it, the last one IMO (in early 2012, under Carlivati) was likely a legit attempt but I suspect TG raised hell about it, like a lot of things he vetoed for Luke when the new regime arrived. By the time Ethan left I was so sick of his smugness. Today he's Mr. Charisma compared to some of these leads.

Edited November 22, 2021 by jsbt

[absnow54]

I think Ethan was intended to be Robert's. I remember his first meeting with Robin was significant, and all the writing was on the wall. TG definitely threw his weight around to hijack that story.

[GHScorpiosRule]

I don't recall if Tristan himself said it, or it was an edict back from the 80s, that Robin was to be the only child Robert and Anna* would have.

 

*Yes, when she was on All My Children, Anna had a daughter, but I don't think she was ever mentioned on this show; and she miscarried the child she had with Duke. I never believed Heinrik was hers, so glad they fixed that horridness.

[tvgoddess]

2 hours ago, Hiyo said:

I do agree though that Ethan would have worked better being the son of Holly and Robert, though.

Definitely, especially since Lulu kissed her half brother.

[Cheyanne11]

2 hours ago, GHScorpiosRule said:

I don't recall if Tristan himself said it, or it was an edict back from the 80s, that Robin was to be the only child Robert and Anna* would have.

Why?  If Luke and Laura could have more than one kid, most definitely Robert and Anna could. 

[GHScorpiosRule]

6 minutes ago, Cheyanne11 said:

Why?  If Luke and Laura could have more than one kid, most definitely Robert and Anna could. 

I don't know. I remember reading something about it back on the TWoP board. Like I posted, I don't remember if Tristan said it or if it was TPTB; I do know in a televised interview, both Tristan and Finola said that they both weren't parents when Robert and Anna became Robin's parents. They joked that they got to practice on Kimberly!

[KittenPokerCheater]

I believe that Tristan threw his weight around when there was a WTD about....was it Lucas?  Robert hooked up with a someone and she claimed the child was his.  Tristan (allegedly) said that the only child Robert would have is Robin and so the baby was retconned or rewritten on the fly that the baby's father was a Jerome.  I think?

[GHScorpiosRule]

Just now, KittenPokerCheater said:

I believe that Tristan threw his weight around when there was a WTD about....was it Lucas?  Robert hooked up with a someone and she claimed the child was his.  Tristan (allegedly) said that the only child Robert would have is Robin and so the baby was retconned or rewritten on the fly that the baby's father was a Jerome.  I think?

The woman was Cheryl, Tiffany's sister. And yes, Lucas was the baby and ended up being Julian Jerome's.

[Francie]

2 hours ago, KittenPokerCheater said:

I believe that Tristan threw his weight around when there was a WTD about....was it Lucas?  Robert hooked up with a someone and she claimed the child was his.  Tristan (allegedly) said that the only child Robert would have is Robin and so the baby was retconned or rewritten on the fly that the baby's father was a Jerome.  I think?

Yes, they clearly were going for Cheryl's child (Lucas) to be Robert's. It all had to do with Cheryl running away and having the baby, only to be told that it had died. They showed her crying for Robert at the time. But, of course, the baby didn't die. Instead, the doctor (nurse?) snatched the baby for sale on the black market. Bobbie bought the baby, and then had Robert be named the godfather. That seemed kinda random, given taht while Bobbie and Robert were friends, they were definitely in different circles. Bobbie had her Brownstone and hospital crew, and Robert had his police work and secret agent friends. 

But Tristan had no interest in Robert having another child and, as you said, threw his weight around, and TPTB were forced to rewrite that Cheryl had somehow hooked up with Julian -- again. It made no sense, but there you have it. 

For selfish reasons, I'm totally fine with Ethan not being Robert's. ;) 

[TeeVee329]

9 hours ago, GHScorpiosRule said:

*Yes, when she was on All My Children, Anna had a daughter, but I don't think she was ever mentioned on this show

They did mention Leora - and by name, to my shock - once on GH, when Anna was diagnosed with that blood disease or whatever.

Thinking about bad retcons on this show, hey, how about the Text Message Killer being Zombie!Diego?

[GHScorpiosRule]

11 hours ago, TeeVee329 said:

They did mention Leora - and by name, to my shock - once on GH, when Anna was diagnosed with that blood disease or whatever

Oh. I was on the Barge when that story line was spawned, so missed it.

Frankly, I don't care that Tristan threw "his weight around" back then. At least he also got to do it, and not just Anthony Geary. Sue me.

[Hiyo]

Leora doesn't count though with regards to that edict, since the father was an AMC character and not Robert.

[GHScorpiosRule]

19 minutes ago, Hiyo said:

Leora doesn't count though with regards to that edict, since the father was an AMC character and not Robert.

I think @TeeVee329 was just clarifying that Anna did eventually get to mention that she had another child besides Robin. In my original post above, I had stated how Finola/Anna wasn't allowed to mention that she had another child (albeit on another soap). Not to be conflated with Tristan insisting that Robin be Robert's only child.

Edited November 23, 2021 by GHScorpiosRule

[Hiyo]

Ah, I thought the edict was Robert and Anna together couldn't have any children besides Robin.

[GHScorpiosRule]

6 minutes ago, Hiyo said:

Ah, I thought the edict was Robert and Anna together couldn't have any children besides Robin.

It was. Sorry for the confusion.

I mean, Anna was pregnant with Duke's child, which she miscarried when Olivia Jerome did something (I'm blanking on what, but I do remember how she made Olivia pay-I miss that Anna); and then Leora on All My Children. But I noticed before the blood disorder plot!, Anna wasn't allowed to mention that she had another child besides Robin.

I don't know why. I only know this because of the articles I'd read and comments from the other board.