S06.E19: Reunion Part 2

[Sweet-tea]

16 hours ago, RealReality said:

Far be it from me to correct you.  But Karen called gizelle a broke ho from Hampton College with a hot box.  

And if broke ho with the clap isn't a low blow, I'm not sure what is....oh wait, it's when gizelle wore that uncle Ben shirt.  

Yes, that was pretty nasty of Karen. I was surprised she got off so easy. They just blew it off. 

I don't know who did Robyn's makeup, but it looks awful. She looks rough. Ashley looks lovely. 

Candiace isn't exactly receptive to constructive criticism, is she? 

[Bronzedog]

Really, the highlight of the Reunion was Robyn discussing her possible constipation situation.

[lilmarysunshine]

21 hours ago, drivethroo said:

 

And good gracious! Size 12 feet?  Mia, you ARE Big Foot!

Hey, now. Size 11 here and average height, even. At least Mia has the height.

[drivethroo]

6 hours ago, Sweet-tea said:

Candiace isn't exactly receptive to constructive criticism, is she? 

I think she would be receptive to constructive criticism but the problem is the criticism she gets is just criticism, not constructive.  That criticism just isn't going to be received from people who are doing the same thing as her and receiving little to none of the same criticism & backlash as she.  It's certainly not going to be received from people who have tried to get her fired, tried to organize an icing out and who inserted themselves into legal matters they had nothing to do with and events they weren't present for.

I think if Wendy or Askale said "Hey, maybe you could respond like XYZ when they do ABC" it would probably be received better.

Why would Candiace take "constructive criticism" from any of the following people?

• Karen (the person who tried to get her fired & who started out the season verbally abusing Gizelle): We are not going to tolerate your verbal abuse anymore!
• Mia (who started the dustup b/w her & Candiace in the first place): You are overdue for an ass whipping!
• Gizelle (who railed against Monique all last season for violence): If Mia had clocked you, oh well!
• Robyn (who ran up on 2 cast members in an aggressive fashion): Don't you think you take it too far?
• Ashley (who has been provoking & derogatory towards Candiace for several seasons): How could I have possibly offended YOU?
• Andy Cohen --who routinely giggles over & rewards bad behavior---Porsha from RHOA has been involved in multiple physical altercations with cast members, spread nasty rumors & stole her cast member's husband ---how's that working out for Porsha?

The best way to deal with Candiace is to leave her alone.  Karen blares on the stage "We are not going to tolerate your verbal abuse."  Then stop talking to her and giving her an opportunity to verbally abuse you.  Stop putting yourself in situations to get verbally abused by Candiace.  If the cast want to go out for drinks and not have to worry about Candiace cutting up in public, embarrassing them in front of the white folks...don't invite her along.

To those who will say "Well Chris has been saying the same thing!"...Chris is a people pleaser & wants to be part of the Get Along Gang and you can't always be part of the Get Along Gang in this life.

At this point I think Candiace would be more concerned with the opinions and feedback of those in the entertainment community than those of "Karen from RHOP."

 

Edited November 16, 2021 by drivethroo

[RealReality]

20 hours ago, truthaboutluv said:

 

 

18 hours ago, Boofish said:

I am not denying from a fan or viewer perspective, colorism exists. But I don't think it exist on this show. The fundamental problem, deep down that none of them want to discuss - no one likes Candiace. For whatever reason, Candiace is TOLERATED. Every single "friendship" she thought she was forming has fallen apart and every single one of these ladies at some point prodded her into saying the things she did and they use that as an excuse instead of just admitting the truth. Candiace can compare her transgressions to the others all day everyday and it won't matter - not because her skin is dark. She needs to admit they just don't like her and move on. 

I dont particularly think the show has borne that out. 

Wendy came on the show as candaces friend and she spent a lot of last season sticking up for Candiace and looking out for her.  They were friends this season too. 

Karen started out this season by saying that she knew she had a lot of work to do to get back her relationship with Candiace, which suggests that she likes candiace enough to want that relationship back that they had.  

Apparently grace was close enough to candace to see her as a "cool older sister " type figure and that's why she had been worried about scraping her car tires.  

Sounds like gizelles own kids may like candace more than they like her.  But having a relationship with grace suggests that gizelle likes her.. otherwise why even allow for any relationship to form with your kids?

So, it doesn't seem like the "no one likes candiace" narrative is borne out.  

BUT, even more to the point, if they are TOLERATING Candiace it's because they realize she is necessary.  They can keep crying about icing her out but they don't have a show without her, unless people want more boring scenes of gizelle refusing to talk about her personal life, Mia lying, Ashley breastfeeding and concern trolling and Karen trying to sell whatever La dame thing she has going.  

They should be dared to put their money where their mouth is.  But I'm guessing that they will all fold.  

[islandgal140]

22 hours ago, drivethroo said:

Who called who a drug addict? We've never even really seen Gizelle drink that much so if Karen is calling Gizelle a "drug addict," that's very far fetched.  It's also damaging since Gizelle has 3 minor children that could be impacted by a statement of their mother being a drug addict.

Candiace saying "yo momma" is much lower than calling somebody a drug addict, though.

Candiace actually kept the crying to a minimum on this reunion.  Growth.

I don't think a beneficial or productive conversation about colorism can be had within the cast because the cast members who are scoffing at Candiace's claims of colorism are the ones who are benefitting from it.  Those cast members would just say Candiace is unlikeable and that's why she gets the heat more than them.  Both situations can actually be true.

A prime example this season is Candiace vs Mia and Ashley vs. Mia.  Candiace was all sorts of terrible for saying "yo momma" but not a blip when Ashley asked if G had Alzheimers.  Karen didn't cry about it and one if not both of her parents died from Alzheimers ---it was a big reason why she was mad at Gizelle.

Another example is excusing physical violence.  Why was it so terrible, so bad when Monique put her hands on Candiace and there were songs and remixes about "We as black women don't do that" and "Monique, you have destroyed the image of black women on this show" but it's ok for light skinned Mia to whip Candiace's ass if need be.  We're gonna shrug and say "Oh well you had it coming" when Mia does it but "Monique turned the show into Love & Hip Hop" when she did it? Also, Mia was physically provoking to Wendy (the other dark skinned person on the cast) on several occasions and not one person took Mia to task about that.

• Just like they didn't take Robyn to task about running up in Ashley's job to physically confront her.
• Just like they didn't take Robyn to task for trying to fight Monique on the street.
• Just like they didn't take Ashley to task for getting up in Candiace's face in Candiace's home and that's what led to the butter knife incident

 Gizelle "wished death" on Ray but we didn't see Karen running to HR claiming to be "scared."  "We're scared" (whether it's Candiace, Wendy or Monique doing the scaring) only seems to happen with the darker skinned cast members, so I don't think "The OGs" would be able to have a productive conversation about colorism because they reap the benefits of it.

Ironically, I think of the 4 OGs, Robyn (the one who looks the most Caucasian) would probably be the one who is the most reasonable about colorism.  Karen, Gizelle and Ashley?  Nope.

 

Everything is on point in this post but I have to disagree with the bolded. It was Robyn who basically said that if you took Candiace's words and put them in Karen's or Gizelle's mouth they would sound less harsh and not offensive and come off more playful.  So basically easier to take coming out of the light skin chick's mouth - the very definition of colorism. 

They have it in their mind now and it is the official narrative of the show that Candiace's mouth is hellfire. Now, anytime she tells someone they have a run in their stocking, they will hear it as her damning their soul to eternal hell! Seriously, 'yo mama' the 1970s go to insult hurled by Fred Sanford, Aunt Esther or George Jefferson is now the greatest insult in the world. 

I've been loving Wendy keeping her foot on Gizelle's multi-neck. I don't care that her reads are coming off rehearsed to some. She still manages to be quick on her feet in the moment. Plus, I think her anger at Gizelle is justified. Why bring something you know to be lie on the show? To be a messy bitch!

Gizelle should've rehearsed some, maybe she would look less like a deer in some headlights if she did. It is like she learned nothing from last year. 

Gizelle's style? Used to be funny but now that I have seen what she has done to that poor house, I don't even know if I can laugh at it anymore because I almost think her problem may be medical.  Who does that to a house? I think she will not see maximum resale value in it because of the disjointed renovations. Jesus be an architect!

I get that people find the 'you ain't got no man' digs as misogynistic, which they are, however, it is hitting Gizelle where she lives. It is a sensitive point for her because one does get the sense that she wants a relationship and sees great value in being in one to the point of going back to a man who served her the greatest humiliation of her life. If I don't like a bitch, best believe, I am gonna hit her where she lives about an issue she is sensitive about. True facts!

 

Edited November 16, 2021 by islandgal140

[CatMomma]

21 hours ago, Yours Truly said:

 

Continuing to point out that they do indeed throw shade at each other without acknowledging that the shade doesn’t come with aggressive body language and threatening behavior like during CandyAss’s episodes just shows how delusional and oblivious Wendy and CandyAss INTEND to be on the matter. 🙄

And This coming from someone who’s really dislikes Gizelle and Robin. 

I mean, I guess it never got to that level between Gizelle and Karen. But, I certainly don't remember them going this hard on Robyn who certainly HAS shown aggressive body language toward Monique and Ashley. Much more than Candiace. 

[CatMomma]

41 minutes ago, islandgal140 said:

 

I get that people find the 'you ain't got no man' digs as misogynistic, which they are, however, it is hitting Gizelle where she lives. It is a sensitive point for her because one does get the sense that she wants a relationship and sees great value in being in one to the point of going back to a man who served her the greatest humiliation of her life. If I don't like a bitch, best believe, I am gonna hit her where she lives about an issue she is sensitive about. True facts!

 

Nah. Still misogynistic. Just say, "You are so desperate for a man, you willing to put up with someone who humiliated you publicly and you're own kids can't stand him."

Succinct and true. No need to imply a woman's worth is based on having a man. Just point out that Gizelle's worth is based on having a man. Someone with 1000 PHDs should be able to come up with a better come back.

[drivethroo]

1 hour ago, islandgal140 said:

I think she will not see maximum resale value in it because of the disjointed renovations. Jesus be an architect!

Gizelle will see maximum resale value for her house because of the land and the location; I think she has at least an acre of land, and I've heard she had up to 3 acres of land.

When Gizelle sells the house, they are going to tear down the house and put up a fresh new mansion because that's what they do in the DC area: builders will buy a small bungalow for $500K+, tear it down and build a McMansion on it and sell it for a million plus. You'll drive through Arlington, you'll drive through Fairfax and see little houses next door to McMansions and when those little houses get sold, they will be torn down & a McMansion will take its' place.

That's why Gizelle got mad at Candiace's "$900K Tear Down Cabin" remark because she knows if she had the money like that, she would've torn that house down and build a fresh new house from the ground up.  But she doesn't have the money like that which is why her house looks like an office condominium, a rancher and a picnic shelter stapled together.

Nevertheless, when Gizelle sells her house, she will see a nice profit because of the lot size and the location.  Robyn & Candiace probably paid around the same amount of money Gizelle did and got better looking houses but Gizelle's house's location is more desirable than Robyn or Candiace's

[qtpye]

21 hours ago, Yours Truly said:

I think it’s very sad that the issues of biracial seem to be disregarded in the face of the darker skinned. I mean, so now biracial lighter skinned folk have got no say in anything either? Are we saying that the plights of the darker skinned are to be prioritized over the lighter skinned? So biracial people should be ashameD of themselves because they don’t put the injustices of darker skinned people above their own discriminatory experiences because the prejudices they face are different from the prejudices of there darker counter parts? I mean, is it really gonna boil down to my hardships are worse than yours so you can’t speak on anything? I get it when OUTSIDERS try to speak on it but at in reality you can’t just snatch the voice away from people based only on a half a shade difference. 
I know that Ashley is on the lighter side obviously but I couldn’t help but focus, at one point, at the neck and shoulders of both CandyAss and Ashley but they don’t look all that different in color. 

Being biracial comes with its own slew of problems so to act like any of these lighter ladies would be free and clear of most racial injustices because they are lighter but CLEARLY POC seems really cold to me. Cause as light as they may be in the wrong situation there is enough evident blackness that will still find them on the wrong side of justice and at the end of the day I think it’s wrong to treat them as if They don’t face that same harsh reality.
 

 

I really hope Candiace has some biracial friends (not Ashley) to talk to because if she ever has children with Chris, they will be biracial.

Also, many of the lighter cast members have lovely brown-skinned daughters that will grow up with the same privilege and advantages that Candiace had in her childhood.

[bichonblitz]

On 11/15/2021 at 3:30 AM, drivethroo said:

In light of the revelation of her trying to get Candiace fired last year coming out, I wouldn't be surprised if Karen pulled a Karen and tried that trick again.

I hope it works this time. 

On 11/15/2021 at 1:39 AM, RealReality said:

Karen called gizelle a broke ho from Hampton College with a hot box.  

Karen has the slickest mouth of all of them. She just doesn't scream as loud as Candyass, and she doesn't cry. I think for some reason Andy really likes Karen therefore she gets away with her ridiculous nonsensical comments without being called out on it. 

[drivethroo]

The only biracial person whose experience was disregarded on this show was Katie, not Ashley. And that wasn't even by Candiace.  No one has ever dissed Ashley for being biracial or for being in an interracial relationship.  Ashley was just putting on the tragic mulatto act at the reunion because Candiace was pointing out the double standards within the group.

Candiace never called Michael a "slave driver" in those 2.5 year old tweets Ashley is still whining about*.   Candiace said Michael was Ashley's overseer (in response to Ashley tweeting something about Dorothy controlling Chris' pockets ---conveniently deleting all of her tweets from that exchange).  

Ashley is the one who claimed Candiace called her a slave, to which Candiace agreed.  Everyone at that table knows after Michael tossed out Ashley on the side of Glebe Road with nothing more than a Hefty bag full of clothes that once he took her back, anytime he says "Jump," Ashley will ask "How high?"

Ashley is completely financially controlled by Michael because her BRAVO check is probably going towards keeping Sheila from living under I-270 with her bum boyfriend.  She's the only Housewife who has nothing going on, no outside projects, nothing except laying on her back and having babies.

The majority of the cast has always been light skinned and/or biracial women so this notion of light skinned/biracial women being silenced on RHOP is silly.

Ashley brought up being biracial to put on as a shield to escape accountability against bad dark Candiace who was correctly pointing out the double standards within the group and how the lighter skinned cast members reap the benefits of those double standards.

Karen, Mia and Gizelle having dark skinned daughters has nothing to do with the double standards they choose to exercise within the group.  If anything they'll insist their daughters are an exception to "the rest."

I don't think Candiace needs a "biracial friend" to talk to because that suggests Candiace doesn't have compassion towards Ashley because she's biracial when the issue is Candiace doesn't have compassion towards Ashley because she's a sneaky bitch.

*Again, everyone can pull up things from yesteryear about Candiace but if she does it to them, that's "old news" or "so long ago."  So if we are not to pull up things from "long ago," why are you still crying over some tweets from "long ago?"  Unless the tweet struck a nerve because Michael does drive his slaves?

 

 

 

Edited November 16, 2021 by drivethroo

[Yours Truly]

2 hours ago, CatMomma said:

I mean, I guess it never got to that level between Gizelle and Karen. But, I certainly don't remember them going this hard on Robyn who certainly HAS shown aggressive body language toward Monique and Ashley. Much more than Candiace. 

That’s probably because Robyn didn’t catch a case and doesn’t ALWAYS handle a confrontation like there’s a case waiting for her around the corner. LOL! 💁🏻‍♀️

Edited November 16, 2021 by Yours Truly

[Yours Truly]

Oh and I keep forgetting to post about Gizelle’s comment when CandyAss was screaming at Mia about getting her ass beat. I burst out laughing at that delivery.. Candaice: “you gonna beat my ass..?” Gizelle: “I hope not, she’s 3x’s bigger than you”… 🤣🤣🤣🤣

I was on the floor! I had to rewind a couple of times.. 😂😂😆😆

It’s like I could see the cartoon thought bubble above her head “See, child this is the reason we are sitting here giving you advice. We are trying to save you from YOURSELF! 🤦🏻‍♀️“ 

Hysterical!! 😆😆

Edited November 16, 2021 by Yours Truly

[qtpye]

7 hours ago, drivethroo said:

The only biracial person whose experience was disregarded on this show was Katie, not Ashley. And that wasn't even by Candiace.  No one has ever dissed Ashley for being biracial or for being in an interracial relationship.  Ashley was just putting on the tragic mulatto act at the reunion because Candiace was pointing out the double standards within the group.

Candiace never called Michael a "slave driver" in those 2.5 year old tweets Ashley is still whining about*.   Candiace said Michael was Ashley's overseer (in response to Ashley tweeting something about Dorothy controlling Chris' pockets ---conveniently deleting all of her tweets from that exchange).  

Ashley is the one who claimed Candiace called her a slave, to which Candiace agreed.  Everyone at that table knows after Michael tossed out Ashley on the side of Glebe Road with nothing more than a Hefty bag full of clothes that once he took her back, anytime he says "Jump," Ashley will ask "How high?"

Ashley is completely financially controlled by Michael because her BRAVO check is probably going towards keeping Sheila from living under I-270 with her bum boyfriend.  She's the only Housewife who has nothing going on, no outside projects, nothing except laying on her back and having babies.

The majority of the cast has always been light skinned and/or biracial women so this notion of light skinned/biracial women being silenced on RHOP is silly.

Ashley brought up being biracial to put on as a shield to escape accountability against bad dark Candiace who was correctly pointing out the double standards within the group and how the lighter skinned cast members reap the benefits of those double standards.

Karen, Mia and Gizelle having dark skinned daughters has nothing to do with the double standards they choose to exercise within the group.  If anything they'll insist their daughters are an exception to "the rest."

I don't think Candiace needs a "biracial friend" to talk to because that suggests Candiace doesn't have compassion towards Ashley because she's biracial when the issue is Candiace doesn't have compassion towards Ashley because she's a sneaky bitch.

*Again, everyone can pull up things from yesteryear about Candiace but if she does it to them, that's "old news" or "so long ago."  So if we are not to pull up things from "long ago," why are you still crying over some tweets from "long ago?"  Unless the tweet struck a nerve because Michael does drive his slaves?

 

 

 

I agree.

[qtpye]

8 hours ago, drivethroo said:

The majority of the cast has always been light skinned and/or biracial women so this notion of light skinned/biracial women being silenced on RHOP is silly.

Ashley brought up being biracial to put on as a shield to escape accountability against bad dark Candiace who was correctly pointing out the double standards within the group and how the lighter skinned cast members reap the benefits of those double standards.

Karen, Mia and Gizelle having dark skinned daughters has nothing to do with the double standards they choose to exercise within the group.  If anything they'll insist their daughters are an exception to "the rest."

I have written on the Candiace thread that I have a light-skinned cousin who only dated dark skin men because they put her on a pedestal. She is extremely colorist, even though she has a dark-skinned daughter she loves. It is why I never bought the argument that a person can not be a colorist if  they date a dark-skinned person, just like I don't believe a white person can not be racist if they are dating a person of color

That is one of the reasons that I said that Candiace should not go to Ashley but the biracial experience is unique, Candicace may or may not appreciate that. If she feels prepared to handle that then she is fine without talking to anyone.

 

 

[Sweet-tea]

On 11/16/2021 at 12:57 AM, drivethroo said:

I think she would be receptive to constructive criticism but the problem is the criticism she gets is just criticism, not constructive.  That criticism just isn't going to be received from people who are doing the same thing as her and receiving little to none of the same criticism & backlash as she.  It's certainly not going to be received from people who have tried to get her fired, tried to organize an icing out and who inserted themselves into legal matters they had nothing to do with and events they weren't present for.

I think if Wendy or Askale said "Hey, maybe you could respond like XYZ when they do ABC" it would probably be received better.

Why would Candiace take "constructive criticism" from any of the following people?

• Karen (the person who tried to get her fired & who started out the season verbally abusing Gizelle): We are not going to tolerate your verbal abuse anymore!
• Mia (who started the dustup b/w her & Candiace in the first place): You are overdue for an ass whipping!
• Gizelle (who railed against Monique all last season for violence): If Mia had clocked you, oh well!
• Robyn (who ran up on 2 cast members in an aggressive fashion): Don't you think you take it too far?
• Ashley (who has been provoking & derogatory towards Candiace for several seasons): How could I have possibly offended YOU?
• Andy Cohen --who routinely giggles over & rewards bad behavior---Porsha from RHOA has been involved in multiple physical altercations with cast members, spread nasty rumors & stole her cast member's husband ---how's that working out for Porsha?

The best way to deal with Candiace is to leave her alone.  Karen blares on the stage "We are not going to tolerate your verbal abuse."  Then stop talking to her and giving her an opportunity to verbally abuse you.  Stop putting yourself in situations to get verbally abused by Candiace.  If the cast want to go out for drinks and not have to worry about Candiace cutting up in public, embarrassing them in front of the white folks...don't invite her along.

To those who will say "Well Chris has been saying the same thing!"...Chris is a people pleaser & wants to be part of the Get Along Gang and you can't always be part of the Get Along Gang in this life.

At this point I think Candiace would be more concerned with the opinions and feedback of those in the entertainment community than those of "Karen from RHOP."

 

I think Andy was trying to give her constructive criticism when he said "the common denominator is you" or something to that effect. She wasn't listening. 

[drivethroo]

1 hour ago, Sweet-tea said:

I think Andy was trying to give her constructive criticism when he said "the common denominator is you" or something to that effect. She wasn't listening. 

That wasn't "constructive criticism," that was just criticism.  Which is fine but be honest about your motives and biases.

According to Asana.com, Constructive criticism focuses on constructive feedback, provided by specific examples, to help you improve in some area and should be given in a friendly manner with good intentions.  Then the person offering the constructive criticism should help the person they're criticizing come up with some solutions for improvement.

Telling Candiace "The common denominator is you" puts blame on Candiace and justifies what others have done to her.  It says "Candiace, it's your fault you were assaulted."  That is not constructive criticism.  It's just criticism.

Telling Candiace "You're overdue for an asswhipping," "If Mia had clocked you, oh well," "Don't you think you take things too far?" "We're not to tolerate your verbal abuse" and "You're going out in public being nasty to people" is not constructive criticism because all of that says "You deserve(d) to be physically assaulted."  

That is the message Andy Cohen and the cast told Candiace on that stage: You deserve to be assaulted.

If the cast's and Andy's specific concern was really about Candiace escalating things in a physical manner then that's what they would focus on but the cast's/Andy's concern is about Candiace's mouth.  To be clear, Karen did bring up the lettuce throwing but 99% of the cast's/Andy's annoyance with Candiace is with her mouth.  Even after bringing up the lettuce, Karen claimed Candiace is going to the store, going out in public and just randomly popping off on people.

Chris tries to give Candiace constructive criticism but he goes about it the wrong way because he puts the blame on her, doesn't give her any solutions other than "let it go", doesn't practice what he preaches and then doesn't back her up.

Constructive criticism from Chris needs to be: I know Karen/Ashley/Michael Rappaport/Gizelle/Andy Cohen/people on Twitter etc get on your nerves.  Whenever they say X you say Y and then it makes you look bad even though they provoked it.  I don't want them to ruin what you've got going on because all they've got is the show and you have so many opportunities in front of you.  When Ashley/Karen/Gizelle start up with you, maybe try paying them dust and then they will look stupid.  If we're at group events and they start with the bullshit, let's just leave.  We don't have to leave the event, we'll just leave the area.  I've got your back and if I disagree with you, I will wait until we're at home instead of arguing with you in public.  Is that something we can do?

I would bet Candiace would be receptive to that.

If Wendy came to her and said "Girl, Gizelle is out here coming for you trying to get you to lose your job.  Don't even respond to her because she doesn't even have anything going on.  I know you are sensitive and she will try to get under your skin.  Don't let her get to you, just pay her dust and make her earn her paycheck another way,"  I would bet Candiace would be receptive to that.

None of what any of them said to Candiace on Part 2 was constructive criticism.  It was just criticism so they could deflect their bullshit onto her, which she projected <<<<<<<<<<<<< right back to them which then led to the "well I hope you get assaulted / you need to leave the show" threats.

 

[Rlb8031]

2 hours ago, drivethroo said:

Chris tries to give Candiace constructive criticism but he goes about it the wrong way because he puts the blame on her, doesn't give her any solutions other than "let it go", doesn't practice what he preaches and then doesn't back her up.

Constructive criticism from Chris needs to be: I know Karen/Ashley/Michael Rappaport/Gizelle/Andy Cohen/people on Twitter etc get on your nerves.  Whenever they say X you say Y and then it makes you look bad even though they provoked it.  I don't want them to ruin what you've got going on because all they've got is the show and you have so many opportunities in front of you.  When Ashley/Karen/Gizelle start up with you, maybe try paying them dust and then they will look stupid.  If we're at group events and they start with the bullshit, let's just leave.  We don't have to leave the event, we'll just leave the area.  I've got your back and if I disagree with you, I will wait until we're at home instead of arguing with you in public.  Is that something we can do?

But isn't that exactly what Chris attempted to do when he sat Candiace down at St, Michaels after lettucegate? He walked her through her assertion that Mia was insecure about her position which was why she came at Candiace, then said that by responding to Mia, Candiace also appeared to be insecure. And Candiace's response was to wail at the top of her lungs about how she wasn't going to let anyone disrespect her and her hard work. 

I feel like he's said everything you've noted here EXCEPT that he won't disagree with her in public, which probably should be a thing. But I do question whether that's a two way street. For example, it's going to be interesting to see how she reacts when Andy has Dot on the phone and Chris tells him to hang up on her. Will she be entirely supportive, or will she try to talk him out of feeling the way he feels and minimize it?

I'm not sure that I agree with your underlying premise - that Candiace would be responsive to criticism if it were just delivered the "right" way. Because at the end of the day the real criticism is that whether or not she thinks she is fighting fair, she is perceived as being "meaner" than the rest of the ladies when it comes to the things she says, the way she says them and her timing in saying them. Candiace fundamentally believes that this is not true and that external factors, not her subject choice or the level of vitriol and physical aggression in delivery is why people don't like her.

However, I'd compare her to Kenya Moore, who is also a brown-skinned woman who has been cast in the villain role in her show. Kenya is biting, catty and constantly picking at perceived weak spots of her coworkers. She has also been involved in a physical altercation on her show. And Kenya has also been known to physically "take the first step" (hitting Porsha with the fan and trying to pull the chair out from under Kim Fields being the two that quickly come to mind) similar to Candiace with the hair flipping and lettuce tossing. All of the language you cited here:  

2 hours ago, drivethroo said:

"Don't you think you take things too far?" "We're not to tolerate your verbal abuse" and "You're going out in public being nasty to people"

...could also be directed to Kenya. But I think that people are far more positive towards Kenya than they are towards Candiace. And I don't recall at all, there being this level of concern about Kenya's ongoing physical well-being on the show from her coworkers or any suggestions that by telling Kenya she took it too far meant that people were okay with Porsha attacking her. So at the end of the day, I do think there is absolutely something visceral in Candiace's language and responses that folks are reacting to and not merely the external forces of colorism.

In my mind it is that she's very willing to imply, allude, hint, insinuate (and at least once actually say) that if you start with her she's going to finish it - and then couple those statements with physical actions that our lizard brains read as aggressive. In St, Michaels, after Karen tried to step in, she pushed the knick-knacks over on the counter. At her house, she picked up the butter knife and flung it in Ashley's direction. In both cases, those physical responses amped up what were already charged situations. That is what I think folks react to, and what Candiace is blind to. If she had the same arguments without that extra sauce thrown in, she'd get the Kenya treatment, even if she did occasional slip up physically. 

[Yours Truly]

4 hours ago, drivethroo said:

That wasn't "constructive criticism," that was just criticism.  Which is fine but be honest about your motives and biases.

According to Asana.com, Constructive criticism focuses on constructive feedback, provided by specific examples, to help you improve in some area and should be given in a friendly manner with good intentions.  Then the person offering the constructive criticism should help the person they're criticizing come up with some solutions for improvement.

Telling Candiace "The common denominator is you" puts blame on Candiace and justifies what others have done to her.  It says "Candiace, it's your fault you were assaulted."  That is not constructive criticism.  It's just criticism.

Telling Candiace "You're overdue for an asswhipping," "If Mia had clocked you, oh well," "Don't you think you take things too far?" "We're not to tolerate your verbal abuse" and "You're going out in public being nasty to people" is not constructive criticism because all of that says "You deserve(d) to be physically assaulted."  

That is the message Andy Cohen and the cast told Candiace on that stage: You deserve to be assaulted.

If the cast's and Andy's specific concern was really about Candiace escalating things in a physical manner then that's what they would focus on but the cast's/Andy's concern is about Candiace's mouth.  To be clear, Karen did bring up the lettuce throwing but 99% of the cast's/Andy's annoyance with Candiace is with her mouth.  Even after bringing up the lettuce, Karen claimed Candiace is going to the store, going out in public and just randomly popping off on people.

Chris tries to give Candiace constructive criticism but he goes about it the wrong way because he puts the blame on her, doesn't give her any solutions other than "let it go", doesn't practice what he preaches and then doesn't back her up.

Constructive criticism from Chris needs to be: I know Karen/Ashley/Michael Rappaport/Gizelle/Andy Cohen/people on Twitter etc get on your nerves.  Whenever they say X you say Y and then it makes you look bad even though they provoked it.  I don't want them to ruin what you've got going on because all they've got is the show and you have so many opportunities in front of you.  When Ashley/Karen/Gizelle start up with you, maybe try paying them dust and then they will look stupid.  If we're at group events and they start with the bullshit, let's just leave.  We don't have to leave the event, we'll just leave the area.  I've got your back and if I disagree with you, I will wait until we're at home instead of arguing with you in public.  Is that something we can do?

I would bet Candiace would be receptive to that.

If Wendy came to her and said "Girl, Gizelle is out here coming for you trying to get you to lose your job.  Don't even respond to her because she doesn't even have anything going on.  I know you are sensitive and she will try to get under your skin.  Don't let her get to you, just pay her dust and make her earn her paycheck another way,"  I would bet Candiace would be receptive to that.

None of what any of them said to Candiace on Part 2 was constructive criticism.  It was just criticism so they could deflect their bullshit onto her, which she projected <<<<<<<<<<<<< right back to them which then led to the "well I hope you get assaulted / you need to leave the show" threats.

 

Does the advice really have to come with chocolate and flowers tho? It's not that she doesn't need to reevaluate some stuff and it's not like there isn't some things that she could reflect on. Whether or not she likes or approves of the feedback she's getting from the cast and viewers doesn't change the reality that she's on the negative side of a lot of stuff. If she wants to double down and keep it as is then of course that's  her right but the masses have spoken and it is what it is. She can embrace the role and keep a stiff upper lip and continue down that road or she can try and soften her image for next season. I think she should chose whichever one she can handle and what's best for her. If all the hate and being perceived as the villain is fucking with her and messing with her mental health and even causing her to be concerned for her safety then it's up to her and no one else to take steps and make decisions based on the information she has.

It doesn't matter if the information came with a snarl and a smirk or a kiss and a wink the information is there for her use either way and she needs to decide what direction she wants to put her energy. 

 

Edited November 17, 2021 by Yours Truly

[Yours Truly]

30 minutes ago, Rlb8031 said:

But isn't that exactly what Chris attempted to do when he sat Candiace down at St, Michaels after lettucegate? He walked her through her assertion that Mia was insecure about her position which was why she came at Candiace, then said that by responding to Mia, Candiace also appeared to be insecure. And Candiace's response was to wail at the top of her lungs about how she wasn't going to let anyone disrespect her and her hard work. 

I feel like he's said everything you've noted here EXCEPT that he won't disagree with her in public, which probably should be a thing. But I do question whether that's a two way street. For example, it's going to be interesting to see how she reacts when Andy has Dot on the phone and Chris tells him to hang up on her. Will she be entirely supportive, or will she try to talk him out of feeling the way he feels and minimize it?

I'm not sure that I agree with your underlying premise - that Candiace would be responsive to criticism if it were just delivered the "right" way. Because at the end of the day the real criticism is that whether or not she thinks she is fighting fair, she is perceived as being "meaner" than the rest of the ladies when it comes to the things she says, the way she says them and her timing in saying them. Candiace fundamentally believes that this is not true and that external factors, not her subject choice or the level of vitriol and physical aggression in delivery is why people don't like her.

However, I'd compare her to Kenya Moore, who is also a brown-skinned woman who has been cast in the villain role in her show. Kenya is biting, catty and constantly picking at perceived weak spots of her coworkers. She has also been involved in a physical altercation on her show. And Kenya has also been known to physically "take the first step" (hitting Porsha with the fan and trying to pull the chair out from under Kim Fields being the two that quickly come to mind) similar to Candiace with the hair flipping and lettuce tossing. All of the language you cited here:  

...could also be directed to Kenya. But I think that people are far more positive towards Kenya than they are towards Candiace. And I don't recall at all, there being this level of concern about Kenya's ongoing physical well-being on the show from her coworkers or any suggestions that by telling Kenya she took it too far meant that people were okay with Porsha attacking her. So at the end of the day, I do think there is absolutely something visceral in Candiace's language and responses that folks are reacting to and not merely the external forces of colorism.

In my mind it is that she's very willing to imply, allude, hint, insinuate (and at least once actually say) that if you start with her she's going to finish it - and then couple those statements with physical actions that our lizard brains read as aggressive. In St, Michaels, after Karen tried to step in, she pushed the knick-knacks over on the counter. At her house, she picked up the butter knife and flung it in Ashley's direction. In both cases, those physical responses amped up what were already charged situations. That is what I think folks react to, and what Candiace is blind to. If she had the same arguments without that extra sauce thrown in, she'd get the Kenya treatment, even if she did occasional slip up physically. 

THIS!!!! 

Especially the bolded.

It's like we have footage of MULTIPLE exchanges that involve bucking, bringing smoke, physical inappropriateness, aggression.  Sure maybe there are one or two examples to be shown where one of the other women have a similar encounter but most of them have zero and out of the others maybe just one example. Robyn is the only one where I believe we have just 2 situations where she got up in someones face (and I was disgusted with her both times). 

It's the frequency and the intensity. I think it's painfully obvious what it is that most of her critics take issue with. 

I also think it's funny how a big chunk of the narrative is that people should be mature and walk away when Candiace does her thing but I would think the same should be true for CandyAss. Her jumping up, towering over Ashley with a butter knife and then THROWING it at her was just CandyAss being her usual "wordsmith" and JUST a war of words? Give me a break! Where's CandyAss's self discipline? Same when she knocked over the items on the counter and even when throwing the lettuce? Sure the lettuce wasn't harmful but where's HER restraint? Apparently everyone is supposed to dig down and stay composed EXCEPT CandyAss. That's the backwards logic that I've been trying to figure out this whole time. 

Edited November 17, 2021 by Yours Truly

[drivethroo]

2 minutes ago, Rlb8031 said:

But isn't that exactly what Chris attempted to do when he sat Candiace down at St, Michaels after lettucegate? He walked her through her assertion that Mia was insecure about her position which was why she came at Candiace, then said that by responding to Mia, Candiace also appeared to be insecure. And Candiace's response was to wail at the top of her lungs about how she wasn't going to let anyone disrespect her and her hard work. 

No, because it was in the height of the moment. You're not going to receive any criticism in the height of the moment.  This was a discussion he should've had with her in the car when they were driving to the Eastern Shore before anything popped off.  He's always admonishing her after the fact which makes her feel like she's being chastised like a child (she actually said something to that effect after the salad toss).  And then he escalates it with the yelling, jerking, sitting on her, pulling and tugging.  Both of them need to learn a different way of communication.

However, Chris does love her and has her best interests in mind.  She will receive the criticism better from him than from her castmates at BRAVO who don't like her.  He just needs to learn how to convey it in a different way.

22 minutes ago, Rlb8031 said:

I'm not sure that I agree with your underlying premise - that Candiace would be responsive to criticism if it were just delivered the "right" way.

Most people would be more responsive to criticism if delivered in the right way.  That's not just a Candiace thing.  How receptive was Wendy to Robyn & Gizelle's criticism of her new look?

32 minutes ago, Rlb8031 said:

Because at the end of the day the real criticism is that whether or not she thinks she is fighting fair, she is perceived as being "meaner" than the rest of the ladies when it comes to the things she says, the way she says them and her timing in saying them. Candiace fundamentally believes that this is not true and that external factors, not her subject choice or the level of vitriol and physical aggression in delivery is why people don't like her.

What were the external factors that led Mia to deliver a low blow to Candiace, when Candiace had not been mean to her?  

All of them are mean bitches; it's just that Candiace displays her meanness up front while the others are sneaky and hide their meanness behind "shade."  Candiace is honest about her meanness...people don't like that.  Most people like meanness under cover.

And the physical aggression actually doesn't bother them nearly as much as they claim because if Karen's delicate sensibilities were so shaken by physical aggression, she would've been the first one calling HR to get Monique off the show.

The fact is, the entire cast (including Karen and excluding Wendy) was GLAD Monique beat Candiace's ass. They were shocked at the severity of it and didn't want to be associated with the low class behavior, especially when Monique refused to apologize.  But none of them (Karen included) were sorry Monique made Candiace's head ring on that table. Ashley actively smirks any time it's brought up.

1 hour ago, Rlb8031 said:

And I don't recall at all, there being this level of concern about Kenya's ongoing physical well-being on the show from her coworkers or any suggestions that by telling Kenya she took it too far meant that people were okay with Porsha attacking her.

But they're NOT concerned about Candiace's "well being" and several of them said if Candiace gets assaulted again "because of her mouth" she deserved it.  So these are people who simply can't deliver constructive criticism to Candiace.  Criticism, yes.  Constructive? No.

1 hour ago, Rlb8031 said:

So at the end of the day, I do think there is absolutely something visceral in Candiace's language and responses that folks are reacting to and not merely the external forces of colorism.

If it was just Candiace they respond to like that, your argument could be made.  But they're also describing Wendy like that too and we will see in the next episode another set of characters that will have double standards applied to them for no reason.

1 hour ago, Rlb8031 said:

In my mind it is that she's very willing to imply, allude, hint, insinuate (and at least once actually say) that if you start with her she's going to finish it - and then couple those statements with physical actions that our lizard brains read as aggressive.

Then don't start with her.  Leave her alone.  Karen wants to issue a threat from the other sofa that they're going to tune her out...then do that.  Don't talk about it, be about it.  If I see a wasp's nest, I'm not going near it.  I'm not poking it, I'm not investigating it, I'm leaving it alone.

1 hour ago, Rlb8031 said:

In St, Michaels, after Karen tried to step in, she pushed the knick-knacks over on the counter.

Was Karen scared when Mia picked up the porcelain thing and slammed it on the counter, breaking it into pieces?  Or is it just Candiace's actions?

1 hour ago, Rlb8031 said:

At her house, she picked up the butter knife and flung it in Ashley's direction.

 After Ashley was provoking Candiace by getting up in Candiace's face and yelling in her face AFTER being told to leave Candiace's house.  I guess Candiace was supposed to sit quietly and let Ashley disrespect her in her house.  

1 hour ago, Rlb8031 said:

If she had the same arguments without that extra sauce thrown in, she'd get the Kenya treatment, even if she did occasional slip up physically. 

I don't think so, because again, she walked away the majority of Season 5, went on the apology tour and still got her ass beat, for twirling and saying Good Night.

• There's a combination of factors that contribute to the dislike of Candiace:
• The butter knife incident (marked her as a physical threat that needs to be destroyed)
• Her financial circumstances, which most people do not respect 
• Her words, which most often are true and strikes a nerve
• And I do think colorism does play a role.  Not the whole role but it does play a part

The only thing Candiace can say and do that will satisfy the cast and viewers is to say "I am quitting RHOP" and going away, never to be heard from again.  If that's the case, the cast and Andy need to just say that and be about it instead of offering "constructive criticism."  They had no problem banding together and saying "Monique fighting is unacceptable, we don't want to film with her."  Even on Salt Lake City, Meredith told the group she didn't want anything to do with Jen because of her actions and she wouldn't be anywhere Jen was at.

 

[spunky]

2 hours ago, drivethroo said:

No, because it was in the height of the moment. You're not going to receive any criticism in the height of the moment.  This was a discussion he should've had with her in the car when they were driving to the Eastern Shore before anything popped off.  He's always admonishing her after the fact which makes her feel like she's being chastised like a child (she actually said something to that effect after the salad toss).  And then he escalates it with the yelling, jerking, sitting on her, pulling and tugging.  Both of them need to learn a different way of communication.

However, Chris does love her and has her best interests in mind.  She will receive the criticism better from him than from her castmates at BRAVO who don't like her.  He just needs to learn how to convey it in a different way.

Most people would be more responsive to criticism if delivered in the right way.  That's not just a Candiace thing.  How receptive was Wendy to Robyn & Gizelle's criticism of her new look?

What were the external factors that led Mia to deliver a low blow to Candiace, when Candiace had not been mean to her?  

All of them are mean bitches; it's just that Candiace displays her meanness up front while the others are sneaky and hide their meanness behind "shade."  Candiace is honest about her meanness...people don't like that.  Most people like meanness under cover.

And the physical aggression actually doesn't bother them nearly as much as they claim because if Karen's delicate sensibilities were so shaken by physical aggression, she would've been the first one calling HR to get Monique off the show.

The fact is, the entire cast (including Karen and excluding Wendy) was GLAD Monique beat Candiace's ass. They were shocked at the severity of it and didn't want to be associated with the low class behavior, especially when Monique refused to apologize.  But none of them (Karen included) were sorry Monique made Candiace's head ring on that table. Ashley actively smirks any time it's brought up.

But they're NOT concerned about Candiace's "well being" and several of them said if Candiace gets assaulted again "because of her mouth" she deserved it.  So these are people who simply can't deliver constructive criticism to Candiace.  Criticism, yes.  Constructive? No.

If it was just Candiace they respond to like that, your argument could be made.  But they're also describing Wendy like that too and we will see in the next episode another set of characters that will have double standards applied to them for no reason.

Then don't start with her.  Leave her alone.  Karen wants to issue a threat from the other sofa that they're going to tune her out...then do that.  Don't talk about it, be about it.  If I see a wasp's nest, I'm not going near it.  I'm not poking it, I'm not investigating it, I'm leaving it alone.

Was Karen scared when Mia picked up the porcelain thing and slammed it on the counter, breaking it into pieces?  Or is it just Candiace's actions?

 After Ashley was provoking Candiace by getting up in Candiace's face and yelling in her face AFTER being told to leave Candiace's house.  I guess Candiace was supposed to sit quietly and let Ashley disrespect her in her house.  

I don't think so, because again, she walked away the majority of Season 5, went on the apology tour and still got her ass beat, for twirling and saying Good Night.

• There's a combination of factors that contribute to the dislike of Candiace:
• The butter knife incident (marked her as a physical threat that needs to be destroyed)
• Her financial circumstances, which most people do not respect 
• Her words, which most often are true and strikes a nerve
• And I do think colorism does play a role.  Not the whole role but it does play a part

The only thing Candiace can say and do that will satisfy the cast and viewers is to say "I am quitting RHOP" and going away, never to be heard from again.  If that's the case, the cast and Andy need to just say that and be about it instead of offering "constructive criticism."  They had no problem banding together and saying "Monique fighting is unacceptable, we don't want to film with her."  Even on Salt Lake City, Meredith told the group she didn't want anything to do with Jen because of her actions and she wouldn't be anywhere Jen was at.

 

People are just dedicated to hating Candiace. Mia threatened her on television and everyone thinks it's cute and funny.  Mia's cousin threatened to hit her on social media, but because it's Candiace they all laugh at it. 

Ashley points her fingers in people's faces but she's not labeled aggressive or ferocious,  her two favorite words for Wendy and Candiace.  Her husband has sexually assaulted multiple men, but somehow that's okay.  If Chris Bassett did that everyone would be asking Bravo to fire Candiace. 

Mia broke a porcelain object during their argument,  but Karen wasn't scared of that. But she's scared of itty-bitty Candiace who is 5'3 and 103 lbs (Candiace said her height and weight the other day). 

Karen called Gizelle every name in the book, but Candiace's mouth is the problem. 

Furthermore if you're in someone's home and they ask you to leave and you don't you're TRESPASSING! Therefore that butter knife that Ashley had to walk around the table to find, should have been the least of her worries.

I do agree that Chris needs to do a better job having his wife's back in public.  Every other husband has their wife's back in public,  right or wrong, they'll defend them. Chris is out here screaming "pick me." I hope he got the point after fans dragged him in the comments section of his interview and on his lives.  

Edited November 18, 2021 by spunky

[Sweet-tea]

16 hours ago, Rlb8031 said:

 

I'm not sure that I agree with your underlying premise - that Candiace would be responsive to criticism if it were just delivered the "right" way. Because at the end of the day the real criticism is that whether or not she thinks she is fighting fair, she is perceived as being "meaner" than the rest of the ladies when it comes to the things she says, the way she says them and her timing in saying them. Candiace fundamentally believes that this is not true and that external factors, not her subject choice or the level of vitriol and physical aggression in delivery is why people don't like her.

In my mind it is that she's very willing to imply, allude, hint, insinuate (and at least once actually say) that if you start with her she's going to finish it - and then couple those statements with physical actions that our lizard brains read as aggressive. In St, Michaels, after Karen tried to step in, she pushed the knick-knacks over on the counter. At her house, she picked up the butter knife and flung it in Ashley's direction. In both cases, those physical responses amped up what were already charged situations. That is what I think folks react to, and what Candiace is blind to. If she had the same arguments without that extra sauce thrown in, she'd get the Kenya treatment, even if she did occasional slip up physically. 

I agree with your assessment. I don't see much self-awareness from Candiace. Mostly what I've seen is someone with a volatile temper who quickly goes from 0 to 60 and blames others instead of taking responsibility for her own behavior. She even appears to take pride in her ability to "use words" better than the others, or however she put it. It doesn't matter how tiny she is. A person can be small and still be aggressive to others. 

Chris frequently tries to calm her down. He will probably grow tired of this if he hasn't already. If something doesn't change, they are headed for a dysfunctional, codependent relationship. She is on the road to becoming like her mother. I understand what it's like to grow up with a mother like that, so I feel for Candiace. I wouldn't wish it on anyone. But she needs a course correction now while she's still young and definitely before she has children. 

I wonder if any of these women really get along when the cameras aren't rolling. It's hard to tell on these shows, especially the reunions. The only ones who seem like genuine friends are Robyn and Gizelle, but I even wonder about them. If they weren't both on the show, would they still be in contact?

I like how all the women followed a color scheme. I think Ashley and Candiace look the best, although something is going on with the top part of Candiace's wig. 

 

 

 

[Yours Truly]

The whole “then don’t start with Candiace” is so very weird to me. First of all they all say slick shit. That’s what the show revolves around. Second, what That says to me is that provocation is good enough to justify Candiace’s behavior and only Candiaces behavior.. No one else.  ummmmmm ok.

Edited November 18, 2021 by Yours Truly

[RealReality]

On 11/16/2021 at 6:42 AM, islandgal140 said:

Everything is on point in this post but I have to disagree with the bolded. It was Robyn who basically said that if you took Candiace's words and put them in Karen's or Gizelle's mouth they would sound less harsh and not offensive and come off more playful.  So basically easier to take coming out of the light skin chick's mouth - the very definition of colorism. 

They have it in their mind now and it is the official narrative of the show that Candiace's mouth is hellfire. Now, anytime she tells someone they have a run in their stocking, they will hear it as her damning their soul to eternal hell! Seriously, 'yo mama' the 1970s go to insult hurled by Fred Sanford, Aunt Esther or George Jefferson is now the greatest insult in the world. 

I've been loving Wendy keeping her foot on Gizelle's multi-neck. I don't care that her reads are coming off rehearsed to some. She still manages to be quick on her feet in the moment. Plus, I think her anger at Gizelle is justified. Why bring something you know to be lie on the show? To be a messy bitch!

Gizelle should've rehearsed some, maybe she would look less like a deer in some headlights if she did. It is like she learned nothing from last year. 

Gizelle's style? Used to be funny but now that I have seen what she has done to that poor house, I don't even know if I can laugh at it anymore because I almost think her problem may be medical.  Who does that to a house? I think she will not see maximum resale value in it because of the disjointed renovations. Jesus be an architect!

I get that people find the 'you ain't got no man' digs as misogynistic, which they are, however, it is hitting Gizelle where she lives. It is a sensitive point for her because one does get the sense that she wants a relationship and sees great value in being in one to the point of going back to a man who served her the greatest humiliation of her life. If I don't like a bitch, best believe, I am gonna hit her where she lives about an issue she is sensitive about. True facts!

 

I cosign this entire post.  

Short of becoming a mute, everything Candace says will be interpreted as something that warrants a beating.  The clutched pearls over a 'yo momma joke, when the person doesn't even know your momma has been a revelation.   This show is centered on conflict and personalities, trying to shut up any castmember is BS.  

Gizelle's is an absolute disaster and the people who should be cast out and banished are the architect and builder who told her that this nonsense was a good idea.  I can't remember if it was Gizelle or someone else who had a tacky ass staircase in her backyard  because she wanted it in the house.  That should have been my first clue.  

Gizelle has bad taste in everything including homes, clothes and men.  

[RealReality]

19 hours ago, Yours Truly said:

The whole “then don’t start with Candiace” is so very weird to me. First of all they all say slick shit. That’s what the show revolves around. Second, what That says to me is that provocation is good enough to justify Candiace’s behavior and only Candiaces behavior.. No one else.  ummmmmm ok.

Yes, because Candace doesn't resort to phyiscal violence and says the same slick shit they all say.  

The only one who needs public justification is Candiace, because everyone else talking the same slick shit and doesn't get the same blowback.  

There isn't anything that Candace has said or done that has been worse than what other castmembers have said and/or done, but she is the only one who is told that she deserves a beating for saying silck shit....when, as you said, they are all always talking slick shit.  

[Ms.Lulu]

I don't have any problem at all with what Candiace said to Mia or vice versa--that's the show.  And in my eyes they were both equally wrong in the salad fight.  They both chose to get into a war of words then a lettuce toss plus.

And I also understand the housewives may have an unspoken agreement not to talk about parents or kids so they get upset when the agreement is broken. A boundary is crossed.

I think it is okay for the other housewives to let Candiace know if you cross that boundary I won't want to film with you.

That said, if you touch someone, whether it is putting your hand on their ass, flipping their collar or hair, putting a hand on their chest, anything where you initiate physical contact, you have moved the conversation into a possible physical confrontation.  And they may dial up their physical response because they expect your physical actions to escalate.  I'm not siding with one person or another, but it has moved beyond a war of words.  So you may not deserve a beating, but you might get one, depending on who you are messing with.

 

Edited November 22, 2021 by Ms.Lulu

[RealReality]

On 11/16/2021 at 8:50 AM, bichonblitz said:

I hope it works this time. 

Karen has the slickest mouth of all of them. She just doesn't scream as loud as Candyass, and she doesn't cry. I think for some reason Andy really likes Karen therefore she gets away with her ridiculous nonsensical comments without being called out on it. 

And this is what people should see.  Candiace is belittled for having a slick mouth, but most of the cast has a slick mouth, Candiace is not the worst, al all. 

That uncle ben shirt, when you knew your friend of 20 years was going through it, is incredibly foul.  

Ashley talking about Rays penis was mean spirited.  

So you have two women that undertook to use personal insults about a man who had been nothing but kind to them, who they both knew and who was merely married to a cast member. 

But Candiace is dragged all over the world for a  'yo momma joke about a woman she didn't know and hadn't laid eyes on.  

[RealReality]

On 11/17/2021 at 12:04 PM, Yours Truly said:

 

I also think it's funny how a big chunk of the narrative is that people should be mature and walk away when Candiace does her thing but I would think the same should be true for CandyAss.

I think the narrative is that if someone is so bothered by whatever Candiace is saying or doing that they are at the point of physical violence and physical attack then that someone SHOULD walk away at that point.  

As this is a show about verbal altercations, drama and verbal insults I don't think either party should be under an obligation to walk away if they can use their words.  Verbal jabs, responses and conflict are the bread and butter of the HW franchise.  Demanding that Candace can only fight back in THEIR perscribed set of rules is nonsense.  Especially here, where so many other castmembers have done far worse.  

However, if her castmembers are so offended by what she is saying they always have the option not to film with her or refuse to attend functions where she will be. If the words spoken are just too much for someone, then that person should walk away because they should realize that no one is under an obligation to walk away from a verbal confrontation on this show.  

And the same applies to Candace.  She refused to do Monique's podcast because she didn't want to be around Monique, which is walking away.  She refused to take the bait twice and walked away from Monique (once at a dinner and once at her lakehouse).  She purposefully did not invite Ashley to her photo shoot, and she actively did not invite Ashley to the trip she was hosting.  

 

Edited November 19, 2021 by RealReality

[Yours Truly]

1 hour ago, Ms.Lulu said:

I don't have any problem at all with what Candiace said to Mia or vice versa--that's the show.  And in my eyes they were both equally wrong in the salad fight.  They both chose to get into a war of words then a lettuce toss plus.

And I also understand the housewives may have an unspoken agreement not to talk about parents or kids so they get upset when the agreement is broken. A boundary is crossed.

I think it is okay for the other housewives to let Candiace know if you cross that boundary I won't want to film with you.

That said, if you touch someone, whether it is putting your hand on their ass, flipping their collar or hair, putting a hand on their chest, anything where you initiate physical contact, you have moved the conversation into a possible physical confrontation.  And they may dial up their physical response because they expect your physical actions to escalate.  I'm not siding with one person or another, but it has moved beyond a war of words.  So you may not deserve a beating, but you might get one, depending on who you are tangling with.

 

AGREED!

I mean, physical violence is absolutely unacceptable but so is threatening behavior that gives off the impression that you are about to escalate the confrontation. I think it's abhorrent behavior to even introduce that vibe into the exchange. It causes doubt to the other person on whether you are able to restrain yourself and I personally am not going to wait til I get confirmation with a slap in the face to act defensively. No, you're not waving you finger in my face, no your not gonna square up with me aggressively, no you are not going invade my personal space in a threatening way requiring me to scatter out of the way.  What you are going to get is a firm stance that will protect my person and if that means slapping your hand away, pushing you up out of my space where you've shown you don't plan on restraining yourself or even punching you dead in the face cause I feel like it's about to get physical then so be it. To me, a conscious decision has been made to cross the line into violence the minute you close the space and still keep the same angry energy. If you're displaying erratic behavior all up to the point when you're in my face and show no signs of calming down then at that point I have to believe anything is possible so I need to take action. To believe that is somehow unreasonable is absolutely ridiculous. Some of the ladies didn't receive such harsh reactions from their moments of inappropriate aggression and hey that's cool but in some of those instances there was enough chaos for me to easily and unapologetically decide that two people were acting reckless had there actually been a blowup. I truly can't comprehend this logic where TWO people, BOTH behaving badly has one who is absolutely wrong and one that is absolutely right. Totally ridiculous and quite laughable. Not to mention unrealistic. 

2 hours ago, RealReality said:

Yes, because Candace doesn't resort to phyiscal violence and says the same slick shit they all say.  

The only one who needs public justification is Candiace, because everyone else talking the same slick shit and doesn't get the same blowback.  

There isn't anything that Candace has said or done that has been worse than what other castmembers have said and/or done, but she is the only one who is told that she deserves a beating for saying silck shit....when, as you said, they are all always talking slick shit.  

So we've completely ignored the instances of her physical aggression. (That have been referenced over and over again).

OK, Got it. 

[sATL]

On 11/14/2021 at 11:51 PM, Misslindsey said:

Are there really four parts to this reunion? If so, that is three parts too many. I am already bored. Haven't they covered pretty much everything already.

If I have to hear them talk about candles again I am going to need way more wine.

 

4 parts ? Its getting to be the reunions have more detail and content than the season that had a dozen episodes..Andy is really trying to get every coin squeezed out of an almost dry bucket..

I haven't been paying too much attention to the commercials - what RHO*/M2M/ etc show us going to replace this one in the time slot?

[Hiyo]

I think it might be 4 parts (and RHOBH was as well) to maybe make up for some of the revenue lost when RHONY canceled it's reunion episodes.

[JoSafe]

I need Wendy to be gone already!

[JoSafe]

On 11/14/2021 at 9:03 PM, LaurelleJ said:

Gizelle can try to spin it any way she wants. There is no explanation for why she brought information from that trash blog onto the show other than she was earning her check, being messy, and deflecting from Jamal. You want to "check up on me", do it when the cameras are not rolling. To tie the rumors to getting plastic surgery is absolutely ridiculous. She lost, take the L. 

Karen brought up that the blogs said Gizelle has an STD. Has Gizelle been complaining and crying about it for the whole season?

You can say what you want about Gizelle, but she's able to take whatever she throws, and so is Karen. Wendy pretends to eat everybody verbally, but has been crying and has been aggressive over a rumour everybody said was wrong? Talking about that it is "rooted in misogyny" and blabla. Whenever she opens her mouth to say Gizelle can't keep a man, does she think she is doing someting different? Candiace and her are quick to cry and show the "colorism" card whenever it's their turn to be burnt.

Edited November 21, 2021 by JoSafe

[JoSafe]

On 11/14/2021 at 10:09 PM, Arynm said:

Wendy has a lot of nerve talking about Giselle bringing up Wendy's surgery as rooted in misogyny when every other word out of Wendy's mouth is "you can't keep a man" or your relationship isn't real, or "I have a mans last name"

Damn, I commented before I read your message.

[JoSafe]

On 11/15/2021 at 3:00 AM, Marley said:

Gizelle and Karen can shut up with their justifications. They go so low pls.

Yes they do, but they don't have a tissue handy when it's their turn to be burnt.

Edited November 21, 2021 by JoSafe

[JoSafe]

On 11/15/2021 at 7:56 AM, RealReality said:

Karen and Gizelle are going to "tolerate" anything that keeps them on the air.  They should stop fronting. 

Gizelles reasonably shady party and her look this entire season has me convinced she needs the money from this show more than anyone.  

There is no way gizelle would have subjected herself  to having her house ridiculed on national television by filming a party on her construction site if she didn't NEED whatever money may come from a location fee or if she didn't have the money to spend to have it anywhere else. 

Gizelle could have had that party at a hotel, she could have had it at Robyn's place she probably could have had it at candaces house, she could have had it at a park.

And sorrynotsorry but Gizelle for all her beauty has been looking particularly poorly put together this season compared to past seasons.  

Karen may not need the money (I think she does) but Karen absolutely NEEDS the attention, fame and recognition the show brings her.    

The only reason I think gizelle was able to push it with monique is because monique had crossed a line into unrepentant physical violence.  

Yep, but neither Gizelle nor Robyn have ever pretended to be rich, so they obviously need the money.

[JoSafe]

On 11/15/2021 at 10:47 AM, drivethroo said:

A prime example this season is Candiace vs Mia and Ashley vs. Mia.  Candiace was all sorts of terrible for saying "yo momma" but not a blip when Ashley asked if G had Alzheimers.  Karen didn't cry about it and one if not both of her parents died from Alzheimers ---it was a big reason why she was mad at Gizelle.

Another example is excusing physical violence.  Why was it so terrible, so bad when Monique put her hands on Candiace and there were songs and remixes about "We as black women don't do that" and "Monique, you have destroyed the image of black women on this show" but it's ok for light skinned Mia to whip Candiace's ass if need be.  We're gonna shrug and say "Oh well you had it coming" when Mia does it but "Monique turned the show into Love & Hip Hop" when she did it? Also, Mia was physically provoking to Wendy (the other dark skinned person on the cast) on several occasions and not one person took Mia to task about that.

• Just like they didn't take Robyn to task about running up in Ashley's job to physically confront her.
• Just like they didn't take Robyn to task for trying to fight Monique on the street.
• Just like they didn't take Ashley to task for getting up in Candiace's face in Candiace's home and that's what led to the butter knife incident

 Gizelle "wished death" on Ray but we didn't see Karen running to HR claiming to be "scared."  "We're scared" (whether it's Candiace, Wendy or Monique doing the scaring) only seems to happen with the darker skinned cast members, so I don't think "The OGs" would be able to have a productive conversation about colorism because they reap the benefits of it.

Ironically, I think of the 4 OGs, Robyn (the one who looks the most Caucasian) would probably be the one who is the most reasonable about colorism.  Karen, Gizelle and Ashley?  Nope.

1. When they condemn violence, it's colorism towards Monique, when they don't, it's colorism towards Candiace.

2. Nobody is scared of Wendy or Candiace.

There are real situations out there with people facing racism and colorism, and to me, seeing cry babies like Wendy and Candiace using those terms as a line of defence for their verbal sparring is offensive. They absolutely don't get much more heat than the others or than what they give to others. Remember last year, Wendy was loved and appreciated by almost everyone, and she had the same complexion. Candiace was protected by almost everyone. 

[JoSafe]

On 11/15/2021 at 3:12 PM, Boofish said:

I am not denying from a fan or viewer perspective, colorism exists. But I don't think it exist on this show. The fundamental problem, deep down that none of them want to discuss - no one likes Candiace. For whatever reason, Candiace is TOLERATED. Every single "friendship" she thought she was forming has fallen apart and every single one of these ladies at some point prodded her into saying the things she did and they use that as an excuse instead of just admitting the truth. Candiace can compare her transgressions to the others all day everyday and it won't matter - not because her skin is dark. She needs to admit they just don't like her and move on. 

Thank you! And for Wendy, almost everybody actually welcomed her last year arms wide open. It's the new season 6 Wendy that has issues.

[JoSafe]

On 11/16/2021 at 12:28 PM, drivethroo said:

Candiace never called Michael a "slave driver" in those 2.5 year old tweets Ashley is still whining about*.   Candiace said Michael was Ashley's overseer (in response to Ashley tweeting something about Dorothy controlling Chris' pockets ---conveniently deleting all of her tweets from that exchange).  

Ashley is the one who claimed Candiace called her a slave, to which Candiace agreed.  Everyone at that table knows after Michael tossed out Ashley on the side of Glebe Road with nothing more than a Hefty bag full of clothes that once he took her back, anytime he says "Jump," Ashley will ask "How high?"

Candiace did call Michael a slave driver during that dinner. I know you people don't like Ashley and I don't blame you, but imagine for one second if Candiace was the one that was supported financially by her husband and Ashley called him a slave manager or something. I bet you wouldn't take that lightly.

 

[Stats Queen]

18 hours ago, JoSafe said:

Candiace did call Michael a slave driver during that dinner. I know you people don't like Ashley and I don't blame you, but imagine for one second if Candiace was the one that was supported financially by her husband and Ashley called him a slave manager or something. I bet you wouldn't take that lightly.

 

That was beyond wrong. I wouldn’t take it lightly no matter who said it.

[Stats Queen]

I don’t know how to start a new thread and don’t see one for Part 3 of this weird 4 part reunion.

Robyn said the rumors about Wendy’s husband cheating on her were from a blog that wasn’t credible. Why, oh why did your bestie give them life and you ran with it and decided to support it as “I thought it was a new rumor” what a crock - it was all on camera.

I actually don’t have a favorite, I’m not thrilled with any of them on a personal level although I would like to see Robyn in an environment where Giselle wasn’t around.