S10.E04: Episode 4

[marypat57]

On 10/26/2021 at 1:35 PM, Haleth said:

(I sometimes have a hard time hearing everything they say.)

That’s why I turn on the closed captioning when I watch CTM.  Even if I wear my hearing aids, I still have trouble understanding the dialogue 

sometimes.

Edited October 31, 2021 by marypat57
Correct spelling

[TVForever]

On 5/10/2021 at 7:30 PM, jpgr said:

 

I think they are totally setting up Trixie with widower dad, and I think I'm OK with it. He is gorgeous and seems like a really good man. I liked the subtle way she was drinking orange juice while everyone else had champagne.

 

Oh, I called that from his first episode. As soon as the wife was diagnosed terminal, and Trixie was being so caring to both the wife and husband, I thought "There's no way they cast a guy that gorgeous for nothing. He and Trixie are going to end up together".  

 

[EllaWycliffe]

13 hours ago, TVForever said:

Oh, I called that from his first episode. As soon as the wife was diagnosed terminal, and Trixie was being so caring to both the wife and husband, I thought "There's no way they cast a guy that gorgeous for nothing. He and Trixie are going to end up together".  

I'm good with it. Trixie has earned the fairytale ending and frankly she's pretty, bright, vivacious, why hasn't she found a man? She's actually heading towards old maid status at this point. I am not of the opinion that a woman must marry, I certainly haven't, but Trixie as a character clearly wants the husband and family and its odd that someone eminently dateable etc hasn't found someone.

[CrazyMoon]

2 hours ago, EllaWycliffe said:

I'm good with it. Trixie has earned the fairytale ending and frankly she's pretty, bright, vivacious, why hasn't she found a man? She's actually heading towards old maid status at this point. I am not of the opinion that a woman must marry, I certainly haven't, but Trixie as a character clearly wants the husband and family and its odd that someone eminently dateable etc hasn't found someone.

But we must remember she was engaged to Tom Herewood early on...and discovered she wasn't cut out to be a minister's wife. She was very vocal about not giving up her own identity. Tom went on to marry Barbara, whose personality wasn't as extreme. 

[Suzn]

2 hours ago, EllaWycliffe said:

I'm good with it. Trixie has earned the fairytale ending and frankly she's pretty, bright, vivacious, why hasn't she found a man? She's actually heading towards old maid status at this point. I am not of the opinion that a woman must marry, I certainly haven't, but Trixie as a character clearly wants the husband and family and its odd that someone eminently dateable etc hasn't found someone.

This is how I view Trixie too.  I certainly don't think women have to marry and have children, but Trixie is someone that really is needs that.  She very much needs her own identity too, but it can be compatible with marriage.

[Rootbeer]

36 minutes ago, Suzn said:

This is how I view Trixie too.  I certainly don't think women have to marry and have children, but Trixie is someone that really is needs that.  She very much needs her own identity too, but it can be compatible with marriage.

IMO, Trixie doesn't need marriage and family; she WANTS it.   And, like any other person who desires a spouse and family, I hope she gets it.  Her character has come such a long way on the show; she's a terrific midwife, a caring friend; she deserves to complete the picture with a husband and kids because it is her heart's desire.

In a way, though, when she gets together with the widower, her story will parallel Sheila's except for the nunhood.  Both will have fallen in love with widowers with young sons and married.

Edited October 31, 2021 by Rootbeer

[Suzn]

11 minutes ago, Rootbeer said:

IMO, Trixie doesn't need marriage and family; she WANTS it.   And, like any other person who desires a spouse and family, I hope she gets it.  Her character has come such a long way on the show; she's a terrific midwife, a caring friend; she deserves to complete the picture with a husband and kids because it is her heart's desire.

In a way, though, when she gets together with the widower, her story will parallel Sheila's except for the nunhood.  Both will have fallen in love with widowers with young sons and married.

You're absolutely right.  I used the wrong word, not NEED, it's what she WANTS and I think very much deserves it.

[EllaWycliffe]

55 minutes ago, CrazyMoon said:

But we must remember she was engaged to Tom Herewood early on...and discovered she wasn't cut out to be a minister's wife. She was very vocal about not giving up her own identity.

Yeah but thats actually different. Being a pastor's wife means embracing his lifestyle - you can't have different opinions (in that you can't be disagreeing with his morals etc) and you really do have to spend a lot of time on his work in the community.  You really don't get to do your own thing work wise, you're "Pastor Herewood's wife" in the community and thats a big deal. 

[CrazyMoon]

25 minutes ago, EllaWycliffe said:

Yeah but thats actually different. Being a pastor's wife means embracing his lifestyle - you can't have different opinions (in that you can't be disagreeing with his morals etc) and you really do have to spend a lot of time on his work in the community.  You really don't get to do your own thing work wise, you're "Pastor Herewood's wife" in the community and thats a big deal. 

Not really. I think it explains why Trixie hasn't been on the prowl for a husband. She loved Tom and was sad to see it end. Then there was that dentist with all of his personal drama. She wants a partner in life, not a man child.

 

[dargosmydaddy]

I'm clinging to my belief that Trixie/ Tom is still end-game. They left the door open for his return (and I would imagine Jack Ashton would be easy enough to get back, considering his real-life relationship with Helen George), and I could see an older, more mature Tom coming back and rekindling a relationship with Trixie, who has also matured in the ensuing years. Also, didn't RL Trixie marry a clergyman? However, I don't see this happening until either the final season of the show, or George's final season (if she ever decides she wants to leave), and with the show continually getting renewed, maybe it won't happen after all. Still, I honestly don't see them marrying off Trixie to anyone before the end.

[kwnyc]

I actually liked the dentist. He and Trixie had a lot in common, and they both liked fashion! But the thought that a divorced couple with a child "had" to get back together for the sake of the children put a lot of pressure on divorced couples. 

[proserpina65]

On 10/31/2021 at 3:44 PM, dargosmydaddy said:

I'm clinging to my belief that Trixie/ Tom is still end-game. They left the door open for his return (and I would imagine Jack Ashton would be easy enough to get back, considering his real-life relationship with Helen George), and I could see an older, more mature Tom coming back and rekindling a relationship with Trixie, who has also matured in the ensuing years. Also, didn't RL Trixie marry a clergyman? However, I don't see this happening until either the final season of the show, or George's final season (if she ever decides she wants to leave), and with the show continually getting renewed, maybe it won't happen after all. Still, I honestly don't see them marrying off Trixie to anyone before the end.

Trixie's personality (as represented on the show) is completely incompatible with being a clergyman's wife.  She and Tom would be a disaster.  There was a certain amount of having to put your needs below that of the parishioners' for the clergy and their spouses, even in the late 60s, and Trixie, even a more mature Trixie, would always struggle with that.  Especially if she didn't agree with what was being asked of her and Tom.  That doesn't make Trixie a bad person in any way, just one unsuited for marrying a clergyman.

[Badger]

Being a clergyman's wife is a lot like being married to someone in the military.  You have to be willing to go wherever he's sent.  

[caitmcg]

6 minutes ago, Badger said:

Being a clergyman's wife is a lot like being married to someone in the military.  You have to be willing to go wherever he's sent.  

It was coming to understand that which made Trixie realize being married to Tom wouldn’t suit her, more than anything else, I think, whereas for Barbara it was entirely normal since her father was a pastor.

[EllaWycliffe]

To use a recent example if Trixie was Pastor Herewood's wife, she would have to be a lot more careful on her public speaking about abortion and birth control.

[kwnyc]

I still think Trixie is going to end up a Member of Parliament.

[Rootbeer]

On 10/31/2021 at 3:44 PM, dargosmydaddy said:

I'm clinging to my belief that Trixie/ Tom is still end-game. They left the door open for his return (and I would imagine Jack Ashton would be easy enough to get back, considering his real-life relationship with Helen George), and I could see an older, more mature Tom coming back and rekindling a relationship with Trixie, who has also matured in the ensuing years. Also, didn't RL Trixie marry a clergyman? However, I don't see this happening until either the final season of the show, or George's final season (if she ever decides she wants to leave), and with the show continually getting renewed, maybe it won't happen after all. Still, I honestly don't see them marrying off Trixie to anyone before the end.

As I recall from the book, Trixie did indeed marry the preacher and they were happily wed for the rest of their lives, but, the show has already gone so far beyond the original stories in the books that Trixie on the show doesn't seem to me to be the sort of person who could put her husband's job above all else which is essentially what she would have to do if she married Tom.

[EllaWycliffe]

32 minutes ago, Rootbeer said:

As I recall from the book, Trixie did indeed marry the preacher

She married but it wasn't the local pastor and in the books she didn't date anyone significant. She also wasn't an alcoholic.

[Rootbeer]

10 minutes ago, EllaWycliffe said:

She married but it wasn't the local pastor and in the books she didn't date anyone significant. She also wasn't an alcoholic.

Exactly.  The show has really changed the character from who she was in the book in order to generate more storylines.  The Trixie on the show now bears little resemblance to the Trixie in the books.

[EllaWycliffe]

Well, Trixie in the books was fun and vivacious so there's that.  To be honest, I don't recall her being a big character - Chummy was the midwife who had a lot of stories, and Cynthia because she had the depression and took vows. There was no Sister Bernadette or Dr. Turner eying each other from afar.

[Cetacean]

1 hour ago, Rootbeer said:

Trixie on the show doesn't seem to me to be the sort of person who could put her husband's job above all else which is essentially what she would have to do if she married Tom.

She reallly has grown into a career woman in the 60's, not afraid to stand up for her opinions.  I can't see her turning into a "little woman" who hosted the WI meetings and made sure there were flowers on the altar and kept her opinions to herself.  That's not our Trixie.

I was surprised when she went the dating service route - but I don't see her doing that again.  The facial expressions with the potential mates was a hoot.

[CrazyMoon]

I'm loving Sr Frances' personal growth! She's so open & willing. And discovering her courage in every situation. 

Nancy is a bit of a loose cannon. She may settle down and get her career moving. She'll have choices to make.

This first donation from HotWidower is a way to get in the door, so to speak...He'll come back to donate more, always in person and always look for the opportunity to see Trixie. He's only been widowed about six months. Historically speaking, widowers tend to remarry long before the women do...so perhaps early next season...if Trixie indeed accepts him...stay tuned

[susannah]

On 10/31/2021 at 11:56 AM, CrazyMoon said:

Not really. I think it explains why Trixie hasn't been on the prowl for a husband. She loved Tom and was sad to see it end. Then there was that dentist with all of his personal drama. She wants a partner in life, not a man child.

 

I disagree that Trixie loved Tom. She wanted to be married, and he was there. She didn't care anything about his views and beliefs, or what being a poor pastor's wife would mean for her. She just wanted the big fancy wedding and having all the attention. Barbara was much more suited to Tom because she did understand what marrying him was about, and she wanted that. I also disagree that the dentist was a "man child." He wanted to do the best for his daughter. That is not a personality flaw.

[eel21788]

On 10/25/2021 at 5:17 PM, Clanstarling said:

He did something with the series of bet - I think he called it accumulating? Which I took to mean that the winnings were automatically put into the next bet. Which means Fred lost a bundle. I'm no expert in gambling, but I think that's what happened.

That's called a parlay.

[eel21788]

On 10/25/2021 at 7:42 AM, zoey1996 said:

"The Sexual Offences Act 1967 is an Act of Parliament in the United Kingdom (citation 1967 c. 60). It legalized homosexual acts in England and Wales, on the condition that they were consensual, in private and between two men who had attained the age of 21." 

In the US, it wasn't declassified as a mental illness until 1973.

[eel21788]

On 10/25/2021 at 6:32 AM, Jodithgrace said:

Dr. Turner is was more advanced than I expected him to be. Some people were more accepting of homosexuality than others, but accepting that people are born that way seems like a fairly recent concept. When I was growing up, (1950s and '60s)it was believed that homosexuality was caused by having a dominant mother and weak father, or some other unhealthy parentage that "warped" you at an early age. I was expecting Dr. Turner to spout something like that, while still being compassionate. . 

That was still the predominant theory when I was in high school in the mid to late '70s. 

[Badger]

The idea that homosexuality was something you could be born with has been around at least since the turn of the 20th century.  Dr. Magnus Hirschfield who was a famous German sexologist was one of the leading proponents of that idea.

He appears in the silent film "Different From the Others" which was the first film to deal with homosexuality.  As part of the plot, the protagonist of the movie who is a gay man goes to see him and he explains his theory to him.  He tells him there is nothing wrong with being homosexual, that it is perfectly healthy and natural.

Marie Stopes who wrote one of the first books about contraception and birth control also believed that homosexuality was something you were born with although she believed it was a kind of defect/perversion.

It definitely wasn't mainstream, but it was something that a well-educated and/or sophisticated, worldly person might have known about.

[GiuliettaMasina]

On 5/10/2021 at 7:30 PM, jpgr said:

I did like the storyline with Phyllis and Doctor Turner, even if it was maybe a bit anachronistic. There had to be some medical professionals and parents who didn't condemn homosexuality and stood by their sons. I love the way they rescued him from the clinic. Don't mess with Phyllis when she's on a mission!

That's where I am. Their behavior may have been out of step with the majority at that time, but there were many outliers, and given that we've seen plenty of storylines about homophobic parents on film/tv, I'm quite happy to see something different. There's plenty of dramatic possibilities to explore as they no doubt existed on a spectrum from "ok with it being an open secret" to "complete and total acceptance."

On 10/25/2021 at 2:14 PM, Tiggertoo said:

I think the problem with Cyril and Lucille is that they’re so bland and pure.  I feel like we haven’t seen any shades of grey with them.  We haven’t seen them screw up, get angry or be miserable.  Well, except for the radiogram purchase.  Gasp!

Ohhhh, yes! You've put your finger on what it is about these two that I just can't get into.

On 10/25/2021 at 7:17 PM, Clanstarling said:

In any time period, there are a multitude of opinions, many of which do not fall within the "norm" of societal thought. So I expect there were plenty of people in the 60's who had nothing against it at all, and who actively embraced friends who were homosexual or gender fluid. The terms might not have been there, but the thoughts would have been. 

Yup. And no doubt plenty of willful blindness about the gay people they loved, like not thinking too deeply about their "roommates" on purpose.

On 10/26/2021 at 1:49 AM, movingtargetgal said:

Yes!  I would love to see a young Sister Monica Joan and Sister Evangelina.  These two women came from such different backgrounds and grew to respect and love each other.  It would be wonderful to watch the beginning of their relationship.  Imagine young Sister Julianne entering Nonnatus House for the first time.  She would be mentored by two Sisters/Midwives that were such wonderful teachers, each with their own strengths.  Sister Monica Joan, wearing her heart on her sleeve and Sister Evangelina with her no nonsense practicality.  They were a big part of making Sister Julianne into such a compassionate and competent leader of Nonnatus House.    

I would watch the hell out of this show.

Edited November 29, 2022 by GiuliettaMasina

[mmecorday]

Oh, if only more people were as evolved in their thinking as Dr. Turner and Nurse Crane. There would have been a lot fewer suicides in the gay community. 

[Clanstarling]

9 minutes ago, mmecorday said:

Oh, if only more people were as evolved in their thinking as Dr. Turner and Nurse Crane. There would have been a lot fewer suicides in the gay community. 

And sad to think that so many years later this is still a problem.

Edited March 9, 2023 by Clanstarling