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All Creatures Great And Small (2021) - General Discussion


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24 minutes ago, Blergh said:

In the same article, it says that virtually the entire Season One cast will re-appear . . . 

In the books, certain characters do reappear from time to time.  It's a smallish town surrounded by farms - and the main characters are veterinarians - so that seems natural in the books.  It's not like they're on Gilligan's Island and different people are parachuting in, etc., every week.  LOL.

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Even the most cursory investigation reveals that the ACGAS book series is fiction. It’s “based on” people and events, no more. The biggest obstacle to Wight’s marriage was not another suitor, but his own mother, who seemed to view the “Helen” as a rival for his affections. The person on whom Siegfried was based threatened to sue Wight for defamation. A great number of the animal stories came from other vets. And what about what isn’t described? Does anyone seriously believe that if he’d had pre-marital sex he’d have written about it? The point of this is that it’s a complete waste of time to be concerned about the fidelity of an adaptation to the original books. We’re not dealing with a Lincoln biography here. If it has animals, the Dales, vets, and normal human interactions, that’s good enough and true enough.

The newest TV version differs in two important aspects from that of 1978, both involving women. Mrs. Hall’s age-appropriateness for Siegfried has been noted everywhere. Much more important is Helen, and not just because she eventually becomes Mrs. Herriot. This Helen had ambitions to get out, get trained, and become an independent woman. She oversees the mating of huge animals. She is earthy and sensual, teasing James about his sexual experience and having fun with him when she catches him skinny-dipping. She has to take on serious familial responsibilities due to the loss of her mother, in addition to which said family is in a somewhat precarious financial situation. In each of these respects she is utterly different from Helen78, and that doesn’t even include the entire engagement/altar-jilting story arc. 

This latest Helen Alderson is the only character of interest to me because she is the only one still trying to figure out how to live her life. Everyone else has already found their niche, their only question being whom to marry. The only thing I’m curious about in the story to come is how they keep those two crazy kids apart to sustain the romantic/prurient interest of the audience and whether they’re allowed to have unsanctified sex. One can only hope. Prurience, after all, is the vice of which I’m most proud.

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Season 2 is set to premiere in Winter 2022, according to PBS's Summer virtual press tour going on today through Thursday. There will be a panel on the series on Wednesday afternoon

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4 minutes ago, possibilities said:

The show was mentioned in a Jeopardy clue this week. 

My PBS station is airing the 90 minute "behind the scenes including insights and reflections from the cast and creators as well as a look ahead at season 2" thing on 8/15.

Thanks for the heads up!  Just set the DVR so I don't miss it.

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2 hours ago, dargosmydaddy said:

It looks great (and I hope this means 'January, 2022' instead of 'December,2022').

Spoiler

While I'll always consider the late Lady Diana Rigg to have been the Revived Mrs. Pumphrey forever, I have to admit I had a laugh when the new one accepted Mrs. Hall's 'biscuits' on Trickie's behalf and when Mrs. Hall protested that they were for HER, Mrs. Pumphrey stated that she only ate biscuits from Fortnam and Mason's while Trickie was 'a bit less fussy' than her about the selection!

 

Edited by Blergh
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1 hour ago, Blergh said:

It looks great (and I hope this means 'January, 2022' instead of 'December,2022').

 

According to one article I found online:

"If the new season does premiere on Channel 5 in the fall, then the earliest American viewers are likely to see Season 2 is January 2022."

Channel 5 in the UK is showing it in September, so that's a good sign!!!!

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1 hour ago, Blergh said:

It looks great (and I hope this means 'January, 2022' instead of 'December,2022').

It does. It's premiering in the UK in the fall; I think the schedule is pretty much the same as last year (where PBS gets it in January).

Edited by dargosmydaddy
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14 minutes ago, dargosmydaddy said:

It does. It's premiering in the UK in the fall; I think the schedule is pretty much the same as last year (where PBS gets it in January).

That's GREAT news! This gives me something to look forward to make it through the next  four months of holiday disruptions,etc. at work! 

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I managed to confuse myself by having watched the original series between showings of the revived series and couldn't understand why James didn't take Helen with him up to Glasgow. But, of course, in the revived series they're not married - in fact, she's positively snippy with him (a little unfairly, IMO - you left your fiance at the altar, James didn't ask you to do that). Did love Helen's sister gossiping about what Helen had said about the whole matter, James saying he couldn't listen to gossip and Tristan cheerfully admitting he had no such compunction! Loved Mrs Hall tricking the truth out of Siegfried too - interesting that he doesn't mind his brother actually practicing on animals (somewhat) but draws the line at him claiming a qualification he hasn't earned - it's a weird double standard.

I find it hard to believe they wouldn't put the sheep worrying dog down IRL, but modern TV would never allow that, so it didn't surprise me he survived.

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I literally lost Tristan's plot. I can't figure out how Siegfried thinks he can keep him practicing without qualification - I need to check back. And does Mrs Herriot think James will come back to Glasgow? His Dad gave him a knowing look and I was surprised there was no follow-up between father and son.

Tristan and Jenny were quite the team LOL! Mrs Hall rules as ever. As for the dog: I have not read the books so this could very well be based on one of Herriot's stories. Since it was a young dog I'd say people might have been a bit more forgiving. But I thought it odd that in sheep farming country nobody knew how to deal with an exuberant dog and that they needed James to go all dog-whisperer. 

The costumes are great - both James and Tristan were wearing beautiful hand-knitted vests.

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This thread didn't exist back when I watched season one (since the thread was created for the US airing, three months after I'd already watched it) so it's nice to find it here now.

I've never read the books and was too young to have really seen the original adaptation, although I've been aware of it all my life, so I came to this show with totally fresh eyes and really enjoyed it. I'm sure S1 aired on Sundays as I thought of it as perfectly relaxing Sunday night drama, but it is on Thursdays now for S2! A second adaptation is always going to strike people differently, though depending on their exposure to the original and how attached they are to it!

21 hours ago, MissLucas said:

I thought it odd that in sheep farming country nobody knew how to deal with an exuberant dog and that they needed James to go all dog-whisperer

It seemed to me the problem wasn't that no one knew how to train an exuberant dog to behave around sheep, but that it didn't occur to anyone to try, because farming tradition said that a dog that had already started to worry sheep should not be given a second chance, no ifs and no buts. The flock must be protected, above all else, because it is the farmer's livelihood, and once a dog has tasted blood there is no way back. But this particular dog hadn't tasted blood, so it wasn't too late - the trouble was that the solution to sheep worrying was so automatic, so inflexible and unyielding, that it took an outsider to say, "Maybe, on this occasion, there is another option." They needed James to train the dog because who else was going to do it? Alderson and Helen felt they had to destroy the dog to make amends to their neighbour, who had lost a lamb because of it (especially since they really should have trained the dog already, instead of leaving it 100% in the care of a kid, hence guilt, hence inflexibility), and the neighbour certainly wasn't going to offer to train their dog for them. Thus James's intercession was needed.

21 hours ago, MissLucas said:

The costumes are great - both James and Tristan were wearing beautiful hand-knitted vests.

Yes.

The biggest problem I have with the costumes is Helen. I'm sure her clothes are as well researched and period authentic as anyone else's, but she always looks more modern than she should, somehow, and that always throws me slightly.

Edited by Llywela
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2.02 "When April with her showers sweet,

Have pierced the drought of March to the root...

Upon the tender shoots. And the young sun,

The half course in the Ram has run,

Then people long to..." head down to vetin'ry!

(How different it might have been if Chaucer had written The Yorkshire Tales instead!)

Certainly, everyone was feeling a bit frisky this episode as everyone got a romance sub plot - nice to see even Mrs Hall got a (potential) love interest and Siegfried got his mojo back. I just wish they weren't so desperate to stretch out the "Will They, Won't They" between James and Helen because it's a trope I find tedious at the best of times and doubly so when anyone with a passing familiarity with the 70s show (or the books) knows they do get together. What I'm pretty sure wouldn't happen is people making jokes about James taking Tristan to the dance - homosexuality was illegal at the time and it seemed a bit of a nod to when it aired as opposed to anything people might actually have said then. I also wonder how they're going to resolve Tristan having failed his exams - another plotline they seem to be stretching out purely for the sake of drama. Here's hoping it has a satisfying payoff, but I doubt it. 

This actually had a couple of scenes I remember from the 70s - Tristan popping the boil on the head of the sow by getting it to run into the edge of its sty and Siegfried venting the cow's rumen and getting showered in undigested cud. It's those moments of comedy that keep me watching!

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Yes, the various jokes about homosexuality felt anachronistic to me. Not that there were none but I doubt you'd hear them in the context and company they were delivered here.

And I'm also still struggling to understand Siegfried's charade  with Tristan. I wondered if I've missed or forgotten a plot where Siegfried talks to the Veterinary College and makes some deal to supervise Tristand for a while. But apparently that's not the case. I've found an interview with Ben Vanston, the writer, and here's what he has to say about Tristan practicing: 

Quote

It wasn't until about I think, 1948 that you had to have a qualification to be a practicing vet. Actually, there was a lot of enthusiastic amateurs dotted around the Dales and other farming communities who would turn their hand to a bit of vet practice. So there's no legal impediment to him working; I would suggest there's a moral one. And obviously, that's a story which doesn't end there. In Series 2, we begin with Tristan unaware of what his brother has done. And, Siegfried, he's very much done this because he's so desperate to move forward in his relationship with his brother. 

As frustrating as it was to watch James and Helen that was nothing compared to Mrs Hall and Rock's master. Mrs Hall deserves some happiness too!

Speaking of Mrs Hall, poor woman has to keep the house clean, cook, assist during procedures and at the end of the day she's left with cleaning and washing all their clothes and scrubs. The last scene with the dung stained scrubs hanging on the coat-rack in the hall made me laugh. Obviously nobody on set ever had the pleasure to deal with cow dung and its distinct perfume that permeates everything. No housekeeper worth their money and no one with a working sense of smell would have kept those things in the house.

Edited by MissLucas
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Can’t believe Siegfried didn’t palm Tricky off onto James (or Tristan) at the first opportunity!

Glad Helen & James had a not-quite-argument about their future the farmer’s widow because too often TV couples rush into getting hitched seemingly without ever having had a serious discussion about anything. And it's good to see that James never promised he could save the herd (in fact, ultimately admitted that he couldn't) but they're just hoping for a miracle. I was actually expecting a "village comes together to help out" moment (with money, fodder or access to their grazing land) so it was somewhat refreshing that didn't happen. Life doesn't always have a happy ending (even if fiction usually does).

 

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I must be a bit grumpy but I was more or less annoyed by Helen and the whole plot. I grew up on the countryside and I think James was right. Phyllis was no farmer so even if she manages to pull through this crisis there will be plenty of hurdles to come. IRL there's a good chance she'll lose the farm anyway and without even making some money to secure her kids a good education and future. And I also rolled my eyes at Helen's dismissal of James leaving his home and family behind to make a new start. Someone living in a city can have as strong bonds to his surroundings as a country-mouse. And I can't recall if she ever asked about his family or showed any interest in his life beyond Yorkshire. I find that pretty irritating.*

Poor Mrs H - more laundry and loneliness - just call Mr 'I'll fix your clock' (that sounds kinky but I simply forgot his name).

*This is pretty much an intrinsic part of the fish-out-of-water trope but I find it annoying whenever it shows up.

Edited by MissLucas
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On 10/2/2021 at 10:55 PM, MissLucas said:

I must be a bit grumpy but I was more or less annoyed by Helen and the whole plot. I grew up on the countryside and I think James was right. Phyllis was no farmer so even if she manages to pull through this crisis there will be plenty of hurdles to come. IRL there's a good chance she'll lose the farm anyway and without even making some money to secure her kids a good education and future. And I also rolled my eyes at Helen's dismissal of James leaving his home and family behind to make a new start. Someone living in a city can have as strong bonds to his surroundings as a country-mouse. And I can't recall if she ever asked about his family or showed any interest in his life beyond Yorkshire. I find that pretty irritating.*

I agree. I can't warm to Helen, and have come to the conclusion that it is the actress. Most of her dialogue sounds fine on paper, but her delivery always comes across as quite hard. Or then again, maybe the character is supposed to be that way, a tough Yorkshire woman, hardened by a hard life. But I feel like the show wants her to be more sympathetic than she is, and suspect a different actress with a softer, warmer delivery might achieve that.

I'm not sure anyone could have made her side of that argument better, though - belittling someone else's attachment to their home to bolster her own claims of how attached she is to hers! So she's got fond memories of growing up on the farm, big deal. I've got fond memories of growing up in the city, and those memories are no less meaningful than hers, that's just what growing up in a stable home and loving family is like. Plus, the show went to all the trouble of showing us James back in his home environment in Glasgow at the start of the season, and went out of its way to establish the close bonds he still has there, so I'm not sure what this particular plotline was meant to achieve. James coming to agree with Helen in the end implies that the narrative supports her claim that farming folk belong on the land no matter what, because those age-old attachments matter more than the ability to put food on the table, or whatever (never mind that Phyllis flat out said that she isn't a farmer, she just married one). Which seems to also imply that the narrative agrees with Helen that her attachment to her difficult farmer's life in Yorkshire is superior to James's attachment to the home he was forced to leave in search of badly-needed employment. I suspect we are meant to read it as part of James's continuing and developing love affair not just with Helen, but with Yorkshire life in general. But it struck a sour note, for me, and didn't ring true - all the more for having so recently been reminded of James's roots and how torn he is over leaving them.

Also in this episode: we met the new Mrs Pumphrey! And it was nice to see Amy Nuttall in a guest role - she seems to play tragic widows and/or single mums in everything I've ever seen her in.

Edited by Llywela
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When I read the episode description ("Secrets come out at a family dinner..." or some such) I was expecting it to be the reveal of James' job offer. So I was glad that it was actually Mrs Hall who let that slip, realised she'd said too much and then when James & Helen actually talked about it, it didn't seem much of a problem. We also got confirmation (as stated above) that Tristan didn't actually need to pass his exams to practice on animals (though it would still probably be fraud to call himself Dr Farnon, FRCVS*, as it claims on his briefcase).

On 10/2/2021 at 10:55 PM, MissLucas said:

I must be a bit grumpy but I was more or less annoyed by Helen and the whole plot.

I'm wondering if she's meant to be the female counterpart to Siegfried - a sibling forced to take a parental role? She has to be tough and a bit bloody minded to run the farm, so maybe she thinks the widow just needs to toughen up a bit. But even if I'm not overly fond of romantic subplots, I'm glad James has to actually work to win her over, because they met and were married by the end of the first Season in the 70s.

* I'm not sure exactly what the right letters are, but it's something like that 

Edited by John Potts
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Well, talk about an uncomfortable dinner all around! But at least all the festering secrets are out in the open now. At least Mrs Brompton showed some social grace by coming to Helen's aid and bringing some booze to Mrs H. Speaking of Mrs H: stop talking to dogs about your feelings of loneliness and call you-know-who!

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And all's back right with the world (well, in Yorkshire at least - in Europe things are taking a decidedly grim turn in 1938)! Tristan and Siegfried have patched things up. I'm glad Hugh turned out to be an honourable man (OK, not above wanting to see James humbled a bit, but not vindictively so) and he's even moving on. James and Helen's relationship progresses (she used the "l" word!) and Clock man is back for Mrs Hall. And of course, Mrs Pomfrey couldn't bear to have Tricky "fixed", so even he gets a love interest (with the "music swells as the couple runs towards each other" ending, no less)! Might have been nice to see a bit more actual vetting since other than ringing the bull and neutering Tricky Woo (which ultimately didn't happen) I don't think our boys had any actual work.

Though my main objection turned out to be the cricket which should have been a draw, since in theory, the injured player could have resumed his innings after retiring hurt - yes, it would be an inferior team holding out for a draw, but still a draw is better than a loss.

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Damn this show!!! I have two writing projects breathing down my neck and  all of a sudden I feel the urge to create something tangible with my hands - which means I have to stubbornly ignore my knitting basket. Along comes this episode which features even more than the usual amount of knitwear in form of all those glorious cricket vests - Siegfried's was absolutely gorgeous. Well, at it that provided some distraction from all that cricket with its arcane rules (sorry UK folks).

I'm glad Hugh seems to be over the whole marriage disaster. His need for a bit of payback was understandable and I'm glad James saw it that way too. Margot did not impress me much last episode though but maybe now that she and Hugh are an item her catty days are over.

Tristan and Siegfried made peace. James and Helen made out, sort of. Tricky got lucky and most importantly for me Mrs H got a date, also sort of. This almost felt like a season finale which makes me really worried for the remaining episodes.

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At last! Helen and James are engaged and James is staying in Darrowby (I mean, we knew it was going to happen so why draw it out?). Liked Helen's dad going "Well Helen's already said yes, so why are you asking me?" which shows either a realistic assessment of the situation or a rather too modern view of parenting (I'm not quite sure which). I suppose her sister will end up inheriting the farm now and it's not like Helen will be moving far.

Mrs Hall's dog man is back! James worked out what was up with the widow's cattle! All is right with the world. Well, all's right in the Dales, the mention of the Munich agreement foretells what's about to happen, but I did like that Chamberlain's declaration of "Peace in our Time" was greeted with cheers - there really was little support for a renewed war in 1938, particularly for "A far off place about which we know nothing". Only people right outside the political mainstream (like Churchill!) denounced it as a terrible mistake at the time.

If Tristan is going back to college (briefly, presumably, as he seems to only need to pass the one subject he failed in), I wonder if that will happen between Season's and he'll be back for the start of Season 3? Or will we start with James & Helen's wedding?

Edited by John Potts
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Solid season finale. But I think James really did a shitty thing to his parents by not telling them sooner. IIRC this was not just about him living with them in Glasgow but also supporting them financially which was not that uncommon at the time but here it was brushed over. Maybe it will come up again next season, it seems his father is still struggling to get a job.

I was a bit mystified by the horse birth. What would they have done if untwisting the uterus had required clockwise turning the horse? Trying to get her up and lie down on the other side?

Very happy to see Mrs H is still dating Mr Clock.

All in all I feel tempted to say that it was too neat were it not for those ominous radio broadcasts and Tristan reading 'Biggles goes to War'.

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It was shown that Mrs Herriot was pushy, domineering and in the habit of inappropriately making decisions for James that she had no business making for a grown man. Putting off telling his parents that he did not want the Glasgow job and was making a life for himself in Darrowby until it was a fait accompli and his mother could no longer meddle in his affairs was the right call. James mentioned in an episode that he was sending his parents money, so there was no reason for him to be physically present in Glasgow to support them.

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Our local PBS station is airing the episodes all day today, presumably because the new season is about to start.  I would have enjoyed seeing the previous series, but it might have confused people.

Did the vets ever treat a wild animal?  Nowadays it's a specialty, but at that time and place these vets were the only ones around.

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The Christmas special was nice! I loved everyone having their Christmas with Mrs Pumphrey in the end, although I did feel they should have asked her instead of just turning up.

I don't feel James and Helen as a couple the way the show clearly wants me to. I think part of the problem is that they never seem to actually talk about any of the things that matter. Like where they are going to live after they get married, which is a fairly major issue to just...not talk about, at all. Even here, when they finally realised they had totally different assumptions about their future together, they still didn't actually discuss the problem or resolve anything. It's hard to root for them as a couple when there is so little substance to the relationship.

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11 minutes ago, DonnaMae said:

Christmas special?  What I watched was a rerun of Christmas from last year when Helen was going to get married.  Was there a new episode?

 

The Christmas special aired in the UK. In the US, we'll get it at the end of the season (which will start airing on PBS next month).

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Sorry to confuse you, @DonnaMae. It's a British show and I'm a Brit, so I just watch and comment as it airs. I forgot you have a time lag!

(I'm used to it being the other way around, not getting to see US shows for months after they air over there, and having to avoid threads here accordingly. I guess you guys also forget sometimes that not everyone on this forum is American!)

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Well, that was wholesome (I guess that's the right word). Just as a Christmas episode should be. 

I was frustrated when Mrs Hall changed back from her cute frock but it was in character. I'm glad she came through in the end and loved the little scene with Tristan after she had invited Gerald (I finally remember his name!). All her scenes with Tristan were great.

Steamrolling Mrs Pumfrey and asking both Mrs Hall and Audrey to switch plans the last moment was a bit much but let's do some hand waving with tinsel decorated wrists.

I loved James talking to his parents and thanking them. I was not happy with how things ended with them last season and I don't agree with the harsh judgements of Mrs Harriot in this thread, but it's still a bit Christmas so no arguing.

The one eye-rolling moment was provided by James and Helen. I agree with @Llywela, it makes no sense that these two never talked about marriage logistics in the past three months. Couples not discussing living arrangements before they get married is a beloved tv trope but that does not make it less annoying. Not to mention that it felt rather anachronistic of Helen to simply assume that James would move in with her at the farm.

I guess the lonely plane was a reminder that we're heading into the year 1939. For a moment I thought Mrs Hall's good for nothing son would make a spectacular and late entry but that's not how this show's style.

 

Edited by MissLucas
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Well, that was... nice. Nothing too stressful (I never doubted Trikki would pull through, in spite of the angst we had to go through) and it turned out happily for everyone, just as a Christmas episode should (well, except for in Albert Square*). Of course, there were squabbles, but which family doesn't have those at Christmas? We even got some character development from Mrs Pomphrey - admitting that she does overindulge Trikki because she has no children of her own. I also love the fact that while all the vets are dedicated, they don't promise they can always cure their patients and let the farmers know that (or that they are running a business, for all their dedication).

On 12/27/2021 at 6:32 AM, Llywela said:

Like where they are going to live after they get married, which is a fairly major issue to just...not talk about, at all.

TBF, they only got engaged last episode (even if it was broadcast a few months ago). At least they're discussing this before they are married rather than (as way too often happens on TV) afterwards. But realistically (even if I hadn't seen the original series) they were always going to end up living at the practice since (as James pointed out) he has to be there for his job. Maybe Helen will end up commuting to her farm?

The ending was rather ominous, what with the Hurricane (I think?) flying overhead, also foreshadowing:

Spoiler

That James will join the RAF when war breaks out.

* Which will probably mean nothing to those outside the UK! 

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Not to mention many of us have read the books...

I do wonder how they're going to handle the war in the TV series. Herriot spent a single book on it, but I would imagine the series won't want to cram six years into a single season... though at the same time I wouldn't think they'd want to follow along in "real time" (i.e. six seasons of war drama overshadowing/ replacing fun veterinary antics...).

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12 hours ago, John Potts said:

Well, that was... nice. Nothing too stressful (I never doubted Trikki would pull through, in spite of the angst we had to go through) and it turned out happily for everyone, just as a Christmas episode should (well, except for in Albert Square*).

* Which will probably mean nothing to those outside the UK! 

EastEnders!!  It’s been years now since I’ve seen it but I can get it over here on BritBox. (Where I’ve been watching the old series with Christopher Timothy.)

Looking forward to the new season to air here next year.  I keep saying I’m going to read the books again too but I’ve so many in the queue already.  

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