S10.E15: "Forever or Never"

[sasha206]

2 hours ago, Neurochick said:

Sure it does.  It's about producing drama.  No drama means the show is boring, more boring than it is. The producers had to lead with something.  I remember how they made Shelia look, come to find out she was angry because Nate had been cheating on her since they said "I do."

They go after drama for all couples.  Some couples give it to them.  The sure love Katie's drama.  They even edited one argument in the previews to sound like she said fuck you to Derek when it turns out it was him to say it.

Are you saying the film production is going after racial stereotypes?  

Edited April 13, 2020 by sasha206

[sasha206]

Oh shit, I didn't know there was a MAF: Second Chances!  Yes, let's get Mindy and Meka on that show!

[Lindz]

3 hours ago, configdotsys said:

It makes me crazy to see what people will put up with. I mean, look at these people. You have Meka saying during the retreat, "I didn't come here to get a divorce." Meaning, after ALL that shit that Michael has done, she's still willing to try to hold on. You have Mindy taking entirely too long to dump Zach and when she did, it was tearful. I mean, really? How about standing up for yourself?

 

3 hours ago, Neurochick said:

I do.  We STILL live in a society where there is more pressure on women to get married/have a partner, than it is on men.  There are more women in this country than men, men don't really have a biological clock; so men have less societal pressure than women do, even in the 21st century.  Meka, Mindy, Stephanie and Shawnice would rather be with someone than be alone, or maybe they feel there is no such thing as a perfect person and every person you meet is going to have this flaw or that one.

This experiment show TRAPS people, in a way.
1. It sells them on the idea that their spouse is THEIR match.
2. They were chosen, SPECIAL, to participate out of thousands of applicants.
3. It's only 8 weeks.
So. They should try to make it work, when they wouldn't normally. It is a MARRIAGE. That line of acceptable behavior is blurred because they're MARRIED. We think it's clear cut, but it must be so difficult for those spouses being subjected to that. They know marriage takes work and are told to proceed after their partner crosses their line. They shouldn't have to tolerate their dealbreakers. That's unreasonable. If they exit, they might be considered quitters, failures, not serious, etc. But, we'd understand, support, & agree with their decision. Editing would probably make it seem like it wasn't that bad or hide the main incident. On flipside, we get to see behavior we'd never tolerate. 😅

[TwirlyGirly]

On 4/9/2020 at 10:50 AM, sometimesjennifer said:

They probably gave that turtle a death sentence, removing him from his own habitat and randomly dumping him somewhere else.

Others have mentioned the turtle, too, so I thought I'd throw in my 2¢.

Many, many years ago, when I was still a child, my dad was driving home from work one day and almost hit a turtle that was in the process of s-l-o-w-l-y crossing a busy road. 

My dad pulled over, picked up the turtle, put it in a box, and brought it home.

We'd had a couple of turtles as pets previously. My dad had bought them from a pet store, when were about the size of a silver dollar. When they'd grown too large for the tank (about the size of an adult's palm), my dad let them go in the large man-made pond in our backyard. Those turtles had done fine; for years after he let them go we'd often see them sunning themselves on the banks of the pond, or on one of the large rocks surrounding it. My dad was always very careful when mowing the grass near the pond so as not to accidentally mow over a turtle or any of the dozens of frogs, lizards, etc., that called our pond home.

When my dad arrived home with the rescue turtle, he brought out our old turtle tank and set it up. We kept the turtle for a couple of months indoors, feeding it greens, bits of raw hamburger, and the occasional dead fly (only freshly dead; i.e., flies that came into the house that met an untimely end with the fly swatter).

Mr. Turtle* did just fine. He was a box turtle and was growing fast, so after about two months my dad let him go in our pond - just like the other two turtles we'd kept as pets. Mr. Turtle did just as well in his new home as the other two turtles. As a matter of fact, a couple of years after my dad released Mr. Turtle, I was paddling around in the pond in our canoe, and saw him - and he was huge! More than double the size of when dad let him go.

Didn't Katie notice the turtle because it was on the side of the road when they stopped to pick it up? If so, and it was either about to, or in the process of, crossing the road, stopping to pick it up may have saved the turtle's life. Generally speaking, when it's turtle v.s. car, the car usually wins.

It looked like Katie let the turtle go in a pond, too - and I saw the turtle swim away when she let it go. Unless the pond was contaminated, the turtle will probably be just fine.

Rule of thumb is "leave wildlife alone and don't take a wild animal and turn it into a pet". And I agree with that. 

Our Mr. Turtle would have most likely been killed had my dad left him there, and we had experience caring for turtles, and we had a safe, clean, place to let Mr. Turtle go - so I think my dad made the right decision when he picked him up and brought him home.

Although it's next to impossible to accurately determine time-frames on MAFS, to me it didn't appear Katie kept the turtle very long before releasing it in the pond.

Katie stopping to pick up the turtle just doesn't bother me as much as it does others. YMMV, of course!

*His name wasn't Mr. Turtle. It's been so long I can't remember what I named him. Pretty sure it was more clever than Mr. Turtle, though...

Edited April 13, 2020 by TwirlyGirly

[cinsays]

17 hours ago, Neurochick said:

Pastor Cal is going to help Taylor find her next reality show gig. 

yeah, I think that is his mission for himself too

 

[sometimesjennifer]

5 hours ago, TwirlyGirly said:

Others have mentioned the turtle, too, so I thought I'd throw in my 2¢.

Many, many years ago, when I was still a child, my dad was driving home from work one day and almost hit a turtle that was in the process of s-l-o-w-l-y crossing a busy road. 

My dad pulled over, picked up the turtle, put it in a box, and brought it home.

We'd had a couple of turtles as pets previously. My dad had bought them from a pet store, when were about the size of a silver dollar. When they'd grown too large for the tank (about the size of an adult's palm), my dad let them go in the large man-made pond in our backyard. Those turtles had done fine; for years after he let them go we'd often see them sunning themselves on the banks of the pond, or on one of the large rocks surrounding it. My dad was always very careful when mowing the grass near the pond so as not to accidentally mow over a turtle or any of the dozens of frogs, lizards, etc., that called our pond home.

When my dad arrived home with the rescue turtle, he brought out our old turtle tank and set it up. We kept the turtle for a couple of months indoors, feeding it greens, bits of raw hamburger, and the occasional dead fly (only freshly dead; i.e., flies that came into the house that met an untimely end with the fly swatter).

Mr. Turtle* did just fine. He was a box turtle and was growing fast, so after about two months my dad let him go in our pond - just like the other two turtles we'd kept as pets. Mr. Turtle did just as well in his new home as the other two turtles. As a matter of fact, a couple of years after my dad released Mr. Turtle, I was paddling around in the pond in our canoe, and saw him - and he was huge! More than double the size of when dad let him go.

Didn't Katie notice the turtle because it was on the side of the road when they stopped to pick it up? If so, and it was either about to, or in the process of, crossing the road, stopping to pick it up may have saved the turtle's life. Generally speaking, when it's turtle v.s. car, the car usually wins.

It looked like Katie let the turtle go in a pond, too - and I saw the turtle swim away when she let it go. Unless the pond was contaminated, the turtle will probably be just fine.

Rule of thumb is "leave wildlife alone and don't take a wild animal and turn it into a pet". And I agree with that. 

Our Mr. Turtle would have most likely been killed had my dad left him there, and we had experience caring for turtles, and we had a safe, clean, place to let Mr. Turtle go - so I think my dad made the right decision when he picked him up and brought him home.

Although it's next to impossible to accurately determine time-frames on MAFS, to me it didn't appear Katie kept the turtle very long before releasing it in the pond.

Katie stopping to pick up the turtle just doesn't bother me as much as it does others. YMMV, of course!

*His name wasn't Mr. Turtle. It's been so long I can't remember what I named him. Pretty sure it was more clever than Mr. Turtle, though...

Not to be a "well, actually" person, but my parents have several turtles/tortoises (about 30 years ago a neighbor found a desert tortoise in the parking lot at work and tried to find the owner but never did, so she brought it home and my mom offered to take it in, so now every time someone finds or needs to re-home a turtle they give it to her). All this is to say that my family has done a lot of research on turtles and I recall my mom telling me that box turtles have a very strong homing instinct. If you pick one up and then set it free somewhere else, it will try to return home. They often don't make it because they get lost, or end up on the road again, and are killed either by predators or cars.

That was all I meant by them giving it a death sentence by dumping it somewhere else, especially if it was old. They should have just taken it to the other side of the road if they were worried he was trying to cross. He had a reason to be doing so if he was. 

I don't doubt Mr. Turtle lived a lovely life with your family. 😁

[Kareem]

1 hour ago, sometimesjennifer said:

Not to be a "well, actually" person, but my parents have several turtles/tortoises (about 30 years ago a neighbor found a desert tortoise in the parking lot at work and tried to find the owner but never did, so she brought it home and my mom offered to take it in, so now every time someone finds or needs to re-home a turtle they give it to her). All this is to say that my family has done a lot of research on turtles and I recall my mom telling me that box turtles have a very strong homing instinct. If you pick one up and then set it free somewhere else, it will try to return home. They often don't make it because they get lost, or end up on the road again, and are killed either by predators or cars.

That was all I meant by them giving it a death sentence by dumping it somewhere else, especially if it was old. They should have just taken it to the other side of the road if they were worried he was trying to cross. He had a reason to be doing so if he was. 

...

Exactly this. Every wildlife conservation and/or rescue group, post and poster says so. Glad they actually took a minute to check with others and released it. Unfortunate that she wasted time patting herself on the back while having it on the floor of the car all day.  

[ReadMeLattice]

On 4/12/2020 at 10:36 PM, Lindz said:

 

This experiment show TRAPS people, in a way.
1. It sells them on the idea that their spouse is THEIR match.
2. They were chosen, SPECIAL, to participate out of thousands of applicants.
3. It's only 8 weeks.
So. They should try to make it work, when they wouldn't normally. It is a MARRIAGE. That line of acceptable behavior is blurred because they're MARRIED. We think it's clear cut, but it must be so difficult for those spouses being subjected to that. They know marriage takes work and are told to proceed after their partner crosses their line. They shouldn't have to tolerate their dealbreakers. That's unreasonable. If they exit, they might be considered quitters, failures, not serious, etc. But, we'd understand, support, & agree with their decision. Editing would probably make it seem like it wasn't that bad or hide the main incident. On flipside, we get to see behavior we'd never tolerate. 😅

Yeah, that's the thing. It's an arranged marriage situation, not dating or The Bachelor-style courtships. It's a legal marriage. I'd likely try to make it work for those eight weeks, too, especially if I could potentially be fined if I didn't and my marriage was recognized by the state.

Outside of straight up cheating or abuse, I would probably wade through almost anything for eight weeks just to make absolutely sure...especially because it would require a state-issued annulment or divorce afterward. This isn't just going home after not getting a rose. I'm assuming they get into the mindset of "ok, I have to treat this like an arranged marriage," or it's very unlikely to work anyway. The couples who treat it like a new boyfriend or girlfriend scenario and not a real marriage don't get through it.

If my actual husband had a problem with lying or distancing himself or a temper, I would try to work through it with him, not immediately leave in a couple of weeks. So I'm assuming that's what the people who stick around are thinking. Not saying that's wise or not, but I don't think it's fair to assume that they are pushovers in every single relationship just from seeing their behavior in these very strange circumstances. 

And yeah, it's easy to say "who cares what other people think," but in the thick of it- I can't say I wouldn't think to myself, "Do I really want to be potentially fined for breaking a contract AND have the world hate me and stalk me angrily on social media in a few months when this airs because I left and they edited it to make it seem like I was a flighty asshole? Or do I just want to stick it out for 8 weeks, go on a few dinner dates and let people see what really happened?"

Edited April 14, 2020 by Lm2162

[luckylou]

Several people have mentioned that participants are fined for failing to try to make these tv marriages work.  True?  Or, alternatively, maybe they are paid for making it through the whole show?

Do you think participants mainly participate in order to be on a national tv show?  I think that was clearly the case this time with Taylor and Greg. I don’t know how to explain Brandon, who evidently could not tolerate being on camera, or Michael, who evidently thought his lies would not be exposed.  And I absolutely stopped believing the casting folks were trying to find compatible couples when they matched a person who was terrified of dogs with someone who had a couple of them.  They are looking for conflict, folks, because they are making a tv show.

[humbleopinion]

Michael was recruited by production.

 Finally, he got validation of being a worthy person but his compulsion to lie, to be more sunk his battle ship.

Got well ahead of his skis on the flight to Panama by giving Meka the mandate that if there wasn't honeymoon sex that he could not see going forward with the marriage...

He may have been letting the in flight cocktails do the talking but to Miss Literal that was a major breach of trust.

Michael told Meka's father that he wasn't expecting honeymoon sex.

Michael's first Lie.

He made the matters worse by denying on camera he told Meka that he expected sex in Panama. 

Meka confronted him as soon as the production crew could get a camera set up...

He would not recant so filming continued and unfortunately Michael's lying got more frequent and outlandish....

Wonder if Michael is gainfully employed today...probably on furlough because of the Covid virus closing schools, yoga studios....

 

 

[humbleopinion]

Katie wanted to show the previous BF that she was worthy of  love even though he treated her badly when they were in a sexual relationship only to U Turn and want her back when she got cast as a bride in MAFS...

Much like Moustachley from a early season this was validation that the past love lost "a good one" so the ultimate revenge will be played out on a basic cable teevee show.

Moustachley was winning by finishing her nursing degree and cast after being chosen from hundreds of bridal applicants.

However, David was her groom and they did not click.

Iris was cast because of her virgin storyline and good looks.

Keith was recruited because of his good looks, his utility knife acceptance of people...he could be matched with lots of personality type of brides...except virgins apparently...

 

Edited April 15, 2020 by humbleopinion

[qtpye]

1 hour ago, humbleopinion said:

Katie wanted to show the previous BF that she was worthy of  love even though he treated her badly when they were in a sexual relationship only to U Turn and want her back when she got cast as a bride in MAFS...

Much like Moustachley from a early season this was validation that the past love lost "a good one" so the ultimate revenge will be played out on a basic cable teevee show.

Moustachley was winning by finishing her nursing degree and cast after being chosen from hundreds of bridal applicants.

However, David was her groom and they did not click.

Iris was cast because of her virgin storyline and good looks.

Keith was recruited because of his good looks, his utility knife acceptance of people...he could be matched with lots of personality type of brides...except virgins apparently...

 

It is crazy to me how many women go on reality TV to make their exes jealous. First season Jamie Otis actually originally went on The Bachelor to make her ex realize what he was missing. 

They got back together and eventually broke up (she wanted children and he did not, his own children were grown) and she married Doug. I think he even wrote the song that she marched down to during her wedding.

[ECM1231]

3 hours ago, humbleopinion said:

Moustachley was winning by finishing her nursing degree and cast after being chosen from hundreds of bridal applicants.

Who is this?

[humbleopinion]

1 hour ago, ECM1231 said:

Who is this?

MAFS Season 3: Ashley and David (he was the groom for the MAFS:Second Chances)

Moustachley had a healthy mouth brow, darker than Katie's ...thus the affectionate nickname...

The couple had less than zero chemistry...she spent the most of her time studying....

[Liberty]

Didn't Moustachley have a social media goon squad claiming David had some sort of criminal record. 

IIRC the goon squad said upon learning of David's criminal record Moustachley become ice cold and fearful, just surviving until filming ended. 

 

[ShowFan]

On 4/10/2020 at 12:42 AM, ECM1231 said:

AS SHOWFAN wisely surmised, she needed affirmation from him...that he cared for her and would miss her

Aww thank you! I’m going off personal experience. Once upon a time many moons ago I was in limerence with a man who suddenly said one day his dream is to move to Country X. Country X is not where I live. Even though I knew he isn’t going to move to country X, that really hurt my feelings and upset me. I belabored a lot about it and whined and complained not because I realistically thought he’d move bit just the fact that he so thoughtlessly was dreaming about it and totally excluding me was upsetting. I’m now older and wiser and don’t give a tiny rat’s ass for that man for many years. He never moved. 
 

But when my husband last year planned a trip abroad to visit family (I didn’t include myself by my own choice) I was upset that he planned it for entire 6 days. When I started to whine about it instead of getting mad he said ..oh that’s so sweet and I’ll miss you every moment of it! He hugged me and kissed me and I was no longer mad. He went, he came back and I survived. So that’s where I see the similarities. Have been with my husband for over 20 years and I still get upset if he has to go anywhere without me

[ECM1231]

3 hours ago, humbleopinion said:

MAFS Season 3: Ashley and David (he was the groom for the MAFS:Second Chances)

Moustachley had a healthy mouth brow, darker than Katie's ...thus the affectionate nickname...

The couple had less than zero chemistry...she spent the most of her time studying....

Thanks. I started to watch this show at the tail end of season 5.