S07.E04: You Don't Forget Your Past

[Mrs. Hanson]

3 minutes ago, Apollo said:

Lastly, you know what I always think of when I see a couple like this? Would Michael be with her if she had the exact personality, but had been born into a different body...a more average looking woman? ... or is the fact that she looks like a pretty young girl, with a compliant personality, the actual appeal?   That he can rescue her and mold her to his wishes, etc, as he was unable to do with his American wife? ... conversely, would she be involved with HIM, if it were not for the wealthy lifestyle he is so eager to provide?  Is there an actual heart/soul connection? I do see some real feelings between the two, just wondering where they come from.

If he and his first wife grew apart, how will Julianna feel is ten years when she missed her 20's to settle down with a man who is now in his mid 50's?

Michael like her for her youth, beauty and body.  If Juliana were his age, not stick thin and a US citizen.......not so much.

He also bugged me with his "We fought so hard and and have overcome so much" chatter.  Shut it buddy.  You are driving expensive cars, sipping wine and lounging on yachts.  You are not overcoming stage four cancer and struggling to pay your bills and riding the bus because you can't afford a car.  

[jenifaohjenny]

On 11/25/2019 at 11:24 AM, gavinmac said:

Aren't you surprised that reasonably attractive, image-conscious young Finnish woman would be so desperate to move to the USA that she would promptly agree to marry a dimwitted, lower class and dark skinned man like Blake who lives with his mom? That doesn't make a lot of sense to me. Helsinki isn't Kiev. 

What does his race have to do with anything?  

[jenifaohjenny]

22 minutes ago, FrancescaFiore said:

Wow, is that judgmental and messed up. I tend to shy away from being preachy here, but this is just a bridge too far. These old, outdated notions about porn actresses being disease ridden and amoral are false and are based in nothing but sexist double standards. To slut shame a grandmother for kissing her grandson on the lips based on what she does for a living is so mean-spirited and unfair.  "Porn star" and "Grandma' are pretty much all we know about her at this point. She seemed to have a great relationship with Bryson, which makes me think she's been present and a source of love and support throughout his life. Why isn't she being given credit for that, and instead only being negatively judged for how she earns a living?

Preach!  The amount of shaming of sex lives and bodies is crazy on this thread. There are plenty other things these 90 day "cast" members can be judged on and rightfully so  - their crazy behavior and denial about the fact that 1/2 their mates are not even that into them. That is better than judging their small boobs, saggy boobs, skin color, ethnicity, sex worker jobs, etc. 

Edited November 26, 2019 by jenifaohjenny
typo

[John M]

13 minutes ago, Apollo said:

I don't think having a differing opinion is EVER going too far.

I don't think morals have an expiration date.

I think "slutshaming" or any other phrase with the wording shaming tacked on, are manufactured terms that have no basis in reality, as I see it.   Just because something is randomly introduced to our culture, usually via social media, and then parroted ad nauseam , does not make it a valid thing in my eyes, in my opinion.  Though, I do think men should be judged equally for disrespecting their own bodies and the bodies of the women they impregnate and often abandon soon after.

Credit?  There are other ways to make money.  

Having sex is disrespecting her body? Scratch that, two people having consensual sex after extensive STI testing is disrespecting their bodies? 

Sex is a profound natural desire, respecting your body is getting tested for STIs regularly, using birth control and/or PrEP as appropriate, engaging in consensual sex and taking care of your general sexual health which can include masturbating to pornography.

Edited November 26, 2019 by John M

[Cammi]

1 hour ago, John M said:

There is very limited evidence for this beyond anecdotal but it's certainly a message being pushed hard by people trying to restrict access to porn and the choices women are able to make in porn. And notice you said actresses, many men do porn, I have yet to see any serious argument about mental health of men that do porn which always makes me suspicious of the motivations of the people pushing the argument (Not you specifically but just in the general tone being pushed by anti-porn proponents). And just to add, lots of people have jobs that cause damaging, lasting effects on mental health, some profound, even people in mainstream respected fields like first responders, medical professionals, people in social services, etc. I personally work in low-income public health/social services and it is not a field for a lot of people, lots of people leave it because of the emotional toll it takes on them which can sometimes be profound.

The medical evidence around porn related sexual dysfunction is almost non-existent and what we have is correlated to a lot of other mental disorders and more often to things related to our public squeamishness and prudishness of having any proper and reasonable discussions about sexual health. E.g. circumcision, masturbation technique, use of sexual lubricants.

I will also add that while there are negative arguments to porn there are also positive benefits to it such as normalizing sexual desire, sex education, improving communication around sex and sexual desires even among committed, sexually active monogamous couples and even increasing the acceptability and frequency of masturbation which is correlated to a decrease of sexual assault in and outside of relationships, the happiness of people again, but in and out of committed monogamous and non-monogamous relationships. Just for example, we are talking about it more publically now but there is a huge amount of marital disharmony caused my mismatches in sex drive with one or both partners viewing masturbating to porn unacceptable.

The issue is complicated and the production of a lot of pornography can certainly be problematic and sometimes abusive but there is one thing we sure as hell know, there is far too little discussion around safer sex and sexual wellness including normalizing sexual activity like masurbation and slut shaming porn actresses is a very, very poor place to start.

I agree with a lot of your points actually, but my point was simply that not everyone thinks like porn grandma. I'm not about to BEGIN to argue whether porn is wrong or right on this message board. It isn't illegal, so watch until your hand falls off 🙂 I WILL argue, that either way, Anne is entitled to her opinion that it is wrong/a lowly career choice. People are seeming to fault her for simply HAVING an opinion that differs from theirs. I'm no pearl clutcher, but old girl can think whatever she wants. Whether the grandma was a porn actress or a scientist. 

And something tells me Robert probably gave up rights to the other kids, so no child support. It'd be a safe bet. 

[FrancescaFiore]

9 minutes ago, Apollo said:

Credit?  There are other ways to make money.  

There absolutely are. Martin Shkrelli did it by price gouging sick people. Other people do it by cheating, theft and other illegal means. Some work for companies that are poisoning the environment, like Monsanto. 

In the grand scheme of things, being an adult film actress does no harm to anyone. Chances are, she wasn't able to afford college, or maybe just didn't have the academic bona fides to go. She may just really enjoy sex and decided to parlay that into a career. SO THE HELL WHAT?? Does that disqualify her from kissing her grandson? She is the GRANDMOTHER, not the mother of Bryson. She doesn't have to be involved with his life at all, if she doesn't want to. She makes the effort to be there for Bryson anyway. Where's the judgement for Bryson's mother, who is evidently not in the picture at all? Money from adult films buys a lot of toys, clothes, doctor appointments and food. Is that all tainted because Grandma had consensual sex on camera to pay for it?

She SHOULD be given credit. She stepped up when her own daughter didn't. Instead the morality police are trying to make her seem like a bad person when there was literally zero indication of that. 

[John M]

3 minutes ago, Cammi said:

I WILL argue, that either way, Anne is entitled to her opinion that it is wrong/a lowly career choice. 

She is not, they are doing the same thing, selling their bodies, what difference does it make on if we actually see Robert's penis inserted into her?

[FrancescaFiore]

21 minutes ago, Apollo said:

I don't think morals have an expiration date.

Think again. Alcohol consumption was once considered immoral. Premarital sex of any kind was considered immoral. Divorce was so immoral it was forbidden. Some morals, especially those to do with sex, absolutely do expire over time, as social mores evolve.

[BallisticNikki]

40 minutes ago, Apollo said:

Yeah, totally disagree and if they were MY children, I'd definitely have a say in it.  You have a right to your opinion.  We can leave it at that.

I'm speaking legally. Parents don't have any say so in what goes on in the other parent's home.

[FrancescaFiore]

1 minute ago, Apollo said:

Which type of woman would you be pleased that your adult son marries?  A pornstar/promiscuous woman or someone who had led a stable life, respecting herself and others?

Why do you believe an adult film actress doesn't have a stable life or respect herself or anyone else? That's a false premise.

[John M]

1 minute ago, Apollo said:

Which type of woman would you be pleased that your adult son marries?  A pornstar/promiscuous woman or someone who had led a stable life, respecting herself and others?  Not necessarily a virgin, but someone who makes carefully thought out decisions, has been in long-term monogamous relationships and is not prone to acting on every whim or urge?  

What mother-in-law would be proud to boast about her ex-pornstar/slut daughter-in-law?  LOL  We can quibble all day long about women's rights and empowering ourselves by doing whatever, whenever, if it feels good, etc.,....but some ideals are in place for a reason.  Just my "outdated" opinion though... LOL

Whatever person, man or woman, fulfills each others emotional and sexual needs in a healthy way.

I'm married to a man I've been in a long term, committed, monogamous relationship with. We both have good jobs, a beautiful home and a very supportive and fulfilling relationship. I've also slept with well over 100 men, my husband knows this, why do you think you get to have an opinion on it?

[FrancescaFiore]

6 minutes ago, Apollo said:

What mother-in-law would be proud to boast about her ex-pornstar/slut daughter-in-law? 

She isn't the daughter in law, she's the grandparent. Also pornstar and "slut" are two different things. That's an antiquated perspective that's not even close to accurate. Porn stars get paid to have sex on camera. "Sluts" are women or men who are promiscuous, reckless and not discriminating about who their partners are. Calling a porn star a slut is like calling someone with a 9-5 gig a hooker because they're giving something of themselves in exchange for money. Why is a woman who enjoys sex a "slut?" 

[RealReality]

1 hour ago, BallisticNikki said:

Awww he was kinda cute in his mug shots. 😁

Bc she did such a wonderful job w/ her own daughter....who got knocked up by the local community peen and completely abandoned her kid. Where was this elevator speech 5 yrs ago? Miss me, granny.🖐️

Perkele? 😆

No such right. You lose that right when you get divorced. She can have whatever hopes, but no right to impose or expect. 

Ideally, but unlikely. 

You would have no way to enforce any of this. She gets to spend time alone w/ them by marrying (or even dating) the father.

I don't always think that bad adult kid = bad parent / parenting.  Some people just get a dud.  

That she chose to remain involved in Bryson's life to the point of having regularly scheduled visits when she doesn't have to says a lot about porn Granny's devotion to Bryson.....

I wouldn't assume she was a deficient mother because she was involved in sex work or because her daughter made horrible decisions....no more than I would assume that Ronald's mother was awful because he is an angry addict who lacks any sense of accountability or responsibility.  

[FrancescaFiore]

Just now, Apollo said:

Because... why? 

BECAUSE THEY AREN'T HURTING ANYONE.

I genuinely don't understand how you don't see the difference. For me, immorality is based on a lack of compassion or consideration for how what you do impacts other people. A porn actress doesn't even rise to the level of being put on an "extreme morality scale." She's doing what she wants, she's not hurting anyone, she's using the money she makes to help her grandson. Where, exactly, is the "extreme immorality" there?

[Cammi]

No matter if Anne is a sex worker or not, ("selling her body for a green card" is pure conjecture at this point. She has not admitted to selling her body for sex, unlike grandma), she is still entitled to an opinion. That is like me saying "I am an accountant, and I can't criticize other accountants". EVERYONE is entitled to an opinion! What the actual fuck? 

[Cammi]

13 minutes ago, John M said:

Whatever person, man or woman, fulfills each others emotional and sexual needs in a healthy way.

I'm married to a man I've been in a long term, committed, monogamous relationship with. We both have good jobs, a beautiful home and a very supportive and fulfilling relationship. I've also slept with well over 100 men, my husband knows this, why do you think you get to have an opinion on it?

Dude, if you think people aren't going to have opinions (good or bad) about you then you are in for a HARSH reality... I just got judged in the grocery line for having "frizzy hair". Everyone "gets" to have their own opinions on anything or anyone they wish! WHY do YOU feel you get to have an opinion on these cast members from a reality tv show ALL of us here are commenting on (that none of us know)? 

[RealReality]

24 minutes ago, Cammi said:

I agree with a lot of your points actually, but my point was simply that not everyone thinks like porn grandma. I'm not about to BEGIN to argue whether porn is wrong or right on this message board. It isn't illegal, so watch until your hand falls off 🙂 I WILL argue, that either way, Anne is entitled to her opinion that it is wrong/a lowly career choice. People are seeming to fault her for simply HAVING an opinion that differs from theirs. I'm no pearl clutcher, but old girl can think whatever she wants. Whether the grandma was a porn actress or a scientist. 

And something tells me Robert probably gave up rights to the other kids, so no child support. It'd be a safe bet. 

I'm not sure he could get out of child support by just petitioning to give up parental rights.  If so, this seems like it would be a huge loophole for deadbeats.  

Anny is as entitled to her opinion as anyone else ....but then she should stop crying about how unfair it is that she is judged poorly when people express their opinion that she is a golddigging green card scam artist who couldnt catch anyone better than broke ass Robert.  Glass houses and what not. 

[FrancescaFiore]

Just now, Apollo said:

Exactly then, how far will we go with our socially engineered tolerance?  Do you know there are groups of people currently pushing for us all to sympathize with pedos, with the end goal of defining this as merely a sexual PREFERENCE?  Very slippery slope, yes?

No, not a slippery slope at all. Pedophiles HURT CHILDREN. A woman who has sex on camera for money doesn't hurt children. Pedophilia is ILLEGAL, sex on camera for money is not. There is no "socially engineered tolerance," that's another false premise. Tolerance for different lifestyles (NOT for deviant behavior that leaves victims) is a product of understanding that my way isn't necessarily the best way for someone else and accepting that without resentment or judgment. 

The argument you make is the same disingenuous argument that is made against marriage equality for same sex couples. "It's a slippery slope. Will we be marrying our pets next?" That's ludicrous - nobody was talking about marrying animals. The only slippery slope is the one on the foreheads of those who buy into that bigoted garbage.

[John M]

1 minute ago, Cammi said:

No matter if Anne is a sex worker or not, ("selling her body for a green card" is pure conjecture at this point. She has not admitted to selling her body for sex, unlike grandma), she is still entitled to an opinion. That is like me saying "I am an accountant, and I can't criticize other accountants". EVERYONE is entitled to an opinion! What the actual fuck? 

I mean we aren't a thought police state, you can have an opinion, I'm just asking you to examine how your opinion is harmful and shows irrational prejudice.

2 minutes ago, Apollo said:

Those are excellent points to ponder and I will.  Exactly then, how far will we go with our socially engineered tolerance?  Do you know there are groups of people currently pushing for us all to sympathize with pedos, with the end goal of defining this as merely a sexual PREFERENCE?  Very slippery slope, yes? If I had not looked it, I would not have believed it, but these kinds of things happen in insidious steps. 

Actually the prevailing medical understanding of pedophiles is that it is in fact an immutable sexual attraction, no different than being heterosexual or being gay. The issue is that their sexual attraction harms people because children can not consent to sexual activity.

There is a lot of evidence that the way we treat pediphilia as a society discourages them from seeking harm reduction strategies and puts them into situations that gives them access to victims.

[FrancescaFiore]

3 minutes ago, Apollo said:

All caps??? . . .  that is normally regarding as shouting when typing. 

Yeah, I'm aware. It needed to be said loudly, since it appeared you weren't aware that porn actresses aren't hurting anyone and were continuing with the false premise that they are. 

[BravoAddict72]

20 hours ago, RealReality said:

I don't remember think porn granny was rude per se, I think she was brusque and to the point because everything anny does will affect Bryson, at least tangentially.  

Everyone should be worried about birth control......if anny and Robert have another kid they will be stretched even more financially thin and anny's priority will likely be her child and not Bryson.  

The two of them are going to alienate their free babysitter and someone who is a stable presence in Bryson's life.  She may be a porn granny, but it doesn't mean she doesn't love Bryson and will fight to protect him.  

But why wouldn't it be? Just because Robert has other children doesn't mean Anny should never be able to have one. Of course this is if they can pay for that child. But still, why should Anny be punished for Robert's past? And her child should be a priority for her. My husband had a child as a teenager and things didn't work out with the mother of his child. Years later he met me and we got married. When his other son was 12 we had a child. My inlaws had nothing to do with our child because they didn't think it was fair that our son got to live with his dad full time when his other son never got to. How was that my or our sons fault? Maybe she shouldn't have thrown out her teenage son's condoms when she found them because in her mind if they didn't have a condom they wouldn't have sex. (3 out of her 4 boys had kids without being married). She couldn't pick our son out of a lineup up until the day she died because of her backward thinking (it was totally her loss. He is an amazing kid!)

[RealReality]

7 minutes ago, BravoAddict72 said:

But why wouldn't it be? Just because Robert has other children doesn't mean Anny should never be able to have one. Of course this is if they can pay for that child. But still, why should Anny be punished for Robert's past? And her child should be a priority for her. My husband had a child as a teenager and things didn't work out with the mother of his child. Years later he met me and we got married. When his other son was 12 we had a child. My inlaws had nothing to do with our child because they didn't think it was fair that our son got to live with his dad full time when his other son never got to. How was that my or our sons fault? Maybe she shouldn't have thrown out her teenage son's condoms when she found them because in her mind if they didn't have a condom they wouldn't have sex. (3 out of her 4 boys had kids without being married). She couldn't pick our son out of a lineup up until the day she died because of her backward thinking (it was totally her loss. He is an amazing kid!)

From porn Granny's perspective though, Bryson getting less attention, less love and having a harder time would be a concern.   Granny IS an interested party...she wants to see the best for her grandson. 

Being pushed aside in favor of another child could be hurtful to Bryson.  Anny's baby would be her priority and that would likely have some impact on Bryson, I would think.  

As an uninterested party with little investment in their situation it wouldnt affect me (other than as a taxpayer)...but I think porn granny has a valid concern.  I don't think it's an unfair point of concern.  

Particularly given their limited resources.  

LOL, this is all going to end in drogo yelling at us to get off his lawn. 

Edited November 26, 2019 by RealReality

[FrancescaFiore]

1 minute ago, Apollo said:

Yeah -- this is exactly the kind of thing being pushed, with the endgame of accepted child-abuse.

I don't know how you got to that conclusion from what was written. "Immutable" doesn't mean we accept pedos. It means it's a mental disorder, an irresistible compulsion, like people who self-harm. Nobody advocates "Oh, just let pedos be pedos." The studies done are intended to help understand the minds of these deviants and try to find ways to keep them from acting on their immutable impulses.

[John M]

4 minutes ago, Apollo said:

"the prevailing medical understanding of pedophiles is that it is in fact an immutable sexual attraction"

Yeah -- this is exactly the kind of thing being pushed, with the endgame of accepted child-abuse. 😡 It's truly disturbing... this thread has taken a very dark, twisted nose-dive.  I am out TOO.

Absolutely no one is saying we should accept child abuse, it's saying that it is fact that some people are inherently sexually attracted to children and they should be able to safely self-identify so we can keep them away from children instead of hiding in the shadows until we find out the molested a kid.

[RoxiP]

2 hours ago, Apollo said:

yeah, parents do not lose their right to PARENT unless they sign them away.  

Unless it is written into the divorce decree/parenting agreement, then you can place dictates on what your ex can and cannot do.

Just now, RoxiP said:

Unless it is written into the divorce decree/parenting agreement, then you can place dictates on what your ex can and cannot do.

Sorry, I was responding to the wrong box and now I have lost my train of thought...choo chooing down the tracks!

[BallisticNikki]

26 minutes ago, RealReality said:

I don't always think that bad adult kid = bad parent / parenting.  Some people just get a dud.  

That she chose to remain involved in Bryson's life to the point of having regularly scheduled visits when she doesn't have to says a lot about porn Granny's devotion to Bryson.....

I wouldn't assume she was a deficient mother because she was involved in sex work or because her daughter made horrible decisions....no more than I would assume that Ronald's mother was awful because he is an angry addict who lacks any sense of accountability or responsibility.  

Bad decisions are one thing. But abandoning your own little child?? (And as a woman, too?) That's a sociopath! (Unless she's confined to a hospital.)

I don't blame grandma but i do think her frustration is misplaced. Why isn't she growling and curling her lip at her own daughter (or even Robert) who created this situation?

Grandma's porn career isn't necessarily the reason why she failed as a mother. But the porn career adds a certain extra layer of unsavoriness to an already unseemly story.

[John M]

5 minutes ago, BallisticNikki said:

Grandma's porn career isn't necessarily the reason why she failed as a mother. But the porn career adds a certain extra layer of unsavoriness to an already unseemly story.

If you are going to label her an unseemly moral degenerate for having consensual legal, safer sex what exactly do you expect her to do with her life now?

Like is there an actual way she can repent to rejoin the rest of us or does she just serve as an irredeemable cautionary tale for anyone else considering also engaging in consensual legal, safer sex that you disapprove of.

And my father is greedy, racist narcissist, my mother is a racist conservative christian and I've devoted my life to public service for the poor, I grew up with a girl with one of the kindest, wholesome, generous families you would ever meet and their daughter is a self-harming schizophrenic. Parenting might have very little to do with her daughter's situation.

Edited November 26, 2019 by John M

[charmed1]

People are certainly entitled to do whatever they want with their own bodies. I don’t judge PornMa for how she makes a legal living. I do however have an incredibly difficult time grasping the argument of “don’t judge me for what I do with my body, but let me ask incredibly invasive and judgmental questions about what you do with yours because...reasons?” Nah. 

Remove thine log from thine own anus, PornMa, then ye shall see clearly to remove the log from thine brother’s. Or something like that.

Edited November 26, 2019 by charmed1

[RealReality]

4 minutes ago, BallisticNikki said:

Bad decisions are one thing. But abandoning your own little child?? (And as a woman, too?) That's a sociopath! (Unless she's confined to a hospital.)

I don't blame grandma but i do think her frustration is misplaced. Why isn't she growling and curling her lip at her own daughter (or even Robert) who created this situation?

Grandma's porn career isn't necessarily the reason why she failed as a mother. But the porn career adds a certain extra layer of unsavoriness to an already unseemly story.

As someone said above, I can see Robert being a lost cause.  He seems stubbornly ignorant and unwilling to accept that he may be doing something wrong.  I can see how any constructive criticism would fall on deaf ears.  

From her perspective, anny may be the only potentially sane person in the relationship she can maybe have some impact on.  

Porn granny may have or have had the same discussion with her daughter....we don't know.  We don't know if her daughter has any other kids, so maybe she at least took her mom's advice and stopped.

At this point, porn Granny's primary objective may just be to stop the bleeding so there isn't any further damage.  

[Spike]

1 hour ago, Cammi said:

I agree with a lot of your points actually, but my point was simply that not everyone thinks like porn grandma. I'm not about to BEGIN to argue whether porn is wrong or right on this message board. It isn't illegal, so watch until your hand falls off 🙂 I WILL argue, that either way, Anne is entitled to her opinion that it is wrong/a lowly career choice. People are seeming to fault her for simply HAVING an opinion that differs from theirs. I'm no pearl clutcher, but old girl can think whatever she wants. Whether the grandma was a porn actress or a scientist. 

And something tells me Robert probably gave up rights to the other kids, so no child support. It'd be a safe bet. 

I think he said they are all back in Brooklyn, so unlikely he is much of a presence in their lives either.

[BallisticNikki]

5 minutes ago, John M said:

If you are going to label her an unseemly moral degenerate for having consensual legal, safer sex what exactly do you expect her to do with her life now?

Like is there an actual way she can repent to rejoin the rest of us or does she just serve as an irredeemable cautionary tale for anyone else considering also engaging in consensual legal, safer sex that you disapprove of.

No, she could have just said hello to everyone, pushed the kid on a swing and kept all the gratuitous information about her career to herself.

[John M]

1 minute ago, BallisticNikki said:

No, she could have just said hello to everyone, pushed the kid on a swing and kept all the gratuitous information about her career to herself.

And wait until people find out, and they will, until they shame her? And keep her career to herself? Her career is safe and legal. Do you keep your career to yourself? Like the one of the first questions out of half of people's mouth when you meet them for the first time isn't "So, what do you do?"

[BallisticNikki]

3 minutes ago, RealReality said:

At this point, porn Granny's primary objective may just be to stop the bleeding so there isn't any further damage.  

OK but when is it ever in good taste to demand the reproductive info from a woman you've just met?

I mean, we all know the line of questioning is producer driven...bc no one could truly be that crass. But even in real life, ppl (well meaning and busybodies) are now being discouraged from asking newlyweds in their own family when they plan on trying for babies, etc. Even that is considered invasive. 🐈🍆🚫

But "do you have birth control in"?????😩🤨

[RealReality]

7 minutes ago, BallisticNikki said:

OK but when is it ever in good taste to demand the reproductive info from a woman you've just met?

I mean, we all know the line of questioning is producer driven...bc no one could truly be that crass. But even in real life, ppl (well meaning and busybodies) are now being discouraged from asking newlyweds in their own family when they plan on trying for babies, etc. Even that is considered invasive. 🐈🍆🚫

But "do you have birth control in"?????😩🤨

I'm no Emily post and it's not something even I would ask, so I agree with you there.  

I guess I could just see where she was coming from.  And yes, let's never forget that that was very very clearly a producer driven conversation.  

Edited November 26, 2019 by RealReality

[BallisticNikki]

22 minutes ago, John M said:

And wait until people find out, and they will, until they shame her? And keep her career to herself? Her career is safe and legal. Do you keep your career to yourself? Like the one of the first questions out of half of people's mouth when you meet them for the first time isn't "So, what do you do?"

No, I don't disclose my career in a park within 20 seconds of meeting ppl. Yes, I may choose to keep my career to myself, depending on the circumstances.

There was no indication Anny wanted to know abut her career.

But if she feels secure in her career choice how could ppl shame her? And why would she worry about it? If they would shame her when they "find out" why couldn't they also shame her when she discloses it? 

Edited November 26, 2019 by BallisticNikki

[Drogo]

Posts have been removed.  Take a beat before posting again and remember the golden rule of Primetimer-- 

Be Civil... or Be Gone.  

[PinkFlamingo]

How about this - if you had to be in a relationship with any of this seasons participants, who would it be? 

Edit now that Drogo has saved us - trying for positivity, bring back the snark! 

Edited November 26, 2019 by PinkFlamingo

[Gobi]

1 minute ago, PinkFlamingo said:

How about this - if you had to be in a relationship with any of this seasons participants, who would it be? 

That's like asking would you rather drown or be hanged.

[essexjan]

Tania is the worst, and Syngin must be wondering what happened to the woman he met in South Africa now he's confronted with this entitled, demanding harridan. It would have taken a day, or a weekend at best, to clean and tidy that shed - take everything out, thoroughly clean the room, clean the furniture, put it back, vacuum the mattress thoroughly, some nice new bedding, a blind, a few lamps and a rug, and it would have been just fine.  It's inexcusable she left it dirty and full of junk until he arrived and then expected him to jump right to it.

Anny and Robert are both as awful as one another. I loved the grandma, and I don't criticise her at all for doing sex work. It's just work, it doesn't define her as a person or mean that she has no morals. She appears to have a very strong moral compass and clearly loves Bryson. I totally understand why she's so concerned about the appearance of this surly green-card tourist into his life.

I feel sorry for Blake. It's obvious Jasmin is only with him because her sister is already in LA and there's no other way for her to get to the USA.  He is a patsy and too stupid to realise it. He has nothing to offer her, and she will be looking for a Rodeo Drive lifestyle that he can't possibly provide.  But once she has the green card and her divorce, she'll find a rich man.

I skipped through the Michael and Juliana segments. They already bore me. And he skeeves me out.

I agree with Anna's friend that there is no way of having a relationship with someone whose language you can't speak. I can only guess that she and Mursel conducted their courtship solely via Google translate, but that's no basis for a marriage, or for him making any kind of a life in the USA. I can't imagine there are many Turkish speakers in the small Midwestern town they're living in. He'll be sunk if he doesn't learn to speak English quickly. He also dissed her beekeeping skills (in Turkish, so she doesn't know).

Mike and Natalie are adorable and genuinely appear to love one another. Her mum is so sweet and it's clear she loves Mike too. But I think Natalie will be in for such a shock when she gets to the USA. A farm in the middle of nowhere, with only Bojangles for company, is probably not what she will be expecting. It looked like a pretty rundown farm too.

I also noticed that in the photos we saw of the couple on his previous visits to see her, Mike was quite a bit slimmer than he is now. I know he's lost a ton of weight, but it looks as if it's starting to creep up a little and he'll need to watch that. I hope these two work out, and I think she will be a good influence on him living a healthy, outdoors life, maybe with a couple of children.

I love Bojangles. He's like a little gnome who lives in the barn. He's probably related to Mose Shrute.

[RealReality]

13 minutes ago, PinkFlamingo said:

How about this - if you had to be in a relationship with any of this seasons participants, who would it be? 

Edit now that Drogo has saved us - trying for positivity, bring back the snark! 

Probably Michael because his kids seem like fun!  Also, while he isn't as wealthy as he'd like us to think, he isn't broke.  

He wouldn't want me though because I'm age appropriate 😋

[John M]

30 minutes ago, BallisticNikki said:

OK but when is it ever in good taste to demand the reproductive info from a woman you've just met?

I mean, we all know the line of questioning is producer driven...bc no one could truly be that crass. But even in real life, ppl (well meaning and busybodies) are now being discouraged from asking newlyweds in their own family when they plan on trying for babies, etc. Even that is considered invasive. 🐈🍆🚫

But "do you have birth control in"?????😩🤨

Well clearly she has an interest in them not having an unplanned pregnancy since the father of her grandchild has 4 other children and I'm guessing sex education is not great in the DR and it is clearly terrible in the US.

Does Anny know where to get birth control? Can they afford condoms? If not does she know where to get them for free? 

Sexual education in high-risk populations is HARD and often involves very blunt language. You would be shocked at how many men literally do not know how to use a condom and as a man, it's not rocket science. Someone has to do it and since they are airing everything else about this trainwreck on TV they might as well put this here too. Where do you think the other opportunities for sex education are going to come up?

Edited November 26, 2019 by John M

[charmed1]

17 minutes ago, PinkFlamingo said:

How about this - if you had to be in a relationship with any of this seasons participants, who would it be? 

None. I’m saving myself for Zied.

[RealReality]

4 minutes ago, charmed1 said:

None. I’m saving myself for Zied.

Is he technically married to Rebecca yet? 

I'll bet you can get a good deal on a zied mug or maybe a zied photo blanket to keep you warm at night.  

Edited November 26, 2019 by RealReality

[Mrs. Hanson]

20 minutes ago, PinkFlamingo said:

How about this - if you had to be in a relationship with any of this seasons participants, who would it be? 

Edit now that Drogo has saved us - trying for positivity, bring back the snark! 

Mike in Sequim.  My hubby is six foot seven (yes I have a type) and living on all those acres of land would be AWESOME.  I would encourage him to either sell off some acres or rent it to farmers to settle his debt issue.  I am, however, 20 years older than him, so......yeah no.

[Scarlett45]

4 minutes ago, Mrs. Hanson said:

Mike in Sequim.  My hubby is six foot seven (yes I have a type) and living on all those acres of land would be AWESOME.  I would encourage him to either sell off some acres or rent it to farmers to settle his debt issue.  I am, however, 20 years older than him, so......yeah no.

I am a city gal through and through, but Mike seems nice and kind. And like a guy who wouldn’t be super demanding and a considerate life partner. I too vote Mike. 

[charmed1]

9 minutes ago, RealReality said:

Is he technically married to Rebecca yet? 

I'll bet you can get a good deal on a zied mug or maybe a zied photo blanket to keep you warm at night.  

I doubt it. He’s scooting around Tunisia, blasting Usher songs in his new whip now. Once Robert takes me shopping for my 25 year old bootcut jeans and pleather jacket, I’m all set to go hookah bar hopping with my boo.

[BallisticNikki]

16 minutes ago, John M said:

Well clearly she has an interest in them not having an unplanned pregnancy since the father of her grandchild has 4 other children and I'm guessing sex education is not great in the DR and it is clearly terrible in the US.

Does Anny know where to get birth control? Can they afford condoms? If not does she know where to get them for free? 

Sexual education in high-risk populations is HARD and often involves very blunt language. You would be shocked at how many men literally do not know how to use a condom and as a man, it's not rocket science. Someone has to do it and since they are airing everything else about this trainwreck on TV they might as well put this here too. Where do you think the other opportunities for sex education are going to come up?

That or she was just trying to be a condescending asshole like so many of the other American relatives.

Either way, she blew it and they are no closer to having birth control than they were before they met her.

[Drogo]

Just now, BallisticNikki said:

Either way, she blew it and they are no closer to having birth control than they were before they met her.

If Anny gets pregnant, she and Robert should definitely blame the grandma.  

[PinkFlamingo]

21 minutes ago, Mrs. Hanson said:

Mike in Sequim.  My hubby is six foot seven (yes I have a type) and living on all those acres of land would be AWESOME.  I would encourage him to either sell off some acres or rent it to farmers to settle his debt issue.  I am, however, 20 years older than him, so......yeah no.

Yeah so far he seems like a nice guy and I liked their joking around with her riding on the suitcase, carrying her into the house, etc.  Every season I want to root for at least one couple and hope the show doesn’t ruin it but it always inevitably gets ruined in some way. 

Side note - the conversation with Natalie’s friends was all about what Mike can provide her and comparing him to her ex in terms of money making ability. Not one question about is he a nice guy, is he fun to be around, or does he treat you well?  Because if money making ability was the only qualification in a spouse, that obviously didn’t work out the first time around. 

[RealReality]

18 minutes ago, charmed1 said:

I doubt it. He’s scooting around Tunisia, blasting Usher songs in his new whip now. Once Robert takes me shopping for my 25 year old bootcut jeans and pleather jacket, I’m all set to go hookah bar hopping with my boo.

If you're not getting the accompanying used lingerie you're doing it wrong. 🤣😂🤣😂