S06.E06: Family Sucks

[Milaxx]

Annalise intervenes in Michaela’s relationship with her father and asks for his help in return; after Asher reunites and has an unpleasant conversation with his estranged mother, he shares a meaningful moment with Michaela.

Edited October 31, 2019 by Milaxx

[Milaxx]

Jack posted on twitter. 

[Annber03]

"After the Keating gang destroys their phones*

"We forgot to tell Asher!"

"Well, it's a little late to call him now..." 

LOL. 

And speaking of Asher, so he and Michaela are getting close again. Only a matter of time before that happened. I liked Asher talking about how he'd always be there for her, whether they were romantically involved or not. Wonder if that promise will have anything to do with why he's covered in blood in that flash forward. 

I'm with Connor in thinking there's more to Bonnie's explanation for why he got picked for the group. I do like the reason she gave, though-that was a nice little bonding moment between them.

Yay, Cora, for giving Tegan the heads up on what was going on with Nate. I hope Annalise listens to Tegan with her concerns about all of this. I get Annalise wanting to fight back, but I also understand Tegan's concerns.

(Also, during the scene in that parking garage, my mom was like, "Don't you know it's a bad idea to fight with somebody in one of those things? Haven't movies taught you anything?")

Edited November 1, 2019 by Annber03

[Dancingjaneway]

I don't think Asher killed anyone and I knew Bonnie wasn't going to be the dead informant. I think Asher witnessed the informants murder. His reaction is added to my list of reasons I think Oliver is the informant. Was anyone else confused by the Frank/Annalise conversation involving Laurel(when she took his pain meds)? What exactly were they talking about and what are they keeping secret? I am SO glad that Tegan's ex didn't sleep with Nate and that she told Tegan what was up. I feel bad for Tegan that she's fallen for Annalise because I don't think Annalise feels the same way & I feel like Annalise is going to betray her somehow. I think it's Annalise's mom that shows up at her door next week. I doubt the Castillos would be stupid enough to show up at her house let alone knock on the door. I was torn on whether I believed Bonnie's story about choosing Connor but in the end I think it's true. It was simple enough & wasn't put forth as a "shocking reveal". I'm glad that Frank told Ollie it wasn't his fault he got beat up. I just wish he would leave Bonnie alone because she will always be a replacement for Laurel. I think the Asher/family storyline is over. I think it was just a way to give the actor more to do and also to bring Michaela & Asher back together romantically. I would love for this to be the end of the Vic storyline but I don't think that's going to happen. 

[Lady Calypso]

4 minutes ago, Annber03 said:

And speaking of Asher, so he and Michaela are getting close again. Only a matter of time before that happened. I liked Asher talking about how he'd always be there for her, whether they were romantically involved or not.

I mean, I vastly prefer Asher/Michaela to Gabriel/Michaela, but....this doesn't bode well, with Michaela blatantly cheating on Gabriel with Asher. Her and Gabriel aren't broken up; they're in a fight, but she never ended things with him, so she's made the conscious decision to cheat. 

And now, with the flashforward, dare I hope that the dead person is Gabriel? Or is it too easy? I guess we know that Asher was there at the crime scene when it happened. I'm not sure if he definitely did do it, but he definitely got involved somehow. Also, THANK GOD Bonnie isn't the dead informant. She lives! At least up to the events of the flashforward. Her and Asher were at the top of my list for the dead informants, so that crosses those two off right now.

So, it was BONNIE who picked Connor for the K5. I will admit, I didn't see that coming. I can buy the explanation for sure. It's just made me totally bitter at Wes and Laurel for taking away these character moments for the other K3 members because we could have gotten Connor/Bonnie scenes earlier, if Wes, and then Laurel, hadn't taken up the major storylines and become second lead to Annalise. 

Similarly with the Asher family drama, which has barely been touched upon throughout the series. We could have gotten so much more of this. Asher's anger is scary, but I also don't blame him for being upset at his mother and his sister. I'm glad he did figure out that these people are toxic to him.

I'm not pleased that Tegan is going along with Nate's crusade for his "Pops". By the way, I actually have figured out that I can't STAND the use of the word Pops from Nate. Just say your Dad that you weren't actually close to until the last couple of months of his life, alright? Jesus Christ, though, he's annoying. I always thought Nate was boring, but now he's annoying on top of boring. I don't care. Poor Tegan is getting roped in to his mess.

But we got the reveal that Tegan likes Annalise, so that's something.

I'd be fine if this was the end of Solomon Vic, but it would also be way too easy, and I think Solomon has a little bit more story to tell.

[Annber03]

9 minutes ago, Lady Calypso said:

I mean, I vastly prefer Asher/Michaela to Gabriel/Michaela, but....this doesn't bode well, with Michaela blatantly cheating on Gabriel with Asher. Her and Gabriel aren't broken up; they're in a fight, but she never ended things with him, so she's made the conscious decision to cheat. 

And now, with the flashforward, dare I hope that the dead person is Gabriel? Or is it too easy?

Oh, yeah, definitely agreed that the timing isn't great, for a whole host of reasons (and it's kind of funny to think of Asher being the other man here when he was so upset with her for cheating on him). I was wondering if he might've killed Gabriel, too. Though I do find the idea that the blood on Asher isn't through his own doing interesting, too. 

[colorbars]

2 hours ago, Dancingjaneway said:

I don't think Asher killed anyone and I knew Bonnie wasn't going to be the dead informant. I think Asher witnessed the informants murder. His reaction is added to my list of reasons I think Oliver is the informant. Was anyone else confused by the Frank/Annalise conversation involving Laurel(when she took his pain meds)? What exactly were they talking about and what are they keeping secret?

I don't think Asher killed anyone either, he could have easily gotten there after the person was dead and found them (since it's outside his apartment, right?) and if it's someone they all know and care about, he'd be understandably shaken the way he is. And if that's the case, I would guess Oliver over Gabriel. Could also see it being Frank (he hasn't been revealed in the flash forwards yet, has he?) or maybe Nate, but that'd be a stretch that he'd be that shaken.

And I'm pretty sure the secret they were talking about was lying to Bonnie and Nate about Miller being involved in Nate Sr.'s death so they didn't feel guilty when they realized he actually had nothing to do with it. They did quick flashes to those scene in that moment, so I'm assuming that's what they meant.

[possibilities]

The secret Annalise and Frank are keeping is that Miller was innocent in the murder of Nate's father. Frank wants to tell Nate, so he'll stop going after Tegan and making more trouble, and Anna wants to keep the secret because she thinks it would devastate Bonnie to know Miller was innocent and she participated in killing him.

Annalise took Frank's pain medication because she thought he'd be more likely to blab while high, with his inhibitions lowered.

[NUguy514]

The Connor/Bonnie scene was really lovely, and I believe Bonnie that she is the one who picked and why she picked him.  For all his early Season 1 bravado, Connor has always been at his best when he's trying to help people who really need help; Bonnie is an innate caretaker, too, so that connection really tracks for me.

Oliver yet AGAIN puts on the woe-is-me martyr act and lets Frank fault Connor for blaming Oliver for Frank's beating when that's not at all what happened.  It's Oliver wanting to be the sweet little victim again, some more.  So done with this season's Oliver. 

I'm glad Cora isn't as stupid as she looks; that was a nice reveal that she was conning Nate the Terrible Seducer.  I also love that Tegan just went right over to Nate and told him he was the fucking idiot he is, even though he still didn't believe her because he's a fucking idiot, and I canNOT with him.

I loved the Michaela/Asher heart-to-heart leading to sex.  Gabriel might go for "charming," but he always lands decisively in "smarmy as hell"; whereas, Asher is authentic with Michaela.  He would be there for her, whether they were romantically together or not, and I think the same is true for her.  And their chemistry?  In an entirely different stratosphere than the non-chemistry between her and Gabriel.

I have no doubt Asher didn't kill anyone, but I feel like we might be down to Oliver (very possible) or Frank (seems unlikely) as the informant.  I'm still dreaming my dream that it's Nate.

[possibilities]

Maybe Laurel is the informant? Has that been ruled out?

Also, there was never any follow up on Asher's phone. That seems like it might come back on them in some way.

[tvfanatic13]

Good point re Asher’s phone. I was thinking the same thing.

Has Gabriel been ruled out as the informant. A weird look that he had on this episode had me thinking it was him. 

[Lady Calypso]

36 minutes ago, tvfanatic13 said:

Good point re Asher’s phone. I was thinking the same thing.

Has Gabriel been ruled out as the informant. A weird look that he had on this episode had me thinking it was him. 

No, but I don't get why there'd be such a big reaction from the K4 if it was actually Gabriel. I doubt Connor would be freaking out like he did. 

I feel like the only person, besides Annalise, that would garner a good shocking reaction WOULD be Oliver, so I actually hope it's him. I want Gabriel dead, but I'd be pissed off if it's his death that garners such reactions from the Keating Group. 

I think it's clear that it's not Nate, but I want him to go away. God, he's been such a waste for the entire series. 

I think Tegan would have been less calm if Annalise was the dead person, so at least it's not her. So it has to be Oliver or Frank at this point, with the possibility of it being Gabriel. I had briefly thought Laurel but everyone thinks she could be dead anyway and it wouldn't be shocking if she died, since she has a really messed up family. Oliver would be the most shocking for the group but it would satisfy me completely. 

Plus, I think the murder took place in Asher's apartment? Or just outside of it? So it would have to be someone close to Asher, or Gabriel, in some way. Maybe it's both Oliver and Gabriel who are dead. 

I now also think Chloe's a prime character to die. Probably not the dead informant (she just showed up this season), but could be dead as well.

5 hours ago, NUguy514 said:

Oliver yet AGAIN puts on the woe-is-me martyr act and lets Frank fault Connor for blaming Oliver for Frank's beating when that's not at all what happened.  It's Oliver wanting to be the sweet little victim again, some more.  So done with this season's Oliver. 

I've been very cool (in a negative way) with Oliver from the start. I've never really liked the guy but I always attributed it to the actor not being very good. But now I think I've just really never liked Oliver as a character because of the writing. But this season, he's ten times worse. Are they really ruining Oliver as a character so that we don't feel heartbroken when he dies? Or are they building up some Oliver/Connor tension only for dramatic purposes? 

[Skarzero]

This could've been the best episode in the season so far if it weren't for that horrible scene with generic brand wes & Michaela  🤮

How fucking stupid is it for Tegan to forgive Nate but not Bonnie!!!?? And she's gonna help his ungrateful ass. Basically the writers are telling me that if Nate stomps his feet hard enough & whines enough he will get what he wants?? Fuck that. Annalise defending his shitty behavior also made me sick 🤢 Like no Annalise, Nate passed reasonably paranoid/angry after killing an innocent(Miller). 

Frank. Shut up. That's all. 

The Cora/Tegan scenes were nice although Tegan is still wounded.  😞

10 hours ago, NUguy514 said:

I loved the Michaela/Asher heart-to-heart leading to sex.  Gabriel might go for "charming," but he always lands decisively in "smarmy as hell"; whereas, Asher is authentic with Michaela.  He would be there for her, whether they were romantically together or not, and I think the same is true for her.  And their chemistry?  In an entirely different stratosphere than the non-chemistry between her and Gabriel.

Watered down Wes gives off shady vibes, he seems really happy whenever Michaela voices her dislike of Annalise like he's trying to turn her against everybody, he still hasn't apologized to Annalise for blaming her for Sam but he probably won't ever get called out so with that in mind, I hate this fucker always will.  

Asher standing up to his family was beautiful I was cheering! They're trash, and he deserves better. 

The Masher reuinon could've been handled better but also worse so I will happily take this win for my otp. HOWEVER, my god can the writers please stop turning Michaela into a cheater. Like I know Value Dollar Wes is a terrible/annoying beyond belief boyfriend but he's still the boyfriend we need an on screen break up pronto. The Masher scene was so amazing and real and raw it made me happy that they reconciled. Please don't make Michaela to be flaky like Olivia Poke who couldn't decide which man she wanted for damn near 6 seasons. Have Masher be together with no wishy washy BS 

Bonnie & Connor was amazing but the writing sucks so bad. I think the reason is legit they just should've hinted at that sooner. Also this is (correct me if I'm wrong) the 1st meaningful conversation Connor & Bonnie have had in the shows entirety. What the hell???? We definitely should've been known that Connor got a conversion Camp shut down in undergrad. 

Overall I'd give this episode a 5.8/10 could be higher but the shower scene ruined that instantly(Michaela had no shower cap on, lmao do these writers know anything about black women or nah?). 

Edited November 1, 2019 by TeamGabi

[Joimiaroxeu]

Ditto comment upthread, Michaela getting her weave completely wet like that? Yeah, no. Loved her winter white coat though.

Wait, what? Solomon Vick had a thing with Anna too? This show is turning into the Six Three Degrees of Separation from Annalise.

I'm with Michaela. For a minute I wondered if Anna might be her mother too. 🙄

"Tegan, do you like Annalise? You want me to pass her a note in class?" How old is Tegan's ex, 11? She zeroed right in on 2-D chess player Nate though.

Whoa, look at the massive size of Gabriel's head. Michaela is lucky you picked her? Boy, bye.

Dare we hope Asher kills Gabriel? Nah, that's too easy.

[Empress1]

1 hour ago, TeamGabi said:

Asher standing up to his family was beautiful I was cheering! They're trash, and he deserves better. 

When he threw the plate I was like "TELL THEM ASHER!" And I don't even like Asher like that (though I vastly prefer him to Gabriel, who sucks. "You're going to forgive me?" Bruh, did you even apologize?). Let his sister (why did he let his sister drive his car with no license?) deal with the mother, and let Asher go back to his found family.

[Milaxx]

15 hours ago, Annber03 said:

"After the Keating gang destroys their phones*

"We forgot to tell Asher!"

"Well, it's a little late to call him now..." 

LOL. 

And speaking of Asher, so he and Michaela are getting close again. Only a matter of time before that happened. I liked Asher talking about how he'd always be there for her, whether they were romantically involved or not. Wonder if that promise will have anything to do with why he's covered in blood in that flash forward. 

I'm with Connor in thinking there's more to Bonnie's explanation for why he got picked for the group. I do like the reason she gave, though-that was a nice little bonding moment between them.

Yay, Cora, for giving Tegan the heads up on what was going on with Nate. I hope Annalise listens to Tegan with her concerns about all of this. I get Annalise wanting to fight back, but I also understand Tegan's concerns.

I definitely get the impression Michaela is covering for Asher. She come a long way from the preppy gal in season 1. She’s become more take charge like Annalise and Tegan. She even dresses like them in pencil skirts and stealth dresses. No more sweet heart ponytails and a lined skirts.

I also don’t buy Bonnie’s excuse to Connor for one minute. On Twitter there was speculation that Connor was Bonnies missing son.  I think Connor’s a little too old to be her child and Bonnie honestly didn’t know her child lived. Unless, of course Bonnie is covering for AK just on gp.

Cora did Tegan a solid by telling her about Nate, but only because Cora knows the truth about Tegan’s relationship with the Castillo’s.

[Milaxx]

8 hours ago, Lady Calypso said:

never really liked the guy but I always attributed it to the actor not being very good. But now I think I've just really never liked Oliver as a character because of the writing. But this season, he's ten times worse. Are they really ruining Oliver as a character so that we don't feel heartbroken when he dies? Or are they building up some Oliver/Connor tension only for dramatic purposes? 

This! I’ve been a Coliver shipper from the start. This season he’s made a 180 turn. Sure Oliver has been enticed bu thrill of what he perceives as the dangerous life the K5 have, but he went from being willing to do anything to be with Connor, being supper duper lovey dovey last season, horrified to the point he was angry at Michaela for even thinking the K5 wanted to hurt Simon, to keeping secrets from Connor and wanting Frank to torture people and barely going into work. If Oliver turns out to be the informant, which I could definitely see pushing Connor over the edge, I’ll be very disappointed because this season’s Oliver is a completely new person.

Edited November 1, 2019 by Milaxx

[Milaxx]

18 hours ago, Dancingjaneway said:

I don't think Asher killed anyone and I knew Bonnie wasn't going to be the dead informant. I think Asher witnessed the informants murder. His reaction is added to my list of reasons I think Oliver is the informant. Was anyone else confused by the Frank/Annalise conversation involving Laurel(when she took his pain meds)? What exactly were they talking about and what are they keeping secret? I am SO glad that Tegan's ex didn't sleep with Nate and that she told Tegan what was up. I feel bad for Tegan that she's fallen for Annalise because I don't think Annalise feels the same way & I feel like Annalise is going to betray her somehow. I think it's Annalise's mom that shows up at her door next week. I doubt the Castillos would be stupid enough to show up at her house let alone knock on the door. I was torn on whether I believed Bonnie's story about choosing Connor but in the end I think it's true. It was simple enough & wasn't put forth as a "shocking reveal". I'm glad that Frank told Ollie it wasn't his fault he got beat up. I just wish he would leave Bonnie alone because she will always be a replacement for Laurel. I think the Asher/family storyline is over. I think it was just a way to give the actor more to do and also to bring Michaela & Asher back together romantically. I would love for this to be the end of the Vic storyline but I don't think that's going to happen. 

It never occurred to me for one minute that the informant would be Bonnie. My money is still on Laurel, Nate, Gabe, Vivian, or Chloe. I could even be talked into Oliver being the informant. I won’t like it, but I could see it happening. They have actually shown Nate and Vivian talking to the FBI, so my guess is it’s someone they haven’t shown talking to the FBI who is the actual informant.

 

16 hours ago, possibilities said:

The secret Annalise and Frank are keeping is that Miller was innocent in the murder of Nate's father. Frank wants to tell Nate, so he'll stop going after Tegan and making more trouble, and Anna wants to keep the secret because she thinks it would devastate Bonnie to know Miller was innocent and she participated in killing him.

Annalise took Frank's pain medication because she thought he'd be more likely to blab while high, with his inhibitions lowered.

 As mentioned, Frank & Annalise didn’t tell Bonnie/Nate that Miller was innocent. Granted Bonnie was darn near suicidal and Nate was/is crazy with grief, so yeah telling them could possibly have broken Bonnie and/orNate.

14 hours ago, possibilities said:

Maybe Laurel is the informant? Has that been ruled out?

Also, there was never any follow up on Asher's phone. That seems like it might come back on them in some way.

I would not be one bit surprised if it’s Laurel.I still think she disappeared herself and if it was the FBI helping her to disappear, maybe they grabbed Christopher for her. 
Poor Asher, he so loyal to them all, but he’s always and afterthought. 
 

I remember the actor who plays Vic from Breaking Bad, so I was laughing when he had a connect to help Annalise disappear. 
 

I think between the last 2 episodes of the season we’ll have a Laurel siting. I’m pretty sure Annalise disappears by winter break. Viola posted on IG when she had filmed her last scene, but according to their social media accounts, everyone else is still filming.

Edited November 1, 2019 by Milaxx

[Milaxx]

3 minutes ago, Milaxx said:

It never occurred to me for one minute that the informant would be Bonnie. My money is still on Laurel, Nate, Gabe, Vivian, or Chloe. I could even be talked into Oliver being the informant. I won’t like it, but I could see it happening. They actually shown Nate and Vivian talking to the FBI, so my guess is it’s someone they haven’t shown talking to the FBI who is the actual informant.

 

 As mentioned, Frank & Annalise didn’t tell Bonnie/Nate that Miller was innocent. Granted Bonnie was darn near suicidal and Nate was/is crazy with grief, so yeah telling them could possibly have broken Bonnie and/orNate.

I would not be one bit surprised if it’s Laurel.I still think she disappeared herself and if it was the FBI helping her to disappear, maybe they grabbed Christopher for her. 
Poor Asher, he so loyal to them all, but he’s always and afterthought. 
 

I remember the actor who plays Vic from Breaking Bad, so I was laughing when he had a connect to help Annalise disappear. 
 

I think between the last 2 episodes of the season we’ll have a Laurel siting. I’m pretty sure Annalise disappears by winter break. Viola posted on IG when she had filmed her last scene, but according to their social media accounts, everyone else is still filming.

I like Masher. I think she played a big part in his growth and maturity, but he also grounds her. He’s honest with her and unafraid to point out her faults. I just want her to completely break it off with Gabe before reconciling with Asher. Gabe is just a Marcus stand in. He’s the image of the Black man she thinks she should be with, and yes superficially pretty. However his personality sucks. Gabe is not the man Michaela needs.

[Marley]

I liked this episode but Gabriel sucks so bad. His sex scene with Michaela was lame and imo not sexy at all. He is just a shitty actor all around and I wanna yell at the tv when he shows up. I just want him to go away forever. His little good man speech made me wanna throw up. 

[Skarzero]

1 hour ago, Marley said:

I liked this episode but Gabriel sucks so bad. His sex scene with Michaela was lame and imo not sexy at all.

Anytime they force feed 75% off Wes sex scenes or shirtless scenes, etc my cooch instantly dries up. 

[Neurochick]

1 hour ago, Marley said:

I liked this episode but Gabriel sucks so bad. His sex scene with Michaela was lame and imo not sexy at all. He is just a shitty actor all around and I wanna yell at the tv when he shows up. I just want him to go away forever. His little good man speech made me wanna throw up. 

I think the problem with Gabriel is that he's so obviously a bargain basement version of Wes.  I don't like to see a new character come on a show and just be SO important.

I think there are two things going on this season.  There's a dead informant and there's Annalise's funeral.  What I keep noticing is that there's no timeline to any of these things.  The only hint is that the old school K5 or K3 now are all in their graduation gowns.  I also think it's interesting that we don't know when Annalise's funeral is taking place.  In the scene you see people dressed in black sitting in chairs, but we don't see their faces.  

Could it be possible that the Annalise's funeral happens ten years from now?  The show tricked us showing Annalise's funeral and then talks about this dead informant that seems to happen in this season.  I think one had nothing to do with the other.

[Dancingjaneway]

I feel like the crime scene that Tegan is visiting is not the site of the informants murder but someone else's. Why? Because the informant was murdered with a fireplace poker. Which is in Annalise's house. That would mean that someone would have to take the poker from Annalises house and bring it to the apartment complex.  I briefly thought what if the killer knew that others had touched it so it would throw the FBI off but nobody in this group is THAT smart. I'm also starting to think that just maybe Annalise isn't going to make it. I feel like they are going to throw a curve ball in that she tries to get away but ultimately doesn't make it. 

ETA: Thank you to everyone who replied to my Annalise/Frank conversation question. 

[Milaxx]

29 minutes ago, Neurochick said:

I think the problem with Gabriel is that he's so obviously a bargain basement version of Wes.  I don't like to see a new character come on a show and just be SO important.

I think there are two things going on this season.  There's a dead informant and there's Annalise's funeral.  What I keep noticing is that there's no timeline to any of these things.  The only hint is that the old school K5 or K3 now are all in their graduation gowns.  I also think it's interesting that we don't know when Annalise's funeral is taking place.  In the scene you see people dressed in black sitting in chairs, but we don't see their faces.  

Could it be possible that the Annalise's funeral happens ten years from now?  The show tricked us showing Annalise's funeral and then talks about this dead informant that seems to happen in this season.  I think one had nothing to do with the other.

Good point. They keep mentioning they graduate in 3 mths, so I assumed all the cap and gown scenes are 3mths ahead and we just keep inching close to that, but they don’t have any dates on the flash forwards like they usually do, so we could be looking at 2 different time lines; the graduation that is 3mths ahead, and Annalise’s funeral scene.

27 minutes ago, Dancingjaneway said:

I feel like the crime scene that Tegan is visiting is not the site of the informants murder but someone else's. Why? Because the informant was murdered with a fireplace poker. Which is in Annalise's house. That would mean that someone would have to take the poker from Annalises house and bring it to the apartment complex.  I briefly thought what if the killer knew that others had touched it so it would throw the FBI off but nobody in this group is THAT smart. I'm also starting to think that just maybe Annalise isn't going to make it. I feel like they are going to throw a curve ball in that she tries to get away but ultimately doesn't make it. 

ETA: Thank you to everyone who replied to my Annalise/Frank conversation question. 

It probably is. They often have 2 concurring events like when Laurel gave birth in the elevator and Simon was shot, so we could have whatever happened at Asher & Gabe’s apartment and the poker situation at Annalise’s apartment.

ETA: 

So Twitter is going strong with this Connor is Bonnie’s baby theory. I’m way too lazy to look it up, but does anyone remember the timeline for Bonnie. I know she got pregnant at 15, but how old was she when she testified?  I figure the K5 are 28-30 so guess it could theoretically work, maybe?

Edited November 2, 2019 by Milaxx

[Neurochick]

44 minutes ago, Milaxx said:

Good point. They keep mentioning they graduate in 3 mths, so I assumed all the cap and gown scenes are 3mths ahead and we just keep inching close to that, but they don’t have any dates on the flash forwards like they usually do, so we could be looking at 2 different time lines; the graduation that is 3mths ahead, and Annalise’s funeral scene.

The thing that's also unusual is we don't see WHO is at Annalise's funeral which to me is very odd.  That's why I keep thinking that Annalise's funeral is years later.  

[wanderingstar]

Was that confirmation we got that Solomon and Annalise were romantically involved? I feel like it'd be easier if we kept track of the people Annalise hasn't slept with.

Ugh, go away Gabriel. Ditto, Nate. Can we hope for a two-fer on murder night? Damn.

Asher & Michaela are still sweet - and hot - together. But I know better than to invest in couples on this show.

Is poor Tegan headed for more heartbreak with Annalise. 😞

Oliver being the informant would be delicious - and would actually make Oliver interesting to me for the first time in a long time.

[Annber03]

Meant to mention last night, too-what do we think about the whole Annalise and Solomon thing? The implication seems to be they had a fling, but I wonder if that's actually true. 

ETA; @Gillian Rosh beat me to it :p. 

Edited November 2, 2019 by Annber03

[colorbars]

2 hours ago, Milaxx said:

So Twitter is going strong with this Connor is Bonnie’s baby theory. I’m way too lazy to look it up, but does anyone remember the timeline for Bonnie. I know she got pregnant at 15, but how old was she when she testified?  I figure the K5 are 28-30 so guess it could theoretically work, maybe?

Considering it was very possibly that Gabriel was her son and they teased it for half a season, I don't see why Connor couldn't be her son. But if he is, that had nothing to do with why Bonnie could pick him, since she didn't even know her son was alive until last season, let alone know Connor was her son. It would only work if Bonnie was covering for Annalise and she didn't really choose him, but iirc, Annalise didn't know about her son, either?

[Milaxx]

11 hours ago, Neurochick said:

The thing that's also unusual is we don't see WHO is at Annalise's funeral which to me is very odd.  That's why I keep thinking that Annalise's funeral is years later.  

More importantly we see who isn’t at her funeral; none of the K4, Bonnie, Frank or Tegan. It’s a crowd of strangers.

10 hours ago, Annber03 said:

Meant to mention last night, too-what do we think about the whole Annalise and Solomon thing? The implication seems to be they had a fling, but I wonder if that's actually true. 

ETA; @Gillian Rosh beat me to it :p. 

I thought the Solomon, AK fling was pretty much confirmed.

9 hours ago, colorbars said:

Considering it was very possibly that Gabriel was her son and they teased it for half a season, I don't see why Connor couldn't be her son. But if he is, that had nothing to do with why Bonnie could pick him, since she didn't even know her son was alive until last season, let alone know Connor was her son. It would only work if Bonnie was covering for Annalise and she didn't really choose him, but iirc, Annalise didn't know about her son, either?

However if Connor is Bonnie’s son, it would mean that either AK manipulated Bonnie into choosing Connor by showing her that essay, or Bonnie is lying to appease Connor. Bonnie was pretty gutted to find out her son was still alive and it was implied that her sister never told her the truth about what happened to the baby.

Edited November 2, 2019 by Milaxx
Remembered the “Who is Gabe” theories

[helenamonster]

Since the murder appears to take place outside his apartment, I can believe Asher was there but not directly involved.

There has to be more to Connor being picked for the K5. The scene between him and Bonnie was wonderful, but the whole time I kept thinking, "Have these two even talked in 5+ seasons?" It would have been more meaningful if they'd had any kind of relationship. I also just wanted it to be more dramatic because that is what I come to this show for. Give me something bananas, people!

I still like Chloe. Hope she sticks around for a bit.

Oh my God. Nate. Enough.

[possibilities]

13 hours ago, Lady Calypso said:

I had briefly thought Laurel but everyone thinks she could be dead anyway and it wouldn't be shocking if she died, since she has a really messed up family.

They would be freaked out that she was informing on them, though. She could sink them all, with the info she has. It's possible Connor flipped out from fear, not grief.

[colorbars]

4 hours ago, Milaxx said:

I never got that Gabriel was Bonnie’s son.  I must have missed that theory. However if Connor is Bonnie’s son, it would mean that either AK manipulated Bonnie into choosing Connor by showing her that essay, or Bonnie is lying to appease Connor. Bonnie was pretty gutted to find out her son was still alive and it was implied that her sister never told her the truth about what happened to the baby.

It was more than just a theory, the show telegraphed and dragged out the misdirect of Gabriel being Bonnie's son from the S4 cliffhanger throughout most of 5a.

But yes, I don't see how Connor can be Bonnie's son unless it's a complete coincidence, which seems very unlikely.

Edited November 2, 2019 by colorbars

[Milaxx]

14 hours ago, colorbars said:

It was more than just a theory, the show telegraphed and dragged out the misdirect of Gabriel being Bonnie's son from the S4 cliffhanger throughout most of 5a.

But yes, I don't see how Connor can be Bonnie's son unless it's a complete coincidence, which seems very unlikely.

I remember now. No idea why I brain farted on that.

Laurel & Gabe are still high on my list of informants. However the Oliver as the informant is interesting. Could the work his father does as a businessman in the Middle East play a part?

I hate that they spent so much time on Wes & Laurel’s families that Michaela and Connor feel like rush jobs.

Edited November 2, 2019 by Milaxx

[Lady Calypso]

2 hours ago, Milaxx said:

i hate that they spent so much time of Wes & Laurel’s families that Michaela and Connor feel like rush jobs.

This is exactly how I feel. Even Asher's family stuff is going to be rushed because they just HAD to focus on Wes and then Laurel for so long. I've been waiting for Asher's family stuff since the Sinclair stuff and it's taken three seasons to finally get more of it. 

I think, if the show didn't have such an obsession for Wes and Laurel (and, hell, even Sam), that we could have gotten more Michaela, Connor, and Asher, and some of these plot points wouldn't feel unearned, in a sense. 

[tennisgurl]

I just dont buy thats the only reason why Connor was chosen, it just feels really anticlimactic. I mean, this show spent so much time on Wes and Laurel and their backstories, we could have had more time on his possible backstory, as well as on Asher and Michaela. It feels like the writers were like "crap, we spent so much time on our favorites, that we totally ignored the rest of the main characters, and the show is almost over! Lets get it done real fast!"

That being said, I did love the scene between Connor and Bonnie, it was really sweet and great to see them having some actual real interaction. I also liked the scene between Oliver and Frank, where Frank said him being almost killed wasnt his fault. Generally, the show is doing better with putting different characters together and digging into the rest of the cast and their issues, probably because Laurel isnt around! And even then, her stupid family drama looms large! 

I really like Asher/Michaela, so I am excited that they might be getting back together. Granted, its not cool that she is cheating on Gabe, as much as I dislike him, but as soon as she dumps him, we can move on to a couple with actual chemistry! 

I am glad that Cora was actually playing Nate on his stupid Pops crusade, and gave Tegan a heads up. I am just so over Nate, I hope he is the informant so that he can finally get some karma for killing poor Miller. I mean, I know that everyone on this show has killed people/covered up for other people killing people, but he murdered an innocent man in cold blood! Yeah he thought Miller was a bad guy, but he didnt know for sure!

Edited November 2, 2019 by tennisgurl

[Milaxx]

5 hours ago, tennisgurl said:

I just dont buy thats the only reason why Connor was chosen, it just feels really anticlimactic. I mean, this show spent so much time on Wes and Laurel and their backstories, we could have had more time on his possible backstory, as well as on Asher and Michaela. It feels like the writers were like "crap, we spent so much time on our favorites, that we totally ignored the rest of the main characters, and the show is almost over! Lets get it done real fast!"

That being said, I did love the scene between Connor and Bonnie, it was really sweet and great to see them having some actual real interaction. I also liked the scene between Oliver and Frank, where Frank said him being almost killed wasnt his fault. Generally, the show is doing better with putting different characters together and digging into the rest of the cast and their issues, probably because Laurel isnt around! And even then, her stupid family drama looms large! 

I really like Asher/Michaela, so I am excited that they might be getting back together. Granted, its not cool that she is cheating on Gabe, as much as I dislike him, but as soon as she dumps him, we can move on to a couple with actual chemistry! 

I am glad that Cora was actually playing Nate on his stupid Pops crusade, and gave Tegan a heads up. I am just so over Nate, I hope he is the informant so that he can finally get some karma for killing poor Miller. I mean, I know that everyone on this show has killed people/covered up for other people killing people, but he murdered an innocent man in cold blood! Yeah he thought Miller was a bad guy, but he didnt know for sure!

Part of what annoys me about these rushed plot lines is we don’t get a gradual decent for Oliver. I need to have more than one scene of why he would become the informant if they decide to go that route. I still don’t recognize this season’s Oliver from stand by your man, straight laced Oliver. 
 

Totally agree about the the unusual pairings of Frank/Oliver and Bonnie/Connor. 

8 hours ago, Lady Calypso said:

This is exactly how I feel. Even Asher's family stuff is going to be rushed because they just HAD to focus on Wes and then Laurel for so long. I've been waiting for Asher's family stuff since the Sinclair stuff and it's taken three seasons to finally get more of it. 

I think, if the show didn't have such an obsession for Wes and Laurel (and, hell, even Sam), that we could have gotten more Michaela, Connor, and Asher, and some of these plot points wouldn't feel unearned, in a sense. 

I never minded the Sam flashbacks because they filled in a lot of blanks about Annalise, but I was at the point where I loathed Wes. I was annoyed when they turned around and did the same thing with Laurel. I want her to be one of the informants and the dead body.

[Neurochick]

7 hours ago, tennisgurl said:

I am just so over Nate, I hope he is the informant so that he can finally get some karma for killing poor Miller.

Why should he get karma when no one else on this show has gotten karma for anything?  I mean Bonnie and Frank both killed innocent people.

Quote

More importantly we see who isn’t at her funeral; none of the K4, Bonnie, Frank or Tegan. It’s a crowd of strangers.

The crowd was only shown from the back, correct?  You can't really see who any of those people are.  

Edited November 3, 2019 by Neurochick

[Milaxx]

23 hours ago, Neurochick said:

Why should he get karma when no one else on this show has gotten karma for anything?  I mean Bonnie and Frank both killed innocent people.

The crowd was only shown from the back, correct?  You can't really see who any of those people are.  

Nate is stupid and probably the worst detective ever and I hate that they made  him the angry Black guy stereotype, but honestly Frank and Bonnie have the highest death counts.

But let talk about  how dumb Nate is. Season 1 - sends Rebecca in to get info off Sam’s computer. We all know how that ends. Season 2 he’s mostly harmless as he drives the K5 away from the Hapstall Mansion.  Season 3 not only leaves Wes at Annalise’s house, but manages to get played by Atwood who forges his signature to move Wes’s body. Season 4 he gets and starts snooping with the files Denver had on everyone. Speaking of which, why hasn’t Annalise asked Nate about the other files? It clear from the mess with Bonnie he kept them. Season 5, he goes snooping in Bonnie’s background, dropped the bombshell her kid is alive on her, and darn near beats an innocent man to death. This season he snooping on Tegan and somehow roped Bonnie into his mess. 

I thought they panned to the crowd or at least the front rows. As far as I could tell there are no familiar faces. Every way, everything about that flash forward funeral looks fake.

That reminds me. what happened to the class action cases? They haven’t tried a single one this season and now Annalise is making plans to ghost. 

Edited November 3, 2019 by Milaxx

[Skarzero]

20 hours ago, Milaxx said:

Nate is stupid and probably the worst detective ever and I hate that they man him the angry Black guy stereotype, but honestly Frank and Bonnie have the highest death counts.

But let talk about  how dumb Nate is. Season 1 - sends Rebecca in to get info off Sam’s computer. We all know how that ends. Season 2 he’s mostly harmless as he drives the K5 away from the Hapstall Mansion.  Season 3 not only leaves Wes at Annalise’s house, but manages to get played by Atwood who forges his signature to move Wes’s body. Season 4 he gets and starts snooping with the files Denver had on everyone. Speaking of which, why hasn’t Annalise asked Nate about the other files? It clear from the mess with Bonnie he kept them. Season 5, he goes snooping in Bonnie’s background, dropped the bombshell her kid is alive on her, and darn near beats an innocent man to death. This season he snooping on Tegan and somehow roped Bonnie into his mess. 

People have been calling for Frank's comeuppance for several seasons now (and sometimes Bonnie's too but she's still liked enough by the fandom Nate not so much...) so people asking for Nate to get his just deserts perfectly justified. Period. For every reason you just listed above. I will say it will be bad optics for Nate to be punished but not Frank, but this is season 6 the writers don't give a fuck about bad optics if they did they wouldn't have killed Wes, or have every other broad on this show be a colossal cheater. Nate & Frank have both made life unnecessarily hard not just for Annalise but everyone else as well, to an extent, including Bonnie. And Bonnie getting fired because of Nate and then Nate actually getting Tegan's help (much undeserved) is just too much. He forced his way into Bonnie's awful past and traumatized her in the process and ON TOP OF THAT got her to kill her boyfriend(Fiance? can't remember). All in half a season! So yeah to hell with Nate idc at this point (he's just that damn annoying to me) if he's the only one who gets his, although I'm all for Frank getting his due reward too after everything he's done & how he did/is doing Bonnie. Annalise and Bonnie(all characters tbh) would better off without Nate and Frank imo. 

Edited November 3, 2019 by TeamGabi

[Milaxx]

I wasn’t saying Nate should or shouldn’t  be killed because he a bad detective. I’ve posted before that I think he’s a bad detective. I’m no more mad at Nate for killing Miller than I am Frank or Bonnie for their misdeeds. I merely pointed out who had higher death counts, then in a separate paragraph once again talked about how I think Nate is a bad Detective. 

Honestly there are many characters on the show that people dislike and would be happy to see killed off, Nate, Laurel and Oliver are the most popular at this point. However, I was one of those upset that Wes was killed off or that it ruined the show. While I was ambivalent towards the character, I did think he pulled focus and from a story telling perspective his death was good for the show until Karla got pregnant and Laurel & the Castillo’s became the shows focus. 

[NUguy514]

My personal issue with Nate, compared with Bonnie and Frank, is that he went and murdered (or at least beat him to the point where he was going to die and Bonnie mercy-killed him) someone just because he thought Miller orchestrated his "Pops'" murder.  He had no actual proof of that and has been trying to conjure proof retroactively to justify his murder morally.  Frank killed Lila at Sam's behest, and he obviously killed an innocent person; however, he did so in order to protect people to whom he was loyal.  The same could be said of Bonnie's murder of Rebecca: Rebecca could, and would, have exposed all of them, and Bonnie murdered her in order to protect the people to whom she was loyal (also, Rebecca was guilty of being the ABSOLUTE WORST).  (Hell, I hated Wes, but his murder of Sam was to prevent him from killing Rebecca.)  Neither Frank nor Bonnie has tried to argue that the murders were morally justified or anything, while Nate has steadfastly refused to consider that he basically just went and murdered a guy because he assumed guilt without having absolute proof of it.  Now, he's running around trying to find the proof after the deed was done, and the bitch of it is, of course, that Nate was wrong but thinks he's right.  Frank and Bonnie did what had to be done (in a way), while Nate did what didn't need to be done yet because he wanted quick vengeance; to me, that's the difference.

[Skarzero]

2 hours ago, Milaxx said:

I wasn’t saying Nate should or shouldn’t  be killed because he a bad detective. I’ve posted before that I think he’s a bad detective. I’m no more mad at Nate for killing Miller than I am Frank or Bonnie for their misdeeds. I merely pointed out who had higher death counts, then in a separate paragraph once again talked about how I think Nate is a bad Detective. 

Honestly there are many characters on the show that people dislike and would be happy to see killed off, Nate, Laurel and Oliver are the most popular at this point. However, I was one of those upset that Wes was killed off or that it ruined the show. While I was ambivalent towards the character, I did think he pulled focus and from a story telling perspective his death was good for the show until Karla got pregnant and Laurel & the Castillo’s became the shows focus. 

Oh yeah lol I was indirectly responding to the post you responded to(I should be more direct next time) and just mostly piggybacking off of your response with my own 2 cents because you brought up some great points(as usual) about Nate being a dumbass detective sorry for the confusion 😅

[Skarzero]

19 minutes ago, NUguy514 said:

My personal issue with Nate, compared with Bonnie and Frank, is that he went and murdered (or at least beat him to the point where he was going to die and Bonnie mercy-killed him) someone just because he thought Miller orchestrated his "Pops'" murder.  He had no actual proof of that and has been trying to conjure proof retroactively to justify his murder morally.  Frank killed Lila at Sam's behest, and he obviously killed an innocent person; however, he did so in order to protect people to whom he was loyal.  The same could be said of Bonnie's murder of Rebecca: Rebecca could, and would, have exposed all of them, and Bonnie murdered her in order to protect the people to whom she was loyal (also, Rebecca was guilty of being the ABSOLUTE WORST).  (Hell, I hated Wes, but his murder of Sam was to prevent him from killing Rebecca.)  Neither Frank nor Bonnie has tried to argue that the murders were morally justified or anything, while Nate has steadfastly refused to consider that he basically just went and murdered a guy because he assumed guilt without having absolute proof of it.  Now, he's running around trying to find the proof after the deed was done, and the bitch of it is, of course, that Nate was wrong but thinks he's right.  Frank and Bonnie did what had to be done (in a way), while Nate did what didn't need to be done yet because he wanted quick vengeance; to me, that's the difference.

Brilliant post.

Another thing is narratively speaking we aren't really supposed to feel that sorry for Frank & Bonnie's victims. Feel free to disagree with me on this. Lila is arguable because she was manipulated by Sam(much like Annalise was) but was still shown to be a privileged and obnoxious twat unlike Annalise. When Rebecca got killed not many people(that I recall) said OMG! Poor Rebecca, no one missed her selfish, dusty ass, I feel like the writers wanted it that way. As much as I hate Frank at least he got on the common sense train about Sam and came to realization that he was trash(something "I'm a nice guy" wes hasn't even done, and probably won't do) and might even somewhat regret his decision to kill Lila for him. Of course that doesn't matter one bit if he does cos she's still dead. He definitely doesn't make excuses, he what he was told cos he owed Sam. What made Bonnie less annoying is she didn't justify it beyond "I did it for the kids and Annalise". Which is fair enough imo cos this is their show, not Rebecca's. Nate is so hardheaded, almost narcissistic with his justification/excuses and unwillingness to even slightly entertain the notion he was wrong. Not to mention the pain in the ass he's been to Bonnie & Tegan(mostly Tegan). Again great post @NUguy514

[juliet73]

Could Laurel be the informant and in protective custody?

Nate, Gabriel, Solomon and Asher's sister can all leave now.

I loved Michaela's black dress!

[Lady Calypso]

17 hours ago, Milaxx said:

I wasn’t saying Nate should or shouldn’t  be killed because he a bad detective. I’ve posted before that I think he’s a bad detective. I’m no more mad at Nate for killing Miller than I am Frank or Bonnie for their misdeeds. I merely pointed out who had higher death counts, then in a separate paragraph once again talked about how I think Nate is a bad Detective. 

Honestly there are many characters on the show that people dislike and would be happy to see killed off, Nate, Laurel and Oliver are the most popular at this point. However, I was one of those upset that Wes was killed off or that it ruined the show. While I was ambivalent towards the character, I did think he pulled focus and from a story telling perspective his death was good for the show until Karla got pregnant and Laurel & the Castillo’s became the shows focus. 

True. I discovered, after reading the last few posts, that I have a Death Tier.

Tier 1 (characters who I actively want dead and gone): Nate, Gabriel, Oliver

Tier 2 (characters I'm not necessarily rooting for to die but who I wouldn't actually care if they did): Frank, Laurel, Asher

Tier 3 (characters who I'd be upset about if they died): Annalise, Connor, Tegan, Bonnie, Michaela

That's excusing the other minor/supporting characters. 

I mean, if the alternative is them just disappearing instead of dying, then fine. It's the last season so I've had to suffer through many characters that I haven't liked (again, Nate and Oliver, for the most part). 

So, in terms of this season, so far, my opinions about Nate and Oliver haven't changed, and I'm really not loving Gabriel. It's a shame, but the way he spoke to Michaela with telling her that she'll forgive him because he's a good guy or whatever? Boy, didn't you kill your mother's boyfriend? How are you a good guy?

And I'd say that about any of these people, for the record. Anyone who has actively killed someone is obviously not a good guy. Maybe they're not the bad guy, but they're also definitely not the good guy. 

[possibilities]

I wonder what Nate was like before Annalise framed him for murder in season 1.

My problem with him is that, while he's gorgeous, the acting is dull. He has one expression and one tone of voice and  other than glistening and flexing, he seems to have few skills.

[Chicago Redshirt]

On 11/1/2019 at 7:18 PM, Milaxx said:

 I know she got pregnant at 15, but how old was she when she testified?  I figure the K5 are 28-30 so guess it could theoretically work, maybe?

Most people go straight from undergrad to law school, while some might do a year or two in the real world and then go.

So it is more likely that the K5 are currently 23 (graduating at 21 plus having summer birthdays) to 26 (graduating at 21, spending 2 years working, and then 3 years in school) than 28-30. 

[darkestboy]

Bonnie's reasons for Connor being picked was interesting. I did like their scenes together.

Loved Cora outsmarting Nate.  Tegan doesn't owe Nate shit but the fact she's willing to help him proves she's a better person than he is.

Annalise be counting the days before she can get the hell out of there. Was the romantic past with Solomon really needed though?

Michaela has better chemistry with Asher than Gabriel. The latter can just go now.

Amusing scenes with Oliver and Frank in this one, 7/10

[Milaxx]

On 11/4/2019 at 12:23 PM, Lady Calypso said:

True. I discovered, after reading the last few posts, that I have a Death Tier.

Tier 1 (characters who I actively want dead and gone): Nate, Gabriel, Oliver

Tier 2 (characters I'm not necessarily rooting for to die but who I wouldn't actually care if they did): Frank, Laurel, Asher

Tier 3 (characters who I'd be upset about if they died): Annalise, Connor, Tegan, Bonnie, Michaela

That's excusing the other minor/supporting characters. 

I mean, if the alternative is them just disappearing instead of dying, then fine. It's the last season so I've had to suffer through many characters that I haven't liked (again, Nate and Oliver, for the most part). 

So, in terms of this season, so far, my opinions about Nate and Oliver haven't changed, and I'm really not loving Gabriel. It's a shame, but the way he spoke to Michaela with telling her that she'll forgive him because he's a good guy or whatever? Boy, didn't you kill your mother's boyfriend? How are you a good guy?

And I'd say that about any of these people, for the record. Anyone who has actively killed someone is obviously not a good guy. Maybe they're not the bad guy, but they're also definitely not the good guy. 

Lol I think most of us have death tiers depending on which characters we like/love/dislike. That’s part of the fun in discussing the show.

On 11/4/2019 at 7:43 PM, Chicago Redshirt said:

Most people go straight from undergrad to law school, while some might do a year or two in the real world and then go.

So it is more likely that the K5 are currently 23 (graduating at 21 plus having summer birthdays) to 26 (graduating at 21, spending 2 years working, and then 3 years in school) than 28-30. 

The show aged the characters for us. Asher was  called “that 25 year old boy” by AK back in season 2 when they were still 1L. Laurel’s hospital chart in season 3 listed her age as 27 when they were 2Ls. Micheala asked where Solomon was 30 years ago. I think it’s safe to assume the K5 are easily 28-30.

Edited November 8, 2019 by Milaxx