S39: Spoilers & Speculation

[himela]

And why did these cast members speak to Varner and not to the social media? I understand they have a contract that they can't talk about the game, but if they can talk to Jeff Varner they can talk to a journalist who could make the matter public. And the excuse for the reunion not being live because the cast members want to publicly stand behind Dan is shady; they can do this AFTER the reunion, the social media will die to know the truth. So lets wait and see what they will reveal after the reunion and then Varner will be proved right or wrong. :)

[Ellee]

Why would the reunion have to be taped to publicly stand behind Dan? 

[ProfCrash]

I am sure that Verner thinks that this will allow the show to cut any thing that might support Dan from the Reunion show.

The Survivor casts do a fair amount of talking. I would not be surprised that there are some folks who are talking to Jeff. I would be very surprised to find that the cast did not support Kellee but I can see that the cast might support Kellee and Dan at the same time. Kellee was uncomfortable and that should not have been the case but they did not think that Dan was dangerous or trying to hurt anyone.

This is not as black and white as some cases. Dan did not try to hurt anyone or force himself on anyone. He ignored requests to stop touching Kellee and the way he touched people was inappropriate. Most the players seemed ok with it, Kellee appears to be the exception.

I don't think it is as clear cut as Brandon has to go because he is becoming unhinged and everyone could see that. It is not a he said she said, everyone knew that Dan was touchy. But it is a what is uncomfortable for one person is fine for a lot of other people.

Dan was obligated to listen to Kellee and stop touching her. 100% but I can see where other people might think Kellee was overreacting.

As for what got him removed. What has leaked is that he touched a female staffer inappropriately on the leg. Dan claimed it was an accident while getting on the boat, the staffer disagreed. Here is the thing, I doubt that too many people are going to be uncomfortable with a slip and hand landed ion your leg, even if it is a strange place. So either he slipped, accidently but a hand on her leg and intentionally lingered or he started some type of motion that was unnecessary.

The reality is, we don't know what happened. It might have been something normally easily blown off but the past history changed it. It might have been something more egregious that Dan is used to getting away with. It might have been minor but the staffer felt uncomfortable. Whatever it was, I doubt that the Producers would do anything that would open themselves to a defamation or libel lawsuit.

And it all could have been avoided if Dan had been issued a clear "Stop touching people without their permission" warning on day 1 or 2.

[himela]

[RescueMom]

Varner (who used to be one of my absolute favorite players) also claims that he was unfairly mis-represented when he outed Zeke. When IMO,  it was his terrible messaging after the episode aired that made him look the worst. Whatever PR firm he worked with did him a real disservice. And now he comes across as a nasty, bitter person who honestly believes his own revisionist history. So I take anything he says with a massive grain of salt. 

Edited December 12, 2019 by RescueMom
Fixed a typo

[LadyChatts]

Varner would be doing himself and everyone a favor and just not say anything.  I don't think he's helping the situation, and by saying the cast is supporting Dan over Kellee (without naming names), people are going to speculate who he's talking about and attack those people even more.  I do agree that people may be supporting both Kellee and Dan, but it could just be how the show has chosen to handle the situation.  Clearly people seemed blindsided by what really went down, so who knows what they were told and what they weren't.  Hell, I don't even think they gave Dan much of an explanation as to what he was being warned for in the first place.  Clearly the show thought they were going to make this a moment about them and how they handled it, and it backfired spectacularly.  If it hadn't been for Julia writing that blog last season about her experiences and feeling like production ignored her, I question if this even would have happened with Dan in the first place.

As to next week-is Tommy the only one who hasn't been to IOTI yet?  Are they going to reveal to everyone about Rob/Sandra?  Speculation on Sucks is that they are actually taken to IOTI, and we did see Rob talking to someone about their still being a lesson.  I wonder if R/S will reveal they've been listening in at TC.  So my guess is Janet's idol is nullified and she goes out in 5th.  Lauren likely goes out in 4th, due to the spoilers as well as the alluding to her making fire (some people think it could be Janet). 

Edited December 12, 2019 by LadyChatts

[ItsJessMe]

On the week the Kellee got booted and Varner started tweeting about the whole thing, taking Dan's side, he also said repeatedly that he had not watched the rest of the season.  In other words, he was basing his opinion off of ONE episode, ignoring all of the previous ones that showed Dan touching.

Also any woman - any person - knows the difference between someone grabbing their leg to steady themselves in an accident and that person touching their leg inappropriately.

[marys1000]

5 hours ago, himela said:

I agree.  Innocent until proven guilty.  You should be able to defend yourself.  If he is being tried in social media he should be able to defend himself there.  
He is being totally smeared and having his life ruined and no other castmates had a problem with his touching but Kellee.  So he shouldn't have touched Kellee.  
I don't trust CBS not to use his slip to correct their actions over the Kellee thing or cover their assess by demonizing him. 
I can't even believe I'm sticking up for him but its what our country is based on!  

[ProfCrash]

Except others did have a problem. We saw a good number of women comment on his touching. Lauren said she had to tell him to stop. Missy agreed with Kellee. Missy and Kellee were both uncomfortable but both felt that they were “safe” from anything beyond touching because they were on tv. Missy only changed her story when Dan asked her if what Janet said was true.

Not to mention the video of Dan touching Kellee after being told not to. Or Dan stroking Missy’s calf while she was eating and he was lying on the ground. Or the other videos we saw.

Dan’s actions were not appropriate. Dan didn’t stop when asked to. Dan did something that made a staff member uncomfortable after a warning.

[Nashville]

23 hours ago, LanceM said:

Well Jeff Varner decided for some reason to weigh in with his thoughts...

Gee, thanks Varner!  I’d forgotten how much of a douchecanoe you were, so I appreciate the reminder. 😛 

14 hours ago, RescueMom said:

Dan has locked down his social media and chosen to not release any statements. Likely due to legal advice, but it has still been his choice in the end to not make any statements in his own defense.

Well, considering everything Dan’s most likely been having to do since he got back home - you know...

• Breaking the news to his family;
• Legal name change;
• Selling the home and moving the family to a new state;
• Getting the kids enrolled in new schools;
• Attending meetings with marriage counselors and/or divorce attorneys;
• Changing his appearance (growing a beard at least, although I wouldn’t entirely rule out plastic surgery as an option);
• Etc., etc.

... Dan probably has simply had neither the time nor inclination to keep up with his SM accounts. 😉 

[Jel]

10 hours ago, marys1000 said:

I agree.  Innocent until proven guilty.  You should be able to defend yourself.  If he is being tried in social media he should be able to defend himself there.  
He is being totally smeared and having his life ruined and no other castmates had a problem with his touching but Kellee.  So he shouldn't have touched Kellee.  
I don't trust CBS not to use his slip to correct their actions over the Kellee thing or cover their assess by demonizing him. 
I can't even believe I'm sticking up for him but its what our country is based on!  

I'm with you on the whole "a complaint warrants an investigation" thing. But the purpose of an investigation is to reveal the truth. We already have the truth -- a woman said don't touch me, and he continued to touch her. Line crossed.

Even if it were just Kellee that he touched, the fact that he persisted after she told him not to should have been enough for CBS.  So I think Dan got a ton of leeway from them because he wasn't immediately ousted from the game. 

Dan had choices. He could have been an adult, apologized and then never touched Kellee again, and then taken a moment to ask the other women if they were okay with his erm warmth-seeking and other "non sexual" touching. Or he could have even been a big baby and said, "Fine! I'll never touch anyone again! Harumph!

But, in the end he decided that he'll decide what's okay. And the thing he doesn't seem to get is that Dan doesn't actually get to make that decision for other people. I hope he learns this lesson.

 I would guess most people would be okay with someone grabbing onto them simply to prevent a fall. So, either it felt (to the production team member) like more than that (which seems to be the claim) or s/he is simply a vindictive or litigious opportunistic person looking to get something. Given that we, the audience. already know that Dan has a history of this type of behavior, I'm inclined to believe the speculation re: the production team member's account over the "opportunist" version. 

Edited December 13, 2019 by Jel

[marys1000]

10 hours ago, ProfCrash said:

Except others did have a problem. We saw a good number of women comment on his touching. Lauren said she had to tell him to stop. Missy agreed with Kellee. Missy and Kellee were both uncomfortable but both felt that they were “safe” from anything beyond touching because they were on tv. Missy only changed her story when Dan asked her if what Janet said was true.

Not to mention the video of Dan touching Kellee after being told not to. Or Dan stroking Missy’s calf while she was eating and he was lying on the ground. Or the other videos we saw.

Dan’s actions were not appropriate. Dan didn’t stop when asked to. Dan did something that made a staff member uncomfortable after a warning.

We also saw them saying the didn't have a problem.  But that they could play to it.  Whats the real story?  Editing of timelines re touching can do a lot.  What they allow us to see and not see.....we don't know the story AT ALL.  Demonizing someone based on a hour of heavily film is inappropirate.   The slip on the boat thing sounds plausible.  Who knows?  

[Paws]

23 minutes ago, marys1000 said:

We also saw them saying the didn't have a problem.  But that they could play to it.  Whats the real story?  Editing of timelines re touching can do a lot.  What they allow us to see and not see.....we don't know the story AT ALL.  Demonizing someone based on a hour of heavily film is inappropirate.   The slip on the boat thing sounds plausible.  Who knows?  

The real story is that Kelle told him to stop touching her and he continued to do so, it was shown to us on tape ...not heavily edited, you can see the mic and the crew in the shot. He should have been removed long long ago. It doesn’t matter if she’s the only one bothered or not.  

[ProfCrash]

1 hour ago, marys1000 said:

We also saw them saying the didn't have a problem.  But that they could play to it.  Whats the real story?  Editing of timelines re touching can do a lot.  What they allow us to see and not see.....we don't know the story AT ALL.  Demonizing someone based on a hour of heavily film is inappropirate.   The slip on the boat thing sounds plausible.  Who knows?  

We saw missy being clear that she had a problem to Kellee. We saw Elisabeth flat out lie the entire time. Missy also said she was fine with Dan being in the game because Dan would not do more then touch. Missy changed her story only after Janet confronted Missy and Elisabeth. And All Missy really did is say that she was fine with Dan, which doesn't mean that she is not uncomfortable with his touching but that she is not afraid of Dan. Missy did not deny that she had said she was not comfortable with Dan, Elisabeth did. Missy did not say she made up her story to Janet to get Janet off her back, Elisabeth did. Missy stayed very quiet during that exchange.

Missy was not lying to Kellee when they talked on the beach, that conversation happened before the plan became "vote out Kellee." It was that long conversation, 2 hours, that led Lauren to be worried about Missy and Kellee working together. Lauren approached Missy right after it and told Missy that Kellee had been talking about voting out Missy, which Kellee had been. Then Missy took the info she had from that conversation and weaponized the harassment in order to flip the vote. That time line is not edited. You saw and heard people pointing to Missy and Kellee talking for that time period. You saw Lauren approach Missy right after it occurred and Lauren reference that conversation. Neither Kellee or Missy has said that that was missequenced in the show.

Whether Missy felt as uncomfortable as Kellee is debatable but they both were vocally unhappy with Dan and his roving hands. Missy's choice to lie about her conversation with Kellee and Janet to Dan is highly unfortunate and rests solely on Missy's shoulders. But I don't believe for 1 second that Missy was lying to Kellee in that long conversation.

[nutty1]

Back to spoilers....I read somewhere (and this person has been right for several seasons but wrong last season) that the F3 are Dean, Noura and Tommy, with Tommy winning. so take it with a grain of salt, but I would not be surprised if this is correct.

[himela]

3 hours ago, nutty1 said:

Back to spoilers....I read somewhere (and this person has been right for several seasons but wrong last season) that the F3 are Dean, Noura and Tommy, with Tommy winning. so take it with a grain of salt, but I would not be surprised if this is correct.

I find it true and logical. Noura wins the final 4 immunity challenge, she chooses Tommy and Lauren to make fire and Lauren leaves at 4. Then Tommy wins. Noura and Dean have no chance against Tommy or Lauren. So for Lauren this was a million dollars fire making challenge. I guess she would have loved to have practiced more at camp.

[nutty1]

19 hours ago, himela said:

I find it true and logical. Noura wins the final 4 immunity challenge, she chooses Tommy and Lauren to make fire and Lauren leaves at 4. Then Tommy wins. Noura and Dean have no chance against Tommy or Lauren. So for Lauren this was a million dollars fire making challenge. I guess she would have loved to have practiced more at camp.

If I was ever going to be on Survivor, I would be watching videos & practicing every chance I got at home, and then when I got to camp. I'd also be practicing swimming, balance, throwing, etc. I wonder how many contestants really do that?

[LadyChatts]

I think it's possible Dean wins the F4 IC (because he would win the one that counts), and takes Tommy, sending Noura and Lauren to fire.  

I have thought for awhile that Tommy's edit seems odd compared to everyone else, almost like he's being protected in a sense.  He hasn't exactly been portrayed badly, he wasn't anywhere to be seen when the Dan drama was going down, he isn't being shown to be a knucklehead like Dean, and of those left he's probably the only one really showing any sort of strategy.  Dean may have strategy, except it's ass backwards.  Then there's Janet, whose along for the ride, Noura whose in her own world, and the duo of Lauren/Tommy who seem to be calling the shots.  

[peachmangosteen]

10 hours ago, LadyChatts said:

I have thought for awhile that Tommy's edit seems odd compared to everyone else, almost like he's being protected in a sense.  He hasn't exactly been portrayed badly, he wasn't anywhere to be seen when the Dan drama was going down ...

I agree, which is why I was very surprised when they showed Tommy's reaction to Dan's outser to be whining about how it affects his game.

Still, there's literally no chance anyone but Tommy wins.

[PhoneCop]

6 hours ago, peachmangosteen said:

I agree, which is why I was very surprised when they showed Tommy's reaction to Dan's outser to be whining about how it affects his game.

Still, there's literally no chance anyone but Tommy wins.

Now I know how you felt watching Tyler in BB20—the long, boring march to a predictable win. Except I don't think I'm getting a jury swerve like you did.

Oh well. Not like Tommy's going to be what this season is remembered for anyway.

[Special K]

33 minutes ago, PhoneCop said:

Oh well. Not like Tommy's going to be what this season is remembered for anyway.

Totally!  He'll definitely be the most forgotten winner ever.   More so than Vecepia, Michelle Fitzgerald, or Chris-the-third-voted-out.  At least I can remember their names!

In fact, whoever wins this season will be forgotten, unless it's Janet.  That would, in some small measure, be a just ending for this disaster.

[nutty1]

Maybe I need more coffee....does Janet have an idol? If so, can't she use it at the 5 to 4 TC?

ETA....oh wait, does someone have an idol nullifier? If so, that is going to be SO aggravating. 😡

Edited December 17, 2019 by nutty1

[peachmangosteen]

4 minutes ago, nutty1 said:

Maybe I need more coffee....does Janet have an idol? If so, can't she use it at the 5 to 4 TC?

ETA....oh wait, does someone have an idol nullifier? If so, that is going to be SO aggravating. 😡

Yea, she has an idol but Dean has the nullifier and he knows that Janet has an idol.

[himela]

A guy in a podcast was saying that he thought that the Dan incident with the stuff member may have been exaggerated by production and having been used as an excuse to remove him because they could see he would go to the final three and they didn't want that.

[LadyChatts]

6 hours ago, nutty1 said:

Maybe I need more coffee....does Janet have an idol? If so, can't she use it at the 5 to 4 TC?

ETA....oh wait, does someone have an idol nullifier? If so, that is going to be SO aggravating. 😡

I know...this finale could have gone so great.  Now, we won't get to see Dean embarrass himself and potentially pull an Erik by playing a fake legacy advantage.  Janet, the only redeeming factor in this finale, is going to get kicked out by the nullifier, which everyone left besides her and Noura knows that Dean has.  I guess the one bright side is, the jury won't be impressed with that move.  Yet, if the spoilers are correct, he and his dopey shit eating grin are in the finals.  So is Noura, who frankly would be my pick to win because I consider her better than Dean or Tommy.  And then there's Tommy, who I don't feel like has done a lot except get lucky, and get angry when things don't go his way.  

We need a female winner next season.  I remember Michele Fitzgerald and Natalie White more than I do the slew of men who've won the last few seasons.     

[nutty1]

It would be great if the 3 women stick together. Then we may finally get a female winner again.  I wonder if they’ll entertain that thought?

[LanceM]

Unless they are arriving in LA tonight, it appears that Jack and Elizabeth are skipping out on the reunion. Dan is obviously not there because he has been banned

[LanceM]

3 hours ago, himela said:

A guy in a podcast was saying that he thought that the Dan incident with the stuff member may have been exaggerated by production and having been used as an excuse to remove him because they could see he would go to the final three and they didn't want that.

Thus is what a bunch of Survivor alums have been sating on Varner's facebook page. I know Johnny Fairplay has been saying it as well on his podcast, as well as the fact that 3 people would not be attending the reunion which appears to be true.

[HurricaneVal]

3 hours ago, himela said:

A guy in a podcast was saying that he thought that the Dan incident with the stuff member may have been exaggerated by production and having been used as an excuse to remove him because they could see he would go to the final three and they didn't want that.

This.......is actually quite plausible.  And could also explain the taped finale shenanigans.

I'm 100% sure Survivor production thought the Dan situation would be self-corrected by Kellee using one of her two idols during that tribal council.  Or by Dan being voted out next by an outraged set of tribemates.  Neither happened, and they were caught flat-footed.

[ProfCrash]

Elisabeth not attending is most likely because she is trying to pretend Survivor never happened. She made an awful choice and has been roundly roasted for her awful decision. She is hoping that people forget she ever played this game.

no idea why Jack would skip.

[LanceM]

6 minutes ago, ProfCrash said:

Elisabeth not attending is most likely because she is trying to pretend Survivor never happened. She made an awful choice and has been roundly roasted for her awful decision. She is hoping that people forget she ever played this game.

no idea why Jack would skip.

It has been rumored that Jack and Elizabeth started dating after the season.This seems to be confirmation of that.  

Edited December 18, 2019 by LanceM

[peachmangosteen]

I can not see Elizabeth and Jack together. Also, why does he have to skip out just because she wants everyone to forget she was ever on this show? So stupid lol.

[LanceM]

Jack obviously thinks of himself as Tommy Wynette?

[LadyChatts]

7 minutes ago, peachmangosteen said:

I can not see Elizabeth and Jack together. Also, why does he have to skip out just because she wants everyone to forget she was ever on this show? So stupid lol.

Supposedly Jack had a long time girlfriend when he went out there, and it appeared they weren't together when he got back.  Everyone assumed he hooked up with Molly or Chelsea, but then by process of elimination it was Elizabeth.  I agree it's kind of an odd pair.  

Jack will be missing out on the reunion money, but besides that he would have been a seat filler on the stage.

And Elizabeth can try and hide the fact she was on Survivor, but the internet never forgets.