Law & Order Discussion Topic (2019 - 2021)

[andromeda331]

Just now, GHScorpiosRule said:

Only for the last half because they thought it would prevent the show, LOLA (Hee! That will never NOT be funny!) from being cancelled.

That's right. They brought her on and moved Alfred Molina from prosecutor to detective. Or I guess back to Detective. His back story he started out a cop, then went onto prosecutor for the first part of the series and then switched to being a Detective. Which really wasn't a bad move. But neither moved saved the show from being canceled.

[Xeliou66]

Season 17 is by far the worst season, the writing took a nosedive that season, it had declined starting in season 15 IMO but season 17 was the nadir, there were some good episodes but overall the show was a lot weaker than it had been, and there was a lot of cliched, preachy writing/dialogue. Also Detective Beauty Queen Cassady was the worst main character in L&O history. Adding in Rubirosa did help the legal side of things, if Borgia had stayed on season 17 would’ve been even worse. 

The show picked back up in season 18 and seasons 18-20 were very good, season 20 was the best season since season 14 IMO, it really pisses me off that the show got canceled and didn’t get the record as it was still a great show, far superior to what SVU is now. At least the show went out on a high note. 

[wknt3]

7 hours ago, WendyCR72 said:

Ah, gotcha. And, yeah, it would have been nice. I often wondered why Carey Lowell left the (original) show since she seemed to sort of recur in the franchise later on.

The way I've always heard it was that it was pretty similar to why the character left. She liked the work but wanted/needed a job with more flexibility so she could spend more time with her kids.

[Mrs. P.]

Which season was Jerry Orbach's last?

[balmz]

1

1 hour ago, Mrs. P. said:

Which season was Jerry Orbach's last?

14th i think

[andromeda331]

3 hours ago, Mrs. P. said:

Which season was Jerry Orbach's last?

2 hours ago, balmz said:

1

14th i think

Yes, 14th was his last season. He left to be on Law & Order Trial by Jury although the second episode of that series was his last.

[Mrs. P.]

1 hour ago, andromeda331 said:

Yes, 14th was his last season. He left to be on Law & Order Trial by Jury although the second episode of that series was his last.

Interesting. I thought he left L&O because he was dying of prostate cancer.

I couldn't watch the following seasons without him for several years...I missed him so much.  I have since gone back and watched those seasons and enjoyed them, but L&O was never the same for me without Lenny Briscoe.

Edited October 10, 2019 by Mrs. P.

[Waterston Fan]

2 hours ago, Mrs. P. said:

Interesting. I thought he left L&O because he was dying of prostate cancer.

I couldn't watch the following seasons without him for several years...I missed him so much.  I have since gone back and watched those seasons and enjoyed them, but L&O was never the same for me without Lenny Briscoe.

I know that he went on L&O: Trial By Jury but I wondered if maybe he realized his cancer was taking over his body and he just wanted out. TBJ was less stressful I think. 

[GHScorpiosRule]

At least Sundance didn’t jump to season 13 after “In Loco Parentis” this time around!

I was watching it and I do admire how Robert Clohessy can play such a raging asshole in one episode (this one), a weenie who would rather kill himself in another, and a good cop on Criminal Intent.

But I’ve been working long hours and my body knew it and I fell asleep watching. I’ve always been conflicted about this one. Though not on point, but Clohessy’s dad character reminded me of Tom Mason’s dad character in season three’s “Trust” that had that kid who had shot and killed two boys, then claiming it wasn’t his fault because it was a game. 

And regular asshole defense attorney played by Ned Eisenberg asking Lennie if he should be responsible for Cathy’s selling drugs is like apples and oranges. Because last I knew, she wasn’t a minor, but an adult.

Going to watch it again to see how it ended. Like, did they blame the video games? Not dad’s fault for giving him the Kama and other knives which he used on the mannequins as practice for what?

I think Mom, she of the murdering Munchausen by proxy mom in “Precious” came forward and said something?
 

[txhorns79]

On 10/10/2019 at 2:32 PM, Mrs. P. said:

Interesting. I thought he left L&O because he was dying of prostate cancer.

At least according to Wikipedia, he took the job on Trial By Jury because it was a smaller role and didn't have the same time requirements as the original series.  It was done to allow him to receive treatment, but continue working.  And if you've ever seen his episodes on Trial by Jury, he does not look well, i.e. he is wearing heavy make up and I think by the second episode, he can barely speak above a whisper.  I don't think anyone realized, including him, that he was dying until the very end.  

On 10/10/2019 at 1:02 AM, Xeliou66 said:

The show picked back up in season 18 and seasons 18-20 were very good, season 20 was the best season since season 14 IMO, it really pisses me off that the show got canceled and didn’t get the record as it was still a great show, far superior to what SVU is now. At least the show went out on a high note. 

Yeah, I think the show reached its nadir with Detective Beauty Queen, and worked its way back up, becoming pretty good once Cutter came in and Jack was made DA. 

[MarylandGirl]

I have officially survived season 17 and am now on to 18. So much better already... Did I miss something, or did they not explain Cassady's departure at all? Or, for that matter, McCoy taking over for Branch? Like, they said he was brought in to finish his term, but did they explain why?

[GHScorpiosRule]

2 minutes ago, MarylandGirl said:

I have officially survived season 17 and am now on to 18. So much better already... Did I miss something, or did they not explain Cassady's departure at all? Or, for that matter, McCoy taking over for Branch? Like, they said he was brought in to finish his term, but did they explain why?

I don’t recall if a reason was given for Cassady, but a reason was given for Foghorn’s departure- and that Jack was acting DA until the special election at the end of the season???

[wknt3]

28 minutes ago, MarylandGirl said:

I have officially survived season 17 and am now on to 18. So much better already... Did I miss something, or did they not explain Cassady's departure at all? Or, for that matter, McCoy taking over for Branch? Like, they said he was brought in to finish his term, but did they explain why?

22 minutes ago, GHScorpiosRule said:

I don’t recall if a reason was given for Cassady, but a reason was given for Foghorn’s departure- and that Jack was acting DA until the special election at the end of the season???

No reason was ever given. Possibly because they were (understandably) so eager to basically reboot the series and move on and possibly because that Thompson left to run for President and they didn't want to be seen as making any political statement with the way they wrote him off.

[txhorns79]

34 minutes ago, MarylandGirl said:

Did I miss something, or did they not explain Cassady's departure at all?

In her last episode, she blows up an interrogation where the perp was about to confess.  Van Buren says to her that she is unsure whether Cassady has a future with the precinct.  It's not said specifically, but I just presumed that Van Buren had her transferred.   

[MarylandGirl]

2 hours ago, txhorns79 said:

In her last episode, she blows up an interrogation where the perp was about to confess.  Van Buren says to her that she is unsure whether Cassady has a future with the precinct.  It's not said specifically, but I just presumed that Van Buren had her transferred.   

Yeah, I was expecting her to resign or get fired in that ep, but then she didn't. But I guess it was setting up her departure.

[NYCFree]

I didn’t really watch Law and Order when it aired live, because it started when I went to law school and the last thing I wanted was more law.

However, after practicing for a while, and then moving on to teaching, I got into it.

I was so surprised when they made a whole episode based on a judge I clerked for one summer, Leslie Crocker Snyder. She was a super tough judge and one white collar criminal defendant appearing in front of her tried to hire a hit man to take her out. That episode was Judge Dread in season 11. 

I was even more shocked when the judge herself popped up, playing “Judge Logan” on a few episodes in seasons 14 and 15.

[Xeliou66]

16 hours ago, MarylandGirl said:

I have officially survived season 17 and am now on to 18. So much better already... Did I miss something, or did they not explain Cassady's departure at all? Or, for that matter, McCoy taking over for Branch? Like, they said he was brought in to finish his term, but did they explain why?

No they never explained Cassady’s departure, but after she blew up in interrogation in the season 17 finale and Van Buren chewed her out it was implied that Van Buren was going to have her transferred as she wasn’t good enough to be a homicide detective, at least that’s what I thought. It still would’ve been nice if they had had a line at the start of season 18 explaining where she wound up. 

As for Arthur, it was never said why he stepped down, I’ve always assumed it was to run for higher office perhaps. I definitely think Arthur had made up his mind to step down in the season 17 finale and wanted Jack to be his successor, based on the final scene of The Family Hour.

[GHScorpiosRule]

43 minutes ago, Xeliou66 said:

No they never explained Cassady’s departure, but after she blew up in interrogation in the season 17 finale and Van Buren chewed her out it was implied that Van Buren was going to have her transferred as she wasn’t good enough to be a homicide detective, at least that’s what I thought. It still would’ve been nice if they had had a line at the start of season 18 explaining where she wound up. 

As for Arthur, it was never said why he stepped down, I’ve always assumed it was to run for higher office perhaps. I definitely think Arthur had made up his mind to step down in the season 17 finale and wanted Jack to be his successor, based on the final scene of The Family Hour.

And he ended up being a judge for that Gaffigan "reality show" with all those kids. Jack's "You're kidding, right?" response to that will never NOT be Funny!🤣🤣

[balmz]

35 minutes ago, Xeliou66 said:

No they never explained Cassady’s departure, but after she blew up in interrogation in the season 17 finale and Van Buren chewed her out it was implied that Van Buren was going to have her transferred as she wasn’t good enough to be a homicide detective, at least that’s what I thought. It still would’ve been nice if they had had a line at the start of season 18 explaining where she wound up. 

As for Arthur, it was never said why he stepped down, I’ve always assumed it was to run for higher office perhaps. I definitely think Arthur had made up his mind to step down in the season 17 finale and wanted Jack to be his successor, based on the final scene of The Family Hour.

agreed i always hate in shows when a major or fairly major show is written off and there's no reason given why they left, whether it's L&O or another show even if i didn't really like or care for the character, like a quick line would do like they did with joe

like nora was only explained in a book, paul wasn't given a reason except in a press release, nina and arthur no explanation 

one thought i always thought would be amusing for nina  to explain her leaving was some really fancy beauty salon or pagent was impressed with her actions that got her promoted, so they made an job offer and she became a private security or leader of security at the location

[GHScorpiosRule]

Not everyone got an explanation for leaving. Just like when Cragen was gone in season four, nothing about why he was no longer squad commander. I didn't give any figgedity fucks about Cassady or Nora, so I didn't need to know why they left.

Edited October 14, 2019 by GHScorpiosRule

[Xeliou66]

I always assumed Nora just didn’t run for election when it came time for the next election, she didn’t seem like the political type. Still one line about any of the characters that didn’t get an explanation for their departure would’ve been nice, because it irritates me when a show writes off a character without an explanation. I thought it was weak as well how Robinette and Cragen weren’t given an explanation at the start of season 4, but at least in season 5 we found out Cragen had become head of an anti corruption task force and then in season 6 we found out Robinette had become a defense attorney (although Robinette totally changed when he became a defense attorney). 

15 minutes ago, GHScorpiosRule said:

And he ended up being a judge for that Gaffigan "reality show" with all those kids. Jack's "You're kidding, right?" response to that will never NOT be Funny!🤣🤣

The ending of that episode always makes me laugh, the way McCoy delivered that line was great, it all seemed so absurd but reality tv is absurd. I would love to know if Arthur agreed to go on the show and how that all went down LOL. 

[ML89]

3 hours ago, Xeliou66 said:

The ending of that episode always makes me laugh, the way McCoy delivered that line was great, it all seemed so absurd but reality tv is absurd. I would love to know if Arthur agreed to go on the show and how that all went down LOL. 

It's sort of a mirror as to how Thompson got into acting - he played himself in a Sissy Spacek movie and then went on from there - Marie is the movie.

[GHScorpiosRule]

On 9/18/2019 at 10:36 PM, Xeliou66 said:

I saw Surrender Dorothy today, an outstanding episode, Harlan Graham was loathsome IMO, a master manipulator, I was glad the jury didn’t buy his story about killing Dorothy and convicted him of manslaughter. McCoy’s closing argument was really strong, I liked how he laid out all the evidence pointing to suicide and pointed out Graham’s manipulations. I also liked Skoda breaking down Graham’s unethical actions, and I liked that he was there when they talked to Graham’s daughter and convinced her to turn against her father. One of my favorite Briscoe one liners when he was arresting Graham “take your own advice doc, surrender with love”. Great episode. 

I saw this over the weekend. And I remember trying to recall what you had said about it! For some reason, I thought you didn't like it. I think it was one of the other episodes, though I'm blanking on which one.

[Xeliou66]

1 hour ago, GHScorpiosRule said:

I saw this over the weekend. And I remember trying to recall what you had said about it! For some reason, I thought you didn't like it. I think it was one of the other episodes, though I'm blanking on which one.

I like every episode from season 10 I believe. Surrender Dorothy is very good, Harlan Graham was one of the worst characters on L&O that never actually killed anyone, I didn’t buy his self serving confession to murder and all of the evidence pointed to suicide. Graham was a cold, manipulative sociopath, I was very glad the jury saw through his lies and convicted him, like I said before I really liked how McCoy’s closing argument laid out all of the facts of the case, Jack had so many great closing arguments. Briscoe had some great lines in this episode as well, Briscoe and Green are always great to watch. Season 10 has my favorite cast lineup, only season with Briscoe/Green and Schiff. 

[GHScorpiosRule]

23 minutes ago, Xeliou66 said:

Briscoe and Green are always great to watch

Oh yeah! And you reminded of what Green said to the obviously stoned surfer dude in "High and Low" where surfer dude is telling Lennie and Martin that he couldn't remember what "stuff" he traded to sell Polone, the night club owner who ordered the torture death of the graduate student/stripper:

Green: "does that stuuuuff come in little pills?"

Me: 🤣🤣 at Jesse's delivery.

But I loathe that episode, or rather, loathe Harris, the fat, white-middle aged CHEATING LOSER, who refused to fully testify against the ex porno star who was his mistress, who was only using him, but he was obsessed over. Because of HIM, Double Jeopardy attached and so Jack couldn't get Palone or that twat for murder, but instead had to be satisfied with conspiracy to commit murder.

[Xeliou66]

I saw Undercovered today, that jury really pissed me off for not convicting Garcia for murder, he kidnapped someone and bashed his head in because he was pissed off at his situation, while I sympathize with anyone who has a sick child, it doesn’t justify killing someone who was just doing their job. Nora really irritated me with how she basically seemed on the side of the defense, she showed how soft she was as a DA in that episode. I thought not enough was made of the fact that the treatment that was denied wasn’t guaranteed to save the killer’s daughter and the victim thought he was making the right call, I didn’t take it that he was a greedy slimebag. Overall I thought McCoy did a good job but the jury just didn’t want to convict, I think another jury might’ve convicted him, I wonder if they retried the case, it seemed like they were leaning against it for some reason. Undercovered was a good episode, I liked how the investigation played out with some good twists but the ending frustrates me.

The legal side of season 12 could drag sometimes with both Nora and Serena on, but the investigation side was great, I LOVE Briscoe/Green. 

[catlover79]

On 10/14/2019 at 11:01 AM, GHScorpiosRule said:

And he ended up being a judge for that Gaffigan "reality show" with all those kids. Jack's "You're kidding, right?" response to that will never NOT be Funny!🤣🤣

That was brilliant - and brilliantly funny. The episode was "Reality Bites" from Season 20.

[MarylandGirl]

Just watched "Burn Card"--great episode, though sad departure for Green. I think the fact that they don't usually tend to focus much on the characters' outside lives makes it much more effective when they do. Some of the exchanges between Green and Van Buren and Green and Lupo were really well done.

[ML89]

2 hours ago, MarylandGirl said:

Just watched "Burn Card"--great episode, though sad departure for Green. I think the fact that they don't usually tend to focus much on the characters' outside lives makes it much more effective when they do. Some of the exchanges between Green and Van Buren and Green and Lupo were really well done.

Green talking about how Lennie left and then he died was so sad. And he left the same way, with his sad cardboard file box.

[balmz]

here's a "fun" question, who are some of the most evil parents you can remember in the show?

one notable one and arguably the most evil is the parents in smoked who sold their kid to a pedophile

Edited October 18, 2019 by balmz

[txhorns79]

I think one of the most evil was the mom who forced her son to work for the drug dealer in Slave to pay for her own habit, and he ends up shooting someone.  I remember the episode mostly from the final scene where they are in family court, and the kid keeps looking at the door, waiting for his mother to show up, but, of course she never does.  It's heartbreaking. 

[Xeliou66]

On 10/17/2019 at 3:23 PM, MarylandGirl said:

Just watched "Burn Card"--great episode, though sad departure for Green. I think the fact that they don't usually tend to focus much on the characters' outside lives makes it much more effective when they do. Some of the exchanges between Green and Van Buren and Green and Lupo were really well done.

I saw Burn Card recently as well, and yeah it’s a good episode, a somewhat depressing ending for Green but it’s a good episode, and I agree about the interactions between Green and Van Buren and Green and Lupo being very good, I especially liked Green’s final scene with each of them. I also liked the start of the Lupo/Bernard partnership, I liked them working together to get to the bottom of the story. I loved Green mentioning Lennie and how he started gambling again after Lennie’s death, it was a nice touch to show how Lennie was still missed and thought about and how Lennie’s death affected Green, I loved the Briscoe/Green partnership and it was nice to hear Green and Van Buren talk about Lennie, Lennie is a legend!

There wasn’t as much legal stuff in this one and it seemed like Cutter wanted Green to be guilty of something but then he seemed relieved that Green was cleared in the end. Rubirosa was really good in this one IMO, there wasn’t much of McCoy but I liked how he said Green had been in his office a hundred times and he never thought he could be a murderer. 

Edited October 18, 2019 by Xeliou66

[wknt3]

Sam Waterston joins Jane Fonda in getting arrested during D.C. climate change protest

Sam Waterston was arrested today while protesting for climate action

So there it is. Some of us were wondering how long it would take for the real Jack McCoy to rear his shaggy hippie liberal head...

[GHScorpiosRule]

54 minutes ago, wknt3 said:

Sam Waterston joins Jane Fonda in getting arrested during D.C. climate change protest

Sam Waterston was arrested today while protesting for climate action

So there it is. Some of us were wondering how long it would take for the real Jack McCoy to rear his shaggy hippie liberal head...

@wknt3, I chose the 😄reaction because of your last six words! 😄😅🤣

[WendyCR72]

WE started S1 again at 3:00 p.m. with the non-Adam Schiff pilot and is continuing on...

[Claire85]

Watching “Prescription for Death” right now. Love when Ben catches out the drunk doctor on the stand after his liquid lunch. 

[balmz]

49 minutes ago, Claire85 said:

Watching “Prescription for Death” right now. Love when Ben catches out the drunk doctor on the stand after his liquid lunch. 

always liked that too,

tell me, who here thinks if ben hasn't had max observe the doctor he would have still gotten a conviction on the doctor? just curious on your thoughts

[andromeda331]

1 hour ago, Claire85 said:

Watching “Prescription for Death” right now. Love when Ben catches out the drunk doctor on the stand after his liquid lunch. 

Its a great scene.

[Xeliou66]

I watched Prescription for Death as well, good episode, although it always bugs me how the witnesses were testifying out of order (one prosecution witness, one defense witness, then back to the prosecution) that made no sense, the show was still finding its footing, but I like the episode, it was a good storyline and I especially liked the second half and watching Stone and Robinette. Only one Schiff scene in this one but he was great as always. 

45 minutes ago, balmz said:

always liked that too,

tell me, who here thinks if ben hasn't had max observe the doctor he would have still gotten a conviction on the doctor? just curious on your thoughts

I think there was a good chance of the jury convicting Auster even without him getting exposed as drunk in the courtroom, they had a pretty good case against him.

Edited October 21, 2019 by Xeliou66

[txhorns79]

I sometimes forget how rough a show Law and Order could be during the first season.  In Subterranean Homeboy Blues, the police apparently don't search the perp's apartment until the middle of trial, and Paul just picks up a few things, no log of what he is taking or anything like that, to use as evidence.  Then at the trial, Shambala Green requests to give a demonstration of what the situation was like for Cynthia Nixon's character before she started shooting, and the Judge, without having any idea what she is actually going to do, allows it.  Finally, without ever speaking to her client, Shambala accepts an offer Ben pulls out of his ass after his case falls apart.  I fully get that this is a fictional tv show and dramatic license is taken, but it was like no one had any idea as to what actually happens at a trial.          

[Xeliou66]

53 minutes ago, txhorns79 said:

I sometimes forget how rough a show Law and Order could be during the first season.  In Subterranean Homeboy Blues, the police apparently don't search the perp's apartment until the middle of trial, and Paul just picks up a few things, no log of what he is taking or anything like that, to use as evidence.  Then at the trial, Shambala Green requests to give a demonstration of what the situation was like for Cynthia Nixon's character before she started shooting, and the Judge, without having any idea what she is actually going to do, allows it.  Finally, without ever speaking to her client, Shambala accepts an offer Ben pulls out of his ass after his case falls apart.  I fully get that this is a fictional tv show and dramatic license is taken, but it was like no one had any idea as to what actually happens at a trial.          

Like I said in my above post, the show was still finding it’s footing in season 1, and there were some errors, and often times things seemed out of order and the detectives would go from one lead to the next without any real correlation, it was sometimes hard to follow, they worked out the kinks over the course of season 1 and the show became much smoother and easier to follow. 

[shapeshifter]

8.2 “Denial” aired yesterday on Bounce. At the end, after the jury incongruously (IMO) deliver Not Guilty verdicts for the teenagers who strangled their newborn baby, MCoy suggests that they could get the teen girl’s father “for obstruction of justice, destruction of evidence,” to which Adam Schiff resignedly replies, “We got beat. Just send him home to his family.” Shouldn’t they have at least found someone guilty of illegally burying the baby at the construction site?

[wknt3]

8 hours ago, Xeliou66 said:

9 hours ago, txhorns79 said:

I sometimes forget how rough a show Law and Order could be during the first season.  In Subterranean Homeboy Blues, the police apparently don't search the perp's apartment until the middle of trial, and Paul just picks up a few things, no log of what he is taking or anything like that, to use as evidence.  Then at the trial, Shambala Green requests to give a demonstration of what the situation was like for Cynthia Nixon's character before she started shooting, and the Judge, without having any idea what she is actually going to do, allows it.  Finally, without ever speaking to her client, Shambala accepts an offer Ben pulls out of his ass after his case falls apart.  I fully get that this is a fictional tv show and dramatic license is taken, but it was like no one had any idea as to what actually happens at a trial.          

Like I said in my above post, the show was still finding it’s footing in season 1, and there were some errors, and often times things seemed out of order and the detectives would go from one lead to the next without any real correlation, it was sometimes hard to follow, they worked out the kinks over the course of season 1 and the show became much smoother and easier to follow. 

I think there were a few issues. One is that they seem to have done a lot more research in law libraries and press archives than in court houses and precinct houses although they certainly seemed to have spent some time in courtrooms as opposed to their ignorance of police procedure. They seemed to be making a real effort to depict aspects of the legal system that had usually been ignored and try to accurately depict the overall legal process (within the confines of television) while being content to gloss over the police work that lead to the trial and sometimes the trial itself. Perhaps Dick Wolf felt that he knew what he was doing as far as the police side given his experience on Hill Street Blues and Miami Vice. Or maybe he was just more interested in using the trials to explore social issues and do his Golden Age of Television filmed radio plays and didn't want to use the time on the strictly procedural aspects. I think another part of it was that the writing and editing was far more interested in style and visual flare than in logically moving from point A to Point B and leading the viewer through the process. This can be seen as good or bad - a lot of those who were involved in those first episodes seem to agree with Chris Noth in finding the look they settled on by late Season 3 or so as "bland cinematography".  And as you said they were finding their way and learning how to set up the sort of plot points and dramatic moments in "SHB" so that it's easier to suspend disbelief.
 

Edited October 23, 2019 by wknt3
accidentally deleted key phrase

[blondiec0332]

6 hours ago, shapeshifter said:

8.2 “Denial” aired yesterday on Bounce. At the end, after the jury incongruously (IMO) deliver Not Guilty verdicts for the teenagers who strangled their newborn baby, MCoy suggests that they could get the teen girl’s father “for obstruction of justice, destruction of evidence,” to which Adam Schiff resignedly replies, “We got beat. Just send him home to his family.” Shouldn’t they have at least found someone guilty of illegally burying the baby at the construction site?

That is one episode I usually skip when I do a re watch.  It's difficult to watch the episodes that have babies that die. I also skip 6.8 Angel. The one where the mother puts her baby in a furnace.

[shapeshifter]

5 hours ago, blondiec0332 said:

That is one episode I usually skip when I do a re watch.  It's difficult to watch the episodes that have babies that die. I also skip 6.8 Angel. The one where the mother puts her baby in a furnace.

Yeah, I generally have it on in the background while working on project,s so I didn't realize which one it was. Either "Denial" doesn't have any graphic images, or I fortunately  missed them. 

Recently there was a scene in front of a furnace for Angel, but, again, if they actually showed it, I missed it. 

[blondiec0332]

2 minutes ago, shapeshifter said:

Yeah, I generally have it on in the background while working on project,s so I didn't realize which one it was. Either "Denial" doesn't have any graphic images, or I fortunately  missed them. 

Recently there was a scene in front of a furnace for Angel, but, again, if they actually showed it, I missed it. 

For me it's not about images but thinking about what happened. I know none of it is real but it still disturbs me to think about it. And as is the case with Law & Order if the writers wrote it then it probably happened in real life and that really disturbs me.

[GHScorpiosRule]

Still slowly watching season 11 and watched "Hubris" and "Teenage Wasteland" last night.

"Hubris":

I just love Judge Bradley. He of the no-nonsense temperament. Because yeah, Green shouldn't have stuck that toothpick in Landry/Morriston's door. HE didn't know why the cops wanted to talk to him again. And since the warrant came within a minute, I very much doubt he would have been able to burn/destroy all those tapes. But, I digress. I loved what he said to Jack about not watching those tapes, because he knew he had to exclude them, and he needed to be objective about it, and follow the law, and not let emotion affect his ruling.

I wonder, because I'm not a lawyer, if the mistrial could have been overturned due to the jury tampering? Or just a new trial with the testimony of the twat that she caused the hung jury because...twuuuu wuuuuuv.🤢🤢 I think they had a strong case for that. But Jack just gave up? That's so unlike him.

Then there's "Teenage Wasteland." Like anybody needed to know Nora's personal beliefs about the death penalty. Her whole attitude and reasoning in this was so infuriating. "God have Mercy on our souls"? STFU. All she needed to do was make the statement that the DA's office was going to seek the death penalty. Full Stop. All that hand wringing and worrying about Regan. UGH. Stone cold, sociopathic killer. Even at the sentencing, he's still trying to blame the others for the killing he did himself. While Jason Ritter only had two small scenes, he was amazing. He's the only kid (His dad was the wonderful Jack Ritter), who inherited the talent.

And why use Judge Schrieber as one who agreed to that guilty plea before the office made their decision to seek the death penalty? Why not use one of the asshole recurring judges? I adore Judge Schrieber, played by John Ramsey.

And while I'm not a lawyer, I do work in the legal field, and that line from Abbie to Nora--"What are you shepardizing?" was WRONG. It may have "sounded" good, but it was wrong. Nora was trying to find a case or cases that would support her not using the death penalty. Shepardizing is looking for and finding cases that supports the argument you're making is still good law/case hasn't been overturned/or the specific argument in the decision of the case you're looking to use hasn't been overturned.

And the mother was the worst kind of stereo type used. The mealy-mouthed, oblivious, clueless, ignorant of who her son was. And that yowling after the jury decided for the death penalty. I mean, Nora had already said the office would seek it. And this was the penalty phase. Did she think they would veto it?

I wonder why we didn't get to see the trial phase--like we did in season nine's "True North." Oh, that's right. We had to see Nora's whining about how  the killer was "barely 18" and that the death penalty shouldn't be put on the table.

Edited October 24, 2019 by GHScorpiosRule

[blondiec0332]

Season 11 has one of my favorite episodes. Ego. The episode where the Assistant Attorney General is accused of killing a co worker he was having an affair with. The defendant was so smug I wanted him to get his comeuppance so badly.

[Xeliou66]

Season 11 was a great season even though I’m not a big Nora fan, almost every episode was great. 

I love Teenage Wasteland, a terrific episode from start to finish. I really liked both of the arguments at the end from McCoy and the defense lawyer, they both made really good points and I was left conflicted as to whether I believed he should get the death penalty or not. I also liked the panel discussion between the various DA’s, and Nora was forced to be more authoritative in this episode. I think we didn’t get to see the trial phase because it there wouldn’t have been any suspense, it was obvious to everyone Mitch was guilty. I do think that if Mitch had pled guilty like he was originally going to he might not have gotten the death penalty, and no jury would’ve been involved. 

[balmz]

what are some of the most memorable defenses you can remember on the show? it doesn't have to have worked or you agreed with it, just ones you recall stand out

the black rage defense in rage is one, also the ending of the episode suggested it might really have some merit