LuAnn de Lesseps: No Longer a Countess, Still Never a Princess

[quaintirene]

2 hours ago, Rap541 said:

Quote

 

If I recall - and I freely admit I could be wrong, wasn't she the one who got drunk and brought back a strange man and upset Heather because that's actually kinda dangerous behavior?

That was her.  And when Heather (rightly) protested she said ‘be cool.  Don’t be like uncool.’  I’d have been yelling so loud you’d hear me in Antarctica over that move.  You want to bang some random guy, fine.  But don’t even think of bringing him by the nice place me & my friends are sharing with you and letting him stay over.  Carol was pissed about that as well.  It’s not like LuAnn goes for nice ordinary trustworthy guys either.  Not if The Pirate & Tom d’Agostino are any example of what she dredges up.

[Celia Rubenstein]

36 minutes ago, WireWrap said:

Yes but again as I said above, many of the divorce/custody comments are base on facts we know from court transcripts or from Bethenny herself.

Okay, that is about 5% of the rumors taken as fact in the Beth thread. That only leaves 95% to account for LOL

Seriously tho, I think one has to admit that given recent events and things we've seen on the show since it started, that old story about Lu getting drunk at that wedding is pretty damn easy to believe now. As are the stories about her penchant for random hookups.  And it has been Luann herself who has eliminated most of the room for doubt with her behavior and her lies that have been exposed.   It's really her own fault people are dragging out the old stories about her and going "mmmmmm hmmmmm!"

 

58 minutes ago, ScoobieDoobs said:

 After booze rehab, Lu, get to peen rehab.

Maybe for her cabaret act she can rework that Amy Winehouse classic

"they tried to make me go to Peen-hab but I said No, no, noooo"

[howiveaddict]

2 hours ago, Wendy said:

 

https://www.huffingtonpost.com/2008/08/26/real-housewives-countess_n_121372.html 

Then, LuAnn, who was there with her husband, Alexandre Count de Lesseps, seemed overwhelmed with affection for her fellow guests. “She was trying to make out with women and married men,” the source said. “A pregnant wife caught her in the act, stormed off and walked home in disgust.”

Alexandre “tried to make her leave and was seen throwing her to the ground in the parking lot,” our spy continued.

“She wasn’t just kissing the married men, she was also grabbing their [crotches],” another witness told The Post’s Braden Keil, adding that one male victim was the escort of one of her TV co-stars.

 

Oh yes, Luann's wild behavior is very well documented, she has zero respect for other people's feelings, she has gotten along with this behavior for a very long time. When Luann wants someone, she will get him/her hell or high water. That might be the reason why this has affected her so badly, Tom is the same version of herself. 

And she is always talking about Sonja getting drunk and making out.

1 hour ago, NeverLate said:

Well she already has a gig.

 

https://radaronline.com/celebrity-news/luann-de-lesseps-planning-cabaret-show/amp/

 

Good for you Lu!:) 

Shade of Sonja.

[lunastartron]

45 minutes ago, quaintirene said:

That was her.  And when Heather (rightly) protested she said ‘be cool.  Don’t be like uncool.’  I’d have been yelling so loud you’d hear me in Antarctica over that move.  You want to bang some random guy, fine.  But don’t even think of bringing him by the nice place me & my friends are sharing with you and letting him stay over.  Carol was pissed about that as well.  It’s not like LuAnn goes for nice ordinary trustworthy guys either.  Not if The Pirate & Tom d’Agostino are any example of what she dredges up.

Actually, Heather went into hysterics because there was a man wandering around in the bedroom that connected with hers via the bath chamber. That was Ramona's trick, whom she deposited upstairs unattended when she herself was ready to pass out.

If memory serves, LuAnn brought her own ONS back to the property but made him leave before she went to bed. 

Somehow, Ramona got off scot free in that whole imbroglio. 

[essexjan]

5 minutes ago, lunastartron said:

Actually, Heather went into hysterics because there was a man wandering around in the bedroom that connected with hers via the bath chamber. That was Ramona's trick, whom she deposited upstairs unattended when she herself was ready to pass out.

If memory serves, LuAnn brought her own ONS back to the property but made him leave before she went to bed. 

Somehow, Ramona got off scot free in that whole imbroglio. 

 

I think Ramona got a pass from the others because she was just out of her marriage and new in the dating pool, so there seemed to be a perception that Luann had been the instigator and wanted to bring the guys back so she could bang hers. And Ramona had found herself in a situation that had gone a bit further than she'd anticipated, she didn't know how to navigate her way out of it and so felt she had to go along with it, but with no intention of sleeping with the guy, so she (wrongly) stashed him in the spare room.

This seems plausible to me. I think that Ramona is a big flirt and likes to be taken out by men, but she was married for a long time and I've not seen anything to suggest she's promiscuous. So I suspect that once Luann disappeared with her guy, Ramona panicked and got the guy out of the way so she could go to bed by herself (or was she sharing with Sonja, I forget now).

[WireWrap]

16 minutes ago, essexjan said:

 

I think Ramona got a pass from the others because she was just out of her marriage and new in the dating pool, so there seemed to be a perception that Luann had been the instigator and wanted to bring the guys back so she could bang hers. And Ramona had found herself in a situation that had gone a bit further than she'd anticipated, she didn't know how to navigate her way out of it and so felt she had to go along with it, but with no intention of sleeping with the guy, so she (wrongly) stashed him in the spare room.

This seems plausible to me. I think that Ramona is a big flirt and likes to be taken out by men, but she was married for a long time and I've not seen anything to suggest she's promiscuous. So I suspect that once Luann disappeared with her guy, Ramona panicked and got the guy out of the way so she could go to bed by herself (or was she sharing with Sonja, I forget now).

Yes, she was new to the dating world but she kept blaming Luann until after they got back from the trip, by then the damage between Luann, Heather and Carol was done. 

[WireWrap]

1 hour ago, quaintirene said:

That was her.  And when Heather (rightly) protested she said ‘be cool.  Don’t be like uncool.’  I’d have been yelling so loud you’d hear me in Antarctica over that move.  You want to bang some random guy, fine.  But don’t even think of bringing him by the nice place me & my friends are sharing with you and letting him stay over.  Carol was pissed about that as well.  It’s not like LuAnn goes for nice ordinary trustworthy guys either.  Not if The Pirate & Tom d’Agostino are any example of what she dredges up.

Actually, Luann and Ramona brought guys back to the house. Luann kept hers outside, pool side, then set him home while Ramona brought hers in then dumped him in the bedroom connected to Heathers/Carol's room without letting them know he was there. And, Ramona blamed Luann for the guy in the house until they were back in NYC. 

1 hour ago, Celia Rubenstein said:

Okay, that is about 5% of the rumors taken as fact in the Beth thread. That only leaves 95% to account for LOL

Seriously tho, I think one has to admit that given recent events and things we've seen on the show since it started, that old story about Lu getting drunk at that wedding is pretty damn easy to believe now. As are the stories about her penchant for random hookups.  And it has been Luann herself who has eliminated most of the room for doubt with her behavior and her lies that have been exposed.   It's really her own fault people are dragging out the old stories about her and going "mmmmmm hmmmmm!"

 

Maybe for her cabaret act she can rework that Amy Winehouse classic

"they tried to make me go to Peen-hab but I said No, no, noooo"

It's way more than 5%, most of the info we have comes from court transcripts, and Bethenny, herself, in interviews she has given or her own SM posts/tweets. 

Is it possible that Luann got drunk at the wedding so long ago, Yes but again, so far it is nothing more than malicious gossip that no one ever confirmed.  As for her "hookups" she hasn't denied having them for several years now. And, she isn't denying what happened in PB, she has apologized twice now.

I think it comes down to that if you like a HW, you are inclined to cut them some slack, give them a chance to redeem themselves but if you don't like them, all you see is a history of guilt/lies and their continued personal failures all rolled into ongoing behavior. LOL

[Neeners]

I don't know what it says about me that I'm more than slightly tempted to go to Luann's gig and report back.

 

Well crud - just looked and it's already waitlisted. Ah well.

Edited January 1, 2018 by Neeners

[Celia Rubenstein]

17 minutes ago, WireWrap said:

 I think it comes down to that if you like a HW, you are inclined to cut them some slack, give them a chance to redeem themselves but if you don't like them, all you see is a history of guilt/lies and their continued personal failures all rolled into ongoing behavior. LOL

I'm sure lots of people are biased the way you suggest. But there is also a middle ground where a person doesn't feel any particular way about a given housewife and doesn't view her behavior with bias in either direction. 

And even when one is especially fond of particular housewife, it is actually possible to admit she's done something wrong. The same way it's possible to look at the behavior of someone you don't particularly like and acknowledge there is nothing wrong with it. 

5 minutes ago, Neeners said:

Well crud - just looked and it's already waitlisted. Ah well.

I wish I knew how ticket sales were going before Lu got busted.  Were people genuinely interested in seeing her act and buying ticketsvor are they just showing up to see the train wreck?

[HunterHunted]

2 hours ago, quaintirene said:

That was her.  And when Heather (rightly) protested she said ‘be cool. Don’t be like uncool.’  I’d have been yelling so loud you’d hear me in Antarctica over that move.  You want to bang some random guy, fine.  But don’t even think of bringing him by the nice place me & my friends are sharing with you and letting him stay over.  Carol was pissed about that as well.  It’s not like LuAnn goes for nice ordinary trustworthy guys either.  Not if The Pirate & Tom d’Agostino are any example of what she dredges up.

The guy was Ramona's guest. Where Luann irritated me was her refusal to acknowledge that Heather's and Carole's concerns about this strange man being there had any validity. I know some people thought Heather and Carole were being hysterical, especially because they thought production would step in and protect the women. All I have to say about that is Bachelor in Paradise. 

The other thing I thought was really strange was how Lu turned paranoid that Heather and Carole were trying to catch her with a guy. It makes me wonder if her hooking up with these dudes is that constant and pathological. Or if she's that delusional about what happened with Tomas. Hint, no one was trying to catch her; she busted herself when the cameras were rolling and the mics were hot. I'm sure her children don't love to be reminded that she has sex, but they aren't unaware that she does, especially after she screwed Tomas. Furthermore, if she's that concerned about her kids knowing about her sex life, bring a vibrator on these trips. The cameras are on them from 9am until at least midnight and sometimes later on these trips. RHoOC kept a camera in reserve on a recent trip because they knew Vicki would be back late. The entire purpose of the crew is to try to catch you doing things. If having her sex life documented like that bothers her, she needs to have some self control. Her inability to control her behavior in the way she wants is what I think she needs therapy for. 

[Alonzo Mosely FBI]

NYE ..... Lu should’ve been  celebrating her 1 year anniversary tonight ! Wherever she is I hope she’s strong tonight, it would have been a shitty day even without the arrest to get through, thinking about her big PB wedding and Toms 50th. I think Lu has been in need for a reality check for years but I am thinking of her and respecting the struggle tonight. 

[hoosiermom]

I have been clean and sober going on 20 years but in my drinking days I never met a peen I didn’t like. So yah, I get what is going on with Luann. Drinking was the only thing that made me horny. Maybe once Luann gets out of rehab she may find that sex is way over rated. IMO. AND, how can you even end up in the wrong  room without a key card for that room?

[gundysgirl]

1 hour ago, HunterHunted said:

The other thing I thought was really strange was how Lu turned paranoid that Heather and Carole were trying to catch her with a guy.

Exactly. Which is one reason I never believed she just made out with that guy on the patio outside. She said to Carole later "I could have had a man in my room. How would that have looked to my kids"? And then something shitty to Carole about her not understanding this because Carole didn't have any kids. Sorry Luann, but your kids already knew all about you. She had had a guy in her room but was smart enough to get him the hell out of there before the camera crews came around. Anyone doubt this based on what we already knew then and have learned since?

The other thing about that deal that brings this all into more focus was when Heather said something like "wouldn't you be afraid if you woke up and there was a strange man in your room"? To which Luann famously shrugged and responded, "not really". Not really indeed. Practice apparently makes perfect. The very idea that she was unable to understand why this might make someone else uncomfortable was the thing that was so shocking about that whole situation. 

Edited January 1, 2018 by gundysgirl

[zoeysmom]

2 hours ago, gundysgirl said:

Exactly. Which is one reason I never believed she just made out with that guy on the patio outside. She said to Carole later "I could have had a man in my room. How would that have looked to my kids"? And then something shitty to Carole about her not understanding this because Carole didn't have any kids. Sorry Luann, but your kids already knew all about you. She had had a guy in her room but was smart enough to get him the hell out of there before the camera crews came around. Anyone doubt this based on what we already knew then and have learned since?

The other thing about that deal that brings this all into more focus was when Heather said something like "wouldn't you be afraid if you woke up and there was a strange man in your room"? To which Luann famously shrugged and responded, "not really". Not really indeed. Practice apparently makes perfect. The very idea that she was unable to understand why this might make someone else uncomfortable was the thing that was so shocking about that whole situation. 

I believe Luann's make out guy was driven off the property in the wee hours of the night and she went to sleep alone.  Maybe by the house manager Alastair?  Ramona then stashed her guy upstairs.  Heather discovered him and he went downstairs and had a smoothie with Sonja.  The big delay was waiting for the cameras and then Carole and Heather stormed Ramona's room and then Luann's.  So Heather's reaction wasn't exactly spontaneous.  Once the cameras arrived she and Carole had their discussion.  Confronted Dorinda and then onto Ramona and Luann's rooms.  

To me it had more to do with the histrionics over what could have happened.  Sonja, Ramona and Dorinda didn't seem as bothered.  Luann wasn't asked abut Heather's feelings-she was asked about hers.  It really wasn't her deal it was Ramona's.  I think they were then bothered about Ramona "conch blocking" the owner of the restaurant from Carole and Bethenny.  Heather was pretty funny as she did mention she was the one who sent Ramona over to talk to the guy.  

There was a lot of quibbling over how someone should or should not behave on that trip.   

[Mindthinkr]

I also recall that the guy that Luanne brought back for the ONS was married. I think that Heather was the one to tell Lu this and she just seemed to shrug it off. I think it was shown just before the "Be cool" comment. 

[Wendy]

12 hours ago, lunastartron said:

Actually, Heather went into hysterics because there was a man wandering around in the bedroom that connected with hers via the bath chamber. That was Ramona's trick, whom she deposited upstairs unattended when she herself was ready to pass out.

If memory serves, LuAnn brought her own ONS back to the property but made him leave before she went to bed. 

Somehow, Ramona got off scot free in that whole imbroglio. 

1

Maybe because every RHNY has known about Luann's escapades for years.  They have hinted at it, they have out loud said it, but yet most viewers only go but what has been on the show. 

Luann has given this sugar-coated version of how her marriage was not an "open marriage", that it was only the Count cheating on her and she couldn't do anything about it, but that is definitely not true. They did have an open marriage by all indications and reports and her castmates know all about it, so when a strange man shows up at the house, given the precedents, they were more inclined to believe it was Luann than Ramona IMO. 

The appalling part of that for me was not that Luann had sex with a guy but according to her own account she brought him to the house and after the deed was done, she sent him away, later she found out the guy was married and she was completely unconcerned with that fact. She didn't even flinch. 

More reports of Luann's activities 

http://people.com/tbd/caught-in-the-act-305/ 

Following New York Post reports that she recently got “cozy” with a younger man at an upfronts party, Real Housewives of New York star LuAnn de Lesseps was spotted sitting with her husband, Alexandre Count de Lesseps, and causing a stir during dinner at Brio in New York. “They were loud; people were definitely looking,” an onlooker tells us of the tense scene at the Italian restaurant. “The count looked furious and she was leaning back in her chair.” Adds the onlooker: “He was swearing and in a raised voice kept repeating to his wife, ‘You don’t understand reality, you’re consumed by the show!'” But the couple denied any strife on the red carpet at the American Image Awards. “Alex and I are very happily married, and we’re very much together,” the countess tells us. And her husband added: “I rarely speak about private matters, but I do agree strongly with that.”

 

There goes Luann, telling her fairytale version of how she was happily married, while getting "cozy" with another man, but then lying about the happy state of her marriage. When it comes to Luann, one thing is for sure, if her lips are moving then she is lying. 

[WireWrap]

1 hour ago, Mindthinkr said:

I also recall that the guy that Luanne brought back for the ONS was married. I think that Heather was the one to tell Lu this and she just seemed to shrug it off. I think it was shown just before the "Be cool" comment. 

It was Kristen that told Luann that her guy was married, not Heather. Oh, and the fact that he was married was on him, not Luann.

[zoeysmom]

48 minutes ago, Wendy said:

Maybe because every RHNY has known about Luann's escapades for years.  They have hinted at it, they have out loud said it, but yet most viewers only go but what has been on the show. 

Luann has given this sugar-coated version of how her marriage was not an "open marriage", that it was only the Count cheating on her and she couldn't do anything about it, but that is definitely not true. They did have an open marriage by all indications and reports and her castmates know all about it, so when a strange man shows up at the house, given the precedents, they were more inclined to believe it was Luann than Ramona IMO. 

The appalling part of that for me was not that Luann had sex with a guy but according to her own account she brought him to the house and after the deed was done, she sent him away, later she found out the guy was married and she was completely unconcerned with that fact. She didn't even flinch. 

More reports of Luann's activities 

http://people.com/tbd/caught-in-the-act-305/ 

Following New York Post reports that she recently got “cozy” with a younger man at an upfronts party, Real Housewives of New York star LuAnn de Lesseps was spotted sitting with her husband, Alexandre Count de Lesseps, and causing a stir during dinner at Brio in New York. “They were loud; people were definitely looking,” an onlooker tells us of the tense scene at the Italian restaurant. “The count looked furious and she was leaning back in her chair.” Adds the onlooker: “He was swearing and in a raised voice kept repeating to his wife, ‘You don’t understand reality, you’re consumed by the show!'” But the couple denied any strife on the red carpet at the American Image Awards. “Alex and I are very happily married, and we’re very much together,” the countess tells us. And her husband added: “I rarely speak about private matters, but I do agree strongly with that.”

 

There goes Luann, telling her fairytale version of how she was happily married, while getting "cozy" with another man, but then lying about the happy state of her marriage. When it comes to Luann, one thing is for sure, if her lips are moving then she is lying. 

Luann in her special said that when she moved back to the states, she pretty much knew it was the end of her marriage.  She also said she did not want to give others fodder to discuss her marriage and she and the Count were waiting for the right time to formally dissolve their marriage.   I am sure like many marriages, there are times you think you can make it work and it just doesn't happen. When this show first filmed, they made $7,500.00 for the entire season it was not a RH show and there was no guarantee it would go forward.  There really wasn't a lot of in depth discussion of their relationships.  I also remember Luann telling Kelly when she baring her soul about her marriage to Giles, and how he left her alone and isolated.  Listening to Kelly for the most part on the show Giles was always fabulous.  During the conversation Luann told Kelly when they don't love you anymore they don't love you anymore.     

The number of times these stories are characterized in a way that feeds the gossip mills is not a rarity.  It was just like so many people (including the cast) deciding Luann and Tom were entering into an open marriage and had an arrangement.  Recent history shows that just wasn't the case.  There are a lot of assumptions made-about the entire cast that just simply aren't quite true.

[gundysgirl]

6 hours ago, zoeysmom said:

Luann wasn't asked abut Heather's feelings-she was asked about hers. 

True, not then. But she did give her opinion about how others should feel about the dude being in the house. "Don't be all uncool" or something like that. 

[Chicklet]

Ok not exactly on topic but kind of is- is sex addiction really a thing? I know celebrities go to rehab for "sex addiction" in the press.

If Lu wasn't drinking too much would she be sleeping with these men? It would take a general anesthetic for me to consider Tom, just sayin.

[quaintirene]

27 minutes ago, WireWrap said:

 

1 hour ago, Mindthinkr said:

I also recall that the guy that Luanne brought back for the ONS was married. I think that Heather was the one to tell Lu this and she just seemed to shrug it off. I think it was shown just before the "Be cool" comment. 

It was Kristen that told Luann that her guy was married, not Heather. Oh, and the fact that he was married was on him, not Luann.

 

However, given that LuAnn has made it crystal clear that she ignores any woman who has any claim at all on any man she wants to bang, I’m not gonna give her a free pass on this.  Because if the guy says ‘I’m married, I hope you don’t mind about that’, her very likely answer is a shrug and ‘not really’.

[Celia Rubenstein]

7 minutes ago, WireWrap said:

Oh, and the fact that he was married was on him, not Luann.

It makes me SICK to hear people say things like this.

It is absolutely on you if you hook up with someone who is married. You may not technically be guilty of adultery but you are sure as hell  guilty of fucking someone else's husband. Split hairs all you want but it's the truth. And there is something morally WRONG with that.

It's worse if you know the man is married beforehand and you just don''t care, of course. But it's not much better if you are so loose that you end up finding out some random guy you bedded down with has a wife and you blow it off like it means nothing. All that says is you would have done it anyway even if you had  known.

I don't know if Luann knew the guy she brought home was married or not, but her reaction showed she couldn't have cared less either way. You might think that after her supposed heartbreak over the count cheating on her she would have awareness she was possibly a party to hurting another woman or care more about the institution of marriage. But not Luann. Just like some guys think with their little head, Luann thinks with her twat. 

Maybe it's the booze ... She just can't control herself when she's loaded. Either way, both her little weaknesses got her in deep shit this time. I look forward to seeing if treating one problem has any effect on the other.

[Rap541]

Quote

Oh, and the fact that he was married was on him, not Luann.

I have to agree with Celia on this on. I certainly think the guy bears MORE responsibility but if you find out you're fucking a married man and decide "well, his problem, not mine, I'm doing nothing wrong by banging him", that's pretty crappy behavior and a pretty crappy way to live.

Quote

I don't know if Luann knew the guy she brought home was married or not, but her reaction showed she couldn't have cared less either way. You might think that after her supposed heartbreak over the count cheating on her she would have awareness she was possibly a party to hurting another woman or care more about the institution of marriage. 

Pretty sure the Count's affair was with a woman who wasn't married. I assume Luann's view of his new fuck is "well, *she wasn't married so she's morally great when she fucked my husband" - oh wait, no, when Luann was the wronged wife, she wasn't all cool and positive about it. 

Quote

Just like some guys think with their little head, Luann thinks with her twat. 

This. Worse, when she's called out on it, she lies about it. 

[WireWrap]

1 hour ago, quaintirene said:

However, given that LuAnn has made it crystal clear that she ignores any woman who has any claim at all on any man she wants to bang, I’m not gonna give her a free pass on this.  Because if the guy says ‘I’m married, I hope you don’t mind about that’, her very likely answer is a shrug and ‘not really’.

What was she going to say/do when she finds out after the fact that he is married? That he is married is totally on him, especially when the "other" woman doesn't know.

[hoodooznoodooz]

3 minutes ago, WireWrap said:

What was she going to say/do when she finds out after the fact that he is married? That he is married is totally on him, especially when the "other" woman doesn't know.

Wirewrap, I suspect that you are a very authentic friend! You are so loyal. I admire that. More posters are bashing Lu than not, but you are kindly defending her. I think your friends are lucky to have you in their lives. 

Back to Lu: you are correct, however, if I were in that situation, I think I would feel remorse or regret. I would not just shrug it off. There was a spouse out there who would be hurt by something that I took part in. But Lu almost looked amused. 

[quaintirene]

9 minutes ago, WireWrap said:

1 hour ago, quaintirene said:

However, given that LuAnn has made it crystal clear that she ignores any woman who has any claim at all on any man she wants to bang, I’m not gonna give her a free pass on this.  Because if the guy says ‘I’m married, I hope you don’t mind about that’, her very likely answer is a shrug and ‘not really’.

What was she going to say/do when she finds out after the fact that he is married? That he is married is totally on him, especially when the "other" woman doesn't know.

It’s on him.  But her previous pattern of behaviour is on her.  She sees a guy she wants, she’ll take him if she can.  Whether he is with another woman/married/whatever.  This does not exculpate the guy in these situations.  If you’re out on a date and ditch her because LuAnn is waving her panties in the air from the toilets area, that is heinous.  But the issue, IMO, is this: would LuAnn give a shit if he said to her ‘I’m married!’ beforehand.  I respectfully submit that she wouldn’t.

[Rap541]

Quote

What was she going to say/do when she finds out after the fact that he is married? 

Stop seeing him?

And if she routinely finds herself discovering that the man she's just fucked is married, she can take one of two paths.

1. Make more of an effort to vet her dates before she spreads her legs.

or

2. Continue to shit care less about anything but getting her itch scratched and declare "I have no responsibility to check if the man I haul home for a fuck is married!"

I mean, Luann has pratted for years how she's classy. A classy broad doesn't cheerfully fuck married man and use the "Because I *can*, dahling" excuse without needing to accept the backlash of "she's a woman who will fuck your man even if she knows he's married".

And honestly, I can see the "I didn't know he was married" excuse getting hauled out maybe a few times before I start to question just why someone has ended up with so many married men without knowing. Accidents happen, but when they keep happening, it starts to look intentional. 

[Celia Rubenstein]

8 minutes ago, quaintirene said:

It’s on him.  But her previous pattern of behaviour is on her.  She sees a guy she wants, she’ll take him if she can.  Whether he is with another woman/married/whatever.  This does not exculpate the guy in these situations.  

Exactly ... nobody is suggesting that holding a knowing (or callous, careless) woman accountable means you are excusing the married man's behavior. 

Likewise, the married man's bad behavior doesn't mean the knowing/uncaring woman he cheated with is off the hook for her actions.

Adults are held responsible for what they knowingly or carelessly do in every other situation in life. This one is no different.

Luann has absolutely no compunction about fucking the husbands of other women. She cannot hide behind ignorance when she clearly demonstrated she wouldn't have given a damn either way. Her willingness to participate in an act of infidelity but whine when it happens to her makes her not only a cheap floozie but a hypocrite as well.

[WireWrap]

12 minutes ago, hoodooznoodooz said:

Wirewrap, I suspect that you are a very authentic friend! You are so loyal. I admire that. More posters are bashing Lu than not, but you are kindly defending her. I think your friends are lucky to have you in their lives. 

Back to Lu: you are correct, however, if I were in that situation, I think I would feel remorse or regret. I would not just shrug it off. There was a spouse out there who would be hurt by something that I took part in. But Lu almost looked amused. 

Thanks. I like Luann but I don't always agree with her. LOL When Kirsten announced that the guy was married, Luann didn't say/do anything until Sonja made a joke about it, then she laughed about it, so I didn't think she knew at the time. Then at the reunion she admitted she knew but that he told her he was separated from his wife and I think she puts those guys into a different category, separated = datable. I suspect that as long as the guy isn't married/living with his wife she is fine dating/hooking up with them and we have no knowledge that she has dated a guy she knew was married and cheating on his wife. I'm not saying that she is right in her beliefs, because some guys will lie about their marriage status and that is on them, not the unknowing woman unless she keeps seeing/sleeping with him after she finds out the truth. 

4 minutes ago, quaintirene said:

It’s on him.  But her previous pattern of behaviour is on her.  She sees a guy she wants, she’ll take him if she can.  Whether he is with another woman/married/whatever.  This does not exculpate the guy in these situations.  If you’re out on a date and ditch her because LuAnn is waving her panties in the air from the toilets area, that is heinous.  But the issue, IMO, is this: would LuAnn give a shit if he said to her ‘I’m married!’ beforehand.  I respectfully submit that she wouldn’t.

What pattern? That she will go after a man, who is not married/engaged/living with a woman to her knowledge, that she wants/is attracted too is bad? And when have we ever seen Luann waving around her panties to attract a guy, let alone waving them from a bathroom? I do think she would stop if they guy told her he was married/cheating on his wife, she knows that pain all too well. Again, if the guy lies to her, or any woman, that is on them, not Luann/the woman.

1 minute ago, Rap541 said:

Stop seeing him?

And if she routinely finds herself discovering that the man she's just fucked is married, she can take one of two paths.

1. Make more of an effort to vet her dates before she spreads her legs.

or

2. Continue to shit care less about anything but getting her itch scratched and declare "I have no responsibility to check if the man I haul home for a fuck is married!"

I mean, Luann has pratted for years how she's classy. A classy broad doesn't cheerfully fuck married man and use the "Because I *can*, dahling" excuse without needing to accept the backlash of "she's a woman who will fuck your man even if she knows he's married".

And honestly, I can see the "I didn't know he was married" excuse getting hauled out maybe a few times before I start to question just why someone has ended up with so many married men without knowing. Accidents happen, but when they keep happening, it starts to look intentional. 

She had a ONS with the guy, she didn't date him! And how exactly is any woman supposed to "check", are you supposed to ask for references first and then call said references? 

Just now, Celia Rubenstein said:

Exactly ... nobody is suggesting that holding a knowing (or callous, careless) woman accountable means you are excusing the married man's behavior. 

Likewise, the married man's bad behavior doesn't mean the knowing/uncaring woman he cheated with is off the hook for her actions.

Adults are held responsible for what they knowingly or carelessly do in every other situation in life. This one is no different.

Luann has absolutely no compunction about fucking the husbands of other women. She cannot hide behind ignorance when she clearly demonstrated she wouldn't have given a damn either way. Her willingness to participate in an act of infidelity but whine when it happens to her makes her not only a cheap floozie but a hypocrite as well.

What other "married" man has Luann slept with that we know about? None that I have heard/read about. This was a 1 night stand where the guy lied to Luann, the blame falls solely on him, not her.  

[Rap541]

Quote

And how exactly is any woman supposed to "check", are you supposed to ask for references first and then call said references? 

I've asked men if they are married before I go out.  It's called minimal effort if I have a suspicion something isn't quite right. There's also looking for a wedding ring, and checking with friends if they know the guy. There is even, these days, checking on social media. These are all minimal effort things that reveal marital status pretty easily.

[film noire]

35 minutes ago, WireWrap said:

 And when have we ever seen Luann waving around her panties to attract a guy, let alone waving them from a bathroom?

And how exactly is any woman supposed to "check", are you supposed to ask for references first and then call said references? 

Yes! It's the new Slut Code!  1) Check marital status. 2) Call reference while waving panties.  3) If all checks out, you're still a slut for having a one night stand ; )

Edited January 1, 2018 by film noire

[Celia Rubenstein]

3 minutes ago, WireWrap said:

 Then at the reunion she admitted she knew but that he told her he was separated from his wife and I think she puts those guys into a different category, separated = datable. 

I think hooking up with a guy who is separated may actually be more repugnant than merely screwing a married man in general because you are interfering in a marriage that is clearly troubled enough already and you are totally contributing to its final demise. By offering up the pussy so readily, Luann is helping drive the last nails in the coffin.

Let a couple at least file for divorce before you hop on that peen, Luann! 

 

18 minutes ago, WireWrap said:

When Kirsten announced that the guy was married, Luann didn't say/do anything until Sonja made a joke about it, then she laughed about it, so I didn't think she knew at the time. Then at the reunion she admitted she knew but that he told her he was separated from his wife

It was Luann's shitty, smug little laugh that showed she couldn't have cared less if the guy was married. What the hell was so funny? She should have been shame-faced, mortified. But she knew better than to even try and fake that, I guess. She knew all the women in the room were too aware of her reputation to tolerate such a gesture from her with a straight face. 

Her coming up with that "separated" garbage was just an attempt to look like less of a maneater at the reunion.  She'd been lambasted for what she did and she needed an excuse. It's obvious because if she knew the guy was separated - and it makes such a crucial difference -  why didn't she point this out when she was told he was married ??????

[Rap541]

Heh, mock me all you like. I've never had any problem asking someone if they're married if they're trying to pick me up at a bar or what not because I don't like men who cheat. I don't like liars either and if they lie about being married, I dump them because I don't want a lying man. If that makes me a slut following the Slut code, well, thanks for the title. 

[lunastartron]

Didn't Bethenny describe Dennis as "separated" when first revealing their relationship on social media?

[film noire]

9 minutes ago, Rap541 said:

Heh, mock me all you like. 

Nobody is mocking you; I'm mocking the idea of a Slut Code replacing Luann's Girl Code.

Quote

I've never had any problem asking someone if they're married if they're trying to pick me up at a bar or what not because I don't like men who cheat.

But men lie, so there' s no way to actually check their status (and thus WW's very funny idea of references.)

Quote

If that makes me a slut following the Slut code, well, thanks for the title. 

It has nothing to do with your private life, RAP541 -- as long as it's safe and happy, whatever floats your boat is how I see other people's sexual code ; )

Edited January 1, 2018 by film noire

[Celia Rubenstein]

5 minutes ago, Rap541 said:

Heh, mock me all you like. I've never had any problem asking someone if they're married if they're trying to pick me up at a bar or what not because I don't like men who cheat. I don't like liars either and if they lie about being married, I dump them because I don't want a lying man. If that makes me a slut following the Slut code, well, thanks for the title. 

You actually CARE if someone is married, RAP541. That's the difference between you and Luann. A guy may still lie, but at least you will have done your due diligence.  Luann doesn't give a shit - clearly demonstrated by the fact that the guy only told her he was separated after he got back to the house, this according to her own words.

In other words, Luann brought him home having not ascertained jack shit about his marital status. Because she didn't care.

[Rap541]

Quote

But men lie, so there' s no way to actually check their status. (and thus the idea of references).

If something has to be one hundred percent fool proof to be a valid help, then you're correct.

But I am talking about minimal effort. Making the minimal effort of checking your guy's social media, asking him directly if he's married and maybe asking around is not much expect a woman to do if she genuinely cares whether or not she's dating a married man.

Nothing is is 100 percent full proof so we should all do nothing at all to prevent it seems like an endorsement of foolish behavior. Luann seems like a bright woman, so I have difficulty granting her a defense of "I made no effort at all and how could i have known he was married, I'm innocent because I made no effort to give a damn who i was fucking".

Quote

Luann brought him home having not ascertained jack shit about his marital status. Because she didn't care.

This. Thanks Celia, for summing it up. She didn't care. I don't consider that a classy position to take on her part. 

[film noire]

1 hour ago, lunastartron said:

Didn't Bethenny describe Dennis as "separated" when first revealing their relationship on social media?

Yes -- and she made a big deal out of it at the reunion as well, iirc (didn't she say the word over and over in Luann's face?)

Quote

In other words, Luann brought him home having not ascertained jack shit about his marital status. Because she didn't care.

Or she asked/he lied. 

Or she didn't ask because she knows men always lie about it (when's the last time GQ wrote a column entitled "Always Admit You're Married When Bar-Hopping"? ; )  This wasn't a dating situation for Luann, it was a ONS. If she'd been seeing a guy for three months, that would be one thing; a fling is another, imo.

 @Rap541 -- I'm curious -- do you just take their word for it? (I myself never trusted anything a man said to me in a bar, from "You're the most beautiful girl I've ever seen!" to "I've been tested!" to "I'm a Taurus as well!" to "I LOVE poetry!" : ) 

And checking social media isn't fool-proof, either; any married man routinely on the prowl will have that covered. 

Edited January 1, 2018 by film noire

[Rap541]

Quote

 @RAP541 -- I'm curious -- do you just take their word for it? 

Depends on the guy. 

And you'd actually be surprised at how many men, looking for a ONS as you call it, are actually pretty honest about their marital status and what they want.

Of course, nothing is one hundred percent fool proof but if that's the criteria required to even try - ie, if it's not 100 percent then don't even bother,  then you're absolutely right and no woman should ever even bother since they can't get that 100 percent guarantee that they will get an honest answer.

But I clearly defined it as a minimal effort. If a woman gives a shit about such things, there are many ways to make a minimal effort to make sure you're not taking home a married man. If Luann doesn't care to make such efforts, then she doesn't, but she's a woman who doesn't care if she fucks someone else's husband and needs to own it. 

[film noire]

3 hours ago, Rap541 said:

I clearly defined it as a minimal effort. If a woman gives a shit about such things, there are many ways to make a minimal effort to make sure you're not taking home a married man. 

Thanks for answering.

eta: The guy told Luann he was separated (Nobody knows if Luann asked or not, or if the guy lied or not; and)  and we do know they weren't dating (or even on a 'date') with time to check out somebody's possible cover story. But (the bigger issue for me) is that if he cheated on his wife, imo, that's all on him. No woman -- Luann or othewise -- should be held retroactively responsible for not knowing what most married men hide when hitting on a woman. 

Edited January 1, 2018 by film noire

[Celia Rubenstein]

17 minutes ago, film noire said:

Or she asked/he lied. 

Or she didn't ask because she knows men always lie about it 

 @Rap541

IIRC what Luann said was that when they were on the patio talking, he revealed that he was separated and they discussed their marriages which each other.  Which doesn't sound to me like she put a whole lot of work into ascertaining his situation before she invited him back to the love shack.  It just wasn't important enough for her to bother with, I guess.

As far as the theory that Lu didn't ask because "there's no point in asking because men always lie" then she is just utilizing the strategy of willful blindness, which does zero to exonerate her for her role in things. 

2 minutes ago, film noire said:

 But (the bigger issue for me) is that if he cheated on his wife, imo, that's all on him.

See this is the thing ... of course his cheating on his wife is on him.

What's on Lu is that she engaged in xyz sexual behavior with a man who is married. It's totally separate from his act of adultery toward his wife. His act of wrongdoing may be greater than Lu's in the grand scheme of things, but it doesn't mean that Lu is without guilt, that is if she knew he was married or turned a blind eye.

[Rap541]

Quote

As far as the theory that Lu didn't ask because "there's no point in asking because men always lie" then she is just utilizing the strategy of willful blindness, which does zero to exonerate her for her role in things. 

Yeah, again I have to agree.

And I really don't know that I agree that a one night stand is some sort of hands off situation where all morality is turned off for the night. A one night stand is two people getting together but not necessarily expecting any commitment. That there's no permanent commitment doesn't mean all bets are off.

If Luann doesn't care, no one can make her but "I don't care if my one night stands are with married men" says a lot about her character.

[Celia Rubenstein]

1 minute ago, Rap541 said:

And I really don't know that I agree that a one night stand is some sort of hands off situation where all morality is turned off for the night. A one night stand is two people getting together but not necessarily expecting any commitment. That there's no permanent commitment doesn't mean all bets are off.

I'm gonna need someone to clarify this for me ... what other rules of morality are not applicable to one night stands?

Can I screw my best friend's man if I only do it once?  I mean, it's not like we're dating.

Can I sleep with my boss in exchange for a promotion if it's just the one time? 

What about blackmail? Like if I can get the guy to let me do something really humiliating to him and videotape it, can I use that to extort money from him? It's not like we're in a relationship.

I'm asking for a friend.

[film noire]

2 hours ago, Celia Rubenstein said:

It's totally separate from his act of adultery toward his wife. 

Not exactly (because his marital status is controlling your condemnation of her) but if they talked about it, and he told her he was separated, then (to me) his status is nowhere near that of a man living with his wife - but since we disagree about judging women who sleep with/have relationships with separated men, we'll just have to agree to disagree about this ; )

Edited January 1, 2018 by film noire

[film noire]

58 minutes ago, Rap541 said:

I really don't know that I agree that a one night stand is some sort of hands off situation where all morality is turned off for the night. 

I don't think anybody here said a ONS = "all morality is turned off for the night".

I think what's been said is that asking a woman to run some version of  an on-the-fly background check (asking a guy in a bar his marital status/then checking his answer with friends/ then checking his answer on social media) is something far more suited to a dating situation, not a one night stand. 

If a guy lies to you, and lies well, and you believe the lie, that's not your fault.  If a guy says he's separated and he's not, still not your fault. Asking women to be a one-person detective agency -- on a night out on the town -- to stop men from cheating feels unrealistic.  It's also, imo, an unfair burden being put on women, instead of  the person lying about being married. 

Edited January 1, 2018 by film noire

[Rap541]

Quote

So, of a guy lies then it is still the woman's fault/responsibility to inquire further? 

To me? If I make an effort, and he lies, while I might feel dumb for falling for his lies, I did make a minimal effort to not be "the other woman".

Quote

What if that guy told Luann he/his wife were separated, getting a divorce, does that then change it?

"Seperated" and "getting a divorce" means "still married. If Luann doesn't care that she's fucking a married man after he tells her that he is still married but seperated or "getting a divorce", she's knowingly banging a married man and needs to own it. I don't screw with seperated or "getting a divorce" guys because frankly, this is where its almost always a lie on the guy's part. 

But yes, if a man tells Luann he is seperated or getting a divorce, that indeed changes things because then Luann knows she's willfully choosing to fuck a married man. 

Quote

And, again, how is one suppose to verify he is telling the truth to begin with? 

If it's a concern, you make the effort, if it's not a concern, then you don't bother. I didn't say it was 100 percent fool proof so if it absolutely has to 100 percent work to make it valid to you to bother, you won't find it. I called it minimal effort - if you (the general you) or Luann don't want to make a minimal effort,then don't but if Luann doesn't want to make a minimal effort to make sure she isn't with a married man, then she's a woman who doesn't care who she fucks. 

Quote

This is the married persons responsibility, not the single persons.

I certainly agree that the married person has the responsibility to not commit adultery, but single people have some responsibility to know who they're banging. Even one night stands can have long term consequences. If someone single cares about who they are banging, they make a minimal effort to get to know the person before they take off their clothes.

If it matters to a single person whether they are having sex with a married person or not, there are things that can be done. If Luann doesn't want to bother, thats on her. 

Put another way - if I pick up some man in a bar, and ask him if he's single and he says yes, I check his social media while we're going to the hotel room and it says single, we screw like wild mink, and then his wife shows up - I might feel bad for her because not only is her husband a lousy cheat, but he's a liar as well. But *I* made a minimal effort to not have a one night stand with a married man. My conscious is clean

Quote

Does this mean that Luann was correct at the reunion 2 years ago, that Bethenny did break up and continues to interfere with the Shields marriage. After all, he has yet to even file for divorce, which would make her behavior even more repugnant that Luann's ONS according to you. If so, then why are we slut shaming Luann when there is someone committing a far more egregious act currently? 

I assume we weren't discussing Bethenny because this is the thread for Luann?

Edited January 1, 2018 by Rap541

[Celia Rubenstein]

12 minutes ago, film noire said:

Not exactly (because his status is controlling your condemnation of her) but if they talked about, and he told her he was separated, then (to me) his status is nowhere near that of a man living with his wife  - but since we disagree about judging women who sleep with/have relationships with separated men, we'll just have to agree to disagree about this ; )

You say "judging" like it's a bad thing, lol. As if all the other housewives don't get judged ...

Maybe I'm a bad person, but I have no problem judging the living shit out of all of the women who put their lives on my teevee to make a buck. Ramona gets judged for being cruel and crazy. Sonja gets judged for being a drunken deadbeat. Carole gets judged for being a hipster twit.  Bethenny gets the piss judged out of her for virtually every move she makes.

What goes down with the geese is good for the gander. Luann ain't special. Her deal happens to be getting drunk and mounting anything with a dick. Imma judge the hell out of her for it!

 

6 minutes ago, WireWrap said:

Does this mean that Luann was correct at the reunion 2 years ago, that Bethenny did break up and continues to interfere with the Shields marriage.

Why yes, yes it does. And I have said as much. 

I have consistently berated Bethenny for her involvement with Mrs. Shields' husband (as I have repeatedly, consistently referred to him in her thread).

Look, nobody has to like or agree with my opinion of Luann. But there's no denying that my values are consistent ... I don't have one set of rules for one housewife I like and a different set for one I don't. 

Gotcha moment : denied!  LOL

9 minutes ago, WireWrap said:

If so, then why are we slut shaming Luann when there is someone committing a far more egregious act currently?

... because it is fun to discuss someone besides Bethenny for a change? LOL 

As I have already explained, I don't think that one housewife's bad behavior trumps, negates, mitigates or in any way nullifies the bad behavior of another housewife. It is entirely possible to disapprove of two of them for the same thing simultaneously. 

[film noire]

15 minutes ago, Celia Rubenstein said:

I have no problem judging the living shit out of all of the women who put their lives on my teevee to make a buck.

Me neither --  I just don't judge Luann in this instance (sleeping with a separated man and taking his word for it).

Marrying an anti-Semite and having kids with him? = 

Edited January 1, 2018 by film noire

[ShawnaLanne]

5 hours ago, WireWrap said:

It was Kristen that told Luann that her guy was married, not Heather. Oh, and the fact that he was married was on him, not Luann.

He had a ring on. Yes,  he cheated,  it's his, but she legitimately has no Fs to give for anyone but herself. She's trash. 

[Neeners]

Any new news on the arrest?