Bethenny & Jason: The Divorce Showdown

[Otherkate]

1 hour ago, WireWrap said:

Since we don't know the specifics of the custody agreement, there is nothing to say that Jason taking Bryn to Mass when he has her is against the agreement. Again, he isn't trying to force Bethenny to take her to Mass or for Bethenny to convert to RC. Also, has it occurred to anyone that maybe Bryn wants to go to Mass, that this is her choice? 

No, no, I never said that at all! I never postulated that it was against the agreement - I'm assuming it's in there somewhere. If Jason's religion is important to him, I'm sure he insisted on having the ability (wIthin the confines of what was detailed) to take Bryn to church when she is with him. I was addressing the speculation that suddenly Bethenny was giving him grief about how often he could take her to church etc while he suffers in silence with his only desire to simply help his child find the Holy Spirit or something. My assumption is that there is no wiggle room or room for speculation. I think it's probably laid out in the custody agreement and either both of them abide by it or one could take the other to task for not doing so. I'm just saying it's probably not something that is up for debate at this point. If he has been given certain terms and Bethenny is giving him problems about what was agreed upon, he should take it to his lawyer. If he's going above and beyond what was agreed upon and she's uncomfortable with it, she should take it to hers. These things are pretty simple if you follow the rules of engagement. Doesn't mean they aren't frustrating though. Trust me, I could write a book. 

[SCS]

2 hours ago, Celia Rubenstein said:

.... that is the definition of speculation.

I'm not knockin' you for it or anything.  I speculate for a living in this thread.  I'm a professional speculator!  That's how I know it when I see it! 

O, Celia, you are my friend. Even when, in case you hadn't  heard, we don't know anything. LOL OMG DVM (<<this last in honor of Cookie the Tormented.)

Edited June 27, 2017 by steelcitysister

[BBHN]

Quote

I was addressing the speculation that suddenly Bethenny was giving him grief about how often he could take her to church etc while he suffers in silence with his only desire to simply help his child find the Holy Spirit or something

Bwah!

[QuinnM]

As we slowly creep toward zero hour when all will become clear I imagine the collective seizure if for some reason the trial is delayed another 2 months out.

Lets all put thoughts into the universe that it proceeds as planned.  That everyone including the dog walker gets time on the stand.  That Page Six has a reporter live tweeting the mess.  That TMZ provides us all with links to the actual emails entered into evidence.  

But just in case make sure you are current on your heart medication, that you have a soft place to land as you faint dead away at the thought of waiting another minute for the conclusion.

[ZoloftBlob]

Yes.... One Day Til Zyra! A death like hush envelopes the world....

[Celia Rubenstein]

Quote

I was addressing the speculation that suddenly Bethenny was giving him grief about how often he could take her to church etc while he suffers in silence with his only desire to simply help his child find the Holy Spirit or something

 

9 minutes ago, BBHN said:

Bwah!

I think you mean "AMEN!"  And of course in a *nice* way because its impossible to mean "I will pray for you," "bless your heart," or "amen" in a rude, condescending, or sarcastic fashion.  It can't!  It came from the bible! 

[lunastartron]

1 hour ago, ZoloftBlob said:

No, Celia is right on this point. Asking for sole custody is not the same thing as Bethenny saying "I don't want Jason to ever be allowed to see Bryn."

Wirewrap - you're forming an opinion based on events, and that's fine, but that is not Bethenny actually saying she wanted Bryn to never see her father again, that's you speculating that is what Bethenny wants.

There's a difference.

Bethenny admitted under cross that she threatened Jason she would ensure he would never see his daughter.

[BBHN]

Quote

A death like hush envelopes the world....

PTV posters who post on this thread be like

Quote

I think you mean "AMEN!"  And of course in a *nice* way because its impossible to mean "I will pray for you," "bless your heart," or "amen" in a rude, condescending, or sarcastic fashion.  It can't!  It came from the bible! 

Or...

[zoeysmom]

4 minutes ago, lunastartron said:

Bethenny admitted under cross that she threatened Jason she would ensure he would never see his daughter.

Actually Luna she admitted it on direct-Jason's attorney never had a chance to cross examine her.  She took a recess and then a week or so later settled. 

[BBHN]

Honestly, this trial is like the Superbowl for RHONY viewers.

[ZoloftBlob]

Under cross examination where?

The major bitch point of the last court appearance was that Bethenny testified and then settled before she could be crossed.

Mind you - I think Bethenny is an awful person but the point here is that people be speculating and insisting it's fact... like Betheny being cross examined somewhere.

[lunastartron]

3 minutes ago, zoeysmom said:

Actually Luna she admitted it on direct-Jason's attorney never had a chance to cross examine her.  She took a recess and then a week or so later settled. 

 

1 minute ago, ZoloftBlob said:

Under cross examination where?

The major bitch point of the last court appearance was that Bethenny testified and then settled before she could be crossed.

Mind you - I think Bethenny is an awful person but the point here is that people be speculating and insisting it's fact... like Betheny being cross examined somewhere.

Thank you, zoeysmom, for the correction! 

I was wrong about cross vs direct.

But Bethenny told Jason he would never see Bryn again. It's not just speculation. 

[zoeysmom]

Just now, lunastartron said:

 

Thank you, zoeysmom, for the correction! 

I was wrong about cross vs direct.

But Bethenny told Jason he would never see Bryn again. It's not just speculation. 

You are correct and she said it under oath!!!!!!!!

[ZoloftBlob]

And has that happened? :)

I mean, Jason said "I will destroy you" in front of witnesses, so how seriously should we be taking that threat? :)

[Celia Rubenstein]

Quote

It's not just speculation.

 No, what it is was an empty threat that unfortunately lots of people make when they are going through a bitter divorce.  

 

5 minutes ago, ZoloftBlob said:

And has that happened? :)

I mean, Jason said "I will destroy you" in front of witnesses, so how seriously should we be taking that threat? :)

Do you not understand that the threats Bethenny got mad and made count against her, but the ones made by Jason are completely understandable and should not be held against him?  C'mon Zoloft, try and keep up lol  

[KungFuBunny]

8 hours ago, Jel said:

I eagerly await the debate on Chez smores!  ;)

I mean really, did she mean "in her apartment building"? I think so. If she's accusing Jason of being a baddy for doing exactly what she regularly did herself, that would seem to make her case a lil frivolous.

I don't think she's that deluded, but time will tell I guess.

Sorry no can do...the abode is currently occupied by Chez Douche

There's some sort of trust, we'll have to wait 4 years to find out it's an illegal document created by fraudulent behavior.

It's also not the Douche's fault, he was just listening to his mommy

Edited June 27, 2017 by KungFuBunny

[SCS]

1 hour ago, KungFuBunny said:

he was just listening to his mommy

 

That's right -- blame the mommy, you Evil Bunny.

[WireWrap]

2 hours ago, ZoloftBlob said:

No, Celia is right on this point. Asking for sole custody is not the same thing as Bethenny saying "I don't want Jason to ever be allowed to see Bryn."

Wirewrap - you're forming an opinion based on events, and that's fine, but that is not Bethenny actually saying she wanted Bryn to never see her father again, that's you speculating that is what Bethenny wants.

There's a difference.

She admitted to it in her court testimony during the custody trial, so No, it is not just my "opinion"! LOL

1 hour ago, Celia Rubenstein said:

.... that is the definition of speculation.

I'm not knockin' you for it or anything.  I speculate for a living in this thread.  I'm a professional speculator!  That's how I know it when I see it! 

See my answer above, again, this was not speculation or just my opinion, it came from Bethenny's mouth and she admitted to it when she testified in court. 

58 minutes ago, ShawnaLanne said:

So you know that she was totally onboard with the kid going to Church every Sunday because she let her child be Baptized. I'm.  Yeah.  

I never said,  she said it.  But ya know,  99 percent of half intelligent people I know in this world who are of a different religion talk about it.  So she's this controlling bitch everywhere else,  but about religion? Okay.  

If she didn't want Bryn baptized in the Catholic church she would have stopped it like she did when their nanny tried to have it done in her church without her/Jason's approval. 

44 minutes ago, steelcitysister said:

 

Well, thanks for clearing it up. LOL

Your Welcome! And when any of us finally get to read the pre-nup, the custody arrangement or the final divorce papers, we can all end the speculation that has gone on with both sides. Not just Bethenny's self serving tid bits but the truth. LOL

40 minutes ago, Otherkate said:

No, no, I never said that at all! I never postulated that it was against the agreement - I'm assuming it's in there somewhere. If Jason's religion is important to him, I'm sure he insisted on having the ability (wIthin the confines of what was detailed) to take Bryn to church when she is with him. I was addressing the speculation that suddenly Bethenny was giving him grief about how often he could take her to church etc while he suffers in silence with his only desire to simply help his child find the Holy Spirit or something. My assumption is that there is no wiggle room or room for speculation. I think it's probably laid out in the custody agreement and either both of them abide by it or one could take the other to task for not doing so. I'm just saying it's probably not something that is up for debate at this point. If he has been given certain terms and Bethenny is giving him problems about what was agreed upon, he should take it to his lawyer. If he's going above and beyond what was agreed upon and she's uncomfortable with it, she should take it to hers. These things are pretty simple if you follow the rules of engagement. Doesn't mean they aren't frustrating though. Trust me, I could write a book. 

Sorry, I misunderstood what you wrote/meant, I thought you said there was an agreement. I don't know where this idea that Bethenny is upset at Jason for taking Bryn to church when he has her came from but it wasn't me either. That said, I wouldn't put it past her to complain about it now, she doesn't like that he is in Bryn's life to begin with. 

20 minutes ago, lunastartron said:

Bethenny admitted under cross that she threatened Jason she would ensure he would never see his daughter.

THANK YOU except it was when her own lawyer was questioning her on the stand. Bethenny settled before Jason's Lawyer had a chance to ask her anything. 

[zoeysmom]

8 minutes ago, ZoloftBlob said:

And has that happened? :)

I mean, Jason said "I will destroy you" in front of witnesses, so how seriously should we be taking that threat? :)

To me, it just illustrates then when angry these two both make threats.  I don't believe either one of them truly means what the say in the literal sense.  I don't believe Bethenny really thinks she would never want Jason to see their daughter again and I don't believe Jason really wants to destroy Bethenny's public persona. 

The major difference is, the one thing one should never do is threaten to take the child out of  the other's life.  I get someone saying something that is pretty stupid in the heat of battle and it goes more to weighing how damaged they are emotionally by these "threats".

There needs to be a truce and they need to both admit things are better when they are not in contact with each other.  Obviously for the last five months child custody exchanges have worked just fine without contact between the two.

[WireWrap]

23 minutes ago, ZoloftBlob said:

And has that happened? :)

I mean, Jason said "I will destroy you" in front of witnesses, so how seriously should we be taking that threat? :)

This fight isn't over, so Yes, she may actually try to force him out of Bryn's life. 

17 minutes ago, KungFuBunny said:

Sorry no can do...the abode is currently occupied by Chez Douche

There's some sort of trust, we'll have to wait 4 years to find out it's an illegal document created by fraudulent behavior.

It's also not the Douche's fault, he was just listening to his mommy

What you actually mean is, She is acting just like her Mommy, Bernadette!

[ZoloftBlob]

Quote

This fight isn't over, so Yes, she may actually try to force him out of Bryn's life. 

Jason said "I will destroy you" in front of witnesses - how seriously should we be taking that?

I mean, I don't want to speculate but if Jason destroys Bethenny, won't that force her out of Bryn's life? Since she'd be dead or worse?

[Celia Rubenstein]

5 minutes ago, WireWrap said:

She admitted to it in her court testimony during the custody trial, so No, it is not just my "opinion"! LOL

See my answer above, again, this was not speculation or just my opinion, it came from Bethenny's mouth and she admitted to it when she testified in court. 

But it was "just your opinion" when you said it because you didn't know she had admitted saying that in court until someone just told us all here.  HA!

You ARE still guilty of speculation, @Wirewrap.  Report to the stocks in the town square this instant for your punishment!  

LOL I'm just needlin' ya!  As I already posted, I love me some speculation.  I do it all the time.  

[WireWrap]

3 minutes ago, ZoloftBlob said:

Jason said "I will destroy you" in front of witnesses - how seriously should we be taking that?

I mean, I don't want to speculate but if Jason destroys Bethenny, won't that force her out of Bryn's life? Since she'd be dead or worse?

I guess if he said it then she needs to worry but again, we only have her word he said it.

1 minute ago, Celia Rubenstein said:

But it was "just your opinion" when you said it because you didn't know she had admitted saying that in court until someone just told us all here.  HA!

You ARE still guilty of speculation, @Wirewrap.  Report to the stocks in the town square this instant for your punishment!  

LOL I'm just needlin' ya!  As I already posted, I love me some speculation.  I do it all the time.  

No, I knew she said it but I admit I could not remember when she said it, if it was in court or before she testified. 

They said I didn't win the prize because I remembered part of it. LOL

I still believe that Bethenny made the decision to divorce Jason and take/get full custody of Bryn when he refused to move to LA. Something in her changed at that moment, she went cold, stone cold and never looked back. 

[ZoloftBlob]

Quote

I still believe that Bethenny made the decision to divorce Jason and take/get full custody of Bryn when he refused to move to LA. Something in her changed at that moment, she went cold, stone cold and never looked back. 

And this is fact or speculation? :)

[Celia Rubenstein]

4 minutes ago, WireWrap said:

No, I knew she said it but I admit I could not remember when she said it, if it was in court or before she testified. 

... a likely story.  LOL!

 

5 minutes ago, ZoloftBlob said:

And this is fact or speculation? :)

Touche'!

[Martinigirl]

Maybe she went stone cold because he didn't follow the apostrophe rule. 

[WireWrap]

6 minutes ago, ZoloftBlob said:

And this is fact or speculation? :)

Opinion! My opinion after watching Bethenny over the years. She really is easy to figure out, it is her way or the highway. LOL

5 minutes ago, Martinigirl said:

Maybe she went stone cold because he didn't follow the apostrophe rule. 

The what?

[ShawnaLanne]

2 hours ago, QuinnM said:

As we slowly creep toward zero hour when all will become clear I imagine the collective seizure if for some reason the trial is delayed another 2 months out.

Lets all put thoughts into the universe that it proceeds as planned.  That everyone including the dog walker gets time on the stand.  That Page Six has a reporter live tweeting the mess.  That TMZ provides us all with links to the actual emails entered into evidence.  

But just in case make sure you are current on your heart medication, that you have a soft place to land as you faint dead away at the thought of waiting another minute for the conclusion.

Since we're putting it out there I'd also like a Watch What Happens Live with Bethany on Thursday or Sunday where she dances around the topic but gives answers with facial expression and body language.

[Celia Rubenstein]

2 hours ago, BBHN said:

Honestly, this trial is like the Superbowl for RHONY viewers.

The trial is going to be televised worldwide, right?  

I am on the west coast so I guess I will have to set my alarm clock at 5 am like I did for Princess Di's wedding way back when.  Wouldn't want to miss a minute of the scintillating coverage! 

Edited June 27, 2017 by Celia Rubenstein

[smores]

It should be like the OJ trial, where you can watch it all day every day until it's over!

[diadochokinesis]

9 hours ago, Celia Rubenstein said:

 

 To say Beth "turned up with Shield on Jason's custody day without warning" makes it sound so nefarious, lol.

Think of it like this: The day before had been Bethenny's day with Bryn.  She spent the night with Bethenny and the next morning Bethenny was dropping her off at school. This was standard operating procedure. On this particular day,  Shields happened to be with her.

That day was to be Jason's day.  You would think that meant picking Bryn up after school, but Jason instead shows up in the morning, supposedly to see Bryn for those 30 seconds it takes to walk from the car to the door of the schoolhouse.  But upon seeing Bethenny and Shields, and despite them both having sent him cease and desist letters warning him to stop harassing them, Jason approaches them and begins what they described as this verbal assault.

 I don't know if that's the real story or not but that has always been my understanding of what happened. 

Exactly. Custody days don't mean that the other parent is not allowed to go to the school to see the child in a dance recital/school play/whatever. From the articles I read, B was dropping off Bryn at school. Per their normal arrangement (due to contentious handovers), B would drop off Bryn and Hoppy would pick her up. However, Hoppy decided to just drop by the school drop-off. What purpose does that serve other than to be a dick?  Did Hoppy have a legal right to be there?  Yes. However, he could have chosen to be an adult and not go off on Bethenny. I don't care whether or not Dennis was there. Hoppy is responsible for his actions. Nobody forced him to start screaming insults/threats. He chose to do that. 

7 hours ago, Celia Rubenstein said:

Does it really matter if it was a school drop off or a dance recital?  The fact is that regardless of why they were all at the school, Jason (allegedly!) got upset and approached two people who had both sent him cease and desist letters and said things that are arguably threatening.

The idea that is being floated around about Jason's behavior being more understandable if a dance recital was taking place doesn't hold water for me and I doubt it will make any difference legally.  The issue isn't whether his behavior was understandable or to some extent justified. The issue is whether he should have known his behavior would cause Bethenny to feel fear.  You can't defend yourself from harassment charges by saying "yeah, but I had a good reason to be pissed off."

See above.  Hoppy needs to be held accountable for his actions. I have worked in schools and I've been around extremely contentious divorces (I've even had parents ask me to submit letters to the court stating one parent would be an unsuitable parent). Both parents knew that they would be invited to school plays, PTA meetings, IEP meetings, etc.  If they had issues being around the other person then they can sit on opposite sides of the room. He had a choice to be an adult, kiss his daughter, and see her off to school OR start screaming insults/threats at his ex-wife and her boyfriend. He chose the latter. He did not choose wisely nor well. 

7 hours ago, ZoloftBlob said:

How is it less of an ass move that Jason followed his lawyer's instructions? I mean, he's a grown man who made the decision to follow his lawyer's instructions even though he knew he was dragging the whole thing out. Someone told him to do it so....? That defense didn't work at Nuremburg, you know. ;)

Bethenny could have made a better decision but I know plenty of divorced people who get tired of dancing around their ex's feelings and start taking the position that it's not in the terms of the divorce so I'm going to do what I want. (Watch Little People Big World for some amusing examples of how divorcing ones wife makes one's exwife much less likely to play nice)

Considering that Jason signed a pre-nup, that this has dragged out for four years really does land squarely on Jason.

Exactly. They had a prenup. Most prenup divorces are fairly easy and quick because everything was outlined beforehand. 

I wonder (Speculation!) if he was fighting for that apartment because he knew he had the fraudulent documents giving him the apartment. I know other people have stated that it is common in NY for your lawyer to tell you not to abandon the apartment but was the ownership of this covered in the prenup?  It also lends some speculation to the shadiness of Hoppy's character that he was doing these fraudulent documents at that point in their marriage. 

5 hours ago, zoeysmom said:

As long as Jason doesn't object to Bethenny taking Bryn to the racetrack, I don't think Bethenny should object to Jason taking the kid to church.  That is what they both know from growing up.  And from what I have read, little Bryn is enjoying horseback riding in  the Hamptons.  I can't think of a better parent experience wise to introduce the child to horses.  We saw how much Luann's daughter and Kelly's daughter enjoyed horses.  I just hope if Bryn continues dad realizes sometimes the horse events take place on weekends and he and Bethenny can come to terms with being able to occupy the same space so they can enjoy her horseback riding events.  I would think it would be okay as well if Bryn decided to play basketball or golf.  These are things Jason knows. 

Religion almost always causes issues though in a divorce. I'm sure Hoppy would have issues if Bethenny decided to become Muslim and started taking Bryn to the mosque. Also, just because Bryn was baptized in the Catholic church doesn't necessarily mean that they were going to raise her strict Roman Catholic. There are a ton of Easter and Christmas Catholics. 

5 hours ago, ShawnaLanne said:

I heard about all the emails about a year ago,  and that's when my perception of him changed.  I watched their show and they were one of those couples that I hoped would stay together forever, because I didn't want anyone else to have to put up with either of them. But the email stuff tipped me in her favor,  because you know he was being verbally abusive,  and then he emailed her boyfriend and it tipped over into this,  man this guy just wants to destroy her.  It's excessive and obsessive which equals dangerous to me.  Whatever the outcome of the trial; my opinion on that won't change. 

I don't believe this either, but you know,  anything to make her look bad. As if she can't do that on her own. 

Crazy Days and Nights is unfortunately becoming questionable. I've been reading that blog for probably 8-10 years now (started in the beginning). From my understanding, the original Enty sold it (but will sometimes still pop in) and it has gone a bit downhill since. He has also stated that the Pitch Perfect girls were divided into a huge feud but yet they all did a big group vacation in Mexico a couple of weeks ago. 

4 hours ago, WireWrap said:

When she filed for sole custody and when she changed it to primary custody, all because she wanted to move to the LA area and Jason refused. IMO, Bethenny wants Bryn all to herself and has since Jason said no to LA. Go back and watch her reaction to him telling her "No" to moving, you can see her change to stone then. 

There are possible reasons for that. She could have been wanting to move to LA for business reasons. I've had friends who haven't been able to move for their jobs or their husband's career because the ex wouldn't modify the custody agreement. It doesn't necessarily have to be just because she wanted to cut Hoppy out of Bryn's' life. 

26 minutes ago, Celia Rubenstein said:

The trial is going to be televised worldwide, right?  

I am on the west coast so I guess I will have to set my alarm clock at 5 am like I did for Princess Di's wedding way back when.  Wouldn't want to miss a minute of the scintillating coverage! 

I'm going to need very detailed analysis and play-by-play on this because it will happen in the middle of the night for me.  

[breezy424]

5 hours ago, motorcitymom65 said:

Hey, I hate to be the big fat bearer of bad news - but that's the way it works around here. Jason has apparently never said a single word about Beth. The guy is a saint - the bigger person. He doesn't leak, doesn't speak off the record, doesn't seem to have any friends or family that are the "sources" for any of the negative stuff we hear about Beth. He just keeps his head down. Yet still folks are very aware of what he thinks, why he does the things that he does, why he is in such agony. They know about advice he gets from his lawyers (for fuck sake Jason - stay in the apartment as long as you can. Get your father to go from room to room in his underwear when Beth has her work colleagues around if you can. And for the love of God, don't flush your shit down the toilet. Girls hate that).  They know what he was thinking when he sent hundreds of emails. That apparently Beth was ignoring important issues about Bryn. Of course he hasn't said that, but still people know this was what he was thinking because he is such a good guy and certainly would not send her emails that didn't pertain to their child.  They seem to know details of his mindset when he decided the dog needed to get the hell out of the house (it varies from the dog was biting people to the dog was barking and Bryn couldn't sleep). Bottom line, Jason has never said "boo", but everyone is very much aware of what he is thinking and why he does the things that he does. It  truly is a world gone mad. 

Well, except for him getting arrested and having a trial date tomorrow. 

Hey MCM.  I don't know what Jason is truly thinking.  But I do know that Jason has not given any interviews since their split.  Given what Beth has said over the years, that says a lot to me.  I don't know what was in those emails.  I do know that Jason never mistreated Cookie in any way.  I do know that any good divorce attorney will tell you not to move out.  That's exactly why Beth stayed there for as long as she did.  I also don't think that either Beth or Jason don't love their daughter. 

I also know that Jason went to church every day.  Maybe not for Mass but he did stop by.  That came out on BEA.  His religion is very important.  I do think that Beth got that and there's nothing wrong with giving a child a religious basis.  It's not like it's a 'cult' or something.  I did the same for my kids and once they got through CCD and childhood sacraments, then it's up to them.  Maybe some will disagree. 

The vast majority of what happened after Beth wanted a divorce is based on Beth's version of events.  And I take that with a huge grain of kosher salt because Beth is the great exaggerator.   And she is very much like her father in that winning is everything.

I really do hope that this doesn't go to trial.  Why?  Because of their daughter.  Beth and Jason both need to 'calm' down.  They 'both' need to find a way to compromise and communicate.  They need to get over themselves and put their daughter first.  Beth needs to get a reality check about shared custody and Jason needs to keep in check. 

[WireWrap]

1 hour ago, diadochokinesis said:

 

There are possible reasons for that. She could have been wanting to move to LA for business reasons. I've had friends who haven't been able to move for their jobs or their husband's career because the ex wouldn't modify the custody agreement. It doesn't necessarily have to be just because she wanted to cut Hoppy out of Bryn's' life. 

 

Actually, Bethenny said that she threatened/told Jason he would never see Bryn again during her testimony in court during the custody battle. So, it had nothing to do with a job on the west coast, it had everything to do with her wanting Jason out of Bryn's life for good. 

[film noire]

1 hour ago, diadochokinesis said:

 However, Hoppy decided to just drop by the school drop-off. What purpose does that serve other than to be a dick?  

There was a dance recital and that's why Jason was present (there's a link to an US article a few pages back).

[WireWrap]

Just now, film noire said:

There was a dance recital and that's why Jason was present (there's a link to an US article a few pages back).

Also, wasn't it his week with Bryn as well? They don't switch up every night, Bryn stays with Bethenny 1 week and Jason the following week.

[film noire]

Just now, WireWrap said:

Also, wasn't it his week with Bryn as well? They don't switch up every night, Bryn stays with Bethenny 1 week and Jason the following week.

I believe (my opinion!) you're right (my opinion again!) that it was his custody day! ; ) 

[diadochokinesis]

8 minutes ago, WireWrap said:

Actually, Bethenny said that she threatened/told Jason he would never see Bryn again during her testimony in court during the custody battle. So, it had nothing to do with a job on the west coast, it had everything to do with her wanting Jason out of Bryn's life for good. 

Correlation or causation?

4 minutes ago, film noire said:

There was a dance recital and that's why Jason was present (there's a link to an US article a few pages back).

Still though...  Just because it was Hoppy's time for custody doesn't mean that Bethenny isn't allowed to attend a dance recital. I've had parents who have had acrimonious divorces attend school functions when the other one had custody. They just sat on opposite sides of the room or ignored each other. It doesn't absolve Hoppy of any responsibility for his actions nor does it justify them. 

2 minutes ago, film noire said:

I believe (my opinion!) you're right (my opinion again!) that it was his custody day! ; ) 

It might have been his custody day but it is still a moot point. It would be different if Bethenny tried to take Bryn home because that could fall under kidnapping. Going to your kid's school to see a dance recital on the day that you don't have custody is not a crime. If Bethenny had tried to keep Hoppy from seeing a dance recital just because it was her custody day, there would be OUTRAGE over that. People would be talking about how Bethenny is trying to cut Hoppy out of Bryn's life and how she is being selfish. 

[film noire]

Just now, diadochokinesis said:

Still though...  Just because it was Hoppy's time for custody doesn't mean that Bethenny isn't allowed to attend a dance recital. 

We don't know what the custody rules are  -- so who knows how they handled recitals, or bringing fuckbuddies to school events -- but that aside, we do know he had a legitimate reason to be there, he wasn't just turning up out of pure dickheadery.

[diadochokinesis]

Just now, film noire said:

We don't know what the custody rules are  -- so who knows how they handled recitals, or bringing fuckbuddies to school events -- but that aside, we do know he had a legitimate reason to be there, he wasn't just turning up out of pure dickheadery.

I have no issue that he attended a school recital. I don't believe that parents should be blocked from attending school or extracurricular events. Grown ups need to act like grown ups. My issue is that he came and then started screaming at Bethenny to the point that charges were filed. Allegedly. He is responsible for his actions. Nobody made him act like that. THAT is the problem. 

[zoeysmom]

1 hour ago, diadochokinesis said:

 

Religion almost always causes issues though in a divorce. I'm sure Hoppy would have issues if Bethenny decided to become Muslim and started taking Bryn to the mosque. Also, just because Bryn was baptized in the Catholic church doesn't necessarily mean that they were going to raise her strict Roman Catholic. There are a ton of Easter and Christmas Catholics. 

 

There are possible reasons for that. She could have been wanting to move to LA for business reasons. I've had friends who haven't been able to move for their jobs or their husband's career because the ex wouldn't modify the custody agreement. It doesn't necessarily have to be just because she wanted to cut Hoppy out of Bryn's' life. 

 

My issue with the religion has to do with the lack of logic in Bethenny's position.  For simplicity sake, Jason has Bryn 26 weeks out of the year.  I don't think I understand that going to church is okay on days she feels are okay.  I kind of thought that people when they leave church are suppose to carry their beliefs with them and essentially practice what they learn.  It just comes down to this weird notion that so many issues between these two are about the parents not the child.  If Bethenny were to say, "my daughter really dislikes going to church and every time she is with Jason she has to go to church," I would think well I can see her point, the kid doesn't want to go.  Instead it is this idea that to placate the child's father she will only give permission to go a half dozen times a year.  Won't Bryn still carry away the same information?  Are the teachings of the church that different on high holidays than regular mass? 

I think it is a lot to ask someone to move across the country for business opportunities.  Bethenny was able to pursue her failed talk show dream in New York.  Again it is the control issue with Bethenny -she would have been in a place to dictate where Bryn lived and thereby depriving Jason on meaningful and continued contact with Bryn. 

[WireWrap]

6 minutes ago, diadochokinesis said:

Correlation or causation?

Still though...  Just because it was Hoppy's time for custody doesn't mean that Bethenny isn't allowed to attend a dance recital. I've had parents who have had acrimonious divorces attend school functions when the other one had custody. They just sat on opposite sides of the room or ignored each other. It doesn't absolve Hoppy of any responsibility for his actions nor does it justify them. 

It might have been his custody day but it is still a moot point. It would be different if Bethenny tried to take Bryn home because that could fall under kidnapping. Going to your kid's school to see a dance recital on the day that you don't have custody is not a crime. If Bethenny had tried to keep Hoppy from seeing a dance recital just because it was her custody day, there would be OUTRAGE over that. People would be talking about how Bethenny is trying to cut Hoppy out of Bryn's life and how she is being selfish. 

I am not sure, her attorney was asking the questions. I am sure someone could find out if she gave a reason, the custody trial was public, so the transcript should be available. 

I don't think anyone here is saying that Jason should be allowed to stop Bethenny from seeing their daughters dance recital and I don't believe that he was upset that Bethenny was there. I believe the discussion here is about Bethenny bringing Shields (a married man she was sleeping with) to it, especially in light of the fact that Shields had sent Jason a C&D letter not long before. She had to have known she was risking a scene. AND, saying that, it does not excuse Jason from loosing his cool, if that is in fact what happened. We don't know exactly what happened that day, only Bethenny's spin on it.

[zoeysmom]

2 minutes ago, diadochokinesis said:

I have no issue that he attended a school recital. I don't believe that parents should be blocked from attending school or extracurricular events. Grown ups need to act like grown ups. My issue is that he came and then started screaming at Bethenny to the point that charges were filed. Allegedly. He is responsible for his actions. Nobody made him act like that. THAT is the problem. 

There is no evidence or testimony of screaming and it appears from what was filed in the way of charges Jason only spoke to Dennis. 

[diadochokinesis]

3 minutes ago, zoeysmom said:

My issue with the religion has to do with the lack of logic in Bethenny's position.  For simplicity sake, Jason has Bryn 26 weeks out of the year.  I don't think I understand that going to church is okay on days she feels are okay.  I kind of thought that people when they leave church are suppose to carry their beliefs with them and essentially practice what they learn.  It just comes down to this weird notion that so many issues between these two are about the parents not the child.  If Bethenny were to say, "my daughter really dislikes going to church and every time she is with Jason she has to go to church," I would think well I can see her point, the kid doesn't want to go.  Instead it is this idea that to placate the child's father she will only give permission to go a half dozen times a year.  Won't Bryn still carry away the same information?  Are the teachings of the church that different on high holidays than regular mass? 

I think it is a lot to ask someone to move across the country for business opportunities.  Bethenny was able to pursue her failed talk show dream in New York.  Again it is the control issue with Bethenny -she would have been in a place to dictate where Bryn lived and thereby depriving Jason on meaningful and continued contact with Bryn. 

7

I've lived in 3 different countries due to my husband's career.  LOL. I have a lot of friends who are either military or married to a military man and custody battles are horrendous in that population for when they move overseas (I had one friend who wound up not going with her husband because her ex wouldn't let the kids go to Germany for 3 years). So, I have a different opinion on whether or not it is unreasonable/a lot for someone to move for your career. Yes, she did her talk show in NYC but production costs would have been cheaper in LA and it is easier to get guests in LA vs NYC (various talk shows have addressed this). Also, who knows what business opportunities she wasn't able to pursue due to having to stay in NYC.

4 minutes ago, zoeysmom said:

There is no evidence or testimony of screaming and it appears from what was filed in the way of charges Jason only spoke to Dennis. 

It had to be pretty bad if the TRO also applies to the school. I've only known one time when we had a parent blocked at an inner city school I worked at and it was the parent threatening to beat the teacher up in the parking lot and nearly ran me over in the parking lot. And it still took about 6 months of that behavior before anything happened. Schools don't want to block parents. They want active parental engagement because that is what is best for the kids. 

[Celia Rubenstein]

Quote

There was a dance recital and that's why Jason was present (there's a link to an US article a few pages back).

Like Us Magazine never gets anything wrong, lol.

It has not been definitively been established that this took place before a recital, which for some reason is being viewed as some kind of holy sacrament or something.  There are competing stories about what the circumstances of the meeting were.

I still don't see what type of event Jason lost his shit at makes a difference.  He (allegedly!) lost his shit. Period.  That's on him.

 

Quote

We don't know what the custody rules are  -- so who knows how they handled recitals, or bringing fuckbuddies to school events -- but that aside, we do know he had a legitimate reason to be there, he wasn't just turning up out of pure dickheadery.

How do we know that?  I think turning up to make your presence felt during a 90 second school drop off may just qualify as pure dickheadery.  If not because it seems purely intended to annoy Bethenny, then because that little girl is not a damn mannequin. She can sense the stress Jason was causing.  

[WireWrap]

1 minute ago, Celia Rubenstein said:

Like Us Magazine never gets anything wrong, lol.

It has not been definitively been established that this took place before a recital, which for some reason is being viewed as some kind of holy sacrament or something.  There are competing stories about what the circumstances of the meeting were.

I still don't see what type of event Jason lost his shit at makes a difference.  He (allegedly!) lost his shit. Period.  That's on him.

 

How do we know that?  I think turning up to make your presence felt during a 90 second school drop off may just qualify as pure dickheadery.  If not because it seems purely intended to annoy Bethenny, then because that little girl is not a damn mannequin. She can sense the stress Jason was causing.  

I will agree with you if Jason lost his shit just seeing Bethenny/Shields there. But, we don't know if anyone said something to him before he lost his cool. Like maybe he needed to leave because Shields was there or because Bethenny was there, since both had sent him C&D letters. All we know right now is that Jason lost his cool and said a few not so nice, ok, nasty, things to them. Once again, we do not have the full story, we only have Bethenny's spin on it, so we need to withhold condemning Jason until the whole truth comes out, both sides and then the truth. LOL

[zoeysmom]

5 minutes ago, diadochokinesis said:

I've lived in 3 different countries due to my husband's career.  LOL. I have a lot of friends who are either military or married to a military man and custody battles are horrendous in that population for when they move overseas (I had one friend who wound up not going with her husband because her ex wouldn't let the kids go to Germany for 3 years). So, I have a different opinion on whether or not it is unreasonable/a lot for someone to move for your career. Yes, she did her talk show in NYC but production costs would have been cheaper in LA and it is easier to get guests in LA vs NYC (various talk shows have addressed this). Also, who knows what business opportunities she wasn't able to pursue due to having to stay in NYC.

There was Jason's career to consider.  The thing about talk shows is they film two or three days a week.  It is about the child's best interests not the parents.  There was an alternative and one that Bethenny in fact accepted.  What Bethenny has said, is when she has the child she doesn't work, her focus is strictly on Bryn.  We watched her deal with it  her first season back on RHONY.  So how would that work if she had Bryn out in California?    

I do have feelings for service personnel and the various difficulties they endure with transfers and assignments.  I don't blame a parent for not letting his kids go to Germany for three years.  I would think the parties could have made it work the children went for a portion of the  summer to Germany

[diadochokinesis]

2 minutes ago, zoeysmom said:

There was Jason's career to consider.  The thing about talk shows is they film two or three days a week.  It is about the child's best interests not the parents.  There was an alternative and one that Bethenny in fact accepted.  What Bethenny has said, is when she has the child she doesn't work, her focus is strictly on Bryn.  We watched her deal with it  her first season back on RHONY.  So how would that work if she had Bryn out in California?    

I do have feelings for service personnel and the various difficulties they endure with transfers and assignments.  I don't blame a parent for not letting his kids go to Germany for three years.  I would think the parties could have made it work the children went for a portion of the  summer to Germany

Is Jason even still working?  Plus, he's a pharmaceutical sales rep.  He can literally live just about anywhere in the US and do his job. 

My husband isn't military and we've still made multiple international moves. My uncle was an engineer and lived overseas for awhile.  You would be surprised at how many of us move overseas for our careers. The dickhead behavior with my one friend though was her ex was also military and this was during Iraq/Afghanistan when the military was on every other year deployments. So, he wasn't going to see the kids for 2 of those 3 years anyways. She was willing to let him have them for all the school breaks when he was stateside but he hated the current husband so he blocked it. It was his way of punishing her for divorcing him. Some people are just immature dicks. 

[Celia Rubenstein]

5 minutes ago, WireWrap said:

I will agree with you if Jason lost his shit just seeing Bethenny/Shields there. But, we don't know if anyone said something to him before he lost his cool. Like maybe he needed to leave because Shields was there or because Bethenny was there, since both had sent him C&D letters. All we know right now is that Jason lost his cool and said a few not so nice, ok, nasty, things to them. Once again, we do not have the full story, we only have Bethenny's spin on it, so we need to withhold condemning Jason until the whole truth comes out, both sides and then the truth. LOL

If agree that someone approached Jason first instigating shit, that does indeed matter.  You can't get in someone's face talking smack after you sent them a cease and desist letter then claim harassment when they respond.  

And they have no right to confront him saying he had to leave because they sent him a C&D letters anymore than they should have to beat a retreat because of those letters. Dammit, people just need to be cooool, not be all uncoool, LOL

I agree with you, final judgment should not be made by anybody until all the evidence is heard.  

I want to confess something to you, @Wirewrap (late at night here, just between you and me, secret quiet like where nobody can hear us talking) ... in a weird way over the last few hours, I have started to hope Jason is acquitted or takes some kind of deal.  I think he needs the counseling help a deal would require and that would be a good thing.  But if he is found guilty ... it just seems like such an ugly, damning thing that bodes so poorly for the future of all involved.  I won't take any joy in that if that is the outcome.  I want better for everyone involved, most of all Bryn.   Having her dad be convicted will not be cause for me to celebrate ... it will only make me sad for her. 

[diadochokinesis]

Just now, Celia Rubenstein said:

If agree that someone approached Jason first instigating shit, that does indeed matter.  You can't get in someone's face talking smack after you sent them a cease and desist letter then claim harassment when they respond.  

And they have no right to confront him saying he had to leave because they sent him a C&D letters anymore than they should have to beat a retreat because of those letters. Dammit, people just need to be cooool, not be all uncoool, LOL

I agree with you, final judgment should not be made by anybody until all the evidence is heard.  

I want to confess something to you, @Wirewrap (late at night here, just between you and me, secret quiet like where nobody can hear us talking) ... in a weird way over the last few hours, I have started to hope Jason is acquitted or takes some kind of deal.  I think he needs the counseling help a deal would require and that would be a good thing.  But if he is found guilty ... it just seems like such an ugly, damning thing that bodes so poorly for the future of all involved.  I won't take any joy in that if that is the outcome.  I want better for everyone involved, most of all Bryn.   Having her dad be convicted will not be cause for me to celebrate ... it will only make me sad for her. 

*peeks around the corner*  It's morning where I'm at (well, lunch time almost) so I have an opinion.  I would love for these charges to be trumped up just for the sake of Bryn.  None of this is doing Bryn any good. Both parents need to just let go of all past hurt and animosity and focus on what is best for Bryn. 

[WireWrap]

15 minutes ago, Celia Rubenstein said:

If agree that someone approached Jason first instigating shit, that does indeed matter.  You can't get in someone's face talking smack after you sent them a cease and desist letter then claim harassment when they respond.  

And they have no right to confront him saying he had to leave because they sent him a C&D letters anymore than they should have to beat a retreat because of those letters. Dammit, people just need to be cooool, not be all uncoool, LOL

I agree with you, final judgment should not be made by anybody until all the evidence is heard.  

I want to confess something to you, @Wirewrap (late at night here, just between you and me, secret quiet like where nobody can hear us talking) ... in a weird way over the last few hours, I have started to hope Jason is acquitted or takes some kind of deal.  I think he needs the counseling help a deal would require and that would be a good thing.  But if he is found guilty ... it just seems like such an ugly, damning thing that bodes so poorly for the future of all involved.  I won't take any joy in that if that is the outcome.  I want better for everyone involved, most of all Bryn.   Having her dad be convicted will not be cause for me to celebrate ... it will only make me sad for her. 

I agree, no matter what Jason needs to seek out help to be there for Bryn, she is going to need him more and more as she gets older. It will not be easy for her having Bethenny as a mom, so she needs a more stable parent and Jason is the only hope left for that child parent wise that is. Both sides need help but let's be honest, Bethenny isn't going to get it so that leaves Jason.

18 minutes ago, diadochokinesis said:

*peeks around the corner*  It's morning where I'm at (well, lunch time almost) so I have an opinion.  I would love for these charges to be trumped up just for the sake of Bryn.  None of this is doing Bryn any good. Both parents need to just let go of all past hurt and animosity and focus on what is best for Bryn. 

No it isn't good for that child and I hope someone finally wakes up and puts a stop to the games. IMO, only Jason has a chance of being that parent, Bethenny is too set on winning at all costs.