S16.E28: Michael Moore, P.J. O'Rourke, Thom Hartmann, Catherine Rampell, and Steve Hilton

[formerlyfreedom]

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Documentary filmmaker Michael Moore; humorist P.J. O'Rourke; political commentators Thom Hartmann and Steve Hilton; columnist Catherine Rampell.

[sualbu]

If the British guy and PJ O'Rourke were 1/10th as funny, smart, charming, interesting, and worth listening to as they believed themselves to be, this would have been a more tolerable show.

I'm hoarse from screaming at the TV for O'Rourke to shut up so I could hear what the fiercely smart Catherine Rampell had to say.

Loved the final New Rule though!!

Edited September 22, 2018 by sualbu
typoes :-)

[GHScorpiosRule]

Aside from Hilton and O’Rourke, this was a good show. I don’t know, but Bill was on fire tonight. So glad Moore was the guest and not on the panel.

New Rules had me ??????????, especially the last few minutes.

ETA: Nothing New, but Moore and O’Rourke were just insufferable during Overtime. And Hilton is another one who believes facts are opinions. Alrighty then.

And whatever Bill, for catering to that bullshit.

Edited September 22, 2018 by GHScorpiosRule

[PickledTinker]

I loved  Rampell, smart and concise in her her opinions. Overtime was good for me. I think I just tune out the over the top right wing shit. 

[Robert Lynch]

11 hours ago, sualbu said:

If the British guy and PJ O'Rourke were 1/10th as funny, smart, charming, interesting, and worth listening to as they believed themselves to be, this would have been a more tolerable show.

I'm hoarse from screaming at the TV for O'Rourke to shut up so I could hear what the fiercely smart Catherine Rampell had to say.

Loved the final New Rule though!!

PJ always looks like he needs a bath. He must have smelled tonight. 

[crookedjackson44]

Republicans must have seminars where they teach their spokespersons how to talk over everyone else so other opinions can't be heard.

[scrb]

Moore was saying make shit up, promise stuff, figure it out later.

unfortunately, critical thinking is at a low level in the US so it works to a certain extent.

It obviously worked for Trump with his “something terrific” BS, though Democrats have a big lead when it comes to polling on which party will better handle health care policy.  They’re running heavily on health care, particularly guaranteeing coverage for preexisting conditions so let’s see if people respond or turn out for that message.

Rempell pointed out the math doesn’t work for Bernie’s Medicare for All proposal but average voters have no way to evaluate whether that’s true or not.

There is one study, by a libertarian think tank called Mercatus, which concluded Bernie’s proposal would cost $32 trillion over 10 years.

What a scary number right?  Actually as a nation, we’re spending about $3-4 trillion already on health care each year, so if anything, $32 trillion might be less than what the US will spend over the next 10 years anyways.

[iMonrey]

I thought it was a pretty good show overall, mainly because Hartmann and Rampell were so effective in shutting down Steve Hilton. That whole "both sides are equally guilty" shit just props up the main Republican agenda, which is "all government is equally corrupt, so the answer is  . . . get rid of government." Yeah, he's perfectly willing to say there's corruption in his party, but only with the qualifier that Democrats are equally corrupt, because it services the goal of drowning government in the bathtub.

Also, yes it did seem like Obamacare was a huge gift to the insurance industry, but in actuality, the insurance industry hated Obamacare, because it forced them to cover high risk individuals. Look how many of the companies pulled out of various states the second and third year after enactment. They didn't like losing money on sick people.

Also, Tucker Carlson and Alex Jones are indeed in the same league, much as Hilton might want to defend his colleague. They are both the purveyor of lies. That one tells bigger ones than the other is a distinction without a difference.

Wait . . . Thom Hartmann was in high school in 1967?? Wow he looks good for his age. 

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I don’t know, but Bill was on fire tonight.

Agreed. So many excellent points made - about which side is asking to talk to the FBI in the Cavenaugh case and what that says about it. And Bill has always been on the front line in saying "we're not supposed to call Trump supporters stupid and racist, but . . . check and check." 

I thought the New Rule brilliantly laid out the case for Trump having narcissistic personality disorder. It's not a joke, it's not just and insult, it's an actual mental illness and it's for real.

[CaliCheeseSucks]

Never heard of Hilton before and WOW - hope to never hear *from* him again. Was yelling at the screen for Bill to stop allowing the guy to talk over Hartmann and Rampell. 

I don't mind O'Rourke but combined with British Mr. Clean, it was too much smug and overtalk. 

[GHScorpiosRule]

32 minutes ago, CaliCheeseSucks said:

but combined with British Mr. Clean,

?????????????

So apt!!!

[GoldenGirl90]

Does anyone else get physically ill when anything about POTUS's penis and the toad from the video game gets mentioned? I'm so ready for that story to disappear from the news cycle, lol. Of course Bill wouldn't be Bill if he didn't mention it but my stomach can't take it anymore... lol.

Overall it was a good show.

Edited September 22, 2018 by Alexis2291

[ganesh]

3 hours ago, iMonrey said:

That whole "both sides are equally guilty" shit just props up the main Republican agenda, which is "all government is equally corrupt, so the answer is  . . . get rid of government."

I liked how the woman ticked off several actual facts to the contrary and the guy just kept going. I just have no time for that narrative. That was the true key to Trump winning and in afraid that it's going to be the same thing in November - well they're both bad so I won't vote. I think we agree here that democrats aren't nearly as effective as we want them to be but must as bad is patently false. 

I know someone irl who peddles this canard who was bitching on FB because they can't get Healthcare. 

Edited September 22, 2018 by ganesh

[meowmommy]

15 hours ago, PickledTinker said:

I loved  Rampell, smart and concise in her her opinions.

IIRC, the first time she was on, she seemed overwhelmed and didn't have much to say.  This time, she was out in front of the discussion and showed why her columns are must-reads.

4 hours ago, Robert Lynch said:

PJ always looks like he needs a bath. He must have smelled tonight. 

And it appears to be a conscious choice.  That day-old growth look just does not work for everyone.

3 hours ago, iMonrey said:

Agreed. So many excellent points made - about which side is asking to talk to the FBI in the Cavenaugh case and what that says about it. And Bill has always been on the front line in saying "we're not supposed to call Trump supporters stupid and racist, but . . . check and check." 

I thought it was one of his best outings ever.  He shut down the stupidity coming out of the Brit, whoever the hell he is.  New Rules were good.  His ending monologue was terrific.  And he allowed Michael Moore to be less obnoxious than usual, which is quite a feat. 

[Mystery Author]

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Loved the final New Rule though!!

Me, too. I thought it was brilliant...funny but not funny. Does Bill write his own New Rules? If yes, mega-props to him!!

[ganesh]

Yeah loud mouth, Roe isn't likely to be overturned directly but the alleged rapist up for the SCOTUS seat is very likely to allow this "death by 1000 paper cuts" to keep moving forward. 

It's called nuance.

I did like Moore's point that Healthcare for means you get it too. I don't feel it's the fans the other way around, cf. tax cuts. 

[Victor the Crab]

Fuck off to Hell, Michael Moore! You were of no fucking help to stop Drumpf from occupying the White House two years ago and you're going to continue doing fuck all in 2018 and 2020, no matter how many movies you fucking make!

Bill's New Rules sermon would have been perfect if he hadn't have gone and berated his audience for not laughing at one of his jokes, like he normally does. But such as he is with his own case of Narcissistic Personality Disorder.

Ugh! Steve Bannon is going to be a guest next week, proving once again Bill invites people to his show that have no business being on. I imagine Bannon is going to take advantage of his invite and make Bill look like an unwiped asshole.

[ganesh]

To be fair to Bill, he told an old time classic joke. I didn't think this was in the case of the usual "the joke wasn't funny but yell at the audience."

I actually like when comedians are a little antagonistic with the audience though. It's kind of an old school thing and I could see where it might have rubbed off on Bill. 

[vesperholly]

Loved Catherine Rampell and even better how she just took the wind out of British Mr Clean with the "what does that have anything to do with what we're talking about?"

It didn't! Hahaha!

[DXD526]

O'Rourke is always annoying, but I don't remember him mugging so much. He spent half his time mugging for the camera like an idiot. He obviously thought he looked like the bomb with his three-day growth of beard. And he wouldn't STFU, even when someone else was talking, he could be heard in the background tossing off some inane comment. I wanted to reach through the screen and throttle him.

That ignoramus Hilton was just as bad. And buddy, if you can't bring yourself to wear a tie, at least put on a decent shirt, you slob.

Other than that, a pretty good episode. I hope neither of those two is asked back, though. They really did drag down the show. 

[GHScorpiosRule]

I’m hoping that Bill shows clips from Politically Incorrect on the October 19 airing he was talking about.

Oh and I won’t lie-I was ???? at the No.18 item of things you didn’t know about Kavanaugh.

If Bill could maintain the calling out bullshit and NONE of letting British Mr. Clean getting away with patently false statements (THANK YOU THOM HARTMAN for doing it!), I would enjoy this show a lot more.

[Victor the Crab]

12 hours ago, ganesh said:

To be fair to Bill, he told an old time classic joke. I didn't think this was in the case of the usual "the joke wasn't funny but yell at the audience."

I actually like when comedians are a little antagonistic with the audience though. It's kind of an old school thing and I could see where it might have rubbed off on Bill. 

Bill thinks he's old school, when in reality he's just old news with his constant whining. Guy needs to get the fuck over himself.

[ganesh]

I just don't think this time is an accurate comparison. 

[formerlyfreedom]

Please stick to the show discussion. Thank you.

[The Mighty Peanut]

The “eat your pets” joke needs to go to the pet cemetery. So unfunny. I was hoping Bill only repeated it to throw shade at PJ by bringing it up and getting laughs where PJ wasn’t, but the audience still wasn’t into it because it was a bad joke. PJ is always so aggressively try-too-hard with everything he does. The rumpled unshaven stinky look, his commitment to bad jokes, his casual dismissal of the entire US political narrative as half stupid and half silly. He hasn’t always had that last opinion btw—he vociferously defended George W. Bush and really went in that climate change legislation was just democrats being wacky again because everyone knows with India and China there’s nothing we can do and hey nbd did you know democrats used to bitch about global cooling back in the day? In a way I feel bad for him because I feel like he’s That Guy who tries to be funny and smart so everyone will like him, but comes off so desperately that no one likes him but they all feel kind of guilty about it.

Also whoever called the guy who filled the But Both Sides slot British Mr. Clean deserves a major award. I still have giggles.

Edited September 24, 2018 by The Mighty Peanut

[iMonrey]

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O'Rourke is always annoying, but I don't remember him mugging so much.

Oh, he's usually much worse. This was an improvement for him, believe it or not. He's insufferable when he's on the panel because all he ever does is interrupt to make horrible, lame jokes. 

I thought Michael Moore's discussion of Michigan and the mistakes Obama made there was really interesting because I hadn't really heard about it before. I remember the stunt where he drank the water but I didn't know about more people showing up in the April primary that year than during the November election. I'm sure I'll see his movie eventually when it's on Netflix or wherever. It's just not something I'd pay to see in theaters.

[ganesh]

10 hours ago, The Mighty Peanut said:

PJ is always so aggressively try-too-hard with everything he does.

People who always need to weigh in on everything about anything with pithy bon mots drive me up the wall. The whole 'stupid silly' isn't helping. That's why people aren't voting. 

[formerlyfreedom]

Next week's show is not up for discussion. Posts have been removed, and warnings will be issued. Stick to the topic at hand.

[Caseysgirl]

I do remember a time when PJ O’Rourke was amusing and relevant, though I often disagreed with him. It must be hard to have lost that edge but still trying.

[paigow]

On 9/22/2018 at 1:45 PM, Alexis2291 said:

Does anyone else get physically ill when anything about POTUS's penis and the toad from the video game gets mentioned? 

In some ways this is better than incessant fat jokes about Christie & Trump....

[wknt3]

On 9/22/2018 at 1:45 PM, Alexis2291 said:

Does anyone else get physically ill when anything about POTUS's penis and the toad from the video game gets mentioned?

 

1 hour ago, paigow said:

In some ways this is better than incessant fat jokes about Christie & Trump....

Good points from both of you. At least you can both agree that the joke about Trump not seeing his penis (because he's so fat) was terrible!