The Spanish Princess - General Discussion

[greekmom]

WOW on the first episode.

I wonder what happened to the baby that he died. I know infant morality was very high back then.  And boy was Henry really showing that kid off whenever he had a chance.

Catherine and her father's dynamics were interesting as well as the sugar grape scenes.  So I guess dad likes mind games?! I guess Joanna takes after daddy.

I agree with the poster above in regards to the costumes. 

Are Lina and Oviedo going to marry???

[Scarlett45]

24 minutes ago, greekmom said:

WOW on the first episode.

I wonder what happened to the baby that he died. I know infant morality was very high back then.  And boy was Henry really showing that kid off whenever he had a chance.

Catherine and her father's dynamics were interesting as well as the sugar grape scenes.  So I guess dad likes mind games?! I guess Joanna takes after daddy.

I agree with the poster above in regards to the costumes. 

Are Lina and Oviedo going to marry???

Lina and Oviedo married in episode 8 of last season (before a priest and witness because Oviedo was to be hanged). 
 

Likely the baby caught a virus (a flu or cold) and died. Something typical that killed babies back then but now with modern medicine we could get the baby’s fever down and offered treatment. A classmate of mine had a baby that died from a virus- caught it and her heart stopped. Nothing anyone could’ve done, rare in the 21st century but much more common 500yrs ago. 
 

Refresh my memory- what happened to the other lady in waiting that came with Lina. The one that was pregnant and miscarried. Did the actress get another job or did the character die? I can’t remember and I didn’t do a rewatch. 

[tennisgurl]

That was one hell of a way to start the season, poor Catherine, what a terrible couple of days, and its even worse knowing what is still in store for her. Poor everyone really, it was a tough one, between the death of baby Henry and Catherine getting screwed over by her own father. Catherine's family sure is something else, even by the standards of royalty. 

I know that the infant mortality rates were high back then, but knowing that your baby could die so quickly at any time without ever really knowing why must have been terrifying. 

I am glad that Oviedo lived at least, I was afraid that he would die abroad and leave Lina pregnant and alone, so very happy that he made it back, and with a fancy new knighthood to boot! 

The clothing this week was even more on point than usual, especially those beautiful mourning clothes. I mean, sad occasion, lovely outfits. 

6 hours ago, Scarlett45 said:

Refresh my memory- what happened to the other lady in waiting that came with Lina. The one that was pregnant and miscarried. Did the actress get another job or did the character die? I can’t remember and I didn’t do a rewatch. 

If I remember right she went back to Spain after the miscarriage near the end of the season, basically saying that England didn't agree with her, I have no idea if the actress wanted to leave or is going to come back though. 

Edited October 12, 2020 by tennisgurl

[AryasMum]

On 10/11/2020 at 12:34 PM, LennieBriscoe said:

I cannot abide the lead actress, ever since seeing her in "Endeavour." Her speaking style is beyond affected, like a poor "Rahlly, my dear, rahlly, rahlly" Katherine Hepburn.  

I’ve struggled with getting over her character on A Game of Thrones. I’ve mostly overcome it. 

[Haleth]

There was a whole lot going on this episode, although the parallel of war and childbirth was a little heavy handed. Catherine running around the battlefield was pretty ridiculous but made for good tv. I’m glad Lina and Ovieto made it to the end of the epi. 

[CarpeFelis]

5 hours ago, Haleth said:

There was a whole lot going on this episode, although the parallel of war and childbirth was a little heavy handed. Catherine running around the battlefield was pretty ridiculous but made for good tv. I’m glad Lina and Ovieto made it to the end of the epi. 

So am I, though it was a bit jarring seeing all the blood around Lina and assuming Catherine would be told on her return that Lina died in childbirth, only to see her perfectly fine next time she appeared. No explanation for how it turned out all right even though she’d seemed to be hemorrhaging quite a bit. I’d half imagined Maggie Pole would have to pull out a knife and do a primitive C-section when Lina passed out.

[tennisgurl]

Some of this episode was pretty ridiculous and over the top, even by this franchises standards, but it did make for a pretty gripping episode. I thought that Lina was going to die in childbirth, but I am glad that she made it out alright, with twins now, and that Ovieto got to see his babies. Really, all of the drama with Lina giving birth and the whole "childbirth and war" comparisons were pretty heavy handed and ended up being kind of pointless, but, again, made for an exciting episode. 

So much going on! Poor Meg, her marriage certainly wasn't perfect and she and her husband practically had some kind of sitcom family hijinks going on, but it didn't seem to be a bad relationship either and they clearly cared about each other. I can see how Henry would just shrug it off as Meg now getting to run Scotland and her son if the heir so why should she be sad, but its still pretty uncaring. But ouch, watching Catherine and Henry losing their children is still really sad. 

Young Henry Poole is really trying to keep his family in the courts good graces. Last week he was trying to find random stuff to help Henry with and encouraging his mom to pay attention to the knight who seemed possibly interested in her, and now this week he is all ready for battle and trying to stop Maggie from yelling at Catherine. I cant blame him, considering what they're family has been through, but I dont know if Maggie will be happy to see him getting in further with the Tudors. 

[cameron]

On 10/18/2020 at 8:27 PM, Haleth said:

There was a whole lot going on this episode, although the parallel of war and childbirth was a little heavy handed. Catherine running around the battlefield was pretty ridiculous but made for good tv. I’m glad Lina and Ovieto made it to the end of the epi. 

Just looked it up and she actually rode into the battle at Flodden.

[CarpeFelis]

I know it wouldn’t reflect history (and just how much of this show does, anyway?), but I so wished Katherine would push Wolsey overboard...

[Scarlett45]

To quote my Mom 

 

Spoiler

"Thats how she (Mary Tudor) kills him (King Louis XII)- by having him run around the bed and have a pillow fight." 🤣🤣 she said "he wont last two weeks" and I told her that he only lives four months after the marriage.

I noticed this episode they dressed Katherine in a lot of muted colors.

[IntrovertRed]

Doublepost

Edited October 27, 2020 by KLJ

[IntrovertRed]

Something I've been curious about - Catherine eventually did learn English, right? 

Edited October 27, 2020 by KLJ

[Haleth]

Yes

[greekmom]

I hated the fact that they blamed Catherine's ride into battle for the loss of the baby and on top of it downplayed the battle.

Interesting on how Mary won over the Scots.

Poor sister Mary who had to marry the old French king. Lucky he only lasted like 3 months.

I do feel for Lady Pole.  Her son never speaks and her children live in fear of being hungry and poor again.

[CarpeFelis]

3 hours ago, greekmom said:

I do feel for Lady Pole.  Her son never speaks and her children live in fear of being hungry and poor again.

Not to mention she’s being railroaded into marriage with the guy who empties the king’s chamber pot!

[tennisgurl]

Poor Catherine, losing two children is awful enough, its even worse when a major part of your responsibilities as a person revolve around giving birth to children. Plus Henry blames her for the miscarriage and is focusing on that, and not the fact that she won a major battle and put a stop to a war with Scotland, its just a whole lot of suck. 

I feel for Lady Pole so much, but her more romantic nature has often made it hard for her to really play the game which has led to tons of problems for her and her family, so I cant really blame her kids for trying to be more pragmatic and try to stabilize their situation. Ursula wanting to marry a decently wealthy and high status man, regardless of her feelings about him, is certainly understandable considering she grew up in a poor and precarious situation. It sucks that the best way to find that stability is probably to find a decent match based around what Henry gives her, even if its not for love or even affection, but its just the way it is, and she sees this as the best way to keep her family safe. 

Mary is going to straight up excite the king to death! At least things are looking up for Meg, who might have lost her husband and is still trying to keep the peace, but she at least has the people on her side now. 

[Scarlett45]

I loved the costume design this episode too. The deep rose cake Katherine wore was gorgeous- when she was being a total bitch to Lina she looked mighty gorgeous. Henry continues to be an ass- your wife asks you to be honest, and you continue to lie. 

[Norma Desmond]

It was hilarious when Henry's sister Margaret said he was fat. WTF. I know the real Henry got fat and all, but it's not believable to call him fat when the actor is so young and fit and gorgeous - same as on The Tudors, where Anne of Cleves and Catherine Howard were supposed to be repulsed by an aging, smelly and obese Henry, but Jonathan Rhys-Meyers was scorching hot and super trim. The only thing they did there to age Henry was a few strands of grey hair.

 

Anyway, I knew it was Lady Blount who was Henry's mistress, so no surprises. And yes, the costumes were gorgeous as ever.

Did Angus plan on betraying Margaret all along, or he did it in the end just to save his own hide?

[Bill1978]

3 hours ago, Norma Desmond said:

same as on The Tudors, where Anne of Cleves and Catherine Howard were supposed to be repulsed by an aging, smelly and obese Henry, but Jonathan Rhys-Meyers was scorching hot and super trim. The only thing they did there to age Henry was a few strands of grey hair.

I recall reading somewhere that Rhys-Meyers refused to have aged makeup or play fat. I can't recall where I read it and who knows if it is correct because the series originally aired years ago, but if my memory is correct the article painted Rhys-Meyers as being arrogantly vain.

[Haleth]

And that's why I could never get passed one episode of The Tudors.  Creative license is one thing, but JRM was so completely miscast in terms of physical appearance. 

I could see a sister teasing a vain brother by announcing he's gotten fat.  Whether he was or not it's not a thing a sister wouldn't say.

The thing that got me was Katherine delivering her baby then waddling over to talk to Henry through the door.  Um, she wasn't done with the birthing, writers.

I have trouble telling some characters apart - Wolsey, More, and certainly all the young courtiers.

But yes, gorgeous costumes.

[Darlin]

I very recently, by chance, came upon a documentary on YouTube about Queen Margaret so the developments in her story that aired on Sunday were not surprising. I felt so bad for her but also felt she was being incredibly stupid. But maybe the Spanish Princess version of Margaret was being stupid, and the real Queen Margaret was just . . . misguided??? I still can't believe that's the young child actress from the Narnia movies!

I loathed Katherine blaming Lina for repeating rumors about Henry (despite Katherine's insistence that she repeat them to her).  There were so many layers to that scene and it made my blood boil!

And what's with the pseudo-attraction/romanticism that's being applied to Maggie Pole and Thomas More???

Are the Phillipa Gregory books the Spanish Princess is based on the Constant Princess, The Kingmaker's Curse and 3 Sisters, 3 Queens?

[Darlin]

1 hour ago, Haleth said:

And that's why I could never get passed one episode of The Tudors.  Creative license is one thing, but JRM was so completely miscast in terms of physical appearance. 

I have trouble telling some characters apart - Wolsey, More, and certainly all the young courtiers.

Thomas More blends in with another dark-haired courtier for me. I'm only reminded that its Thomas More during his scenes with Maggie.

I only remember that Wolsey wears the hat/cap covering his ears. I never know if Wolsey was really eeeeevil or not. I liked the Sam Neill version of Wolsey from The Tudors and I *think* we were supposed to dislike him.  

I often think the guy with the eye patch is Charles Brandon (based on how friendly he is with Henry), and then I remind myself that is Stafford. I then I remember The Tudors and that Stafford was very different.  

[IntrovertRed]

4 hours ago, Darlin said:

I often think the guy with the eye patch is Charles Brandon (based on how friendly he is with Henry), and then I remind myself that is Stafford. I then I remember The Tudors and that Stafford was very different.  

After watching Henry Cavill's portrayal of Charles Brandon in The Tudors, this Charles Brandon just pales by comparison.

However, the actor portraying Henry is doing a damn good job, definitely much better than Rhys-Meyers.  And really Henry, you didn't know that women bleed when losing their virginity?  It will be interesting to see how Catherine explains this once he brings it up.

While Ms. Pole certainly despises the constant scheming of the court, she deftly handled the issue with Compton quite well.  Her parents would be proud.

Maybe I'm just mean, but I'm not feeling a whole lot of sympathy for Catherine.  I don't know if it's the actress or what. 

So that was Mary at the end with Henry?  I kept getting her and Bessie confused. 

Edited November 2, 2020 by KLJ

[rur]

1 minute ago, KLJ said:

However, the actor portraying Henry is doing a damn good job, definitely much better than Rhys-Meyers.  And really Henry, you didn't know that women bleed when losing their virginity?  It will be interesting to see how Catherine explains this once he brings it up.

 

I was fully expecting Maggie Pole to make some comment about horseback riding as an explanation for that problem, so I was a little surprised when she decided to address the mistress problem first. But, in hindsight, it made sense since she managed to have it benefit her.  

[tennisgurl]

The "you look old" "you look fat" exchange made me laugh, it sounded very much like the petty insults people can throw at their siblings. I half expected Meg to stick her tongue out at him if way more serious stuff wasn't happening. Meg has had a lot of really bad breaks lately, but marrying Angus in secret was really not a good move. Not only was he not worth the trouble, marrying someone else as regent in secret is just asking for trouble. 

It really is so sad how having a daughter was considered such a horrible thing, and that the woman was blamed for the gender of the baby (because that's something woman can control apparently) and its sad seeing Catherine's coldness towards baby Mary. She is so upset that she even took it out on Lina, who was only trying to be a good friend. At least we got to see Lina and her family, who are so adorable that they make me nervous. They keep teasing either Lina or Oviedo dying, and now that they have two super cute kids, it would be even worse. 

Ursula was absolutely glowing all episode, I guess her wedding night went well, even with that whole "there will be blood" warning. Maggie might not enjoy playing the royal games, but she is quite good at it when she wants to be. 

Everyone did look extra great this week, the costumes are just so luxurious. 

Edited November 2, 2020 by tennisgurl

[Scarlett45]

10 hours ago, Darlin said:

Are the Phillipa Gregory books the Spanish Princess is based on the Constant Princess, The Kingmaker's Curse and 3 Sisters, 3 Queens?

This show The Spanish Princess based on  Phillipa’s books : The Constant Princess and The King’s Curse- although there’s a good bit of 3 Sisters, 3 Queens in it, but it may have been a licensing issue. 

[Norma Desmond]

11 hours ago, KLJ said:

So that was Mary at the end with Henry?  I kept getting her and Bessie confused. 

It was Bessie Blount.

[qtpye]

On 11/2/2020 at 2:01 AM, Bill1978 said:

I recall reading somewhere that Rhys-Meyers refused to have aged makeup or play fat. I can't recall where I read it and who knows if it is correct because the series originally aired years ago, but if my memory is correct the article painted Rhys-Meyers as being arrogantly vain.

 

On 11/2/2020 at 7:21 AM, Haleth said:

And that's why I could never get passed one episode of The Tudors.  Creative license is one thing, but JRM was so completely miscast in terms of physical appearance. 

I could see a sister teasing a vain brother by announcing he's gotten fat.  Whether he was or not it's not a thing a sister wouldn't say.

The thing that got me was Katherine delivering her baby then waddling over to talk to Henry through the door.  Um, she wasn't done with the birthing, writers.

I have trouble telling some characters apart - Wolsey, More, and certainly all the young courtiers.

But yes, gorgeous costumes.

 

On 11/2/2020 at 12:44 PM, KLJ said:

After watching Henry Cavill's portrayal of Charles Brandon in The Tudors, this Charles Brandon just pales by comparison.

However, the actor portraying Henry is doing a damn good job, definitely much better than Rhys-Meyers.  And really Henry, you didn't know that women bleed when losing their virginity?  It will be interesting to see how Catherine explains this once he brings it up.

While Ms. Pole certainly despises the constant scheming of the court, she deftly handled the issue with Compton quite well.  Her parents would be proud.

Maybe I'm just mean, but I'm not feeling a whole lot of sympathy for Catherine.  I don't know if it's the actress or what. 

So that was Mary at the end with Henry?  I kept getting her and Bessie confused. 

There was an episode of the Tudors where a young fit JRM was talking to the amazingly gorgeous young and fit Henry Cavill about getting old and how their youth was gone and I was like...what the hell? The visuals so did not match a conversation that was supposedly happening between two old men well passed their prime.

The Tudors were like The People vs OJ Simpson. A great show (though it took a lot of historical liberties) with an amazing talent that fucked up casting the main part. JRM was not Henry and Cuba was not OJ.

I think Catherine is jealous of Lina. The queen is very unhappy and her best friend/servant has the marriage and family that she longs for. It does not excuse the bitchy behavior but human nature can be nasty.

Angus was such a dimwit and was not worth all that Margaret had to lose by marrying him.

[Scarlett45]

5 hours ago, qtpye said:

I think Catherine is jealous of Lina. The queen is very unhappy and her best friend/servant has the marriage and family that she longs for. It does not excuse the bitchy behavior but human nature can be nasty.

Angus was such a dimwit and was not worth all that Margaret had to lose by marrying him.

I agree. 
 

IRL I have no idea why Margaret married Angus- she could’ve just kept him on the side and not jeopardized her position as regent. 

[greekmom]

On 11/1/2020 at 10:20 PM, Norma Desmond said:

It was hilarious when Henry's sister Margaret said he was fat. WTF. I know the real Henry got fat and all, but it's not believable to call him fat when the actor is so young and fit and gorgeous - same as on The Tudors, where Anne of Cleves and Catherine Howard were supposed to be repulsed by an aging, smelly and obese Henry, but Jonathan Rhys-Meyers was scorching hot and super trim. The only thing they did there to age Henry was a few strands of grey hair.

 

Anyway, I knew it was Lady Blount who was Henry's mistress, so no surprises. And yes, the costumes were gorgeous as ever.

Did Angus plan on betraying Margaret all along, or he did it in the end just to save his own hide?

I was just coming to post that the actor who plays Henry is going to need padding because Henry got fat.

I felt sorry for both Catherine and Meg. Catherine because she is getting blamed for a a girl child and Woslley is whispering in Henry's ear and Meg because Angus betrayed her.

I hope Catherine dismisses Bessie from court.

[CarpeFelis]

The thing that was really unbelievable to me was the scene where Katherine was all “I know you have needs, you can have other women while I’m pregnant, just tell me about it”. Such an attitude among royalty at that time may not have been all that unusual, but Catherine was such a staunch Catholic that it’s hard to imagine her embracing it.

Edited November 4, 2020 by CarpeFelis
typo

[rur]

52 minutes ago, CarpeFelis said:

The thing that was really unbelievable to me was the scene where Katherine was all “I know you have needs, you can have other women while I’m pregnant, just tell me about it”. Such an attitude among royalty at that time may not have been all that unusual, but Catherine was such a staunch Catholic that it’s hard to imagine her embracing it.

Although it may not have actually happened, I can imagine that it could have. She had broken with her father and cast her lot with England and Henry. Doing whatever was necessary to remain in her husband's good graces in hopes of having a male child while she was still capable of having children might have been her best option, as she saw it. 

[CountryGirl]

I'm torn on whether I think RL Katherine gave Henry her blessing to get his "needs" met elsewhere (I recall The Tudors' Jane Seymour doing). I honestly feel like that would have made her more of a doormat, instead of the power play she was angling for. I mean, pretend not to notice, but to say, go ahead and cheat? No. 

While I am glad to see more of this story, especially Katherine (and a red-headed Katherine and Henry!!!) and Henry's early years, man, some of this is so hard to watch.

[Haleth]

Henry already had an illegitimate son by this time, right?  So Katherine was fully aware that he was not faithful. She’d have little leverage to prevent him from sampling the pleasures of the ladies at court though. 

[qtpye]

1 minute ago, Haleth said:

Henry already had an illegitimate son by this time, right?  So Katherine was fully aware that he was not faithful. She’d have little leverage to prevent him from sampling the pleasures of the ladies at court though. 

Wasn't RL Katherine's father, Ferdinand, also a cheater? I think her mother had a grin and bear it attitude (this is what kings do) and Katherine adopted the same.

[Scarlett45]

1 hour ago, Haleth said:

Henry already had an illegitimate son by this time, right?  So Katherine was fully aware that he was not faithful. She’d have little leverage to prevent him from sampling the pleasures of the ladies at court though. 

No not yet. Mary Tudor (the younger) was older than Henry Fiztroy by a couple of years. So at this point Henry has no living children (outside of Mary that was just born). 

[ShellsandCheese]

On 11/4/2020 at 5:59 PM, qtpye said:

Wasn't RL Katherine's father, Ferdinand, also a cheater? I think her mother had a grin and bear it attitude (this is what kings do) and Katherine adopted the same.

Weren't most Kings cheaters back then? I feel like not having some kind of mistress would be the exception to the rule.

Also, Aunt Lady Pole, is becoming my favorite character. She is very good at getting what she wants. And I could listen to Peter Egan's voice all day long. 

Edited November 9, 2020 by ShellsandCheese

[Haleth]

STOP PUTTING OVIEDO IN DANGER, SHOW!  I swear, every week I’m afraid for either him or Lina. I don’t care about anyone else. (Well, since I know how they all end up anyway.)

I’m so glad the show didn’t go there with More and Maggie. I would have thrown something at the tv. 

Edited November 9, 2020 by Haleth

[greekmom]

21 hours ago, ShellsandCheese said:

Also, Aunt Lady Pole, is becoming my favorite character. She is very good at getting what she wants. And I could listen to Peter Egan's voice all day long. 

Yep I agree.

Also, besides cheating, Henry is an ass. I mean to rub it in Catherine's face by leaving Bessie Blout as one of her ladies in waiting.  To go back on his word with his sister. And most important, to trust Wollsey. He thinks just because he knows that W is taking bribes from the French that he is still in control?!!? LOL. I love the fact that W will get his one day.

[tennisgurl]

Henry is such an ass, not only cheating on Catherine but making his side piece one of her ladies and announcing his baby by her to the whole court. Plus just generally treating everyone in his life, including his friends and family, like pawns at best and like garbage at worst, and acting like a petulant child when things don't go his way. Plenty of kings cheated, but you would think most of them were at least somewhat discreet. I think Catherine might have been able to handle him having affairs, as most kings had mistresses and many queens just looked the other way to keep the peace, but she cant handle being publicly humiliated with Henry basically flaunting his affair.  

I am glad that they didn't go there with Moore and Maggie, that would have been a bit much even by this franchises standards. I do like their scenes together though, they seem to really get each other and enjoy each others company without a lot of double talk and court intrigue. Maggie in general is always great, she has so much dignity to her no matter what happens. I am glad that at least Ursula's marriage seems to be going alright so far, she certainly seems happy to be married and on Henrys good side. 

Yeah enjoy it now Wollsey, Henry is the most fickle of people, and that will just become more and more apparent, with his friends, his children, his right hand men, and of course, his wives. 

They just need to stop putting Oviedo and Lina in danger, its stressing me out! 

[Scarlett45]

On 11/8/2020 at 9:15 PM, ShellsandCheese said:

Weren't most Kings cheaters back then? I feel like not having some kind of mistress would be the exception to the rule.

 

Absolutely. Sexual fidelity that was something that was expected of wives not husbands. And in royal/aristocratic circles, if a woman did her duty and produced an heir and a spare, if she wanted to take a lover people usually looked the other way unless there was a political reason not to.

[Norma Desmond]

Great episode. I feel terrible seeing how many of these characters will die by Henry's orders: Stafford, MargaretPole, Thomas More... I don't know at what point in history the series will end, I almost hope it doesn't cover the "crazy Henry  murdering everyone" part.

 

In a way, I kinda wish season 2 never happened, so we could be left with the young, vibrant and in love couple of Henry and Katherine...

 

 

 

 

[CountryGirl]

On 11/8/2020 at 10:15 PM, ShellsandCheese said:

Weren't most Kings cheaters back then? I feel like not having some kind of mistress would be the exception to the rule.

Also, Aunt Lady Pole, is becoming my favorite character. She is very good at getting what she wants. And I could listen to Peter Egan's voice all day long. 

Most were - it appears (from what I've read and I'm talking true history not Phillipa or Allison) ,Henry's daddy (Henry VII) was faithful to Lizzie.

I think I've mentioned this before, but it's interesting to watch Lady Pole and daughter Ursula as if my husband's genealogy work is correct (and he's pretty darn exceptional in this area), he is their direct descendant. 

I was teasing him while watching the "will they or won't they?" between Maggie and Thomas and he was all, "Ew, gross! that's my grandma!"

[brisbydog]

Catherine would know and accept that kings have mistresses, she would not act like some modern wife accusing her husband of cheating. This was her king, and he could and would do what he wanted and she would (and the real Catherine did) look away and stay dignified

I literally screamed 'oh come on' when Mary Sue Catherine performed an episiotomy on Bessie Blount. Seriously show?

What I really loathe about Philippa Gregory is the modern nicknames: Maggie, Teddy, Lizzie and now Charlie. It pulls me out of the time period. 

 

[AryasMum]

I realize little girls being betrothed to grown men was common in this time. But the girls were not treated like fiancés. They did not socialize with their intended. They were fostered by the man’s family and then wed when they came of age. It’s ridiculous watching that little girl acting the part, accompanying her betrothed like a woman grown. 

[Norma Desmond]

9 hours ago, brisbydog said:

I literally screamed 'oh come on' when Mary Sue Catherine performed an episiotomy on Bessie Blount. Seriously show?

That was a real "what the F..." moment.

 

"Katherine of Aragon: Wife. Queen. Warrior. Surgeon"

 

A bit too far, I'd say.

[Norma Desmond]

So, apparently, with only 2 episodes to go, the Boleyn angle won't play a big part at all. Neither will the fall of Margaret Pole, Thomas More, Stafford, Wolsey, etc

I hope they include Katherine's famous, heartbreaking speech at Blackfriars (“Take of me some pity and compassion, for I am a poor woman, and a stranger born out of your dominion. I have here no assured friends, and much less impartial counsel"). Lina will probaly be shown here as the last loyal lady in waiting to Katherine, who was with her until the end.

It was nice to see Rosa, and that her character got some closure. Henry is still an ass and the costumes are  glorious, as usual.

Edited November 15, 2020 by Norma Desmond

[Haleth]

The two kings brawling like a couple gutter rats?  Um, no. 

[childeroland]

That really happened, apparently, though I'm not sure if it was as big a deal as they made it (and I don't think it had anything to do with Mary).

[Scarlett45]

3 hours ago, Norma Desmond said:

It was nice to see Rosa, and that her character got some closure. Henry is still an ass and the costumes are  glorious, as usual.

The costume design this season has been phenomenal. 

1 hour ago, childeroland said:

That really happened, apparently, though I'm not sure if it was as big a deal as they made it (and I don't think it had anything to do with Mary).

Yes the did have a wrestling match. No it didn’t have anything to do with Mary, just young rich men engaging in horseplay.