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DWTS: Juniors Spoilers and Speculations

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Is Tom going to be hosting the Jr. Show also?   Only reason I would even tune in would be him and that is questionable.

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16 minutes ago, PhD-Purgatory15 said:

No. Tom is definitely not hosting the Kids version. The heavy speculation is that Jordan Fisher, the winner from a couple of seasons ago will be the host.

Thanks.  I'm out then.

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I said it in General Gabbery, but if all or most of the Junior Pros are going to be either relatives/friends/clients of the Grownup Pros (I see that two of them are Lindsay's sister and Jenna's niece) or retreads from other shows, I don't know how to feel about that.

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12 hours ago, LexieLily said:

I said it in General Gabbery, but if all or most of the Junior Pros are going to be either relatives/friends/clients of the Grownup Pros (I see that two of them are Lindsay's sister and Jenna's niece) or retreads from other shows, I don't know how to feel about that.

I think that's just going to happen with any show like this. The dance world is small to begin with, and then you filter them through criteria of:

  • have enough dance experience to be considered a "pro"
  • between the ages of 10-13 (slightly older for the boys, likely because of hight issues) 
  • with parents/guardians willing to relocate them to LA for the summer for a television show

I think you naturally will end up with a pool full of kids who are "on the circuit," for lack of a better word, for other television shows. (For better or worse.)

Here's the full list of mini pros (source

Quote

The new cast consists of Rylee Arnold, Hailey Bills, Brightyn Brems, Artyon Celestine, JT Church, Kami Couch, Tristan Ianeiro, Lev Khmelev, Jake Monreal, Kamri Peterson, Sage Rosen, and Eliana Walmsley. 

Rylee is Lindsay‘s younger sister, Hailey is Jenna‘s niece; and Artyon was on America’s Got Talent.

JT and Jake from the Next Generation season of SYTYCD; and Eliana has been on Dance Moms as well.

(I don't know any of them besides JT and Jake, and then knowing of Lindsey's sister & Jenna's niece.)

 

I'm not going to be making this appointment television. (Though I did get sucked into clips of The Voice Kids UK on youtube the other day and it was the cutest damn thing I'd ever seen, so maybe I should never say never.) The couple thoughts I have about this version kinda boil down to

  • They went real young with the casting, which makes me hope that DWTS fans go a bit easy on them, because they can be cruel and these are kid kids. Even as much as I want to eyeroll at some of the "celeb" casting rumors (Bristol Palin's son? Bleh), I find myself wanting to take it more easy on them?
  • I'm curious to see how the actual pros do as mentors and what that will mean in the construct of the format they set up. Hayley and Brandon from troupe have gotten bumped up to mentors on this version, which seems like an indication they're on the track to potentially get a pro spot in the future, so it might be interesting to see them in a potentially bigger role.  
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Hmmm...so Jenna has her fiance, a former partner she won a MBT with, and a woman that she has choreographed with as judges. Nothing biased there at all. Calling it right now, Jenna, her niece and partner will be in the finale.

Edited by BeeBop88
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1 hour ago, BeeBop88 said:

Hmmm...so Jenna has her fiance, a former partner she won a MBT with, and a woman that she has choreographed with as judges. Nothing biased there at all. Calling it right now, Jenna, her niece and partner will be in the finale.

If Jenna wins her MBT with the Athlete Four Week Mini-Season of DWTS and DWTS Kids, can we count those as participation trophy mirror balls and not against the real count? ;) 

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Jenna's "star" is Tripp Palin. Anyone remember watching his Mom dance? I don't think he's going to win.

Maddie Ziegler's younger sister is a "star" is well. Which is odd, because she should be a pro. Her partner is actually a professional dancer, Sage Rosen. It's kind of ridiculous (going against a spelling bee winner), but so is the casting every season.

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Adam Rippon as a judge is ridiculous. I think he only had 2/3 ballroom dances on DWTS Season 25. He is no expert. I hated it that DWTS kept making it seem that Adam got a bronze medal for an individual performance, when in reality he got the bronze medal for the TEAM competition, IOW, more people other than him were involved in getting that bronze olympic medal.  Same thing with that Asian chic that was on there, but they didn't push the misrepresentation with her, as much as with Adam.

And I just knew a Chmerkovskiy had to be involved. Yuck.

2 hours ago, DancingD said:

Jenna's "star" is Tripp Palin. Anyone remember watching his Mom dance? I don't think he's going to win.

Maddie Ziegler's younger sister is a "star" is well. Which is odd, because she should be a pro. Her partner is actually a professional dancer, Sage Rosen. It's kind of ridiculous (going against a spelling bee winner), but so is the casting every season.

Well, I sure hope not.  I would not be surprised if they are in the finale, at least. If he is like Bristol, that name he has will well suit him. Because she sure did a lot of Trippin' around that dance floor with Mark. It sure was cringe worthy. 

Edited by BeeBop88
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Isn’t Bristol’s son only about 8?  I thought that the kids would be 12 - 14 years old, not elementery school kids.  Kids that young; it just seems mean to judge them.  

Is this show supposed to air yet this summer?  

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7 hours ago, Mittengirl said:

 

Is this show supposed to air yet this summer?  

Starts October 7th.  Well, this frees up my Sundays.  I don't mind Jordan and Frankie, but Adam is a judge on the basis of....WHAT EXACTLY?! 

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If their target audience is 12 year olds then that is a strange choice of judges. I doubt kids would be interested in Val, Adam, or Mandy, much less heard of them. Why didn't they just poll some kids to see whom they liked?

And Bristol Palin's kid as a contestant? Yikes, I guess she's really desperate for another 15 minutes.

Edited by boyznkatz
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57 minutes ago, PTVjones said:

Can someone help me clarify? Does this mean that there's no regular season in the fall? 

Season 27 (which Tom has promised to be a full-length, normal season) premieres Monday 9/24 @ 8pm. The Junior season doesn’t begin until Sunday 10/7. 

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This show is so weird. I will watch almost for the trainwreck appeal.  I'm glad it's taped only because kids and live eliminations need to be taped.  I don't know if anyone remembers the US version of X Factor, which was live and had kids competing and some of the kids had full on breakdowns on live tv when eliminated.  I think this is safer so they can edit around the super uncomfortable stuff.  Kind of how Masterchef Jr. does.   Sure there are tears sometimes on the latter, but it's taped so you always get to see the kids looking happier after the fact when they have had time to collect themselves and such.  And you avoid the full on meltdown aspect.

The casting for both the judges and kids are a bit weird.  Mackenzie Ziegler counts as a celeb, yet little Eliana also of Dance Moms is a pro.  I knew about the relatives of our current pros and I get the dance world is small and of course Lindsay would be paired with her sister and Jenna her nieces.

The main reason I think the judging panel is so weird is you would think they would choose a judging panel that might appeal to kids...and on what planet do Mandy Moore, Val and Adam do that?  I get it's also annoying since it's basically a Jenna love-in panel, but I think with Jenna being handed Bristol's kid there is little chance of her "winning" her second fake season.  But Adam barely did any ballroom in his own mini season and knows nothing about ballroom.  Val is Val.  He claims he loves kids, blah blah, and even though he's full of crap...at least he does know ballroom.   Would I rather see another pro?  Yes, but this is DWTS and they love them some Val.

I guess they chose Frankie and Jordan after they co-hosted the last tour.  But it all feels so random.

The one thing I do kind of like is that online fanbases will play pretty much no role since the show is taped.  There is an audience vote that will get factored in with the judges vote and the family/friends of those involved won't get to vote.  So in some ways, I think that might make for a fairer contest since popularity will come into play less.  Mackenzie's crazy online Dance Moms fanbase will be annoying while the show is on, but they can't actually vote for her or anything else.  It won't matter if a kid has a million followers or 25k, or the pros too for that matter.

I also think that is what will do Bristol's kid in too.  With the at home audience not voting, her conservative backing won't have a chance to vote and I'm willing to bet that most LA in studio audiences aren't super conservative.

Also if I had to call a winner without seeing anything, I call Miles and Rylee.  He can dance and is cute and so is she.

Edited by spanana

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I don't think even conservatives care about Bristol Palin anymore. That fifteen minutes expired at least 5 years ago.

By the way, the Jenna/Val worship from the show is really bizarre. How weird to make a kids' show about a couple of geezers no kids have ever heard of.

Edited by boyznkatz
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Are they trying to appeal to kids?  Or to parents/grandparents?  Seems more like they are going for adults.

My local news said (maybe a spoiler)

Spoiler

Honey Boo Boo

is one of the “celebs” and I just can’t see kids giving even half a hoot about her.

Edited by Mittengirl · Reason: Tried to remove my spoiler but since I can’t remember how I did it, it will have to stay.

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I don't know who they are trying to appeal to honestly.  Kids likely won't care but I'm not sure the regular DWTS audience will either.

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4 hours ago, JeezumCrow said:

Season 27 (which Tom has promised to be a full-length, normal season) premieres Monday 9/24 @ 8pm. The Junior season doesn’t begin until Sunday 10/7. 

Thank you! Even though I feel like I'm still confused...

I feel like a few of the pro children are not ballroom dancers, since when is Eliana from Dance Moms a ballroom dancer? Plus, if that means her horrible mother will be around then I'm not into it...

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3 hours ago, spanana said:

This show is so weird. I will watch almost for the trainwreck appeal.  I'm glad it's taped only because kids and live eliminations need to be taped.  I don't know if anyone remembers the US version of X Factor, which was live and had kids competing and some of the kids had full on breakdowns on live tv when eliminated.  I think this is safer so they can edit around the super uncomfortable stuff.  Kind of how Masterchef Jr. does.   Sure there are tears sometimes on the latter, but it's taped so you always get to see the kids looking happier after the fact when they have had time to collect themselves and such.  And you avoid the full on meltdown aspect.

Rachel Crowe from season one of X-Factor is immediately who I thought of for why they wanted to tape the eliminations. She collapsed to the floor in tears and started wailing to the point her mom had to come up on stage because the host was useless at attempting to comfort her, and I still to this day remember her tearful "Mommy, you promised me!" It was uncomfortable enough to see Willow Shields get eliminated at fourteen from the grown-up DWTS, and she took it surprisingly well.

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1 hour ago, LexieLily said:

Rachel Crowe from season one of X-Factor is immediately who I thought of for why they wanted to tape the eliminations. She collapsed to the floor in tears and started wailing to the point her mom had to come up on stage because the host was useless at attempting to comfort her, and I still to this day remember her tearful "Mommy, you promised me!" It was uncomfortable enough to see Willow Shields get eliminated at fourteen from the grown-up DWTS, and she took it surprisingly well.

Yes, she was exactly who I was thinking of when I mentioned X Factor.

Eliana from Dance Moms isn't a ballroom dancer, but neither are a few of the other kid pros.  At least outside of maybe doing some ballroom bootcamp in the last few months.  Ballroom didn't seem to be a prerequisite to be chosen.  Also they are having a troupe of four kids, and again, they aren't necessarily ballroom.  My guess is they figure the young kids can fake it well enough and nobody will care, especially since they aren't really doing the choreographing and teaching.  Though I have to think if they really have the kid celebs do ballroom, the ones paired with the actual trained ballroom dancers that already know how to partner will be at an advantage.  I also expect there will be a lot of contemp and jazz mixed in.  I wouldn't be surprised if we get hip hop too considering I think a few of the kids specialize in hip hop.

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52 minutes ago, spanana said:

Yes, she was exactly who I was thinking of when I mentioned X Factor.

Eliana from Dance Moms isn't a ballroom dancer, but neither are a few of the other kid pros.  At least outside of maybe doing some ballroom bootcamp in the last few months.  Ballroom didn't seem to be a prerequisite to be chosen.  Also they are having a troupe of four kids, and again, they aren't necessarily ballroom.  My guess is they figure the young kids can fake it well enough and nobody will care, especially since they aren't really doing the choreographing and teaching.  Though I have to think if they really have the kid celebs do ballroom, the ones paired with the actual trained ballroom dancers that already know how to partner will be at an advantage.  I also expect there will be a lot of contemp and jazz mixed in.  I wouldn't be surprised if we get hip hop too considering I think a few of the kids specialize in hip hop.

So how is this different from So You Think You Can Dance: The Next Generation?

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On 7/29/2018 at 11:18 PM, Mittengirl said:

Isn’t Bristol’s son only about 8?  I thought that the kids would be 12 - 14 years old, not elementary school kids.  Kids that young; it just seems mean to judge them.   

Yet that's when many of the pros started their competitive careers.  Heck, I've seen pics of a six-year-old Anna Trebunskaya in competition.  So to me, it's not that big a deal that they're going to be judged.  They have to get used to being coached, critiqued, and judged now because they're going to be dealing with all three events many times throughout their lives.

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Mini pros & mentors

 

1 hour ago, Emily-D said:

Has the show started taping yet and if so do we know who has been eliminated?

First taping was this weekend and apparently had a double elimination. I haven’t come across any spoilers but my wild guess is that one of them was Jenna, her niece, and Tripp based mostly on a sappy, “you’re the most amazing” post Val directed at her almost immediately after the show was supposed to have taped. Felt like a cheer up message. (Also, political family aside, I don’t think Tripp would be able to hang with some of these cross trained Disney kids.) 

We’ll see I guess! I could be off base.

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On 8/1/2018 at 3:45 PM, kitcloudkicker said:

Mini pros & mentors

 

First taping was this weekend and apparently had a double elimination. I haven’t come across any spoilers but my wild guess is that one of them was Jenna, her niece, and Tripp based mostly on a sappy, “you’re the most amazing” post Val directed at her almost immediately after the show was supposed to have taped. Felt like a cheer up message. (Also, political family aside, I don’t think Tripp would be able to hang with some of these cross trained Disney kids.) 

We’ll see I guess! I could be off base.

I wonder if Emma and the girl she is mentoring Elliana  Walmsley and celeb kid partner ? were the first to be eliminated. Emma has posted zip on her twitter account about DWTS Jr like the other dance pros has. She has posted a couple times on her IG acct. But I have a sneaking suspicion about it.

 

Edited: Scratch that. From a post tonight and an Insta story, it seems Emma's team is still alive and well and still competing. 

Edited by BeeBop88

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The thing about it is while I haven't seen official spoilers, the pros aren't doing a very good job covering up who is still in it and who isn't.  They have taped three shows so far and the pros posting from the tapings with their pros who are costumed up are definitely still in it.  Whereas Jenna's niece seemed to be back in Utah after the first show and Jenna has posted nothing from rehearsals/tapings (also hence Val's post).  Also Hayley was out and about with Derek during a taping...so my assumption is they are both gone.

Whereas Cheryl, Lindsay, Wit, Emma and Sasha in particular are posting quite a bit from the tapings.  Emma's kids were definitely still in considering her kid was getting all Disneyfied in hair and make-up the other day, at least as of that show.  Mind you I don't think anybody in the media cares enough to pay attention, but fans will at the very least know who is in the finals at this rate long before it airs, unless the show shuts them down from posting at some point.

I have heard rumors that Brandon's people are doing quite well.  Also that the judges are being harder on the kids with dance experience, namely Miles and Mackenzie.

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I think some of them have been doing “decoy shots” - posting old pictures from hair and makeup during show days to try and throw people off, but yeah, for the most part it seems a bit sloppy. The subset of fans that pay close attention is probably such a small percentage of the viewing audience they don’t care, is what I would guess? 

I’ve heard some of the elimination order, though all of it is unverified rumors, so I have no idea if it’s right. I know we don’t have to do spoilers in a spoiler thread, but I’ll do it in case 

Spoiler

Here’s the (totally unverified, might be wrong) scuttlebutt I’ve seen so far on eliminations:

 

Week 1 (double):

Jenna’s team

Keos team 

 

Week 2:

Hayleys team

 

Week 3:

Sashas team 

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So who are the “Stars”?   So far I have heard mention of three - Palin kid (Tripp?), Honey Boo Boo, and the youngest son on Blackish.   

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1 hour ago, Mittengirl said:

So who are the “Stars”?   So far I have heard mention of three - Palin kid (Tripp?), Honey Boo Boo, and the youngest son on Blackish.   

 

If you click through to this Twitter thread ☝?the replies contain the best summary I’ve seen. I know like, none of them, but I do get the context of some of them (Stevie Wonder’s son, Scottie Pippen’s daughter)

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And I'd argue in some cases the kid pros are probably more known than the celebs.  Or I should say, have more tv exposure and therefore more fans.  For instance, Jake Monreal and Scottie Pippen's daughter.  Jake was on SYTYCD when they did a kids version (and Jenna mentored him) whereas obviously Scottie Pippen's daughter isn't necessarily known in her own right.

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1 hour ago, LexieLily said:

I'm going straight to hell but it cracks me up that even on a kiddie season Keo STILL gets eliminated first.

I have nothing against Keo, but I wish the show would stop trying to make him happen. He’s not going to happen. At least not on DWTS, if history is any indicator.

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16 hours ago, JeezumCrow said:

I have nothing against Keo, but I wish the show would stop trying to make him happen. He’s not going to happen. At least not on DWTS, if history is any indicator.

So agree.  He should stay overseas if he wants to be competitive.  A lot of DWTSs viewers see ballroom as a non-Black dance style. 

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On 8/5/2018 at 8:28 PM, kitcloudkicker said:

I think some of them have been doing “decoy shots” - posting old pictures from hair and makeup during show days to try and throw people off, but yeah, for the most part it seems a bit sloppy. The subset of fans that pay close attention is probably such a small percentage of the viewing audience they don’t care, is what I would guess? 

I’ve heard some of the elimination order, though all of it is unverified rumors, so I have no idea if it’s right. I know we don’t have to do spoilers in a spoiler thread, but I’ll do it in case 

  Reveal hidden contents

Here’s the (totally unverified, might be wrong) scuttlebutt I’ve seen so far on eliminations:

 

Week 1 (double):

Jenna’s team

Keos team 

 

Week 2:

Hayleys team

 

Week 3:

Sashas team 

Not only do we not HAVE to do spoiler tags in a spoiler thread, we're actually not SUPPOSED to use them in one.  The whole point of a spoiler thread is to be able to freely discuss spoilers -- anyone who doesn't want to be spoiled knows enough to stay out of here until after the show has aired in its entirety!

On 8/8/2018 at 1:18 PM, crossover said:

So agree.  He should stay overseas if he wants to be competitive.  A lot of DWTSs viewers see ballroom as a non-Black dance style. 

Tell that to Strictly's Oti Mabuse.

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10 hours ago, legaleagle53 said:

Tell that to Strictly's Oti Mabuse.

I thought she was runner-up a couple seasons ago?  I really didn't mean a win is guaranteed but maybe he wouldn't end toward the bottom all the time.

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47 minutes ago, crossover said:

I thought she was runner-up a couple seasons ago?  I really didn't mean a win is guaranteed but maybe he wouldn't end toward the bottom all the time.

You just proved my point. I was answering your statement that ballroom is seen as a non-black dance style.  Oti's popularity in the UK clearly proves that that's not true, nor is it true on other versions of DWTS that have had black celebrities and pros.  Keo's race has nothing to do with it. It's simply that for whatever reason, he can't deliver the goods on DWTS and has failed to click with viewers. He may not necessarily do any better on Strictly or any other version.

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I don’t think the viewership is resistant to a black pro, I think it’s this particular pro. Something with Keo just isn’t clicking. Maybe if TPTB weren’t limiting the roster to one black pro it would be easier to see that it’s the individual and not his race. 

 

I think Keo is a great dancer but he does nothing for me with any of his celebrity partners. Usually when pros don’t ‘pop,’ they get replaced. Maybe the network just doesn’t want to roll the dice with a different black pro since this attempt hasn’t been incredibly successful (a devil-you-know kind of scenario) but they don’t want to risk whitewashing the roster, either. I understand it. But I think Keo has been given plenty of partner opportunities on DWTS and I’d welcome a change in the pro lineup. 

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2 hours ago, legaleagle53 said:

You just proved my point. I was answering your statement that ballroom is seen as a non-black dance style.  Oti's popularity in the UK clearly proves that that's not true, nor is it true on other versions of DWTS that have had black celebrities and pros.  Keo's race has nothing to do with it. It's simply that for whatever reason, he can't deliver the goods on DWTS and has failed to click with viewers. He may not necessarily do any better on Strictly or any other version.

Oh I see what you meant.  I wasn't looking at the world.  I was just talking about the average US DWTSs viewer. 

1 hour ago, JeezumCrow said:

I don’t think the viewership is resistant to a black pro, I think it’s this particular pro. Something with Keo just isn’t clicking. Maybe if TPTB weren’t limiting the roster to one black pro it would be easier to see that it’s the individual and not his race. 

 

You may be right of course.  I just don't agree. 

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I used to live in Memphis, and believe me, plenty of black people study ballroom, contemporary, ballet and jazz dance. I don't think Keo being black has anything to do with it, either, He seems popular with his partners and dances well, so I don't get why he doesn't do well. Maybe he just isn't that great of a teacher?

That said, having one black dance pro is unacceptable. DWTS needs to get more pros of different races, and some LGBT dancers as well. Time to get out of 1980.

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17 hours ago, madpsych78 said:

Isn't a female troupe member black?

Yes, Britt Stewart, but she didn't come in with a ballroom background.  

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On 8/13/2018 at 8:05 AM, boyznkatz said:

I used to live in Memphis, and believe me, plenty of black people study ballroom, contemporary, ballet and jazz dance. I don't think Keo being black has anything to do with it, either, He seems popular with his partners and dances well, so I don't get why he doesn't do well. Maybe he just isn't that great of a teacher?

That said, having one black dance pro is unacceptable. DWTS needs to get more pros of different races, and some LGBT dancers as well. Time to get out of 1980.

Believe me, LGBT dancers are a dime a dozen in the DanceSport world, especially the men.  That's always been one of the most common stereotypes about male dancers, and there's a lot of truth to it:  Pros Louis Van Amstel from DWTS, Ian Waite and Robin Windsor from SCD, and Carmelo Pizzino from the Australian DWTS are all gay and have always been quite open about  it, as are Bruno Tonioli, Craig Revel-Horwood, Australia's Todd McKenney, and the Netherlands' Jan Postulart (all judges on the various international versions of SCD/DWTS, and Todd and Jan were both multiple DanceSport champions in their day). And then you have Benji Schwimmer, Travis Wall, and Mark Kanemura from So You Think You Can Dance.

It's the straight male dancers who are the exception rather than the rule.

Edited by legaleagle53
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15 hours ago, legaleagle53 said:

Believe me, LGBT dancers are a dime a dozen in the DanceSport world, especially the men.  That's always been one of the most common stereotypes about male dancers, and there's a lot of truth to it:  Pros Louis Van Amstel from DWTS, Ian Waite and Robin Windsor from SCD, and Carmelo Pizzino from the Australian DWTS are all gay and have always been quite open about  it, as are Bruno Tonioli, Craig Revel-Horwood, Australia's Todd McKenney, and the Netherlands' Jan Postulart (all judges on the various international versions of SCD/DWTS, and Todd and Jan were both multiple DanceSport champions in their day). And then you have Benji Schwimmer, Travis Wall, and Mark Kanemura from So You Think You Can Dance.

It's the straight male dancers who are the exception rather than the rule.

Yep, it's very strange that dwts only manages to get blonde, straight dancers. Dance is one of the few fields that is truly diverse. They do a pretty good job getting a good mix of contestants. No clue why they can't do the same with their dancers.

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4 minutes ago, boyznkatz said:

Yep, it's very strange that dwts only manages to get blonde, straight dancers. Dance is one of the few fields that is truly diverse. They do a pretty good job getting a good mix of contestants. No clue why they can't do the same with their dancers.

But they did.  As I pointed out, former DWTS pro Louis Van Amstel is openly gay, and I suspect that many of the male pros in the troupe are.  They simply prefer not to define themselves by their sexual orientation, because that's not what they're about.

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On 8/21/2018 at 1:43 PM, legaleagle53 said:

But they did.  As I pointed out, former DWTS pro Louis Van Amstel is openly gay, and I suspect that many of the male pros in the troupe are.  They simply prefer not to define themselves by their sexual orientation, because that's not what they're about.

Maybe boyznkatz is referring to the female pros when talking about the "blonde, straight dancers." Gay male dancers may be a dime a dozen, but how many of the female pros are lesbians?

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6 hours ago, madpsych78 said:

Maybe boyznkatz is referring to the female pros when talking about the "blonde, straight dancers." Gay male dancers may be a dime a dozen, but how many of the female pros are lesbians?

There undoubtedly are quite a number of them.  But the gay stereotype only applies to male dancers because DanceSport is traditionally seen as a "feminine" sport, so no one would really care about lesbian pros or even  expect to find them in DanceSport.  The place to find lesbians, such people would argue, is in traditionally "masculine" sports such as hockey, baseball/softball, soccer, and basketball.  And as I said, most gay dancers really don't care to be defined solely by their sexuality (Louis certainly doesn't; I asked him once whether he had formally come out by acknowledging his sexual orientation and he responded that he never really considered himself to be "in" -- he simply didn't believe in putting a label on it or in being defined solely as a gay dancer), so that's another reason that we really haven't seen that many openly gay/lesbian pros on DWTS or anywhere else.  They simply consider their sexual orientation to be (a) nobody's business and (b) irrelevant.

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