S01.E08: Mother of the Year

[mtlchick]

8 hours ago, SnarkEnthusiast said:

Did anyone else see MJ Rodriguez back up dancing for Janelle Monae on LSSC this week?

I did now!  Thanks!  

[Guest]

On 7/23/2018 at 2:14 PM, Shadowcat2576 said:

While I'm not a fan of the character of Stan, I'm a bit disappointed that they chose to end the Stan/Angel storyline. I get that the main focus is the NYC ball culture, but this show has given us a lot to explore and discuss about the LGBT experience and especially that of transgender women. I think watching Angel try to adjust to the New Jersey suburbs life she thinks she wants would be interesting. So would seeing how people outside the culture react to Stan and Angel as a couple.

I thought he was going to murder her outside the ball for rejection revenge, so the wimpy ending was appreciated nonetheless.

Eh, I took his suburbs promise as desperation to get Angel back so he wouldn't be alone and have to face his identity crisis. Even if she agreed, he'd always find a way to kick the can down the road or subjugate her to preserve his self-image. "I can't find a house/Patty's keeping the kids from me/you can't be seen in public with me here etc." She'd never be happy because he's neurotic and still raw over his lost reputation. The affair was sexy because it was forbidden and a mutual fantasy for Stan and Angel for different reasons, but now that the secret's out and his wife is gone, all that's left is trying to make it work as an actual couple, which is much less appealing to both and doesn't really go with either of their lifestyles.

Edited July 25, 2018 by Guest

[Surrealist]

17 hours ago, vixenbynight said:

Tens across the boards.

I am so glad that FX greenlighted another season for Pose, even though it never got the ratings and folks complaining about the limited levels of acting. When I initially heard about the show, I totally expected nothing but camp (which I love) and not "Downton Abbey" acting, but we got amazing stories about these characters lives. I started to care about them (not too much about Matt and Stan) and want them to succeed. I am glad that the "other shoe" did not drop for Blanca, Elektra and Angel in the season finale. They were able to survive and truly know that they are a family.

I am so excited for season two.

I was thinking about what to post, but you've how I felt about the finale too.

I cannot wait for season two.

[heckkitty]

On 7/23/2018 at 12:37 PM, WednesdayAddams said:

 

I thought Elektra was based on a real Mother (can't remember her name)

 

Crystal Labeija, at least vocally. 

[Scarlett45]

9 hours ago, SnarkEnthusiast said:

The affair was sexy because it was forbidden and a mutual fantasy for Stan and Angel for different reasons, but now that the secret's out and his wife is gone, all that's left is trying to make it work as an actual couple, which is much less appealing to both and doesn't really go with either of their lifestyles.

Exactly! You’ve summed it up perfectly. 

 

I do wonder if they will have Evan Peters come back next season, or Angel will have another love interest. 

[CofCinci]

I appreciate a finale without some sort of shock-value cliffhanger. It’s refreshing. I look forward to seeing more of this family next year. 

[qtpye]

On 7/24/2018 at 9:19 AM, Mattipoo said:

Wow this was such a great season finale! Love all the ballroom scenes especially the pose-off between the Evangelistas and the House of Ferocity.

I was so afraid Stan or Dawson was going to kill Angel, since she is supposed to be based on Venus Xtravaganza, and was glad they didn’t go that route.

Elektra’s acting definitely improved through the season, especially after she showed her softer side. I thought she was channeling Naomi Campbell most of the prior episodes.

Yay for Jiggly Caliente from RuPaul’s Drag Race as one of the new members of House of Ferocity. She was werking it in the ballroom pose-off in her mother of the bride realness.

Ricky and Damon dancing for Al B Sure was cute.

Love Pray Tell’s new man being so accepting of his HIV status.

Billy Porter and MJ Rodriguez deserve every acting award that will hopefully be bestowed on them next year!

Its weird, I always thought Venus looked most like Lulu, but Lulu did not seem to be prostituting herself. I liked the finale and that everyone was happy. I did think it odd that Lulu and Candy were Blanca's friends and now they hate her for no reason. It was like on Glee when the cheerleaders would be nice to Rachel and then they would be enemies because the writing needed them to be. I guess with Abundance out of commission we still needed a foe to our lovable underdogs.

[ZuluQueenOfDwarves]

18 hours ago, qtpye said:

Its weird, I always thought Venus looked most like Lulu, but Lulu did not seem to be prostituting herself. I liked the finale and that everyone was happy. I did think it odd that Lulu and Candy were Blanca's friends and now they hate her for no reason. It was like on Glee when the cheerleaders would be nice to Rachel and then they would be enemies because the writing needed them to be. I guess with Abundance out of commission we still needed a foe to our lovable underdogs.

It would be so much better if they were friends when the sun was up and rivals at the balls. And I mean rivals, not enemies. They’re not divas, they’re straight up hateful to Blanca for no apparent reason. And Pray Tell is the same way to Candy. This episode was justified because he’s probably pissed at the way she treats Blanca, but the last one, when she gets the silicone injections, he crossed the line from camp to cruel. 

[Dee]

Pray Tell wasn't mean to Candy.

She was the one determined to walk in categories she wasn't suited for.

[ichbin]

On 7/25/2018 at 7:22 AM, Scarlett45 said:

I do wonder if they will have Evan Peters come back next season,

Although he appears to be a Ryan Murphy favorite, I hope he doesn't return.  

[noveltylibrary]

This show started out really well but is getting kind of corny.  Hope it gets edgier.

[AmandaPanda]

I also hope Evan Peters doesn't come back next year. I love him and think he's a fantastic actor, but his character served its purpose. I'm positive that whole plot was added to get some "name" actors who could be used heavily in promotional materials. However, Peters, Kate Mara, and James Van Der Beek have all served their purposes. Their plot has come to a natural close and we don't need to come up with anything new for them. 

I can see where they'll try to amp up the drama between Ricky and Damon next season. Maybe Damon will suffer some major setback with his dancing while Ricky turns the Al B Sure tour into another job, which sets it up where Ricky is more successful in his dancing career than Damon is. I just hope the actor playing Damon would be able to bring some depth to that storyline, rather than just having Damon be super petulant. 

Love that the show didn't succumb to the Bury Your Gays trope this season. That was a very refreshing change of pace. 

[ElectricBoogaloo]

13 hours ago, AmandaPanda said:

I also hope Evan Peters doesn't come back next year. I love him and think he's a fantastic actor, but his character served its purpose. I'm positive that whole plot was added to get some "name" actors who could be used heavily in promotional materials. However, Peters, Kate Mara, and James Van Der Beek have all served their purposes. Their plot has come to a natural close and we don't need to come up with anything new for them.

I agree. I totally understand casting those three to draw people in, but I don't want to keep them on the show now that Angel has moved on. I would hate to see her storyline next season center around any of those three characters. One thing I really dislike is when shows keep a character because the writers/producers like the actor. Great if he's a nice guy, but you need to think from a writer's point of view, not as a person who likes the guy. If a character has served his purpose, let him go. Please don't create lame reasons to keep the character on the show! All three of them were great in those roles, but I don't want them shoehorned into Angel's storyline next year.

[bosawks]

Out of the three I guess I would follow Kate Mara's character.  Patty got more interesting to me as the season went on as Stan got less.

[Scarlett45]

On 8/20/2018 at 11:49 AM, bosawks said:

Out of the three I guess I would follow Kate Mara's character.  Patty got more interesting to me as the season went on as Stan got less.

This is true, but how would she mesh with the rest of the cast? Unless her master is in social work or health care and she ended up working at one of the HIV/AIDS clinics Pray Tell & Blanca visit. 

[RealReality]

I love this show.  So glad I watched it right before the second season.  

Yes, it was all cheesy and slightly cliche but I loved the whole episode.  And I don't care what anyone says, I don't care how awful her acting is...and it's bad...but I love me some Elektra!  She does give me that reformed creula di ville realness, but that was my favorite Disney villain, and I found everyone else, including the dalmations boring 

I have a sensitive question to ask.  And maybe no one will read this.  Please don't get mad and understand that I'm coming from a place where I'm curious and want to understand.

But once Elektra got her operation, why didn't she look for a straight sugar daddy?  As beautiful as her face and body are, I feel like a lot of straight men would be attracted to her.  And I didn't get the impression that the sex had to be enjoyable for her, she just wanted to be cared for.  So what am I missing?

[Blakeston]

On 5/28/2019 at 2:42 AM, RealReality said:

I have a sensitive question to ask.  And maybe no one will read this.  Please don't get mad and understand that I'm coming from a place where I'm curious and want to understand.

But once Elektra got her operation, why didn't she look for a straight sugar daddy?  As beautiful as her face and body are, I feel like a lot of straight men would be attracted to her.  And I didn't get the impression that the sex had to be enjoyable for her, she just wanted to be cared for.  So what am I missing?

Realistically, I think she would have marketed herself to typical straight guys before she resorted to sleeping at a booth in a fast food place.

I think the idea may have been that she couldn't compete with cisgender prostitutes who are half her age, and much more conventionally feminine looking. (I think she's beautiful enough that she could find men happy to pay for sex with her - but finding a super-wealthy one willing to give her the lifestyle she wanted might be difficult.)

If I were the one writing this show, I would have included a scene where Electra tells Blanca, "I thought about escorting for straight guys, but it's too dangerous. I'm a transsexual celebrity in this town, and you know how word gets around. Sooner or later my johns would find out that the woman they're fucking used to have a dick, and then one of them would probably kill me."

[Scarlett45]

On 6/20/2019 at 10:08 AM, Blakeston said:

Realistically, I think she would have marketed herself to typical straight guys before she resorted to sleeping at a booth in a fast food place.

I think the idea may have been that she couldn't compete with cisgender prostitutes who are half her age, and much more conventionally feminine looking. (I think she's beautiful enough that she could find men happy to pay for sex with her - but finding a super-wealthy one willing to give her the lifestyle she wanted might be difficult.)

If I were the one writing this show, I would have included a scene where Electra tells Blanca, "I thought about escorting for straight guys, but it's too dangerous. I'm a transsexual celebrity in this town, and you know how word gets around. Sooner or later my johns would find out that the woman they're fucking used to have a dick, and then one of them would probably kill me."

Yes I agree with you. Also Elektra is not only middled aged, she’s a middle aged dark skinned black woman. The market for men who’d want her as a kept woman (meaning they’d have to be wealthy enough to afford her) is small. As a pre-op trans woman the market of men interested in keeping her is smaller but as a “commodity” she was rare enough that it worked out. The city is filled with pretty, well kept middle aged cis black women to compete with. 

Add that to Elektra very much lives in and embraces her community- she wouldn’t want deny that or hide that, it would be a lot of work. 

[RealReality]

Thank you @Blakeston and @Scarlett45 for the kind and thoughtful responses.

[Meedis]

On 7/22/2018 at 9:13 PM, mtlchick said:

I did bust out laughing that Electra lost her shit over Al B Sure. 

On 7/23/2018 at 10:42 PM, Mumbles said:

That was the best. She was so girlishly gleeful and dropped her haughty persona for a few minutes. I loved everyone’s side-eye during it. I remember “Night and Day.” Big hit, but worth Electra losing her mind? (Shrugs). To each their own.

It was so funny seeing Electra fanning herself over Al B Sure.    While "Night and Day" was his big hit, I absolutely loved his R&B infused rendition of The Eagles "Hotel California".

Add me to the list of those glad that Angel survived the season.    

[aradia22]

On a shallow note, the actress who plays Elektra has amazing legs. Like, she looks like a drawing of a person. It's like if someone actually had the proportions of Jessica Rabbit. 

Again, I'm surprised that they had Elektra fall so far and that she apparently had saved nothing to the point that she's sleeping in random restaurants and on park benches. Like, really, she's at Damon's level? And yet Blanca could rent that big apartment? 

Also, it feels like they purposely stopped having Angel work there while Elektra was working there. Why not mine that for drama? 

"Turns out the only thing I'm qualified to do is give orders and look good." Seriously, they should go with the dominatrix thing next season.

I loved Blanca's look when she was trying to get the bartender's attention.

I could watch Blanca setting Pray up on dates/talking about his love life all day. Hilarious. This show needs more fun.

LOL, I missed proactive Blanca from the first episodes. Glad she dragged Elektra to find a job. Also, I'm glad we learned that Elektra also dropped out of school early because it was confusing why she thought she had no job prospects. LOL, this show pretending that no one notices that Elektra must be over 6 ft tall. And that her name is Elektra Abundance. She's not really selling stealth.

Ooh, thank you, Pose, for that scene of Ricky dancing in his crop top. In a different era, he would definitely be in a boy band. 

Kudos to Billy Porter. I didn't think he could pull off shy but I definitely got first date energy from him. It was really cute though. A bit too easy? Maybe. But Pray Tell needs something good in his life.

I don't think Angel is anywhere close to being a good mother but maybe that talk from Blanca will make her shape up.

Patty is making no sense. She doesn't want to see the therapist again. She wants him to give up his job. These decisions don't seem like they're coming from a rational, practical place. The show is acting like they are but I feel like she's just punishing him. It makes more sense for him to work a high paying job and hire a nanny to be with the kids until he can be home. And she can still go to school. 

DEAD. Elektra's gold outfit? I can't. 

Oh, so Lulu is a pole dancer? 

Elektra recruiting new members for Evangelista reminds me of when the New Directions kept picking up new members (that never stuck around for long) on Glee. But whatever, it's the last episode of the season. 

Lulu vs. Blanca was the only part of that battle where Evangelista didn't wipe the floor with Ferocity. It was a little anticlimactic for the battle to be between Evangelista and Ferocity when it's been Evangelista vs. Abundance all season but Lulu and Candy have been nasty so sure, take them down a peg.

Whether Damon would go on tour or go to school was a waste of a plotline but I'm glad he's making the right call and that Ricky still has something good in his life. 

Candy was such a mess at the end of the episode but I'm not going to lie... I enjoyed that fight.

Stan coming back to try and play white knight was... I mean, okay. I guess we needed some resolution. I liked Angel's response to him but it didn't make sense. It didn't make sense with her characterization or behavior up to this point. Actually, I feel like this entire episode is coming from a different writer who has a much happier, more empowered POV that the depressing bleakness we've been stuck in for a while. It appears that those characters are gone for season 2. I do think it's worthwhile for them to continue interrogating the ways mainstream society does and does not accept them more than just talking about balls and personal drama so I'll be interested to see if/how they achieve that. I feel like season 1 really used Paris is Burning as a template. 

Loved Blanca's finally yellow gown. She looked like a goddess.

[aradia22]

Quote

Yeah, I had no problems with Damon giving up the tour to stay in school. His dream is to become a professional dancer. While being a back up dancer would given him some nice cash and experience, that isn't the type of professional dancing that I think that he was dreaming about. He is being professionally trained and his teacher/mentor think he has a lot of raw talent that needs to be developed. 

Agreed. Though I think it would help if we got a clear statement of what Damon wants. Damon said he wants to be a star but very few dancers find that kind of success. It's not an especially lucrative career for the majority of people. I think it would help for us to know what he would consider success. Does he want to be a pop star? Does he want to be a ballet dancer and have artistic success even if he's not the next Baryshnikov? Does he want to dance on Broadway? Does he just want a long career and to maybe transition into being a choreographer? Dance is unique because even if you are one of the best, it doesn't mean fame and fortune. 

I hope the writers have learned what the actors' strengths and weaknesses are and going forward they give the heavy lifting to the ones who can handle it. Some emotions are easy. Even a bad actor's face will usually light up when they smile. And even a weak actor can usually handle anger and screaming. It's all the little subtleties... line readings, conveying thoughtfulness and listening and depth that's harder for some of the actors on the show. Most people don't convey emotions on their faces that easily, especially if for one reason or another they've been socially conditioned to hide their feelings.

[aradia22]

Quote

Eh, I took his suburbs promise as desperation to get Angel back so he wouldn't be alone and have to face his identity crisis. Even if she agreed, he'd always find a way to kick the can down the road or subjugate her to preserve his self-image. "I can't find a house/Patty's keeping the kids from me/you can't be seen in public with me here etc." She'd never be happy because he's neurotic and still raw over his lost reputation. The affair was sexy because it was forbidden and a mutual fantasy for Stan and Angel for different reasons, but now that the secret's out and his wife is gone, all that's left is trying to make it work as an actual couple, which is much less appealing to both and doesn't really go with either of their lifestyles.

I disagree. I know I was getting warning signs about him all season but now that it's over, I think they genuinely wrote Angel a prince charming. I think he would have genuinely tried to have a life with her. He had no problem buying the apartment. He didn't really complain when they spent time together. The problem is that in all the loaded, heteronormative ways, he doesn't have it in him to be a rescuer. We've never really seen him be a strong character. He's a doormat. He didn't live brazenly like Meloni's character. I think he would have genuinely tried. But it would have fallen apart at some point (probably over his kids or the financial instability that disappeared as a plot thread at some point) and he would have given her that sad puppy look and been ineffective but Angel would have been left with nothing. It's better she ended it now.