Social And Race Issues In Black-Ish

[Rae Spellman]

 

Also, is Zoey a common name for black female teenagers? I thought the kids' names were subtext into the "Black-ish" theme.

 

The names are probably meant to tell us something about the Johnson's. I can easily imagine black professionals naming their kids Andre, Diane, Jack, and Zoey. The majority of the people in my (black, working to middle class) family have names that aren't particularly black. My teenaged nephew is named Brandon. Would upper middle class black kids have names that are even less likely to be black than the general black population?

 

Now, even though half the Johnson's I've met are white, their last name seems pretty black to me. 

[Drank-KoolAid]

 

I'd also like to see them talk about first names. I know the pilot had a short scene about "Andy" not being short for "Andre". But, I want to know the story behind the name Rainbow, and also why they chose Jack and Diane for the twins.

"A little diddy, about Jack and Diane." Maybe the show's creator is a John Cougar Mellencamp fan.

 

In my imagination, Rainbow's parents were Northern California hippies from the 1970s.

 

My guess is that Andre and Rainbow didn't want to give their children contemporary "black" names--meaning, names with -sha, La-, Qua-, Tra-, Tre-, etc. And no apostrophes or hyphens. I'm sure they both know the sociological studies showing the bias against black men and women with black-sounding names, and they didn't want to put these burdens on their children. Doesn't make it right (the racial bias, that is).  And Andre is very proud of his name, but I'm sure he's had to overcome barriers in the workplace that stemmed solely from him having a black-sounding name.

 

--I'm not trying to be insensitive, but I've worked in the school system, and I currently work in the medical field. And my black children have young friends with unique names. So when I hear names like Qua-Sim, Za'kir, Zy-nida, Shar-kesha, Na'Shan, Seanyqua, and Tyresha, I want to shake their mothers and ask them what the hell they were thinking when they burdened their kids with these made-up names that are hard to spell and hard to pronounce.

[mojito]

 

...I want to shake their mothers and ask them what the hell they were thinking when they burdened their kids with these made-up names that are hard to spell and hard to pronounce.

From the movie "Coach Carter" (2005):

 

"LaQuisha? Okay, yeah, the ghetto called and they want they name back.

Girl, LaQuisha? Be for real.

You might as well call the baby Food Stamp."

 

Andre served Andre Agassi pretty well! (but that's all I came up with, outside of the giant.....)

[dusang]

From the movie "Coach Carter" (2005):

 

"LaQuisha? Okay, yeah, the ghetto called and they want they name back.

Girl, LaQuisha? Be for real.

You might as well call the baby Food Stamp."

 

Andre served Andre Agassi pretty well! (but that's all I came up with, outside of the giant.....)

 

Shit, do I have to rewatch Coach Carter now?? ... maybe.

[mojito]

I only saw that part of the movie. Must've been some clip or I must've caught it at just the right time. I had to look up what movie the quote came from. That food stamp reference generates a lot of laughs.

[BoogieBurns]

"A little diddy, about Jack and Diane." Maybe the show's creator is a John Cougar Mellencamp fan.

 

I mean within the fictional universe. I guess they will just make Rainbow a fan of JCM. Although it would be much more unexpected for the fan to be Andre. 

[ridethemaverick]

"A little diddy, about Jack and Diane." Maybe the show's creator is a John Cougar Mellencamp fan.

In my imagination, Rainbow's parents were Northern California hippies from the 1970s.

My guess is that Andre and Rainbow didn't want to give their children contemporary "black" names--meaning, names with -sha, La-, Qua-, Tra-, Tre-, etc. And no apostrophes or hyphens. I'm sure they both know the sociological studies showing the bias against black men and women with black-sounding names, and they didn't want to put these burdens on their children. Doesn't make it right (the racial bias, that is). And Andre is very proud of his name, but I'm sure he's had to overcome barriers in the workplace that stemmed solely from him having a black-sounding name.

--I'm not trying to be insensitive, but I've worked in the school system, and I currently work in the medical field. And my black children have young friends with unique names. So when I hear names like Qua-Sim, Za'kir, Zy-nida, Shar-kesha, Na'Shan, Seanyqua, and Tyresha, I want to shake their mothers and ask them what the hell they were thinking when they burdened their kids with these made-up names that are hard to spell and hard to pronounce.

If people can learn to pronounce names like Tchaikovsky, they can learn to pronounce Tyresha.

I hate name bias. It's so stupid and racist. All names were made up at some point. Hell I think a lot of Anglo names sound stupid but I wouldn't refuse to hire a Brayden or Hailey.

[topanga]

 

If people can learn to pronounce names like Tchaikovsky, they can learn to pronounce Tyresha.

 

I hate name bias. It's so stupid and racist. All names were made up at some point. Hell I think a lot of Anglo names sound stupid but I wouldn't refuse to hire a Brayden or Hailey.

I totally agree that name bias is stupid and racist. But I also think we need to be aware that it exists.

 

So what are parents to do? Do I stick to a safe name like Zoe or Jack or Diane that doesn't hold any racial, cultural, or socioeconomic assumptions? Or do I give my children a name that sounds beautiful to me, even if other people think it sounds "ghetto" or made-up, or if its spelling possibly suggests a lower socioeconomic status (e.g. Maddisyn instead of Madison)?  Am I accepting the unfair bias if I refuse to name my daughter LaQuesha?

[ridethemaverick]

I totally agree that name bias is stupid and racist. But I also think we need to be aware that it exists.

So what are parents to do? Do I stick to a safe name like Zoe or Jack or Diane that doesn't hold any racial, cultural, or socioeconomic assumptions? Or do I give my children a name that sounds beautiful to me, even if other people think it sounds "ghetto" or made-up, or if its spelling possibly suggests a lower socioeconomic status (e.g. Maddisyn instead of Madison)? Am I accepting the unfair bias if I refuse to name my daughter LaQuesha?

What makes you think those names hold no assumptions? Zoe sounds like a white girl's name, possibly suburban, possibly trailer park. Jack sounds like a white man's name, class neutral, although I wouldn't be surprised to meet a black man named Jack. Diane is race and class neutral, but skews older.

Thing is, I would never use those assumptions to discriminate against anyone. THAT is what we need to be concerned with...the idiots who use their naming prejudices to degrade, mock, disenfranchise, etc. Of course people should name their kids what they want, provided it's spelled phonetically according to the rules of the language they speak (and most so called black names are).

[ribboninthesky1]

If people can learn to pronounce names like Tchaikovsky, they can learn to pronounce Tyresha.

I hate name bias. It's so stupid and racist. All names were made up at some point. Hell I think a lot of Anglo names sound stupid but I wouldn't refuse to hire a Brayden or Hailey.

 

I remember reading an article about how several names that are coded as black have British and Irish roots.  Like Tyrone, as an example.  Oh, the irony.  Even the name Andre has French roots, if I'm not mistaken.  The name bias was and is just another way to exercise subtle discrimination. It's harder to prove racial bias when you aren't getting the interview vs getting the interview, and then being rejected. Especially now that recruitment is more automated than ever.

 

It makes sense to me that Bow and Andre wouldn't use names commonly associated with inner-city blacks. I think that's distinctive from the general lower socioeconomic group, as I suspect blacks from small or rural towns are less likely to use names like...LaQuesha.  But I also assume that the theme of the show plays a part into the kids' names.  Because Zoey and Diane could have been Monica or Aisha or Ebony, any of which could be associated with upwardly mobile or middle class blacks. In the same vein, Jack and Andre could have been Reginald or Tyrone or Maurice.  But since the show is exploring what it means to be black and upwardly mobile in the United States, use of somewhat atypical names for black kids (born in the 00s especially) seems par for the course.  

Edited November 8, 2014 by ribboninthesky1

[pookat]

I don't think there are many "Middle Eastern" Asians in football, but that maybe a cultural thing (it being made with a pigskin and all

Not true, actually, on either count.

In parts of Michigan, at least, which has large Arab American enclaves, football is as big a part of life as any other American Midwestern town. Interestingly enough, football is seen as a way to a better education and life for many working class immigrant families in cities like Dearborn as seen in the short-lived reality show, All American Muslim, as well as this documentary: http://www.fordsonthemovie.com

Edited November 8, 2014 by pookat

[mojito]

I watched All American Muslim and found so many things about that show interesting. It's a shame that ignorant people pressured Lowe's to stop sponsoring the show (I believe that's how it went). It was interesting how they had the kids playing football while they were on their fast. I have an Iranian friend whose boys lived in a small town and were able to play football there because they weren't too small.

 

 

I hate name bias. It's so stupid and racist. All names were made up at some point. Hell I think a lot of Anglo names sound stupid but I wouldn't refuse to hire a Brayden or Hailey.

I've always been a name Nazi. When a resume comes into a corporation, people can easily reject them for any reason and don't have to justify their reasons. So it's easy to pass on Lamar and Keisha because no one asks why. I'd rather see Jack or Jill get invited to an interview, startle the manager, yet still possibly impress the manager enough to get him/her to overcome his/her biases. It's tough enough to find a job; why handicap your child? My two-cents' worth.....

 

I agree about names, in a way. They're just sounds. I have an Indian friend who thinks Anglo nicknames are stupid. "Why would anyone call their child 'Candy'?" she asked. "And Dick? Why in the world...."

Edited November 9, 2014 by mojito

[jhlipton]

There is also what I've heard called the rebellion against "slave names"  -- the Anglo names that blacks were given by the masters when they took away their real name.  

 

Not true, actually, on either count.

In parts of Michigan, at least, which has large Arab American enclaves, football is as big a part of life as any other American Midwestern town. Interestingly enough, football is seen as a way to a better education and life for many working class immigrant families in cities like Dearborn as seen in the short-lived reality show, All American Muslim, as well as this documentary: http://www.fordsonthemovie.com

 

I'm glad to be wrong.  And now that I think about, there are obviously a fair number of Arabs and Muslims in the NFL.  Sometimes, I'm just a knucklehead.

[ribboninthesky1]

There is also what I've heard called the rebellion against "slave names"  -- the Anglo names that blacks were given by the masters when they took away their real name. 

 

I've heard about this as well, such as the adoption of names with Islamic roots (Aisha and Jamal being popular ones).  Not much better in terms of rebellion against "slave names," but you didn't hear that from me.

[Driad]

 

Has anyone heard the name Nitoja or Natja?  According to a friend's family's oral history, their enslaved ancestress had that name.  She was brought to the US as a girl in the 1840s.  Of course her name may not have been exactly that, but likely a similar name.

[Kromm]

From the movie "Coach Carter" (2005):

 

"LaQuisha? Okay, yeah, the ghetto called and they want they name back.

Girl, LaQuisha? Be for real.

You might as well call the baby Food Stamp."

 

Andre served Andre Agassi pretty well! (but that's all I came up with, outside of the giant.....)

Dr. Dre's real name is Andre.

Andre Watts is a well known classical pianist (and African-American).

That empties my barrel for African-American Andres. Otherwise, all I know are Agassi, Andre Previn (who apparently is ACTUALLY named "Andreas") and long dead André Ampère (because he discovered electromagnetism, and then was guillotined during the French Revolution).

Oh yes, and the Giant too.

[pookat]

I've heard about this as well, such as the adoption of names with Islamic roots (Aisha and Jamal being popular ones). Not much better in terms of rebellion against "slave names," but you didn't hear that from me.

The difference here is that the Muslim names have some historical basis as many of the Africans brought over to the US actually practiced Islam. Roots, anyone?

Unfortunately, because entire family histories, cultures and religious traditions were wiped out as a result of slavery, not everyone can trace back as far as Alex Haley did for an authentically documented lineage. But I can certainly understand choosing a Muslim name as a way of trying to reconnect with one's roots.

However, I can see how name bias could play a role here, too, though for a very different reason given the current political climate. Look how hard Barack Hussein Obama had to work to "overcome" his name.

Edited November 9, 2014 by pookat

[Rinaldo]

Dr. Dre's real name is Andre.

Andre Watts is a well known classical pianist (and African-American).

That empties my barrel for African-American Andres. 

Mr. Braugher?

[ribboninthesky1]

The difference here is that the Muslim names have some historical basis as many of the Africans brought over to the US actually practiced Islam. Roots, anyone?

 

I think most names have historic basis, no matter the origin.  I'm not disputing some Africans being Muslim.  My point was that some, perhaps many, blacks in the 60s and 70s took on names with Islamic roots to discard their European "slave names," when the Arab slave trade had persisted for thousands of years and into the twentieth century.  Although the Arab slave trade included Europeans, it's my understanding that the majority of the slaves were African.  I just thought it sad that one would discard one "slave name" for possibly another.  As an issue of discarding a label, it makes more sense to me to embrace West African names, but that didn't seem to be a trend among American blacks.    

Edited November 9, 2014 by ribboninthesky1

[dusang]

Having spent some time in Africa, there is nothing funnier to me than the American perspective on "African cultural identity".

 

This conversation is interesting to me because it's revealing my own unconscious bias on the name issue.  Why should I think anything about the name LaQuisha?  But I do have thoughts.  I could defend my bias -- that name has no cultural significance and is more a triumph of systemically maintained ignorance than culture -- but really, it's not my place to judge and I should just let it go.

 

But I do get angry with parents who treat names as a joke.  LaQuisha isn't even that bad, in a world where parents have been allowed to name their children Apple, Pilot Inspektor, Audio Science, or Kal-El.  (Not joking.)

 

ETA: I stand corrected, LaQuisha may have a cultural significance -- several times removed from with unconfirmed associations to the Hebrew word "Kezia" meaning "cassia tree".  However, no two sources provide the same origin or meaning.

Edited November 9, 2014 by dusang

[ridethemaverick]

I watched All American Muslim and found so many things about that show interesting. It's a shame that ignorant people pressured Lowe's to stop sponsoring the show (I believe that's how it went). It was interesting how they had the kids playing football while they were on their fast. I have an Iranian friend whose boys lived in a small town and were able to play football there because they weren't too small.

I've always been a name Nazi. When a resume comes into a corporation, people can easily reject them for any reason and don't have to justify their reasons. So it's easy to pass on Lamar and Keisha because no one asks why. I'd rather see Jack or Jill get invited to an interview, startle the manager, yet still possibly impress the manager enough to get him/her to overcome his/her biases. It's tough enough to find a job; why handicap your child? My two-cents' worth.....

I agree about names, in a way. They're just sounds. I have an Indian friend who thinks Anglo nicknames are stupid. "Why would anyone call their child 'Candy'?" she asked. "And Dick? Why in the world...."

That's not how racism works. That's not how any of this works. Because a person who is racist enough to toss a resume with a black name on it is not going to suddenly become non racist when Deshon comes in with a degree from Yale and better credentials than any other applicant. In fact, a black man with a college degree is less likely to be hired than a white man with a high school diploma. Because racism.

Beyond names, employers also look at your school, your address, and the clubs and orgs you belong to. So John Smith with his race neutral name can still be discriminated against based on his address or the fact that he attended an HBCU or his membership in the local NAACP. Again, because racism.

Finally, it's not the responsibility of the victim to get the racist to overcome his biases. That's too much of a burden to bear.

Edited November 9, 2014 by ridethemaverick

[mojito]

 

That's not how racism works. That's not how any of this works. Because a person who is racist enough to toss a resume with a black name on it is not going to suddenly become non racist when Deshon comes in with a degree from Yale and better credentials than any other applicant.

You're painting some awfully broad strokes there. Kind of ironic, as the discussion is racism and prejudice.

 

Clearly, we've had different experiences. People's biases come in all sorts of forms and intensity. Hopefully, you'll learn that.

Edited November 9, 2014 by mojito

[Mozelle]

If people can learn to pronounce names like Tchaikovsky, they can learn to pronounce Tyresha.

I hate name bias. It's so stupid and racist. All names were made up at some point. Hell I think a lot of Anglo names sound stupid but I wouldn't refuse to hire a Brayden or Hailey.

That reminds me of something I read about one of the actresses from Orange is the New Black. Her name is decidedly Igbo, but people had trouble pronouncing it. She says that when she was younger, she asked her mother if she could have her friends just call her Zoe, and her mom's response was, "If people can pronounce Dostoevsky, they can pronounce your name."

I think most names have historic basis, no matter the origin. I'm not disputing some Africans being Muslim. My point was that some, perhaps many, blacks in the 60s and 70s took on names with Islamic roots to discard their European "slave names," when the Arab slave trade had persisted for thousands of years and into the twentieth century. Although the Arab slave trade included Europeans, it's my understanding that the majority of the slaves were African. I just thought it sad that one would discard one "slave name" for possibly another. As an issue of discarding a label, it makes more sense to me to embrace West African names, but that didn't seem to be a trend among American blacks.

That's what I've always found interesting about this reclamation, as it were. The names given to black children during that time were usually Arabic or Swahili. The African slave trade to the Americas didn't extend to either the eastern or northern regions of Africa, yet that ended up being the pivot for naming.

Edited November 10, 2014 by Mozelle

[OnceSane]

It's a little heated in here, so let's cool it. Please respect your fellow posters and their opinions. Thank you.

[PRgal]

"A little diddy, about Jack and Diane." Maybe the show's creator is a John Cougar Mellencamp fan.

 

In my imagination, Rainbow's parents were Northern California hippies from the 1970s.

 

My guess is that Andre and Rainbow didn't want to give their children contemporary "black" names--meaning, names with -sha, La-, Qua-, Tra-, Tre-, etc. And no apostrophes or hyphens. I'm sure they both know the sociological studies showing the bias against black men and women with black-sounding names, and they didn't want to put these burdens on their children. Doesn't make it right (the racial bias, that is).  And Andre is very proud of his name, but I'm sure he's had to overcome barriers in the workplace that stemmed solely from him having a black-sounding name.

 

--I'm not trying to be insensitive, but I've worked in the school system, and I currently work in the medical field. And my black children have young friends with unique names. So when I hear names like Qua-Sim, Za'kir, Zy-nida, Shar-kesha, Na'Shan, Seanyqua, and Tyresha, I want to shake their mothers and ask them what the hell they were thinking when they burdened their kids with these made-up names that are hard to spell and hard to pronounce.

 

I'm sure Rainbow herself had issues being taken seriously based on her name.  Rainbow = "were your parents high when you were born?"

 

I think each culture has unique naming methods for their kids.  Hong Kong Chinese parents often give their kids "y"/"ie" names, especially for females.  And sometimes, the names are from an older generation.  I'm 35 and I went to school with a girl named Peggy, for example (other "y/ie" names were Amy, Patty and Mandy.  There were also LOTS of Jennifers, but that's generational, not just for Asians but for white people, too).  The white girl with a Margaret derivative was a Megan.  My parents legally named me Cindy until I officially changed it to Cynthia when I was 20.  I didn't think "Cindy" would be taken as seriously as Cynthia.  It DOES sound like a mallrat sort of name.  And dated, too.

[jhlipton]

That reminds me of something I read about one of the actresses from Orange is the New Black. Her name is decidedly Igbo, but people had trouble pronouncing it. She says that when she was younger, she asked her mother oif she could have her friends just call her Zoe, and her mom's response was, "If people can pronounce Dostoevsky, they can pronounce your name."

It's funny -- up until a few days ago, I would fave no idea what Igbo is. But I'm reading Americnah (in which most of the main characters are Igbo and a great book), so that's kind of cool. Igbo, for those who may not know is one of the languages of Nigeria

[Inquisitionist]

If people can learn to pronounce names like Tchaikovsky, they can learn to pronounce Tyresha.

 

Sometimes it's not so much a matter of pronunciation as it is memory.  I have a lot of difficulty registering Asian names, for instance, because they are essentially foreign words to me. 

 

One of the things I'm really enjoying about the show is the very light touch it uses (IMO) in addressing social and race issues.  Its priority is being funny, but against this particular backdrop.  When I watch comedies, I want to laugh.  This show is up there with B99 in laugh output for me.

[Mozelle]

It's funny -- up until a few days ago, I would fave no idea what Igbo is. But I'm reading Americnah (in which most of the main characters are Igbo and a great book), so that's kind of cool. Igbo, for those who may not know is one of the languages of Nigeria

To be more specific, it's an ethnic group in Nigeria. My maternal grandfather was Igbo.

As for Americanah, I adore Chimamanda Ngozi so much!

[PRgal]

Sometimes it's not so much a matter of pronunciation as it is memory.  I have a lot of difficulty registering Asian names, for instance, because they are essentially foreign words to me. 

 

One of the things I'm really enjoying about the show is the very light touch it uses (IMO) in addressing social and race issues.  Its priority is being funny, but against this particular backdrop.  When I watch comedies, I want to laugh.  This show is up there with B99 in laugh output for me.

I'm Asian (Chinese) and a Cantonese speaker and STILL have issues remembering certain Chinese (given) names - especially if they're Anglicized pronunciations.  It's very foreign/confusing to me as it isn't quite Cantonese nor is it quite English/western.  Family/last names are easier to remember for the most part.  Also, most non-related Cantonese speaking/people of Cantonese (Hong Kong) heritage I know have (official/legal) western names and I know them through work or school.  Those are the names they use in that situation. 

 

Mozelle: Is Chimamanda Ngozi pronounced : Chee-ma-MAN-DAH GNO-zee? (ngo as in gnocchi)  Wondering because the Cantonese pronunciation of the family name Ng sounds more like the gno in gnocchi than the Anglicized "ing."

[mojito]

 

One of the things I'm really enjoying about the show is the very light touch it uses (IMO) in addressing social and race issues.  Its priority is being funny, but against this particular backdrop.

It's sort of like our private humor gone public.

[jhlipton]

Wikipedia (yeah, I know -- edit it if it's wrong) has "(ə)ng·gō·zē ŭ·dēch·yā".

[Mozelle]

Mozelle: Is Chimamanda Ngozi pronounced : Chee-ma-MAN-DAH GNO-zee? (ngo as in gnocchi)  Wondering because the Cantonese pronunciation of the family name Ng sounds more like the gno in gnocchi than the Anglicized "ing."

 

The first name you've broken down correctly. "Ngozi," however, is (kind of) pronounced "EN - goe - zee." I say kind of because the "N" in Ngozi is not quite "en," but I think that's as close to the sound as folks who aren't speakers of Igbo (I'm not) or who don't have familiarity with the name (I do as it's my sister's middle name as well as an aunt's first name). The way my grandfather used to pronounce the "n" was at the back of the throat, tongue touching the roof of the mouth--perhaps a double "nn" sound.

[BoogieBurns]

So is the "n" sound similar to how Lupita Nyong'o is pronounced? 

[Mozelle]

So is the "n" sound similar to how Lupita Nyong'o is pronounced?

I think so. Your question made me search out her IG when she pronounced her name: http://instagram.com/p/jA51uOHuUG/

[Empress1]

Diane is race and class neutral, but skews older.

My (black) grandmother, born 1929, was named Diane.

I can buy Rainbow as a Mellencamp fan; what I want to know is how hard she has to fight to be taken seriously as a doctor named Rainbow.

[dusang]

I can buy Rainbow as a Mellencamp fan; what I want to know is how hard she has to fight to be taken seriously as a doctor named Rainbow.

 

True.  Fortunately, to patients she would just be Dr. Johnson.  (I am very suspicious of any doctor who allows patients to call them by their first name, like Dr. Bob or some such.  You are my doctor, not my friend!)

[ribboninthesky1]

My (black) grandmother, born 1929, was named Diane.

I can buy Rainbow as a Mellencamp fan; what I want to know is how hard she has to fight to be taken seriously as a doctor named Rainbow.

 

Do you mean in general? By blacks? By non-blacks? I can see her getting some grief from her black peers for her name, but I assumed it wouldn't be a problem for her non-black peers. There are some rather unique names with doctors that I've seen, especially because in the areas where I've lived, there have been several non-white doctors with non-Anglicized names. I would think Rainbow Johnson is fairly tame. 

[pookat]

Do you mean in general? By blacks? By non-blacks? I can see her getting some grief from her black peers for her name, but I assumed it wouldn't be a problem for her non-black peers. There are some rather unique names with doctors that I've seen, especially because in the areas where I've lived, there have been several non-white doctors with non-Anglicized names. I would think Rainbow Johnson is fairly tame. 

I think there is a difference between a non-Anglicized name from someone of a different ethnic background, especially if they or their parents immigrated to the US, and an atypical name that has an everyday meaning in English. I think Bow probably had to endure more than a few snickers from classmates, from elementary school through medical school, and probably from some patients. It's unfair because she obviously didn't choose the name, but as someone might have mentioned above, a hippie holdover name like Rainbow puts her in the same category of the Apples and Pilot Inspektors (OMG, really?!) of the world rather than the Lupita Nyong'os.

 

I think that parents who name their child North West know that they are marking their child for life, but probably think that fame and money will insulate them from teasing or make them unique among the Matthews and Madisons. I feel sorry for those kids, knowing what they have to put up with. I do feel sorry for parents who unknowingly give their children names rich in cultural heritage only to move to the US and find that Harshit does not fly as well here.

[PRgal]

Do you mean in general? By blacks? By non-blacks? I can see her getting some grief from her black peers for her name, but I assumed it wouldn't be a problem for her non-black peers. There are some rather unique names with doctors that I've seen, especially because in the areas where I've lived, there have been several non-white doctors with non-Anglicized names. I would think Rainbow Johnson is fairly tame. 

 

There's a difference between a name like Rainbow and a name that is representative of non-Anglo cultures.  I'm sure people would take a Dr. Mei Tsin Wang more seriously than a Rainbow Johnson.  Rainbow/Bow screams (as I've said earlier in this thread) "how high were your parents when you were born, anyway?"

[ribboninthesky1]

That's why I was asking Empress1 for clarification.  Because it's hard for me to imagine someone with a non-Anglicized name giving her a hard time, or taking her less seriously just because of her name. 

[pookat]

Jinx, PRgal!

 

ribboninthesky1, I would hope that those of us with names different from the mainstream would have a little extra understanding and compassion for fellow uniquely-named counterparts. But in all honesty, as someone with a non-Anglicized name, if I ever met a Bronx Mowgli (Ashlee Simpson's kid), it would be hard to say the name out loud without giggling, while I would not have that reaction to Chweitel Eijofor or Rajesh Koothrappali which are perfectly reasonable names that reflect one's heritage even if it takes the average American (of any background) some time to get accustomed to.

[Taylorh2]

The first time we watched this,  I jokingly told my son (Brandon) that he was "black-ish".

 

I'm a Black female, my dh is White, so that makes our 19 yr old son 'mixed race. We live in a upper-middle class neighborhood in a 2,300 sq ft house-in a very good school district. lol

 

He watches hockey with me. lol

 

Speaking of "Black names"    I'm a Black female and my name is Taylor

Edited November 14, 2014 by Taylorh2

[BoogieBurns]

I don't have a "black" name at all. But my sisters do. So, I think my parents just stopped being creative when they found out they were having a third girl. 

[OnceSane]

My sisters, brother, and I all have African first names. It makes sense, my dad is West African and my mom is white.

[Featherhat]

In the UK the only person I've met with the name Andre was French. In the area I work in (London) there seems to be a lot people of Indian descent (some of them 4th generation UK) who us UK nicknames for Indian names "Sam" for Sanjay or "Katie" for Kamal etc. There doesn't seem to be a huge "white name/black name" difference among the middle classes where I live.  The name "Tyresha" would get flagged up as "American" before "black" in any system that was paying attention.

Edited November 16, 2014 by Featherhat

[PRgal]

In the UK the only person I've met with the name Andre was French. In the area I work in (London) there seems to be a lot people of Indian descent (some of them 4th generation UK) who us UK nicknames for Indian names "Sam" for Sanjay or "Katie" for Kamal etc. There doesn't seem to be a huge "white name/black name" difference among the middle classes where I live.  The name "Tyresha" would get flagged up as "American" before "black" in any system that was paying attention.

 

Aren't most black people in the UK mostly first and second generation British by way of former colonies in the Caribbean?  Most of the black people I know here in Toronto are the same and they tend to have names like Katherine, John and Michael.  Interesting that even fourth generation UK Indians carry on traditional names while Chinese rarely do. 

[mojito]

 

Speaking of "Black names"    I'm a Black female and my name is Taylor

And you married a white guy? Tsk, tsk. I can see we're going to have to take your "soul sister" card and afro pick (the one with the fist) and your Motown records away from you! (Yeah, I remember the late sixties.) We're going to have to get you an ethnic tutor, too. Me, I've been stripped of everything but my Motown records. They're going to have to take them out of my cold, dead hands.

[ridethemaverick]

I tend to put black names in perspective whenever the "cultural meaning" reason is used. African American culture us less than 400 years old. I don't think it's fair to hold black names to the same standards as names from cultures that are thousands of years old. And frankly, a Chinese or French name holds no more meaning or importance to me as an American than a black American name holds for anyone who isn't.

[pookat]

Since we're discussing names, I just learned that John Cougar Mellencamp named his son Speck Wildhorse. (Why, America?)

Perhaps Jack and Diane were just too pedestrian for him. It makes me wonder if Bow, who probably endured lifelong teasing for her name, wanted to give her kids names that wouldn't make them stand out in the way hers did.

ridethemaverick, I also wanted to clarify that I hope there was no offense taken with the cultural heritage comment I made about names above. It was used specifically to explain how ethnic names that differ from the mainstream (such as names with overseas roots and would also include newer names that reflect cultural heritage like Tyresha and Shenequa) are in a different category from crazy celebrity baby names (see above), which is how Rainbow might get categorized, even if it is one of the more tame ones.

[SimoneS]

Aren't most black people in the UK mostly first and second generation British by way of former colonies in the Caribbean?  Most of the black people I know here in Toronto are the same and they tend to have names like Katherine, John and Michael. 

 

Exactly. Traditionally, most people of African descent from former British colonies have extremely British (Irish, Scottish, and English) names although there are popular names that are French and Spanish in origin like Leroy. However, I think that globalization and television has had an impact so this tradition might be changing. In the U.S., African Americans have a culture that embraces giving children unique names. 

Edited November 16, 2014 by SimoneS