Spoilers and Speculation: Clink Boom and Cheese Fondue

[dubbel zout]

I’m certain there will be a “which one is the real Jason?” period, but I think it will be for the characters, not the viewers. IOW, we know SBu is the real Jason, but PC won’t know right away.

[TeeVee329]

9 minutes ago, ulkis said:

I think it was a smart decision to make it clear though. This show doesn't need more plotting.

But why then play up that it's a mystery in the promo?

4 minutes ago, dubbel zout said:

I’m certain there will be a “which one is the real Jason?” period, but I think it will be for the characters, not the viewers. IOW, we know SBu is the real Jason, but PC won’t know right away.

Yeah, with the Todds, we all figured that Roger Howarth was the real one, but we didn't have an explanation as to who the other person could be for a while.  Here, we already do - it's Franco's childhood pal Drew, barf.

Edited October 17, 2017 by TeeVee329

[dubbel zout]

It cracks me up that the identical twin thing is used again, but they just introduced it earlier on GH, so when we find out Jakeson is actually Drew, we won’t feel like it came out of nowhere. Except of course it did, since it’s a sloppy retcon.

[Oracle42]

27 minutes ago, TeeVee329 said:

it's Franco's childhood pal Drew, barf.

Oh, so that's how they're going to break up Drew and Sam.

[TeeVee329]

20 minutes ago, dubbel zout said:

It cracks me up that the identical twin thing is used again, but they just introduced it earlier on GH, so when we find out Jakeson is actually Drew, we won’t feel like it came out of nowhere. Except of course it did, since it’s a sloppy retcon.

At least the OLTL reveal was amusingly bonkers, with Irene "I joined the CIA as a last resort!" Manning and it all being over IT and Victor having "special needs" and that coda of her slicing the scar into VicTodd's cheek...pointlessly since she was going to give him plastic surgery lol.

11 minutes ago, Oracle42 said:

Oh, so that's how they're going to break up Drew and Sam.

Meanwhile, are we now going to have to sit through the whole thing again of people explaining to Steve Burton Jason that Franco is totes cool now, there were DVD's and a brain tumor and he's such a good surrogate dad to Kiki and he's bonded with Jake and blah blah blah BLAH.

Edited October 17, 2017 by TeeVee329

[ulkis]

42 minutes ago, TeeVee329 said:

But why then play up that it's a mystery in the promo?

Because the promo people like to make weird promos, heh.

47 minutes ago, dubbel zout said:

I’m certain there will be a “which one is the real Jason?” period, but I think it will be for the characters, not the viewers. IOW, we know SBu is the real Jason, but PC won’t know right away.

Oh, there are a couple of people who really think SB is Drew, or, seriously, Nikolas.

[dubbel zout]

I loved the CIA’s work program for single mothers. It was entertainingly bananas, and at least showed some creativity. A childhood friend is pretty snoozy, so TFGH.

I think people who think SBu is Nik are victims of wishful thinking. There’s no way Nik is back now.

[peachmangosteen]

On 10/17/2017 at 3:04 PM, TeeVee329 said:

At least the OLTL reveal was amusingly bonkers, with Irene "I joined the CIA as a last resort!" Manning and it all being over IT and Victor having "special needs" and that coda of her slicing the scar into VicTodd's cheek...pointlessly since she was going to give him plastic surgery lol.

I don't care, I loved the hell outta that shit. This shit with Jason and Drew wishes it was as fun and entertaining as the Two Todds story.

Edited October 18, 2017 by peachmangosteen

[absnow54]

Has there ever been a "character returns with a different face and then years later the original actors comes back" story where the original actor turned out to be the imposter? Does Faison's Duke fondue mask count?

At least the OLTL reveal was amusingly bonkers, with Irene "I joined the CIA as a last resort!" Manning and it all being over IT and Victor having "special needs" and that coda of her slicing the scar into VicTodd's cheek...pointlessly since she was going to give him plastic surgery lol.

I just rewatched the Tale of Two Todd's on YouTube, and it's weird I had blocked out all the ridiculous CIA, Pepto-Bismal chugging, special needs campiness, and could only remember the emotional beats of the characters gathering for the various reveals. "Patience, Victoria, I'm getting there..." wow that storyline was a hoot.

[Chairperson Meow]

On 10/17/2017 at 11:20 AM, TeeVee329 said:

This week on "Generally Jason So Shut Up About Other Characters":

GH PTB: My gawd, the mystery!!!  The intrigue!!!  Who is the imposter, WHO!!!

Me: ...you've made it clear from the jump who the imposter is.  You even introduced the twin retcon way earlier than in the Tale of Two Todds that you're clearly riffing on.

Dude.   Is that the same damn audio from 2011?  

21 hours ago, peachmangosteen said:

I do't care, I loved the hell outta that shit. This shit with Jason and Drew wishes it was as fun and entertaining as the Two Todds story.

Idk.  We could get a campy Helena scene with JasonxJason

[IWantCandy71]

On ‎10‎/‎11‎/‎2017 at 0:16 PM, dubbel zout said:

It's been argued that people would rather see their faves with someone terrible than not see their faves at all. I hate seeing Elizabeth with the SERIAL KILLER—the writing for that couple is especially heinous—but when the alternative is barely seeing her at all, I guess I'm glad she get some attention. It's a tough one for me.

I totally get that. I haaaated Luke and Tracy for the half of their run-except for the brief times they were just friends. But it was almost the only time,  especially during Guza, that I got to see her. So, I can relate.  It's like the lesser of two evils. See your fave with someone you despise, or don't see them at all.  Some choice !  :(

 

Quote

"There's only one Jason Morgan."

Yeah, and that's one too many. I hate the way people act like he's a good man.  Sounds like the days of Jasbot the town savior are coming again full force. SO glad I'm not tuning in for this.

Edited October 18, 2017 by IWantCandy71

[General Days]

I don't get why they are going (well, or went) with the "Which one is the real Jason?" 

It makes no sense to bring Burton back on if he isn't the real Jason. They've been planting seeds for a while that Carly and Sonny (and even Sam to an extent) feel Jason is so different. Billy Miller Jason is not married to the mob. He's actually married to Sam and she and the kids are more important to him than his brother/owner Sonny.

What I hope we get (don't think we will) is a layered story in which Sam chooses Drew (i.e. Billy Miller's character) because he is so much more of what she wants and she and the kids matter to him more than she mattered (and, for that matter, more than Liz and Jake mattered) to Jason. It's the story we should have gotten with Patrick and Billy Miller Jason, when he was first revealed as Jason.

[HeatLifer]

19 minutes ago, General Days said:

It's the story we should have gotten with Patrick and Billy Miller Jason, when he was first revealed as Jason.

I agree up until this point. Sam and Patrick should have never happened and it was never going to end up with those two as "endgame" on any version of the show. 

[General Days]

Why should they have never happened? Because Robin was still alive or something else? 

[HeatLifer]

Just now, General Days said:

Why should they have never happened? Because Robin was still alive or something else? 

To me, they made absolutely no sense as a couple. The characters did not mesh. Patrick had to be completely twisted into a pretzel and forget significant qualities that constructed his character and Sam was made into a perfect little Suzy Homemaker princess. I won't even get into the fact that the story was rewritten more times than I can count, Robin's name wasn't allowed to be mentioned, Samtrick were propped by every and all characters ("This isn't Robin's home anymore, Sam! -Anna) and the actors had zero romantic chemistry.

[WendyCR72]

45 minutes ago, General Days said:

Why should they have never happened? Because Robin was still alive or something else? 

Because they were Stepford people with anti-chemistry. Robin being alive was a huge factor. But even if she were truly dead, Sam and Patrick were just barely above Sabrina and Patrick, who were also cavity inducing when not cringeworthy.

And, IMO, it was All. About. Sam. Patrick, much like with Sabrina, never got a POV. It was just "Yes, Sam!" and "No, Sabrina."

Mileage varies, though.

Still, I can totally see why Jason Thompson decided to go elsewhere. Guza sucked, but Patrick was a well-rounded character under his staff. This regime had him as a handsome prince for Sabrina (who didn't even know him from Day 1) or just as some Sam worshiper with no thoughts of his own.

[General Days]

48 minutes ago, HeatLifer said:

To me, they made absolutely no sense as a couple. The characters did not mesh. Patrick had to be completely twisted into a pretzel and forget significant qualities that constructed his character and Sam was made into a perfect little Suzy Homemaker princess. I won't even get into the fact that the story was rewritten more times than I can count, Robin's name wasn't allowed to be mentioned, Samtrick were propped by every and all characters ("This isn't Robin's home anymore, Sam! -Anna) and the actors had zero romantic chemistry.

 

9 minutes ago, WendyCR72 said:

Because they were Stepford people with anti-chemistry. Robin being alive was a huge factor. But even if she were truly dead, Sam and Patrick were just barely above Sabrina and Patrick, who were also cavity inducing when not cringeworthy.

And, IMO, it was All. About. Sam. Patrick, much like with Sabrina, never got a POV. It was just "Yes, Sam!" and "No, Sabrina."

Mileage varies, though.

Still, I can totally see why Jason Thompson decided to go elsewhere. Guza sucked, but Patrick was a well-rounded character under his staff. This regime had him as a handsome prince for Sabrina (who didn't even know him from Day 1) or just as some Sam worshiper with no thoughts of his own.

Gotcha. I liked their chemistry when the show tested them. I remember Patrick ran into her when she was waiting for the other Dr. Michael Easton and they had a cute vibe. I thought their story once the show put them together was typical latter-Ron writing -- lazy and incomplete.

Other spoilers for tomorrow say Nathan is worried about his marriage and Sam manipulates Maxie. I keep forgetting Maxie and Nathan are even married, but I think it's dumb to have problems with her just back. I wish they'd get a real story. This Man Landers thing needs to be drowned in a well. Kristin can handle better material and I think the Tree has come far enough along to follow her lead. 

What would Sam be manipulating Maxie about -- Crimson? Maxie wants to return to Crimson, right? Sometimes the spoilers are more of a let down than the show itself, and that's saying something. 

 

[stlbf]

The stupid thing with Maxie is that Nina offered her the job back. Maxie pissed on it without even talking to Nathan about it. She finally asks again. Nina gave her a ultimatum: get a scoop for Crimson. She had the Man Landers junk. Passed on it due to Nathan asking her not to break the story. Why not just write about the aftermath for Crimson?  I don't get it. 

The writers had absolutely no fucking idea what to do with Patrick after Robin went away again. So they tried the nightmare inducing St. Pretty Pretty Princess and Patrick relationship. That was terrible. Then we had a similar issue with pairing Sam with Patrick. But it was all about Sam. Patrick just had to show up. If the show really wanted to pair up Patrick,  then they should've strongly looked at Patrick/Liz. It would just make sense for a busy, overwhelmed guy like Patrick develop feelings for Liz. A work friend. A neighbor.  A woman friends with Robin. Someone who truly did help out with his young daughter.  And he was helping with her 3 mostly fatherless boys. Not saying that it would be forever love or even marriage material. Maybe it just would've been a rebound relationship for both of them. Which would be ok.

[dubbel zout]

I think Sam and Patrick could have worked if we didn’t know Robin was being held captive. That was the mistake, IMO. Either don’t let anyone know Robin is alive or use it properly, but the show tried to have it both ways, as it too often does.

I’d have preferred that Sam and Patrick stayed friends, because they were stultifying as a couple.

[Neptune]

General Hospital Spoilers: October 23-27, 2017 Edition

https://tvsourcemagazine.com/2017/10/general-hospital-spoilers-october-23-27-2017-edition/

[dubbel zout]

Sam makes an important announcement.

It had better not be that she's pregnant.

 Is Nelle just unlucky in love or a danger to those who love her? After provoking Carly, she’s confronted by Michael. Will Michael change his mind?

Ugh, why is this being dragged out? It's SO BORING.

Griffin is there for Liz.

Please let it be when she kicks Franco to the curb for good. (Let me cling to this.)

[Oracle42]

14 hours ago, dubbel zout said:

I think Sam and Patrick could have worked if we didn’t know Robin was being held captive. That was the mistake, IMO. Either don’t let anyone know Robin is alive or use it properly, but the show tried to have it both ways, as it too often does.

I’d have preferred that Sam and Patrick stayed friends, because they were stultifying as a couple.

I'm not sure they could have worked, but they could have at least been watchable if they'd been written as characters instead of plot points. There is built-in conflict there! Patrick hated Jason, and Jason was their primary topic of conversation (that and their new "family" that made one(?) onscreen appearance together)  because they had nothing else to talk about once they exhausted the subject of "Amsterdam" and being "adventure buddies"

Sam is the least educated member of her entire family, and (under Guza's writing team) she was self-conscious about it. But it never comes up when she's dating a brain surgeon whose wife was a doctor and a research scientist!? I mean, maybe it would have if they'd ever been allowed to talk about Robin....

Before Sam, Patrick's serious relationships were with women who thought of him as a risk-taker. For Sam, he was the safe, sensible guy. And he and Sam had zero conversations about her insane tolerance for risk/danger and the unacceptable ways it could have affected Danny or Emma. Not even one conversation about their different parenting styles, or comparing the other as a parent to either of their deceased spouses? K.

Patrick bounced from Brit, to Sabrina (whom he left at the altar as soon as he saw Robin) - and Sam has no qualms about this relationship or about getting engaged? Because she just wants to make muffins and crafts now? And she doesn't know him well enough to be concerned by that behavior, but they lurve each other? Alrighty then.

And the writers didn't even use that terrible relationship to inform this current family-based, anti-mob attitude that she adopted once they paired her with BMJason. 

Edited October 21, 2017 by Oracle42

[TeeVee329]

Quote

Scott riles Kiki up.

Why is Scotty bothering with Keeks? 

Edited October 20, 2017 by TeeVee329

[dubbel zout]

Because Ava's unavailable?

[TeeVee329]

If Scotty wants to talk to a young blonde woman, he should give Serena a call.

[Fellaway]

54 minutes ago, TeeVee329 said:

Why is Scotty bothering with Keeks? 

 

13 minutes ago, dubbel zout said:

Because Ava's unavailable?

Probably because of Ava.

[LexieLily]

Quote

And while Valentin and Lulu have found a way to co-parent for the moment, Van Etten says Charlotte's mom will be looking "for any opportunity to rip the rug from beneath him."

That is from Soaps In Depth.

I don't consider Valentin bullying Lulu into getting his way yet again and then going out of his way not to share Charlotte per their agreement "finding a way to co-parent", but whatever, GH. 

[HeatLifer]

Yep. You killed that post, @Oracle42. I'd like it 100 times if I could.

[Star Aristille]

30 minutes ago, LexieLily said:

I don't consider Valentin bullying Lulu into getting his way yet again and then going out of his way not to share Charlotte per their agreement "finding a way to co-parent", but whatever, GH. 

I do.

[Neptune]

The Scoop: GH previews, teasers, and spoilers for the Week of October 23, 2017

http://soapcentral.com/gh/content/scoop/spoilers/2017/171023.php

[TeeVee329]

Quote

Michael wants answers from Nelle

This story is sooo repetitive.  Michael catches her doing something sketchy or in a lie, she gives him a weak tea explanation, he swallows it whole, Chloe Lanier smirks, rinse, lather, repeat.

Edited October 21, 2017 by TeeVee329

[Ambrosefolly]

2 hours ago, Star Aristille said:

I do.

How?

[Star Aristille]

1 minute ago, Ambrosefolly said:

How?

*Shrugs*  Just typical Port Charles custody drama to me.

[TeeVee329]

Speaking of repetitive storylines, this Charlotte custody mess also needs to stop, we're creeping up on a year of this crap.  Ship off her to boarding school and be done with hit. 

[LexieLily]

9 minutes ago, TeeVee329 said:

Speaking of repetitive storylines, this Charlotte custody mess also needs to stop, we're creeping up on a year of this crap.  Ship off her to boarding school and be done with hit. 

If the same characters (Lulu, Ava) are never allowed to win in custody-related storylines, they don't need to be brought up again and again, I agree, TeeVee329

[TeeVee329]

I'm not really a fan of custody battle storylines in general.  And while nothing tops Griffin and Anna's attempt to get custody of a child neither of them was related to because Griffin spent five minutes thinking he was her dad as far as the dumbest, this one has certainly dragged on the longest.  Even the agonizing Avery tug-of-war has taken periodic breaks.

Edited October 21, 2017 by TeeVee329

[dubbel zout]

The longer both of these custody suits go on, the worse everyone looks, IMO. Neither Valentin nor Lulu seem able to come to an agreement without one or both being underhanded later, and with Sonny and Ava, he refuses to let Ava see Avery, and Ava lets him push her around. Gross on all fronts. These are children (girl children, granted, but still children), not some rare book or painting. Resolve this crap for good and move on.

Edited October 21, 2017 by dubbel zout

[Neptune]

"The Man in the Park"

[stlbf]

14 hours ago, dubbel zout said:

The longer both of these custody suits go on, the worse everyone looks, IMO. Neither Valentin nor Lulu seem able to come to an agreement without one or both being underhanded later, and with Sonny and Ava, he refuses to let Ava see Avery, and Ava lets him push her around. Gross on all fronts. These are children (girl children, granted, but still children), not some rare book or painting. Resolve this crap for good and move on.

These custody battles are moronic. The vast majority of courts are going with true 50/50 custody. There has to be a major reason why parents don't have it. If anything, Sonny should be the easy loser. He is a convicted murderer. It doesn't matter that he was given a pardon. All that should mean is that he was given a get out of prison for free card. He should still have a record. Ava doesn't have a murder conviction on her record. Sonny was caught on tape threatening to kill a mother of his child. He shot Carly in the head. Michael was shot and in a coma because of him. His kids have been kidnapped on more than one occasion. Hell, he was the guy secretly threatening Kiki to force Ava to give Avery to Sonny. For "Avery's protection". 

Ava is no saint. But she is still a tad better parent than Sonny. As much as TIIC think otherwise.  Kiki never felt endangered as a child. Her mother wasn't a mobster, just high end art dealer.

These whole stupid blackmail over Avery is stupid. Carly having a sex tape of Ava and Paul is pointless. It wasn't illegal. Nobody should care. Except perhaps Kiki, Avery and Dillon. Since what child ever wants to see a parent having a sex tape?

This crap is pissing me off. Just go 50/50 with these shitty soap parents.  M,T one parent. W is the transfer day. T, F is the other parent's days. Everything other weekend. Judges can make you suffer if they see you not cooperating.  

Edited October 22, 2017 by stlbf

[LexieLily]

3 minutes ago, stlbf said:

This crap is pissing me off. Just go 50/50 with these shitty soap parents.  M,T one parent. W is the transfer day. T, F is the other parent's days. Everything other weekend. Judges can make you suffer if they see you not cooperating.  

Judges in real life, sure. But family court judges in Port Charles? This is the same court system that succeeded for quite awhile in denying Maxie visitation with her daughter simply because she was spending time with Nathan.

[stlbf]

2 hours ago, LexieLily said:

Judges in real life, sure. But family court judges in Port Charles? This is the same court system that succeeded for quite awhile in denying Maxie visitation with her daughter simply because she was spending time with Nathan.

Maxie was nuts to pissed off the judge. And she had a very bad habit of lying. Harsh? Yes. Spinelli was a better choice to have the baby until Maxie got her shit together. I get that Ellie and Spinelli were leaving the show. It was easier to send a baby that Maxie never really wanted off screen. The show was just trying to keep Maxie from looking like a truly terrible parent since she wasn't with her baby. 

There are perfectly decent options far flung parents are given. They can get most if not all holidays and summer vacations. My sister in law has to send her daughter home for virtually all holidays/school breaks over 4 days. Which was extremely trying/expensive when they were a thousand miles away. Under 14, non stop flights can be insanely expensive. Which my sister-in-law and brother had to pay for. 

Edited October 22, 2017 by stlbf

[statsgirl]

This is the show that had the ridiculous storyline of Alexis dressing up as the Quartermaine's butler because she wasn't allowed to even see Kristina.  I don't think Ned should ever be forgiven that.

It makes zero sense that Ava should have to be Sonny for permission to see her daughter, and Sonny gets to emotionally abuse her every time.  She's no saint but she isn't even in the same league as Sonny for evil deeds.  (Also if Sonny and Carly had been better parents, Ava might not have felt she had to protect Kiki from Morgan)

[TeeVee329]

13 hours ago, stlbf said:

Ava is no saint. But she is still a tad better parent than Sonny. As much as TIIC think otherwise.  Kiki never felt endangered as a child. Her mother wasn't a mobster, just high end art dealer.

Seriously.  By all accounts, Kiki's childhood was drama-free and Ava had no on-the-books criminal history prior to coming to Port Charles.  And since she's been in PC, she's never been convicted of a crime.  Unlike Sonny, who - even though he was bullshittingly pardoned by the governor - pled guilty to AJ's murder.

[dubbel zout]

45 minutes ago, statsgirl said:

(Also if Sonny and Carly had been better parents, Ava might not have felt she had to protect Kiki from Morgan)

I think Ava was more concerned about Morgan's volatility than Sonny and Carly's influence. Once Morgan was diagnosed, his parents were more concerned he took his meds regularly than Morgan was for a long time. Which makes it extra ironic that Ava decides the way to break up Morgan and Lauren is to mess with his meds, ensuring he'll be unpredictable. Morgan was idiotic enough that all Ava had to do was bide her time; he'd have messed up eventually.

[stlbf]

1 hour ago, dubbel zout said:

I think Ava was more concerned about Morgan's volatility than Sonny and Carly's influence. Once Morgan was diagnosed, his parents were more concerned he took his meds regularly than Morgan was for a long time. Which makes it extra ironic that Ava decides the way to break up Morgan and Lauren is to mess with his meds, ensuring he'll be unpredictable. Morgan was idiotic enough that all Ava had to do was bide her time; he'd have messed up eventually.

No doubt. Morgan would've gone off meds soon enough. Plenty of bipolar sufferers do. They feel better, think that they don't need the meds anymore. And the disease rears its ugly head again. But I get Ava's concern about her kid. Carly was most definitely pushing Lauren to be Morgan's babysitter/nursemaid. She was ready to blame Lauren if Morgan did anything off balance. It was never Lauren's job to keep Morgan on his meds, therapy and on an even keel. That was always Morgan's job.

It would be interesting to see Ava and Lauren taking a few family therapy sessions.  Ava needs to work on her need to control Lauren's life. Lauren needs to not be some damn passive and weak. She did it with Morgan,  Michael, Carly and with Ava. Even with Franco. How nice and different would it be to see parent and child actually working through their respective issues to improve their relationship.

[Ambrosefolly]

23 minutes ago, stlbf said:

No doubt. Morgan would've gone off meds soon enough. Plenty of bipolar sufferers do. They feel better, think that they don't need the meds anymore. And the disease rears its ugly head again. But I get Ava's concern about her kid. Carly was most definitely pushing Lauren to be Morgan's babysitter/nursemaid. She was ready to blame Lauren if Morgan did anything off balance. It was never Lauren's job to keep Morgan on his meds, therapy and on an even keel. That was always Morgan's job.

It would be interesting to see Ava and Lauren taking a few family therapy sessions.  Ava needs to work on her need to control Lauren's life. Lauren needs to not be some damn passive and weak. She did it with Morgan,  Michael, Carly and with Ava. Even with Franco. How nice and different would it be to see parent and child actually working through their respective issues to improve their relationship.

 

Yeah, but if Morgan was the one that went off his meds, Morgan would at least know why his medication wasn't working. Morgan was under the impression that the meds should be doing something, but they weren't and he was getting more unstable and more frustrated. For the time being, he was finally trying to do the right thing. It didn't help that his idiot girlfriend had no real agency and was always helming and hawing. Kiki, and I hate to say it Liz to some extent, think they are so damn important, especially to people like Morgan and Lucky, that somehow they would never recover if they found out the ladies had already moved on. 

[stlbf]

Morgan knew something was wrong. He talked to his doctor, was taking his pills, but was still unraveling. The only thing he didn't do was get his blood work checked. He never did get that done. That is what would've red flagged that something was wrong with his medication or he wasn't taking them as prescribed. Easy enough to have his meds tested to see if they were real or fake.

I don't see how it is Lauren's fault that Morgan was losing his mental stability. That was on Ava's ill thought out plan. Lauren was being pressured by Morgan and Carly to be Morgan's girlfriend. With Carly, that also meant nursemaid. She just didn't want to disappoint Morgan. She did feel like Morgan's recovery was all on her. And that if she broke things off, Morgan's possible backslide would be HER FAULT. Which we all know Carly would immediately do just that. Yeah, Lauren was a bit of a coward. But I get why she stayed. She just didn't want Morgan to hurt. She would rather have him stable and her just be ok. At least for the time being. Plenty of people stay in a one sided relationship. Either they are scared for a myriad of reasons or they are resigned to their fate.

[katie9918]

1 hour ago, stlbf said:

Morgan knew something was wrong. He talked to his doctor, was taking his pills, but was still unraveling. The only thing he didn't do was get his blood work checked. He never did get that done. That is what would've red flagged that something was wrong with his medication or he wasn't taking them as prescribed. Easy enough to have his meds tested to see if they were real or fake.

I don't see how it is Lauren's fault that Morgan was losing his mental stability. That was on Ava's ill thought out plan. Lauren was being pressured by Morgan and Carly to be Morgan's girlfriend. With Carly, that also meant nursemaid. She just didn't want to disappoint Morgan. She did feel like Morgan's recovery was all on her. And that if she broke things off, Morgan's possible backslide would be HER FAULT. Which we all know Carly would immediately do just that. Yeah, Lauren was a bit of a coward. But I get why she stayed. She just didn't want Morgan to hurt. She would rather have him stable and her just be ok. At least for the time being. Plenty of people stay in a one sided relationship. Either they are scared for a myriad of reasons or they are resigned to their fate.

Yeah, I don’t get the argument how the supposition that Morgan would have eventually gone off his medication anyway (don’t get me wrong, I agree with that one) in any way mitigates what Ava did to him in switching them out. 

 

Ava is responsible for Morgan having gone off the rails before his death. Not Carly, not Kiki, not Morgan himself. Ava was responsible and it was a shockingly cold, ruthless act on par with anything Sonny has ever done, in my opinion.

[stlbf]

It doesn't mitigate Ava's actions. It was just as terrible as Morgan and Lauren's stellar idea of drugging Michael to gaslight him into losing Avery. Same terrible idea. Only difference is that Michael wasn't involved in an crime(stealing a car) and having the extremely rotten luck of that stole car having a car bomb. 

 I wish someone who loved Michael knew about of Morgan's plot would throw it in Carly's face. Just because. It is a tad annoying that Morgan's poisoning of Michael was truly just glossed over. Since he just wanted to help Sonny. It made it ok, because Michael was being a jerk to Dad. Morgan and Lauren really lucked out that Michael didn't,get hurt or hurt someone else. Including an innocent Avery.

But Ava didn't get the same luck. 

[LexieLily]

3 minutes ago, stlbf said:

It doesn't mitigate Ava's actions. It was just as terrible as Morgan and Lauren's stellar idea of drugging Michael to gaslight him into losing Avery. Same terrible idea. Only difference is that Michael wasn't involved in an crime(stealing a car) and having the extremely rotten luck of that stole car having a car bomb. 

 I wish someone who loved Michael knew about of Morgan's plot would throw it in Carly's face. Just because. It is a tad annoying that Morgan's poisoning of Michael was truly just glossed over. Since he just wanted to help Sonny. It made it ok, because Michael was being a jerk to Dad. Morgan and Lauren really lucked out that Michael didn't,get hurt or hurt someone else. Including an innocent Avery.

But Ava didn't get the same luck. 

Michael did find out about the poisoning attempt on him, right? It makes no sense - among the many other things that make no sense about Michael/Nelle - that Michael is totes cool now with Nelle drugging Sonny to gaslight him into thinking they had sex.