S01.E05: None the Wiser

[Bort]

Quote

Three concurrent surgeries at the hospital push its staff to the limits. Determined to ease the pressure, Nic requests Jude for one of the operations, making Conrad jealous. Dr. Lane Hunter sets out to discredit Nic's claims, Devon struggles with a patient who has an embarrassing problem and a charitable contributor comes to the hospital wanting to donate a lot of money to Dr. Lane's oncology program.

[Jlina]

Okay I didn't watch most of it because I thought everyone died (ugh) and the music was cringe inducing.  Anyone want to fill me in?  It was damn depressing imo.

[rhys]

Urg, I hate Dr Bell blaming Dr O. Note to self: get a verrrry long lasting temp tattoo before any kind of surgery saying: "This is the healthy one."

[Happy Harpy]

Ooh, so daddy's in town. I didn't expect this one. But of course, daddy issues (sigh). We'll see, maybe they'll use a new angle or at least make it interesting.

I hate love triangles with a passion so this episode ranks as my least favorite so far. I hoped they had dropped that storyline. It never does any favor to any character and in this particular case, both men look like jerks and Nic like an idiot for buying the sob story.

2 hours ago, Jlina said:

Okay I didn't watch most of it because I thought everyone died (ugh) and the music was cringe inducing.  Anyone want to fill me in?  It was damn depressing imo.

It was less depressing than it seemed. Mina and Bell's patients survived, but they mistakenly ablated the healthy testicle so the guy lost both. Jude lost a patient but it was not related to the triple surgery.

The surgery scenes were well done, with the rush. But too much violins. The general tone wasn't as well balanced as in the other episodes imo. Even Feldman was a bit annoying, but Mina smiled so well.

I guesss that Dev needed to stop  worrying about reviews and all, but I wanted to bitchslap his patient.

Bell was back to pure manipulative evil bastard. At least he knows Mina's worth.

The gloves are off between Lane and Nic. Bring it on, this plot has more potential.

[izabella]

1 hour ago, Happy Harpy said:

The gloves are off between Lane and Nic. Bring it on, this plot has more potential.

I have my popcorn ready for this!  Very curious where this will go.

I  guess there wasn't a reason to recommend that guy freeze some sperm, just in case, but it's too bad they didn't.

[Jlina]

Thanks Happy Harpy.  I did see the Emily Thorne smirk, she does that so well.  Nic I mean lol. I hope it's epic between her and that condescendingly patronizing....woman. :)

Edited February 27, 2018 by Jlina

[vibeology]

Well, I guess I'm glad it wasn't an actual bloodbath the way I thought it would be but it was still pretty awful.

As much as I hate Bell, I'm glad Mina went up there and took ownership of the mistake. She'd been away too long, she'd been focused on too many other critical thing and they absolutely should have done another time out before she cut into the patient. That shouldn't even been the doctor's choice. It should just be after x amount of time away, one has to be done.

Mina shouldn't have been in that position in the first place, but once there, she had the responsibility to put her patient first. She's arrogant, which I do like about her overall, but in this case it cost that patient the ability to have a biological child.

The most insidious thing about it all was Bell getting that doctor fired for daring to push back against multiple surgeries and for trying to hold him accountable. That's pretty awful. His "apology" was disgusting too. I really cannot wait for him to be brought down.

[Lady Calypso]

I didn't piece the father-son connection until Conrad saw his father at the hospital at the end. But I guess it makes sense. 

That whole beginning did make me assume all three patients died horrifically. I guess they fooled me. 

I felt bad for Mina, but good on her for taking responsibility. That's the type of character I like seeing; she may be arrogant, but she's not arrogant enough to not own up to her mistakes when she knows she's at fault. Unfortunately, Bell couldn't drop his arrogance to own his part in it. Bell's just the worst type of character. He may know that Mina's an excellent doctor, but he's also still busy protecting himself. I imagine a story down the line when he truly has to choose between himself and Mina, and it won't be pretty. I am actually curious to see what would happen if that actually happened. 

Arg, love triangles suck. I'm going to pretend it doesn't exist between Conrad, Nic, and Jude. Nic's plotline with Lane is WAY better. I actually love the idea of Lane and Nic clashing. Nic is going to expose Lane's shady clinic, and I am here for it.

I did feel bad for Dr. Bradley, but he should have insisted that he shouldn't do the surgery after working 30 hours. However, they have made it clear that saying no to Bell is risky. Well, it turns out that maybe he should have just stood up for himself because it got worse for him.

[izabella]

2 hours ago, vibeology said:

Mina shouldn't have been in that position in the first place, but once there, she had the responsibility to put her patient first. She's arrogant, which I do like about her overall, but in this case it cost that patient the ability to have a biological child.

I think they did more than that.  He had one testicle that was atrophied, and then they removed the one that functioned.  Doesn't that effectively castrate the man?  He can't produce hormones that give him his sex drive, and can't have erections anymore, right?  They basically ruined his life forever, and he's a young man!  I'd be suing the hell out of that hospital and no "heartfelt apology" would reduce that amount by 45-55% and no amount would truly be enough.

Edited February 27, 2018 by izabella

[Happy Harpy]

4 hours ago, vibeology said:

Mina shouldn't have been in that position in the first place, but once there, she had the responsibility to put her patient first. She's arrogant, which I do like about her overall, but in this case it cost that patient the ability to have a biological child.

 

4 hours ago, Lady Calypso said:

I felt bad for Mina, but good on her for taking responsibility. That's the type of character I like seeing; she may be arrogant, but she's not arrogant enough to not own up to her mistakes when she knows she's at fault.

This episode made me rethink Mina's arrogance and now I take it as "knowing her worth". She is that good a doctor, even Bell says she's exceptional. She gives herself a pat on the shoulder when she succeeds and a kick in the ass when she drops the ball. I think it's shocking or surprising since smart people, especially women, are supposed to be humble and are bullied into it when they have the bad taste of being proud of their accomplishments (whereas people good at sports, for example, are often allowed to step all over the others with their physical or athletic superiority). Mina isn't modest in any way either, but she's honest about who she is, she takes responsibility and I like it very much.

[Guest]

Would a hospital in a major metropolitan area really only have three surgeons working at any time?  They really made it seem as though the only options were Bell, Silva or Mina and absolutely no other surgeons were available to assist.

[thuganomics85]

Well, at least it wasn't a massive disaster like they were hinting it would be at first, but it still sucks for the one guy who lost the ability to have biological children now.  Glad Mina took responsibility for it, but Bell and his arrogance was still the over-lining issue, thanks to him basically forcing the other surgeon who was up for over 30 hours to participate, and demanding multiple surgeries at the same time.  I wonder how much longer he can keep this up, because it is obvious that he is experiencing some side effects with those drugs he is taking.

Still think Hunter is some kind of cult leader in the making, because her ability to get this much loyalty from her patients is amazing!  Nic better watch her back, or she's going to get kidnapped, tossed in a bunker, and be forced to drink the special "Kool-Aid."

Poor Devon.  I like to think I'm openminded, but I will never understand the appeal of those who like to put numerous things up their butts.

Really should have saw Glenn Morshower being Conrad's father, after Conrad's story to Nick and then later, we hear Marshall mention having an ex-wife and son.  Still, any Glenn Morshower is great Glenn Morshower!

[preeya]

On 2/27/2018 at 5:53 AM, vibeology said:

Mina shouldn't have been in that position in the first place, but once there, she had the responsibility to put her patient first. She's arrogant, which I do like about her overall, but in this case it cost that patient the ability to have a biological child.

1

They could have/should have saved some sperm for future use, JUST IN CASE. Just saying.

[milner]

While I watch this hoping/wondering when/if  Doctors Lane and Bell will be brought down, I know that won't happen since they are main cast members and likely won't be fired or killed off.  That thought makes watching less interesting for me.

[Lady Calypso]

1 hour ago, preeya said:

They could have/should have saved some sperm for future use, JUST IN CASE. Just saying.

To be fair, the doctors told him that he'd be able to have children with his one healthy testicle, so there was literally no need to save any sperm.

[preeya]

39 minutes ago, Lady Calypso said:

To be fair, the doctors told him that he'd be able to have children with his one healthy testicle, so there was literally no need to save any sperm.

I agree BUT, as I stated it was a "just in case" and see what happened. Organs and body parts removal mistakes happen frequently. Better to be safe than sorry.

[Trillian]

On 2018-02-27 at 11:27 AM, izabella said:

I think they did more than that.  He had one testicle that was atrophied, and then they removed the one that functioned.  Doesn't that effectively castrate the man?  He can't produce hormones that give him his sex drive, and can't have erections anymore, right?  They basically ruined his life forever, and he's a young man!  I'd be suing the hell out of that hospital and no "heartfelt apology" would reduce that amount by 45-55% and no amount would truly be enough.

When I was studying Medical Jurisprudence in law school, the prof claimed that, statistically, victims of medical malpractice are far less likely to sue doctors they liked and whom they thought were caring.  He cited, in particular, one case we were studying where the deceased’s family sued everyone in sight - except the resident who had actually killed the patient but who had come across to the family as a really nice, compassionate person. I went into a different legal field so I can’t say from experience if this is true, but it seems plausible that an apology could help do something similar or make it more palatable for the victim to settle for a lesser amount. 

7 hours ago, preeya said:

I agree BUT, as I stated it was a "just in case" and see what happened. Organs and body parts removal mistakes happen frequently. Better to be safe than sorry.

I think I’d run, not walk, away from any hospital/surgeon who suggested I prepare myself for the eventuality of cutting off the wrong body part.  Doctors have to warn about known medical risks, but not about the possibility of gross negligence or incompetence.  How would that conversation even go?

[torqy]

Conrad's dad is Aaron Pierce!!

36 years ago William Daniels played the Arrogant Surgeon (not evil, though.) Bruce Greenwood has come to own this type of character like Michael Douglas owns the Evil Businessman. Interesting that Greenwood also played a doctor on St. Elsewhere.

[twoods]

Shouldn’t the residency program get reprimanded for making a resident perform surgery after the 30 hour mark? What about the other residents in the program? And the CEO should get shit for suggesting multiple surgeries because that is a big reason why there were mistakes. Gah, this show. All those shady doctors and administrators need to be held accountable.

Edited March 2, 2018 by twoods

[LittleLulu]

The topic of concurrent surgeries hits pretty close to home since there was a huge whistleblower scandal about this at my local hospital a few years ago.  I recently had a major surgery and I was reading the Op notes and the surgeon had to sign an attestation at the bottom certifying that he was present for the entire procedure.   

I thought that there were strict rules now about how many hours residents could work.  That would have sent the resident home after his 30 hour shift. I realize they had to do this all for the drama, but I kept wondering where the other hospital employees were during this fiasco.  Surely there are many other surgeons around!  The testicular surgery didn't have to be done right away - they should have prioritized the more emergent cases ahead of that one.

[whinewithwine]

On 3/1/2018 at 12:23 AM, torqy said:

Conrad's dad is Aaron Pierce!!

36 years ago William Daniels played the Arrogant Surgeon (not evil, though.) Bruce Greenwood has come to own this type of character like Michael Douglas owns the Evil Businessman. Interesting that Greenwood also played a doctor on St. Elsewhere.

Damnit, I wasn't going to watch this disaster anymore until you said Aaron Pierce is back.  The only thing better would be Kiefer.  

St. Elsewhere set the bar for medical dramas.  So many great actors.

One thing in this episode was correct....the third cause of death in this country is medical mistakes.  

On 2/28/2018 at 5:06 PM, Trillian said:

When I was studying Medical Jurisprudence in law school, the prof claimed that, statistically, victims of medical malpractice are far less likely to sue doctors they liked and whom they thought were caring.  He cited, in particular, one case we were studying where the deceased’s family sued everyone in sight - except the resident who had actually killed the patient but who had come across to the family as a really nice, compassionate person.

My father was a victim of gross malpractice by an orthopedic surgeon.  This guy was persona non grata in the Houston Medical Center, but was practicing in a small suburban hospital.  But, he was a nice guy and my Dad refused to believe he was the cause of his misery.  I absolutely believe that a "compassionate" bedside manner covers for incompetence.

[biakbiak]

On 2/28/2018 at 6:11 AM, preeya said:

They could have/should have saved some sperm for future use, JUST IN CASE. Just saying.

There is literally no way they would not have recommended he do that.

[wendyg]

William Daniels was wonderful in ST ELSEWHERE  - arrogant, yes, but also deeply emotional in a repressed kind of way. And also really trying to push the envelope on surgeries that are now routine but then were first-time ground-breaking stuff. They're not doing anything nearly so interesting with Bell.

[Ceindreadh]

Bell’s apology to the young couple actually had me thinking maybe he wasn’t so bad, it sounded so sincere. Perhaps he should switch to acting when he finally admits he can’t do surgery. 

[Dot Com]

Here's a copy of what I write today on my Facebook:

* * * *

So about the interesting guy I met today. So I was sitting in the waiting room at the hospital in Rochester NY and I kept looking at this man across the way. I kept thinking he looks and sounds like someone on a TV show and I knew exactly who he looked and sounded like. He looked like a guy who had recently been on the FOX network show "The Resident" (who I knew had looked familiar from something else). I talked with him a bit and he mentioned that he lived in NY City but was originally from the Rochester area. A little bit later the woman (family member I think) he was talking to mentioned "The Resident" and acting. I said out loud that I had been sitting there for a good two hours thinking that he looked familiar and looked like an actor. So yeah, I had seen this guy in some episodes of "Law & Order: Special Victims Unit" (playing a public defender) and on "The Resident". We chatted a bit and I got his autograph and a photo with him. He was thrilled that I recognized him and that I loved "The Resident". 

* * * * 

So who was he? The guy who plays 'York', Mr. Syrup Bottle himself. Nice guy. 

[Chas411]

Did any of the 3 patients die?