Mind Your Surroundings: Arrow, The Flash, Supergirl, Legends of Tomorrow and Other Superhero Universes

[tv echo]

When I saw the promo that Gotham was moving to Thursdays in the fall, I thought, 'oh no, they didn't put it up against Arrow, did they?' But then I checked and it's not...

THURSDAY (Fox)
8/7c: Gotham
9/8c: The Orville (New series) 

THURSDAY (CW)
8/7c: Supernatural 
9/8c: Arrow 

Edited June 6, 2017 by tv echo

[tv echo]

Someone upthread asked about Rick Cosnett being at Super Heroes Con III (Paris). Here's some fan tweets about what he said at that comic con...

Edited June 6, 2017 by tv echo

[tv echo]

This writer is more optimistic than I am...

'Wonder Woman's Success Is Going To Have a Big Effect On 2018's Television
Merrill Barr JUN 5, 2017 @ 08:59 AM 
https://www.forbes.com/sites/merrillbarr/2017/06/05/wonder-woman-success-record/#28b6fb0a6f55

Quote

It will be said until the day Diana returns to the island, Hollywood is a reactionary business where success begets copy. In this case, the copy is going to be with an increase in female driven feature films. However, those concepts are two to three years away. The same is not true of television.
*  *  *
Last week began the first phase of the fall development process: pitch season. It’s the time of year writers big and small head into the clear walled conference rooms of tinseltown to try and sell the networks on their next great hit. Many shows will get sold, many will not. But, the ones that will have the best chance at succeeding are the ones that meet the (often unrealistic) goal of being unique and timely. In 2017, the issue of inequality is at the forefront more than ever. Normally, it’s an issue given consideration, but ultimately ignored. Post-Wonder Woman, the issue now has one thing going for it: money.

The success of DC’s latest means there’s money in female driven media. Some will argue this has always been true with the buzzy success of Supergirl, Scandal and Blindspot, but all those shows came forward on the back of something or someone big, like Greg Berlanti and Shonda Rhimes. People with that caliber of success can get anything made, male or female starring. However, when it comes to non-name recognition writers selling projects not attached to IPs, chances of a sale are slim without some kind of successful financial history somewhere. For the first time, there’s proof female media sells big.
*  *  *
As we get deeper into the summer and networks hear more and more pitches, they’re going to be looking to latch on to the latest trend. Right now, be it in a female fronted superhero flick or Transformers movie being sold as “little girl fights robots,” that trend is “women sell big.” Come this time next year, don’t be surprised if we see far more women at the front of the pack than ever before, both in front of and behind the camera. Will all the shows be good, no. The law of averages will always make that true. However, many more will have a shot than in years past, and Wonder Woman will be to thank.

Edited June 6, 2017 by tv echo

[tv echo]

Is Huntress the daughter of Batman and Catwoman in the comics, or was that just done for BoP show?...

[Starfish35]

21 minutes ago, tv echo said:

 

Is Huntress the daughter of Batman and Catwoman in the comics, or was that just done for BoP show?...

 

My understanding is that there are two Huntresses in the comics.  One Huntress is Helena Bertinelli, and the other, from a different Earth, is Helena Wayne, the daughter of Batman and Catwoman.  The part about her being a metahuman was made up for the show, though.  

ETA:  From Wikipedia:

Quote

Huntress is the name of several fictional superheros appearing in American comic books published by DC Comics, commonly in association with Batman. The two most well known women to bear the Huntress name are Helena Bertinelli and Helena Wayne, the latter being from an alternate DC universe.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Huntress_(comics)

ETA2: Apparently the first Huntress was a villain, however, and this is where they got Artemis' mother in Young Justice.

Quote

The Golden Age Huntress was a supervillain with the real name of Paula Brooks who battled the superhero Wildcat, first appearing in Sensation Comics #68....She married fellow supervillain Sportsmaster.

Edited June 6, 2017 by Starfish35

[Delphi]

19 minutes ago, Starfish35 said:

My understanding is that there are two Huntresses in the comics.  One Huntress is Helena Bertinelli, and the other, from a different Earth, is Helena Wayne, the daughter of Batman and Catwoman.  The part about her being a metahuman was made up for the show, though.  

Correct.   I think in the new 52 it was actually Helena Wayne crossing into our earth to impersonate a dead Helena Bertinelli though,  but the less said about that the better. 

[Starfish35]

Just now, Delphi said:

Correct.   I think in the new 52 it was actually Helena Wayne crossing into our earth to impersonate a dead Helena Bertinelli though,  but the less said about that the better. 

Lol.  Who says comic books aren't soap operas? ;)

[Delphi]

4 minutes ago, Starfish35 said:

Lol.  Who says comic books aren't soap operas? ;)

 The comic fanboys that have to insist that their manly men who would never read soap operas,  or watch and how dare these writers try to put that out there for any audience and how dare we enjoy it? :D

[Velocity23]

New casting for Legends

 

 

The CW has announced that Tala Ashe (American Odyssey) will join the cast as as Zari Adrianna Tomaz, a character better known to DC Comics fans — not to mention viewers of 1970s Saturday-morning television — as the superheroine Isis.

 

Ashe’s character is described by the network as a Muslim-American woman from the year 2030 who lives in a world of contradictions: “Technology has brought about incredible change in her future — too bad human nature hasn’t kept pace. Fear, prejudice and a lack of care for the planet have forced Zari to become a “’grey hat hacktivist.’ A computer nerd with a wry, combative attitude. A woman living a double life who doesn’t realize that she has secret, latent powers derived from an ancient, mystical source.”

http://www.cbr.com/legends-of-tomorrow-casts-isis/?utm_source=CBR-TW&utm_medium=Social-Distribution&utm_campaign=CBR-TW&view=list

Edited June 6, 2017 by Velocity23

[Starfish35]

Who?

Nice to have another woman on the team though.  

ETA:  Found this - Adrianna Tomaz.

Ok that sounds kind of like a Hawkgirl take 2. :(

Edited June 6, 2017 by Starfish35

[scarynikki12]

Please be Zatanna, please be Zatanna, please be Zatanna!

[Lily-n11]

[Starfish35]

Legends of Tomorrow Casts Role of Muslim Hacktivist From the Future — Plus, Caity Lotz Teases Season 3

Quote

DC’s Legends of Tomorrow has filled Rip Hunter’s vacated seat aboard the Waverider with a new series regular.

Tala Ashe (Smash, As the World Turns) has joined the cast of the CW drama as Zari Adrianna Tomaz, a Muslim-American computer nerd with a wry, combative attitude who hails from the year 2030.

According to the character description, “Zari lives in a world of contradictions. Technology has brought about incredible change in her future — too bad human nature hasn’t kept pace. Fear, prejudice, and a lack of care for the planet have forced Zari to become a ‘grey hat hacktivist.'”

As Zari lives her double life, she has no idea that she possesses secret, latent powers derived from an ancient, mystical source. (In DC Comics lore, Adrianna Tomaz was an Egyptian who inherited special abilities via the Amulet of Isis and then became known as the superhero “Oh-Mighty-Isis!”)

[Starfish35]

The video is short, and there's not much information that we don't already know, except that she mentions a love interest for Sara, but she doesn't elaborate.  

[wonderwall]

While I have no desire to see Felicity suit up, it's frustrating to see Guggenheim have a female hacktivist from the future put on a suit and fight. Apparently with Felicity it defies all logic/is silly but with this new character/Curtis/Ray/Cisco it's TOTALLY ok. 

Smh.

[Starfish35]

I'm just kind of rolling my eyes at a Muslim superheroine named Isis.  Subtlety thy name is not Guggenheim.

[wonderwall]

5 minutes ago, Starfish35 said:

I'm just kind of rolling my eyes at a Muslim superheroine named Isis.  Subtlety thy name is not Guggenheim.

It's not subtle and very offensive when you put it in context with what's happening in the world today (even if it's an Egyptian name)...

If they keep her name as Isis Guggenheim will officially be the most dense moron.

[Chaser]

5 minutes ago, wonderwall said:

It's not subtle and very offensive when you put it in context with what's happening in the world today (even if it's an Egyptian name)...

If they keep her name as Isis Guggenheim will officially be the most dense moron.

That's exactly where my mind went and ouch. That's terrible.

[ohjoy]

I mean, I get that the name of the Egyptian god from which the story is derived is Isis, and the terror group's acronym happens to coincide in the English language, but this seems like a bad idea. Plus, we already have a woman on the team using the powers of a mystical amulet, and do we really need another computer nerd in the Arrowverse?

 

ETA: On a tangential note, I always loved the name Isis when I was growing up (she was Catwoman's cat in Batman: The Animated Series!), and it totally bugs me how terrorism has so ruined the name for public use.

Edited June 6, 2017 by RandomMe

[Cleanqueen]

21 minutes ago, wonderwall said:

While I have no desire to see Felicity suit up, it's frustrating to see Guggenheim have a female hacktivist from the future put on a suit and fight. Apparently with Felicity it defies all logic/is silly but with this new character/Curtis/Ray/Cisco it's TOTALLY ok. 

Smh.

I actually like that her unique quality has been maintained. There will always be all these tech ppl in costumes but Felicity will always be the only one anyone will remember at the end of the day. 

[scarynikki12]

I'm not familiar with this character but Isis was an awesome goddess, worshipped across the Mediterranean, including the Roman Empire where hers was the most popular religious cult. The modern negative association shouldn't outweigh her historical one. That said, LOT probably won't even use the hero name very often, if at all, to avoid those negative associations. 

Still wish she were playing Zatanna though. 

[way2interested]

4 minutes ago, RandomMe said:

Plus, we already have a woman on the team using the powers of a mystical amulet, and do we really need another computer nerd in the Arrowverse?

Yeah, I just hope that she's got something different going for her to bring to the team/show. At this point, we already have characters who have a "wry, combative attitude" and computer nerds and a female fighter who uses an amulet. At this point the only thing unique about her from this first glance is that she's from the future (and even then just 2030, so presumably not far enough to really be disconnected from the team in that way and also even then Rip was from the further future) and that she's Muslim. 

Plus, with this description: "Fear, prejudice, and a lack of care for the planet have forced Zari to become a ‘grey hat hacktivist'," I really hope she doesn't just become a tool for White Knighting.

Edited June 6, 2017 by way2interested

[Cleanqueen]

There are a lot of people named Isis and a terrorist organization doesn't stop them from using their names. However, I think just to be safe the show might change her name.

[Chaser]

14 minutes ago, RandomMe said:

I mean, I get that the name of the Egyptian god from which the story is derived is Isis, and the terror group's acronym happens to coincide in the English language, but this seems like a bad idea. Plus, we already have a woman on the team using the powers of a mystical amulet, and do we really need another computer nerd in the Arrowverse?

 

ETA: On a tangential note, I always loved the name Isis when I was growing up (she was Catwoman's cat in Batman: The Animated Series!), and it totally bugs me how terrorism has so ruined the name for public use.

Same. That's what immediately popped into my head.

[wonderwall]

12 minutes ago, scarynikki12 said:

I'm not familiar with this character but Isis was an awesome goddess, worshipped across the Mediterranean, including the Roman Empire where hers was the most popular religious cult. The modern negative association shouldn't outweigh her historical one. That said, LOT probably won't even use the hero name very often, if at all, to avoid those negative associations. 

 

While I agree with the sentiment, the problem with it is that we're only rarely exposed to daily talk about the Egyptian Goddess whereas the terrorist group is talked about almost on a daily basis. That's what most are exposed to and that's what people's minds will first go to when they think of the name Isis. So yeah, I do think the name has been ruined for most of our generation...

[ohjoy]

11 minutes ago, Cleanqueen said:

There are a lot of people named Isis and a terrorist organization doesn't stop them from using their names. However, I think just to be safe the show might change her name.

That's what I mean. People who had the name before the rise of this organization still have the name, yes, and still use it (it's their given name). But whereas before writers and creators probably didn't think twice about using Isis as a character name or title for something, now they have to, because the minds of much of the general public jump to the terror group rather than the Egyptian goddess (or even "oh, that's a pretty name!).

 

Or what @wonderwall said while I was typing. :-)

Edited June 6, 2017 by RandomMe

[JenMD]

I am feeling so old right now.  I remember watching Isis (along with Shazam, from which she spun off into her own show) when I was a kid.  I'm pretty sure it was Saturday morning tv.  I thought she was just so beautiful and so cool.  Probably one of my first tv superheroes.  Still not watching LOT, though.  And there's certainly time for tptb to change their direction since they're just getting going on the season.  Not surprised they didn't seem to think this one through.

[Morrigan2575]

3 minutes ago, RandomMe said:

That's what I mean. People who had the name before the rise of this organization still have the name, yes, and still use it (it's their given name). But whereas before writers and creators probably didn't think twice about using Isis as a character name or title for something, now they have to, because the minds of much of the general public jump to the terror group rather than the Egyptian goddess (or even "oh, that's a pretty name!).

 

Or what @wonderwall said while I was typing. :-)

I'm the exact opposite,  I think they shouldn't change the name because that's just giving in. Take the name/word back!

[Starfish35]

At first glance, I was only thinking about the "ancient Egyptian goddess" part when calling her Hawkgirl take 2.  But you all are right - other than the hacktivist part, she sounds a lot like Vixen.  According to Wikipedia, her powers are "magically bestowed superhuman strength, speed, endurance and wisdom, flight, telekinesis, and control over various aspects of nature."    Not exactly like Vixen - Vixen gets her powers from animals and can (presumably) only access one power at a time.  But still. 

[scarynikki12]

You know what? This could also be another way for DC to stick it it to Marvel. Marvel had been resistant to female centered stories to the point that Captain Marvel only seemed to get the green light once Wonder Woman did (and don't get me started on Black Widow). And I know a lot of us really want to see Kamala Khan (Ms Marvel) in live action but it's unlikely given how they've acted so far. So, if we assume that DC knows that Kamala and her story are well received and desired for live action (and they absolutely are), then Zari on LOT could be about them beating Marvel again, this time with a female Muslim superhero. 

It could also be coincidence but these two companies are such rivals that I can see it playing a part. 

[statsgirl]

I hate the idea that Felicity can't put on a mask but now LoT has a Felicity-clone and it's okay for her to do it.

On the other hand, there are real people who have the name Isis.  I heard an interview with a woman who was named Isis decades ago when she was born but she's always being harassed by border security now because they think she's a terrorist.

[Lokiberry]

1 hour ago, JenMD said:

I am feeling so old right now.  I remember watching Isis (along with Shazam, from which she spun off into her own show) when I was a kid.  I'm pretty sure it was Saturday morning tv.  I thought she was just so beautiful and so cool.  Probably one of my first tv superheroes.  Still not watching LOT, though.  And there's certainly time for tptb to change their direction since they're just getting going on the season.  Not surprised they didn't seem to think this one through.

Yes! I'm not the only old-timer here! Isis was also my first female superhero. I loved that show so much, Shazam was okay too, but that was about boys. Isis was way cooler because it was about girl power (only years and years before I ever heard that term).

My question is: how do they reconcile this Muslim woman channeling the goddess Isis (that's what happened in the 70s show)? Or does she just take use it as her superhero name when she gets powers? Or is it just her hacktivist name? It seems like it would cause confusion about what her goal really was.

[Midnight Lullaby]

22 minutes ago, statsgirl said:

 

On the other hand, there are real people who have the name Isis.  I heard an interview with a woman who was named Isis decades ago when she was born but she's always being harassed by border security now because they think she's a terrorist.

It's a bit like all the kids that were named after dictators because at the time it was a way either to show loyalty or to keep a family safe. After the country was freed it was a pretty uncomfortable name to carry even if it's just a name.

[LeighAn]

I think another part of 'Felicity will never suit up' is that Marc doesn't want to deal with the headache that is likely to cause him from the side of the fandom already looking for reasons to hate Felicity.

Plus I just don't think it's in Felicitys DNA to put on a suit and become a vigilante like the others. Like I can't see her mentally or emotionally ever getting to that place where she would see that as an option.

I would however hope that they would at least let her go out in the field more like they did this season since she showed she can handle her own.

[way2interested]

Idk, the way I see it it's not just having Isis as her name. It's that coupled with the idea that her character is Muslim-American (instead of making her Egyptian to at least try to change the connection) from a future that's just a reference to how some people see America right now along with having no featured character traits that sound unique so far at all. It's so on-the-nose and so purposefully political that it kind of leaves a bad taste in my mouth instead of thinking that they want to push for diversity with good intentions.

[Featherhat]

The press release made her sound like a mash up of various female characters already in the Flarrowverse, but reading and watching a bit more about her makes her seem like a potentially interesting character, though so does Hawkgirl (with a similar type Egyptian Mystical origin and look how that turned out. Much as I hate the idea, I do think they should consider changing (or not mentioning) her name. They rarely do on LOT anyway for any character, despite the fact that it's Ancient Egyptian based the fact that the character has been widely touted as a Muslim-American with a code name like Isis might be more trouble than it's worth, from all sides of the debates. Maybe not, I don't think they should be allowed to taint the name forever or even now, but certain perfectly good names take on "no go" status at times.

I do think some of the EP's "Felicity will never wear a mask" insistence comes from the paranoid "Felicity is going to become BC which will herald the apocalypse!" commentary from Comics!Only! Peeps but in a universe where almost every other single character has a mask, she does stand out, especially during action scenes, she's often the only one who's face and voice you can see clearly when the whole gang of vigilantes descend on Star City's always wet and dark streets (it's almost like they're trying to hide stunt doubles or something).

[Lady Calypso]

I'm actually genuinely excited for this new female character for LOT. Legends has done the female characters way better than Arrow and The Flash (at least in terms of giving them an actual storyline and having the female characters interact), so I'm hoping for the best here. At first glance, Zari sounds similar to Amaya and Felicity combined, but I also think she has the potential to be quite different. I mean, how many versions of Felicity have we gotten since her popularity rose? Cisco, Winn, Ray, Curtis, and even Tracy all share similarities to Felicity but they also grew into their own characters. And it sounds like, besides being a hacktivist, she will be more cynical than Felicity is. It doesn't sound like she's all that similar to Felicity at all, actually. It's like saying that Barry and Wally are the same because they're speedsters. Or saying that Ray/Nate are the same...oh wait, they kind of are. But they do share different abilities. I'm also glad that she's presumably not going to the pure comic relief character just because she's a hacker. We already have two goofballs (Ray and Nate) to last the entire series. 

Honestly, I'm all good with more female characters on Legends. As long as she's not replacing Amaya and as long as she's not paired with Ray, then I am totally willing to see where her character goes.  They've written Sara very well, and they got Amaya right for most of the season (until the unfortunate Nate-pair up; I'm still rooting for Amaya/Mick), so despite their failure with Hawkgirl, I am willing to give them a chance with Zari. 

It does suck that the name Isis has been forever tainted because when I was a kid, I watched a supernatural show and one episode had an Egyptian reincarnation character named Isis and I always thought the name was pretty. Now I think that MG cannot use the name because it will 100% backfire and he won't survive the backlash. 

Also, the actress they cast for Zari is gorgeous. I definitely have a woman crush on her and she might be at the top of my Beautiful Women of the Flarrowverse list, or near the top. She definitely cracked the top 5. 

[Primal Slayer]

I wonder if they are trying to get audiences ready for Isis on the big screen like they did with Suicide Squad.

[johntfs]

ISIS the terror group wants women to be powerless and subordinate.  The idea that a Muslim woman is a superherorine, a woman with power and agency who has "their" name works to troll the living shit out of them.  Bonus points if she actually kicks the living fuck out of some ISIS members.

[wonderwall]

One thing I learned about Guggenheim is that him and all of his shows should stay away from politics and that includes terrorism.

Edited June 7, 2017 by wonderwall

[Delphi]

Eh,  I am so fed up with current situations that I cannot be bothered by everyone in Hollywood taking the time to call certain people on their shit. 

[tv echo]

Warning: spoilers from Gotham's recently aired season finale...

What Does the Gotham Season Finale Mean For Arrow?
Russ Burlingame- 06/06/2017
http://comicbook.com/dc/2017/06/06/what-does-the-gotham-season-finale-mean-for-arrow-/

Quote

The introduction of Ra's al Ghul on Gotham -- a character who battled Oliver Queen in season 3 and ultimately died on Arrow -- raises some interesting questions about whether or not his daughters, who are significant figures on Arrow, will be allowed to stick around.

Nyssa, , Ra's al Ghul's younger daughter, has been a major player on Arrow since season 2. Talia, the villain's older and more famous daughter, didn't appear until season 5, but played a significant role in both the flashback storyline and the modern-day material.

While Ra's is dead on Arrow, and so the idea of the two telling basically the same story with the character is pretty unlikely, the fact that Ra's has already told Bruce that he wants him to be Ra's's "heir" indicates that the most commonly-used Batman/Ra's storyline, the idea that Ra's wants Batman to sire an heir to the Demon's Head with Talia, is still very much in play for Gotham.

...Which, in turn, could mean that Talia has to be off-limits to Arrow.
*  *  *
While a lot of characters took big leaps forward in the Gotham finale, most of those were expected. Possibly the biggest surprise of the episode was in the hospital, where a catatonic Butch Gilzean, being treated for a gunshot wound to the head, was admitted under his birth name: Cyrus Gold.
*  *  *
If you were paying close attention, and we know most of our readers were, you might remember that Cyrus Gold was the name of a Mirakuru-enhanced member of the Church of Blood in season 2 of Arrow.
*  *  *
In many of his comic book appearances, the English nursery rhyme "Solomon Grundy" is used as a framing device. In Arrow, while searching Cyrus Gold's apartment, John Diggle found a book, containing a poem on Solomon Grundy. When Diggle asks about Gold after the last fight with Arrow, Oliver simply says "Dead on Saturday, buried on Sunday," a reference to the poem.

Because of the undead nature of Solomon Grundy in the comics, and the introduction of the Lazarus Pit in season 3 of Arrow, some fans have expected, or hoped, that a more traditional version of Solomon Grundy might appear on the series, but the farther season 2 got from the current day, the less plausible that seemed -- and with Gotham seemingly on the road to bringing one to the small screen already, it seems even more unlikely.
*  *  *
If there's one Batman story that's potentially a looming threat to Arrow's current roll with the fans, it's arguably Matt Reeves's The Batman, which will incorporate Deathstroke -- a character who finally came back to Arrow with the season 5 finale and impressed fans so much that pretty much everybody wants to see more of him.
*  *  *
Remember also that Arrow and Gotham have shared villains before; shortly after Arrow used The Dollmaker, Gotham took the character on for a much more significant role. Reality didn't collapse. Both shows carried on.
*  *  *
In any case, there are definitely some concepts and characters that could go off the table for Arrow following the Gotham finale, but most of those things were toys that the Arrow writers had already picked up, put back down, and moved on.

Edited June 7, 2017 by tv echo

[BunsenBurner]

What Gotham is going to mean for Arrow is this:  Gotham is on at 7 and the writing is great. Arrow is on at 8 and the writing is deplorable. I actually think it will bring the ratings down and could be the downfall of the show.

[scarynikki12]

Any Talia story is going to involve a teenage actress, so that shouldn't affect Arrow's plans. If she's an island casualty I'd say it's a show choice more so than a DC mandate. 

[tv echo]

DCN Exclusive Interview: Maisie Richardson Sellers – Vixen From ‘DC’s Legends Of Tomorrow’
Steve Ray   June 3, 2017
http://dccomicsnews.com/2017/06/03/dcn-exclusive-interview-maisie-richardson-sellers-vixen-from-dcs-legends-of-tomorrow/

Quote

MRS: We did the huge Invasion Crossover, where almost everyone from all four shows appeared, that was so much fun. I definitely want to do more of that. There were some people that I think could’ve been there in bigger roles, that weren’t as much as I would’ve liked.

DCN: I know I would’ve liked to see all the characters, but even doing what you did was incredible, and must’ve been a logistical nightmare.

MRS: Oh, wait ’til the next one!

DCN: I’m excited already! So who did you miss that you wanted to be in it?

MRS: Emily (Bett Rickards: Felicity Smoak). I’d love to work with Emily and do scenes with Felicity and Amaya together, We’ve not had that.

DCN: Wow, you’re right.

MRS: In fact, I’d love an episode or crossover with just the ladies. Vixen, Sara, Supergirl… all the girls going on a mission on their own. That would be so great!

DCN: I’d watch the hell out of that, it would be awesome!

MRS: Yes, it would!

Edited June 7, 2017 by tv echo

[BkWurm1]

I really love Gotham, but I found their Ra's even less memorable than Arrow's first introduction of Ra's. He seemed...short and too normal looking. And the shiny black leather outfits and repurposed painting masks for the LoA didn't impress.  Gotham's Ra's may still turn out better than Matt Noble, but I think Arrow will beat them in the costume department.  

Edited June 7, 2017 by BkWurm1

[Lokiberry]

24 minutes ago, BkWurm1 said:

I really love Gotham, but I found their Ra's even less memorable than Arrow's first introduction of Ra's. He seemed...short and too normal looking. And the shiny black leather outfits and repurposed painting masks for the LoA didn't impress.  Gotham's Ra's may still turn out better than Matt Noble, but I think Arrow will beat them in the costume department.  

I have to disagree. Alexander Siddig is the perfect choice for Ra's, and Gotham has costumed him to look just like he does in the comics. If there's one thing Gotham can do, it's cast a villain. 98% of their choices have been nothing short of inspired.

The LoA soldiers had me laughing though. With the costumes and all the flipping around, they looked to me exactly like they did on Arrow.

[johntfs]

5 hours ago, tv echo said:

What Does the Gotham Season Finale Mean For Arrow?

I don't know.  What does the Arrow season finale mean for NCIS?

Quick answer: Absolutely nothing.

Quick answer to the Gotham question: Also absolutely nothing.

They're two different shows on two different networks (and unlike Supergirl and The Flash those networks aren't owned by the same corporation). 

To my knowledge Gotham City has never been mentioned on any of the CW DC shows, nor was it mentioned on the first season of Supergirl on CBS.  The closest I've heard to anyone making a "Bat" reference was Cisco in the most recent episode of The Flash where he referred to the villain as "Two-Face."  The context of the reference was almost certainly pop culture in nature (just like most if not all of Cisco's references).  IE, Cisco was referring to the fictional Batman villain, Two-Face.  Which means that in the universe of The Flash, Legends of Tomorrow and Arrow, Batman is a fictional character.  He's probably fictional in the universe of Supergirl as well, but we don't know for sure.

And all of that is a roundabout way to say that an appearance by a version of Ra's al Ghul (or Talia or Nyssa) on Gotham(or on any other show outside the CW DC universe) doesn't mean anything.  As far as Arrow goes, Ra's isn't just really dead, he's really, most sincerely dead.  Unless the show-runners decide to resurrect him or something.  The show is still based on a comic book, after all.

[Oreo2234]

Quote

To my knowledge Gotham City has never been mentioned on any of the CW DC shows, nor was it mentioned on the first season of Supergirl on CBS.  The closest I've heard to anyone making a "Bat" reference was Cisco in the most recent episode of The Flash where he referred to the villain as "Two-Face."

Gotham was mentioned once or twice in the second season of Supergirl. 

[way2interested]

They also all but directly name-dropped Batman a few times on Supergirl (Kara mentioned that she thought masks were big "in that other city," she mentioned that her cousin worked once with a vigilante who had tons of demons, James mentioned how a civilian looked at Guardian in fear like "Clark's friend" even though he was trying to save her, etc.).