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Celebrating 25 Years Of The West Wing

GH History Lessons: Because History is Always Repeating Itself

Stinger97

By Stinger97
in General Hospital

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Dandesun
Dandesun

She was his friend. She was his friend! She drugged him and dumped alcohol all over him to get him to leave town not because she was afraid of his drinking... she knew very well how hard he was workin

dubbel zout
dubbel zout

Michael is so mean not to forgive Sonny for all of this.

HipOldBat
HipOldBat

"Goaded him."  No.  Classic excuse, but...no.  Sonny chooses to get angry.  It is not the women's fault.   The mothers were at fault for not taking the kids out of the room.  Again, no.  It's Sonny'

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TeeVee329

TeeVee329

Can someone give me the highlights about Sean and Tiffany?  I know they were a major part of the Anna/Robert/Felicia/Luke group for a while, but they were before my time and they've never really visited like all the others.  Did the actors leave of their own free will or were they written out?

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SlovakPrincess

SlovakPrincess

I think they got written out in the mid 90s. They left town to get Sean medical treatment after he got shot or something.

Tiff shows up in the ice princess story in '81 as the actress girlfriend of one of the Cassadines. Robert lures her away, she switches to the good guys' team, and they date for a while.

Sean shows up a few years later, as Robert's former WSB boss and pal. But he's scheming to steal Felicia's family fortune for a while and is bad for a while. Eventually he decides to be nice I guess. Monica has an affair with him at one point.

I don't know how they get together in the late 80s, but they marry after a lot of comical bickering, during which wedding her real name is revealed to be Ellie Mae Krumholtz. Sean tries not to laugh but can't help himself and she is pissed.

They were very good friends with Robert and Anna and very close to Robin.

Tiff really wanted a kid and does get pregnant. But she finds out about an affair Sean had, and that lady ends up dead (Sean didn't kill her but is a suspect), the stress of which causes a miscarriage. Tiff starts drinking and almost kills herself with pills.

Then Luke and Laura returned and I think they got backburnered then written off.

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Box305

Box305

(edited)

One of the best soap weddings EVER: 

 

 

I remember watching this the day it aired. (I was a freshman in high school.) 

 

BTW, Sharon Wyatt really wounded John Reilly during this scene and made him bleed. That was a real yelp at 1:58, it wasn't acting. 

Edited by Box305
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GHScorpiosRule

GHScorpiosRule

Sean shows up a few years later, as Robert's former WSB boss and pal. But he's scheming to steal Felicia's family fortune for a while and is bad for a while. Eventually he decides to be nice I guess. Monica has an affair with him at one point.

I don't know how they get together in the late 80s, but they marry after a lot of comical bickering, during which wedding her real name is revealed to be Ellie Mae Krumholtz. Sean tries not to laugh but can't help himself and she is pissed.

 

I actually loved the affair storyline of Sean and Monica.  I can't recall who it was, but someone reached out to Tiffany and asked her to break them up, and in doing so, both Sean and Tiffany fell in love.

 

And it was Tiffany who killed that twat of a nasty ADA/DA? who Sean had the affair with. Though I don't know if anyone other than Sean found out.

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Francie

Francie

One of the best soap weddings EVER:

IMHO, THE best soap wedding ever.

 

I loved how some in the audience genuinely were surprised and starting laughing at the "Elsa May Glutz"/ "Who?" exchanges.  Since many actors only read the pages on which they, themselves, had lines, a lot of them had no idea it was coming.

 

You may note, too, that Robin disappears as she's cut off on the side.  In reality, due to child labor laws, she got to go home at 5 or 6.  And everyone else had to stay until midnight to finish filming.  I never noticed that until someone did a pop up version of the wedding scene, and pointed it out.

 

 

I can't recall who it was, but someone reached out to Tiffany and asked her to break them up, and in doing so, both Sean and Tiffany fell in love.

Edward brought back Tiffany.

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TeeVee329

TeeVee329

And Cheryl is Lucas' mom, right? 

 

It's too bad Lucas would never speak to his relationship with Aunt Tiffany.  And I've always thought it was kinda nuts that he's never asked Julian to tell him about Cheryl.

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UYI

UYI

Jessica Holmes was the name of the DA Sean cheated on Tiffany with. At one point, Felicia tied Jessica up, and naturally, that scene has a become a hit on YouTube among those with a "bound and gagged" fetish. 

 

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Box305

Box305

(edited)

I actually loved the affair storyline of Sean and Monica.  I can't recall who it was, but someone reached out to Tiffany and asked her to break them up, and in doing so, both Sean and Tiffany fell in love.

 

And it was Tiffany who killed that twat of a nasty ADA/DA? who Sean had the affair with. Though I don't know if anyone other than Sean found out.

 

I liked Sean and Monica's storyline too. I was only 11 at the time and probably shouldn't have been rooting for an affair but I did anyway ;) 

 

I ended up really loving Sean and Tiffany together. I missed a lot of the 1993 stuff because I was busy in college at the time but caught up with it on YouTube. Sharon Wyatt was amazing. 

Edited by Box305
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Cattitude

Cattitude

You know you have GOT to warn me before I have to see Dante's bad hair! Is it wrong I was glad Sonny shot that hairdo?

 

The last video can't be viewed but I think it was a favor b/c Carson sex probably better not seen.

 

LOL at Edward being an "old man". Edward was plenty ugly himself at times.

 

I really loved that clip of Sonny and Dante. The acting was really good, and Sonny looked kinda cute. That was some good drama(I hope it wasn't Guza)

 

Sorry to say none of that made me dislike Sonny. Sonny is a mob boss, I'd expect him to be like he is. My view of it most of those people were actually confronting and berating Sonny, so not like he went out of his way to be evil. He was running his business.

Do I think Sonny is a good person, no, but he isn't trying to be so I like him as a bad guy.

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ulkis

ulkis

(edited)
You know you have GOT to warn me before I have to see Dante's bad hair! Is it wrong I was glad Sonny shot that hairdo?

 

 

Yes! :p He was adorable, despite his hair. Or because of it. :) I was going to tell you but I forgot. Just assume pre 2012 Dante is going to have hair you don't like :)

 

Sorry to say none of that made me dislike Sonny. Sonny is a mob boss, I'd expect him to be like he is.

 

 

Of course! The problem was the show kept trying to tell us he was a "good" mob boss/murderer/abuser. I totally get liking to him as bad character . . . but the show kept trying to tell us he was awesome, which was annoying.

 

My view of it most of those people were actually confronting and berating Sonny, so not like he went out of his way to be evil. He was running his business.

 

 

 

He kinda did though. In the clip with Dante he could have at least shot him and have done with it. Instead he rubbed it in about how no one was gonna find his body and made poor Dante stand there while he made a blah blah I'm gonna kill you speech.

 

And yeah, that was Guza. Guza was capable of great drama. He just never followed through so many times unfortunately. And that was an excellent scene - sadly neither Dominic nor Maurice got nominated for it. I still think it was probably Dominic's best scene on the show.

 

LOL at Edward being an "old man". Edward was plenty ugly himself at times.

 

true! But he was an old man and Sonny should have been above choking him if he's as honorable as he says he is.

 

The thing with his girlfriend Brenda was probably the least justified. She was shot at while she was taking a shower because of him. If had just confided in her, trusted her a bit she would have never been driven to wear a wire. And he held that against her for a loooong time.

Edited by ulkis
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TeeVee329

TeeVee329

But he [Edward] was an old man and Sonny should have been above choking him if he's as honorable as he says he is.

 

Plus, Edward wasn't wrong, Jason and Sonny totally got Justus killed.  Any "honorable" person would have at least stood there and taken the grief-stricken railing, not choked an old man.

  • Love 8
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Francie

Francie

(edited)
Can someone give me the highlights about Sean and Tiffany?  I know they were a major part of the Anna/Robert/Felicia/Luke group for a while, but they were before my time and they've never really visited like all the others.  Did the actors leave of their own free will or were they written out?

 

As to when they left, it was the beginning of the end for GH, because neutralizing the last effective Police Commissioner was important to allow for the overrun of the mob. 

 

When Luke and Laura returned in late 1993, Luke was forced back into the mob.  That put him at odds with Sean, the then Police Commissioner.  Of course Luke had to win and Sean lose, so rather than writing Sean as ignominiously as they have written Mac and Anna, the writers wrote Sean off, and along with him, Tiffany. 

 

I think Tiffany was pregnant at the time and we later heard that she had given birth to a girl whom they named Anna.

 

There is a youtube video of John Reilly's goodbye luncheon with the fans.  John said that he was at the end of the contract, and the show runners (Wendy Riche at the time, but he didn't name names) decided not to offer him a new contract.  After John says, "I was at the end of my contract," Sharon Wyatt -- the actress who played Tiffany -- blurts out, "Well I wasn't!"  She didn't sound too happy about being let go mid-contract.

 

Within two years after Sean left, Sonny was running the mob and the mob was in charge.    In, what three or four more, Jason was the only one who could stop crime. Good was bad, up was down, and Port Charles has never been the same.

Edited by Francie
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Dandesun

Dandesun

Sean got badly injured and it was kinda Luke's fault, right? I just remember him being wheeled out of the hospital while Tiff tearfully hugged Robin.

Y'know,back when people were allowed to be nice to Robin. :(

 

I believe it was. That was when I first started watching but I remember Luke going to Tiffany and saying 'Hello Elsie Maye...' in this real sorrowful, regretful tone. I think they made a sort of peace but it Luke was very much involved in Sean's shooting.

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HeatLifer

HeatLifer

Sean got badly injured and it was kinda Luke's fault, right? I just remember him being wheeled out of the hospital while Tiff tearfully hugged Robin.

Y'know,back when people were allowed to be nice to Robin. :(

Not only are people not nice to her anymore, they just don't care. :( :(

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UYI

UYI

You can literally find everything you need to know about Sean & Tiffany at Paige E.'s YouTube channel (formerly known as Donelys3). Everything you will ever need to know and more about--to quote Paige--"The Life and Times of Stiff." :)

 

I'm not quite sure why John Reilly and Sharon Wyatt were let go, but I do know that Paige labels the playlist of their final years on YouTube--1993-1995--as, "Are We Still On The Show?" The storyline where Tiffany lost her baby/Jessica Holmes' murder really was their last significant story. I remember hearing they were let go because of age, but given how inclusive Claire Labine was for writing to each age group, I find this somewhat hard to believe. 

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ulkis

ulkis

awww... ya'll better stop showing me these Sonny clips. It makes me like him MORE not less. I felt bad for him when he shot Carly by accident.

 

Who was that guy he shot? Looked like Chandler Bing off of Friends. LOL

 

Bite your tongue! Old no-lips (aka Alcazar) does not look like my cutie Chandler Bing.

 

I tried to find the clip of Jeanine where Sonny made her crawl on the floor and throw money at her, but I couldn't find it. But, oh, how could I forget this one? 

 

Sonny harasses the girl he convinced to become a stripper (and he plied her with drugs to keep her going)

 

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Ambrosefolly

Ambrosefolly

Remember on GH, after Port Charles premiered and there was a crossover with Karen and Sonny, and Karen actually thanked him, but years later on Port Charles, Karen nearly slapped him across the face? It occurred to me in the former, Karen was far removed from her drug addiction and stripper days that she could look back on that chapter as something almost positive, but in the latter, when she relapsed into drug addiction, she realized that Sonny was a hinderance, not a help.

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jsbt

jsbt

I don't think the scene where Sonny makes an example of Faith in front of the Five Families using her sex is on YT. It was 2003 or 2004 - he grabs her by the hair, kisses her, drags her around and asks the old goombas if they want a piece of this whore. I couldn't believe what I was watching, but it was deliberately done to show us Sonny was badass.

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ParadoxLost

ParadoxLost

awww... ya'll better stop showing me these Sonny clips. It makes me like him MORE not less. I felt bad for him when he shot Carly by accident.

 

Not me.  I had forgotten that he stood around swaddling the baby and cooing to it while Carly had a bullet in the head.  That is really the most bizarre reaction to seeing a woman with a bullet in her head I've ever seen, baby or no.  There was no urgency over saving Carly at all.

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Deputy Deputy CoS

Deputy Deputy CoS

awww... ya'll better stop showing me these Sonny clips. It makes me like him MORE not less. 

 

I am sorry that you just started, there have been some good character/story arc over the years. Some YTuber's have good playlist in chronological order that you could watch for characters you are interested in.

 

If being invested in Sonny, good or bad makes one a fan then I guess you can count me as such. Good or bad, I like watching Sonny. His love story with Brenda was one of my all time favorite pairings on GH. Brenda's love for him redeemed him, and his love for her endeared him to me. I even liked S&C at their inception. 

 

I don't condone most of the things he does. While his love story with Brenda is one of my favorites, the AJ meathook period is right up there with my most hated period in the show's history. Sonny's done an awful lot of bad things, there are no buts or ifs about them. The thing is, I haven't lost the ability to laugh at him. Sonny unintentionally brings the LOLs. Some of the clips above like him accidentally shooting Carly in the head is one those times. He gets some of the most atrocious lines that I can't help busting into laughter over. Then there is that killer smile of his.

 

The writers have never shied from making him look like the most foolish in the room. IMO, he has propped Jason Morgan since AJ drove him into that tree. Even today, you have people blaming him for Jason joining the mob.

 

Between the unholy trio, Carly/Sonny and Jason, Sonny is the one who comes close to paying for anything. The latest prison ass whooping is not the first time Johnny has had him beaten up. He did it to Johnny first and Johnny repaid in kind when Johnny was a regular. The point is Johnny was allowed to humiliate Sonny. This would NEVER happen with Jason and they both run the mob. To humiliate Jason, one of his women would get kidnapped and he'll swoop in to save them. All the while crying over his box of pain. 

 

In recent history, some of the best telling off has had Sonny on the receiving end. He is not above other character's disdain. 

 

I absolutely LOVE Sonny and Kristina's relationship. Kristina had a fascinating love/hate relationship with Sonny that I enjoyed. I don't think Sonny loves Kristina less, but it appears he does. I love that Kristina is allowed to feel this way and express it to him.

 

 

Looking for some clips for you, I got stuck on youtbe watching clips of Kristina's abuse. That storyline had me bawling. Kristina and Ethan were love.

 There was no urgency over saving Carly at all.

 

Because it was a bullet of love.

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KerleyQ

KerleyQ

Not me.  I had forgotten that he stood around swaddling the baby and cooing to it while Carly had a bullet in the head.  That is really the most bizarre reaction to seeing a woman with a bullet in her head I've ever seen, baby or no.  There was no urgency over saving Carly at all.

 

He's no good at responding properly when the women he "loves" have been shot.  Just ask Connie. 

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shadowpup

shadowpup

Hi all!  I've been lurking for a while so I thought I would throw my hat into the ring. 

 

I have been LOVING this return of AH.  Faison has been much more Faison-like this time around.  But my god - could they PLEASE manscape him a bit?  Anders was never conventionally handsome but he was always well put together and "old school" suave.  Let's tie the hair back, weed-whack those eyebrows and trim up the beard, shall we?   The suits and the cigars are not enough on their own - I'm digging The scenes between AH and FH however...

 

And I also preferred it when Cesar Faison was just some powerful creepy bad dude from Anna's DVX past - they tried to up the creep factor by retconning when and how they met, I assume to make Anna more rootable and more of a victim of circumstance.  It wasn't necessary, it was a better story when her working for him was just a bad, bad decision that kept coming around to smack her upside the head. 

 

I miss Robert - he should be all over this story...

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Cattitude

Cattitude

(edited)

Okay ulkis maybe if you go all the way back to when Sonny was a "young punk" he is a little unlikeable. LOL

Of course all I could think was how much like Patrick he acted back then.

And aww to Dr. Hardy and Alan...oh classic GH.

 

Deputy Deputy CoS I agree with you. I like Sonny and I can't get why people go on and on about how he doesn't pay, when I see people berate him right and left at every turn. Just the little time Jakson's been on I'm already on Saint Jasus overload so I can imagine how bad it was when that block of wood was playing him. Thanks for the Kristina clip. From that I can see why Sonny ignores girlchild. Sonny is slightly fearful of wimmens and all their "emotions" and having to deal with a girlchild is kind of scary to him. No wonder with how Kristina was.

Edited by Cattitude
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ulkis

ulkis

Okay ulkis maybe if you go all the way back to when Sonny was a "young punk" he is a little unlikeable. LOL

Of course all I could think was how much like Patrick he acted back then.

And aww to Dr. Hardy and Alan...oh classic GH.

 

Deputy Deputy CoS I agree with you. I like Sonny and I can't get why people go on and on about how he doesn't pay, when I see people berate him right and left at every turn. Just the little time Jakson's been on I'm already on Saint Jasus overload so I can imagine how bad it was when that block of wood was playing him.

 

Trust me, we went on and on about Jason not paying either. :)

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sometimesfan

sometimesfan

It was so transparent to prop Holly and it actually made me loathe her (her shitty attitude when Robert confronted her about playing dead didn't help either - "how could you remarry Anna?!" Like, seriously lady? You broke his heart and you're conning his brother right now. Shut up.)

A few years ago I watched youtube clips for the start of Robert and Holly in 1983. And I finally, finally get the Holly love. But 90s Holly was bad and 2000s Holly is ridiculous.

 

The rewrites of Holly's character were ridiculous. Because I watched her introduction and enjoyed she and Robert falling in love with one another, I was angry, but if I hadn't have seen any of those early years, I probably would have hated her too.

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Cobalt Stargazer

Cobalt Stargazer

(edited)
Deputy Deputy CoS I agree with you. I like Sonny and I can't get why people go on and on about how he doesn't pay, when I see people berate him right and left at every turn. Just the little time Jakson's been on I'm already on Saint Jasus overload so I can imagine how bad it was when that block of wood was playing him. Thanks for the Kristina clip. From that I can see why Sonny ignores girlchild. Sonny is slightly fearful of wimmens and all their "emotions" and having to deal with a girlchild is kind of scary to him. No wonder with how Kristina was.

 

Except Sonny being "fearful" of women and their emotions often comes off as him being at best dismissive and at worst abusive. Kristina was often annoying, sure, but Kristina wasn't even a twinkle in his eye when he was telling Karen Wexler how she enjoyed being molested by her father and feeding her pills so that she'd strip in his club. So this is pretty much who he's always been. And maybe he does get berated by the other characters, but it never takes or does any good. Like Carly, Sonny never changes, and he never learns.

 

Not me.  I had forgotten that he stood around swaddling the baby and cooing to it while Carly had a bullet in the head.  That is really the most bizarre reaction to seeing a woman with a bullet in her head I've ever seen, baby or no.  There was no urgency over saving Carly at all.

 

Maybe he couldn't remember where the towels were then, either.

Edited by Cobalt Stargazer
  • Love 7
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TheGourmez

TheGourmez

 

Deputy Deputy CoS I agree with you. I like Sonny and I can't get why people go on and on about how he doesn't pay, when I see people berate him right and left at every turn.

 

Cattitude, Cattitude, dear one. That's because you missed all the years of every criminal act Sonny did being proclaimed as in the best interests of basically the whole town. And by years, I mean a decade and a half. And by every criminal act, I mean all those clips you just watched and about 20 more heinous acts a year. Sonny being called on his actions now, everywhere he turns but Carly and his bestie Duke, is probably the thing I am most grateful to the new regime for. In the prior decade and a half, we were supposed to sympathize with him for doing all that because "he cares about his kids. Really. Well not, Kristina. But who remembers her?" Now? We're allowed to view him as the selfish prick he started as and the one to which he's returned.

 

None of that is to say that I mind Sonny on my screen these days. Seeing him get some form of comeuppance is indescribably beautiful to me. But I did have his back, too, before that decade and a half of propping commenced--I still have the Maurice Benard photobook from the late 90s to prove it. If you're interested in how good Sonny could be, I do suggest watching clips of the Sonny/Brenda romance and Sonny taking care of ailing Stone and supporting Robin. I miss that guy. He slowly transgressed back into his original self from the moment he returned from his self-exile to save Brenda from marrying him. Only truly selfless thing he's done. AND I LOVED SONNY AND BRENDA.

  • Love 8
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Cattitude

Cattitude

I don't have any problem with people gloating over his misfortune, b/c he is a mob boss so his bad luck is deserved. But I can't hate him and don't see him getting propped when you have Patdick, Ava and Jakson running around. Now at this moment they are certainly getting propped. I find Sonny much more interesting and layered than any of those people.

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ulkis

ulkis

Patrick is a jerk, but I can't put him on a level with Ava, Jason and Sonny.They're murderers. Patrick is your run-of-the-mill douche. (to tie this in with the history thread - he always has been, just a bit.)

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Deputy Deputy CoS

Deputy Deputy CoS

I would include Sabrina, the disney princess with, the murdering crew before I do Patrick. 

 

Patrick is a jerk, but I can't put him on a level with Ava, Jason and Sonny.They're murderers. Patrick is your run-of-the-mill douche. (to tie this in with the history thread - he always has been, just a bit.)

 

Anna never gets the same harsh judgement and she is in the same boat as Patrick.

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Cattitude

Cattitude

Oh I don't think he is an evil person, but things are written to make him seem like this great guy and it is annoying as hell. I'd almost rather throat punch him than any other character on the show and I don't even know much about Robin. ugh

 

I guess I need a clip b/c I truely don't see how Robin could ever like that guy he is the worst.

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UYI

UYI

Except Sonny being "fearful" of women and their emotions often comes off as him being at best dismissive and at worst abusive. Kristina was often annoying, sure, but Kristina wasn't even a twinkle in his eye when he was telling Karen Wexler how she enjoyed being molested by her father and feeding her pills so that she'd strip in his club. So this is pretty much who he's always been. And maybe he does get berated by the other characters, but it never takes or does any good. Like Carly, Sonny never changes, and he never learns.

 

 

Maybe he couldn't remember where the towels were then, either.

 

 

This is nitpicking, but Ray Conway wasn't Karen's father, he was her mother's boyfriend when she was a child.

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