Sharp Objects by Gillian Flynn

[FoundTime]

I first remember seeing Patricia Clarkson in Six Feet Under. I will be happy to see her and Amy Adams get acting awards for this but I hope it will not sweep the awards like the director's last miniseries (Big Little Lies) did.

Didn't really need to see Calhoun Day but it was obvious that it was a perfect set-up for a dramatic telling of the story, in that it enabled all the town's characters to be at the same place at the same time and for Conflict to Inevitably Ensue. It did become a bit morbidly fascinating the longer it went on.

IIRC, we didn't start getting hints of the Munchausen's by Proxy until about two-thirds of the way through the book, so maybe in the next ep or two? We haven't seen Camille get "treated" (and sickened) by Adora yet.

[bijoux]

18 hours ago, ElectricBoogaloo said:

IIRC, Calhoun Day is not an actual thing in the book. Camille mentions this guy (Millard Calhoon in the book vs Zeke Calhoun on the show) in passing because the high school is named after him but the details are different. There’s no story about pregnant child bride Millie refusing to tell the union soldiers where her husband is and being violated. I think all Camille says about him is that he defended the town during the Civil War and later became the first mayor of Wind Gap. She does mention that his wife (no name in the book) was in her 50s when he died at almost 100 years old, but Adora’s family is not related to the Calho(o/u)n family in the book. 

What was the occasion for which Camille went shopping with Adora and Amma, and Adora badgered her to try on shorter dresses? I thought it was Calhoun day, I'll have to look it up. 

The Munchausen by proxy thing came out fairly late on in the game. I still haven't seen the last episode. Did Camille and Amma get drunk and do drugs together? I feel like it was after that that things clicked into place. 

ETA: I checked the book, they go shopping for a party that Adora and Alan are planning. 

Edited August 7, 2018 by bijoux

[ElectricBoogaloo]

10 minutes ago, bijoux said:

What was the occasion for which Camille went shopping with Adora and Amma, and Adora badgered her to try on shorter dresses? I thought it was Calhoun day, I'll have to look it up.

In the book, Adora just said that she and Alan were having a party "next Saturday" and that's why Camille needed a dress, but we never actually see the party.

Quote

The Munchausen by proxy thing came out fairly late on in the game. I still haven't seen the last episode. Did Camille and Amma get drunk and do drugs together? I feel like it was after that that things clicked into place. 

No, it looks like that's next week's episode but yes, that's the impetus for the MBP information to come out.

The MBP suspicions/major clues not brought up in the book until probably the last 50ish pages of the book. After Camille and Amma get high together, they both get hurt on the way home so Adora tends to them and she gives Camille a blue pill that she says will prevent infection or help her get better (something like that). When she wakes up, she goes to Amma's room to check on her and Amma mentions that those blue pills are a favorite of Adora's to give to Amma and that they make her "hot and drooly." She also tells Camille that Adora gives her other drugs that give her various symptoms: vomiting, sleepiness, hot enough to require cold baths, etc. Camille recognizes these as things that Marian suffered from and realizes that Adora was making her sick. Camille then leaves the house to talk to Jackie about Adora to confirm her suspicions. That night, she lets Adora give her more medication which makes her start vomiting which further confirms her suspicions. The next day Camille goes to the hospital where Marian died to look at her medical records. She finds a note from one of the nurses who says that Adora is making Marian sick so Camille tracks her down to talk to her about it further.The nurse is the first one who actually uses the term MBP and that's about 20 pages before the end of the book.

[BingeyKohan]

21 hours ago, teddysmom said:

4 hours ago, ElectricBoogaloo said:

The MBP suspicions/major clues not brought up in the book until probably the last 50ish pages of the book. 

I was just coming here to solicit speculation on how closely folks think the last 3 episodes of the series will hew to the book. In the book, Jackie seemed to be on her way to making a reference to the MBP at the boozy brunch we saw in episode 4 (I remember her saying something about Adora and harm but she trails off and doesn't finish the thought.) I don't think that happened in the show, though, so you're right, next episode will be the earliest they can steer that direction, other than the obvious of Marian having been ill, and Amma exhibiting strange symptoms once or twice. What felt rushed in the book to me was the scenario of Amma going back home with Camille to live and then the sudden final resolution beyond that. If that's how it plays out then that would have to be all of episode 8, I suppose - meaning only episodes 6 and 7 will still take place in Wind Gap? 

[LilaFowler]

Camille's promiscuity is being discussed in the episode thread and I have to say, I don't actually remember that from the book. In terms of the show, what is left?

Camille and Amma party together, and afterwards Adora poisons Camille for the first time since she's been back. This is when Camille realizes her mother's illness and the truth about Marian's death. She also finds a letter from one of Marian's nurses that confirms her suspicions.

Adora poisons Camille again and "cleans" her wounds (won't be able to watch that scene if it's graphic) and when Camille wakes up, Richard is arresting Adora for all three murders (Marian, Ann and Natalie). He had apparently suspected her (?) for some time.

Camille takes Amma with her when she leaves. Amma's classmate goes missing with teeth pulled out and that's when we're told that Amma killed the two girls and used their teeth and hair for her dollhouse.

Only three episodes left and the show is slow as molasses. I'm guessing these last few shows might actually be exciting.

[BingeyKohan]

23 minutes ago, LilaFowler said:

Only three episodes left and the show is slow as molasses. I'm guessing these last few shows might actually be exciting.

It'll be interesting to see if they do a time jump - the show has run on a fairly compressed timeline so far but obviously some time has to elapse for Amma to relocate, get settled in a new school, make a friend, have the friend start coming over to Camille's apartment, where Amma can see her and Camille getting closer (if they follow that part of the book's ending). It also seems like it would be a little too obvious, that if the show introduces a brand new teen-age girl that even non book readers will know she's marked for death. 

Reviewers of the show received 7 episodes - only the finale was withheld. And supposedly episode 7 ends on a major moment. 

[carrps]

3 hours ago, BingeyKohan said:

Reviewers of the show received 7 episodes - only the finale was withheld. And supposedly episode 7 ends on a major moment. 

Heh, I read a review several weeks back (sorry, can't remember where), and the reviewer made some negative comment and said "Episode 7 I'm looking at you."

[mamadrama]

Keeping up with the show here and other places...people are going to lose their shit when they learn the significance of the ivory floors and dollhouse floors. I am fairly desensitized to things these days and my stomach turned.

[casey65]

I’m wondering if they skip the whole part with Amma moving in with Camille and just have Camille discover the dollhouse floor and put the pieces together.... there hardly seems to be enough time for all that is left.

I read the book so long ago - doesn’t the cop get involved with her mother poisoning her and try to get her to leave the house? And am I totally misremembering or doesn’t Camille sleep with the teenage boy? 

[ElectricBoogaloo]

4 hours ago, casey65 said:

I’m wondering if they skip the whole part with Amma moving in with Camille and just have Camille discover the dollhouse floor and put the pieces together.... there hardly seems to be enough time for all that is left.

I read the book so long ago - doesn’t the cop get involved with her mother poisoning her and try to get her to leave the house? And am I totally misremembering or doesn’t Camille sleep with the teenage boy? 

Camille leaves Jackie's house convinced that Adora is a murderer so she does what she always does: goes to a bar. John is there and already drunk. They talk about their dead sisters and John says that he was about to break up with Ashley/Meredith and then Natalie was murdered. Camille offers to drive his drunk ass home but he says he can't go back to Ashley's carriage house or his parents' house so he asks her to take him to a motel. He asks to look at her scars and they have sex. A few hours later, Richard and Vickery bang on the door because Adora called Vickery allegedly worried about where Camille was.

The next day, Camille goes to the hospital where Marian was treated. The nurse tells her that Richard had already been there (after Camille returned to Wind Gap) to look at Marian's file and had copied every piece of paper in it, so he definitely saw the note that the nurse wrote. The nurse says that Richard questioned her a lot so he clearly knows that she suspected Adora of MBP.

Camille is furious that he knew about the nurse's suspicions and never said anything about it to her, so she goes to confront him about it. He admits that he had a hunch about Adora before he even met Camille and that he initially didn't say anything to her after they met because he didn't know how close she and Adora were so he didn't want to tip her off. He says he is going to come to the house the next day with a search warrant. Camille wants to take Amma out of the house immediately, but Richard tells her she has to act like everything is normal so that Adora doesn't suspect what's coming and have the chance to destroy evidence. She tells him that Amma isn't safe in the house because Adora has been poisoning both of them. Richard tells her that she should have told him so that they could run tests on her.

Camille goes home and has dinner with her family. Adora says that John is about to be arrested (which made me wonder if Richard didn't tell Vickery about the search warrant or if Vickery knew and lied to Adora about John's imminent arrest). After dinner, Camille lets Adora drug her so that the police can test her blood the next day after they serve the warrant.

Edited August 8, 2018 by ElectricBoogaloo

[uoflfan]

17 hours ago, mamadrama said:

.people are going to lose their shit when they learn the significance of the ivory floors and dollhouse floors. I am fairly desensitized to things these days and my stomach turned.

Yes, they are.  One of my unspoiled friends has correctly surmised that Amma and the roller girls killed Ann and Natalie.  However, I don't believe she or anyone who hasn't read the book will guess the reason for the murders because it's too insane.

[bijoux]

Speaking of roller girls, does anyone have an idea why the show added roller skating when there was none in the book? I don’t mind it, I just find it curious.

[carrps]

17 hours ago, mamadrama said:

Keeping up with the show here and other places...people are going to lose their shit when they learn the significance of the ivory floors and dollhouse floors. I am fairly desensitized to things these days and my stomach turned.

I was mad that I didn't pick up on that. But, yeah, pretty sick-making.

[casey65]

Wow, thank you for that ElectricBoogaloo! 

I have a feeling they are going to skip over Camille sleeping with John.  I just don’t see how they are going to fit all this in with just three episodes left... something is getting shortchanged.  And so weird to develop the tertiary Alice character to the extent that there was almost an entire episode about her. 

[jeansheridan]

12 hours ago, bijoux said:

peaking of roller girls, does anyone have an idea why the show added roller skating when there was none in the book? I don’t mind it, I just find it curious.

I think it's because it looks cool to be honest. I wonder if those actors had to get training to skate so confidently. I'm still incredulous that three girls (four in the book) can keep their mouths shut about a murder for almost a year. And I'm still not getting any kind of impression of the girls on the show. They popped a bit more in the book. Just a bit. Also I think the age gap in the book was important. The two murdered girls were 11 and the Blondes were 13/14 years old. Is there still that age gap on the show? It just explains how the girls were so easily able to lead Ann and Natalie away.  

The description of the town in the book drives me nuts. How can a town of 2,000 have so many rich people versus dirt poor? She keeps talking about the rich side of town and new houses and McMansions, and old Victorians, etc ...And 11 bars in a town of 2,000! I live in a city of 50,000 and we only have two bars, not counting chains like Red Robin that serve alcohol. She is not good at setting the geography in the book at all whereas the show is so much better at creating a sense of place. 

I also think Show Sheriff is protecting Adora whereas Book Sheriff barely registered and couldn't imagine a woman being the killer. I think Show Sheriff suspects but can't quite mentally get there.

And I really hope Alan gets a moment. He's such a weird non-entity in the book. 

I also think they're going to make Richard less of a creep to her in the end. Like they may end the show with her getting a call from him. Not a total romance ending but something indicating hope. That they've gone through this thing together. The book ends on  hopeful note but since it is an internal monologue, Adams will need someone to play off of and quite a few people see chemistry there. I don't especially, but mileage varies on chemistry. 

[ghoulina]

23 hours ago, bijoux said:

Speaking of roller girls, does anyone have an idea why the show added roller skating when there was none in the book? I don’t mind it, I just find it curious.

I could have sworn they did go around on skates once in the book. 

[ElectricBoogaloo]

On 8/8/2018 at 9:24 PM, jeansheridan said:

I think the age gap in the book was important. The two murdered girls were 11 and the Blondes were 13/14 years old.

In the book, Natalie was 10 (this was listed on the flyers posted around town, Ann was 9 (Camille runs down the details of Ann's case in the first chapter right after her first meeting with Vickery), and Amma & the blondes were 13 (Camille mentions Amma's age when she first sees her playing with the dollhouse.

On the show, they haven't specifically mentioned Amma's age but in the most recent episode, she said she used to hang out with Natalie and Ann in seventh grade, and Camille says that was only a year ago, which would make Amma 13-14. In the second episode, Camille sees a woman taking down the flyers that say Natalie is missing but I can't remember if they listed her age. In the third episode when Amma asks Camille if she wants to come out with her, Camille says, "You're the same age as Natalie and Ann," but I don't know if she was just grouping them all together under the category of young girls or actually saying they were in the same grade.

On 8/8/2018 at 9:24 PM, jeansheridan said:

And 11 bars in a town of 2,000! I live in a city of 50,000 and we only have two bars, not counting chains like Red Robin that serve alcohol.

.My friend grew up in the next town over from me which had a population of 50K and definitely had more than two bars (not counting restaurants). The population is still the same but I know that there are even more bars there now! Most of them are nice bars though, not the seedy kind that Camille describes.

[Anela]

I had this on loan from the online library, downloaded it today (finally) and skimmed up to where the show is currently, then finished it. I was right about the murderer, just not that it was a group of girls. The way they giggled about the cool girls not getting killed, the way all of the men are so creepy, that you expect it to be them. My sister is really strong, and always has been., although it feels a bit odd to call out a sexist assumption about a serial killer.  I thought it was the mother at first, though. 

I love the actor who plays her boss, but I've thought the guy was a douche for sending her back there, when she did not want to go. His wife seemed dismissive of her on the show, when he was talking to her on the phone, so I'm glad that by the end of the book, she is on the receiving end of actual love. I don't buy the detective disappearing on her, but he lied about why he was hanging around her, to begin with, so I guess I should. He knew her mother murdered her sister, and abused Camille (that she only survived, because she wasn't placid enough to accept her mother's "affection"). That the whole town looked at her as something disgusting, due to her liking the boys - which feels like it really had nothing to do with the book in the end. Except for when she sleeps with the eighteen year old suspect, and you see that she has no real friends there. 

 

On 7/9/2018 at 11:18 AM, Empress1 said:

Me too. A coworker loaned me the book around the time Gone Girl was being made into a movie and there was all this buzz about the movie. I was saying how I was hearing all this about the movie and I'd heard a ton of buzz around the book but never read it, and she was like, well, why don't you try her first book and see if you like it? So I borrowed it from her. It's a quick read. After I finished I told her that I'd figured out the whodunnit early and she said she had too. I never did read Gone Girl, although I did see the movie (on cable).

 

I can't remember why I quoted this. Maybe I quoted the wrong post. I read Gone Girl, four years ago, and loved it, although the ending was even more twisted than the rest of it. I liked the fact that her husband wasn't totally sympathetic - he was an ass, just not a sociopath, like her. 

On 8/5/2018 at 6:34 AM, JohnnyRotten said:

I think this is one of those rare cases where the character in a book is described as knock out beautiful, and the actress they chose isn't that special. Usually it's the other way around (they cast Michelle Pheiffer to play a normal stay at home mom, for example).

I think Amy Adams is beautiful. I always have trouble picturing someone who is described as the most beautiful girl anyone has ever seen. That would be different for for different people. As well as the idea that beautiful = special. 

On 8/6/2018 at 9:39 AM, jeansheridan said:

I think the book and show ought to differ. Otherwise what is the point? The show is one thing, the book another thing. 

I loved seeing Calhoun Day in all its sickness. And you get a stylized representation of what we all assume happened to Camille in the woods. A town approved pantamine. John is right to hate that place.

And I like that some details are changed. Natalie attacks her classmate with scissors in the book, not a pencil. Both eyes. Natalie could be dangerous too. I wish we had seen some that fight in her. I hate that we never see Ann and Natalie alive. 

I liked the book because every detail does matter. I hope the show can be so exacting. I feel like it is trying. I mean we have already seen the dollhouse floor. Briefly but it mattered.

I still have no sense Richard is playing a long game however. I wish he had been a bit more sharp with Adora. Just a hint.

I didn't see the dollhouse floor, and I don't know how I didn't clue into the teeth being a part of the dollhouse, considering she spent so much time working on it. A floor to match the one her mother adored. 

I have no sense of Richard playing a long game, either. It seemed natural to me, that they would get together. 

We will probably see the girls alive, in flashbacks, near the end of the show.

On 8/6/2018 at 11:22 AM, uoflfan said:

We had to wait 5 episodes for the ivory floor and are still waiting for the Munchausen's by proxy.  I read the book when it first came out in one day.  The series is dragging the plot out and could have been done with fewer episodes.  I am enjoying the performances of Amy Adams and Patricia Clarkson. 

Patricia's depiction of a toxic narcissistic mother is spot on.  My mother enjoys having an audience when she tells me I'm "unlovable" as she did in front of my boyfriend after a family funeral 14 days ago.  Since my mother believes my conception ruined her life, I was raised by my grandmother who loved me.   I only see my mother at family events and have seen my father only a few times since they split when I was about 3 years old.  He's just as bad as my mother and married a second toxic narcissistic woman.  My sister from that marriage and I stopped self-harming because tattoos are just as painful, more decorative and our mothers hate them.  I highly recommend revenge tats.

I had certain issues with my mother as a kid, but not like this (also with my grandmother - she had me stuttering by the time my mother moved us out of her house), but mum changed when she became an alcoholic, and certain other things were going on.

 

I got to hear that she knew I was trouble, the day I was born (something she'd never said in my previous 37 years). She said that she left therapy, because the therapist wouldn't blame me for her drinking. When she was sober, she wouldn't say why she left. My sister was the one causing all of the trouble in the house, and I was getting beaten up, and harassed - I will never understand how this happened to my family. My sister always had issues, and when we were kids, I would be the one punished by her when she was upset, but I don't understand how things blew up so much as adults, when everything had been fine for years, for the most part - except for her husband (married six years ago, but together for years). He hit on me, and did so every so often, causing trouble all along. He worked on her self-esteem (negatively). I was able to mostly avoid him, until they got engaged, and then bridezilla emerged in all her glory. And destroyed our family. Virtually destroyed me.

Tagged, because it's long.

Anyway, that's why I was thinking it was sexist thinking, that a woman couldn't be strong enough to do what the murderer was doing in the book. I guess he said that to throw them off his real suspect, though. 

[bijoux]

@Anela, I'm sorry to hear about your family and hope you have dinstancced yourself from them.

On 09. 08. 2018. at 6:24 AM, jeansheridan said:

And I really hope Alan gets a moment. He's such a weird non-entity in the book. 

He seems to be the biggest divergence form the book to me. In the book, it just felt that he occupied the space in the house. I couldn't imagine that dude standing up for Camille in small ways on a couple of occasions and pointing out Marian was his daughter as well. I'm interested if he'll be as devoted to Adora when the Muchause by proxy is revealed as he was in the book.

On 09. 08. 2018. at 6:24 AM, jeansheridan said:

I also think they're going to make Richard less of a creep to her in the end. Like they may end the show with her getting a call from him. Not a total romance ending but something indicating hope. That they've gone through this thing together. The book ends on  hopeful note but since it is an internal monologue, Adams will need someone to play off of and quite a few people see chemistry there. I don't especially, but mileage varies on chemistry. 

What about Richard came off as creepy to you in the end?

[jeansheridan]

On 8/10/2018 at 9:44 AM, bijoux said:

What about Richard came off as creepy to you in the end?

That he let her go home to dinner so Adora wouldn't be tipped off and hide evidence before he got the search warrant. That he didn't seem too worried Adora poisoned her. That he freaked out when he saw the scars and never approached her again.

I know she slept with John, but she and Richard were not remotely exclusive. He should have felt hurt of course but he was also using her too. I just felt like he was a creep and didn't really consider her trauma.

[bijoux]

Camille makes an observation about Richard being brought up in a stable family. If she's right, he could just be unequipped to handle her traumas. Not just the scars, but the fact that she slept with an 18-year-old murder suspect in a case she was working on. Or maybe it's just the fact that this book is filled with such odious people that Richard's actions didn't really register. If he ever did get in touch, and the show swerves there, I think after Amma is discovered would be the right point. 

[jeansheridan]

Well, the show managed to make the teen party sequence not horrific. I liked seeing Richard work too. Although why would Camille's hospital be so close to Wind Gap? I know her mother tried to visit her, but I assumed she was near St, Louis. 

Also, how did Camille find out about Natalie's ear? I can't remember who told her first but I'm fairly sure no one did on the show.

[bijoux]

5 hours ago, jeansheridan said:

Also, how did Camille find out about Natalie's ear? I can't remember who told her first but I'm fairly sure no one did on the show.

Meredith/Ashley told her about it during the interview the show cut short. But in the show, Camille saw the disformed ear during their interview, so she’s guessing about how it happened.

ETA: I think the sign on the hospital said St. Louis.

Edited August 13, 2018 by bijoux

[jeansheridan]

5 hours ago, bijoux said:

But in the show, Camille saw the disformed ear during their interview, s

Thank you! Again my TV fails me. I also wasn't looking for it.

I feel like John is being a bit obvious in his dislike of Amma. But she is generally unlikable so maybe not so weird.

I think the show is better at red herrings. Jackie is almost being set up as a possibility now. And Richard seems to suspect Camille too. And the Sheriff and Alan with their morning rituals. Why show the Sheriff's morning routine twice? I feel like there was a reason? That he didn't call Adora about the bike or visa versa?

[bijoux]

I honestly wasn't sure if that was a replay or Alan's dream. I'm guessing here it's used to show the contrast. The chief's wife wakes him up, cookshim breakfast and hugs him on the way out. Meanwhile, in the snazzy part of town Alan puts away his fold out bed. Sad trombone. Two scenes are overkill though. They easily could have cut out the one previous week. The only point it seemed to serve was to introduce the chief's wife and that could have been done at the party. 

[BingeyKohan]

I think the next episode (7) will end with Camille discovering the teeth in the dollhouse. I don't think they'll do the bit with Amma going to St Louis with her. I think episode 8 will have a little more suspense to it potentially, the viewer (nor Camille) not being sure, still, whether the killer is Amma or Adora. Just a guess though. 

I liked how they changed the bit with Jackie being ominous but not revealing to an interaction with the detective rather than Camille. Unless she and Camille still have the weird foot rubbing/chocolate eating scene next episode. But I think the one in the bar this episode was a stand-in for that. I thought Elizabeth Perkins did a good job letting the information hit her that Camille's rehab roommate poisoned herself. It showed us (who know the full story) that she already knows or suspects that Adora poisoned Marian, and that Jackie is taking in the irony. Her face falls just a little.

I thought the scene with Camille and Alan just didn't work. It was too ham handed with the bits about Adora's mother being witch like. I didn't buy Alan's determination to say all that. And in general I don't buy the demonization of this Joya person in general (in the book or in the show) - maybe because we don't ever really see her, we just hear about her, she doesn't seem real, even less so in the show. I know what they're trying to set up in terms of intergenerational trauma but I don't think it really adds any complexity to Adora. But I wouldn't have wanted to see somebody else's flashbacks either.

[jeansheridan]

Alan bringing up Joya was interesting in that he seems to know deep down that Adora is not a good mother. He reassures her to her face but he has mildly challenged her on the show. I am not quite sure what we are to make of his final conversation with Adora. She is annoyed because the car is still there. He says she was always better with the girls. Did she really want help or is he reinforcing her worldview that only she can parent the girls?

And then it is easier for him to blame his evil mother in law than his adored wife.

Although honestly Camille, do not park on the lawn! It is rude to the gardeners.

[bijoux]

If we weren't witnessing Adora's and Amma's behavior, that would seem pretty cartoony IMO. So I don't have a problem with the Joya mentions. They don't make me sympathize with Adora, they just add another layer of horror. Joya created Adora, Adora created Amma. I'm sure there's a shithead who created Joya as well. The family legacy includes the ivory floor and psychological and physical torture. Wee. 

[Anela]

It looks like next week continues with the book. They probably will cram the rest into one last episode. 

[jeansheridan]

I am hoping for a surprise. Gillian Flynn said in a behind the scenes interview that she didn't know who the killer was until.she finished the book. It kept changing. Which is a weird way to write a thriller. I kind of wish she would give up the crutch of having murders in her books. She doesn't want to write thrillers at all.

But I wonder if she has a surprise in store.

[ruby24]

I also wonder how they will handle the part about Amma going with Camille, and discovering months later that it was her who was killing the girls. I thought that was one of the more twisted surprises in the book at the end, I kinda hope they do it that way...although I guess I can see them also have Camille discovering it right after Adora's arrested or something.

Still, I think an extended epilogue sequence would work in the finale. Especially if they have it so that there seems to be no doubt at all for the audience of Adora's guilt, and then hit them with that at the end, after a few scenes of false resolution and calm. I can see it.

[jeansheridan]

I felt the epilogue was way too rushed. And Amma's last killing too overt. Psychologically it made sense I guess. Especially the shag carpet made from the girl's hair. Ug, that dollhouse! Yet it is kind of genius. It reminds me of Silence of the Lambs when the guy killed women because he wanted a woman suit. It wasn't personal. He needed parts for the dress.

They did show the floor of teeth in the 2nd ep. They didn't look remotely like teeth. 

Based on the show thread however, I feel like most people suspect Amma already. It's harder to hide her on a show with so few people. And so few red herrings. At this point if it was Alan, it would feel like a cheat.

One detail in the book "amused" me. The assumption it takes strength to pull teeth. But not so much with they're juvenile teeth. Richard 's experiment actually pointed him the wrong way.

[carrps]

O.k. is it just me or do other people's brains say "Sharper Image" instead of "Sharp Objects?"

Just me? O.k.

6 hours ago, jeansheridan said:

I felt the epilogue was way too rushed. And Amma's last killing too overt. Psychologically it made sense I guess. Especially the shag carpet made from the girl's hair. Ug, that dollhouse! Yet it is kind of genius. It reminds me of Silence of the Lambs when the guy killed women because he wanted a woman suit. It wasn't personal. He needed parts for the dress.

They did show the floor of teeth in the 2nd ep. They didn't look remotely like teeth. 

Based on the show thread however, I feel like most people suspect Amma already. It's harder to hide her on a show with so few people. And so few red herrings. At this point if it was Alan, it would feel like a cheat.

One detail in the book "amused" me. The assumption it takes strength to pull teeth. But not so much with they're juvenile teeth. Richard 's experiment actually pointed him the wrong way.

I could never quite figure out how she turned the teeth into the flooring. There aren't too many flat surfaces on teeth...even if you're trying to make tiny pieces.

Edited August 14, 2018 by carrps
stupid typo

[FoundTime]

My prediction for the end of episode 7 is that it will reveal Adora having killed Marian (and set up the red herring that she killed the two girls) and/or with MbP having been established and Camille obviously suffering from a poisoning. (Cliffhanger: Will Amy Adams' character die?! Yeah, right.) Which is an awful lot to cram into one episode in terms of the progress the story would have to make.

I was talking with someone once who I already knew but hadn't known as a cutter when I noticed scars near her wrist and asked what happened. (I know, real smooth.) I already knew her family history so understood why she would have done that, and she was very upfront in telling me, but God, I felt awful. I know HBO puts up the little info card about self-harming at the end of every ep but I wish there was some way for the show to help folks know how to talk with people about cutting (when it's in the past, not ongoing).

[jeansheridan]

5 hours ago, carrps said:

could never quite figure out how she turned the teeth into the flooring. Th

Front bottom and top teeth are fairly flat. And if she broke them into pieces to make a mosaic then she could flatten them into the glue. Teeth chip too into pieces. Basically Amma's great artistic skill was being good at details. Very good. Like Camille she is thorough. 

[Andromeda]

I read the book awhile ago. Did Camille get raped/whatever by the football team in it? I just don't remember that happening, but I don't recall all the details.

[bijoux]

She was. She tells it to Richard similarly as in the show, during their tour and obscurely. Richard insists it was rape, she pulls the but what if the girl wanted it card.

[jeansheridan]

The rape has taken over the discussion thread. I kind of wonder if the author intended the rape to be so prominent ultimately.  It isn't hidden in the book, but it seems like a low priority to Camille when she is dealing with three other traumas--the murders, Marion, and facing her mother. 

But the book downplays the event. It's like it was this muddle of Marion's death, crazy mother, and the rape, all equally traumatic. But everyone seems stuck on the rape. 

What is my point? Did the author overload the story? I think the TV viewers will feel satisfied because they're right.  They know it is Amma. But I think there will be frustration because all the other major plot points just sort of don't matter. Richard doesn't matter, the roommate, even Marion whom we barely know, and the victims while not random aren't really special. The rape matters to explain the cutting and alcohol issues, but it is almost background trauma in the book. One more crappy thing in the life of Camille.

And then the novel ends on such an upbeat note after all that pain. Maybe a false note? I liked the ending but maybe it is unearned.

Edited August 17, 2018 by jeansheridan

[Stephanie23]

Do you think that maybe they'll change the killer in the show?

 

I don't know why but it looks to me that something definitely will be different from the book.

[bijoux]

No, I expect the killer still to be Amma. They may change some things around, preferably extend the ending, which felt really rushed, but not something so central. This has been a very faithful adaptation so far. 

[jeansheridan]

20 hours ago, Stephanie23 said:

Do you think that maybe they'll change the killer in the show?

I think it will be Amma but they won't do the very last murder which was clumsy. I just hope Amma doesn't attack Camille for a Woman in Jeopardy finale. 

They never do find the bike in the novel, do they?

In some ways I wish this were more of a ghost story so Marion could kick some ass from the beyond. Stephen King's Bag of Bones has that aspect. Deeply satisfying. 

[jeansheridan]

So some interesting changes. Unfortunately we don't get to see Camille do her own investigating of Marion's death, but I get that for TV. They needed to streamline (although they could have shown her doing the legwork and having the nurse reference meeting Richard, but Messina had to do something on screen).

In this version Richard is perhaps a bit crueler in his language, BUT he doesn't send her back to that house to protect his investigation. So that's a win for the character. And I get why he's angry. That entire scene was so wonderfully awkward and horrifying and undignified in ways I fully appreciate. And the sheriff's excessive politeness (proving good manners really can help you manage a horrible situation). I don't like the sheriff much but I do think he was about as respectful as he could be in that situation.

Also, I doubt the non book readers will notice this, but Amma had absolutely no interest in the crime scene photos Camille had in her room. She was utterly indifferent  because she already knows what the girls look like.

Finally, I will flat out admit, the Camille and John scene was hot. They had chemistry starting from the bar scene. And yes it is messed up of her, but emotionally it made such sense. An eighteen year old isn't intimidating to her thirtysomething self. And he really was so intuitively tender with her. All his instincts about how to approach her were correct. Plus I am glad she had about 10 minutes just to relax. Fully relax.

[ShellsandCheese]

Yeah. I don't see how the last episode could possibly stay true to the book. There's no time, unless it's going to be a two hour eppy. I agree that more than likely, Adora will be exposed but Amma will be fingered for the murder of two girls and they'll skip the Amma moves to Chicago....er St. Louis with Camille stuff. There was a lot of focus on the dollhouse this week, a lot. I would imagine that we'll finally see what's really going on with the dollhouse next week. I'd be okay with changes that skip Amma moving but I really hope they don't change the ultimate ending. 

[bijoux]

I would have preferred to have seen Camille doing the leg work and hearing about Richard rather than have him just drop the hospital records in her lap. But oh, well.

In a sick way, I’m sad that they cut Adora taking care of Camille. Out of everything, you cut that? Unless they have Camille subjecting herself to it next week to confirm her suspicions. Although, I am grateful to have skipped Adora’s temperature taking technique. ?

[Anela]

The preview looked like it showed Camille in the bath, and Adora coming in - just like in the book. A lot of focus on Amma posing, and I can't remember what else, but it didn't look like a new location was involved (unless they're keeping that under wraps). 

[jeansheridan]

Having Richard do the investigation on screen seems to have hurt his character a bit with the viewers. They seem to think he's an invasive stalker rather than he's actually researching Adora as the murderer. The focus of the police investigation is the real change from the book. In the book the little boy is taken more seriously than they reveal to Camille too. In fact the police are much more on the ball in the book than Camille ever realizes.

Camille does seem to  work in the novel a lot more. Although I will give her credit for finding John so efficiently in this ep. And as I mentioned, their sex scene really works on the show versus the novel in my opinion. I cringed when I read it, but didn't mind it on the show. Chemistry helps.  Novel Camille does admit to feeling really good after the sex which was nice.  By that point of the novel I just wanted something to go well for her. Show Camille doesn't get much of an afterglow at all. And the scene with Jackie felt much nastier than in the book. Jackie almost seemed to be mocking Camille which I thought was a weird choice.

Edited August 20, 2018 by jeansheridan

[Jextella]

I haven't read the book but have read most of the posts here.  I'm still fuzzy on how Richard comes off in the book compared to the screen.

My interpretation of him on TV is that he:

• Has no clue about Adora until visiting with Jackie who leads him to the nurse.  I never picked up on anything that would allude to him suspecting Adora all along and using Camille to get to her.  
• Has real feelings for Camille and that their time together wasn't just a romp in the hay, etc.

From what I gather reading the posts, he uses Camille in the book and while he may have some feelings for Camille, they aren't deep and he sees her as a disturbed person.  His words to her when he caught her and John together seem like they might align more with the book version.  They seem excessively harsh and out of place for the tv version.

Same question for the father.  He is one of the more spooky characters on the screen, IMO.  He seems like he's going to snap at any moment, but based on what I've read here, it seems his character didn't get as much attention in the book version.

Am I reading these differences for both Richard and the Dad accurately?

Edited August 20, 2018 by Jextella

[bijoux]

The book is strictly from Camille's POV, so you see even less of Richard, so you have to go by what he says to Camille about when he started suspecting Adora. As I recall, he says it was pretty early on and he certainly never suspected John, he just used the fact the others did to cover up his suspicions. 

Alan is completely vague in the book, without any flashes of empathy and actual spark of life the show has shown him to have a few times. 

[ElectricBoogaloo]

Up until this point, most of the changes they made from the book were either minor or made sense (like creating Calhoun Day in order to bring all the characters together). But I felt like the changes in this episode were unnecessary.

Interesting that they added Vickery having a search warrant for John and trying to arrest him. I guess they wanted to amp up the drama another notch. And Ashley telling Vickery about the blood under John's bed just so she could get her name in the paper - WTF?

A more unnecessary addition was having the nurse being fired from the hospital and working at a meth clinic. I guess it was supposed to possibly cast some doubt about the veracity of her statements, but all of the medical records seems to indicate that it wasn't just one meth addict making up stories. Between Jackie's repeated requests and the nurse saying that there were other nurses who had the same MBP suspicions, it seemed pointless to add that she got fired and ended up working at the meth clinic.

I didn't hate these changes but I also didn't think they were really necessary.

[Stephanie23]

14 hours ago, jeansheridan said:

Finally, I will flat out admit, the Camille and John scene was hot. They had chemistry starting from the bar scene. And yes it is messed up of her, but emotionally it made such sense. An eighteen year old isn't intimidating to her thirtysomething self. And he really was so intuitively tender with her. All his instincts about how to approach her were correct. Plus I am glad she had about 10 minutes just to relax. Fully relax.

Yes, I agree so much on this. I really liked their chemistry.

But I'm confused with show Alan because I don't remember him knowing what Adora does with her daughters in the book.

And from the book I always saw him as being out of it all, but not like this as a personal slave to his wife with a few signs of rebel and even possibly violence in episode 4.

 

And I have to praise again Amy Adams and Patricia Clarkson for being so perfect in their roles.

Believe it or not but before the show was even in plans and I was reading the book I imagined Patricia Clarkson as Adora because she looked perfect to me for that part and when I saw thet she was cast I was really happy haha

On the other I don't know why but show Amma isn't working for me.