The Last Word With Lawrence O'Donnell - General Discussion

[Jaded]

10 minutes ago, car54 said:

I hope this means Lawrence is on.

That tweet was from yesterday. I saw him on but wasn't feeling well so I don't remember most of what he said. Here's David's segment from last night.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6CqFpOGS19Q
 

Edited April 13, 2019 by Jaded

[meowmommy]

Lawrence takes so many Fridays off, they should just program a weekly show from somebody else to fill that slot.  Somebody who wants to be there.

[meowmommy]

Lawrence gets too excited about possibilities that are obviously going nowhere.  Among other things, he was convinced in 2017 that the VP and the Cabinet would invoke the 25th Amendment, when it was clear that would and will never happen. 

And now he thinks William Weld is going to make a difference against 45.  Don't get me wrong; I'd love to see a Republican debate, carried on Faux Noise, just to shine more light on the evils of 45 for the Faux audience.  But there's no guarantee 45 would agree to debate or that any network, especially Faux, would carry it.  Weld pretty much told America to vote for HRC while he was running as the VP candidate on the Libertarian ticket, and has little following within the current GOP.

I know LOD is an expert on 1968, but the parallels between McCarthy/LBJ and Weld/45 are few.  Anti-war Democrats were eager for a champion to challenge LBJ, while the current Republicans pretty much love their orange puppet.  Poppy Bush didn't lose because of Pat Buchanan; he lost because Ross Perot siphoned votes from him.

I really hope I'm wrong and LOD is right.

[stormy]

On 4/17/2019 at 8:18 PM, meowmommy said:

Lawrence gets too excited about possibilities that are obviously going nowhere.  Among other things, he was convinced in 2017 that the VP and the Cabinet would invoke the 25th Amendment, when it was clear that would and will never happen. 

And now he thinks William Weld is going to make a difference against 45.  Don't get me wrong; I'd love to see a Republican debate, carried on Faux Noise, just to shine more light on the evils of 45 for the Faux audience.  But there's no guarantee 45 would agree to debate or that any network, especially Faux, would carry it.  Weld pretty much told America to vote for HRC while he was running as the VP candidate on the Libertarian ticket, and has little following within the current GOP.

I know LOD is an expert on 1968, but the parallels between McCarthy/LBJ and Weld/45 are few.  Anti-war Democrats were eager for a champion to challenge LBJ, while the current Republicans pretty much love their orange puppet.  Poppy Bush didn't lose because of Pat Buchanan; he lost because Ross Perot siphoned votes from him.

I really hope I'm wrong and LOD is right.

I still get angry with Lawrence when I remember him constantly calling trump the man who will never be president or run for president prior to 2015.

[Morrigan2575]

On 4/13/2019 at 11:56 AM, meowmommy said:

Lawrence takes so many Fridays off, they should just program a weekly show from somebody else to fill that slot.  Somebody who wants to be there.

Just like Rachel, which hlgave her Friday summer slot to Richard Engel.  Obviously, they both have it in their contracts.

[fairffaxx]

O'Donnell and his guests are talking about how Trump seems to be "forcing" Congress into impeaching him.  I hope Pelosi recognizes the Brer Rabbit briar patch tactic better than all these guys do.

[Jaded]

On 4/13/2019 at 10:56 AM, meowmommy said:

Lawrence takes so many Fridays off, they should just program a weekly show from somebody else to fill that slot.  Somebody who wants to be there.

I get so annoyed with Lawrence sometimes that I wish they'd give his nighttime show to someone else like Ali who does a good job of filling in on Fridays. 

[meowmommy]

1 hour ago, Jaded said:

Ali who does a good job of filling in on Fridays. 

I actually feel bad for people like Ali or Ari or Joy who already have to do their own show during the day and are then dragged to do Chris or Rachel or Lawrence's show in the evening.  I have to think it takes all day to plan and prepare just one prime time show, but when you're doing two different shows, that's gotta be extra hard, and it happens so damn often.  I often wonder if they're forced to do it or if they volunteer, and if it's part of their contract or if they get paid extra. 

It might be better to hire a regular prime time sub to do a two hour block on Friday nights and then fill in when the prime time hosts take vacation.

[Ohwell]

I used to like Lawrence, but now he's gotten so sanctimonious and self-righteous that I can't stand to watch him for more than five minutes now. 

[Jaded]

1 hour ago, Ohwell said:

I used to like Lawrence, but now he's gotten so sanctimonious and self-righteous that I can't stand to watch him for more than five minutes now. 

It's getting harder for me to watch his show too. It makes me frustrated and kinda sad at the same time.

[Apprentice79]

Why do you guys feel that he is being self-righteous and over the top?  

[meowmommy]

1 hour ago, Apprentice79 said:

Why do you guys feel that he is being self-righteous and over the top?  

I can't speak for Ohwell or Jaded, but for me, he gets very preachy and very smug at times.  He is so sure of the rightness of his positions, and he's not always right.  Not everything he saw when he worked for DP Moynihan is directly applicable today.  A lot of his interview questions, when one comes down to it, are basically asking his guests if they agree with him, instead of letting them talk about what they know or what they think.  I recall a long while back when George Will was on, and LOD tried that game, but George Will, being the cantankerous old sod he is, was having none of it.  He told LOD in his own preachy and smug way that he was FOS, but I don't even know if it registered on Lawrence.

He's also like a dog with a bone when it comes to some particular outrage; he'll talk about it night after night when it's lost relevance to everyone else and dropped off the news cycle. 

I don't know how many times I've started to watch him and then just shut him off, sometimes before the first commercial.  I do keep him on the DVR because every so often he breaks out a gem.

Edited April 30, 2019 by meowmommy

[Ohwell]

Thank you, @meowmommy for articulating my issues with Lawrence.  I just got in from mulching and I was too exhausted to think clearly. 😃

[Apprentice79]

2 hours ago, meowmommy said:

I can't speak for Ohwell or Jaded, but for me, he gets very preachy and very smug at times.  He is so sure of the rightness of his positions, and he's not always right.  Not everything he saw when he worked for DP Moynihan is directly applicable today.  A lot of his interview questions, when one comes down to it, are basically asking his guests if they agree with him, instead of letting them talk about what they know or what they think.  I recall a long while back when George Will was on, and LOD tried that game, but George Will, being the cantankerous old sod he is, was having none of it.  He told LOD in his own preachy and smug way that he was FOS, but I don't even know if it registered on Lawrence.

He's also like a dog with a bone when it comes to some particular outrage; he'll talk about it night after night when it's lost relevance to everyone else and dropped off the news cycle. 

I don't know how many times I've started to watch him and then just shut him off, sometimes before the first commercial.  I do keep him on the DVR because every so often he breaks out a gem.

I will watch him closely and keep in mind your valid criticism.  To be fair, they all preach to a certain extent. I do love how he highlights the Freshman Democrats in the House.

[meowmommy]

I liked the montage of Lindsay Graham then and now, and it needs to be run everywhere and often, but given how much LOD hyped it at the beginning of the show, I expected it to be longer and more dramatic.

[stormy]

Great interview with NYT Suzanne Craig last night. An added bonus David Cay Johnston to debunk any of trump's claims.

Now the he has tweeted (this am) fake news, why doesn't he come clean and prove it? Suzanne Craig seemed to infer that there's more to come especially since Heilemann said dozens of banks could have the same info to process his requests for mortgages.

Edited May 8, 2019 by stormy

[Apprentice79]

1 hour ago, stormy said:

Great interview with NYT Suzanne Craig last night. An added bonus David Cay Johnston to debunk any of trump's claims.

Now the he has tweeted (this am) fake news, why doesn't he come clean and prove it? Suzanne Craig seemed to infer that there's more to come especially since Heilemann said dozens of banks could have the same info to process his requests for mortgages.

Lies are unraveling and the truth will come out one way or another.. The founders were prescient in enshrining the freedom of the press as part of the first amendment of the constitution. 

[Kemper]

I wish Lawrence had not waited until practically the end of the show to bring on Jeff Daniels; he was fantastic.  He was also on with Nicole Wallace a week or so ago.

[car54]

Lawrence has a one on one with E.Jean Carroll tonight.     

That's quite a get.      I have followed her for a long time--and I believe her story--it's horrifying.

[possibilities]

Joyce Vance looked shaken.

[stormy]

17 hours ago, car54 said:

Lawrence has a one on one with E.Jean Carroll tonight.     

That's quite a get.      I have followed her for a long time--and I believe her story--it's horrifying.

I feel sick for her.  It's sad that's she's lived this nightmare for the past 23 years.  And what does it matter?  Even his own words on tape and video don't change people's minds and his claims that everything is a fake is acceptable to the same people.

Edited June 22, 2019 by stormy

[Kemper]

I think sometimes Lawrence can devolve into tabloid tv; many appearances by Michael Avenatti and Gloria Allred.  But.  He has a kind of snarky way about him that I love.  He just smoothly trashes people that I would love to trash on-air if given the opportunity.  

I always tune in at the beginning if he has good guests with some humor.  John Heileman comes to mind.  And he lets his guests talk which puts him ahead of some of the other male hosts on MSNBC.   Are you listening Joe S and Chris M? 

[Medicine Crow]

Lawrence's show tonight was a joy to behold & a pleasure forever!!!  I love it when he tell's all about Trump!!!

[possibilities]

Was the show pre-empted last night, or did my DVR just neglect to record it?

[meowmommy]

39 minutes ago, possibilities said:

Was the show pre-empted last night, or did my DVR just neglect to record it?

MSNBC took Rachel's and LOD's hours and mashed them into a two hour "A Nation in Crisis" with Rachel, BriWi, and Nicolle.  My DVR picked them up as the original, separate hours, but if your cable provider was given new data with a different title, then your DVR wouldn't recognize it.

[kassygreene]

The entire two-hour special is on Rachel's full episode page where it will be for at least two days (until August 7) - although it might stay up longer as it doesn't have an expiration date listed, and MSNBC seems to retain the "special" episodes for a very long time.  You do have to "log in" with your provider....

[possibilities]

Thanks, all.

I'm a little saturated with horror right now, so I'm not sure I will track it down... do they say anything new, or is it just a cataloguing of the grief and outrage that makes up the current moment generally?

[kassygreene]

I thought it was pretty good coverage - most of what seems "new" is the sense that this time it might mebbe change things, and also not only are people more willing to swear, but MSNBC at least is willing to understand it....

As I type this that program is now 24 hours old, so "new" news it ain't, unless you've been radio dark.

[possibilities]

LOD was so excited to host Huerta; I felt bad for him that she didn't make it to the studio.

I liked her calling him "Larry," though; no other guest would be that casual and get away with it.

Edited August 23, 2019 by possibilities

[car54]

So last night as a follow up to the trial where Deutche Bank admitted they might have the Trump Tax paperwork, Lawrence said he had a source who said they would show that Russian Oligarchs cosigned his DB loans.

This morning Trump's attorneys threatened to sue, including the network.    Lawrence did say it was just one source and said "If true"---but I suspect the network is pushing to back off of it.

Edited August 28, 2019 by car54

[meowmommy]

20 minutes ago, car54 said:

This morning Trump's attorneys threatened to sue, including the network.

Their letter is a paper tiger, curiously devoid of content, but looks like the network will cave anyway.

Lawrence was very clear last night that he had only one source that had not been verified by anyone and that he could not confirm the information was true.  I hate that he's being forced to back down.

[car54]

I just saw that letter---I don't feel like Lawrence is the guy who goes off half-cocked with information, and he did qualify it.  I would imagine that this is the network being afraid of litigation.

I love this guy and while he is very opinionated, I feel like he does have standards for himself so this must be hard on him.

I will plan to watch to see what he has to say.

[teddysmom]

20 hours ago, car54 said:

I just saw that letter---I don't feel like Lawrence is the guy who goes off half-cocked with information, and he did qualify it.  I would imagine that this is the network being afraid of litigation.

I love this guy and while he is very opinionated, I feel like he does have standards for himself so this must be hard on him.

I will plan to watch to see what he has to say.

That was one of the most awkward hand offs between Rachel & Lawrence I've ever seen. I guess she knew they couldn't chat, that he had to get the apology done. 

I read somewhere this morning the fact that Trump has stayed quiet about it on Twitter, while the WH sent a letter "threatening" to sue, must mean there's more to it. 

Why he wouldn't hold off til he had another source is baffling. 

[car54]

My guess was that he felt so confident of whoever told him, he let his guard down.   I don't think Laurence is as scoop happy as some people, but I do think he has old/deep connections with many people because he's worked so many places so if someone he trusted to know told him maybe he slipped.     There is photojournalist was in the courtroom for all this and she seemed to confirm what Laurence got out of his source.

Trump has not been the worst--he did tweet about it but not constantly.   Eric Trump posted a threat that the Trump Org would sue, but I suspect he needs to run that by Dad's lawyers.

They don't want to go to court because then the documents become open to NBC's lawyers for discovery, so they have to tread lightly.

NBC has their own Deutche Bank expert--Stephanie Ruhle worked there for 8 years.    She seems to be off this week and even when she is in, she seems very reticent to discuss her time or any info she might know about them.   Maybe she has an NDA from when she left or something.   Not that I think she has direct info, but she never seems to participate when there is DB news.

[teddysmom]

Oh I believe Lawrence, but when you announce a story and also say "we haven't double sourced it and the source we have didn't see the docs" that's going to set off the alarms.

Wonder why he didn't say (or did he and I missed it) that his source was in the court room during the DB arguments, unless he was trying to protect them. 

[car54]

I don't know if this photojournalist is his source or who told him, but she was posting every day from the courthouse and then after they announced he'd be retracting she posted that he'd be vindicated.

[meowmommy]

13 minutes ago, teddysmom said:

Oh I believe Lawrence, but when you announce a story and also say "we haven't double sourced it and the source we have didn't see the docs" that's going to set off the alarms.

I haven't seen anywhere that Lawrence or the network has said the information was wrong--just that they can't verify it.  It will be a sweet day indeed if the report turns out to be true.

1 hour ago, car54 said:

I don't think Laurence is as scoop happy as some people, but I do think he has old/deep connections with many people because he's worked so many places so if someone he trusted to know told him maybe he slipped.

I wonder, but hope I am wrong, if Lawrence got excited at the chance to break something before Rachel and therefore got out ahead of his skis.  Too often, it seems, by the time he comes on the air, everything of importance has been reported, dissected, and analyzed, often by Rachel, and he gets the crumbs left over.

[teddysmom]

26 minutes ago, meowmommy said:

I haven't seen anywhere that Lawrence or the network has said the information was wrong--just that they can't verify it.  It will be a sweet day indeed if the report turns out to be true.

I'm sure it's true, based on Eric Trump's statements alone; but the general rule is two sources.  I don't know if the documents are sealed that they can't get them thru a FOIA request or what, but if it's in a court proceeding, usually they're public unless the defendant can get them sealed? 

How in God's name did this stuff not get found out til now?  

[HyeChaps]

I love Lawrence, but he should have known better. IMO he should face some punishment. 

[HyeChaps]

Not suspended, but I noticed he didn’t have his usual Friday night off. 

[Jaded]

2 hours ago, HyeChaps said:

Not suspended, but I noticed he didn’t have his usual Friday night off. 

I was thinking he may have shown up in an attempt to quash any rumors that he may have gotten suspended.

[Hooper]

In the great cosmic scale of things, the attitude of the Present Occupant of the Oval Office (POOO) toward dogs is a tiny insignificant thing.  Still, it gladdened my heart to hear Lawrence mention  POOO spending a life time using "like a dog" as the ultimate insult and then praising the "beautiful" and "talented" military dog involved in the Al-Baghdadi raid. In one sentence POOO was using "like a dog" to describe Al-Baghdadi's supposed (ie, imagined) cowardly whimpering, and a sentence or two later describing the military dog chasing Al-Baghdadi down a dead end tunnel, saving human military personnel from that high risk action. You know, fearlessly pursuing her quarry, as she had been trained to, "like a dog".  That bit of hypocrisy is a small thing in the great cosmic scale of hypocrisy and stupidity, but I'm glad Lawrence pointed it out.

[Ohwell]

Lawrence handed Pete Buttigieg his ass last night for saying that Democrats weren't concerned enough about the deficit.  He invited him to be on the show but I wonder if he'll show up.

[Pearson80]

On 12/6/2019 at 11:18 AM, Ohwell said:

Lawrence handed Pete Buttigieg his ass last night for saying that Democrats weren't concerned enough about the deficit.  He invited him to be on the show but I wonder if he'll show up.

It was a thing of beauty.. Lawrence is on fire whenever he brings up his past working in the senate.  He always offers little insights that we don't know about.

Edited December 8, 2019 by Pearson80

[Hanahope]

Nice interview with Joe Biden last night.  No edits, every word broadcasted.  He had some good answers to tough questions.  Had to chuckle that’s he still managed to include a criticism of Sanders with the compliment.

[Lebanna]

It is driving me nuts that Lawrence and some other shows on MSNBC were saying Monday that France and Spain had zero new cases on Sunday.
 

It only appeared that way due to the lag in reported cases in France due to the weekend, they don’t count them and then have a huge total every week for Monday which includes all the cases from the last three days. Therefore Monday’s total was 3,376, making it over 1,000 cases per day. This pattern of not giving daily totals is clear to see from any chart from the last few weeks.
 

The exact same thing is true of Spain, which had 8,532 cases on Monday after not counting any cases over the weekend. 
 

Come on, Lawrence and MSNBC. We rely on you to be more truthful than Fox. Don’t fall into the trap of fudging the numbers to get the result you want for the story. Don’t try to trick us. The US figures are still way worse than in any of these countries, but you don’t have to lie by omission to get that information across. Because then you just look like another bunch of con artists.

[possibilities]

... or they're just extremely lazy, which is also possible. I'm not in any way defending it, but I've seen a lot of shockingly sloppy things happening on various "news" shows. Maddow seems to be the only one who meticulously checks everything, including pronunciation of names of people she'll be talking about.

[Lebanna]

You are a lot kinder than me.

I feel like, when you are reporting international news, you probably should have noticed that both governments of countries you are saying have zero cases are simultaneously making public statements about the second wave that is currently happening and that other nations in the area are putting in travel bans to those areas of France and Spain affected. I mean, this has been a prominent story in most reputable newspapers. Perhaps it was based on ignorance, but if you’re in news reporting and are telling people something so far outside the facts, that’s just another reason people shouldn’t trust you. Is a lie based on ignorance not still a lie? The intention may be different, but the result is the same. 

Besides, when you see a figure of zero Covid cases at the moment, outside New Zealand perhaps, it’s just general knowledge that it’s going to be wrong.

I also have huge suspicions about the fact that this was reported on a Monday, probably because they knew that it would be the only day where they could make such a statement and have plausible deniability.  

Who knows, but I was going to catch up with the show and switched it off after that statement in utter disgust. I will probably avoid the show from now on. You can’t criticise ridiculous incidents of fake news and then make it so blatantly yourself. I will retreat back to Maddow only for my opinion based reporting.

[gatopretoNYC]

I loved Lawrence's Boston accent slipping out while saying manslaughter (manslaughtah) last night. He corrected himself, and then slipped again a minute later. And then John Heilemann teased him about it. Very cute. 🙂

[meowmommy]

15 hours ago, gatopretoNYC said:

I loved Lawrence's Boston accent slipping out while saying manslaughter (manslaughtah) last night. He corrected himself, and then slipped again a minute later. And then John Heilemann teased him about it. Very cute. 🙂

Every so often it pokes out, and then of course there are the times he lets it out deliberately.  When he wants everyone to know his roots.  I think the last time was when he was angry at John Kelly, and he wanted us to hear what a real Boston Irishman should sound like.