S01.E10: Chapter Ten: The Lost Weekend

[Bort]

9 minutes ago, maxineofarc said:

What's that German word for vicarious embarrassment? Because that is what I felt watching that. I'm officially old.

Fremdschämen. It's the opposite of the more well-known schadenfreude.

[truthaboutluv]

27 minutes ago, maxineofarc said:

What's that German word for vicarious embarrassment? Because that is what I felt watching that. I'm officially old.

Isn't the common expression just to say you're experiencing second-hand embarrassment? Because that's what I was feeling. Well that and "oh I guess high school cheerleading is now about who can shake their ass and flip their hair around the best. Good to know."

Edited April 18, 2017 by truthaboutluv

[maxineofarc]

Just now, truthaboutluv said:

Isn't the common expression is just to say you're experiencing second-hand embarrassment? Because that's what I was feeling. Well that and "oh I guess high school cheerleading is now about who can shake their ass and flip their hair around the best. Good to know."

It sounds better in German.

[HariboPeach]

47 minutes ago, truthaboutluv said:

Isn't the common expression just to say you're experiencing second-hand embarrassment? Because that's what I was feeling. Well that and "oh I guess high school cheerleading is now about who can shake their ass and flip their hair around the best. Good to know."

Even though I love Veronica and think she is super good-looking, I didn't love the cheerleading ass shakes. I can't picture the other high school girls clapping along and fist pumping. I think they'd be staring at her wide-eyed and in shock..because who does that. I've been out of high school for a long time, but I don't think things have changed THAT much.

[MarkHB]

1 minute ago, HariboPeach said:

Even though I love Veronica and think she is super good-looking, I didn't love the cheerleading ass shakes. I can't picture the other high school girls clapping along and fist pumping. I think they'd be staring at her wide-eyed and in shock..because who does that. I've been out of high school for a long time, but I don't think things have changed THAT much.

Ask a teenager what passes for "dancing" at their dances these days. 

[HariboPeach]

2 minutes ago, MarkHB said:

Ask a teenager what passes for "dancing" at their dances these days. 

Sure, but in front of each other like that? On display in a 'competition' style setting? I thought it was pretty strange.

[PeekaBoo]

21 hours ago, Irish Lass said:

I am loving all the twists this show is adding every week. Just when you think you have a grasp at the characters and the story they add a huge twist and it gets you thinking hard again. That keeps me wanting more and thinking throughout the week till the next episode on what they are going to give us next. I am loving this.

I know!! That's my thoughts exactly! I'm like, nah, can't get any more revelations and then bang! THey show up with something new! I mean come on! There's dirt on absolutely everyone in this little town!!

21 hours ago, HariboPeach said:

Same here, I like that the show keeps me guessing. This show is the reason I created an account. I think it's awesome that an old comic book can be spun into what we see on the screen.

I am with you on that one! Created an account for the same reason!!! Archie is the only comic book that I ever read and that's more or less the only reason I'm watching the show!!

12 hours ago, Sisygambis said:

I re-watched the episode with friends tonight and what jumped out to me this time was the length of time the Blossom family had been making payments to the Lodges - 75 years.  Could great-grandfather Lodge be involved in great-grandfather Cooper's murder?  The more I think about it, the two murders must be connected somehow.

Ouh!!! You got a nice clue on that one... I'm wondering (from another post somewhere in the forum) if the Joneses are also involved in this.

I honestly think the show has gotten a good start. I know the pace has been a bit too fast and I'd like to see more storylines from the other characters and the parents. Oh! The parents!!! I love them and their horrible secrets and scandals!!! I love the adult cast, its just so much fun to bring back old heartthrobs. BAck to the fast pace though... I mean, they had 1 season, 13 episodes to try to write about a murder and all the connections and character developments, of course they had to jump over several things... It really does suck but not much you can do about it...

I also did enjoy the first episodes a lot better then the last few, could it be because of the character development? Don't get me wrong, still loving the show, the episodes and all that but isn't there a bit too much Jughead? (and really I love him and am a total bughead). Is he some sort of first choice because he's the narrator? Maybe it just pops up a lot more since his character is so popular nowadays... I am missing Reggie... I mean, yeah, he's a douche but I thought he sorta got along with the rest of the gang and not just being a dumb jock... I hope he shows up a lot more next season. And Chuck, I was not aware of who he was in the comics but they made him pure evil...

I am so looking forward to the end of the season... From all the speculations and spoilers I've read, omg, I just can't wait!!

And the dancing choreography... Meh... Unnecessary...

[Chicago Redshirt]

5 hours ago, NutmegsDad said:

One thing that has bothered me since this episode.

Since Cheryl had a hand in Chuck's downfall from the team through #hashtagjustice, and since Cheryl knew what Chuck and the other players were doing, why would Chuck and Cheryl team up with each other to bring out the secrets at the party?

Cheryl all but explicitly invoked the old maxim "The enemy of my enemy is my friend." Ally with each other to take down Veronica and Betty at once. 

Edited April 18, 2017 by Chicago Redshirt

[Mazz]

I use to be a cheerleader in high school and I am 27 so even though it seems like it has been an eternity since I was in high school it really hasn't been that long. I know dances have changed, but there is no way a high school cheerleader mentor or coach would even allow something like that that Veronica did. Oh I guess that is why there is an absence of one of them which a high school would never have. They wouldn't just have a student captain like Cheryl Blossom in charge that is for damn sure.

[Bruinsfan]

On 4/16/2017 at 6:47 PM, maxineofarc said:

It's been made explicit in the last few years in the recent comics line, but for most of his 2D existence Jughead mostly just ran away from Ethel. I don't think he's ever been shown as very interested in dating.

Yeah, in previous decades Jughead was referred to as a "woman-hater," but wide public awareness of asexuality is fairly recent. It's certainly a characterization that fits what I remember from the comics.

On 4/17/2017 at 4:51 PM, catrice2 said:

I always felt sorry for Reggie, just hanging around for Archie's leftovers as if there were no other girls in town.

My knowledge of the source material is hardly encyclopedic, but wasn't a recurring subplot of Reggie's trying to steal Midge away from Moose? Though I suppose on this show Moose wouldn't actually be all that bothered...

[Affogato]

On 4/13/2017 at 10:45 PM, ybrik said:

I also wonder if Jughead's speech about not being wired like other people is kind of a first hint that the show may eventually go the asexual route with him. I doubt that it will also be aro but can see this as a first hint about him being ace. This way they can still tell an asexual Jughead storyline but allow him to have romantic relationships on the show (or maybe they just keep it to him having these feelings just for Betty)

 

I wondered about that, too...Betty eventually feeling as if the relationship wasn't progressing. Now, of course, distracted by Polly and so on, she hasn't noticed, but later it becomes noticeable in some way and is confronted. It plays into him being a little distant from the people around him, the narrative voice.

[PeekaBoo]

40 minutes ago, Affogato said:

I wondered about that, too...Betty eventually feeling as if the relationship wasn't progressing. Now, of course, distracted by Polly and so on, she hasn't noticed, but later it becomes noticeable in some way and is confronted. It plays into him being a little distant from the people around him, the narrative voice.

Its a nice way to play in the asexuality bit...  but what bugs me is that, ok, he's jughead, he's weird, we get that... But -he- pursued -her-, he was the one that actively took the first step... You cant back track that and suddenly go asexual... How can you be the one to kiss someone else and then go "nah, I'm not into the whole physical stuff" And jughead seems really passionate about Betty... It would take a lot to turn that around...

I just find it weird sometimes... this whole ship is weird... and incredibly oh-so- cute. 

[Affogato]

6 minutes ago, PeekaBoo said:

Its a nice way to play in the asexuality bit...  but what bugs me is that, ok, he's jughead, he's weird, we get that... But -he- pursued -her-, he was the one that actively took the first step... You cant back track that and suddenly go asexual... How can you be the one to kiss someone else and then go "nah, I'm not into the whole physical stuff" And jughead seems really passionate about Betty... It would take a lot to turn that around...

I just find it weird sometimes... this whole ship is weird... and incredibly oh-so- cute. 

Well, he's young and cares for Betty, perhaps he's experimenting and through experimentation finding it doesn't work.

[peachmangosteen]

Exactly. Also him being asexual would not necessarily mean he was aromantic. In fact I would assume that if they do eventually go the asexual route with Jughead they will make him a romantic asexual.

Edited April 22, 2017 by peachmangosteen

[Mabinogia]

I would love it if they did go the asexual route with Juggy and that it wouldn't mean that there was no more Buggy automatically but that they try to figure out what this means for them. It could be, if done well, a fascinating storyline. Does a romantic relationship have to be sexual? It would be refreshing to see a romantic teen relationship without sex that isn't based on "no sex before marriage". It's deeper than that and should be explored. My fear would be how well they can pull it off. That fear is less about the writers and more about the network. Will the network allow this story to be done well or will they force some kind of excess drama out of it. That is my worry. But I do think Cole and Lily could pull it off. They have great chemistry together and are doing well with what they've been given so far.

[jay741982]

5 hours ago, Mabinogia said:

I would love it if they did go the asexual route with Juggy and that it wouldn't mean that there was no more Buggy automatically but that they try to figure out what this means for them. It could be, if done well, a fascinating storyline. Does a romantic relationship have to be sexual? It would be refreshing to see a romantic teen relationship without sex that isn't based on "no sex before marriage". It's deeper than that and should be explored. My fear would be how well they can pull it off. That fear is less about the writers and more about the network. Will the network allow this story to be done well or will they force some kind of excess drama out of it. That is my worry. But I do think Cole and Lily could pull it off. They have great chemistry together and are doing well with what they've been given so far.

I have a fear that they would do the storyline but then do something like Betty cheats on him with someone cause they can give her what Jughead cant. Like you said I do think Cole and Lily could pull it off but I'd rather have them not together or Jughead not be Asexual just cause of fear the writing won't be good enough 

[ruby24]

This is kind of random, but I always hate it when somebody says something like what Kevin said in this episode about how "so-and-so is my boy/girlfriend, so that makes them inner circle." It makes me roll my eyes SO hard. 

[Lady Calypso]

On 4/22/2017 at 11:36 AM, Mabinogia said:

I would love it if they did go the asexual route with Juggy and that it wouldn't mean that there was no more Buggy automatically but that they try to figure out what this means for them. It could be, if done well, a fascinating storyline. Does a romantic relationship have to be sexual? It would be refreshing to see a romantic teen relationship without sex that isn't based on "no sex before marriage". It's deeper than that and should be explored. My fear would be how well they can pull it off. That fear is less about the writers and more about the network. Will the network allow this story to be done well or will they force some kind of excess drama out of it. That is my worry. But I do think Cole and Lily could pull it off. They have great chemistry together and are doing well with what they've been given so far.

It could absolutely be interesting and a different story to take on. If Betty is interested in exploring the sexual aspect of a relationship, how will that go? Could Jughead try to provide that for her? What if Betty wants to have sex? Will that end up being a dealbreaker? How can they find a way to compromise? Those kinds of questions could easily be explored. I expect that it won't be written that well, but it IS possible to explore it. They have different avenues to go down that would actually cause drama in their relationship that would not be typical. Well, it would be a little typical, but also with a twist. And I really like when shows try something new and different.

On 4/21/2017 at 10:00 PM, PeekaBoo said:

Its a nice way to play in the asexuality bit...  but what bugs me is that, ok, he's jughead, he's weird, we get that... But -he- pursued -her-, he was the one that actively took the first step... You cant back track that and suddenly go asexual... How can you be the one to kiss someone else and then go "nah, I'm not into the whole physical stuff" And jughead seems really passionate about Betty... It would take a lot to turn that around...

He did pursue a romantic interest in Betty. It doesn't mean that he wants to do that much physical stuff. Maybe kissing is just ok with him. He can absolutely be passionate about Betty but not want a sexual relationship with her. So it wouldn't be backtracking. There's a lot of different layers to asexuality, layers that are ambiguous and still being explored. Some people are fine with some physical stuff but not sex. Some are uncomfortable with any type of physical stuff. Some asexuals don't even want relationships, or they are aromantic as well. 

Speaking from some experience, I didn't discover my own asexuality until second year of university. I never understood until I first heard the word "asexual" the year previous, and it slowly clicked over many months. Yes, I still had crushes on guys from when I was very young, but not in the "I would have sex with that guy" but "I would date that guy." I also thought that it was weird when my friends were discussing things about sex and how sexually attracted they were to guys when we were all in high school and I just wasn't on the same page. I just never really figured out until a little later, which Jughead could do as well. So I do like that the show is dropping potential hints with Jughead's asexuality if the network allows them to go that route. They haven't done anything to make it seem out of character later on if Jughead does discover his asexuality. At least, from my perspective. 

Quote

This is kind of random, but I always hate it when somebody says something like what Kevin said in this episode about how "so-and-so is my boy/girlfriend, so that makes them inner circle." It makes me roll my eyes SO hard. 

Back to this episode, though, I agree. This was frustrating to hear from Kevin. No, Kevin. Not all significant others are part of some inner circle. 

[ByTor]

On 4/16/2017 at 5:17 PM, Chas411 said:

Alice being a serpent was the most interesting development.

How did I miss this?  When was this revelation made?  I assumed the Serpents were a male biker club.  Unless she was an "Old Lady"...thanks Sons of Anarchy for making  me think of that term haha!

[secnarf]

They never said Alice is a serpent - just that she is from the "south side", the same neighbourhood as FP. That doesn't automatically make her part of the gang.

[starri]

FP did tell her to remember that a snake can't shed its skin, or something to that effect, though.

[Bruinsfan]

He kind of picked the wrong metaphor there, didn't he?

Maybe Alice Cooper is really a lizard person and we'll see her gulping down a rodent at some point.

[Affogato]

On 4/24/2017 at 5:50 PM, secnarf said:

They never said Alice is a serpent - just that she is from the "south side", the same neighbourhood as FP. That doesn't automatically make her part of the gang.

I honestly thought it was implied she was a serpent. It might just mean she came from a family that lived in the same area, had several male family members that were serpents and some female family members that were hooked up with serpents. Then she goes and marries someone, an outsider, she meets at school.

[AzureOwl]

On 2017-4-13 at 9:25 PM, ybrik said:

Don't mind Veronica and Archie kissing this ep. They have been kind of dancing around this since the first ep. Also did like it seemed like the show was making it clear that kissing was as far as they went.

On 2017-4-13 at 9:31 PM, SeanC said:

Actually, on that point, it's interesting that for a show that opened with Archie banging his teacher and features things like a running gag about incest, the teen/teen relationships have been fairly chaste, on the whole.  Plenty of shows would have had Archie and Veronica have sex if they'd started making out in similar circumstances.

Personally I would prefer it if the show acknowledged that the space between "kissing" and "full-on coitus" actually covers quite a lot. If I had to guess I'd say Archie and Veronica did a lot more than just kissing without going all the way out to sex.

Since I'm not from the US I'm not familiar with what the baseball metaphors entail, so please forgive me if I'm misusing them, but for the sake of argument couldn't the have made it to second or third base?

On 2017-4-18 at 8:38 AM, NutmegsDad said:

One thing that has bothered me since this episode.

Since Cheryl had a hand in Chuck's downfall from the team through #hashtagjustice, and since Cheryl knew what Chuck and the other players were doing, why would Chuck and Cheryl team up with each other to bring out the secrets at the party?

It seems that Chuck holds a particular enmity towards Betty in particular, which is perfectly understandable considering she was the one who was a hair's breadth away from boiling him alive. Also, from Chick's point of view, Betty was the ringleader of the whole thing. 

[MarkHB]

On 5/8/2017 at 3:16 PM, AzureOwl said:

Since I'm not from the US I'm not familiar with what the baseball metaphors entail, so please forgive me if I'm misusing them, but for the sake of argument couldn't the have made it to second or third base?

Yes, you used them properly, and that could be a possibility.  But, just from the way the evening was presented to us, I doubt it; I don't think they touched each other after they went to their separate beds.  (For the record, first base is kissing, second base is petting above the waist, third is below the waist, home run is coitus.)

[ZoloftBlob]

"Speaking from some experience, I didn't discover my own asexuality until second year of university. I never understood until I first heard the word "asexual" the year previous, and it slowly clicked over many months. Yes, I still had crushes on guys from when I was very young, but not in the "I would have sex with that guy" but "I would date that guy." I also thought that it was weird when my friends were discussing things about sex and how sexually attracted they were to guys when we were all in high school and I just wasn't on the same page. I just never really figured out until a little later, which Jughead could do as well. So I do like that the show is dropping potential hints with Jughead's asexuality if the network allows them to go that route. They haven't done anything to make it seem out of character later on if Jughead does discover his asexuality. At least, from my perspective. " This. What "sexxors" may not understand about asexuals is that it's a spectrum just like regular sexuality. Some asexuals can't conceive of even allowing a partner to touch them sexually... and some asexuals marry and have children with sexual partners. And asexuality is *rarely* discussed with kids Jughead's age... you're straight or you're gay or you're maybe bi, but being asexual? I never even heard the term until college.

[thuganomics85]

Teenage parties never end well on television, huh?  And there really needs to be a training seminar that explains that if you are with an anti-social person who doesn't want a birthday party, don't throw him a birthday party.  Even if you can't understand his reasons, it just is going to make thing awkward or worse.  In Betty's defense at least, she only attended for it to be her, Archie, Veronica, Ethel, and Kevin, with Kevin taking it upon himself to invite his boyfriend, while Cheryl/Chuck invite the entire school pretty much to spite Veronica/Betty.  And, of course, Archie lets them all in, because he's fucking Archie.

Riverdale kind of turned into Step Up: Vixen Edition there for a second.  Doubt any of those moves are used in actual cheerleading, but fuck it, I am not going to complain about seeing Camila Mendes busting out some moves in short-shorts.  Cheryl never had a chance, as far as I'm concerned.  In general, this episode was all about the Veronica eye-candy with that, her party dress, and the glasses (yes, her wearing glasses was equally hot in its own way.)  For that alone, this episode gets an A!

I thought for sure they were going to use Betty and Jughead's blowout as an excuse to break them up, but credit to FP for stopping that.  I guess he isn't a completely sucky father.  We'll see if it sticks, because I do think there are some issues still.  Jughead's line about how Betty is just waiting for Archie to realize he likes her was telling, and seem to hit her hard, because she might suspect it is true on some level.

Speaking of which, Archie has a drunken spat with Valerie that goes nowhere, and he already moves on with Veronica.  He really moves fast, huh?  I wanted to roll my eyes over it, but he does have more chemistry with her then anyone else.  Granted, I'm completely biased, because I thinks she has chemistry with pretty much everyone.

I wonder if this is going to be Jughead's earlier claim about how Veronica/Betty getting Chuck booted would have consequences, or if he'll cause even more trouble down the line.

Veronica agrees to support Hiram, after he basically threatens to take Heromine with him, and she still believes there is good in her.  I hope Heromine doesn't disappoint her, but I don't know.

I guess the Reggie actor was filming that 13 Reasons Why show, because I really couldn't believe that Reggie wouldn't be at the party.  And where was Josie?

Alice use to be "south side" and knew KP?  Interesting!

I should have known that Molly Ringwald was going to be Archie's mom.  Was there ever any other choice?

Favorite episode by far due to the craziness, entertainment value, and all the fourth-wall breaking, with Veronica's twincest remark, Jughead talking about always wearing the beanie, and KP saying the kids were already doing a better job with the case then the sheriff (that is so, so true.)  Oh, and of course, lots of hot Veronica.  My crush on Camila Mendes is getting bad, y'all!

[mtlchick]

Finally catching up on Netflix and...

 

Quote

Teenage parties never end well on television, huh?

made me feel a lot older.  Especially with that sinners game.  I was like (blinks) (blinks) (rapid blinking.)  "These kids are catty and pissy as hell!"