S03.E06: Is Someone Really Dead?

[stuckin60s]

Sorry folks, but I hope it is the character Wes.  We have spent soooo many hours watching him be the center of the story line and it just doesn't interest me.  I find the story lines of the COW ( most of the time), the back stories of the K5, Bonnie, Nate and Frank ( especially Frank) much more intriguing.  

[Milaxx]

Annalise is attracted to, for want of a better phrase, "broken people". Part of it is due to her own issues. A good parallel is this week's COTW. When she brokers that deal she tells the officer something to the effect of " Do you want help or do you want to keep slashing people's throats?" Like Annalise being forced into AA, the officer needed someone to put on the brakes and make her get the counseling she needed. Annalise knows Franks history. That includes his self destructive behaviors. She understand self destructive behaviors because she has a truckload of her own. She might not want to see Frank again, but she doesn't want him dead. Otherwise she would have let the hitman take care of it. There would have been no need to give him instructions to call her once he found Frank. Even worse if she did intentionally set that house on fire and someone died in that fire, it will only pile on guilt. So yes I can see her being upset. There's a big difference between not wanting to see someone again and wishing them dead.

Edited October 30, 2016 by Milaxx

[ProudMary]

Am I the only person watching who DOESN'T want it to be Wes under that sheet?  I can continue watching without issue if it turns out to be Nate, Frank or Connor but if they're writing Wes out, I'm done with the show.  I really like both the character and the actor but that definitely seems to be the unpopular opinion!

[DearEvette]

No I don't really want it to be Wes either. But since he is still in play,  In order of preference I have:

Nate (sorry Nate, you're just eye candy really)

(big gap)

Frank

Wes

Connor

[Happytobehere]

My preference for under the sheet, even though I know I won't get my way is:

1) Nate

2) Connor

3) Wes

4) Frank

[J-Man]

Apparently the recapper and I are the only ones who think the body under the sheet is SIMON'S. Is there some reason it wouldn't/couldn't/shouldn't be him? No one even seems to even be considering him as a possibility, but he seems more likely than the usual suspects that keep getting named.

[Milaxx]

It's supposedly someone whose demise was so hard on the main cast that they needed to pause while filming.  A newbie to the show wouldn't fit that bill.

[J-Man]

Quote

It's supposedly someone whose demise was so hard on the main cast that they needed to pause while filming.

But that could just be misdirection from the actors. Or they could've bonded with the actor playing Simon, since he's apparently on all of the episodes this season (at least through the break.)

[Milaxx]

You're comparing someone they've known/worked with for the past 3/4 years vs someone they've known a few months. It's possible, but not probable.

[SimoneS]

3 hours ago, ProudMary said:

Am I the only person watching who DOESN'T want it to be Wes under that sheet?  I can continue watching without issue if it turns out to be Nate, Frank or Connor but if they're writing Wes out, I'm done with the show.  I really like both the character and the actor but that definitely seems to be the unpopular opinion!

I definitely don't want it to be Wes and don't think that it will be him. I think the actor is great as the show's male lead.  I don't take any of the complaints about him seriously. 

[Dee]

It's interesting how Connor is portrayed as the most tormented about everything The Murder Clan has done.

If a viewer were to start watching now, no one would suspect the other four have been through nearly as much.

Edited November 2, 2016 by Dee

[helenamonster]

I wasn't going to be happy no matter who the father of Laurel's baby was, but ugh anyway at it being Wes. Luckily Laurel strikes me as the kind of woman who would consider her options.

I am nervous, however, that some of you may be onto something and that whoever is #UnderTheSheet is a red herring and Laurel will actually end up dead (creating angst for Wes when their fetus dies with her). The only thing that gives me pause is that if the person #UnderTheSheet wasn't dead, then they wouldn't be #UnderTheSheet at all. Unless this show wants to go with the double whammy of two major deaths. Or unless the person #UnderTheSheet is Simon (we know the victim is male and he's the only non-major male character hanging around) and Laurel is the big death. God damn it. That's probably what's going to happen. It was only a matter of time before Laurel got added to my pile of dead favorite characters.

Connor was especially whiny this episode. Also, him and everyone else freezing Laurel out for not mentioning that Mahoney was Wes's father (like it even really mattered; yeah, I get they're worried that if any of them get arrested for anything, the person who is arrested will use their knowledge of all the other crimes to get themselves out of a personal jam) was just bizarre. Y'all are keeping all kinds of nasty secrets from each other and everyone around you. None of you really trust each other, whether you're boning or not. Sometimes they all need to just get over themselves and stop trying to act like they're not as bad as the rest because of this or that little thing. I much prefer it when they all just embrace their awfulness.

I did think it was funny that it took this long for them to reveal Asher as safe, as he was at the absolute bottom of my list of potential victims.

On 10/28/2016 at 7:37 AM, Milaxx said:

Annalise would be racked with guilt if any of the K5 died. 

I agree, especially because it seems she asked them all to come to her house before the fire. I go back and forth each week on whether or not I think she started the fire, but this week had me thinking no. Unless she is putting on an act, maybe her grief is related to the fact that she asked the K5 to come to her house and one of them ended up dead. Despite her annoyance with the kiddos, I think she feels responsible for them and in spending so much energy protecting them has come to sort of love them in her weird, twisted, Annalise way. Idk, pure speculation.

On 10/28/2016 at 0:09 PM, Neurochick said:

Asher mentioned that Annalise called them all to her house, why didn't Michaela know about that call? 

Asher said something along the lines of, "You didn't know because you were with your mom, but Annalise called us all to the house." Perhaps she was called but didn't want to leave, either because she and her mom were in the middle of having it out or, as she mentioned when she did leave, she was afraid her mom would steal from her.

I am really curious about the circumstances under which Annalise calls (or, potentially, lures) the kiddos to her house. I keep remembering that Laurel was found in the basement, and we all remember what happened the last time someone was down there. I've had a feeling for a while that Laurel is going to get herself in trouble with Annalise and Bonnie. Maybe it's a sort of repeat of the Rebecca situation. Man, even in this post I'm flip-flopping about whether or not Annalise had a hand in the fire.

On 10/29/2016 at 1:00 AM, Milaxx said:

That's right! They had already moved the body when Wes went back to retrieve the staute and ran into Annalise.  Later Connor & Micheala were ready to crack and Laurel told Annalise who stopped them, but the plan to hide the body was theirs,Annalise just helped with details so they wouldn't get caught. In fact if they had completed the job and incinerated the remains after they had chopped it up and burned it, there would have been no remains to be found later. 

No, they hadn't moved the body when Wes went back to get the statue. After Wes killed Sam, they argued a bit about whether or not to call the cops, and Wes's main concern was getting Rebecca out of there because she was already under suspicion for Lila's murder. So they split and agreed to meet up in the woods after Wes dropped Rebecca off at the motel. Before meeting them is when Wes decided to go back for the trophy (there's a sequence of him stopping in the middle of a crosswalk and realizing that they needed to get rid of it). When he got back, Sam's body was still there. He picks up the trophy and apologizes, and that's when we see Annalise watching from her desk. After that is when Wes goes into the woods and lies about the coin flip to get them to get rid of the body (unknown to the rest of them, on Annalise's orders).

[LydiaMoon1]

I didn't see anybody else say this when I skimmed the comments, but Laurel already looked pregnant to me during the classroom scene.  She was wearing a pale blue blouse that had a ruffle down the front, and, to me, her belly looked a bit bumpish.  Maybe she was already pregnant when she slept with Wes (if she even really slept with Wes)?  For some reason, the abbreviated sex scene between Laurel and Wes struck me as very purposeful.  I think they gave us enough for us to assume that they had sex, but brief enough that they can still say that one or both of them changed their minds about actually doing the deed.  When Laurel went out to find Wes sitting on the floor watching TV, they just didn't seem very post-coital to me.  Then again, this show has me so crossed up, I'm not sure what is happening.

I do know that this episode was the first time I liked Michaela and Asher together.  I think it’s because I finally like Asher.  I didn’t care for him the first two seasons when he was primarily portrayed as a rich frat boy.  In season three, he’s still a frat boy, but I admire the way he’s handled being cut off from his family’s money.  He’s made the best of it, stayed in school, and, best of all, hasn’t whined that his life is hard.  Instead, he’s gotten on with it.  I like that.

As for who is dead, I have no idea, so kudos to the writers.  I also don’t know who set the fire, but I’m throwing ADA Atwood’s name into the mix.  She doesn’t strike me as being completely stable, she’s more than a little obsessed with Nate, and this show has a history of being hard on ADAs.  If Nate  goes back to Annalise, I wouldn’t put it past her to burn down Annalise’s house.

Edited October 31, 2016 by LydiaMoon1

[Tara Ariano]

In case you missed it, here's the Previously.TV post on the episode!

The Minor Characters Have More Fun On How To Get Away With Murder

The leads are too busy having sex with each other to actually do anything.

[love2lovebadtv]

On 10/29/2016 at 10:35 AM, darkestboy said:

More twists and turns. Frank framing the other Mahoney kid was well played. I did not see that coming.

Wes could be the baby daddy but Frank is also coming back, so I guess we're so sure yet, are we with Laurel?

So this week we had Wes/Laurel, Michaela/Asher, Oliver/Thomas (I like him) and Nate telling Annalise about him and Renee.

While there's a degree of truth in Connor's anger for Wes, he forgets that everyone has played a role in things being the way they are for the lot of them.

Bonnie certainly takes a lot of crap from Annalise but she also dished some out at Wes as well.

Really want to know about Michaela's mommy issues. Laughed at Asher dancing to Cotton Eyed Joe and Connor wearing Michaela's bathrobe.

Simon, not sure what they're doing with him but I don't mind him being around too much, 8/10

Remind me , please , who Simon is. 

On 10/29/2016 at 3:07 PM, rubyred said:

OMG this explains so much. It never occurred to me that she actually did kill herself (both because of the manner of death and because I couldn't see how she would think that would be best for her son), but I must have looked away from the TV for a few seconds which as we all know, one.must. not. do.with.this.show. (I still kind of like thinking of Wes as a sleeper psycho though...) Anyway thanks!

I don't think Wes is a sociopath at all.  He seems quite normal with an unfortunate series of events in his life,  starting with the way he was conceived . But I thought Wes said his mother was from Haiti, not both of them . 

Edited November 1, 2016 by love2lovebadtv

[love2lovebadtv]

On 10/30/2016 at 7:22 PM, ProudMary said:

Am I the only person watching who DOESN'T want it to be Wes under that sheet?  I can continue watching without issue if it turns out to be Nate, Frank or Connor but if they're writing Wes out, I'm done with the show.  I really like both the character and the actor but that definitely seems to be the unpopular opinion!

I adore both Wes and Alfred Enoch. I would be devastated if he's under the sheet. 

[darkestboy]

9 hours ago, love2lovebadtv said:

Remind me , please , who Simon is. 

I don't think k Wes is a sociopath at all.  He seems quite normal with an unfortunate series of events in his life,  starting with the way he was conceived . But I thought Wes said his mother was from Haiti, not both of them . 

Simon is Drake, that guy who sent the posters about Annalise being a killer and the same guy who has been winding up the Keating 5 since the first episode this season.

[love2lovebadtv]

4 hours ago, darkestboy said:

Simon is Drake, that guy who sent the posters about Annalise being a killer and the same guy who has been winding up the Keating 5 since the first episode this season.

Ohhhhh, than you.  This show comes on too late for me but I keep staying up to watch it. And then it's so crazy I have to wind down afterward. I really need to watch this on demand but I can never wait that long. 

[maddie965]

Maybe this is nothing, but why does Michaela's mother tell her "You are in shock" and offers to go with her? Is she saying that because of the news on TV? Or did something else happen that we're not aware of?

Funny, I spent two seasons hating Frank, and now I can't stand the idea of him dying. I love the tragic figure he turned into. And I love the twisted romance between him and Bonnie. I want more of that. Please, show, don't make me say goodbye to Frank!

Now Connor, I've always loved him. Maybe it's the actor, but I'm crazy about him, always was. If he goes, it will be very difficult for me to keep watching. 

Never cared about Wes, never will. Such a waste of time and space. Most of his scenes creep me out - don't even get me started at that "love" scene with Laurel! DNW. Please let it be him under the sheet!!!

Edited November 2, 2016 by maddie965

[blackwing]

On 10/30/2016 at 9:59 PM, SimoneS said:

I definitely don't want it to be Wes and don't think that it will be him. I think the actor is great as the show's male lead.  I don't take any of the complaints about him seriously. 

I am hoping it is him.  I don't have anything against the actor personally, although I think he is mediocre at best.  The reason I want Wes to be dead is because I can't stand the character.  He is this show's special snowflake.  Many of the storylines have revolved around him.  The awful obsession with Rebecca.  The business with Rose and the amount of time we spent wondering if Annaliese was his mother.  The Mahoney business.  I just don't care about any of it.  The quicker they get rid of him, the sooner I can be rid of seeing him and his only move, the "puppy dog eyes".

Getting rid of Wes would open the show up to feature more of the other characters.  I am loving the expanded focus on Michaela this year beyond her previous gunner prom queen persona.  And I agree with the comment upthread that this is the first season I have liked Asher.  That's completely due to the fact that they gave him a personality between the "irresponsible frat boy" persona.  I loved at the end of this episode when Michaela was freaking out that he was dead and then there was relief on her face when she saw him drunk dancing.  Liking these two as a pair.

Who I don't like... Laurel and Wes.  100% because of Wes.  The actor has had zero chemistry with all of the females on this show except for Annaliese.

[blackwing]

There was no discussion in the show of her being his mom... but we here on the boards speculated about it at length.  Given the fact that he was eating the show, it didn't seem that out of the question that she could have been his mom, and that's why she was always protecting him.  It was only later that we learned that she protected him because she felt guilty about her role in what happened to Rose.

I agree that the writers have featured Michaela, Asher and Laurel a lot more this season.  But when you assert that crappy writers kill off characters to make room for others... those same "crappy writers" are the ones that were unable to make room for others in the first two seasons.  We know so much more about Wes' background than any of the others.  Asher was a cartoon, and we got to meet his aristocratic father briefly last season, but that's all we knew about him.  We finally met Laurel's dad this season.  It took us until the third season to learn that Michaela has a white mom, is adopted, and may or may not be from the South?  And I believe we still don't know anything at all about Connor's background.  It's not really the time to assert that it's an "ensemble show" that can include Wes when it hasn't truly been an ensemble show until this season.

As much as I really want Wes to be the dead body, I wouldn't be at all surprised if it's Nate.  Nate seems increasingly extraneous.  Any favours or tricks that he could do with police files or whatnot, it seems just as easy for Bonnie to work her magic and get things done.

[Keepitmoving]

OK, so let me remind myself of the list of characters who have actually committed murder:

Frank

Wes

Bonnie she killed Rebecca right?

Asher, he killed that DA right?

Am I missing anyone who actually has blood on their hands? The rest of the characters are accessories to covering it all up right?

Wait who cut up Sam's body, is there another charge for that?  Because Michaela and Laurel weren't part of the carving of that body right?

There has been so much killing on this show, I just had to take a moment to try and remember who's actually committed murder.

[Keepitmoving]

Quote

Who I don't like... Laurel and Wes.  100% because of Wes.  The actor has had zero chemistry with all of the females on this show except for Annaliese.

Yes! 

This is a problem well... He just doesn't interest me now that they've fleshed out his connection to Anna. The actor is decent enough in the group, but still easy to forget.  I felt nothing with regard to that love scene with Laurel and I feel it's mostly because of him. While I wasn't that into Frank and Laurel, they did have chemistry and Frank knew how to get it done in the love scene department.  The Laurel and Wes love scene juxtaposed with the Michaela and Asher scene was no contest for me. Heck, the Asher/Michaela kiss at the end of him trying to get her to commit to something real topped the Laurel and Wes love scene. 

Yeah, and it is  all because he doesn't have that "it" factor.  I still don't know if I want him gone though, I mean, Anna and Laurel still care about him so... and he's part of the Keating-5 who are bonded in getting away with murder.

 

Quote

 

Maybe this is nothing, but why does Michaela's mother tell her "You are in shock" and offers to go with her? Is she saying that because of the news on TV? Or did something else happen that we're not aware of?

 

This is what I wondered as well. Is her mother there because of bad news?

I also didn't know what to make of Michaela telling her mother that she had been through worse. Was she referring to all the shit that has gone down with Ann and the Keating-5 or something else in her past. 

Edited November 2, 2016 by Keepitmoving

[starri]

1 hour ago, blackwing said:

We finally met Laurel's dad this season

We met him (her whole family, actually) in the first season.  They just switched out actors and backstories, the latter at Karla Souza's request.

[Keepitmoving]

11 minutes ago, starri said:

We met him (her whole family, actually) in the first season.  They just switched out actors and backstories, the latter at Karla Souza's request.

So how did they switch out the back story? Her father isn't doing criminal activity? I don't know if we got any confirmation on this theory but I always thought her father was doing something illegal. Is that not the case?  I also didn't realize that her mother was mentally ill, didn't the new dad say something to that effect? Didn't he apologize for having to commit her mother? I didn't realize in season one that the woman sitting at the table wasn't her biological mother.

Edited November 2, 2016 by Keepitmoving

[starri]

If memory serves, they insinuated that the father was involved in a cartel.  They also lived in Los Angeles, I think.

We've since seen him in Miami as some kind of legitimate businessman.

[secnarf]

2 hours ago, blackwing said:

  We know so much more about Wes' background than any of the others.  Asher was a cartoon, and we got to meet his aristocratic father briefly last season, but that's all we knew about him.  We finally met Laurel's dad this season.  It took us until the third season to learn that Michaela has a white mom, is adopted, and may or may not be from the South?  And I believe we still don't know anything at all about Connor's background. 

Asher - we met both his parents, and I believe he has a sister. I'd say we got more than "briefly" of his father last season, but I think his mother only got a scene or two. It said wonders about their relationship, though.

Laurel - as others have stated, we met her whole family in the Christmas episode. Karla Souza didn't like the insinuation that her father was the head of a cartel so it was changed, although they never outright stated he was the head of a cartel so whether or not this is 'retcon' is debatable. We got more detail this season - he is some sort of businessman that deals with weapons/military stuff (I think??), he divorced Laurel's mother who had some sort of mental illness, he has remarried, and he didn't pay ransom to secure Laurel's release when she was kidnapped at age 16. We also know Laurel spent some time visiting her mother, and her father checks up on/speaks with her mother.

Michaela - we already knew that she is adopted and from the South ("backwater bayou" is I believe how Michaela phrased it). We knew she didn't come from money. We also got a sense of how she feels about adoption, which doesn't quite jive with her view of her adoptive parents that we have seen this season. We just didn't know her mom is white. I think the only new things this season for Michaela are what we have learned about her parents' characters. I find it interesting that in this episode she said that she never had a family. There's obviously more there, but I think that will be explained this season.

Connor - we met his family in the Christmas episode. He gets along well with his sister and seems to have a supportive, boring and normal family. Of course, they could retcon this pretty easily if they wanted to, but that's what we know so far.

Granted, we got quite a bit more detail about certain parts of Wes' backstory, but it's not like we know nothing about the others. And with Wes, we know what happened when he was 12. We have little idea what happened to him before or after. We really only know a one part of his backstory (small in terms of time), we just have a lot of detail on it.

[blackwing]

Thanks everyone.... I guess I don't pay as much attention as I had thought, because it certainly seems like it was Wes Wes Wes overload in comparison to the others.

[wanderingstar]

At the end of this episode, we saw Frank headed back to South Philly. I wonder if he'll make contact with Bonnie before the House Fire Night.

[ribboninthesky]

6 hours ago, blackwing said:

I am hoping it is him.  I don't have anything against the actor personally, although I think he is mediocre at best.  The reason I want Wes to be dead is because I can't stand the character.  He is this show's special snowflake.  Many of the storylines have revolved around him.  The awful obsession with Rebecca.  The business with Rose and the amount of time we spent wondering if Annaliese was his mother.  The Mahoney business.  I just don't care about any of it.  The quicker they get rid of him, the sooner I can be rid of seeing him and his only move, the "puppy dog eyes".

Who I don't like... Laurel and Wes.  100% because of Wes.  The actor has had zero chemistry with all of the females on this show except for Annaliese.

I'm not rooting for Wes's demise simply because I don't want a lead character (particularly one that's POC) with this tragic of a backstory to meet that grizzly of an end, despite my many misgivings surrounding his past/present plotlines. Son of an immigrant domestic worker, his conception the product of sexual assault, watched his mother commit suicide á la Madame Butterfly and then saw his rapist father blown away right in front of him? Jeez. Typing it out even feels harsh and unnecessarily punitive.

However, on the Wes/Laurel front, I agree 100%. That pairing should've remained in the friend zone. Wasn't really for or against it initially, but them hooking up pushing me out of Swiss-like neutrality into a firm anti vote. Not feeling it. WHATSOEVER.

2 hours ago, Keepitmoving said:

I felt nothing with regard to that love scene with Laurel and I feel it's mostly because of him. While I wasn't that into Frank and Laurel, they did have chemistry and Frank knew how to get it done in the love scene department.  The Laurel and Wes love scene juxtaposed with the Michaela and Asher scene was no contest for me. Heck, the Asher/Michaela kiss at the end of him trying to get her to commit to something real topped the Laurel and Wes love scene. 

Yeah, and it is all because he doesn't have that "it" factor.

It's like you pulled my thoughts out of my head and posted them yourself. I found it so jarring that a not-so-platonic subtext which had been building from the beginning fell so flat once Laurel & Wes finally did the do. And that's not something I can put on Karla, because whether anyone debates if Flaurel was too toxic to last or not, you at least believed in her and Frank's physical attraction.

Honestly, Waitlist & Wallflower making heart eyes at each other in Annalise's kitchen last season alongside their first kiss packed a far chemistry greater punch. And inter-spliced with the intimacy of Asher & Michaela being effortlessly playful and sexy together in bed? It only reinforced how cold "Waurel" left me.

Alfred Enoch is an extremely attractive man, but good looks alone does not sexiness make. Maybe we should've taken his first swing and a miss with Rebecca as a sign… since that one shared simultaneous S1 screen time with Lila's autopsy.

[Milaxx]

8 hours ago, blackwing said:

There was no discussion in the show of her being his mom... but we here on the boards speculated about it at length.  Given the fact that he was eating the show, it didn't seem that out of the question that she could have been his mom, and that's why she was always protecting him.  It was only later that we learned that she protected him because she felt guilty about her role in what happened to Rose.

I agree that the writers have featured Michaela, Asher and Laurel a lot more this season.  But when you assert that crappy writers kill off characters to make room for others... those same "crappy writers" are the ones that were unable to make room for others in the first two seasons.  We know so much more about Wes' background than any of the others.  Asher was a cartoon, and we got to meet his aristocratic father briefly last season, but that's all we knew about him.  We finally met Laurel's dad this season.  It took us until the third season to learn that Michaela has a white mom, is adopted, and may or may not be from the South?  And I believe we still don't know anything at all about Connor's background.  It's not really the time to assert that it's an "ensemble show" that can include Wes when it hasn't truly been an ensemble show until this season.

As much as I really want Wes to be the dead body, I wouldn't be at all surprised if it's Nate.  Nate seems increasingly extraneous.  Any favours or tricks that he could do with police files or whatnot, it seems just as easy for Bonnie to work her magic and get things done.

I think we got a lot of Wes in season 1 because there was the mystery as to why he made it in in the first place.  Yes viewers did question his relationship with Annalise & like what  Laurel's dad did for a living it was implied that he might be her long lot son, then quickly squashed when she felt him up. Wes also had the relationship with Rebecca, so yeah season 1 was lots of Wes. However I think the biggest issue was that Viola Davis simply acted circles around these younger actors. As they have settled into their roles and the characters have become more defined we see less of that. 

As others have mentioned we met  Laurel's family in season 1. This season they recast her father and walked back on the cartel implications. He works for the government in tech. Michaela we knew came from poor beginnings. In season 1 Aiden's mother makes mention of her coming from the "bayou swamp". Season 2 we find out she was adopted.

7 hours ago, Keepitmoving said:

OK, so let me remind myself of the list of characters who have actually committed murder:

Frank

Wes

Bonnie she killed Rebecca right?

Asher, he killed that DA right?

Am I missing anyone who actually has blood on their hands? The rest of the characters are accessories to covering it all up right?

Wait who cut up Sam's body, is there another charge for that?  Because Michaela and Laurel weren't part of the carving of that body right?

There has been so much killing on this show, I just had to take a moment to try and remember who's actually committed murder.

IIRC they all helped cut up the body except Micheala & Asher who wasn't there. However they all helped transport the body so they are all accessories.

 

6 hours ago, starri said:

If memory serves, they insinuated that the father was involved in a cartel.  They also lived in Los Angeles, I think.

We've since seen him in Miami as some kind of legitimate businessman.

Family always live in Miami.

6 hours ago, Keepitmoving said:

So how did they switch out the back story? Her father isn't doing criminal activity? I don't know if we got any confirmation on this theory but I always thought her father was doing something illegal. Is that not the case?  I also didn't realize that her mother was mentally ill, didn't the new dad say something to that effect? Didn't he apologize for having to commit her mother? I didn't realize in season one that the woman sitting at the table wasn't her biological mother.

It was implied that the father was part of a drug cartel. Now he works for the government making drones (and Iguess military tech?). They never mentioned her mother but  at the holiday dinner her father's mother appeared (to me) to be white and clearly the 2nd wife. We found out about her mother back in Mexico this season.

4 hours ago, Gillian Rosh said:

At the end of this episode, we saw Frank headed back to South Philly. I wonder if he'll make contact with Bonnie before the House Fire Night.

They showed him on 95S that's the highway from NYC to Philly. Bonnie mentioned he wanted to come home. My impression was that Frank thinks by framing David Mahooney, Wes is safe so it's clear for him to come home.

Edited November 3, 2016 by Milaxx

[Keepitmoving]

Michaela seems to have sticky fingers and I think she's been nurtured into that behavior based on her telling her mom not to steal anything out of her own daughter's apt.. She wasn't joking either and mama didn't seem offended. She took it as matter of fact.

i swear I think her adoptive family must have been down in that Bayou committing crimes and teaching a little Michaela how to pick pocket and lord knows what the hell else. Maybe it was a foster care set up and that system can be shady, people  just taking in kids for the money. If this is how it went down then yeah that's not much of a family.  I don't even get how this adoption would go down if they were that poor and unsettled. But I'm on the edge of my seat to get into this backstory. 

Edited November 3, 2016 by Keepitmoving

[muessigkeit]

Re Laurel's father:

I think it's a little misleading to say it was heavily implied that he worked for a drug cartel specifically. Laurel's father was mentioned/seen exactly 3 times that I can remember:

1. In the christmas episode we see him recount playing golf with a politician (City Commissioner Springer) and get angry that the politician cheated. Then he throws out Laurel for being disrespectful. (1x11)

2. When Annalise tries to make Laurel shoot her, she says: "You've gone through worse with your father." (2x09)

3. Before the first Wes/Laurel kiss she cries about Frank, saying he's just like her father who's "not a good person." She also says that's the reason she was always so calm about everything they went through with Annalise and that she wanted to get away from him. (2x12)

To me all these clues certainly scream "Very bad man, probably a criminal", but if your mind immediately goes "Mexican -> Drugs" that says more about how Mexicans are portrayed on tv in general than on this show in particular imo.

Edited November 3, 2016 by muessigkeit

[stuckin60s]

I think that Laurel will lose the baby.  She will not die.  They cannot have a child on this show.  The K5 are still in school and supposed to be studying.  A baby would require too much help..  Frank has to come home, he brings so much into this show.  If you like him you DO, if you don't like him you DONT very little in the middle.  As far as Wes, he can leave any time.  They have used that character too much and it is time to go.  The title is HTGAWM, the COW has to be decent but the main story is the interaction between the main characters.  I like having Nate in the episodes, besides the obvious eye candy; he brings additional story line and allows Anna to be a real adult person.  I am ready for her to get hold of herself and get back to the group being a group.  Maybe next season.  Still cant wait for tonight and the next saved character is.....

[muessigkeit]

5 minutes ago, doram said:

Well it's on record that the actress specifically asked that her father's background be changed from that direction. So while I can't remember the exact details of that Christmas conversation (I always thought there was a point in time when Laurel implied that her father was a criminal at least), the ground-work was definitely there. So it wasn't entirely in the viewers's heads. 

I didn't think "drugs" specifically. More like "Don Corleone" type mafia.

"It’s great writing. It’s such a collaboration with Pete. For me, it was very important that Laurel’s father had nothing to do with the drug cartel. I was so passionate about that. The fact that he is an awful person, powerful, and has a lot of money doesn’t necessarily mean that he’s involved with that. I was very happy that we found a different profession for him to have, following my desire to not just be stereotyped." (http://www.ew.com/article/2016/10/06/how-get-away-murder-karla-souza-laurel)

"First of all, it was so exciting to play opposite Esai Morales. And then the idea of Laurel’s father had been in the oven of ideas for so long. What does he do? The pitch of him being in this multi-billion dollar technology corporation was something I pitched to Pete because I didn’t want it to have anything to do with the drug cartel. That’s something in my activism that’s really important, to not play into that stereotype." (http://tvline.com/2016/10/06/how-to-get-away-with-murder-recap-season-3-episode-3-laurel-lies-annalise/)

I'm always more of a fan of directly quoting someone instead of paraphrasing, so above are the quotes I found. You can read into these that Pete wanted to go in that direction if you want to, but I think you can also give him the benefit of the doubt since Karla never says it was his original plan, only that she worried about the stereotype.

Here's the Christmas scene by the way: 

He says he didn't say anything about the politician kicking the ball closer to the hole "because [he] didn't want to lose that contract." So Laurel's father being in business with the government isn't much of a retcon in the first place. Still would like to know why they recast the actor, though.

[wanderingstar]

Quote

Still would like to know why they recast the actor, though.

Me too! I like Esai Morales, but I've adored Jose Zuniga, the original actor they cast, for a long time. I was hoping we'd see him again.

I've always liked that Christmas dinner scene. Thanks for posting it, muessigkeit.

Edited November 4, 2016 by Gillian Rosh

[love2lovebadtv]

14 hours ago, Keepitmoving said:

Michaela seems to have sticky fingers and I think she's been nurtured into that behavior based on her telling her mom not to steal anything out of her own daughter's apt.. She wasn't joking either and mama didn't seem offended. She took it as matter of fact.

i swear I think her adoptive family must have been down in that Bayou committing crimes and teaching a little Michaela how to pick pocket and lord knows what the hell else. Maybe it was a foster care set up and that system can be shady, people  just taking in kids for the money. If this is how it went down then yeah that's not much of a family.  I don't even get how this adoption would go down if they were that poor and unsettled. But I'm on the edge of my seat to get into this backstory. 

If she was in foster care first,  the family wouldn't need to have money to adopt her.. In fact,  there's assistance available even after you adopt. This is a completely different system from adopting children from abroad or even through private domestic agencies.