S01.E07: In No Uncertain Terms

[formerlyfreedom]

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Charley faces up to the state of her marriage; Ralph Angel wants to farm full time; and Aunt Violet uncovers information about Hollywood that jeopardizes their relationship.

[wanderingstar]

They're really upping the ante with these episodes. I'm afraid there won't be any relationships left intact by the end of the season.

Kudos to Nova for calming LeeAnne. That was a good way of trying to de-escalate the situation. I'm glad the truth is out, but I want Vi and Hollywood to work it out.

Remy was great tonight - especially with Charley. He didn't tell her how to feel, nor was he overbearing. He was just there for her.

Micah was mouthing off so much that I thought for sure someone was going to smack him.

I like Nova's new girlfriend, Chantel. They're cute together. I don't think that phone call was the last we'll see of Calvin, though.

I am really pulling for Ralph Angel to get paid to work on the farm.
 

Edited October 13, 2016 by Gillian Rosh

[Dee]

Charley was a ball of fire this episode. Her chin checking everyone was priceless. When she flounced out of the restaurant I cracked up.

Micah certainly inherited his mama's freshness. He was letting everyone have it too. Poor Hollywood looked positively dumbstruck when Micah took him to task.

Nova and Chantel are too cute. The lighting in that scene was brilliant.

Tina Lifford was the star of this episode. My heart broke for her at the end of the episode.

Remy is a keeper. A cliche, but a keeper.

Roberta is to the Bordelons as Anika is to the Lyons.

Blue remains the cutest child on Earth. I love that he misses his mama who Ralph Angel has a lot of nerve passing judgment on.

Edited October 13, 2016 by Dee

[mrsbagnet]

This show is playing with my emotions. That last scene with Hollywood and Violet killed me. They have to make up.

Poor Micah was having a day. He was probably thinking, "Is there any man in this family who isn't shady?" He had a every right to be mad at Charley for reprimanding him for leaving the house, but I did lol at her "Oh no you didn't" look when he asked which home he should come to.

Charley's ponytail had a life of its own. I'm so cynical that I thought she might snap on Remy for all his feel-good, "don't let them kill your spirit" talk at the farm. He's being nice and supportive, but he's also clearly into her.

I second Blue's cuteness. I did not like imagining baby Blue being present while his mom was turning tricks. Now I see why they all hate her so much.

[NowVoyager]

I like Nova's new relationship; her being with a married man always left a bad taste in my mouth. I didn't like the new girl smarting off to Charley though. She don't know her like that. Maybe it was the weed... I loved that Nova took her nephew to the art exhibit. It was wonderful! I felt inspired through my tv screen.

I'm with Aunt Vi: I feel some kinda way about Ralph Angel having full custody of his son. He's continued to make bad life choices time after time the entire series. I really hope he can get it together. (Although, honestly I don't think the farm is the easiest way to do that. My goodness, farming is a lot of work! And a storm's a brewing... Lawd! Foreshadowing of some Hurricane Katrina-type situations? I didn't read the book.) I did feel RA's pain when the boy was longing for his mother, seemingly less appreciative of the parent who is actually present. And, um, I wouldn't mind getting another look at that probation officer... seems Remy's not the only cutie-pie in town. Meanwhile, what was up with RA telling the bosomy waitress she had to take a shower? He hasn't exactly been discerning with his sexual partners in the past.

I thoroughly enjoyed watching Aunt Vi walk into that restaurant & hearing her former patrons tell her shit wasn't right since she left. (Mm-hmm! I work in a customer service industry & I can tell you, you can't put a price tag on good people, with charm & personality like Aunt Vi.) Vi didn't seem to pressed about her lost gig, though. She got a pedicure & shopped up for the crawfish boil. It looked so yummy! I cracked up at RA busy getting down with his plate while folks were trying to dance. My brother works offshore, like Hollywood. He says its good money & easy work---the toughest part for him is being away from family for such long stretches of time. Lord, I hope they get back together!

I felt some kinda way about Charley telling her son his father has slept with prostitutes. He's a little young to hear all that--- well, on second thought, I guess it's all going to come out in the media anyway? I applauded Charley's venting about everybody just take-take-taking. I had one of those moments myself this week.

[TVForever]

Oh, I feel bad for Hollywood right now. He should have told Vi about Leanne before, yes, but it should have been obvious at that crab boil that something wasn't right with Leanne, and that maybe she  (Vi) should just stop and listen before acting on her first (and usually worst) impression. Admittedly, I'm biased because I know (as audience) what the full story is, but still.  When he gets back from taking Leanne  home, I hope he comes completely clean with Vi, and I hope she really listens, because their relationship is one of the true highlights in this Queen Sugar world.

Edited October 13, 2016 by TVForever

[DearEvette]

That crawfish boil, backyard party looked so damned fun.  I was jealous I wasn't invited!

Charley was pissed at Davis and took it out on everybody else.  She had an absolute right to yell at Nova, but Micah didn't deserve it.  Come on, he is a kid at loose ends who is used to living in LA with his friends.  He is isolated, away from anything really familiar.  At least he got out of the house and did something positive.  I would have loved to take my 17 y.o. to that exhibit.

Nova and her girlfriend were cute together.  I like the actress and I think she and Rutina have some nice chemistry.  But, sigh, I know it is wrong--- bu they just don't seem to have the sizzle that Nova and Calvin do. I almost feel like ... if Nova and Calvin are really over we need more closure than that argument they had because it doesn't feel like it is enough to kill their relationship.  It feels almost like an excuse for a time out.  I also get the feeling we haven't seen the last of Calvin and if he truly plans to leave his wife, will this force Nova to make a real choice?

Aunt Vi was holding it down and spilling all the truth tea.  First her hard-eyed recital of Darla turning tricks with Blue in the room was just devastating and then finally giving Charley an earful.  I loved Aunt Vi this ep.  It probably won't happen, but I would love for Tina Lifford to get some sort of award recognition for her work on this show.

Poor Ralph Angel.  If it isn't one thing it is another.  I can totally understand having a a full time job being a condition of parole, but stipulating health care too?  It is hard enough for ex-cons to get jobs in the first place let alone FT let alone with health benefits.  It just seems the bar is so high to rehabilitation it is no wonder so many find themselves back inside. 

Since Ava Duvernay's most recent documentary project is about prison & mass incarceration of blacks , RA's storyline and Nova's preoccupation with Too Sweet seems somewhat editorial.  Although RA's situation feels a lot more organic to the story.

The scene where Maxine Shaw (yeah, I don't remember the character's name) interrupts the party was soooo uncomfortable. I liked how in character it was for Nova to try to comfort her.  Vi was devastated and poor Hollywood.  He cried.  Damn.

[Dee]

9 minutes ago, DearEvette said:

Charley was pissed at Davis and took it out on everybody else.  She had an absolute right to yell at Nova, but Micah didn't deserve it.  Come on, he is a kid at loose ends who is used to living in LA with his friends.  He is isolated, away from anything really familiar.  At least he got out of the house and did something positive.  I would have loved to take my 17 y.o. to that exhibit.

It tickles me how quickly she gets hood with him when he's acting petulant.

You can take the girl out of the South, but you can't take the South out of the girl.

[Milaxx]

Can't believe I didn't think to find this forum! OMG I love this show. Each character is so well rounded. None of them are all good or bad so even when they make stupid decisions you get why they took those actions. When Remy spoke with Charley about her grief I positively swooned. Never in a million years did I image Dondre Whitfeild had this type of performance in him!

I want Auntie Vi and Hollywood to get back together but he needs to apologize for keeping LeeAnne a secret.

Nova's new relationship appears nice but she has to deal with her guilt that TooSweet probably was busted with her pot. Then there's the potential fallout because Calvin knows she grows and sells pot. I also think her guilt is what prompted her to bail him out in the first place.

I don'y disagree with Vi retaining guardianship. Hopefully she is willing to work with RA and award him visitation and a step down process for him to regain full guardianship (overnight visitation> co-guardianship> full guardianship.)

[FairyPrincess]

1 hour ago, Milaxx said:

Can't believe I didn't think to find this forum! OMG I love this show. Each character is so well rounded. None of them are all good or bad so even when they make stupid decisions you get why they took those actions. When Remy spoke with Charley about her grief I positively swooned. Never in a million years did I image Dondre Whitfeild had this type of performance in him!

I want Auntie Vi and Hollywood to get back together but he needs to apologize for keeping LeeAnne a secret.

Nova's new relationship appears nice but she has to deal with her guilt that TooSweet probably was busted with her pot. Then there's the potential fallout because Calvin knows she grows and sells pot. I also think her guilt is what prompted her to bail him out in the first place.

I don'y disagree with Vi retaining guardianship. Hopefully she is willing to work with RA and award him visitation and a step down process for him to regain full guardianship (overnight visitation> co-guardianship> full guardianship.)

Yes!  Both of Remy's talks with Charley had me swooning.  The first time they talked, the way he said "You are an incredible woman, Charley"  I DIED ???

Hollywood and Vi broke my heart.  He loves her so much.  He was trying to do the right thing by Leanne but he should have been honest.  Especially since the truth ain't really that bad...

[Dee]

5 hours ago, FairyPrincess said:

Hollywood and Vi broke my heart.  He loves her so much.  He was trying to do the right thing by Leanne but he should have been honest.  Especially since the truth ain't really that bad...

To be fair, that's a lot of baggage for anyone to deal with. How does one even begin to explain something like that?

"So, Violet, babe? My bipolar wife, whom I've long been separated from is still in love with me, continues grieving the miscarriage of our child and occasionally doesn't take meds properly needs me to remain intermittently involved in her life so she can take full advantage of my health insurance and not feel triggered enough to engage in self harm."

The description alone is exhausting.

Edited October 14, 2016 by Dee

[Neurochick]

7 hours ago, Milaxx said:

I want Auntie Vi and Hollywood to get back together but he needs to apologize for keeping LeeAnne a secret.

I do too, but Hollywood was all kinds of wrong.  Had he explained the situation to Vi, she might have understood; I mean we do live in a country where not everybody has health insurance.  I understand the situation Hollywood is in; he's trying to do the right thing, but sometimes when you try to do the right thing, you fuck things up.  Hollywood might have been afraid that had he divorced LeAnne, she would have ended up on the streets, and Hollywood would have felt guilty.  It's a mess.

[Clanstarling]

On 10/13/2016 at 5:05 AM, TVForever said:

He should have told Vi about Leanne before, yes, but it should have been obvious at that crab boil that something wasn't right with Leanne, and that maybe she  (Vi) should just stop and listen before acting on her first (and usually worst) impression.

Yeah, but lying is lying. And he's been lying to her for a very long time. He had reasons, understandable and worthy reasons, to stay married to Leanne - but he should have been upfront about them with Vi in the beginning. She's a good, kind, soul. I think she would have understood at that point - and she could have made an informed decision about getting in deep with Hollywood. No one likes to feel like a fool for believing in the person they love. It's going to take a lot to build trust again.

On the lighter side, I had to laugh when Charlie was so surprised a storm could harm their crops. I'm no farmer, never lived in the country, but I've watched enough news to know that weather can make or break a harvest.

On 10/13/2016 at 8:24 AM, DearEvette said:

I can totally understand having a a full time job being a condition of parole, but stipulating health care too?  It is hard enough for ex-cons to get jobs in the first place let alone FT let alone with health benefits.  It just seems the bar is so high to rehabilitation it is no wonder so many find themselves back inside. 

I was surprised at that too. Where I live, jobs with benefits - even for non-cons - are hard to come by.

[TVForever]

22 minutes ago, Clanstarling said:

Yeah, but lying is lying. And he's been lying to her for a very long time. He had reasons, understandable and worthy reasons, to stay married to Leanne - but he should have been upfront about them with Vi in the beginning. She's a good, kind, soul. I think she would have understood at that point - and she could have made an informed decision about getting in deep with Hollywood. No one likes to feel like a fool for believing in the person they love. It's going to take a lot to build trust again.

On the lighter side, I had to laugh when Charlie was so surprised a storm could harm their crops. I'm no farmer, never lived in the country, but I've watched enough news to know that weather can make or break a harvest.

I was surprised at that too. Where I live, jobs with benefits - even for non-cons - are hard to come by.

Agreed. That's why I hope that Vi and Hollywood can really talk once she's had some time to cool down. He can apologize profusely and explain everything, and she can listen and hopefully forgive. I'm only giving him a "pass" here because he did the wrong thing, but for the right reasons. He was actually trying to do right by someone that he no longer loved, but still felt enough compassion for to try to provide what he could (access to his health insurance). It's not like he was "stepping out" on either woman romantically. 

That aside, I'm sure this is a coincidence, but did anyone else think that Vi and Leanne look like older and younger versions of the same person? I actually wondered if that was one of the reasons for switching Vi's hairstyle before the scene where they "meet". If Vi was still wearing the big curly hair, it would have been a little weird. 

[Dee]

The ironic juxtaposition of Violet comforting a devastated Charley at the beginning of the episode with her being left reeling in a similar fashion at the episode's end, was striking.

[Clanstarling]

That and the fact that Nova is on the other side of that pain with her cop boyfriend (ex though he may be - it sounded like he was leaving his wife).

[Artsda]

I felt so bad for Vi at the end, she was just floored. What makes it worse was that he lied to her all these years for a lie that wasn't even worth it. He could have told her the ex-wife he had to stay married to for health care because she was locked up. He was doing a good thing, not keeping a girl on the side like Micah thought. I actually do hope when Vi understands or Hollywood explains he's an idiot they get back together.

Micah is like a bouncy ball, every week he goes from not wanting to be in LA to wanting to be in LA. Wasn't it last week he wanted out and far away from his school? The week prior he wanted to go back to LA with Davis. Now he's throwing tantrums from being away from LA again?

Nova trying to justify her steeling was pathetic, she stole 10,000 and how exactly does she intend to pay Charley back? And what business is it of hers what Charley does with Charley's money? Nova doesn't get to steal it because Charley payed off the hooker. Charley should take Nova's rights away from that charge account ASAP.Charley finding out both Nova and Vi are sleeping with married men is ironic, especially after Nova's trying to act high and mighty over stealing the money because Charlie pays off the hooker with 3 million. 

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Blue remains the cutest child on Earth. I love that he misses his mama who Ralph Angel has a lot of nerve passing judgment on.

 

After that story of Hollywood finding Blue's mama turning tricks in a shed while a dehydrated Blue lay right next to her. RA has every right to pass judgement on her! RA may be a criminal stealing iPhones or cash, but at least his misguided reasoning is provide for his son. Not to get crack or what ever drug Blue's mama is buying. 

[Joimiaroxeu]

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Micah is like a bouncy ball, every week he goes from not wanting to be in LA to wanting to be in LA. Wasn't it last week he wanted out and far away from his school? The week prior he wanted to go back to LA with Davis. Now he's throwing tantrums from being away from LA again?

It might help for him to be around kids his own age. He's kind of isolated now just being around a bunch of grownups and little boy Blue.

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I don't think that phone call was the last we'll see of Calvin, though.

We can only hope. Maybe Nova can arrange a threeway. ?

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Roberta is to the Bordelons as Anika is to the Lyons.

Yep, you could see her eyeballing things like she was trying to figure out how she could get her hands on some of it. RA had better be real diligent about using protection when he gets with her because she seems like the type who'd try to trap him with a baby. Good thing Violet clearly has Roberta's number.

[Dee]

It's been three days, and Charley's Ponytail Of Righteousness, is still cracking me up.

[Empress1]

Micah and Blue playing together was so cute. "You wanna go get some ice cream?" "Of course!" Blue clearly adores his big cousin, and Micah is sweet with him.

14 hours ago, Artsda said:

Nova trying to justify her steeling was pathetic, she stole 10,000 and how exactly does she intend to pay Charley back? And what business is it of hers what Charley does with Charley's money? Nova doesn't get to steal it because Charley payed off the hooker. Charley should take Nova's rights away from that charge account ASAP.Charley finding out both Nova and Vi are sleeping with married men is ironic, especially after Nova's trying to act high and mighty over stealing the money because Charlie pays off the hooker with 3 million. 

Charley was having a day. Nova was dead-ass wrong for taking the money and for counting Charley's money. And she doesn't have an extra ten grand lying around - Charley's not getting that money back.

That art exhibit was beautiful. I'd buy that work. I know Charley was mad, but I didn't think Micah did anything wrong.

I'm going to need Charley and Remy to do it already. My mother told me "you just have to feel it" the first time I got my heart broken. It's true.

That crawfish boil looked like so much fun! And delicious!

I've been uninsured. It's scary - and I'm healthy and didn't get hurt during that time (I'm so thankful for that). So in Vi's place, if I knew Hollywood's situation, I would probably be sympathetic- IF I knew the situation. The lies though? Not cool. And to have it come out in front of everybody like that? She was humiliated. Of course she ended it. I would too. He clearly loves Vi and he did the wrong thing for the right reasons and hopefully they can patch things up, but I get it.

Roberta is trouble. What happened to Blue's teacher? She's a better option.

[Neurochick]

On October 14, 2016 at 1:58 PM, Clanstarling said:

Yeah, but lying is lying. And he's been lying to her for a very long time. He had reasons, understandable and worthy reasons, to stay married to Leanne - but he should have been upfront about them with Vi in the beginning. She's a good, kind, soul. I think she would have understood at that point - and she could have made an informed decision about getting in deep with Hollywood. No one likes to feel like a fool for believing in the person they love. It's going to take a lot to build trust again.

 

Yes, Vi was upset because Hollywood lied to her. It's the lying that bothered Vi, not really what Hollywood did.

 

3 hours ago, Empress1 said:

I've been uninsured. It's scary - and I'm healthy and didn't get hurt during that time (I'm so thankful for that). So in Vi's place, if I knew Hollywood's situation, I would probably be sympathetic- IF I knew the situation. The lies though? Not cool. And to have it come out in front of everybody like that? She was humiliated. Of course she ended it. I would too. He clearly loves Vi and he did the wrong thing for the right reasons and hopefully they can patch things up, but I get it.

Very true.  Vi would have understood.  The lie that Hollywood told Vi was a big whopper.  My mother told me there are two really awful lies that a person can tell in a relationship; if you've been or are married and how many children you have.  Hollywood didn't even tell Vi that LeAnne had lost their baby.  Vi was just blindsided and embarrassed.  How else could she have reacted in that moment?   

[luckyroll3]

On 10/13/2016 at 3:23 AM, NowVoyager said:

I felt some kinda way about Charley telling her son his father has slept with prostitutes. He's a little young to hear all that--- well, on second thought, I guess it's all going to come out in the media anyway?

I thought she was being nice.  That was the least of that asshole's evils.  And it's better he hears from her first than from social media like he did with the initial accusation.   

[Empress1]

I agree. Better he hear it from her than from the media - and once the divorce proceedings get underway, things will come out.

[Timetoread]

I liked this episode a lot.  Charley's rage and Ponytail of Righteousness (thanks Dee) kind of made me chuckle.  She was in a mood and NOBODY was going to win on that day.  Remy was lucky to get out unscathed, poor RA couldn't say good morning without getting cussed out.  She wasn't always right but she wasn't always wrong either.  Loved her read of Nova "Don't bring my family into this and don't count my money."  She was a little hard on Micah but I enjoyed her reverting back to "black mama" when he made his little smart ass remark about "where is that exactly".  She looked like she was about to snatch him through the phone!  Still I feel so bad for her.  She's lost a lot in the past few weeks.  When we first met her, she was a happily married business woman/quasi celeb, with a healthy young son who was doing well and a father who was in her life.  In less than a month she lost her father, her marriage, her celebutante lifestyle and she has to build something new for her child.  And she really has nobody she feels that she can lean on.  Remy is all kinds of awesome, but I could understand her keeping him at a distance because you have to wonder if all that sage sweetness is just to get into her designer drawers.

I'll stand alone as the only one who doesn't like Nova's new boo-ette and has no interest in their "woke" storyline.  I love, love, LOVE Ava Duvernay, but it felt preachy.  Calvin is a married man, so I don't necessarily ROOT for them as a couple.  But I was VERY interested in the choices and lines both were walking to be together.  Particularly because they seemed to truly love each other in spite of themselves.  Like they never meant for it to be more than sex, but it became a "thing" in which they needed each other for comfort and they needed the other to understand them.  I want to see this laid bare because you find out who someone is by the choices that they make.  Nova talks a good game, but she is really quite selfish and self centered and keeps loved ones at arms length.  I thought that the reason she felt so "free" with Chantal is because right now, at this stage, Chantal has no expectations of her.  They have sex, smoke weed, and hashtag BLM.  That's it.

As for Vi and Hollywood.  There is so much love there.  For the life of me I can't figure out why he felt the need to lie for all these years.  I need more before I can either forgive him or dismiss him.  I want to forgive him, though.

[Arcadiasw]

Finally caught up with the show. Good show and I agree with opinions here on the characters. All the characters have interesting stories worth investing in.

Ralph Angel is an idiot. Not surprised he can’t see Roberta is trouble. I hope he wore protection. He doesn’t need a woman like Roberta hanging on him she’s pregnant with his kid. Ralph Angel got himself in the mess at work by mentioning the farm. When you mention farm, certain people will think “land, money and how I can use this to my advantage.” You would think after that experience with the warehouse people Ralph would be smart to be careful when talking about the farm to anyone else but smart and Ralph Angel don’t mix. Ralph Angel needs to specify that he shares the farm with his sisters, not own and though he shares the farm, technically Charley owns the farm since she’s bankrolling everything.

I feel for Charley in this episode. It’s a double edge sword to have money and have family members who don’t have money or know how to properly manage it. When you try to help out, the family may see you as their personal bank. Charley’s smart with money and business as we’ve seen with her L.A. life. I get her personal issues distracted her to make the mistake allowing her siblings access to that money. Now that she’s staying home, I hope Charley takes Ralph Angel and Nova’s name off the account. Definitely see sparks with Charley and Remy and even Davis picked up on it but it would be too soon for her to do anything.

Nova does good things but comes across as selfish, hypocritical and jealous at times especially with Charley and her money. I didn’t care for her mixing with a married man who’s also a father but I was really turned off with her taking the money for her personal needs and not the family farm. She knows she’s not paying Charley back. Stop with the lies. Lol

I love Aunt Vi and if Hollywood was honest everything would be good between them. They’ve been together for a while. Hollywood should know Aunt Vi long enough she could handle and understand the situation with his wife. He dropped the ball bigtime and it would be hard to win Vi back. Vi was right to not let Ralph Angel have custody of Blue. He’s been making grievous mistakes since the show started. He’s not ready for full custody of Blue any more than Blue’s mother.

[ribboninthesky1]

On 10/15/2016 at 5:53 PM, Empress1 said:

Charley was having a day. Nova was dead-ass wrong for taking the money and for counting Charley's money. And she doesn't have an extra ten grand lying around - Charley's not getting that money back.

Maybe Nova will sell some extra weed...

I've been #teamCharley since episode one, and still am.  She doesn't even get a day to grieve, process anything because she has to handle business. I've always liked Micah, but yeah...teenagers. My perception was that Charley was more upset he was with Nova than him leaving the house. 

Charley was much kinder with Nova than I would have been. 

I felt bad for Aunt Vi, she didn't deserve Hollywood's lies.  Totally understand why she's done with him for now.  That said...she came off rather self-righteous well before the crawfish boil:

• when Charley dared to *gasp* complain about the farm challenges, her response was, "Well, ya'll wanted it." She conveniently forgot her part in conjoling Charley and Nova, who actually didn't want it, to keep the farm for Ralph Angel's sake. The dude who knows little to nothing about farming. 
• she conveniently left out that Ralph Angel would have DESERVED to be arrested during that warehouse bust as he was a full and willing participant.  So her "everything isn't what it seems" didn't make any sense in context of Ralph Angel.  It is exactly as it seemed - Ralph Angel was engaged in criminal acts. Whatever, Ava and writing team with this "Ralph Angel is doing the best he can" crap.  Show me via his actions. 
• she was awfully sassy with the restaurant owner for someone who up and quit with no warning, especially since she didn't bother to have a conversation with the owner about his nephew and give him a chance to address it.  
• the one time she made complete sense to me was about not giving Ralph Angel custody, but then she lost me when she made it about Darla.  

Hearing about Darla was awful, but she deserves a chance to be a mother as much as Ralph Angel deserves the chance to be a father. I wonder if Darla was an addict when she and Ralph Angel were together. If so, Ralph Angel has culpability for knowingly getting involved with an addict AND having unprotected sex with her.  It ain't just on Darla.  Not to mention, he slept with her AGAIN fairly recently.  Either way, Darla hasn't been shown much, and the little we've seen has her behaving much more responsibly than Ralph Angel.  So, again, I need to see Ralph Angel doing something beyond looking fine yet sulky when he doesn't get his way.  Or show me Darla as the irresponsible, unstable drug addict that Vi saw. 

On 10/19/2016 at 2:58 PM, Timetoread said:

I'll stand alone as the only one who doesn't like Nova's new boo-ette and has no interest in their "woke" storyline.  I love, love, LOVE Ava Duvernay, but it felt preachy. 

My main problem with it is that it is very male-centered.  As if black girls and women are impervious to the same conditions that these black men and boys have experienced.  Not nary a mention of the black girls and women who have been beaten, shot, raped, and murdered, not just by police officers, but by the men in these very communities. I mean, if you're gonna go there, then go all the way there and be circumspect with it. I expect that kind of myopia on shows where the leads are primarily black men.  I expect better from this show.  I'm trying to hang, but it's tough. 

[LydiaMoon1]

1 hour ago, ribboninthesky1 said:

My main problem with it is that it is very male-centered.  As if black girls and women are impervious to the same conditions that these black men and boys have experienced.  Not nary a mention of the black girls and women who have been beaten, shot, raped, and murdered, not just by police officers, but by the men in these very communities. I mean, if you're gonna go there, then go all the way there and be circumspect with it. I expect that kind of myopia on shows where the leads are primarily black men.  I expect better from this show.

ICAM.

[Dee]

5 hours ago, ribboninthesky1 said:

I felt bad for Aunt Vi, she didn't deserve Hollywood's lies.  Totally understand why she's done with him for now.  That said...she came off rather self-righteous well before the crawfish boil:

• when Charley dared to *gasp* complain about the farm challenges, her response was, "Well, ya'll wanted it." She conveniently forgot her part in conjoling Charley and Nova, who actually didn't want it, to keep the farm for Ralph Angel's sake. The dude who knows little to nothing about farming. 
• she conveniently left out that Ralph Angel would have DESERVED to be arrested during that warehouse bust as he was a full and willing participant.  So her "everything isn't what it seems" didn't make any sense in context of Ralph Angel.  It is exactly as it seemed - Ralph Angel was engaged in criminal acts. Whatever, Ava and writing team with this "Ralph Angel is doing the best he can" crap.  Show me via his actions. 
• she was awfully sassy with the restaurant owner for someone who up and quit with no warning, especially since she didn't bother to have a conversation with the owner about his nephew and give him a chance to address it.  
• the one time she made complete sense to me was about not giving Ralph Angel custody, but then she lost me when she made it about Darla.  

I love Tina Lifford and Auntie Violet.

But if there is one thing that turns me off the character, it's the incessant coddling of Ralph Angel. I could empathize with her stance if Ralph Angel's mistakes felt organic, but everything he's done thus far has all been about self sabotage with huge dash of entitlement thrown in for good measure.

It's also bothersome because we're also supposed to believe that someone as sharp as Violet would choose to be willfully blind to her nephew's shenanigans. Your ex-con nephew appears offering you fistfuls of money? Accept his half ass explanation that he got it from a friend. Your ex-con nephew shiftily padlocking sheds on the family farm? Don't confront him right then & there, just ditch the stolen merchandise he's hiding later.

And the show is never called out about these blatant double standards. Instead, we're expected to view Violet as an unfailingly wise, impartial third party when she's anything but.

Edited October 22, 2016 by Dee

[ribboninthesky1]

1 hour ago, Dee said:

And the show is never called out about these blatant double standards. Instead, we're expected to view Violet as an unfailingly wise, impartial third party when she's anything but.

Right? That's why I can't roll with her.  Yes, he's family, but she was the one who acknowledged early on that part of Ralph Angel's problem was Ernest treating him with kid gloves.  Yet, she's taken every opportunity to do the same. *throws hands up*    

Tina Lifford is a treasure, but whoo chile, I'm over Vi's coddling of a grown-ass man. I'm interested to see what she does for money if her break-up with Hollywood isn't resolved quickly. 

[LydiaMoon1]

On 10/21/2016 at 7:22 PM, ribboninthesky1 said:

Yes, he's family, but she was the one who acknowledged early on that part of Ralph Angel's problem was Ernest treating him with kid gloves.  Yet, she's taken every opportunity to do the same. *throws hands up*    

Tina Lifford is a treasure, but whoo chile, I'm over Vi's coddling of a grown-ass man.

According to black folks, it's a black woman's duty to "help a brother out", "hold a brother up", "ride or die", "support the race" and all the other catchphrases and nonsense constantly thrown at black women to brainwash us into coddling and blindly supporting grown men.  In that way, Aunt Vi is an absolute reflection of reality.  I'm not at all surprised that she's written this way. My shock was that they let her acknowledge in the first place that the coddling of RA was the source of his problems.

[ribboninthesky1]

Agreed on all points, @LydiaMoon1. I think having her acknowledge it got my hopes up, you know?

[LydiaMoon1]

I know.  Mine too.  We should have known better.

[Emily Thrace]

On 2016-10-21 at 6:22 PM, ribboninthesky1 said:

Right? That's why I can't roll with her.  Yes, he's family, but she was the one who acknowledged early on that part of Ralph Angel's problem was Ernest treating him with kid gloves.  Yet, she's taken every opportunity to do the same. *throws hands up*    

Tina Lifford is a treasure, but whoo chile, I'm over Vi's coddling of a grown-ass man. I'm interested to see what she does for money if her break-up with Hollywood isn't resolved quickly. 

Vi has her heart in the right place. I also don't think she was necessarily coddling Ralph Angel in the scene with Charley . I felt like it was more that she was telling Charley what she needed to hear. In the end its better for everyone if Ralph Angel works at the farm full time Charley included. Charley was feeling isolated and unappreciated having Ralph Angel to help will be good for that. She and Ralph Angel get along better than her and Nova and Charley needs all the support she can get right now.

Speaking of supporting Charley it was nice to see Remy get more depth this week. He's been more of a magic farming genie than a character of his own  it nice to get some backstory and motivation for the character.

[Dee]

Charley doesn't get along better with Ralph Angel than she does with Nova. He hasn't had one conversation with her that hasn't been strictly motivated by his own self interest.

For all their fighting, the Bordelon sisters are much closer to each other than they are to their brother, which given the age difference & extenuating circumstances, makes a lot of sense.