S05.E22: Only You / S05.E23: An Untold Story

[RulerofallIsurvey]

Part two:

• I still don't get why the first part was called "only You."  No, I don't really want to know.  Can we kiss that song goodbye now?
• Some one slap Henry.  Oh, I volunteer!  Let it be me!  Please!
• I think Hook could have taken Hyde.  
• And yeah, Henry, it is on you, doofus.
• I like the Dragon.  Did anyone but me want to do yoga when he put the lotus flower in the bowl?l
• From the first  half: all the Camelotians went back to their world through the portal and no one noticed Violet wasn't with them?  That's messed up.  Violet is a cutie though.  Can we exchange her for Henry?
• The show should have ended with the crew coming through the fountain and applause.  That was a good note. 
• I really like that Snow carries a flask.  Or was that Hook's? 
• But how the hell did Snow think it was a good idea to inject Regina with the Jekyll Juice?l
• So if 'Good' Regina was able to take a heart and crush it, even if it was the Evil Queen, how does that make her 'Good'?
• Hook didn't ride back with Emma?  
• Ah, fuck.  Violet's father is Bugs Bunny.
• ETA: fun fact, I once won a game of charades by correctly guessing "A Connecticut Yankee in King Arthur's Court."  Hella impressed my friends.  :)

Edited May 17, 2016 by RulerofallIsurvey
Mark Twain is THE MAN. But Bugs is the Rabbit. Or, er... the Wabbit.

[chrisvee]

So lame that Violet's father is a Connecticut Yankee in King Arthur"s court; too 4th wall for my taste.

Twice as much Regina next season is just ugh although I thought the Regina/Snow/Emma interactions were actually somewhat touching & well done specially when Snow talked about Regina defeating the Evil Queen so they could be the family they deserve to be. Corny but still touching unlike the crap with Henry which was just corny. I felt as if they were friends. But I reserve the right to feel manipulated by these externalizations of people's inner evil in order to force redemptions.

Liked the Charmings, Hook, and Zelena teaming up -- there was chemistry there that bodes well for next season.

why does Emma always approach Regina so deferentially? Can't stand it.

Too little Captain Swann although Emma's cute little glance in the diner at the beginning was sweet.

[Randomosity]

4 minutes ago, RulerofallIsurvey said:

• Hook didn't ride back with Emma?  

I'm telling myself that the moms both wanted to be in the car with Henry, who would of course be with Violet. And I don't see Regina taking a literal backseat to Hook and Emma sitting up front. (Though the visual of her smushed in the middle seat between the kids and glowering at Captain Swan up front is amusing :D )

[Rumsy4]

4 minutes ago, chrisvee said:

why does Emma always approach Regina so deferentially? Can't stand it.

Right?? It's downright embarrassing. She's like a child worried about the next reprimand. 

[YaddaYadda]

3 minutes ago, Rumsy4 said:

Right?? It's downright embarrassing. She's like a child worried about the next reprimand. 

Well Regina is her step-granny, so you know, respect and fear your elders, and other such things.

People lay into Emma even though she has nothing to do with anything, and Emma apologizes. 

[AudienceofOne]

I think Emma apologising for not being there for Regina when she just got Hook back from the dead was the epitome of this.

But Hook once again giving Emma credit for rescuing them because Emma is always his hero regardless of what actually happens made me grin like a teenager.

[kili]

Quote

I'm telling myself that the moms both wanted to be in the car with Henry, who would of course be with Violet.

Why do the two kids who just ran away and almost caused people to be stranded in a foreign land get to dictate the car sharing logistics? Shouldn't part of their punishment be being separated?

I'm going to head cannon that the people in Gold's car had so much fun together in Steampunk Land they just wanted to carpool karaoke together all the way home. I want to see the video.

[Randomosity]

5 minutes ago, kili said:

Why do the two kids who just ran away and almost caused people to be stranded in a foreign land get to dictate the car sharing logistics?

I never said they dictated it; I said that's how I think it worked out. As in, dictated by the moms, who usually dictate such things in the absence of any dads here, and one of whom was driving. As in, a) the mothers wanted to both keep an eye on the children, because they misbehaved, as you said, and b) separating them would be extra punishment for Violet, who doesn't really know anyone but Henry and just happened to be dumb enough to go along with his plan. I don't see Emma or Regina doing that to Violet. You can certainly think your theory too.

[Dianthus]

17 hours ago, MMR said:

Great ep! Loved all Regina stuff,love Sam Witwer.
 And 2 Regina's next season! Yaaasss! Can't wait!

Yeah! Woo-hoo! Roland was more of a grown up than Regina. Go, Regina!

Regina was standing right there when Emma had to run Hook through with Excalibur, but Emma's suffering doesn't count. Regina was standing right there when they saw a battered and bloody Hook via the magic Skype juice, but I guess his suffering doesn't count either. Regina's such a special snowflake 'cuz no one's suffered like her. Also, Regina shouldn't face any consequences for her bad actions, not like the rest of us, or, hey, maybe we should just dismantle our legal system entirely.

[vizakenjack]

am I the only one who cringed at Henry's speech to the NYC crowd?

Totally unrealistic, only at the beginning the crowd's reaction made sense, from then onwards, it was fairytale, no way actual new yorkers would stop and keep listening to some boy's babble about "magic", also given current time, at least 2 or 3 passerbys would have started recording him, but in no way, it'd have been so easy to persuade everyone to do something, like tossing coins into the fountain while making a wish. NYC has a reputation for having "mind your own" business people, and a lot of non-new yorkers complain that the NYC people are brazen and a bit rude.

[3dog]

2 hours ago, Terrafamilia said:

Sam Witwer, please tell me those weren't your own sideburns.

Yes, this. And can someone explain to me the artistic choice in giving Hyde massively bloodshot eyes? I don't think I was getting something there. He blows out eyeball blood vessels when he hulks out? Mmmkay. I couldn't focus on anything else in his scenes. I just kept thinking how it must be The Land Without Visine.

[Tiger]

So next season are we going to learn that every bad thing Rumple has ever done is really the fault of The Consortium of Naughtiness consisting of Aunt Jemima, Christopher Robin, and that guy from the Summer's Eve commercial?

[Camera One]

So it looks like Emma and Snow actually did have an off-screen conversation in this episode.  But it was about Regina.  I'm going to pretend it went something like this.

SNOW: So, is Regina going to snap or is she going to be okay?
EMMA: I don't know... she was all over the place.  She said she wanted to rip out Hook's throat.
SNOW: Hmm... this is really scary.  We have to be even more careful than usual.

So they gave her the Dr. Jekyll serum out of desperation to keep themselves and their loved ones safe.

[RulerofallIsurvey]

21 hours ago, Watt said:

Maybe Adam and Eddy will be so wrapped up in their new show that they will leave next season entirely to Jane Espenson or one of their other competent writers to write.

The show is about Hope, after all!

13 hours ago, Randomosity said:

Also, just re-watching now, but I noticed that when Emma and Killian walked up to Granny's, it was very much dark night outside. The cemetery scene was gray, but definitely still during the day. I'm telling myself that they were extra late to the gathering at Granny's because they went home to do some reunion ravishing of each other first.

This is totally my headcannon from now on.  

11 hours ago, Curio said:

Hook may be a hell of a captain, but it's still really farfetched to believe he sailed that entire ship on his own and did it fast enough to outrun Dark Curse 2.0.

Well, the Jolly is made of enchanted wood, don't forget.  And no, I don't think it's too far far-fetched that Captain Hook is a hella captain who can outrun a curse to get to the woman he loves.

10 hours ago, kili said:

And then Henry used a rare book to smash a display case and steal an artifact.

Yes, some one please explain to Henry that display cases usually have doors.  That open.  Even if they are locked, it's only necessary to break the lock, not the glass.  

Fuck You, Henry.

[scenicbyway]

2 hours ago, Randomosity said:

I'm telling myself that the moms both wanted to be in the car with Henry, who would of course be with Violet. And I don't see Regina taking a literal backseat to Hook and Emma sitting up front. (Though the visual of her smushed in the middle seat between the kids and glowering at Captain Swan up front is amusing :D )

Hook didn't get to ride back with Emma because it would've ruined the SwanQueen family road trip. Nevermind that Regina should've ridden back with her sister and Snow.  It's like one more twist of the knife that Regina would keep CaptainSwan separated eventhough they've literally been to hell and back the day before.

[Curio]

I was finally able to watch the entire episode, and the nicest thing I can say about it is that Mark Isham's new violin theme for the Steampunk World is amazing. I want to learn that violin part like right now.

I agree with everyone else who said they should have spent more time exploring Jekyll's world instead of NYC. The 1800s buildings, the flying aircrafts, the street costumes, and the interior decorating was so fun and so different than what we normally get on the show. And what do they give us instead? Two hours of yet another Emma and Regina road trip. How many do they need at this point? Two was enough, we didn't need another one. Why can't they explore other character road trip options for Emma? Why can't Snow and Emma spend an entire episode together traveling to Boston? Emma and David could scope out some Ivy League colleges for Henry. I'd even be up for watching Rumple and Belle on a road trip.

I don't understand why Adam & Eddy love writing for Regina and Emma because their scenes always seem so disingenuous to me. Maybe I'm not giving the actresses enough credit, but Jennifer always looks stilted when she plays Emma in a serious scene with Regina. The entire Regina pity party monologue in Neal's apartment was awkwardly one-sided in favor of Regina, both in acting and character emotion. Of course when I complain about the show not allowing characters to talk for longer than 5 minutes, they give Regina and Emma the longest conversation of the season, and 90% of it is Regina going on and on about karma that she should have recognized years ago.

Why can't the other characters have emotional monologue dumps like Regina where they spill everything that's on their mind? Can you imagine how much information Emma could tell the audience with a monologue that long? Or Snow? Or Hook? Or Belle? Why couldn't Snow/Charming/Hook/Zelena have an equivalent conversation that lasted as long as the Emma/Regina apartment discussion? They could have covered so much characterization in that cage! Those four stuck in a cage is literally the perfect set up for a bottle episode.

This might be the first season finale where it's made me not want to watch the next season.

[Mathius]

Wait, when was the second Emma-Regina road trip?  I remember the one in 5x19, what was the other?

[Rumsy4]

35 minutes ago, Curio said:

Mark Isham's new violin theme for the Steampunk World is amazing. I want to learn that violin part like right now.

That's was heavenly. Hope one of the music blogs pull out the theme soon.

Quote

I agree with everyone else who said they should have spent more time exploring Jekyll's world instead of NYC. The 1800s buildings, the flying aircrafts, the street costumes, and the interior decorating was so fun and so different than what we normally get on the show.

I really wish 6A was happening in Steampunk World instead of Storybrooke. 

In the market scenes, I noticed The Three Musketeers, and maybe Jasmine & Aladdin among the people in the crowd. I'll need to rewatch to see who else was referenced in the scene. Though it is not certain if those were intentional or merely easter eggs.

[Camera One]

It was a mishmash of randomness so they have the freedom to tell whoever's story tickles their fancy next season in between The Evil Queen Stage Show and Where In The World is Belle In A Box.

Edited May 17, 2016 by Camera One

[Curio]

6 minutes ago, Mathius said:

Wait, when was the second Emma-Regina road trip?  I remember the one in 5x19, what was the other?

I include the Chernabog Chase as a mini road trip.

[InsertWordHere]

Rewatching and Regina telling Emma she's sick of condolences at the beginning of the episode is even worse because Zelena literally just said, "I think what my sister needs is a little time with someone who knows what she's going through" (which was rude even for Zelena BTW). Emma, AKA someone who knows what Regina's going through because as far as everyone knows she's just lost her boyfriend too, enters, says exactly one word, "Regina," and Regina brushes her off. 

I just? Tell a coherent story please, writers. Don't do fakeout deaths if you aren't going to deal with the fallout. This is like when everyone acted like it was a foregone conclusion that Blue would live again and no one was surprised when they were told she wasn't really dead. Even Rumple didn't react to Hook being alive again. 

[Camera One]

It was nice for Snow to get two nice lines this episode.  One was the "without the twister?" quip to Zelena, which I think was more the delivery than the actual line, and I liked this one as well:

HOOK: Other than that, even in this hellish land, the bloody Crocodile manages to get in my way.  What the devil do you think he did to that warden?

SNOW: Well, with him, it could be anything.

[KAOS Agent]

I watched the episode last night, but after reading the comments in the live thread, I drank way too much and was unable to stand up much less post anything coherent. I was bored and uninterested in most of the episode and am not at all excited about S6. Since it's pretty much all been said by now, I'll sum up my opinion of the episode in three words, Shut up, Henry!

[InsertWordHere]

18 minutes ago, Camera One said:

HOOK: Other than that, even in this hellish land, the bloody Crocodile manages to get in my way.  What the devil do you think he did to that warden?

SNOW: Well, with him, it could be anything.

Everyone's talking about the Captain Charming touching, but I see you, Snow and Hook, bonding over the Crocodile. I see you.

I loved Snow's attitude about her enemy, Rumplestiltskin. Please no one ever trust him again. And while they're at it, figure out what he did to Milah, thanks.

[Camera One]

I haven't read "Strange Case of Dr. Jekyll and Mr. Hyde" in years, so I read the synopsis on Wikipedia to review.  This part I found interesting, as it related to Regina:

 

Quote

Horrified, Jekyll tried more adamantly to stop the transformations, and for a time he proved successful by engaging in philanthropic work. One day in early January, at a park, he considered how good a person he had become as a result of his deeds in comparison to others, believing himself redeemed. However, before he completed his line of thought, he was seized by sensations of agony; once they had faded, he looked down at his hands and realised that he had suddenly transformed once again into Hyde. This was the first time that an involuntary metamorphosis had happened in waking hours.

 

So someone who saw their good deeds as making them redeemed suddenly transformed into their evil selves.  

I don't know if A&E thought they were being deep with their use of this story, or if they just used it as a tool to get The Evil Queen back.  

Edited May 17, 2016 by Camera One

[YaddaYadda]

8 hours ago, vizakenjack said:

am I the only one who cringed at Henry's speech to the NYC crowd?

Totally unrealistic, only at the beginning the crowd's reaction made sense, from then onwards, it was fairytale, no way actual new yorkers would stop and keep listening to some boy's babble about "magic", also given current time, at least 2 or 3 passerbys would have started recording him, but in no way, it'd have been so easy to persuade everyone to do something, like tossing coins into the fountain while making a wish. NYC has a reputation for having "mind your own" business people, and a lot of non-new yorkers complain that the NYC people are brazen and a bit rude.

I decided that the people at the "library" are tourists. Because tourists really get involved in this sort of stuff. Like they block the sidewalks when there are people performing dance routines, which annoys me to no end. 

5 hours ago, InsertWordHere said:

Rewatching and Regina telling Emma she's sick of condolences at the beginning of the episode is even worse because Zelena literally just said, "I think what my sister needs is a little time with someone who knows what she's going through" (which was rude even for Zelena BTW). Emma, AKA someone who knows what Regina's going through because as far as everyone knows she's just lost her boyfriend too, enters, says exactly one word, "Regina," and Regina brushes her off. 

I just? Tell a coherent story please, writers. Don't do fakeout deaths if you aren't going to deal with the fallout. This is like when everyone acted like it was a foregone conclusion that Blue would live again and no one was surprised when they were told she wasn't really dead. Even Rumple didn't react to Hook being alive again. 

Zelena needs to take several seats. So one day boyfriend who fucking used her, and I don't really care that they shared a TLK. Emma's experience has been fucking traumatic. I'm surprised she can still function normally. 

I think one of the things that I absolutely hated was that walk to Granny's after everyone came back from NYC, where Hook is asking Emma if she still feels guilty because he's back. 

4 hours ago, Camera One said:

So someone who saw their good deeds as making them redeemed suddenly transformed into their evil selves.  

I don't know if A&E thought they were being deep with their use of this story, or if they just used it as a tool to get The Evil Queen back.  

The Evil Queen has been back in dialogue a lot this season, and Regina has gone on about how she enjoys the power especially in 5x08. I think A&E have been trying to figure out a way to bring the EQ back for a while without messing too much with what they've done with Regina. Splitting her was probably their best idea. 

I really wanted them to go the route of Jekyll and Hyde where Regina is just randomly turning into the Evil Queen, and doesn't know until she buys a clue about it, or her alter ego shows up at a family event, or something.

[Randomosity]

5 hours ago, Camera One said:

So someone who saw their good deeds as making them redeemed suddenly transformed into their evil selves. 

 

Reminds me of when Phoebe was on her quest to find the selfless good deed and couldn't find one :)

[RadioGirl27]

6 hours ago, InsertWordHere said:

I just? Tell a coherent story please, writers. Don't do fakeout deaths if you aren't going to deal with the fallout. This is like when everyone acted like it was a foregone conclusion that Blue would live again and no one was surprised when they were told she wasn't really dead. Even Rumple didn't react to Hook being alive again. 

Yeah. The writers knew that Hook was going to be back, we as fans knew he was going to be back. But the characters didn't and yet A&E had them acting as if Hook was visiting some friends in other realm, not as if he was dead, so Emma's grieving was shortchanged and there was a total lack of reaction to seeing him alive from people like Rumple or Henry. 

[Arnella]

This is sort of random but I thought Regina and Zelena looked particularly beautiful just lately (and I am not a fan of either!).  Was Regina's lip scar gone?  It was like they were wearing extra but really well done makeup and Regina's teeth were preternaturally white. 

Am I the only one who noticed?  I haven't seen a comment on this but I may have missed it.

[maryle]

 Finally saw it! Well the first hour. I will see the second later today.

I did not hate it! Did not love it!  I find realistic how Emma and KillIan play the delicate situation. They were sorry but still wanted to be together.

I am meh! On the Violet and Henry ship. It miss something to me.

I like Jared but I do not find it to be interesting on screen. He is just there without showing emotion most of time. I find he was acting out without thinking on any consequence! He is the one who need a time out the most!

I think Emma should had a long chat  too with her Mother, or killian at the end. Tell him  how her perception about hero, villain, sacrifices, guilt have evolve with everything happened.

How that make her a better person, leader. Because having  a person who love you no matter what  help you to stand for yourself and face villain. Regina can feel sorry. But I really wish we had some insigh on Emma too. 

I love Dr. Jekill and Hyde. Everything about this side of the story. It does seems that Rumple mess every realm.

[Shanna Marie]

2 hours ago, RadioGirl27 said:

The writers knew that Hook was going to be back, we as fans knew he was going to be back. But the characters didn't and yet A&E had them acting as if Hook was visiting some friends in other realm, not as if he was dead, so Emma's grieving was shortchanged and there was a total lack of reaction to seeing him alive from people like Rumple or Henry. 

Yeah, that was really bothering me. At Robin's funeral, Snow said something about hoping they didn't have another day like this, which suggested that either they were burying Robin on the same day he died or that there had been multiple funerals on the same day. Hook's grave, nearby, was still fresh, with bare dirt on it. So, to the characters, Hook had very recently been buried, as well as Robin, and Emma had just lost Hook for good. He may have physically died weeks ago, but Emma had parted from him for what she believed to be the last time on the same day Robin died. The characters had no reason to know or believe that there was any chance Hook would be coming back, but we only got to see anyone but Emma mourn for him. Emma got her moment at the grave, but we didn't see his funeral, didn't see his wake. They had the shrine to Robin set up in Granny's with nothing about Hook, so it wasn't a joint wake. We saw everyone comforting Regina at Robin's death, at the funeral, and now at the wake, but Emma just got that initial hug from her parents. Even though the characters didn't know Hook would be back, it was like they took Emma's loss less seriously. And then they had Emma apologize for not being there for Regina at Robin's death, although Emma lost Hook for what she thought would be for good on the same day. Everyone was gathered around Regina and mourning Robin, but we never got to see Emma getting a similar treatment. Maybe they should have delayed Hook's return until the finale -- leave with him walking off into the light -- and let Hook's end sink in a little, make it seem a little more real so that the miracle of the return would have been bigger. As it was, no one but Emma really acted like he might be gone for good.

[Mitch]

4 hours ago, YaddaYadda said:

I decided that the people at the "library" are tourists. Because tourists really get involved in this sort of stuff. Like they block the sidewalks when there are people performing dance routines, which annoys me to no end. 

Zelena needs to take several seats. So one day boyfriend who fucking used her, and I don't really care that they shared a TLK. Emma's experience has been fucking traumatic. I'm surprised she can still function normally. 

I think one of the things that I absolutely hated was that walk to Granny's after everyone came back from NYC, where Hook is asking Emma if she still feels guilty because he's back. 

The Evil Queen has been back in dialogue a lot this season, and Regina has gone on about how she enjoys the power especially in 5x08. I think A&E have been trying to figure out a way to bring the EQ back for a while without messing too much with what they've done with Regina. Splitting her was probably their best idea. 

I really wanted them to go the route of Jekyll and Hyde where Regina is just randomly turning into the Evil Queen, and doesn't know until she buys a clue about it, or her alter ego shows up at a family event, or something.

Yes, I wanted them to do something along those lines with Regina/EvilQueen but its this show, which after S1 has no clue on how to build a story or theme subtly. It would have been more fun to see the EQ slowly take over...waltzing in to Granny's demanding pancakes...(okay probably Regina does that anyway) snarling at the dwarves "Get out of my way, little man!" (okay, she probably does that too) and being finally being mean to Henry "Did I ask your opinion child...whatever happened to children should be seen and not heard..that's a certain way to loose a tongue. How old are you anyway with your fairy-farty talk of heroes and villains!"  She gets more and more like the queen as episodes go by and Regina is perplexed that people are angry with her. At night she would go full out EQ and go hang out with Hyde and come up with evil plans while indulging in a little rough love...if you know what I mean.

[Curio]

4 minutes ago, XrystalPond said:

I think that something missing for me was Emma's lack of concern about leaving Hook. I realize she was worried about Henry, but she just hopped in her Bug and gone. It would have been more poignant and interesting if she was communicating with him by phone. The messages stop and now she has the added worry that his return was only temporary and she wasted it. It would have added to that ending of her saying I love you in a quiet moment. It would have been a good juxtaposition to Regina finding the letter from Robin.

Why are you so concerned about Emma's pain? This episode was about Regina's pain, not Emma's. Emma isn't allowed to have emotions when Regina is grieving. It would be incredibly insensitive of Emma to care about her boyfriend or parents and call or text them while she's in the presence of Regina. I mean, who does she think she is? Someone who just came back from Hell and said goodbye forever to her boyfriend less than 24 hours ago?

The episode felt incredibly disjointed, and this was part of the reason. The Steampunk Land and NYC stories seemed like they were from completely different episodes, and honestly, it might have been better if they were. The themes in each world were totally different, the vibes were totally different, and the lesson learned by each character was totally different. In Jekyll's world, the heroes had to learn to trust a stranger to fix a magical item while they tried to figure out a way to get back to Storybrooke. In NYC, Henry was looking to get rid of magic, Rumple was looking to take it all for himself, and Regina was using Emma as her personal therapist. (Emma should seriously start charging Hopper prices.) There just wasn't a lot of glue holding the two stories together, and the clunky cut between Emma grabbing her red coat in the apartment, ditching Hook and her parents, and chasing down Regina on the street was obviously just the writers' way of wanting to get Regina and Emma alone together on a road trip as fast as possible, and who cares what Hook, Snow, Charming, and Zelena think about that plan. 

[Randomosity]

1 hour ago, Curio said:

...Emma grabbing her red coat in the apartment, ditching Hook and her parents, and chasing down Regina on the street was obviously just the writers' way of wanting to get Regina and Emma alone together on a road trip as fast as possible, and who cares what Hook, Snow, Charming, and Zelena think about that plan. 

Seriously, after all that had gone down, you'd think Killian would have tagged along if for no other reason than to just be in Emma's proximity. He probably would have been perfectly content to sit in the backseat, just happy to be alive and to have Emma. What did he have to do that was pressing enough to keep him in Storybrooke instead?

[Curio]

13 minutes ago, Randomosity said:

Seriously, after all that had gone down, you'd think Killian would have tagged along if for no other reason than to just be in Emma's proximity. He probably would have been perfectly content to sit in the backseat, just happy to be alive and to have Emma. What did he have to do that was pressing enough to keep him in Storybrooke instead?

Hook probably knew it would be insensitive to rub it in Regina's face that he's alive while Robin is dead, but I don't see why Snow or David couldn't have joined them. Snow especially seems to understand Regina on a level that Emma never will, so she would have been an even better person for Regina to whine to in Neal's apartment. I actually would have liked to have seen how those three would have handled that Woe Is Me discussion instead of what we got on screen. When it's just Emma and Regina, Emma reverts into her shell, apologizes for things she shouldn't have to apologize for, and lets Regina walk all over her. But Emma seems to gain a spine when her mother is there, like we saw with the rooftop scene.

Edited May 17, 2016 by Curio

[oliverwendell]

I just watched it, and I'm kind of loving Hyde, gross bloodshot eyes and all. I'm hoping he turns out to be the good guy, and Jekyll the bad guy. Maybe he wants Storybrook because he's actually trying to help the people from the Land of Untold Stories finish their stories and find their happy endings, while Jekyll wanted to come to Storybrook to be all eeeeevil and such?

One way or another, I'm pegging Hyde for Regina's new love interest. I don't think you hire Sam Witwer just to talk in a really low voice and rock Victorian outfits.

 

[Rumsy4]

13 minutes ago, Randomosity said:

Seriously, after all that had gone down, you'd think Killian would have tagged along if for no other reason than to just be in Emma's proximity. He probably would have been perfectly content to sit in the backseat, just happy to be alive and to have Emma. What did he have to do that was pressing enough to keep him in Storybrooke instead?

He sensed that Emma was feeling guilty that he was back alive becasue her BFF was in pain (WTF). So, we have another instance of Killian understanding Emma feels the need to coddle Regina right after Killian has been saved from mortal peril. 

[YaddaYadda]

As a card carrying member of the "I hate Henry" club, and also founder, one thing I've been wondering about is why not have a non magical person talk to Henry, like Snowing or Hook?

Hook especially has suffered a lot because of magic. His brother died because of a magical plant, and his girlfriend got her heart torn out and crushed, watching Emma disappear, sacrificing herself to the darkness, becoming the Dark One himself, dying, and being brought back. 

Logic would dictate that maybe someone who suffered deeply from it, but also understands that magic can be good could have talked him down. Henry in NYC was surrounded by his grandpa who has dark magic, his mother who used to be the Evil Queen and just lost her boyfriend, and the other mom he is clearly really pissed at for whatever reason. An extra person on the trip who gets it might have done some good.

[InsertWordHere]

7 minutes ago, Curio said:

Regina to whine to in Neal's apartment.

Phrasing it like this has just caused me to realize, and I really can't believe I am saying this, how insensitive it is of Regina to sit in the apartment of Emma's dead ex and complain that her life is cursed. 

[Curio]

Well, it doesn't matter now @YaddaYadda, because Henry quickly learned his lesson and this will be the last we hear about wanting to destroy all magic. But I totally agree, I mentioned when the spoilers came out that it seems a bit selfish for all the magical Storybrooke characters to be the ones to talk Henry down, and I'm honestly surprised he didn't bring that up. But the writers probably didn't think about those implications and only wanted to use Henry as a plot device to quickly get to their Jekyll Juice idea.

Quote

Phrasing it like this has just caused me to realize, and I really can't believe I am saying this, how insensitive it is of Regina to sit in the apartment of Emma's dead ex and complain that her life is cursed.

I didn't even realize that when I was typing it out, but that's kind of hilarious irony. Here is Regina, whining about how she thinks her curse is to finally have a conscience and never be happy, when the very apartment she's staying in belonged to Emma's first love, a man who is permanently dead, and the person partially responsible for killing him is Regina's sister. But no, Emma has no idea what you must be going through, Regina.

Edited May 17, 2016 by Curio

[YaddaYadda]

I also like how Emma put an App on her son's phone because his ass runs away. I don't know what that says about the parenting.

[RadioGirl27]

3 minutes ago, YaddaYadda said:

As a card carrying member of the "I hate Henry" club, and also founder, one thing I've been wondering about is why not have a non magical person talk to Henry, like Snowing or Hook?

Hook especially has suffered a lot because of magic. His brother died because of a magical plant, and his girlfriend got her heart torn out and crushed, watching Emma disappear, sacrificing herself to the darkness, becoming the Dark One himself, dying, and being brought back. 

Logic would dictate that maybe someone who suffered deeply from it, but also understands that magic can be good could have talked him down. Henry in NYC was surrounded by his grandpa who has dark magic, his mother who used to be the Evil Queen and just lost her boyfriend, and the other mom he is clearly really pissed at for whatever reason. An extra person on the trip who gets it might have done some good.

Henry seems to idolize Neal (even if he knew him for a couple of days at most and he already knows what he did to Emma), so having Hook or Charming acting like actually good male figures for him would have been counterproductive.

[YaddaYadda]

12 minutes ago, InsertWordHere said:

Phrasing it like this has just caused me to realize, and I really can't believe I am saying this, how insensitive it is of Regina to sit in the apartment of Emma's dead ex and complain that her life is cursed. 

It's not because I wanna beat a horse dead, but Regina also killed Graham. You know how he collapsed right in front of her, and then just died?

Emma doesn't know what it's like to fight the darkness, and she doesn't know what it's like to be on her own and have no hope, or what it feels like to lose friends, first loves, true love. Emma needs to buy a clue.

Edited May 17, 2016 by YaddaYadda

[InsertWordHere]

Regina is what a friend of mine calls a "one-upper." Every bad thing that happens to her is worse than what happens to anyone else. Every good thing that she does is better than anything anyone else does. It's not hard for Emma to be good because she's already good. Regina doesn't have that and that makes her good deeds harder and more noteworthy. 

[Anakerie]

Someone please tell me that Mr. Hyde brought Jareth the Goblin King along to SB.  He can take Snowflake, Pistachio, and Henry back with him. Why not take Alex back with him as well since Cinderella can't remember if she gave birth to a boy or a girl? We could even do a layaway plan for the Baby in the Belle in the Box:  he could make a down payment. I can't see why Jareth would want Henry, but he might make a cute goblin. 

[Shanna Marie]

12 minutes ago, Curio said:

Here is Regina, whining about how she thinks her curse is to finally have a conscience and never be happy, when the very apartment she's staying in belonged to Emma's first love, a man who is permanently dead, and the person partially responsible for killing him is Regina's sister. But no, Emma has no idea what you must be going through, Regina.

This is where Regina's big Pity Me speech that led to wanting to separate and kill the Evil Queen makes about as much sense as the "why don't I get a happy ending when I stopped murdering people" routine in season 4 did. Regina's life really isn't that bad, especially when compared to the heroes (and her victims). What bad stuff has happened to her since she went good at the end of season 2? She had to lose Henry for a year, but she got him back (in spite of him being her "sacrifice" to undo the curse). Then her boyfriend went back to what he thought was his wife for a couple of months, but she got him back when his wife turned out to be Regina's sister. There was the minor complication of Regina's sister being pregnant with Regina's soulmate's baby. Robin was nearly (?) fatally wounded by Percival, but healed and later saved by the Guardians of the Galaxy. And now Robin's dead. Otherwise, Regina lives in a mansion, is still considered mayor and queen. Her victims have forgiven her and consider her to be family and bend over backward to help her. In the Underworld she got to be forgiven by her father, was reconciled with her parents and got to see them move on to heaven, and was reconciled with her sister, who killed her True Love to save Regina. The only bad spot is the Robin stuff, which makes it look yet again as though Regina's happiness and definition of a good life are totally bound up in a man.

Meanwhile, in the same time span, Emma was separated from her parents and made to forget the reason that she was abandoned, so she went back to feeling totally unloved. Her first love and father of her child died in her arms. In the time travel she had to be around her parents while they thought she was a stranger. She was imprisoned in Regina's dungeon and set for execution. The man she loves was nearly killed right in front of her while she was frozen and forced to watch helplessly. Then he was killed again right in front of her in the AU. She took on the Dark One to save the town -- and more specifically, Regina -- and ended up being psychologically tortured and constantly criticized by others for her actions. Just as she managed to fight back against the Darkness and win, her love was mortally wounded and her desperate attempt to save him backfired horribly, so she ended up having to kill him herself. His sacrifice was short-circuited, so his death was in vain. She went to the Underworld to save him and failed, having to lose him yet again. In the Underworld, the people who were important to her life (even if she'd never met them in life) -- her son's grandmother and her uncle -- got thrown into the River of Souls.

Which one of these people is under a curse and facing bad karma from her terrible evil? If that's what they wanted to show us, then maybe they should have framed Robin's death and Hook's return that way -- have Robin's fate have something to do with the price of his life after Percival's attack, so he died as a consequence of Regina's evil and have Zeus give Hook his personal stash of ambrosia since Emma earned it with her true love. But instead, Robin died of the same terminal stupidity Neal suffered from, rushing into a non-critical situation with no plan, while Hook was saved because of his own actions, not because of what Emma did.

So it's really hard to take Regina's whining about suffering seriously. She's never acted like she has the slightest bit of guilt or remorse for what she's done to others, and even in her owning up to what she's done, her only concern seems to be how it makes her feel and what suffering she's going through because of it. It's more "I feel bad because I was evil, and I'm sad that being evil has made my life suck" rather than "I feel bad that I've done so much harm to others."

[kili]

Quote

Logic would dictate that maybe someone who suffered deeply from it, but also understands that magic can be good could have talked him down. Henry in NYC was surrounded by his grandpa who has dark magic, his mother who used to be the Evil Queen and just lost her boyfriend, and the other mom he is clearly really pissed at for whatever reason. An extra person on the trip who gets it might have done some good.

One of them could also have explained that magic is not the only cause of death. Henry was whining that magic killed his father, but his father was also almost killed when he was shot by Tamara. Heck, Henry himself watched a decidedly non-magical David kill non-magical Hook with a non-magical sword. David was nearly fatally wounded by a sword. And magic actually saved Snow from the unmagical death of being burned alive (in this timeline). I don't know what killed Violet's Mom, but living in a medieval world with knights and swords was probably dangerous all on its own. Magic can save lives and protect people. Magic in the wrong hands is the problem. Shouldn't that be the problem he is trying to fix (better mental health care would have stopped Regina from being the Evil Queen).

[tennisgurl]

16 hours ago, vizakenjack said:

also given current time, at least 2 or 3 passerbys would have started recording him, but in no way, it'd have been so easy to persuade everyone to do something

That was what I kept thinking! If some of the passers by did think this was a performance art piece or something (or if you actually buy that people decided to randomly believe in magic on their way to the Churro stand) people would have been recording all this with their phones, and all this would be in Facebook or Instagram or something. One of my favorite things about the Marvel Cinematic Universe is how whenever some weird superhero thing is happening, the crowd around them is half running for the hills, and half recording everything on their phones. The fact that people can record and post all the crazy goings on in the MCU has been made a plot point more than once. That was probably even more unrealistic to me than people actually throwing their penny's into the fountain because of some kid ranting about magic. 

[Mitch]

18 hours ago, Daisy said:

 

Well like I said in a previous post - I think it's because SB has concentrated magic. Land W/O Magic makes sense, if you are an adult, or cynical and all that stuff. so what this is showing (and i am probably giving the show writers  a hell of a lot of credit), Magic can exist anywhere. It's like.. believing in Santa or the Tooth Fairy or the Easter Bunny. it takes a lot of faith + believing and that is inherently magical. So while you can tap that into the LWOM, (like Henry did) or there's Magical Hotspots (the Fountain) it probably takes a hell of a lot of energy to control/maintain it. 

Where as SB - it's just there. you can tap it, you don't have to hunt and gather it up. it's there at your disposal. So ruling SB is akin to ruling any kingdom in the Enchanted Forest: it's everything 

Okay, but why was Regina able to split herself with a magic potion...and then able to pull out a heart, and then the EQ floated over to the Dragon and pulled his heart out if there is no...or hard to find magic in the LWOM? I realize Emma in magic..but does everyone else know this as she makes chains appear on the EQ? Is this a retread of S2 "Magic works differently here" when Regina couldn't get her mojo going but then its like,"Oh no it doesnt!" I wish people would quit asking the producers if "Rumbelle has a future" ..or "Are Hook and Emma going to go sofa shopping soon," and ask them "Please explain your rules of magic..you do know that nothing makes sense and it is fairly obvious you don't know what the hell you are doing..."

[Shanna Marie]

They didn't really resolve that "magic is bad and must be stopped!" plot. When you look at it, the progression was like:

-- "Magic has caused nothing but problems and everything would be better if it were destroyed!"
-- "Smooth move, kid. You've just trapped your grandparents, your aunt, and your stepdad in another world."
-- "Everyone, make a wish and believe in magic!"

There's no reason for Henry's turnaround other than the unintended consequences. It's not like he changed his mind about magic or saw the good magic could do. It was just that he'd ended up depriving himself of people he wanted in his life.

As is so often the case in this show, it's not really about what's good or bad, right or wrong. It's about how something affects the main characters.

I wonder what happened to Maleficent while magic wasn't working in Storybrooke. She couldn't leave town because she wouldn't exist without magic. Are they going to have to reconstitute her yet again, or did she come back once they brought the magic back?