GH In The News: The PC Press Club

[Sake614]

you know it's funny how things change. Ron was so terrified that people wouldn't like the OLTL finale (cast and crew) that he almost didn't go to the screening party. He seemed like a great guy and very modest. I'm sure there was an ego hiding in there, but I never would have guessed he'd become Frankenstein's Monster.

[jsbt]

He had it by then, but it was not nearly as bad as it got after these guys 'saved' GH (which they did, up to a point). Ron only got really prickly in public back then when it came to the rapemance story with "Todd II"/Victor Lord Jr.  and Marty Saybrooke, or the Fords or Rex and Gigi, IMO.

 

He also shadowed TWOP and, I was told, the old SOC column I used to write, which often devolved into a lot of semi-coherent ranting about Victor and the Fords in the last couple years. So I'm pretty sure that guy hates my ass.

Edited July 24, 2014 by jsbt

[dubbel zout]

I'm pretty sure that guy hates my ass.

 

I hope you wear that as a badge of honor, jase!

Edited July 25, 2014 by dubbel zout

[Chairperson Meow]

I just want to know what I have to do to get blocked.

Example, he tweeted about Franco and I said straight up dude why is Roger Howarth playing a shit role. All he said was no it's a great role. I then said I hope he gets a better job. He was like I'll tell Roger. I said please do. Next day, the whole thing is deleted. So he will delete my tweets but I'm not blockworthy. Saddening.

[jsbt]

I hope you wear that as a badge of honor, jase!

 

I dunno about that. I started that gig because I really adored what he was doing in late 2007 and early 2008, and I thought OLTL was frankly better than it had been in many, many years and I wanted everyone to know about it. It was pretty much a rollercoaster of high highs and low lows from then on, but it was never like this at GH. I don't hate the guy or his work, but it's definitely a very different feeling. And I often couldn't be nearly as vulgar or obnoxious as I am here or was at TWOP (or SON). 

Edited July 25, 2014 by jsbt

[Chairperson Meow]

I just recognized you as jacebot. I've been wondering who you were. I was like these posts look familiar. We used to disagree on Roger Howarth lol.

[Fylaki]

 

you know it's funny how things change. Ron was so terrified that people wouldn't like the OLTL finale (cast and crew) that he almost didn't go to the screening party. He seemed like a great guy and very modest. I'm sure there was an ego hiding in there, but I never would have guessed he'd become Frankenstein's Monster.

 

He had it by then, but it was not nearly as bad as it got after these guys 'saved' GH (which they did, up to a point). Ron only got really prickly in public back then when it came to the rapemance story with "Todd II"/Victor Lord Jr.  and Marty Saybrooke, or the Fords or Rex and Gigi, IMO.

How supervised by the network were he and Frank back then. I tend to agree that when they are "on" Gh is better then it has been in years, but they are like two teen age kids who the longer they are left unsupervised the more they regress.

[Chairperson Meow]

Also, I tend to think Erika and Robin would have put them in their places.

Dorian Lord and Viki Buchanan yelling at them makes me smile.

[Fylaki]

 

Also, I tend to think Erika and Robin would have put them in their places.

Dorian Lord and Viki Buchanan yelling at them makes me smile.

Yes over there they would have, sadly at GH only TG and MB would  have the power to do that and Ron/Frank keep feeding those two egos to much. Today was not bad (see episode thread) but some one at Disney is going to need to take control. I have seen reports that GH is actually a pretty low cost show to produce, instead of running a vanity project Ron and Frank need to capitalize on this and begin to tie the show into the greater Disney Community. There have been hints that Grey's takes place in the same universe, roll with that and assume that scandal does as well, why not Nashville if we can't get JJ back as then a guest shot as Avery would sky rocket things. Avery could sing at next's years nurses ball...the resemblance well that is just like Noah Drake and Eli Love. Tie GH into the center of the ABC Universe given the generally unreal nature of the show it is the perfect place to cross-pollinate on the cheap neither Agents of SHIELD, Once Upon a Time nor Revenge would be so outlandish they could not fit into the GH world.

 

instead Ron and Frank write bad fan fiction, exploit children and ruin history all in the name of saving the show

Edited July 25, 2014 by Fylaki

[jsbt]

I am very used to Nancy Lee Grahn's way of doing interviews and her love for banter, but I can't be the only one who found this awkward.

[dubbel zout]

TG and MB might have influence over their own stories, but I highly doubt they can change the overall direction or tone of the show.

[Stinger97]

It swerved in and out of the awkward lane a couple times, but I didn't think it was a train wreck or anything. I love NLG, but sometimes I think she's a little too quirky/zany for her own good. And I think WD is just along for the ride. 

[dubbel zout]

It cracked me up how deVry kept trying to reel her in and then basically gives up.

[OnceSane]

I love NLG, even when she comes off as at least 20% BSC.

 

 

It cracked me up how deVry kept trying to reel her in and then basically gives up.

 

Me too! 

Edited July 25, 2014 by OnceSane

[ulkis]

Methinks Nancy was a bit buzzed on the devil's poison.

 

this made me laugh though

 

Grahn: That's right, he doesn't have a house of his own. The rich, big-shot mobster!
deVry: [Laughs] He lives at his sister's place.
Grahn: That is so...hot.

 

Edited July 25, 2014 by ulkis

[TarHeelTeacher]

It cracked me up how deVry kept trying to reel her in and then basically gives up.

 

It cracked me up too. That interview reminded me of every couple I know who has been together for decades. I laughed and laughed.

[Harmony233]

Are we allowed to discuss backstage rumors we have heard?

[KerleyQ]

I would think so, as long as you spoiler-tagged any parts of it that might relate to upcoming events on air. 

[OnceSane]

 

Are we allowed to discuss backstage rumors we have heard?

 

I vote yes, & IA w/ @KerleyQ .  Just tag potential spoiler-talk.  I miss the Behind the Soaps drama thread that was locked long ago on TWoP.

Edited July 25, 2014 by OnceSane

[Stinger97]

I'd say that rumors are fine, so long as you attempt to provide a source for them. I don't want this to devolve into, "My cousin's first boyfriend who works on GH said he saw Ron and Frank pushing random old ladies down flights of stairs." 

[Harmony233]

I know this is a dumb question but how do you do spoiler tags?

 

If you edit this post, you'll see. Simply highlight whichever text you'd like to spoiler tag, and then click the "Do Not" symbol to the right of the text box. Incidentally, if you watch Big Brother, it's also in the same shape as the Power of Veto. 

 

ETA: Keep in mind that this thread is mostly for backstage rumors. If you'd like to discuss spoilers that'll soon be appearing on screen, the better place for them is in the spoiler thread. However, if the rumors somehow implicate an occasional spoiler, it's probably fine here. -- S97

Edited July 25, 2014 by Stinger97
Spoiler instructions!

[jsbt]

There is, however, some stuff we can't necessarily source without compromising people. There always has been.

[GHScorpiosRule]

My .02 for whatever it's worth. I'm hoping this doesn't morph into a gossip fest, where what is heard or told isn't substantiated, like Stinger stated, or just a bunch of tweets and retweets.

[Stinger97]

There is, however, some stuff we can't necessarily source without compromising people. There always has been.

 

Then I guess use your best judgment. If it starts to become an issue, we'll recalibrate. 

[OnceSane]

IA about the tweets, @GHScorpiosRule .  Maybe we can have a separate thread for tweets/FB posts.

[Stinger97]

Let's keep the thread as is and see if a Twitter/FB post thread becomes necessary. I'd rather not create another subthread if it makes more sense to keep all the backstage discussion housed in one thread. That said, if you're posting tweets/FB posts, please make sure you're adding some discussion beyond simply posting someone's Twitter feed (and if you're doing that... just provide a link (w/ discussion)).

[KerleyQ]

I'd say that rumors are fine, so long as you attempt to provide a source for them. I don't want this to devolve into, "My cousin's first boyfriend who works on GH said he saw Ron and Frank pushing random old ladies down flights of stairs." 

 

I heard it was actually only old ladies holding babies or puppies.   Things get SO distorted when they go through various sources. 

[WendyCR72]

I agree if there must be such a gossip thread, cite a source or, if you can't? Err on the side of caution and refrain from the unsubstantiated (stuff without a source), as such posts can lead to issues for any given site. Not that it would necessarily happen here, but one never knows who is reading. This is just my take, personally, on the matter.

[Badsamaritan]

I've been blocked by Ron. I posted something on my feed asking where are the parents of these kid actors and why are they allowing their children to act like 40 year olds. He responded and told me to lighten up & used my government name like he know me. I suggested he lighten up on the kiddie stories and show grown folks stories more than once a month. The next time I looked he had blocked me. The feeling of pride that came over me made me feel like I'd just taken a bullet of love to the head.

If that's not the definition of petty I don't know what is. So in other words, getting Ron to block you is pretty much a crapshoot. Kinda like how he writes.

[Fylaki]

 

I've been blocked by Ron. I posted something on my feed asking where are the parents of these kid actors and why are they allowing their children to act like 40 year olds. He responded and told me to lighten up & used my government name like he know me. I suggested he lighten up on the kiddie stories and show grown folks stories more than once a month.

More and more I am freaked out by the Kid story line and Ron's re-action. There is a Prince of Pop vibe, where there does not seem to be a realization as to what is and what is not appropriate for children, and the kid actors parents are caught up in that same web as those kids were, where speaking out will not benefit them (Though I would be like screw it and screw this whole career and get away from my kid before I hurt you muthafucker)

 

That is not saying Ron or anyone is doing anything wrong, just like there was never evidence to prove wrong doing on Mickey J's part, just a very clear understanding that this person had no idea what is and what is not right for children

[Stinger97]

Folks, we're treading some very murky water. Please stop intimating that the head writer has some ulterior motive with the children on the set. It's uncalled for. You may not like the characters the children are playing, but it's squicking me out that we're now "subtly" suggesting that Ron is somehow a pedophile. I, along with the rest of your fellow posters, can read between the lines. 

 

Moreover, the topic of this thread includes the tweets of those folks working on GH and does not include your tweets that ultimately got you blocked by GH employees. 

[Ambrosefolly]

While I will take Kin story with a grain of salt, it must suck for long time cast members that they have little input on their characters unless their name is Tony Geary ( I have a feeling that RoHo and MB no longer have this luxury), especially when the writer is as plot driven as RC. I get it, actors have a job to do, but at the same time they have been playing the character for a really long time and I think they should be entitled to a little control.

 

How is Elizabeth Korte's writing? She has been with General Hospital for a super long time and has worked as a head writer for the show, however briefly, and holds the rank of associate head writer currently. Is there some reason she was never promoted to long term head writer, talent wise? Or is it some sort of political thing, like how Garin Wolf became head writer twice because he was willing to cross the picket line (according to Karen Harris)?

 

Another observation, while Dillon/Georgie started floundering when Guza/JFP noticed how popular they were becoming, I think that Georgie as a character really started taking the hit not only when Lulu debuted, but when Michael Cinquemani left in 2005, meaning she started getting a lot less screen time. (He was dubbed One Good Writer by TWOP).

[ulkis]

I think Elizabeth Korte is fine to good, at least as a script writer, although a lot of people dislike her because she has a strong pro-Carly bias. I don't think we'd want her as head writer though cause it would turn into Carly's world (more so).

Edited July 26, 2014 by ulkis

[GHScorpiosRule]

While I will take Kin story with a grain of salt, it must suck for long time cast members that they have little input on their characters unless their name is Tony Geary ( I have a feeling that RoHo and MB no longer have this luxury), especially when the writer is as plot driven as RC. I get it, actors have a job to do, but at the same time they have been playing the character for a really long time and I think they should be entitled to a little control.

 

 

I disagree. Unless they're putting in some of their own money into the show, have a stake in the show, as in, own a part of it, they have no say in how their character is written. Bottom line, this is a business, and the actors don't own the characters, no matter how long they have played them. I've seen this same argument over in the Facts of Life thread, that the actresses who played Blair, Tootie, Jo and Natalie should have had a say in how their characters were written based solely on the fact that they'd been playing them so long. Same answer. It's a business, and they get paid to act and read the lines.

 

They can make suggestions...talk with the writers, but ultimately, the writers will write how they want to write. It would be nice if the current crop of writers, wrote well and true to the characters.  But like someone else posted, writers no longer sit together and discuss the show/script. They're all scattered and communicate by email; that is one writer doesn't know what the other has written or something like that. And that's also a HUGE part of the problem.

[WendyCR72]

I don't think we'd want her as head writer though cause it would turn into Carly's world (more so).

 

Which we did see first-hand when Korte/MVJ shared head writing duties for a nanosecond back in 2001 - between Guza leaving and Megan McTavish showing up. It was the Carly versus Liz follies, (remember the Face of Deception wars?) and it was AWFUL!

[Fylaki]

Hmm should actors have input......This is hard to answer on a soap. On the one hand the Blair, Jo and Facts of Life reference falls short because as I have said before IMHO soaps have got to have the conceit that these are real people. We never thought Tootie was a real person. And they are perhaps closer to live plays (weren't some early soaps done live? ) then scripted TV. On the other hand if an actor is given too much freedom with a character than things can run wild based on their egos (I am looking at you TG as much as I love Luke)

 

A balance is needed. And the balance on GH has been out of whack for a long time. It titled out way before Ron got here. Guza's unholy Trinity. Tony's long (far to long) vacations and assorted other things sent the show out of balance. Truth is when Ron and Frank first got here they restored some balance. The problem seems that the longer they stay the more unbalanced the show becomes.

 

I fall back on what I suggested before that Soaps need a Chief Historian more than a chief writer. The Historian could over rule the writer in favor of the actor or the actor in favor of the writer. Further new charterers would need to integrate on the canvas with respect to the history of who they are dealing with (For example IMHO McBain made sense for Sam, she likes 'dangerous men" Jax, Sonny and Jason. Boring doctor Silas did not fit her type...which by the way historically is not all that different then her mothers:  Julian, Ric, Sonny, Jerry.The writer forced the pairing based on the actors not the history of the character of Sam or Kiki would have worked with Michael if she had kept her original bad girl attitude which would have played off how stiff and formal Mikey holds himself unless his temper pops ) . A show historian could give actors input: For example giving TG one last tour de force playing a dual role is fine, allowing him to destroy the historic character of Bill, if that is who he turns out to be, or to make Tracy look like a fool n the process, is not.

 

And YES all the writers should have to live near thier job communicating via email is not the wya to write a soap and Disney should not allow it. If you dont want to move to LA to work on GH, well let's face it there are want to be TV writers on every corner of Hollywood

[Ambrosefolly]

They can make suggestions...talk with the writers, but ultimately, the writers will write how they want to write. It would be nice if the current crop of writers, wrote well and true to the characters.

 

That the thing, it really sucks that the writers/producers can continue writing this slop and having characters acting out of character, not giving a shit about the history or not having the characters move on for past grievances and are pretty safe in their jobs. Thats my deal, the actors always have to worry about their jobs, even if they were partially responsible for making the show the phenomenon that was (Tristan Rodgers, Leslie Charleston, Genie Francis, among others) but the head writers and executive producers can pull whatever crap they want, but if they are credited with "saving" or "keeping" the show on the air, no matter how dubious that claim is, they are locked in. Guza/JFP were pretty awful in their own right, but kept their jobs for a good decade, because their bosses never put the fear that their staff and cast had. 

 

And that is pretty much since the 2000s, because when the networks gave a crap about the success of the show, they were willing to change things up and weren't as afraid to get rid of head writers or producers if that is what it took.

 

I think TR's Robert Scorpio is a good example. I heard somewhere that he and Fiona Hughes did not want to be paired together, but I believe Gloria Monty overruled them and in that case she was right to do so. On the other hand, TR wasn't happy with his return in the 2000s, so it makes me think he might have mentioned to Guza/JFP that Robert would never abandon Robin the way the show wrote him, but he played it anyways as he probably needed the work and in that case TR was the one that was right, but Guza/JFP managed to keep their jobs for the next several years. 

Edited July 26, 2014 by Ambrosefolly

[Fylaki]

 

Guza/JFP managed to keep their jobs for the next several years.

I wonder if that is because the PTB at the network really don't think there are other people capable of doing the job or if because they have reached the point with soaps (especially now that on ABC GH is the Last Man Standing ..wait that's a different show) that they just don't care,

 

I'd love to see a reality show called "I could write a soap" it would scare the hell out of Ron and Guza and others when they discovered many of the fans could write this better than they can

[SlovakPrincess]

I don't think actors should get to dictate what their characters do, and sometimes they do just have to be told "no, this is what works better for the story."   But their opinions should be given some consideration by the people running the show.  As with everything, it's a judgement call and a question of balance.

 

The actors do end up being the face of the show - to the public, if not within the industry where everyone knows who is really responsible for the storylines on the show.  When the writers make the characters look ridiculous, it's the poor actors who wind up being mocked on The Soup and Chelsea Lately.  That can't feel good.

(Ok, sometimes it's their own acting that gets them into trouble, but often it's not).

 

Also, it's got to be galling to be one of the actors who has been on the show forever, and the writers who have maybe only a few years experience with the character are ruining the goodwill that your character used to have with the audience, and they just don't care that you are being sent on set every day to look foolish.  Or that the more unhinged of your fans are now writing to you, like "I USED TO LOVE YOU - WHY THE HELL DOES CARLY SUCK SO MUCH NOW?!!  CAN'T YOU DO SOMETHING?!"  I've read that soap actors can get some psychotically vicious "fan" mail.

 

I fall back on what I suggested before that Soaps need a Chief Historian more than a chief writer. The Historian could over rule the writer in favor of the actor or the actor in favor of the writer.

 

Yes!

[GHScorpiosRule]

Hmm should actors have input......This is hard to answer on a soap. On the one hand the Blair, Jo and Facts of Life reference falls short because as I have said before IMHO soaps have got to have the conceit that these are real people. We never thought Tootie was a real person.

 

Sorry, have to disagree with you, Fylaki, because to me, not just Tootie, but Jo, Natalie and Blair were real people to me. I'm a girl, and these characters were portrayed as real girls, girls I could relate to, in terms of attitude and looks (body types, looked real, and not stick figures). I was maybe a year older than Tootie when that show premiered and grew up watching it. Hell, those characters are more real to me than the characters on this show. And I'll leave it at that, before we veer too much into off topic territory.

[Rancide]

Okay, re-editing in what I'd said because someone had already "liked" it.  If backstage gossip stuff is allowed, I'd prefer a separate thread for that and another one for people's opinions about show management (e.g. writing, directing, budgeting, scheduling, etc.)  They seem to me to be two different topics and some people might be interested in one but not the other.

Edited July 26, 2014 by Rancide

[Fylaki]

GHScropiosRule not to go off topic but I will concede the Facts of Life Girls as real. Monica, Chandler, Ross, Rachel, Phoebe and Joey were real for me. Point taken.

 

back to topic

[yowsah1]

Guza/JFP managed to keep their jobs for the next several years. 

 

Much of the reason for this is that Guza managed to get in good and tight with Brian Frons (notice how the departures of Frons and Guza very nearly coincided) and JFP also has/had "friends in high places".

Edited July 27, 2014 by yowsah1

[cheyz]

 

But like someone else posted, writers no longer sit together and discuss the show/script. They're all scattered and communicate by email; that is one writer doesn't know what the other has written or something like that. And that's also a HUGE part of the problem.

 

Have none of these folks ever heard of Google Docs? Teleconferencing? IM?

 

There is no reason for them not collaborating, not knowing what the others have written. They should have a database of old stories/characters to look at, wiki software is free. For that matter, regular Wiki has most of this info, and it is mostly accurate.

[yowsah1]

Have none of these folks ever heard of Google Docs? Teleconferencing? IM?

 

I'm sure they all do, but really, there is no substitute for people working in physical proximity to each other when it comes to maintaining a free flow and cross-pollination of ideas.

[Sake614]

It's been years since writers sat in The same room as each other to work on soaps. At the OLTL finale party, a couple of the writers said they had never even met the other writers. I was dumbfounded. These people had no idea who their coworkers were, they were first introducing themselves at the party. I'm not even sure they'd met Ron before that day.

[KerleyQ]

I don't think actors should get to dictate what their characters do, and sometimes they do just have to be told "no, this is what works better for the story."   But their opinions should be given some consideration by the people running the show.  As with everything, it's a judgement call and a question of balance.

 

 

I agree with this.  They shouldn't get a free pass to run rough shod over the writers just because they "know" their character best.  But, the writers should be willing to listen and consider their take if they feel strongly that their character would not act in a certain manner.  You can't let someone who's popping into the writer's or producer's office on a weekly basis sway you, but if someone who doesn't generally complain speaks up and says "hey, I know I'm just the actor, but, after playing this character for 20 years, I firmly believe that she would NEVER do this, and here's why..." then I think the writer needs to at least engage in a conversation to try and get to a point where the story can go on but the actor doesn't think their character is being ruined to move the story along.  But, ultimately, it is up to the writer, because they're the ones who have to take responsibility for what's on the page, and if their continued employment is at least partially contingent on the quality of their writing, then the writing we see on our screens should theirs.  

 

The nature of this business is that you have a LOT of actors who have been around playing the same character through multiple writing regimes, spanning many years, even multiple decades.  So they are going to know their characters more completely than some writers will.  A good writer will take that input into consideration, weigh it against their planned story line, and figure out what is best for the show.  A bad writer will either ignore all instances of input from actors or let some actors dictate whatever they want.  

 

It's been years since writers sat in The same room as each other to work on soaps. At the OLTL finale party, a couple of the writers said they had never even met the other writers. I was dumbfounded. These people had no idea who their coworkers were, they were first introducing themselves at the party. I'm not even sure they'd met Ron before that day.

 

 

I live in the Chicago area.  A guy my husband used to work with has been in a relationship for years with a woman who is on the writing staff of Y&R.  She lives and works out here and ventures out to L.A. here and there.  (And my husband's former co-worker gets to go to the Daytime Emmy ceremony every year, which is so cool). 

[WendyCR72]

Much of the reason for this is that Guza managed to get in good and tight with Brian Frons (notice how the departures of Frons and Guza very nearly coincided) and JFP also has/had "friends in high places".

 

Well, it also didn't hurt that these Three Stooges had history with each other long predating GH. In the '80s, Brian Frons was VP of NBC Daytime and (back when he had some hair) he made a guest appearance on Santa Barbara as...wait for it...God, when Mason/his split personality Sonny Sprockett was shot and went to heaven. JFP was the EP. and Guza was a staff writer (as were Patrick Mulcahey and Michele Val Jean, among others) at one point writing under Charles Pratt.

 

So, as you can see, the inbred nature of daytime employees and their buddy system goes back for DECADES. It's no wonder so many get away with so much even when shows turn to shit. Sadly.

[jsbt]

I agree it's a dangerous buddy system. I think Michele ValJean is a brilliant writer, but I remember her going on quite a bit in some recent interviews about how Bob Guza got a bad rap, that there were many external pressures on him from the network in his second run. And I'm sorry, I know Guza and Frons did differ on any number of things, but the fact is that no writer was better served under Brian Frons than Bob Guza, and Bob Guza's GH was very much his singular vision.

 

Same thing with Karen Harris - brilliant writer, long history. Loved her work on PC too. But when Guza was dismissed and Garin Wolf was promoted she went on a fairly embarrassing Twitter whinefest about the new guy and how terribly misunderstood Bob was. I thought it was horribly tacky, and I mean, come on - I get that these people are friends, that they've worked together decades. I know they know the man better than we ever possibly could, but I also know that in this industry the relationships often (understandably) come first. Speaking as an audience member, though, the way I see it these are women who, IIRC, were both there under Claire Labine. They know what the show looked like then and how it ended up by the time Guza left. I think Bob Guza had a lot of brilliance in him, but he went sour years ago.

It's been years since writers sat in The same room as each other to work on soaps. At the OLTL finale party, a couple of the writers said they had never even met the other writers. I was dumbfounded. These people had no idea who their coworkers were, they were first introducing themselves at the party. I'm not even sure they'd met Ron before that day.

 

I didn't know it was that disconnected. I do know it was supposed to be something of a recent novelty when OLTL 2.0 went to Connecticut and they showed the writers' room, with everyone together in the same place.

Edited July 27, 2014 by jsbt

[Fylaki]

More and more I am opposed to the very idea of a head writer. It seems they all begin brilliant and end badly, some more rapidly then others. Maybe it should be a "show runner" some one who has a general idea where things are going, but who must collaborate with Actors, Writers, and Directors.

 

Overall though I fear that Soaps are a doomed genre if some head writer/show runner/producer (and yes I am looking at you Ron and Frank) do not tie them into the greater TV Community. Gone are the days when soaps could exist in thier own little world. Cross Pollination over multi-media is needed> ABC is never going to give GH the kind of marketing budget that it needs but Ron and Frank could do more, Instead of blocking people on twitter how about getting on one of these boards and engaging? You dont need to take every suggestion that is made, but for the genre to last you need to take your fan base seriously.