S01.E02: Episode 2

[Glade]

Quote

 

Ivy chances to trust again, only to be betrayed, and the investigation into the missing girl raises more questions about Ivy's time in captivity.

 

 

[Glade]

I was really disgusted watching the arrogant, condescending, victim-blaming bitch of a detective go after Ivy.  When actually, I think what Ivy said is completely consistent with what the CCTV camera showed, when you take into account her perspective.  She said "he was always with me, there was no opportunity to escape."  And that is perfectly valid, because it can FEEL like you abuser is constantly with you, you can be extremely afraid, paranoid, and anxious due to all of the years of abuse to the point where you see no way out.  And then when her boss validates it and they all seem to agree that she could be 'abetting a serial killer,' if she's too traumatized to answer all of their questions in the way they want a few days after escaping from this hell...it's fucking insane.   

 

I'm really not feeling the 'cop' aspect of this show, and wish someone would get Ivy a lawyer to protect her from this bullshit.  But otherwise, I think it does a great job of showing Ivy's C-PTSD after everything she experienced.  How, quite understandably, she ab-reacts and is not present or generally able to deal with the reality of her situation, but is of course looking for the life she had dreamed of reclaiming for all those years of captivity, and doesn't understand how much she's changed and how those fantasies can't come true.  Of course her family and old friends also have fantasies built up which Ivy herself can't fulfill.  Her time spent with Tim, though, is magic, as their interaction is multi-layered. 

[missmontyp]

I agree with you.  The story of that boy who was kidnapped here in the US and escaped came to mind when I watched this.  I won't say his name as I am happy he has moved on with his life and is recovering now.  I'm sure lots of people remember the story.  He said in an interview that he was allowed out to ride bikes with his friends, allowed to go watch movies at friends' houses and even had a parent ask him if the missing boy on the tv was him.  He said no.   It is very believable that Ivy would walk to the bathroom and come looking for her captor afterwards.  When I think about all the changes in life in 13 years.  Even if that video was taken when she was only 7 or 8 years gone the world had changed.  

[wayne67]

I think Ivy is seriously dodgy and manipulative and I don't trust her story at all. 

[atomationage]

Ivy looked like a wife in one of those cults in that video.   Marc White had her trained to come back to him by then.   The police frequently get things wrong, in real life and TV.   Her reactions to some of the other male characters might indicate that she worried about getting punished if she looked at another man.   At first I thought she was just afraid of men, but she wasn't afraid of DI Elliot.

Edited March 24, 2016 by atomationage

[formerlyfreedom]

This episode is scheduled to air in the US on Thursday, June 30, on BBC America.

[Primetimer]

After many, many, MANY more interviews with the police, lies are revealed before a shocking ending.

View the full article

[HeatherinThailand]

When Kim first talked about this on EHG, I was like "This show is my JAM!" But after bingeing it (I live overseas), I was disappointed to discover it's basically a how NOT to run an investigation like this rather than a compelling mystery. I would be a lot more annoyed by it if they didn't point out in the first episode that "there is no protocol for this type of thing." This is the very opposite of a victim-centric investigation. The repeated questioning by the police, the lack of psychological presence during questioning, and don't even get me started on how fast they start treating the victim like a suspect. It's good and worth the watch, but I am happy to report that, at least in the human trafficking and sexual abuse sector in other parts of Britain, this is not an accurate portrayal of how all police actually handle these types of situations.

[Lemons]

Are those British songs they are playing or songs written for the show?  Is the lead actress well known in England?

[kat165]

I loved the segment where Ivy plugs the ipod into a speaker and starts dancing and then eventually Tim joins her. So well acted & kind of joyous.

Yeah, these cops, for the most part, really are schmucks.

Edited July 2, 2016 by kat165

[Portia]

I really, really want  to love this show, but the terrible work being  done by all the "professionals" associated with Ivy's case is really straining mt credulity. It's a fscinating premise  for a show. I think it strongly  parallels the case of Elizabeth  Smart, the young Mormon girl abducted by a religious zealot and his wife. She was taken out in public multiple times and didn't  flee. As far as I know, no one ever blamed her. 

[Ms Lark]

I haven't been spoiled, so this is just my theory, but I think Phoebe (10 years old) may be Ivy's child. Ivy would have been 16 at the time. Baby may have been taken away from her at birth and was told she died, but actually adopted out by Marc. That's why Marc kidnapped Phoebe. She's his daughter. Plot could go anywhere from there.

I hate the cops on this show. Elliot is less hateable, but he's seriously flaky when it comes to dealing with Lisa. They are handling, as many have pointed out, this case all wrong. Victim-blaming at its worst.

[Mabinogia]

I am actually really loving this show. The lead actress is amazing and captivating and the story if fascinating. I can't stand Detective Lisa, but I assume we're not really supposed to like her. I do wish they had not gone with that terribly cliché argument leading to a kiss because THE FUCK! But if I just ignore the detective story other than where it pertains to Ivy, the show is fascinating.

My heart breaks for all concerned. Ivy, obviously, because she spent literally half her life with her abductor. Yes, Lisa, that fucks you up. I wish they would ask more direct questions like "so, did he threaten you if you left him? Did he tell you your family didn't want you back? is that why you didn't run?" But Lisa clearly has an agenda and Elliot is already too attached to Ivy to ask hard questions.

The poor mom is terrified to let Ivy out of her sight, but has pretty much turned Ivy into a captive again, which is heartbreaking but understandable. I think that's what I like, that all of the behavior that, sitting on my couch I can tell is the wrong way to go about things, makes sense in the story. The dad's smile when ivy hugged him said it all. They are all struggling to reconnect and none of them really knows how to do it.

I feel for Tim because, how do you react to the girl you loved basically coming back from the dead. I mean, I'm sure he had to write her off as dead in order to move on with his life. And now she's back. It's not like he ever fell out of love with her. He just had to give her up and move on. But now she's back how do you even process that?

I'm just accepting that the cops are just crappy cops, at least at abduction cases. It happens. The rest of the show makes up for it.

[atomationage]

2 minutes ago, Mabinogia said:

I'm just accepting that the cops are just crappy cops, at least at abduction cases. It happens. The rest of the show makes up for it.

I agree that the cops are supposed to be bad at their jobs.  I watched this back in March, alongside The Family, and old episodes of Hollyoaks which also had a similar story going on last year that is still continuing.  It's funny that Elizabeth Smart was brought up, because I had forgotten about her until the Nancy Grace story here:

http://previously.tv/nancy-grace/read-the-cuts-list-of-nancy-graces-craziest-tv-moments/

[Whimsy]

The thing with Tim, though, is that they were 13 years old. That is not old enough for REAL romantic love. They had puppy love. I get how Ivy is still stuck on it since she probably hasn't really emotionally matured, but I actually don't get Tim in this situation. He has nothing to feel guilty about. It's not like they were engaged or something when she got abducted. 

I was sort of intrigued by Elliot, but then he went and kissed Lisa. She is being such a hard ass and he's trying to shelter Ivy. I don't get his motivation for kissing her.

the actress that plays Ivy is doing a fantastic job. I'm mostly watching for her. 

Oh- and to answer the question above about the music- no those songs are not just for the show. I have that song that Tim played for Ivy. It is Simple Song by the Shins. He said they wore it out, which means the song would've come out before she was abducted. It's from their album Port of Morrow that was released in 2012, so that kinda bugged me. 

[kat165]

Yeah, that kiss bugged me too. Since it's only 5 eps long with no chance of a 2nd series I don't know why they'd thrown that in unless is pays off somehow in the next couple of eps. With only 5 eps it's sort of pointless to add that to the story. I don't really know what Lisa's agenda is. Maybe just to catch the abductor and get Phoebe back? Elliot had mentioned something about her not getting a promotion.

But honestly I'm not interested in the cops or their backstories. Ivy is just so fascinating.

[mansonlamps]

Why is there no chance for a second series?

[AnnaMayWong]

Within This 'Story', I find the the lack of professional psychological support for Ivy puzzling and a bit vexing as well.

[Silje]

15 hours ago, GenL said:

Oh- and to answer the question above about the music- no those songs are not just for the show. I have that song that Tim played for Ivy. It is Simple Song by the Shins. He said they wore it out, which means the song would've come out before she was abducted. It's from their album Port of Morrow that was released in 2012, so that kinda bugged me. 

Tim says "Do you know that song that we wore out? This has been the same for me" so I took that to mean that there was another song they wore out together (perhaps New Slang by The Shins, out in 2001), and Simple Song was one of his newer favorites that he was sharing with Ivy.      

[Whimsy]

Ah. I heard it as "we wore this out", but that makes more sense. 

[lucindabelle]

Yeah even I don't get how there might not be a kind of Stockholm syndrome. It's wrll known that a used  children will often hold hands with and try to appease the parent that abuses them. Her taking his hand and not fleeing means precisely nothing.

[slf]

I was willing to give Lisa the benefit of the doubt last episode because I didn't think her more detached approach was necessarily a problem, nor the suggestion that Ivy might have Stockholm Syndrome. But man. Is Lisa actually jealous of Ivy a little bit? Her looks to Ivy and Elliot, the way she phrased some things, seemed as much about being insecure w/r/t the attachment Elliot and Ivy obviously had to one another as they were about censuring what she sees as Elliot being too emotionally involved. (Possibly combined with career ambition.) 

She's being deeply inappropriate in her treatment of Ivy and many of her suggestions. Being held in captivity would naturally create in Ivy a sense that Marc was always watching her, that she was never alone, as well as a sense of dependency. Especially because she was so young when she was taken. So her looking for him when she came out of the bathroom makes total sense; many victims would be either freaking out at being 'abandoned' or calculating the risks of escape and decided 'he'll find me, there's nowhere to go, he'll punish me, etc'. And of course she lied about it because she understands what that must look like from the outside- there might also be a chance she's mentally berated herself for 'choosing' to go back to him and so is ashamed of the choice (it's been known to happen).

Poor Ivy. As if being abducted and held captive for more than a decade wasn't bad enough, now she has to deal with two idiots handling her case. 

On 7/1/2016 at 11:50 AM, HeatherinThailand said:

It's good and worth the watch, but I am happy to report that, at least in the human trafficking and sexual abuse sector in other parts of Britain, this is not an accurate portrayal of how all police actually handle these types of situations.

I figured it was likely just poor writing but it's nice to have confirmation that British police are more competent than the two dingbats Ivy's stuck with.

This show has a such a powerful concept I just wish the writing wasn't letting it down.

Edited July 7, 2016 by slf

[GinnyMars]

Quote

Lisa    - There's a possibility - and it's just that, a possibility - that Ivy knew Mark White before the abduction. That she had seen him in school.
Elliot    - Why would she lie?
Lisa    - If he was grooming her. If it was a pre-existing relationship that then went sour.

I just... I cannot believe that she used that word, relationship, and neither her boss nor Elliot said: "No, there can be no 'relationship' between an adult man and a 13 yo. No, a 13 yo can not give consent."

I hate her. I hope we are supposed to. The fact that she would even suggest something like that... What, that the child ran away to be with her lover, and then it "went sour" when he kept her hostage for the next 13 years? How does she not hear how messed up that sounds!

I'd wonder if it's going to be revealed that something traumatic happened to her too, and that's why she has such a skewed view of things... but then again, no one contradicted her. Blech.

(I'm enjoying the show, don't get me wrong. But I hope it will validate our feelings of disgust in the end.)

Edited July 8, 2016 by GinnyMars

[lucindabelle]

Hopefully she meant relationship just as condition or connet ion because ugh,

[proserpina65]

Quote

I am actually really loving this show. The lead actress is amazing and captivating and the story if fascinating. I can't stand Detective Lisa, but I assume we're not really supposed to like her

I actually like Lisa a lot more than I do Elliott.  I think someone needs to keep questioning Ivy's version of events because she has lied to them about certain details.  It's understandable, given what she probably needed to do to survive her experience, but I don't think that gives her carte blanche to lie, not when the lack of being truthful might interfere with the police's ability to find the recently kidnapped girl.

[Mabinogia]

My problem with Lisa is not that she doesn't trust Ivy, it's her approach to Ivy. Ivy is a victim. She may have Stockholm, she may be lying her ass off, but Lisa is treating her as if Ivy wanted all of this to happen when she should be approaching Ivy as a victim. Lisa is basically proving what Mark said to Ivy as right. Because Mark probably told her for years that she can't run away because no one would believe her.

I get they are going for the contrast between the two cops, the one hardened cop who trusts no one and treats victims like perps and the kind, gentle cop who feels too much compassion for victims to be objective, but for me it's overly simplified and makes them both the weak link in the story. I much prefer the stuff at the Moxom home, how they are all dealing with Ivy being back and Ivy herself. I am interested in the mystery as far as what poor Ivy went through, but not so much in the manhunt for Mark White and him having kidnapped another girl doesn't change that.

[kat165]

Mansonlamps, I'm sorry that I never answered your question. According to Wikipedia: "On the 27th March 2016, the writer of the series, Marnie Dickens, stated that there won't be a second series of the show."

Which reminds me, because there is only 1 writer on this series I'm just wondering if she doesn't know much about police precedure and what we're seeing as crappy police work is just uninformed writing.

[Jordan27]

Another excellent episode.  The actress playing Ivy is just killing it.  

The family should really have some of kind of counseling for Ivy and them.

Why she is always wearing that long sweater and keeping her hands inside it?  It makes her look really crazy.

[slf]

On 7/12/2016 at 0:17 AM, Jordan27 said:

Why she is always wearing that long sweater and keeping her hands inside it?  It makes her look really crazy.

Probably because it was the first thing she'd had in over a decade that hadn't been given to her by her abductor. She may associate it with safety, as well.

[Ailianna]

On ‎7‎/‎3‎/‎2016 at 9:31 AM, BookElitist said:

Within This 'Story', I find the the lack of professional psychological support for Ivy puzzling and a bit vexing as well.

 

On ‎7‎/‎12‎/‎2016 at 1:17 AM, Jordan27 said:

The family should really have some of kind of counseling for Ivy and them.

In the first episode the police tried to give them counseling, both family and just for Ivy, and the mom very forcefully rejected it.  The police can't really force a victim or family into counseling when they don't want to.

[Jordan27]

That's why I said the family should have the counseling, not the police forcing it on them.

[Ailianna]

And my point was that Christine is so in denial at that point that they refuse a psychologist/psychiatrist/counselor provided free by the government.  Not that it's a cop with no training but that they were offered therapy and turned it down.  So the fact they don't have it has nothing to do with the police, but is entirely their choice.