Spoiler Discussion Thread

[tangerine95]

Maybe MG and WM weren't aware?lol because WM was also surprised when she was told people didn't like WD and Rory was the fave newbie.But idk how a EP wouldn't be aware that bringing in 5 newbies and focusing on them heavily while the screentimes of main characters noticeably dropped,won't be well received.Especially because they already went through backlash over sidelining OTA for new characters and acknowledged it and were surprised by it then as well.

I do think the newbies were mostly WB/DC mandates but to say they were about keeping it fresh and telling new stories is so dumb imo considering they brought it nothing new.Its not like we haven't seen new people join TA and Oliver have to deal with that and its not like we haven't seen new masks develop and train.Dinah is literally a BC number 3,the second character to be called Dinah and the 3rd mask to have a version.of the canary cry.Curtis is a basically supposed to be a male version of Felicity.WD is very similar to Roy.There's literally a scene where the newbies joke about being the new Oliver,Felicity or Digg.

[calliope1975]

32 minutes ago, apinknightmare said:

Given the way they've handled long-term, supposedly life-changing injuries, that doesn't make me feel any better, haha. 

I would greatly appreciate it if that explosion blew out all sonic screaming capabilities though.

Soooo, an episode and a half of long-term consequences. That sounds about right.

 

6 minutes ago, SmallScreenDiva said:

For somebody whose business should include understanding and knowing his audience, he sure does get surprised a lot. 

This entire team of Flarrowverse writers are continually surprised at the audience's reaction and response to characters and story lines. I don't know if it's because of their comic book backgrounds or inability to critique themselves, but it's funny and sad how often they gauge incorrectly. 

[leopardprint]

1 hour ago, Trisha said:

He also said 520 was needed so they could have an adult conversation because "at the end of 415 Felicity just walks out the door and they never really talk about the things that broke them up in the first place."  (I guess we're just supposed to pretend the convos in 416 didn't happen?)

 

What was the adult conversation they had in 520? No, really, what was it? Because Oliver told Felicity he didn't trust himself then later she apologized for being a hypocrite about Helix. How is that addressing anything that happened in 415? There wasn't even any back and forth dialogue. 

Edited June 22, 2017 by leopardprint

[LeighAn]

2 minutes ago, leopardprint said:

What was the adult conversation they had in 520? No, really, what was it? Because Oliver told Felicity he didn't trust himself then later she apologized for being a hypocrite. How is that addressing anything that happened in 415? There wasn't even any back and forth dialogue. 

 

You really must have missed a lot in 5x20 then? 

The entire episode was Oliver and Felicity laying out their problems and what they needed in terms of trust, honesty and communication, while showing them working together to get themselves out of danger by trusting, communicating and being open with one another. 

[JJ928]

I listened to MG's interview too. I am thinking Siren will remain a villain, he said they were going back and forth between her being Team Chase or begrudgingly being team Oliver. He also said how much they loved Evil Laurel & how obvious it was that Katie loved playing that version of Laurel... So until they say otherwise, I think Siren will remain a villain, specifically for Lance & Dinah. I can see them having her help the team out, if it benefited her, and then betraying them.

Edited June 22, 2017 by JJ928

[insomniadreams88]

You know, the thing about any possible redemption arc for Black Siren is that looking at what would come next after that, it's not just about Oliver. Say he decides he's okay with working with her because of... some reason they come up with. That doesn't mean the others will be. And I'm hoping they've gotten to the point on this show that MG/WM/etc. realize that. 

Edited June 22, 2017 by insomniadreams88

[strikera0]

Judging from that podcast interview, it looks like they will be doing another topical episode this year - because the first one turned out to be so frakking awesome. [/sarcasm] I wonder which topic they will be covering this time? Maybe they'll try their hands at rape culture considering that Bill Cosby has been such a big topic the last couple of years. 

 

16 minutes ago, Proteus said:

I never thought that Siren wouldn't be redeemed eventually. There's no way to sustain her as a series regular if she isn't.

That's where I'm at, too. While I am generally not a big fan of that idea, I probably wouldn't even mind a BS redemption arc if she would simply disappear afterwards, but with this gutless writing staff, I worry that they will end up writing her back into her old spot and make her a permanent fixture on Team Arrow as BC version 4,0. 

[LeighAn]

5 minutes ago, JJ928 said:

I listened to MG's interview too. I am thinking Siren will remain a villain, he said they were going back and forth between her being Team Chase or begrudgingly being team Oliver. He also said how much they loved Evil Laurel & how obvious it was that Katie loved playing that version of Laurel... So until they say otherwise, I think Siren will remain a villain, specifically for Lance & Dinah. I can see them having her help the team out, if it benefited her, and then betraying them.

I'm going with seeing is believing too. The way they've written Black Siren has been pretty begrudgingly. They've spent more time using BS as a mouth piece for meta statements on fandom or to mock Laurel as a character or prop other characters then they have building her as a character in her own right. In fact they haven't built her at all. 

 

So so yeah Im not convinced they are going to devote time to redeeming her and if they do they'll half ass it more then likely anyway. 

[apinknightmare]

30 minutes ago, Proteus said:

I never thought that Siren wouldn't be redeemed eventually. There's no way to sustain her as a series regular if she isn't.

Sure there is, depending on how many seasons they're planning on her sticking around. 

[johntfs]

9 hours ago, Proteus said:

I never thought that Siren wouldn't be redeemed eventually.  There's no way to sustain her as a series regular if she isn't.

Why not?  I have two words for you:  Malcolm Merlyn.

At no point was Merlyn ever really "redeemed."  He always pursued his own agendas and aligned with or against Team Arrow based how congruent their goals were with his.

Perhaps Black Siren will find herself feeling a bit of a soft spot for Quentin, but she can still be a destructive criminal.  Also, criminals are frequently in conflict with each other.  Black Siren might provide information to Team Arrow so they'll take out one of her rivals or competitors.  In the mean time, her presence as a regular gives us a bigger window into the happenings on Team Bad Guy.

Edited June 23, 2017 by johntfs

[statsgirl]

But Barrowman is a better actor than KC.  It really looks like they only decided to bring her back as a regular when they saw her play evil in Black Siren.  Redeem her in any way and they're back to the Laurel problem again because KC just doesn't do nuance.  Also for many viewers, Malcolm Merlyn used up his welcome in s3.  He was redeemed somewhat because of this season of LoT but for all Barrowman's skill, MM was a drag from 3A on.  After he make Thea kill Sara and set up Oliver to be killed by Ra's and the horrible Al Sahim story arc, especially leading to the fake killing of all Oliver's friends, I hated everything Malcolm did after that.  But then the writers often miscalculate how much people want to watch the EPs pets.

2 hours ago, Trisha said:

He also talked about being surprised that the new recruits were "polarizing" and "controversial" in 5A,

I guess "controversial" is the new "I hate this so much I'm going to stop watching" as the viewers just kept leaving.  MG also sounded genuinely surprised that they said that the best episode of the season was Underneath.  More evidence that they don't know how viewers will read.  And then, there's the whole Susan thing where they kept saying that she was good while showing her to be very shady.  Just like Samantha in s4 who was supposed to be a caring mother.

MG also said something about them having to add new characters and that they had added new characters before so people calling for OTA shouldn't be upset. But it's not the adding of new characters that people have a problem with so much as whenever they do, Diggle and Felicity have to go stand in the corner and wait till they get a moment in the sun again.

The lesson I really want the EPs to learn is that you can't ask people to swallow grit in the first half of the season because you think they will be happy with the end of it.

1 hour ago, way2interested said:

Yeah, I'm going with someone's in a coma or semi-permanently injured.

My bet is Samantha.  An episode or two of her being incapacitated so that Oliver can bond with Myson and then she takes the kid away so they don't have to write around him.

Edited June 22, 2017 by statsgirl

[Primal Slayer]

2 hours ago, Trisha said:

Just listened to MG's interview on Superhero Radio.  The fact that he says there was a debate among the writers about whether or not Black Siren should side with Oliver or Chase in the finale makes me think she's going to side with Oliver eventually. If she was just a villain with no redemption arc planned, it wouldn't even be a question, right?

What is that crazy talk he is talking? SHE IS A STRAIGHT UP VILLAIN!

[Proteus]

47 minutes ago, apinknightmare said:

Sure there is, depending on how many seasons they're planning on her sticking around. 

 

37 minutes ago, johntfs said:

Why not?  I have two words for you:  Malcolm Merlyn.

At no point was Merlyn ever really "redeemed."  He always pursued his own agendas and aligned with our against Team Arrow based how congruent their goals were with his.

Perhaps Black Siren will find herself feeling a bit of a soft spot for Quentin, but she can still be a destructive criminal.  Also, criminals are frequently in conflict with each other.  Black Siren might provide information to Team Arrow so they'll take out one of her rivals or competitors.  In the mean time, her presence as a regular gives us a bigger window into the happenings on Team Bad Guy.

It didn't work for MM and now he's gone. It was ridiculous how he'd go back & forth with being aligned with the team and then against. 

I just think by the end of s6 Laurel will likely be redeemed if she's sticking around and not keep going back & forth. Or she'll become their Mick Rory.

[catrox14]

1 minute ago, Proteus said:

I just think by the end of s6 Laurel will likely be redeemed if she's sticking around and not keep going back & forth. Or she'll become their Mick Rory.

But she's not Laurel. Laurel is dead. This is an E2 Black Siren. I guess that's why I don't understand here.

[leopardprint]

10 minutes ago, catrox14 said:

But she's not Laurel. Laurel is dead. This is an E2 Black Siren. I guess that's why I don't understand here.

It will be interesting to see if she's written as evil Laurel or an actual, different character also named Laurel Lance. So far, it sounds like she's going to be evil Laurel. It seems like they had the same life then diverged post-yacht. 

Edited June 22, 2017 by leopardprint

[Proteus]

9 minutes ago, catrox14 said:

But she's not Laurel. Laurel is dead. This is an E2 Black Siren. I guess that's why I don't understand here.

I never said she was Earth 1 Laurel. But the character is still named Laurel. MG even said that's what she'll be called next season.

[LeighAn]

Actual convo in the writers room:

"Guys should we make BS cartoon evil team Prometheus or redeemed team Oliver?"

"meh we'll just make her Dinah and Quentins punching bag, knock her on her ass and call it day- who's ready for lunch?" 

I'm sure the extent of their thought process.

[Angel12d]

Petition for E2 Laurel to wear a name badge that says Laurel 2.0. Just for funsies. 

[Mellowyellow]

I wonder what they have for Olicity in S6. I think they were in a great place emotionally end of S5. I wonder if they'll go courting again or just jump into acting married and maybe we'll have a s6 wedding.

Will we be getting interviews/ hints now that they aren't broken up like end of S4?

[catrox14]

7 minutes ago, Angel12d said:

Petition for E2 Laurel to wear a name badge that says Laurel 2.0. Just for funsies. 

I vote for this.

[LeighAn]

2 minutes ago, Mellowyellow said:

I wonder what they have for Olicity in S6. I think they were in a great place emotionally end of S5. I wonder if they'll go courting again or just jump into acting married and maybe we'll have a s6 wedding.

Will we be getting interviews/ hints now that they aren't broken up like end of S4?

Considering what happened this year with Stephen's off hand remarks and jokes happening off screen and the fact that he has never talked about desiring to see Oliver and Felicity married and having babies as much as he has in the last few cons I'm thinking there is a very very strong chance of wedding bells in the imminent future.

 

Im just hoping we get 4A 4B part 1 type blend of romance and action. I liked them quietly together in the background. I never needed them to be showey and melodramatic. Some of my favourite moments from season 4 were Felicity and Oliver having domestic convos over the Comms like about Felicitys code name and Oliver inviting Donna to dinner without telling Felicity.

 

Plus looking forward to seeing more physical affection and contact between them. You know we were deprived when people got excited by  Oliver touching Felicitys shoulder in 5x21 haha.

[Mellowyellow]

Haha I forget which episode but I remember getting all excited Felicity poked Oliver's hand!

I don't think we'll get another sex scene but it's 9pm so I've got this tiny spark of hope and I'm like "You love to pretend to be dark and edgy Arrow, gimme a dirty sex scene"

[johntfs]

57 minutes ago, Proteus said:

It didn't work for MM and now he's gone.

It worked for five years, pretty much.  I seriously doubt this show has five more years in it.  Of course, I'm kind of amazed that Supernatural is still on and is going into Season 13 in the fall.  Honestly, the show-runners would have better off is they'd watched Katie during her run on that show and realized her comfort zone is pretty much "bitchy frenemy" and not much past that (as far as I've seen since I haven't really seen her in much beyond Arrow and Supernatural).  As Black Siren, she'll be fine as bitchy frenemy for the couple more seasons or so this show will run.

[Chaser]

54 minutes ago, Angel12d said:

Petition for E2 Laurel to wear a name badge that says Laurel 2.0. Just for funsies. 

I just an image of BS in a Dunce #2 cap.

[LeighAn]

1 hour ago, Mellowyellow said:

Haha I forget which episode but I remember getting all excited Felicity poked Oliver's hand!

I don't think we'll get another sex scene but it's 9pm so I've got this tiny spark of hope and I'm like "You love to pretend to be dark and edgy Arrow, gimme a dirty sex scene"

Well I was convinced 3x20 would be our one and only sex scene of that nature but then we got 5x20 which pretty much rivalled it. So never say never!

[Starfish35]

I think she'll probably be like season three MM (JB was a series regular that year as well).  Someone who kind of pops in and out, throws down some snark, and has vague and shifting motivations and allegiances.  But I just don't see a full-scale redemption/joining the team scenario being in the cards.  If they do that, they may as well have resurrected E1 Laurel, and what would be the point of that after replacing her with Dinah? I know the argument has frequently been made that The Flash has more than one speedster, so why can't the team have more than one meta with a sonic cry, but in that case, the main speedster is the lead of the show, and we're not looking at a case where one character was kicked off the show, replaced, and then essentially brought back alongside her replacement.  I really do think the Malcolm Merlyn scenario is the most likely.  

2 hours ago, johntfs said:

Why not?  I have two words for you:  Malcolm Merlyn.

At no point was Merlyn ever really "redeemed."  He always pursued his own agendas and aligned with or against Team Arrow based how congruent their goals were with his.

Perhaps Black Siren will find herself feeling a bit of a soft spot for Quentin, but she can still be a destructive criminal.  Also, criminals are frequently in conflict with each other.  Black Siren might provide information to Team Arrow so they'll take out one of her rivals or competitors.  In the mean time, her presence as a regular gives us a bigger window into the happenings on Team Bad Guy.

Yeah this pretty much.

[lemotomato]

Ugh. What if that's exactly why they brought her back-- to replace JB/Merlyn in the ambiguous bad guy role? I'm willing to bet that KC is much cheaper and more available than JB.

[Starfish35]

If they had let Juliana Harkavy go, I'd be much more willing to buy into the redemption arc theory.  But since they kept her....I just don't find it plausible that they would have both Dinah and Black Siren on the same team.  I know the arguments for it, but I'm just not buying it.  *shrug*  It wouldn't be the first time I was wrong, but Laurel didn't work on the team the first time around.  I just can't see why they would try it again, especially since they seem quite happy with her replacement. 

[Angel12d]

As much as I'd rather she wasn't around at all, I'd prefer a dumb Malcolm Merlyn-esque situation with BS than a full-on redemption where she just starts acting like E1 Laurel and joins the team. One canary crier is enough thanks.

Admittedly this means Oliver and the team will probably look stupid for working with her sometimes, just as they did with MM, but meh. Whatever. Not as if that's a new thing.

Edited June 23, 2017 by Angel12d

[BkWurm1]

6 hours ago, Angel12d said:

I took that to mean the explosion has longer lasting consequences other than death. So life changing injury or PTSD. Something like that. 

It will also probably be a bunch of emotional stuff that causes different team members to reflect on their lives and what else they want in life.  Diggle will probably be looking at the risks in his life or maybe return to his concerns about ARGUS.   In Felicity's case, hopefully starting her own company to put out some meaningful product or something that she takes personal pride in that she can share with the world.  Rene, it will be more stuff with his kid.  Dinah, who knows but maybe just trying after years undercover and then out for revenge for some kind of normal life outside of work?  (Cue her past catching up with her, lol)  Oliver will have parent stuff early on.  I wonder if he keeps the Mayorship or if being gone again will get him voted out.  (Frankly the people of Star City should be happy just to have a live Mayor)  Thea also REALLY needs to figure out her life.  I have no clue what they will do with her but I'm sure dead MM will be mentioned.   

4 hours ago, Angel12d said:

Petition for E2 Laurel to wear a name badge that says Laurel 2.0. Just for funsies. 

How about "NotLaurel" tattooed on her forehead?  

[statsgirl]

But she is Laurel!  She's just a different Laurel who we'll have new flashbacks for.

So on Earth2 Oliver never took Sara on the Gambit and he died there and Robert became the Green Arrow?  I guess we'll find out what makes E2 Laurel so bitter that she becomes a villain.  It shouldn't just be Oliver's innocent death.

[catrox14]

13 minutes ago, BkWurm1 said:

How about "NotLaurel" tattooed on her forehead? 

LOOOL. You win.

[LeighAn]

2 hours ago, statsgirl said:

But she is Laurel!  She's just a different Laurel who we'll have new flashbacks for.

So on Earth2 Oliver never took Sara on the Gambit and he died there and Robert became the Green Arrow?  I guess we'll find out what makes E2 Laurel so bitter that she becomes a villain.  It shouldn't just be Oliver's innocent death.

Well if you believe BS sob story in 5x10 losing Oliver turned her to darkness, but something about her telling an already noticeably easy to emotionally manipulate and gullible Oliver and then flipping a bitch switch immediately on Felicity, always left me with the impression she was just making up that whole sob story for Olivers benefit. 

 

If I have to sit through some Siren flash back ep I hope they go full left of centre and make her reasons for going evil something we haven't already predicted. 

[imusuallysweet]

9 hours ago, LeighAn said:

You really must have missed a lot in 5x20 then? 

The entire episode was Oliver and Felicity laying out their problems and what they needed in terms of trust, honesty and communication, while showing them working together to get themselves out of danger by trusting, communicating and being open with one another. 

I guess I missed a lot too. The reason they broke up was never really addressed. At least not on Oliver's end. They framed his actions as right & had her doing all the apologizing. That was bull. & then her entire Helix arc was basically all about him. Not about everything she's been through. That episode to me only benefited one person in the relationship. It should have been rewarding for both individuals. It totally crapped all over Felicity & no their problems aren't fixed. They're still there.

Edited June 23, 2017 by imusuallysweet

[Midnight Lullaby]

8 hours ago, statsgirl said:

 

MG also said something about them having to add new characters and that they had added new characters before so people calling for OTA shouldn't be upset. But it's not the adding of new characters that people have a problem with so much as whenever they do, Diggle and Felicity have to go stand in the corner and wait till they get a moment in the sun again.

 

He said this but also that they added new characters to not repeat SLs..so they did something they did already to not do something they did already, LOL.

Not to be mean but we need new EPs and writers, MG and Wendy in charge (as much as EPs can be) gives me a sense of dread.

I don't know how they can keep BS on the show if they redeem her, not if they don't because there's Dinah. If they redeem BS one of them has to go and I don't think they will go for the 5th new BC in 6 years. If they redeem her I could see her leaving for her earth or another city, if she stays a villain I could see her staying. Of course they might not want to keep her for longer than one season as a regular so there's that too.

[LeighAn]

13 minutes ago, imusuallysweet said:

I guess I missed a lot too. The reason they broke up was never really addressed. At least not on Oliver's end. They framed his actions as right & had her doing all the apologizing. That was bull. & then her entire Helix arc was basically all about him. Not about everything she's been through. That episode to me only benefited one person in the relationship. It should have been rewarding for both individuals. It totally crapped all over Felicity & no their problems aren't fixed. They're still there.

I'm sure for some satisfaction is unacheivable regardless of what the writers chose to do. That's there choice to make- to be satisfied or unsatisfied.

 

That being said from my perspective the episode laid out two very definitive issues. Oliver broke the relationship when lying to Felicity. This caused Felicity to feel Oliver didn't trust her and therefore she struggled to trust Oliver in return.  Both discussed in the 5x20 present and flash backs. 

 

The second issue was that Oliver wanted to fix or address that part of their relationship problems but every time he approached the subject Felicity shut him down, walked away or closed the door in 4x16, 5x05, and the 5x20 flash backs. Something that was brought out in the open in 5x20 and discussed.

The 5x20 flashbacks laid out very specifically what Felicity and Oliver needed to mend the bridge. Felicity said she needed to understand what it was that prevented Oliver from not trusting her enough to keep parts of himself from her like the secret about his son. Oliver said within the 5x20 flashback that he wants to discuss their relationship but Felicity walked away and that he was willing to wait until she was ready to talk which she told him she wasn't and she repeated something similar in 5x05 when he asked if the door was still open.

 

5x20 saw Oliver admit the biggest secret he has to Felicity and why that's crippled he's ability to fully trust and let her in, while Felicity told Oliver she finally understood on even the smallest level what Oliver struggled with by internalising pain and dark experiences. Through out the episode they had to rely on trust open communication and being honest with one another to work together to save them selves from danger thereby putting into action three of the things they struggled with since they broke up- lack of trust, lack of communication, lack of honesty and being a team. 

 

Fans can either hope the writers run a fools errand and give fans who can't  actually articulate what it is that they need as a satisfying resolution of Olicitys problems; or fans can tolerate/or chose not to tolerate that this is the soloution the writers saw fit as a compromise that wraps up both Oliver and Felicitys arch and brings them back to common ground. Because at this point I don't think they are going to budge from the resolution the ended up with nor will they budge from their choice to move on from Olicitys past and work on their future stories.

(Welcome to the board :))

[Midnight Lullaby]

I think it's a matter of priorities..you can't choose to be satisfied, like you can't choose to like something or not. Either you do or don't, it's a feeling. I think if Olicity is your top or towards the top priority than you are more willing to accept the offered resolution, even if it isn't what you would have chosen if it was up to you. (So here I'm not considering the people blaming Felicity since they got exactly what they wanted and didn't have to decide if a compromise was fine by them). And those who didn't really care I guess are happy the drama is over.

I ship Olicity but I don't need Felicity to be with Oliver no matter what. I liked 520 and I enjoyed her arc while it aired but looking at it now, knowing they did it to put her in a position to empathize with Oliver to reconcile Olicity, for me it's a disappointment.

The actors are amazing together, some scenes and stories they wrote for them were great but for me it's not the same anymore and 520, while enjoyable to watch, didn't fix anything for me. It's no big deal, I'm sad I lost that enthusiasm that I used to have about them and the show in general. :(

[LeighAn]

1 hour ago, Midnight Lullaby said:

I think it's a matter of priorities..you can't choose to be satisfied, like you can't choose to like something or not. Either you do or don't, it's a feeling. I think if Olicity is your top or towards the top priority than you are more willing to accept the offered resolution, even if it isn't what you would have chosen if it was up to you. (So here I'm not considering the people blaming Felicity since they got exactly what they wanted and didn't have to decide if a compromise was fine by them). And those who didn't really care I guess are happy the drama is over.

I ship Olicity but I don't need Felicity to be with Oliver no matter what. I liked 520 and I enjoyed her arc while it aired but looking at it now, knowing they did it to put her in a position to empathize with Oliver to reconcile Olicity, for me it's a disappointment.

The actors are amazing together, some scenes and stories they wrote for them were great but for me it's not the same anymore and 520, while enjoyable to watch, didn't fix anything for me. It's no big deal, I'm sad I lost that enthusiasm that I used to have about them and the show in general. :(

I don't have an issue with people who choose to be unsatisfied with how the writers dealt the hand they gave Olicity. If that's how they feel that's how they feel. They have the choice to turn the remote on or off.

 

I guess I do have a retort for responses like the 'writers didn't address anything' or 'didn't resolve anything' or the 'writers blamed it all on Felicity'- which is blatantly not true. It's just that some didn't like or were unsatisfied with the way the writers chose to address Olicity, resolve their issues and have decided to focus their attention on one minor aspect of Felicitys part (the fact that she apologised- not for breaking up with Oliver but for not understanding Oliver's damage as well as she did after experiencing it her self) instead of concentrating on the overall picture which is their trust, lack of communication, honesty and equal partnership and respect.

 

Oliver broke the relationship which the writers have had Oliver vocalise, but the break up itself was a catalyst to greater underlying problems between them that required both of them to work through to get back to common ground. A relationship is a two way street not about keeping score. 

[Midnight Lullaby]

12 minutes ago, LeighAn said:

I don't have an issue with people who choose to be unsatisfied with how the writers dealt the hand they gave Olicity. If that's how they feel that's how they feel. They have the choice to turn the remote on or off.

 

I guess I do have a retort for responses like the 'writers didn't address anything' or 'didn't resolve anything' or the 'writers blamed it all on Felicity'- which is blatantly not true. It's just that some didn't like or were unsatisfied with the way the writers chose to address Olicity, resolve their issues and have decided to focus their attention on one minor aspect of Felicitys part (the fact that she apologised- not for breaking up with Oliver but for not understanding Oliver's damage as well as she did after experiencing it her self) instead of concentrating on the overall picture which is their trust, lack of communication, honesty and equal partnership and respect.

 

Oliver broke the relationship which the writers have had Oliver vocalise, but the break up itself was a catalyst to greater underlying problems between them that required both of them to work through to get back to common ground. A relationship is a two way street not about keeping score. 

You say you don't have an issue but tell people who didn't like it to stop watching the show, LOL. There's so much more on the show than Olicity..if only the people that liked every single thing about the show watched it I don't know how many viewers it would have..I guess not a lot since the show is about lots of things and everyone has different tastes.

I think the "greater underlying problem" was someone the writers thought about in season 5 so I don't find it all that compelling.

I don't need Oliver and Felicity to be together and if I could have chosen I would have picked them going their separate ways and her arc not being about understanding Oliver over what we got and them back together.

You have a different perspective because Oliver and Felicity together is clearly important for you. We disagree not because one of us doesn't understand how a relationship is supposed to be but because we have different preferences of what we would like to see on screen. And there's nothing wrong with that.

[Hiveminder]

I agree that the show never portrayed Felicity as 'at fault' for the breakup. None of the characters, especially Oliver, ever said anything implying she was wrong for breaking up with Oliver. Oliver said that he was in the wrong multiple times. She was never treated as the bad guy. I'm thinking of the fake wedding episode where she made multiple snarky little comments that were actually kind of mean, but the show never tried to call her out on them in anyway. She was allowed to do that, because she was the more injured party. (Because they were an expression of her totally warranted pain, not even close to as bad as lying about a secret child, and in character.)

Comic dude bros blamed Felicity, but the show never did. Maybe some fans were a little more sensitive and read some things into the show that weren't intended as a reaction to all the Felicity hate in social media, but in the actual show Felicity has been shown to have been quick to shut down Oliver's efforts (not always made in the most effective way) to talk about things and reconcile but ultimately to be mostly in the right. 

[ComicFan777]

I think that my issue was that after knowing that Felicity needed to understand why Oliver made the choices he did, I didn't see Oliver make an effort to find the answers that Felicity needed.  Yes, he was willing to talk to her, but there was no indication that he thought about what Felicity asked of him.  He didn't have any answers until after 5x17, but did he even think about it up until then? 

I would have liked to see him do a little soul-searching...maybe a line mentioning him mulling it over about what Felicity really needs when he was skyping Diggle or have him mention it to Thea at some point.  A line or two indicating that it was on his mind, he was thinking about it or that he was trying to work on it would have gone a long way for me.  Instead, we got robot!Oliver...

[ladylaw99]

taking to relationship thread

[leopardprint]

Another Black Canary memorial? Welp, that bodes well for S6. Off to a great start! 

[SmallScreenDiva]

I'm hoping that's just a separate glass case in the basement of the bunker so she doesn't take up room with the other suits, LOL! 

[leopardprint]

Like in a spare utility closet or behind some servers? 

[way2interested]

5 minutes ago, SmallScreenDiva said:

I'm hoping that's just a separate glass case in the basement of the bunker so she doesn't take up room with the other suits, LOL! 

Probably on the same floor they keep that cage in, since there's all that space there.

[Mellowyellow]

Huh? What did I miss?

Did the release a snippet of what's happening in S6??

Nevermind found it

Edited June 23, 2017 by Mellowyellow

[Angel12d]

Black Canary memorial display? Are they kidding me with this? Are we really gonna repeat the Saint Laurel mess of s5? Ugh x100000000000.

Edited June 23, 2017 by Angel12d

[tangerine95]

I'm guessing they're moving it out of the way from where the current team arrow costumes are held,for Dinah to put her costume there.Still tho enough with the hero memorials for a character that wore the mask for basically a season and did nothing more than be an unwanted sidekick.It's way over the top imo.They could have just given the costume to Lance or something.

[Morrigan2575]

As stupid as I think it is to redo this shit again. It kind of makes sense, she's the only one that's Dead Dead. Roy left to another town, Sara died and came back but the show wants to continue making the point that Laurel is Dead, Dead and, not coming back. 

Dinah will be the NuBC and Black Siren is a villain. Laurel Lance as Black Canary is dead dead and forever immortalized, Never to return.

Edited June 23, 2017 by Morrigan2575