Spoiler Discussion Thread

[Mellowyellow]

Do the Reddit people like Wild Dong?

Or does NO ONE like him?

[dtissagirl]

Starting it with "that's a great question" gives it cruelty levels, imo. What a super great question about Diggle! Here, lemme answer it by talking about the guy we kinda replaced him with.

[catrox14]

Oh HELL NO. That answer about writing for John and veering to really loving writing for Wild Dung is unacceptable and insulting.

[insomniadreams88]

There better be some AMAZING story planned for WD in 5B that makes it worth sitting through these first 9 episodes with him and that's why they're pushing him so much. Otherwise... 

Turning the focus of a Diggle Q to WD?! Next thing we know: "So, Felicity's new friends...?" "Oh, yes, great question. We love those characters. And we love writing for Tina/Talia/some new female character they could still introduce/etc. She's..." 

[apinknightmare]

3 minutes ago, dtissagirl said:

Starting it with "that's a great question" gives it cruelty levels, imo. What a super great question about Diggle! Here, lemme answer it by talking about the guy we kinda replaced him with.

Are there any spoilers that he actually gets out of prison anytime soon? 

[way2interested]

Just now, apinknightmare said:

Are there any spoilers that he actually gets out of prison anytime soon? 

He was in the scene with the team in that Russian bar during filming 512 when they did the mannequin challenge, but other than that idk.

[insomniadreams88]

4 minutes ago, apinknightmare said:

Are there any spoilers that he actually gets out of prison anytime soon? 

Didn't EK post a photo of him with the team + Tina? 

[Chaser]

Can Diggle be on Felicity's Team?

[bethy]

Quote

I think Rick Gonzales is tremendous and versatile. He’s a blast to write for. The character has a very specific point of view, which is always fun to tackle as a writer.

I've never seen RG in anything else, but what? "Versatile"? How? And I guess if the specific point of view is "jackass," then sure. I'm not sure how that partIicular POV is fun, though, other than getting to write your inner-jerk fantasies? 

And I'm guessing the pivot to Wild Dog after specifically being asked about Diggle means that Digg's got nothing coming up. Blech.

1 minute ago, Chaser said:

Can Diggle be on Felicity's Team?

She can take Diggle and Rory with her. That would be a show I'd like to watch!

[Chaser]

Oliver can keep WD and Curtis. Felicity can get Diggle/Rory/Tina.

[bijoux]

20 minutes ago, insomniadreams88 said:

Didn't EK post a photo of him with the team + Tina? 

Yup.

 

As for Felicity's team, I'm all for Rory and Dig, but I fear it might actually be Wild Dog if it's anyone from Team Arrow. It's supposed to be someone new and he's certainly the team member she's worked with least, and his crazy brashness might actually appeal to her if she's going off the rails.

[Carrie Ann]

I don't think she's actually forming a new team. My guess is that she'll end up working with hackers she knows from her past, and with Vigilante. But yeah, if we were splitting up the team, I like Felicity, Dig, Rory, and Tina TBD.

Edited December 19, 2016 by Carrie Ann

[LeighAn]

All I'll say about that interview is I resent the tone of the Olicity question. Talk about trying to lead the interviewee. 

I think Wendy double talked her way out of it but her comments about how they have thought up an interesting different path for Oliver and Felicity in season 6 makes me think marriage may be on the table.

[Sunshine]

I want to be excited for a Felicity arc but I am expecting most of her cohorts to be randos similar to Diggle's military cohorts, even if one ends up being Vigilante.  The timing of Diggle's arc in 5A was so Oliver would need new vigilantes.  It picks back up just as Oliver gets another fighter. DR had less than 5 minutes of screen time an episode.  Now Felicity has to be moved out so Oliver can bond with the fighters.  Felicity and Diggle might be background on the team but that's it. My guess is DC wants a comics team.  Best way to do that is sideline 2/3 of OTA.

Anyone else think the picture of JH, EBR, JD, EK, SA & DR might be nothing other than them going to dinner for David's birthday?  WH, PB, RG, JS might have been filming.

As for the mannequin challenge, maybe that's all it was and not an indication of them all filming a scene together.   The extras made me think Russian bar.   

[Featherhat]

1 hour ago, Angel12d said:

This is awful. "Diggle? Don't know who that is. Never experienced that emotion. Now, about Wild Dog..."

Yikes.

That was awful. Poor Diggle/DR (hey David we totally sidelined you so we could bring in this cool new character and have the actor remind everyone of how he is so totally like SA's double/heir).

Look writers if you aren't getting enough questions about WD (except maybe "when his he leaving/can he stop calling Felicity "Blondie" when they don't have that kind of relationship and the actor can't sell it like CC/HW might do?") to be able to rave about writing him in a question asked about him, then maybe he isn't as popular as you'd hoped and you shouldn't pin all your hopes on selling him (or promise the actor he will be a regular next season?

[Morrigan2575]

Quote

Anyone else think the picture of JH, EBR, JD, EK, SA & DR might be nothing other than them going to dinner for David's birthday?  WH, PB, RG, JS might have been filming.

No.

EBR is clearly in Felicity's costume in that picture. EBR does not dress, wear her hair like that, or do her makeup like that in RL.

[Velocity23]

Also EBR never wears Felicity glasses. She has her own that she sometimes puts on as was evident when the paps revealed the wheelchair last season.

[Cleanqueen]

I'm thinking the dark friends Felicity turns to could be people from hacktivist days. I do think she will fight the best way she knows how and that is through her computer. And I'm sure if shes keeping it a secret then she'll be doing it during her free time since she has no full time job.

Also Wendy's comments sound hopeful. I am getting marriage vibes for season 6 but we need them to actually notice they once had a relationship soon.

[lemotomato]

18 minutes ago, Sunshine said:

Anyone else think the picture of JH, EBR, JD, EK, SA & DR might be nothing other than them going to dinner for David's birthday?  WH, PB, RG, JS might have been filming.

As for the mannequin challenge, maybe that's all it was and not an indication of them all filming a scene together.   The extras made me think Russian bar.   

Or maybe those BTS photos are just like all the other BTS photos, which have them all together because they were filming together. What about the mannequin challenge that happened in the bunker with EBR, JD, and one of the makeup artist? And the videos/pics EK took of everyone in the bunker for the DC Instagram takeover? And the other pic EK posted of him, EBR, and JD dressed up and wearing sunglasses? 

[Sunshine]

Okay, okay I'm in the minority.  LOL!

I just remember a picture from S1 or S2 that had Paul Blackthorne and one of the cops (can't think of his name at the moment) in a BTS picture with OTA in the lair.  The first time Lance was in the lair was in S3, episode 19 (I think).  They were all in their character's attire.

I hope they are all shooting together just not convinced. :-) 

Edited December 19, 2016 by Sunshine

[Trisha]

Just as frustrating as Wendy's Diggle answer was her Olicity answer. She admits they are the show's "central core relationship" but implies they are going to drag out the reunion - maybe until season 6. But both characters are so unrecognizable at this point that I'm not sure I'll care by then. Her quote from the Blaster interview: http://www.blastr.com/2016-12-19/exclusive-arrow-showrunner-talks-flashpoint-future-olicity-and-season-six

Quote

We made a choice at the top of this season not to … not to get them back together right away, for sure. And to leave that question up in the air...I think both sides provide — having them together and apart —  certain types of storytelling opportunities. This season has certainly given us different ones. But I think ultimate the key thing, and i think is true for so many series, especially ones where you’ve been fortunate enough to go to 100 episodes and beyond, that you have that central core relationship and as writers you have that opportunity to explore it. And you can take it many different directions. We definitely have some ideas about where we’re headed in Season 6. We’ll see where that goes.

Edited December 19, 2016 by Trisha

[LeighAn]

Yeah I really think the EPs and their partner in crime (entertainment media) are way overstating Felicitys storyline like they always do because the loudest complaint they've heard- and the one they've gotten the most touchy and hostile over- is lack of writing for Felicity. So I think they are using descriptors that probably exaggerate what will actually happen. 

I don't think Felicity will go full evil. I don't think she is going to have a brand new team and say FU to Team Arrow. I think she will be doing some things OOC for her (like releasing a dangerous meta human into the city without consulting the team because she's hoping it will lead her to another criminal) and that she will be hiding or not consulting the team about it.

I think there may be a divide between her and Oliver/the team because they have different focuses. She wants to get Prometheus at all costs while Oliver also wants to honor Laurels legacy by recruiting Tina and that maybe creates some tension because Felicity thinks they aren't doing enough and she seeks out allies who she thinks will (vigilante).

I think that ultimately though she will end up regaining some focus in her life if BFS tweet is anything to go by and will end up finding some new career path or her own sort of legacy that will be a positive. 

Also if the spoilers for 5x10 are true Oliver wants BS close by because he wants to believe there is still good in her that he can find. There is good chances that they will also have Oliver be the one to remind Felicity about the good in herself and her own strength of character when she ventures down this morally grey path. So I warily doubt that this storyline is entirely about isolating Felicity on another Palmer Island type thing. 

[AyChihuahua]

55 minutes ago, LeighAn said:

I think Wendy double talked her way out of it but her comments about how they have thought up an interesting different path for Oliver and Felicity in season 6 makes me think marriage may be on the table.

How would that be different? That was their path in S4.

[LeighAn]

12 minutes ago, Trisha said:

Just as frustrating as Wendy's Diggle answer was her Olicity answer. She admits they are the show's "central core relationship" but implies they are going to drag out the reunion - maybe until season 6. But both characters are so unrecognizable at this point that I'm not sure I'll care by then. Her quote from the Blaster interview: http://www.blastr.com/2016-12-19/exclusive-arrow-showrunner-talks-flashpoint-future-olicity-and-season-six

The question and answer about Olicity bugged me a little because it was a leading question with a non answer. But at the same time I get the impression that at least season 6 will be a positive step for Olicity and that they can't be thinking about changing endgame like worst case scenarios specs. 

I'm 50/50 on whether I will actually feel satisfied and entertained when Oliver and Felicity do reunite/get married. 

[LeighAn]

4 minutes ago, AyChihuahua said:

How would that be different? That was their path in S4.

I'm talking them being actually married. My gut for a while is that they've been writing Olicity they way they have in the first half because they have something big in the back half of the season. Sort of like in season three they wrote Olicity all angst and doom and gloom because they had planned for LOA lair sex and running off into the sunset. Sort of like how in season 4 they wrote super domesticated Olicity because they had planned in the back half for broken up Olicity.

Stories typically have ebbs and flows, what comes up must come down and vice versa. 

So the next logical place to take Olicity IMO  that raises the stakes is to see them make good on their desire to be married by actually getting married.

But if you need to believe the opposite that's okay too.

[AyChihuahua]

11 minutes ago, LeighAn said:

I'm talking them being actually married. My gut for a while is that they've been writing Olicity they way they have in the first half because they have something big in the back half of the season. Sort of like in season three they wrote Olicity all angst and doom and gloom because they had planned for LOA lair sex and running off into the sunset. Sort of like how in season 4 they wrote super domesticated Olicity because they had planned in the back half for broken up Olicity.

Stories typically have ebbs and flows, what comes up must come down and vice versa. 

So the next logical place to take Olicity IMO  that raises the stakes is to see them make good on their desire to be married by actually getting married.

But if you need to believe the opposite that's okay too.

I don't need to believe anything. I simply don't see any evidence of an impending marriage.

[Morrigan2575]

@LeighAn - I think they're going for a S2 surprise/shock reunion.

[Chaser]

2 hours ago, Carrie Ann said:

IF Felicity's "dark" arc with new cohorts is not just being exaggerated as usual, then...for angsty reasons, I kind of don't want anyone to notice her slipping away until she's, like, pretty far gone. And then I want them to freak out when they figure it out, because they fucked up by assuming she was fine, and just seeing her as Ol' Faithful.

Ideally, I would like to Noah to hear about Felicity making a reappearance in the Hacker world and make a trip to Star City. Confront Oliver and the Team when he realizes that she is playing with fire.

[way2interested]

Just now, Morrigan2575 said:

 I think they're going for a S2 surprise/shock reunion.

Same, although I'm stumped as to how exactly, since they've already done the realization of feelings/kiss/i-love-you moments, but it might become easier to see once we're around the Feb sweeps drama, whatever that's going to be.

[statsgirl]

Because it is a sucky day in the news, I'm going to take the good where I can. WM saying

Quote

We made a choice at the top of this season not to … not to get them back together right away, for sure. And to leave that question up in the air...I think both sides provide — having them together and apart —  certain types of storytelling opportunities. This season has certainly given us different ones. But I think ultimate the key thing, and i think is true for so many series, especially ones where you’ve been fortunate enough to go to 100 episodes and beyond, that you have that central core relationship and as writers you have that opportunity to explore it.

I'm going to take that as a good.  Yes, they have been acting as if they were barely together, and yes there's no way they can be together right now after Oliver killing Mayo but it's an acknowledgement that it's the "central core relationship".  And they always were terrible at writing subtle or consistent.

2 hours ago, Mellowyellow said:

Do the Reddit people like Wild Dong?

Or does NO ONE like him?

The writer of that interview does.  And season 5 is the bestest ever!

1 hour ago, Featherhat said:

Look writers if you aren't getting enough questions about WD (except maybe "when his he leaving/can he stop calling Felicity "Blondie" when they don't have that kind of relationship and the actor can't sell it like CC/HW might do?") to be able to rave about writing him in a question asked about him, then maybe he isn't as popular as you'd hoped and you shouldn't pin all your hopes on selling him (or promise the actor he will be a regular next season?

LOL!  I'd missed that they're pushing WD maybe because no one is asking questions about him.

Summary:  That was one of the most fawning interviews I've read in quite a while, and that includes "rabid Olicity fans".

[LeighAn]

9 minutes ago, Morrigan2575 said:

@LeighAn - I think they're going for a S2 surprise/shock reunion.

Yep that's the vibe I'm getting. They want to make it this big surprise when Oliver and Felicity reunite- even though it seems inevitable that they will. 

I don't know I could be way off base because the writers intentions this season aren't as obvious, but on gut alone I think they're leading to some kind of payoff at the end of the season.

[lemotomato]

14 minutes ago, Morrigan2575 said:

@LeighAn - I think they're going for a S2 surprise/shock reunion.

Maybe an Olicity lunge (like O/S in season 2) during sweeps? 

[Featherhat]

1 minute ago, statsgirl said:

Because it is a sucky day in the news, I'm going to take the good where I can. WM saying

I'm going to take that as a good.  Yes, they have been acting as if they were barely together, and yes there's no way they can be together right now after Oliver killing Mayo but it's an acknowledgement that it's the "central core relationship".  And they always were terrible at writing subtle or consistent.

The writer of that interview does.  And season 5 is the bestest ever!

LOL!  I'd missed that they're pushing WD maybe because no one is asking questions about him.

Summary:  That was one of the most fawning interviews I've read in quite a while, and that includes "rabid Olicity fans".

Seconding your sucky day in the news so fandom threads of all kinds are a kind of comfort/release valve of things that don't matter but we still care about any good news, for me.

BIB That's the way I read it, as WD has been hyped by TPTB but there seems to be very little actual fan enthusiasm for him from anywhere (not sure about Reddit don't want to venture there very much) but even from more comic based sites. They want to say how awesome he is whenever they get an opening. It may just have been that Diggle just doesn't have any interesting stories coming up and "yep he's still in prison so no it's boring" isn't going to cut it as an answer (or both).  

There's no way for several reasons that Olicity will get together for now (or maybe anytime soon) but whilst I'm glad Mayo made a low impact on actual screen time or attempts to prove how amazingly awesome and possible real deal he was, it does frustrate me as well. Ray Palmer I miss your onscreen actual relationship with FS, except I don't and you are terrible in relationships even on LOT (but good without them) but when you caused issues or catalysts at least I saw most of them on screen.

[BkWurm1]

2 hours ago, way2interested said:

I mean, if she teams up with Vigilante and basically makes him a mercenary against Prometheus, and Team Arrow is going after Prometheus, I'm guessing they'll at least be a scene/episode with a liar revealed trope when the team finds out that she's working with other people. Kind of like 317 (only hopefully at least a bit better and more focused on Felicity). 

 

2 hours ago, Carrie Ann said:

IF Felicity's "dark" arc with new cohorts is not just being exaggerated as usual, then...for angsty reasons, I kind of don't want anyone to notice her slipping away until she's, like, pretty far gone. And then I want them to freak out when they figure it out, because they fucked up by assuming she was fine, and just seeing her as Ol' Faithful.

I absolutely know I'm letting get into my head how a kind of similar story line played out on Smallville for Chloe when the death of someone close to her pushed her to take maters in her own hands, but I really worry that Felicity is going to get excoriated by Oliver and the team for whatever she does.  

I want to believe they will be dismayed and regretful over how isolated they let her get and work to help her find herself again, but I worry that instead she'll just get their disdain and censure and then she'll beg their forgiveness and they'll let her come back but won't trust her like they did before.   Or something equally awful.  It really doesn't help that the story line on Smallville also took place when they were pushing the show in a different direction. 

And since I'm already such a downer:

Quote

We made a choice at the top of this season not to … not to get them back together right away, for sure. And to leave that question up in the air...I think both sides provide — having them together and apart —  certain types of storytelling opportunities. This season has certainly given us different ones. But I think ultimate the key thing, and i think is true for so many series, especially ones where you’ve been fortunate enough to go to 100 episodes and beyond, that you have that central core relationship and as writers you have that opportunity to explore it. And you can take it many different directions. We definitely have some ideas about where we’re headed in Season 6. We’ll see where that goes.

This is going to sound really pessimistic but I don't think WM said anything new, just the same stuff as always about Oliver and Felicity.  

Starting with that first line.  I read something different out of it, that she was initially going to say that they made a choice at the top of the season not to get them back together, but then she backtracked to make it less definitive and softened it with well, "not right away for sure". As if there was a chance that they were just not getting back together but hey, things change so who knows.

Then she says they have ideas about where Oliver and Felicity are heading next season but they'll see where that goes which sent me to think about Tina showing up and them not knowing how she'll be received.

So again, I don't think this interview says anything new. 

Now tell me why I'm wrong.  I want to believe in good things for the future.  

Edited December 20, 2016 by BkWurm1

[Velocity23]

Or maybe its because Oliver is connected with the reporter during sweeps. 

[Morrigan2575]

1 minute ago, way2interested said:

Same, although I'm stumped as to how exactly, since they've already done the realization of feelings/kiss/i-love-you moments, but it might become easier to see once we're around the Feb sweeps drama, whatever that's going to be.

At this point I think it depends on how long Felicity's dark path lasts and how they handle it. Does she quit for a couple of episodes or does she work with Vigilante on the DL? 

I'm torn with a surprise sex scene/reunion at the end of Feb Sweeps. 

Or IF they drag this out to May Sweeps and, I think that depends on Felicity's story. Then, I think they're going to have Olicity elope. 

[LeighAn]

2 minutes ago, lemotomato said:

Maybe an Olicity lunge (like O/S in season 2) during sweeps? 

Well my probably fanfic spec for this season was that Olicity will have a friends with benefits type sex hookup before an actual emotional reunion. And that sort of sex lapse will be the catalyst  for them confronting the rest of their relationship. 

[BkWurm1]

2 minutes ago, Morrigan2575 said:

Then, I think they're going to have Olicity elope. 

That would be a call back to Oliver in his Alien dream world wanting to run off an get married that instant. 

[LeighAn]

7 minutes ago, BkWurm1 said:

 

I absolutely know I'm letting get into my head how a kind of similar story line played out on Smallville for Chloe when the death of someone close to her pushed her to take maters in her own hands, but I really worry that Felicity is going to get excoriated by Oliver and the team for whatever she does.  

I want to believe they will be dismayed and regretful over how isolated they let her get and work to help her find herself again, but I worry that instead she'll just get their disdain and censure and then she'll beg their forgiveness and they'll let her come back but won't trust her like they did before.   Or something equally awful.  It really doesn't help that the story line on Smallville also took place when they were pushing the show in a different direction. 

And since I'm already such a downer:

This is going to sound really pessimistic but I don't think WM said anything new, just the same stuff as always about Oliver and Felicity.  

Starting with that first line.  I read something different out of it, that she was initially going to say that they made a choice at the top of the season not to get them back together, but then she backtracked to make it less definitive and softened it with well, "not right away for sure". As if there was a chance that they were just not getting back together but hey, things change so who knows.

Then she says they have ideas about where Oliver and Felicity are heading next season but they'll see where that goes which sent me to think about Tina showing up and them not knowing how she'll be received.

So again, I don't think this interview says anything new. 

Now tell me why I'm wrong.  I want to believe in good things for the future.  

Except Smallville and Arrow are two different shows in terms of how their heroes are written. Clark was the moral centre of the show from the get go and therefore used as the character the others had to live up to or seek approval from which made him at times come of as self righteous and judgemental.

 

Where as the trajectory of Oliver is for him to see the light in the world and the good in people and believe in hopeful outcomes precisely because he had seen so much darkness and the worst side of humanity. Felicity has also been singled out by Okiver as the person who made him realise that he deserved love, that made him feel human again, that lights his way that made him TRUST again. So story wise it makes more sense for him to return the favor and pull Felicity back from the edge then condemn her. I'm sure there will be done judgement and some dude pot calling the kettle back jabs but I think/hope that really Olivers just going to be more coming from a place of concern for Felicity then anything. 

I mean Felicity is Olivers romantic lead where Chloe was not Clarks so there is a difference in the approach in that regard also. I mean in a way I think they took Chloe down that path more for Smallville Olivers benefit as it allowed the two of them to connect on a deeper level and have their romantic relationship resonant because they both had reached that dark place. 

Clark and Arrow Oliver are similar in some respects that they both had/have issues with trusting people, but I really want to give the arrow writers the benefit of the doubt that Felicity flirting with the edge or moral lines is to emphasise the importance of her moral fibre and her light and goodness by having the person most profoundly change by having her in his life Oliver remind her of that.

As for whether Olicity reunite or are being replaced. There is certainly a lot of possibility that your correct in that the writers may be testing the waters with Tina but I just don't know how probable it is. Only time will tell. 

[way2interested]

5 minutes ago, BkWurm1 said:

This is going to sound really pessimistic but I don't think WM said anything new, just the same stuff as always about Oliver and Felicity.  

Starting with that first line.  I read something different out of it, that she was initially going to say that they made a choice at the top of the season not to get them back together, but then she backtracked to make it less definitive and softened it with well, "not right away for sure". As if there was a chance that they were just not getting back together but hey, things change so who knows.

Then she says they have ideas about where Oliver and Felicity are heading next season but they'll see where that goes which sent me to think about Tina showing up and them not knowing how she'll be received.

So again, I don't think this interview says anything new. 

Now tell me why I'm wrong.  I want to believe in good things for the future.  

I took it as she was about to say that they made a decision at the top of the season not to get them back together, but immediately not the in general sense. Like "We made a choice at the top of this season not to get them back together" -Wait that sounds too permanent and not where we're going with this- "We made a choice at the top of this season not to get them back together right away for sure." Not backtracking in a soft lie way, but in a way that tries to cover them from criticism of getting them back together too late or too soon (It's not too late, we specifically said we didn't want it too soon, so we had to wait until it came back organically; It's not too soon, we specifically wrote with the intention to not get them back together too soon, so we wrote them reuniting where it came up organically).

They always say they'll see where it goes so those words mean little to me, and if they are actually waiting for reaction to Tina for either her as a LI or for Oliver and Felicity's relationship, then I think it's pretty poor planning on their sake, since by the time we actually meet her, they'll be well into planning the finale. If that is the case then I would be guessing they really are waiting until s6 to make real relationship steps in the narrative.

I could be wrong, but that's how I read it. I agree it basically doesn't say anything new because at this point there is nothing new in the promotional narrative (Oliver and Felicity are such good partners despite not being together!). I do still think though that these whole non-answers are them just dancing around the fact that they had to split up the main couple because television and can't put them back together immediately also because television, with some network/outsider influence mixed in.

[LeighAn]

3 minutes ago, way2interested said:

I took it as she was about to say that they made a decision at the top of the season not to get them back together, but immediately not the in general sense. Like "We made a choice at the top of this season not to get them back together" -Wait that sounds too permanent and not where we're going with this- "We made a choice at the top of this season not to get them back together right away for sure." Not backtracking in a soft lie way, but in a way that tries to cover them from criticism of getting them back together too late or too soon (It's not too late, we specifically said we didn't want it too soon, so we had to wait until it came back organically; It's not too soon, we specifically wrote with the intention to not get them back together too soon, so we wrote them reuniting where it came up organically).

They always say they'll see where it goes so those words mean little to me, and if they are actually waiting for reaction to Tina for either her as a LI or for Oliver and Felicity's relationship, then I think it's pretty poor planning on their sake, since by the time we actually meet her, they'll be well into planning the finale. If that is the case then I would be guessing they really are waiting until s6 to make real relationship steps in the narrative.

I could be wrong, but that's how I read it. I agree it basically doesn't say anything new because at this point there is nothing new in the promotional narrative (Oliver and Felicity are such good partners despite not being together!). I do still think though that these whole non-answers are them just dancing around the fact that they had to split up the main couple because television and can't put them back together immediately also because television, with some network/outsider influence mixed in.

Pretty much. I think CW fuckkery is to blame then anything else like the writers being scared of the anti Olicity hate or DC mandating a GA/BC relationship. If you look at all their shows romantic cord pairings they all go through the make up break up drama cycle which makes me think it's more a network directive to show runners. Give us a good ship- then create as a much drama and suspense as possible to keep the audience stringing along. 

I mean other then Supernatural which wasn't set up as a romantic drama type show but a procedural is there any CW/WB show that hasn't followed that format yet?

I think that's why I found 4A Olicity so refreshing because for a time it looked like they were going yo break the CW norm. 

[Mellowyellow]

I just hope they don't get to Chuck and Blair levels of awfulness and then try to reunite them. Better to leave them be in that case! 

[statsgirl]

Smallville and Arrow are also different in that for most people Clark and Lois are THE couple.  Comic book readers may flirt with the idea of Superman dating Wonder Woman but the general public would never buy him with anyone but Lois. Lane.  Green Arrow, on the other hand, is less well known and people like me had never hear of GA/BC before this show so I think there is more leeway here.

35 minutes ago, BkWurm1 said:

Then she says they have ideas about where Oliver and Felicity are heading next season but they'll see where that goes which sent me to think about Tina showing up and them not knowing how she'll be received.

No matter how good JH is as Tina, I don't think Oliver/Tina will replace Olicity.  It's been too long that Olicity has been "the core relationship" of the show but more than that, when the writing isn't bad soap opera, SA and EBR have something that's rare on TV.

It reminds me of ER after George Clooney left.  They tried to pair Carol with Luka but as sexy and troubled as Luka was and as good an actor is Goran Visjnic is,, the audience wasn't buying it, not one little bit.  I suspect it will be that way with Oliver and Tina.

I don't expect an elopement this season because there is too much distance between them right now and the Billy killing/Felicity darkness to overcome but I expect them to be together at the end of the season to hold the audience over them summer.  An elopement in s6 maybe since they've already had the (fake) wedding.

[Morrigan2575]

WM and MG have used those exact words about holding off on Olicity since SDCC.  I don't think they mean any more now then they have before. 

I wouldn't be surprised to find out the whole reason they didn't put Olicity back together in 'right away' is because they wanted that whole 509 Billy scene. Oliver has to kill someone close to Felicity in order to kick off her 'dark path'. They can't kill Donna or Curtis so she gets a Red Shirt boyfriend which means Olicity has to be apart. 

[BkWurm1]

11 minutes ago, Morrigan2575 said:

WM and MG have used those exact words about holding off on Olicity since SDCC.  I don't think they mean any more now then they have before. 

I wouldn't be surprised to find out the whole reason they didn't put Olicity back together in 'right away' is because they wanted that whole 509 Billy scene. Oliver has to kill someone close to Felicity in order to kick off her 'dark path'. They can't kill Donna or Curtis so she gets a Red Shirt boyfriend which means Olicity has to be apart. 

This really rings true.  They have this Gotcha! moment they want to do so everything else has to revolve around it. 

Edited December 20, 2016 by BkWurm1

[insomniadreams88]

6 minutes ago, Morrigan2575 said:

I wouldn't be surprised to find out the whole reason they didn't put Olicity back together in 'right away' is because they wanted that whole 509 Billy scene. Oliver has to kill someone close to Felicity in order to kick off her 'dark path'. They can't kill Donna or Curtis so she gets a Red Shirt boyfriend which means Olicity has to be apart. 

Yep. And maybe they've kept them apart because of the reporter storyline. There would be no reason for him to "need a friend" if he's with Felicity. Otherwise, how would that conversation go? "You look like you need a friend. Let's get drinks. Not a date." "Uh, I'm with/engaged/married to Felicity. I'm good." "No, you're not. You must open up to me because ... Russia!" 

[tangerine95]

Yeah I don't think its much different than what they've been saying so far except WM saying they decided not to put them back together right away is basically saying it's a classic ship stall pretty clearly. 

I could be really wrong and the EPs have proven tone deaf especially this season but I don't think they have some plan to maybe replace olicity with Oliver and Tina or Oliver and whoever and are just waiting to see if it works and what's the reaction before they decide. I do think even with the horrible writing and stalling, they have decided olicity is their main couple seasons ago. And they already know the reactions to Oliver or Felicity with other people.Ship stalls like Oliver/Sara, Felicity /Ray, these new temps haven't been able to sway the audience or gain even close to the olicity popularity and were largely disliked so I do think they are aware another main romance on arrow doesn't have much chance of being accepted. 

[LeighAn]

5 minutes ago, Mellowyellow said:

I just hope they don't get to Chuck and Blair levels of awfulness and then try to reunite them. Better to leave them be in that case! 

I think it would be hard to reach Chuck and Blair levels of cockblocking plot twists. 

The Arrow writers aren't at sleeping with your love interest uncle/Indecent Proposal/drunk filled rage/married and pregnant to another man yet but killing love interest rebound boy is close to the money. 

But I'm not going to lie maybe it's because I was a naive teenager for most of Gossip Girl years but I still got a little happy and weepy when Chuck and Blair finally got married and had a kid. Even though I totally get how unhealthy they became. I can be shallow and not a very good feminist like that sometimes when it comes to ships haha.

Gossip Girl is another show that's a case study on how to take to actors with amazing chemistry and dynamic and squander it. 

[LeighAn]

10 minutes ago, BkWurm1 said:

This really rings true.  They have this Gotcha! moment they want to do so everything else has to revolve around it. 

Which is funny since Matc said that's his big regret with Olicity last season that they didn't let the relationship breathe because they had tent poles they had to reach and therefore broke them up to soon; and now they are doing basically the same thing in prolonging their reunion because they have tent poles they need to reach 

[Morrigan2575]

11 minutes ago, insomniadreams88 said:

Yep. And maybe they've kept them apart because of the reporter storyline. There would be no reason for him to "need a friend" if he's with Felicity. Otherwise, how would that conversation go? "You look like you need a friend. Let's get drinks. Not a date." "Uh, I'm with/engaged/married to Felicity. I'm good." "No, you're not. You must open up to me because ... Russia!" 

Yep, that too. It's ALL about some stupid plot that has to happen in the future. I made my peace with them writing for plot a long time ago but, sometimes it can get really annoying