"The View": Week of 10/12/15

[Former Nun]

I hate Lena Dunham. I think Girls is off the wall terrible, I think she got where she is because of her parents (whatever, happens in every industry) but her writing is so unbelievably amateur.

 

 

I like Lena Dunham and think she's very talented. I enjoyed her movie "Tiny Houses" before I ever learned her name...and I enjoy her series.  I'm certainly not in her generation; I'm old enough to be her grandmother.  She has a different (modern?) approach to writing/directing that isn't common (yet) on television.  I do question what kind of clout her parents could have.  Are they powerhouses in show business?

[backformore]

I am glad people have brought up the interview with Malcolm Jamal Warner again.  I posted before that I missed the interview with him ... well, Don Lemon just did a big segment on him being on the show today.  Very interesting. So interesting that I actually tracked down a full clip of MJW talking about The Cosby Show for those who also missed it http://www.thewrap.com/malcolm-jamal-warner-clarifies-stance-on-cosby-show-legacy/

 

One of the panelists on Lemon ripped Michelle for waving her hand in the air trying to cut off MJW and asking everyone to "move on" just when he was making some really important points.  After watching, I simply cannot believe Michelle did that.   MJW was delving into the impact of the show on African Americans and Michelle just put a stop to the whole discussion.  It was so messed up.   Not only was it rude as hell, it was also frustrating and disappointing and completely unnecessary.  I really wanted to hear what he was saying.  Joy apparently did, too, because she sort of shrugged and gave Michelle a "why?" response.  But Michelle immediately shifted the topic to whatever show MJW is now doing.  Couldn't that have waited?  How could anyone think that was a more interesting topic than the Bill Cosby and The Cosby Show and the cover of Ebony that just came out?  The mind just boggles.

 

So was someone screaming at Michelle through her earpiece to change the subject or something?  Why??? Did she take it upon herself to end the most interesting discussion on the entire show today unilaterally?  Who the hell is calling the shots on this miserable show?  Do they have any idea what a scoop they had on their hands when Malcolm Jamal Warner was willingly participating in a discussion like that? 

 

This show just doesn't deserve to be on the damn air. 

Yes, the show would be a lot more interesting if guests were given more than a couple of minutes.   MJW and Alan Alda , each on for a few minutes, is a terrible idea.   Give each one 20 - 30 minutes of the show.  Allow the conversation to go off track a little, if the guest has something to say.  They limit their guests to a couple of sound bytes, and then shuffle them out.   The producers are under-estimating the attention span of the audience. 

[Kenz]

My take on Malcolm Jamal Warner's interview was that the whole thing didn't need to be about Bill Cosby. Malcolm is an accomplished actor and  director ( including acting in the upcoming American Crime series), and he's come out with a new album, so he was appreciative when Michelle changed the subject and actually wanted to talk about his recent activities. I don't blame him for not wanting to talk solely about Bill Cosby OR Raven. Of course, they jam an interview into too few minutes, so it's always frustrating.

Edited October 17, 2015 by Kenz

[DebbieM4]

My take on Malcolm Jamal Warner's interview was that the whole thing didn't need to be about Bill Cosby. Malcolm is an accomplished  director ( including the upcoming American Detective series), and he's come out with a new album, so he was appreciative when Michelle changed the subject and actually wanted to talk about his recent activities. I don't blame him for not wanting to talk solely about Bill Cosby.

 

I don't blame him either.  It was a shame, though, that he was given so little time when he was more than willing to share his thoughts about the Cosby issue as well as talk about his own projects.  And they wasted precious moments showing a Raven-centered clip from The Cosby Show, followed by her reaction to it.  Pretty much everything about his segment had to do with Raven, and he ended up having to rush to plug his own stuff at the end.  I thought he seemed like a really interesting, articulate guy, and I resent that we were subjected to yet more Raven rather than the focus being where it should have been.

[Meatball]

Re: the Ebony cover

Sandra always gets the shaft!

I totally agree that MJW seemed willing to discuss *his* views but was sidetracked by the awesomeness that is Raven. That clip showed her to be nothing more than a trained seal at that age. She probably thinks "Blue Suede Shoes" was written for the show.

[Dahlia]

Today while watching Michelle NOT engage in listening but instead swivel her head from side to side while simultaneously squawking just enough to prevent me from hearing anyone else and fluttering her hands around like two numb mitts, the urge to reach into the screen to throttle her was so strong that I almost had the sensation I actually was doing it

STFU you idiot YOU

[Haleth]

Raven  uses her most-serious voice to tell us "let us not forget that the Cosby show was a sitcom, and not a reality show. A sitcom- Let's just remember, we had writers, and things of that nature."

 

Thank you, Captain Obvious.

Does anyone know what her point was?

[backformore]

Thank you, Captain Obvious.

Does anyone know what her point was?

I THINK she was saying that Bill Cosby portrayed a character that was not himself.  And that the SHOW shouldn't be judged by the actions of ACTORS.   Kind of, that the show delivered a message about Black families, and the message is still valid.  That Dr. and Mrs Huxtable can still be symbols, role models to aspire to even though the actor playing Dr. H was an asshole rapist.  Separating the MESSAGE from the MESSENGER. 

But she didn't articulate it very well at all.   So she could have meant something else entirely.

  I originally quoted what she said because her delivery was so solemn, as though she was making some profound revelation about the difference between fact and fiction.  She seemed to think she was saying something important,  so I suspect it was part of a conversation she heard others having.

 

There's a parallel here.   A clip of Raven singing "Blue Suede Shoes" -  a child performing something she was told to perform, not understanding it.

Then, the grown-up version of the same child, making pronouncements about the difference between sitcoms and reality shows, having really no idea what the hell she's talking about, but, just as in the younger version, over-estimating her own abilities.   She is still that child.

[Former Nun]

Does anyone know what her point was?

 

 

My take is that she didn't want to say it in so many words: the show was "not a reality show," and therefore the characters shouldn't be considered real people.  What Mr. Cosby portrayed on the show may be something quite different from what he did in the privacy of various hotel rooms.

[Celia Rubenstein]

My take on Malcolm Jamal Warner's interview was that the whole thing didn't need to be about Bill Cosby. Malcolm is an accomplished actor and director ( including acting in the upcoming American Crime series), and he's come out with a new album, so he was appreciative when Michelle changed the subject and actually wanted to talk about his recent activities. I don't blame him for not wanting to talk solely about Bill Cosby OR Raven. Of course, they jam an interview into too few minutes, so it's always frustrating.

I totally understand how MJM would not want his interview to be limited to the Cosby thing. He's multi-talented and has lots of other interesting projects to discuss.

What I don't understand is why The View would cut off a topic that was red-smoking-hot and had everyone watching on the edge of their seats, waiting to hear what MJW thought about what has happened. Google "Malcolm Jamal Warner the view" and see how many stories his interview generated across the web. There was a lot of interest in what he had to say ... So much for "making sparks" I guess.

I suppose (as many others have pointed out) the long clip of Raven (the trained seal omg how funny, Meatball) ate up precious time. That whole thing really irked me. If you want to show a Theo Huxtable clip, EVERYONE knows the clip to show is of him in the Gordon Gartrelle shirt episode! It is truly a comedy classic.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=crnPfls0fHw

Edited October 17, 2015 by Celia Rubenstein

[Cosmocrush]

And how annoying that the clip they showed (which should have featured the guest, MJW) was all about Raven!  And then we get to see her acting all embarrassed and giggly.  That was ridiculous because he actually seemed like an interesting guy with some well-thought-out things to say, and that nonsense cut into his segment time.  

They do the same thing with Whoopi's ancient film clips whenever someone she's ever worked with shows up as a guest; and the clip is always more about Whoopi than the guest.  I think the last one was just a couple weeks ago with Tony Goldwyn who had a smallt part in Ghost but the clip was mostly Whoopi.  Before that, Babs did the same thing.  So showing a MJW clip that was mostly Raven is just standard operating procedure.  

 

I don't think it would be so annoying if they didn't limit the interview segments to 4-5 minutes and it's generally the more interesting the guest, the less the time.  Didn't Whoopi's daughter have two segments?  

 

 

Wait! Cosby was a sitcom?? Bill Cosby isn't like Cliff Huxable? Oh! That's right! We already knew that! And, wasn't Claire a lawyer? If it was a reality show, Claire would have been spending all her time trying to keep Cliff from raping more women.

LOL!  I don't think the Bill Cosby thing is funny but this post cracked me up.  

 

 

 

So was someone screaming at Michelle through her earpiece to change the subject or something?  Why??? Did she take it upon herself to end the most interesting discussion on the entire show today unilaterally?  Who the hell is calling the shots on this miserable show?  Do they have any idea what a scoop they had on their hands when Malcolm Jamal Warner was willingly participating in a discussion like that? 

 

This show just doesn't deserve to be on the damn air. 

All good questions.  I saw Michelle do this yesterday and couldn't believe it and that's saying something since I think of this show as consistently rude to each other and everyone that comes on the show.  

 

The exception was the Alan Alda interview.  I applaud the choice to have it just be Joy and him; I think it made all the difference. I always find him delightful and I'm glad to see he's still working.  We are going to see the movie tomorrow. 

 

 

I like Lena Dunham and think she's very talented. I enjoyed her movie "Tiny Houses" before I ever learned her name...and I enjoy her series.  I'm certainly not in her generation; I'm old enough to be her grandmother.  She has a different (modern?) approach to writing/directing that isn't common (yet) on television.  I do question what kind of clout her parents could have.  Are they powerhouses in show business?

Not at all. They don't have anything to do with show business. Lena's parents are artists in NYC and have a name in the art world.   Her father is a painter [Caroll Dunham] and her mother is a photographer [Laurie Simmons].   When Girls first came out  and the internet figured out who her parents were the accusations of nepotism began,  which was so ridiculous.  I'm not surprised someone on this show is still promoting that idea after four seasons, a bestselling book, and a Golden Globe. 

 

Today while watching Michelle NOT engage in listening but instead swivel her head from side to side while simultaneously squawking just enough to prevent me from hearing anyone else and fluttering her hands around like two numb mitts, the urge to reach into the screen to throttle her was so strong that I almost had the sensation I actually was doing it

STFU you idiot YOU

YES!!!!   I only watch a couple times a week but I've never not seen her do this. 

Edited October 17, 2015 by Cosmocrush

[Celia Rubenstein]

I THINK she was saying that Bill Cosby portrayed a character that was not himself.  And that the SHOW shouldn't be judged by the actions of ACTORS.   Kind of, that the show delivered a message about Black families, and the message is still valid.  That Dr. and Mrs Huxtable can still be symbols, role models to aspire to even though the actor playing Dr. H was an asshole rapist.  Separating the MESSAGE from the MESSENGER. 

 

 

My take is that she didn't want to say it in so many words: the show was "not a reality show," and therefore the characters shouldn't be considered real people.  What Mr. Cosby portrayed on the show may be something quite different from what he did in the privacy of various hotel rooms.

 

If Raven had the verbal ability to come anywhere close to articulating the points you all made so well, she would actually deserve her spot on this show.

 

 

Today while watching Michelle NOT engage in listening but instead swivel her head from side to side

 

 

This whole head-swiveling thing has gotten completely out of control.  Michelle seems to do it most often when she is trying to figure out what to do, but Raven, Whoopi, and Joy seem to do it more to express their frustration to whomever it is that is sitting front and center among the audience.  It is SO distracting.

 

Is that where the producers sit now or something?  

 

Well, I don't know who the hell is sitting there.  But I wish they would find someplace else to park their derriere during the show so that the panel would stop mugging for them.  It makes it too easy for the panelists to show their contempt for each other. Or in Michelle's case, to look more like a confused puppy than she usually does.   

 

Of course, the panelists could always decide to be more professional and simply not engage in such antics.  And monkeys might fly out of Barbara Walters' butt, too.  But neither of those things is very likely. 

[Former Nun]

Not at all. They don't have anything to do with show business.

 

 

Thanks, CosmoCrush.  I asked the question because of this post.

 

I hate Lena Dunham. I think Girls is off the wall terrible, I think she got where she is because of her parents (whatever, happens in every industry) but her writing is so unbelievably amateur.

 

[mbutterfly]

Ann Coulter just slapped down Raven by reminding everyone that she is mean to people based on their names.

 

Raven went silent

I thought this would never happen but I a little bit liked Ann Coulter when I watched the show this morning. 

[DebbieM4]

 

 

There's a parallel here.   A clip of Raven singing "Blue Suede Shoes" -  a child performing something she was told to perform, not understanding it.

Then, the grown-up version of the same child, making pronouncements about the difference between sitcoms and reality shows, having really no idea what the hell she's talking about, but, just as in the younger version, over-estimating her own abilities.   She is still that child.

 

This is perfection!  Absolutely on target.  I agree with your entire post, but most especially this part.

Edited October 18, 2015 by DebbieM4

[Dahlia]

I so agree! that description of that child was perfectly said. Spot on in fact.

What a (nother) lousy choice for a position on this panel .

[RogerFromOhio]

Ya gotta wonder if they cut off the discussion about Cosby to protect Whoopi..... if the discussion made news then it would have to be mentioned how Whoopi supports rapists and ignores the victims..... The View just cant deal with that kind of press

 

Oh... Im pretty sure that the ear piece that Michelle wears was the reason to derail the discussion

Edited October 18, 2015 by RogerFromOhio

[represent]

 

I THINK she was saying that Bill Cosby portrayed a character that was not himself.  And that the SHOW shouldn't be judged by the actions of ACTORS.   Kind of, that the show delivered a message about Black families, and the message is still valid.  That Dr. and Mrs Huxtable can still be symbols, role models to aspire to even though the actor playing Dr. H was an asshole rapist.  Separating the MESSAGE from the MESSENGER.

I just don't feel the need to "save" the show. It had it's day, the show made television history, but it supporters will never be able to remove the "but" that will always come into play when you discuss it because it's lead and creator was and forever will be a rapist. This is where we are, this is where we will forever be when it comes to The Cosby Show. I know that's what I see when I look at him and some crimes you just can't separate the actor from the character and rape is one of those crimes for me anyway.

 

The guy that plays Kramer on Seinfeld talked about my ancestors hanging from trees, yet I can still watch the show cause he actually was my least favorite character. I'm not so in to slapstick comedy and that is what he was most on the show. Constanza and Elaine were my favorite and quite frankly, Seinfeld to me was better comedic show. So I can still watch it and laugh from time to time despite the lunatic racist that was on staff. He did really sound like a complete lunatic on that stage.  Also, the actor who played Kramer, which I like that I can't even remember his name right now, never presented himself as some kind of upstanding role model in a community the way Cosby did. Heathcliff Huxstable was upstanding and so was Bill Cosby, or so we thought. Telling young black people what they should and shouldn't do, and talking down to them, meanwhile he's drugging and raping women. There's a hypocritical factor that also plays into to all this for me as well.

 

I remember my friends and I waiting outside of the NBC studio in Brooklyn NY, because one of their studios was behind my high school, Edward R. Murrow. It's where they use to film the Cosby Show. On one of our breaks I remember us going out there to see if we could get a glimpse of any of the actors on the show and low and behold, he came out. I remember my friends saddling up right next to him while I took their picture, they were so tickled. So was I, all I could say was, "you look exactly the same" I always expect stars to look so different from the way they look on tv. He was admired, but now I get to look back and wonder if had just finished using a casting couch and drug to rape young promising actress when he met us.  Sidenote: Lisa Bonet tried to avoid us by having her driver drive around to the side door LOL and Tempest Bledsoe was really sweet. 

 

They need to let it go and stop trying to "save" the legacy of the show. I see it as just added insult to the victims that they keep discussing it, I don't care about the show's anniversary, please.

Edited October 18, 2015 by represent

[Foghorn Leghorn]

A lot of crying over spilt residuals!  LOL

[Cosmocrush]

Nicely written post represent!  I completely agree.

 

As inarticulate as Joy was, I think her point was that shows end.  Or they used to anyway.  Now of course with all the old TV show cable channels, Netflix, etc. they seem to go on forever and not just Seinfeld.  But that doesn't mean they should and your post perfectly explains why this one should not.   And whatever career boost the actors on The Cosby Show were going to get they got long ago.   Whatever 'good' the show did it did long ago.    No boo hoos from me either.

Edited October 19, 2015 by Cosmocrush

[JAYJAY1979]

Remember back in the early days of the show that debbi M was let go sue to being too young and not well informed? I don't recall her saying half the stupid stuff that Raven and sometimes Michelle say on a daily basis.

Sometimes I think Michelle has potential, other times not so much. Paula isn't too bad, she seems kind of sweet..man I do lament nicole not being there cause I could see joy and Nicole being able to interview politicians, etc.

[Foghorn Leghorn]

I like Paula's ability to remain cool and calm at the table and stand her ground to make her point whether I agree with it or not BUT I don't like her condescending way of lowering her eyes and dropping her chin then making her statement in a know it all tone.  

 

Michelle is like an eager puppy jumping up and down yapping constantly like "look at me!" and everyone ignores her! 

 

Joy has brought the adult back to the table with Paula supporting that.  

 

Raven so wants to be an adult but she just can't grow up!  She reminds me of the Scarecrow from the WOO..."if I only had a brain!"

[ginger90]

Raven so wants to be an adult but she just can't grow up!  She reminds me of the Scarecrow from the WOO..."if I only had a brain!"

Not exact quotes from the movie:

Dorothy: How can you talk if you haven't a brain?

Scarecrow: Some people without brains do an awful lot of talking.

The View.