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Boy, Hawkeye really begins to bug around season 5. I watched the episode where he quits drinking and he hits new levels of sanctimony. If I had been Shelly Long's character, I would have smashed that bottle of wine right over his head.

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11 hours ago, mmecorday said:

Boy, Hawkeye really begins to bug around season 5. I watched the episode where he quits drinking and he hits new levels of sanctimony. If I had been Shelly Long's character, I would have smashed that bottle of wine right over his head.

As I said in another post, BJ and later Hawkeye were perfect tent mates because both practically swam in sanctimony.

I am still very partial to the first three seasons with Trapper, Henry, and Frank and the more blatant humor. (I will admit that Potter and Winchester had more depth versus Blake [though he even had his moments] and Frank, but I watched for the laughs, mainly.)

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22 hours ago, mmecorday said:

Boy, Hawkeye really begins to bug around season 5. I watched the episode where he quits drinking and he hits new levels of sanctimony. If I had been Shelly Long's character, I would have smashed that bottle of wine right over his head.

At least he realizes that he's being a complete jerk; the later Hawkeye doesn't have that moment of clarity.  Plus, that sort of assholery is fairly common in people who've stopped drinking or stopped smoking or are on a diet or suchlike; they wonder why everyone can't be as perfect as they are.

I like the series through Radar leaving; after that, I pretty much can't watch it anymore.

Edited by Fosca
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Speaking of Hawkeye's drinking, last night I saw the episode where Colonel Potter's last WWI buddy died and had the bottle of brandy sent to him. Potter gathers everyone in his tent and tells the story of the brandy and then says he wants to share that last bottle with them, his new friends at MASH. It always makes me laugh the way Hawkeye jumps up and says, "WE'D BE HONORED, COLONEL!" as Potter barely has the invitation out of mouth. Geez, give him a second to get the bottle open.

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One scene that bothered me was an officer (Colonel Potter?) talking with a young soldier who was about to go back into battle. The officer asked, "Are you scared?" and the soldier replied, "No, sir." The officer said, "If you had any brains, you'd be scared." Someone who becomes an officer should realize that lower ranking people often say what they think the officer wants to hear.  Yeah, not an ideal world.

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23 hours ago, Driad said:

One scene that bothered me was an officer (Colonel Potter?) talking with a young soldier who was about to go back into battle. The officer asked, "Are you scared?" and the soldier replied, "No, sir." The officer said, "If you had any brains, you'd be scared." Someone who becomes an officer should realize that lower ranking people often say what they think the officer wants to hear.  Yeah, not an ideal world.

I read that more as him (and yes, it was Potter) giving the young GI permission to BE scared, and not be thought a coward for it.  The voice of wisdom (this was his third war) trying to keep the young man alive.  And frankly, in the military, as in so many other areas of life, a lot of stupidity gets done in the name of not looking like a coward, when, in fact, anyone with brains would actually be scared.

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2 hours ago, Ailianna said:

I read that more as him (and yes, it was Potter) giving the young GI permission to BE scared, and not be thought a coward for it.

Thank you, I see your point, but if that was Potter's intention, he could have said it in a kinder way. I think the young soldier likely heard it as a put-down.

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I am still very partial to the first three seasons with Trapper, Henry, and Frank and the more blatant humor. (I will admit that Potter and Winchester had more depth versus Blake [though he even had his moments] and Frank, but I watched for the laughs, mainly.)

After Margaret gets engaged to Donald Penobscott and Frank loses his mind, there's a moment when Frank is talking to his mother on the phone and he's telling her that he had a friend who wasn't really a friend. "She was just pretending to like me. Like Dad did." Larry Linville's line delivery there is heart breaking.

 

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Larry Linville, like most of the cast, was a really great actor.  He did much more with that two-dimensional part than most anyone else could have done.  And yes, that whole conversation is just heart-wrenching.  I pitied Frank more than hated him, which makes it harder to laugh at him.  Charles evoked no pity whatsoever in me, and I always figure he pretty much got what he deserved.

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6 hours ago, mmecorday said:

After Margaret gets engaged to Donald Penobscott and Frank loses his mind, there's a moment when Frank is talking to his mother on the phone and he's telling her that he had a friend who wasn't really a friend. "She was just pretending to like me. Like Dad did." Larry Linville's line delivery there is heart breaking.

 

Yes! I remember that now. Larry Linville played Frank as the butt of all jokes, but had the writers put in ANY effort as they did for the later cast, I could see Frank showing more layers as Linville WAS a good actor.

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Looks like MeTV will once again be showing the M*A*S*H finale movie, "Goodbye, Farewell, and Amen", on Veterans' Day, November 11th, from 7:00 p.m. to 10:00 p.m. ET.

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12 hours ago, Browncoat said:

Hm.  Wasn’t it only two hours originally?  

It's titled "MeTV Remembers The M*A*S*H Finale...", so maybe there will be interviews and such?

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Yeah, MeTV has been airing it with interviews added for the last few years. Plus, I remember the original airing on CBS as being 2.5 hours. 

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Oh good about the interviews and commentary -- I was worried they'd added a whole hour of commercials!  I remember it being two hours -- I was a Freshman in college, and we had a huge watching party.

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I may watch tonight because I don't think I have seen it in its entirely since it originally aired and I was only 12 years old then. I remember being traumatized about Hawkeye's confession that the woman on the bus smothered her baby to keep him quiet.

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I must admit that every time MASH shows up in my notifications, my heart plummets.  Thank goodness we are just being nostalgic.

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I'm watching as I normally get my daily MASH fix during this time slot - M-F. I get to see scenes that I never seen before. Like yesterday - "The Late Captain Pierce" - I had no idea that Hawkeye and Frank got into a physical fight, which also involved food,  in the mess tent during pay distribution, until I saw it on this channel.  Also - there is nothing else really on.

So maybe this finale airing will have scenes I didn't know about either. I do wish it had more comedy scenes. Seeing Hawkeye being counseled for a breakdown has a whole new meaning during a pandemic.

 It must have been filmed some time ago b/c William Christopher had a talking  point during the interview.

Today is Veteran's day - so  let me say Thank you to those who served in our armed forces. 🏁

As it relates to this show - Thank you to those cast members who served in this long running comedy project . To those cast members who longer are with us - rest in peace. You will always be in our hearts and mind.

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Edited by sATL
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1 hour ago, sATL said:

It must have been filmed some time ago b/c William Christopher had a talking  point during the interview.

 

These cast & crew interviews have been airing on MeTV for several years now, whenever they show this episode. You'll notice they've also shown Wayne Rogers, who died in 2015.

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Just some trivia:

Wayne Rogers (who, as is mentioned, was also interviewed for this [and died exactly a year before William Christopher, both on New Year's Eve]) and Jamie Farr were the only two cast members to serve in the actual Korean War.

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Watching the finale tonight was a gut punch all over again. I cried so hard when the characters were saying goodbye to each other and sobbed when Hawkeye's helicopter took off and he saw BJ's "Goodbye" written in stones. It was a beautiful way to end the series.

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13 hours ago, rubaco said:

These cast & crew interviews have been airing on MeTV for several years now, whenever they show this episode. You'll notice they've also shown Wayne Rogers, who died in 2015.

ok.

I am/was a follower of MASH on every other channel but MeTv until recently. It aired so much on TVland, Sundance and AMC? almost 7 days a week - until what almost a 1.5/2 yrs ago?  Still haven't found it on Saturdays and Sundays.

Sundance used to marathon it on Monday mornings , which I see now is replaced by Andy Griffith or Hogan's Heroes. I never really cared for Hogan Heroes. Andy sure has made a resurgence recently. Let me pop over to that board to see why. Not that I dislike Andy but wow, it really seems to be on all.... of.... the..... time...

I do wish they would have closed out - as to what he was going to do - the Dr Sydney Freidman character. His goodbye " pull down your pants and slide on the ice" was cute, but when the war is over - but what was his plans personally and professionally? Couldn't really  send his treated patients back into "the action" if the war was over.

another little snippet that has always worried me was when BJ visited Hawk at the hospital. I'm not sure it was wise to bring a flask. Also, to break out a paragraph about Erin's birthday, he could see that it agitated Hawk. He's lived with Hawk and winchester enough to know that not everyone wants a kid update - esp. if they don't have a kid. Granted BJ didn't know what pushed Hawk to his mental state, but surely he could have wiggled quickly from the subject of his daughter. And I always wonder why he didn't tell Hawk about the rumors of the peace talks..

Edited by sATL

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18 hours ago, sATL said:

And I always wonder why he didn't tell Hawk about the rumors of the peace talks..

This last part, I get. Even back in the Trapper era, there was an episode about the rumor that a cease fire was happening (which Trapper was skeptical of!) - and didn't. I think there was also an episode or two with the theme with BJ. So, knowing the other times were false alarms, why get Hawkeye's fragile hopes up for yet another disappointment?

One more little piece of trivia: Per IMDB, Mike Farrell's real-life daughter is named...Erin.

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On 3/6/2019 at 8:06 PM, chitowngirl said:

But that doesn’t explain how Klinger scored a tent to himself when the Officer nurses were 4 to a tent with bunk beds...

As a female, with lecherous men on the loose on an incessant prowl, I wouldn't want to be by myself. There is safety in numbers. I can't honestly say I seen any if the nurses carry a weapon- even something as simple as a baseball bat. I would have at least hid a scalpel in a sheath in my pocket.

That is a good quality point for Charles. He didn't make it an off-duty job looking for which nurse to bed down with.

A funny scene was when Hawk, BJ and Charles pulled a prank by putting the helicopter's travel mannequin in  Margaret's closet.  Lots of laughs, but what if that was real person, who snuck in while she was away?

I felt sorry for Margaret when she was trapped in a supply shed with Trapper, who made it clear "I sure as hell don't want to take inventory" comment, while they awaited help. Any other nurse its no telling what the outcome could have been. I get shivers just thinking about it.

Speaking of the nurses- I didn't get why all of them were LTs- except the two who were  old friends of Margaret ; one who had a drinking problem and the one Charles did fall for - Lorriane from the 8063. It only takes 2 years to go from 1st LT (silver bar) to Capitan. If the show was to simulate close to 3 years, someone should have promoted. Also - most of the nurses had experience somewhere prior, so that the majority should had been at least 1st LT ,yet I think a couple were 2nd LT (gold bar).

Nurses can also be enlisted- Army Practical Nursing Specialist, licensed as a LPN,  - odd they weren't weeded into the cast.

Edited by sATL
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On 11/14/2020 at 3:28 AM, sATL said:

I felt sorry for Margaret when she was trapped in a supply shed with Trapper, who made it clear "I sure as hell don't want to take inventory" comment, while they awaited help. Any other nurse its no telling what the outcome could have been. I get shivers just thinking about it.

Trapper was a lot of talk, but he was, despite the comments, respectful of Margaret. She even told Frank as much. Even if it was another nurse, I think Trapper would have tried some advances. But I also believe, had she said no, as with Margaret, it would have been the end of it. Trapper as shown on the TV version, anyway, didn't strike me as a rapist in waiting.

On a side note, I notice in those early episodes, there will the supply tent and the one where Margaret gets wasted after requesting a transfer and again when Trapper had his hernia and was thrown a going-away party when it was thought that he would be going home, that Margaret seemed to crush on Trapper, not Hawkeye. Only when Trapper was gone did that dynamic seem to shift.

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On 11/11/2020 at 7:16 PM, sATL said:

I'm watching as I normally get my daily MASH fix during this time slot - M-F. I get to see scenes that I never seen before. Like yesterday - "The Late Captain Pierce" - I had no idea that Hawkeye and Frank got into a physical fight

It may have been inspired by the movie version [as Radar narrates outside with Col. Blake]:

 

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I stumbled on YouTube a random link to the first scene of the first episode (which I hadn't seen literally in decades) and seeing it did make me very sad about a few decisions they quickly made on the show.

First, Spearchucker is part of that opening sequence.  I fully understand the show waking up to how bad an idea it was to have a black man nicknamed "Spearchucker" on their show, but what's ridiculous is that their way of handling it wasn't to drop the nickname, but instead to erase the character.  I believe he lasted 6 episodes, and this opening reminded me of that.  Boo hiss.  The original writer of those horrid books the show was based on thought he was being clever saying the nickname was about how good the character was at tossing a javelin in college, but... come on.  Pretending it was some kind of post-racial claiming of a term by a character who'd have been in college/med-school in the 1940s?  That kind of thing, reclaiming the offensive, is definitely a more modern thing. From around the time the books were written in fact, but projecting it back to the 1940s and 50s was a cover for the author just making a rude joke of it. Why the TV producers didn't always see what a bad idea "Spearchucker Jones" was is a real question, but dwarfed by how bad an idea it was to deal with it the way that they did.

In later years one of the show producers claimed they dropped the character because they decided it was "tokenism" since there weren't actually any black surgeons in Korea. But if that was the case, why did they have this realization 6 episodes in instead of when originally putting the show together?  It's nonsense.  Plus, it's factually wrong on top of that. A man named Alvin Vincent Blount, Jr. was a black surgeon in a MASH unit in Korea. Here's proof, from the US Army itself:  https://www.army.mil/article/217374/black_history_month_recalling_the_first_african_american_mash_surgeon

Plus, there's at least some evidence if you search the net that there were others.  It was a knock-on effect of the racial integration of the Army, which happened in 1948.  

So the show echoing both the books and the movie, and having the character, wasn't actually a bad idea.  The only bad idea was keeping the nickname for a TV audience.  At least until the followup bad idea of dealing with it by simply erasing him.  Any later excuses they made mostly smack of them covering up for being hyperreactive at the time--at least some to people objecting to the nickname, but I bet even more from people complaining to the network that the show dared have a black character in the first place.

Of course, what did Spearchucker DO in the opening?  Threw a football.  Go figure.  Then again other characters were reading Bibles while playing footsie, drinking champagne or playing Golf, so I guess it's not that bad.

 

Another thing I saw in that intro and regret the show ditching was the filming style.  It was very Verite in style. The camera looks over shoulders, tracking along with them running for the helicopters, etc. Much later in the show, when they started doing lots of "very special episodes", I suppose there may have been sequences with fancier camerawork, but my memory of most of the initial seasons was simple utilitarian camerawork, at least after this Pilot episode.

 

The final thing I definitely wish they hadn't changed was Radar. He's very different in the movie, and at least some of this carries over into the pilot, and even that opening scene.  He's not the little boy they later steered him into, but wiser and snarkier.

  

 

 

Edited by Kromm
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On 11/14/2020 at 12:28 AM, sATL said:

As a female, with lecherous men on the loose on an incessant prowl, I wouldn't want to be by myself. There is safety in numbers. I can't honestly say I seen any if the nurses carry a weapon- even something as simple as a baseball bat. I would have at least hid a scalpel in a sheath in my pocket.

That is a good quality point for Charles. He didn't make it an off-duty job looking for which nurse to bed down with.

A funny scene was when Hawk, BJ and Charles pulled a prank by putting the helicopter's travel mannequin in  Margaret's closet.  Lots of laughs, but what if that was real person, who snuck in while she was away?

I felt sorry for Margaret when she was trapped in a supply shed with Trapper, who made it clear "I sure as hell don't want to take inventory" comment, while they awaited help. Any other nurse its no telling what the outcome could have been. I get shivers just thinking about it.

Speaking of the nurses- I didn't get why all of them were LTs- except the two who were  old friends of Margaret ; one who had a drinking problem and the one Charles did fall for - Lorriane from the 8063. It only takes 2 years to go from 1st LT (silver bar) to Capitan. If the show was to simulate close to 3 years, someone should have promoted. Also - most of the nurses had experience somewhere prior, so that the majority should had been at least 1st LT ,yet I think a couple were 2nd LT (gold bar).

Nurses can also be enlisted- Army Practical Nursing Specialist, licensed as a LPN,  - odd they weren't weeded into the cast.

Given that no one can give a truly accurate picture of how long anyone was there, even with references to General MacArthur all the way to the cease fire on the TV show I can give them a pass. Especially since all the major role officers except Hawkeye and Major Houlihan rotated in or out during the run of the show. And the war wasn't run on for the duration plus 6 months. Of course the big cosmic joke is that of all the characters it was only Sergeant Klinger that I remember who got promoted.

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2 hours ago, Raja said:

Given that no one can give a truly accurate picture of how long anyone was there, even with references to General MacArthur all the way to the cease fire on the TV show I can give them a pass. Especially since all the major role officers except Hawkeye and Major Houlihan rotated in or out during the run of the show. And the war wasn't run on for the duration plus 6 months. Of course the big cosmic joke is that of all the characters it was only Sergeant Klinger that I remember who got promoted.

A pass on what  - promotions or enlisted nurses ?

Frank got promoted when he left - his last call back to the 4077 and he talked to Hawkeye. He made Lt . Col. And then  there was the helicopter pilot - the owner of the mannequin- who stated he promoted twice. During war time, back then , promotions tended to move a little faster than peacetime.  Fr. Mulchey  also finally got promoted to captain - and he ranted some of his counterparts were already major.

If the series would have continued after the war - I suspect Margret would have promoted to Lt. Col. there was a nurse at the end-of-war dinner during the finale, who stated she came in at the tail end of WW2. She was a silver bar LT. that's too long to be a LT. Radar deserved a promotion to sergeant by the time he left.

The other officers , were just "there" and probably wouldn't have cared either way ,if they got promoted , as their focus was on the civilian world .  Potter came in looking for a place to nest for the time-in-service until retirement. He probably knew he couldn't/wouldn't make general.

 

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Alan Alda was one of the narrators of a audio book "soldiers of science" today. George S did  the interview..

I'll admit I was taken aback a little on how time can age a person... when you are so used to seeing them on MeTV 5 days a week, seeing them in real time... wow... But he still has a strong voice, so I guess that is why he was chosen for the book

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Wow (regarding Alan Alda now). But, as was said, his younger self is still on TV, so real life is just a bit jarring. But good for him for still keeping active and working! (He had a half-brother, Antony Alda, who was on Days of Our Lives in the early '90s and they looked so much alike! Alas, Antony Alda died at only 52 in 2009 of liver cirrhosis. For the record, their father, Robert Alda, also acted on Days of Our Lives [and on M*A*S*H!] in the early 1980s) Here is a picture of Antony Alda [who I believe also acted on M*A*SH in its final years!]:

aldaantony10.JPG

And here is a picture of Robert, Alan, and Antony Alda from a scene in M*A*S*H:

aldamash.jpg

 

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On 8/24/2020 at 11:23 AM, mmecorday said:

After Margaret gets engaged to Donald Penobscott and Frank loses his mind, there's a moment when Frank is talking to his mother on the phone and he's telling her that he had a friend who wasn't really a friend. "She was just pretending to like me. Like Dad did." Larry Linville's line delivery there is heart breaking.

MASH was great at scenes like this.  You start to really dislike a character and then you see what's in their heart.  I never saw Frank in the same way again after that scene.

 

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RIP to former NFL player turned actor, Mike Henry, a.k.a. Donald Penobscott, on M*A*S*H. (Also well known for playing Tarzan in the 1960s in a series of films and, probably most notably, Jackie Gleason's son, Junior, in the Smokey and The Bandit film(s).)

Apparently, he died of Parkinson's and chronic traumatic encephalopathy. Football is a harsh sport...

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On 2/10/2021 at 2:26 AM, WendyCR72 said:

RIP to former NFL player turned actor, Mike Henry, a.k.a. Donald Penobscott, on M*A*S*H. (Also well known for playing Tarzan in the 1960s in a series of films and, probably most notably, Jackie Gleason's son, Junior, in the Smokey and The Bandit film(s).)

Apparently, he died of Parkinson's and chronic traumatic encephalopathy. Football is a harsh sport...

Wasn't there 2 actors who played her husband? Which was the one hawk/BJ put in a half body cast...I think another actor appeared for the MASH Olympics episode..

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33 minutes ago, sATL said:

Wasn't there 2 actors who played her husband? Which was the one hawk/BJ put in a half body cast...I think another actor appeared for the MASH Olympics episode..

I think so. If I recall, I THINK the obituary mentioned him showing up in S6. So he was probably Donald #2.

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On 8/21/2020 at 12:35 PM, mmecorday said:

Boy, Hawkeye really begins to bug around season 5. I watched the episode where he quits drinking and he hits new levels of sanctimony. If I had been Shelly Long's character, I would have smashed that bottle of wine right over his head.

If I had to sit next to Shelly Long, I would have kept on drinking.🍷

I find her incredibly annoying.

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I'm finding it really hard to watch MASH now.  I pretty much won't watch any episodes after Larry Linville leaves - I don't dislike David Ogden Stiers it's just I found the humour was scarce on the ground and things became way too heavy handed.  But now I'm also finding the early seasons hard to watch.  The casual adultery played for laughs just isn't funny anymore - and the rampant sexism, which considering this is an Alan Alda show is pretty surprising really.  That said some of the early episodes I do still have to count among the best things I've ever seen on TV - that first time we meet Col Flagg - loved it.

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6 hours ago, WinnieWinkle said:

I'm finding it really hard to watch MASH now.  I pretty much won't watch any episodes after Larry Linville leaves - I don't dislike David Ogden Stiers it's just I found the humour was scarce on the ground and things became way too heavy handed.  But now I'm also finding the early seasons hard to watch.  The casual adultery played for laughs just isn't funny anymore - and the rampant sexism, which considering this is an Alan Alda show is pretty surprising really.  That said some of the early episodes I do still have to count among the best things I've ever seen on TV - that first time we meet Col Flagg - loved it.

Let us remember the show took place in the 1950s. As such, sexism WAS rampant. And even Mad Men glorified adultery in that era. Not saying it's right, but I think context does make a difference where some themes are concerned.

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I noticed an inconsistency the other night while watching the episode about Charles' tooth ache. He says that it's been seven years since he's seen a dentist. I guess he forgot about the time that drunk knocked a front tooth out.

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I don't always like Margaret, but something reminded me of the time she gave a patient a sponge bath.  The man was embarrassed at first, but she spoke cheerfully and looked him in the eyes the whole time.

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Speaking of Margaret, "Hot Lips and Empty Arms" from Season 2 [think that is the title!], the episode where Hot Lips ends things with Frank and then, as seemed to be the usual thing in those early years, wanting a transfer after another go-round with Hawkeye and Trapper, was on Me TV hours ago.

I really love that one, when Hawkeye/Trapper give her "champagne" (gin) as she lists what she will put in a report, then completely soused and visiting Henry. I like how, at one point, Henry says, "Why don't you call me Henry, for Pete's sake..." and she's all "that's really swell of you, Pete!". Add in that Margaret tells Blake he looks just like her father before he died (oh look, plot inconsistency!) and Margaret telling Trapper she could have went for him and telling Hawkeye/Trapper that "Frank Burns is a lipless wonder!", and I think it was one of the best/funniest early Hot Lips/Margaret episodes. Loretta Swit played drunk really well.

And it is something that her fascination was towards Trapper, not Hawkeye, until Trapper left the show. (She also - drunkenly again - made a pass at him in Trapper's ulcer episode!)

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I think initially Trapper and Hawkeye were supposed to be equal leads, but Hawkeye basically became "the" lead, which is a big part of the reason why Wayne Rogers left.  So it makes sense that Margaret initially went for Trapper.  In hindsight, it is a nice change.

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Speaking of Margaret, "Hot Lips and Empty Arms" from Season 2 [think that is the title!], the episode where Hot Lips ends things with Frank and then, as seemed to be the usual thing in those early years, wanting a transfer after another go-round with Hawkeye and Trapper, was on Me TV hours ago.

I really love that one, when Hawkeye/Trapper give her "champagne" (gin) as she lists what she will put in a report, then completely soused and visiting Henry. I like how, at one point, Henry says, "Why don't you call me Henry, for Pete's sake..." and she's all "that's really swell of you, Pete!". Add in that Margaret tells Blake he looks just like her father before he died (oh look, plot inconsistency!) and Margaret telling Trapper she could have went for him and telling Hawkeye/Trapper that "Frank Burns is a lipless wonder!", and I think it was one of the best/funniest early Hot Lips/Margaret episodes. Loretta Swit played drunk really well.

And it is something that her fascination was towards Trapper, not Hawkeye, until Trapper left the show. (She also - drunkenly again - made a pass at him in Trapper's ulcer episode!)

Loretta Swit deserved an Emmy for this episode. I love it too when Hawkeye gives her the B1 shot and she looks at him and says, "And I didn't get you anything."

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Apparently actress Arlene Golonka, known as the hapless Nurse Edwina, passed away on May 31st at age 85 due to Alzheimer's disease.

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In the episode where Radar is on leave just before Gary Burghoff left the show, the power goes out at the 4077th. Even when Radar is back on the job, he cannot manage to secure a generator. In this same episode, Col. Potter receives a telegram about the passing of Radar's Uncle Ed. How was he able to receive a telegram when the electricity wasn't working?

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Do telegrams come through phone lines?  My corded, plugged into the wall phone works when there's no electricity.

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