Figure Skating

[SeanC]

3 hours ago, Jeddah said:

My favorites were The Artist programs from the 2012-2013 season. I liked that he continued a theme from his short to his long. 

I’m surprised that more skaters don’t do that.  It’s an obvious way to add an extra layer of artistic cred. 

[Avaleigh]

22 minutes ago, SeanC said:

I’m surprised that more skaters don’t do that.  It’s an obvious way to add an extra layer of artistic cred. 

Wasn't there an ice dancing team that did two versions of Romeo and Juliet for the short and long? I might totally be misremembering. 

[Jeddah]

22 minutes ago, Avaleigh said:

Wasn't there an ice dancing team that did two versions of Romeo and Juliet for the short and long? I might totally be misremembering. 

I vaguely remember an ice dancing team doing it too. The girl was a showgirl or something and the guy was a nerd? Not a great theme to begin with, much less build two programs around.

[Harry24]

In addition to Denis's friends and family, my thoughts immediately went to Frank Carroll, imagining how awful this must be for someone of his age who has devoted his life to coaching.  I believe he was still Denis's primary coach, wasn't he?

[Jeddah]

4 minutes ago, Harry24 said:

In addition to Denis's friends and family, my thoughts immediately went to Frank Carroll, imagining how awful this must be for someone of his age who has devoted his life to coaching.  I believe he was still Denis's primary coach, wasn't he?

Phil Hersh’s article has some comments from Frank Carroll. He shared some very sweet memories of Denis.

http://www.globetrottingbyphiliphersh.com/home/2018/7/19/a-sad-untimely-farewell-to-denis-ten-iconic-as-the-artist-on-ice

[EVS]

1 hour ago, Jeddah said:

Phil Hersh’s article has some comments from Frank Carroll. He shared some very sweet memories of Denis.

http://www.globetrottingbyphiliphersh.com/home/2018/7/19/a-sad-untimely-farewell-to-denis-ten-iconic-as-the-artist-on-ice

Great article. Thanks for posting the link. The last story/paragraph was so sweet, I was fighting back tears after reading it. 

[doodlebug]

7 hours ago, Jeddah said:

Phil Hersh’s article has some comments from Frank Carroll. He shared some very sweet memories of Denis.

http://www.globetrottingbyphiliphersh.com/home/2018/7/19/a-sad-untimely-farewell-to-denis-ten-iconic-as-the-artist-on-ice

Thanks for sharing that, what a lovely article.  Dennis Ten was a really special skater, both artist and athlete.

[honeywest]

10 hours ago, Jeddah said:

I vaguely remember an ice dancing team doing it too. The girl was a showgirl or something and the guy was a nerd? Not a great theme to begin with, much less build two programs around.

Zhiganshina and Gaszi, the German ice-dance team. They also had a zombie number and a Carmen in which she wore a housedress and he wore an undershirt.

[annzeepark914]

11 hours ago, honeywest said:

Zhiganshina and Gaszi, the German ice-dance team. They also had a zombie number and a Carmen in which she wore a housedress and he wore an undershirt.

Now this ^^ I wish I had seen!  A housedress on her, an undershirt on him.  Sort of like Stella and Stanley on ice.  He could've been yelling, Stelllllllllllllllllllaaaaaaa across the rink, as the Carmen music blasted away.

[Omeletsmom]

On 7/19/2018 at 7:28 AM, Enero said:

Denis Ten Dies at 25

This is terrible and sad. May he Rest In Peace. 

Oh no!  That is horrible!

[HartofDixie]

[surreysmum]

On the subject of linked programs, I remember Phillippe Candeloro had Godfather programs one year for both short and long.  Candeloro never did it for me (I was always put off by how loose-limbed and - not his fault - bandy-legged he was, not to mention his dude persona) but the Godfather year was his most successful in my books.  

[Enero]

^ It really is amazing that Candeloro was able to medal in any competition considering his wild technique and clunky skating. I guess he was entertaining enough though. Also, I think his career peaked at the perfect time, when there really weren't any consistently strong contenders for silver and bronze for a couple of seasons. Him managing to defend his OBM in 98' was surprising, but considering how others skated at that event, I guess he managed to have a better skate i.e. not end up on his ass. 

[annzeepark914]

This was competitive skate of Candeloro's that I remembered (actually, what I remembered was the sword fight down the ice...you almost could see that "sword").  Scott said, Phillipe was program-oriented, he skated for the audience and not the judges. I sort of miss this style of skating.

[galaxygirl76]

I'm pretty sure I've said it here or int he Olympics thread but that steps sequence is a thing of beauty that is rarely seen anymore (imo of course), artistically he was so much fun to watch.

[doodlebug]

16 minutes ago, galaxygirl76 said:

I'm pretty sure I've said it here or int he Olympics thread but that steps sequence is a thing of beauty that is rarely seen anymore (imo of course), artistically he was so much fun to watch.

I was fortunate enough to see him skate live in Lillehammer.  He wasn't always the most graceful, but he knew how to connect with an audience and bring them into the skate.  He had a charisma and warmth that so many skaters today lack.  He also did have beautiful, intricate step sequences the likes of which we almost never see these days.

Candeloro had a tremendous ability to connect with the character and the music and tell a story with his skating.  Just so fun to watch.

Edited July 24, 2018 by doodlebug

[annzeepark914]

I'm trying to think of which skater(s) pulled in an audience like Phillipe did with that sword fight.  Jason Brown sure did with his Riverdance program (loved that choreography & music).  Possibly Michelle Kwan at Worlds 2003? where attendees said that 2/3's of the way through her LP, the audience was applauding and making so much noise that she said later she couldn't hear her music.  I want to add Mishkutenok/Dmitriev's '94 Olympic Rachmaninov LP as I recall the audience was applauding it before it ended (but that could've been just me going wild over it at home). Oh wait...a more recent audience puller-inner was the bronze medal winners Black Swan FD at the 2014 O's in Russia (and I don't think it was just home crowd rapture). Figure skating, as it's become more technically difficult, has lost a lot of that creativity/artistry.  I'm sure there are more heart-stoppers...just can't think of them right now.

[Crs97]

I saw Candeloro skate live, and he was sex on ice.  Not my type and not even in the top ten skaters that night, but he had charisma to burn and everyone was standing by the end.

[ML89]

Candeloro has presence and charisma, which you can't teach, and thrived on performing. That sword step sequence is so good - I miss those big highlight sequences where they weren't trying to rack up every point and the skate could just breathe. I wasn't the biggest Yagudin fan but his step sequences were terrific. Now most seem to skate within themselves and try to rack up all the points. It gets really dreary after awhile. 

[annzeepark914]

13 hours ago, ML89 said:

It gets really dreary after awhile. 

This sentence says it all, IMO, about today's figure skating competitions.  Most of the skaters do skate within themselves (even in exhibitions where you'd think they'd let it all hang out and go wild...they pick some sad piece of music that "speaks" to them but not to the rest of us).  I remember Yagudin's 2002 LP step sequence and how exciting it was.  There's another skater who got the crowd worked up.

[Harry24]

Quote

I'm trying to think of which skater(s) pulled in an audience like Phillipe did with that sword fight.

I will always get goose-bumps at Shen and Zhao's 2003 Worlds: 

 

It certainly is hard to think of other more recent examples under the current scoring system.  "Dreary" is truly the word.

[Crs97]

I know my Boitano hero worship is showing, but he drew people in not because he played to them, but because he was just simply fantastic.  Watching him in person, you couldn’t help but marvel at his power and technique and speed.  I swear he could cover the length of the ice with one push of his skate and still be faster than anyone else.  His clean lines, his height on jumps that flowed with the program - no one seems to be able to do that anymore.

[ombelico]

5 hours ago, Crs97 said:

I know my Boitano hero worship is showing, but he drew people in not because he played to them, but because he was just simply fantastic.  Watching him in person, you couldn’t help but marvel at his power and technique and speed.  I swear he could cover the length of the ice with one push of his skate and still be faster than anyone else.  His clean lines, his height on jumps that flowed with the program - no one seems to be able to do that anymore.

And that spread eagle. God, that spread eagle.

[Crs97]

His spread eagle is a wonder of nature.

[Mellowyellow]

I really enjoyed Alina's Don Quixote with the crazy backloading and bright tutu. I've watched it soooooo many times now. I love the fast music and the jumping spree she goes on.

Really wish she had nailed it at Worlds too. She made it look so easy at the Olympics and Worlds showed just what could go wrong when it did go wrong. 

[annzeepark914]

Backloading aside, I too enjoyed Alina's skating at the O's. That girl has presentation skills that a lot of skaters can only dream of.  It's going to be interesting to see how she does with balanced  programs this season.  Do wish she could/would switch coaches.

[displayname]

13 hours ago, annzeepark914 said:

That girl has presentation skills that a lot of skaters can only dream of. 

She's a good skater with a special quality to her skating, but her body awareness, and response to the music via stretching out her movement to the music need more work.

[Jeddah]

Frank Carroll Retires

I can’t believe he’s been a coach for 60 years. What a career!

[Harry24]

31 minutes ago, Jeddah said:

Frank Carroll Retires

I can’t believe he’s been a coach for 60 years. What a career!

No mention of Ten?  

[SeanC]

For Canadian skating, one of the more interesting/important storylines for this season is going to be Stephen Gogolev's long-awaited debut on the international junior scene.  He (along with the other notable Canadian junior men) were all at the Minto Club's recent event.

The junior men aren't doing quads in the short program this year, apparently, so his short is on the lower end in terms of technical content (I expect they'll all put quads in for Canadian nationals):

 

The free skate was a bit erratic (it was a problem for everybody, due to the short amount of time between the SP and the FS), but still, he's a 13-year-old with a quad Lutz.

[displayname]

On 7/30/2018 at 3:26 AM, SeanC said:

The free skate was a bit erratic (it was a problem for everybody, due to the short amount of time between the SP and the FS), but still, he's a 13-year-old with a quad Lutz.

Unimpressed with his technique. He jumps big though.

[Jeddah]

Phil Hersh’s article about Frank’s retirement:

Frank Carroll: At 80, he retires from a “frozen life” of transcendent coaching success in figure skating

There’s quite a bit in this article that I hadn’t heard before. He seems to have had a falling out with about half of his skaters, but it sounds like most of them reconciled at some point!

[HartofDixie]

[Mellowyellow]

Sneak Peek of Alina's new program!

 

The cutting of the  music is ridiculous! Why must they try to fit the entire soundtrack into a SP?

Her music box spin bit is gorgeous though! 

Apparently she takes a while to adjust to her programs so I look forward to a later version.

Now to wait for Evgenia's program! 

[displayname]

Zag's program looks pretty awful. She can't possibly be expected to hold a position or perform with those psychotic music cuts. Shame, she seems to be performing better than she did last season at the beginning there.

[Mellowyellow]

Her general skating skills have improved imo even though I've always been a fan and enjoyed her skating! The music cuts are ghastly and sabotaging her!

Beautiful girl though!  

[SeanC]

The Asian Open was last weekend, which this year was the first Challenger event.  Lim Eun-soo won the ladies' event -- really lovely short program; iffy on the free skate (not just in delivery, some of the choreo doesn't make sense to me).

[Enero]

23 hours ago, Mellowyellow said:

Her general skating skills have improved imo ....The music cuts are ghastly and sabotaging her!

I agree.  Her carriage and skating skills appear to have grown leaps and bounds overnight. Her jumps look more effortless as does her basic skating skills. That said, it still feels as if she's rushing through a lot of positions. Some things could be held just a half a second longer. IMO. 

And I agree the music cuts are horrible. It's not helping that POTO is so very tired. Wish it would be banned for at least 10 years along with Carmen.

[annzeepark914]

15 hours ago, Enero said:

And I agree the music cuts are horrible. It's not helping that POTO is so very tired. Wish it would be banned for at least 10 years along with Carmen.

Not Carmen!! No, no, no.  There's so much drama to Carmen, provided the right skaters use it (e.g., Cappellini & Lanotte, V/M).  Wish the powers that be could stipulate that only strong, artistic skaters could use these warhorses (with the ability to tell a story while skating). Ah, well.  Like that'll ever happen.

[NUguy514]

No, Carmen needs to get the fuck gone for a while.

[ML89]

Ban Carmen, POTO, anything Rachmaninoff, Tango De Roxanne and Your Song (Vincent Zhou and the Australian lady at least skated new cuts so they get a pass), half a dozen others I'm blanking on but I read in people's lists of new programs and I just sighed. I'm so tired of all of them. Hell a season long rest would be enough.

I loved Toth to AC/DC, there's a novice I just saw skating to "Look What You Made Me Do," Adam to his club song - anything new, please? 

[HartofDixie]

15 hours ago, ML89 said:

Ban Carmen, POTO, anything Rachmaninoff, Tango De Roxanne and Your Song (Vincent Zhou and the Australian lady at least skated new cuts so they get a pass), half a dozen others I'm blanking on but I read in people's lists of new programs and I just sighed. I'm so tired of all of them. Hell a season long rest would be enough.

I loved Toth to AC/DC, there's a novice I just saw skating to "Look What You Made Me Do," Adam to his club song - anything new, please? 

Add in Les Mis, Chicago, and Despacito!

[ML89]

12 hours ago, HartofDixie said:

Add in Les Mis, Chicago, and Despacito!

Les Miz! Yes! 

I thought we’d be hip deep in, say, Katy Perry’s Firework, or some other song (okay Candy Man & Despacito are exceptions) but instead, out come the warhorses again.  

[SeanC]

The Quebec summer skate event just concluded.  These are always a bit weird to watch, what with the elite international skaters mixed with people who are basically hobbyists (especially at the adult level).  Most of the Quebec-based elite skaters came out for at least a short program, though several (Moore-Towers/Marinaro and Soucisse/Firus, notably, withdrew rather than skate the free).

One of the new pairs teams, Justine Brasseur and Mark Bardei (Justine is Isabelle's niece), debuted.  A lot of work to do there, of course, given that they're a very new team, but they already have a great twist.

The most interesting action was in the dance field, the highest concentration of prominent international-level competitors.  This being a Quebec event, Team Gadbois was all over the place, not just the Canadians, but also the French team of Lauriault/Le Gac and a Bulgarian team (who had the single most eye-catching element).  Of the most immediate interest, in terms of what events are coming out, is probably Marjorie Lajoie and Zach Lagha, Canada's #1 junior team, who'll be aiming to bring home some major hardware in their final junior season:

These are taken off the Skate Quebec livestream, so they're a bit erratic in places, but overall I like the look of both programs.  A little stumble from Marjorie in the free, but otherwise good execution too, particularly this early in the season.

Laurence Fournier Beaudry/Nikolaj Sorensen and Soucisse/Firus both competed in the RD (the latter withdrew after, as I previously said), so we also got a preview of the bronze medal hunt at Nationals this year.  F-B/S placed 0.87 points ahead of S/F.

[Jeddah]

I’m a big UNC fan, and came across this article and video about Rachael Flatt today. She’s getting a PhD at UNC and wants to study the role of technology in helping athletes with eating disorders.

Meet a Tar Heel: Rachael Flatt

[SeanC]

First day of the JGP Slovakia, the beginning of the Junior Grand Prix.

In the men's short program, the lead goes to Canada's Stephen Gogolev (poor audio quality here compared to the video I posted earlier).

In the ladies' short, the lead goes to Russia's Anna Shcherbakova.

And in pairs, the Russian team of Anastasia Mishina and Aleksandr Galiamov.

Edited August 23, 2018 by SeanC

[Mellowyellow]

Apparently there is a quad lutz in Anna Shcherbakova's final skate. 

[SeanC]

On 8/24/2018 at 6:41 AM, Mellowyellow said:

Apparently there is a quad lutz in Anna Shcherbakova's final skate. 

She chose not to attempt it, as it turns out.

In the men's free, Gogolev became the first Canadian and youngest person to land a quad Lutz.  He also did a quad toe and a quad Salchow-triple toe combination.

[displayname]

Both Shcherbackova and Gogolev's 4Lz have technique issues, and Gogolev's 4Lz shouldn't have been ratified as being clean. 

Gogolev is the first skater whose technique has been built by TCC coaches pretty much from base-up. The best technicians from that camp were Yuna and Yuzuru -- both of whom learnt basics from their childhood coaches. There are a LOT of issues there, and Gogolev's an interesting case for TCC's approach to basics. There is no reason for him to have such messed up jumps at his age, and there was certainly no reason for him to do an incorrect 4Lz in the LP, and there is even less of a reason for him to even be practising a 4Lz at all when he gets unclear edges on his 3Lz (which was also ratified clean).

[SeanC]

The JGP continues on.

Biggest discovery of the JGP Lithuania event for me was definitely ice dance.  Count me as a fan of Oona and Gage Brown; will be excited to see how they develop.