All Episodes Talk: What's Up Doc?

[marceline]

I've been binging "ER" on lockdown and now I'm up to "Be Still My Heart." Watching how Carter just attacks and dismisses Lucy over and over again while hovering over Abby is kind of infuriating.

[WendyCR72]

1 hour ago, marceline said:

I've been binging "ER" on lockdown and now I'm up to "Be Still My Heart." Watching how Carter just attacks and dismisses Lucy over and over again while hovering over Abby is kind of infuriating.

To be fair, Lucy was also dismissive. She was always seemingly trying to pretend she knew things she didn't and would get prickly when given simple advice/instructions.

Carter was a real tool with her, but Lucy annoyed me so damned much that I didn't - and still don't - really care.

[marceline]

13 hours ago, WendyCR72 said:

To be fair, Lucy was also dismissive. She was always seemingly trying to pretend she knew things she didn't and would get prickly when given simple advice/instructions.

Carter was a real tool with her, but Lucy annoyed me so damned much that I didn't - and still don't - really care.

Understood. Lucy as a character never really worked for me. I didn't dislike her so much as was bored by her. They tried so hard to make her interesting but the only thing I found interesting about her was her death.

[readster]

17 minutes ago, marceline said:

Understood. Lucy as a character never really worked for me. I didn't dislike her so much as was bored by her. They tried so hard to make her interesting but the only thing I found interesting about her was her death.

I agree, even after she died and we met her mother, it then opened up this: "Where is her father?" "How did she even get into med school?" Then add in everything with the character where one minute she knew things and then be so brain dead, she didn't ask for help UNTIL it was too late. I still find the patient that killed her played by David Krumholtz, just didn't come off right either. Not only him walking into the staff lounge and everyone was: "Get out!" I would love to know where he hid that Butcher's knife or the way he just hid away and then stabs both Lucy and Carter and then just runs out and then of course, hit by a car and he is still going off.

Then two years later: "I'm so sorry for what I did, I don't have a job, and I'm hurting myself, but my classmates got me off and my wife and daughter love me. Now if you excuse me, I'm heading over to CBS and my wife is going to be on Gilmore Girls for the next six years." 

[WendyCR72]

6 hours ago, marceline said:

They tried so hard to make [Lucy] interesting but the only thing I found interesting about her was her death.

Yeah, pretty much this.

[MVFrostsMyPie]

Something I’ve personally thought about myself! https://m.eonline.com/news/1136008/how-er-would-handle-coronavirus-according-to-neal-baer 

“"The closest we came to a pandemic in the first seven years of ER, when I was a writer/producer, was in "Exodus," an episode featuring the late Mickey Rooney. The ER was evacuated owing to a benzene spill. If we were to do the show today, I'd pitch that everyone in the ER would undergo an antibody test to see who has already been exposed to Covid-19 and has recovered.

We'd find out that Ross (George Clooney), Carter (Noah Wyle), and their nemesis, Weaver, (Laura Innes), all had caught Covid-19 but were asymptomatic. They'd be on the front lines since it's unlikely that they'd contract it again. They'd have their typical triage arguments, the electricity would go out, and they'd all take turns bagging patients together, since the generators are being used in the ICU and OR. Of course their personal stories would come out as they're sitting together huddled over patients, bagging them. We'd see Ross and Weaver hand-in-hand saving the patient and they'd reveal something deeply personal to each other (you'll have to watch the episode to learn their secrets!).“

[marceline]

As I rewatch the scene where Carter goes to his first AA meeting and locks eyes with Abby my heart sinks because I know that I'm watching the beginning of one of the most dysfunctional relationships in all of television history.

[Danny Franks]

40 minutes ago, marceline said:

As I rewatch the scene where Carter goes to his first AA meeting and locks eyes with Abby my heart sinks because I know that I'm watching the beginning of one of the most dysfunctional relationships in all of television history.

Definitely dysfunctional. But a walk in the park compared to Lee Adama/Kara Thrace.

There's just something so dispiriting about Carter's character journey in E.R. He goes from that wide eyed, bouncy puppy of a med student to a sad, lonely man too scared to reach out to his wife in case he has to come to terms with the fact she doesn't care. I guess it all started to go downhill with Abby.

What could have been, if Maria Bello had stayed, or if they'd cast and written Lucy better. Or if they'd just let Carter and Chen get together.

Edited April 1, 2020 by Danny Franks

[doodlebug]

54 minutes ago, MVFrostsMyPie said:

Something I’ve personally thought about myself! https://m.eonline.com/news/1136008/how-er-would-handle-coronavirus-according-to-neal-baer 

“"The closest we came to a pandemic in the first seven years of ER, when I was a writer/producer, was in "Exodus," an episode featuring the late Mickey Rooney. The ER was evacuated owing to a benzene spill. If we were to do the show today, I'd pitch that everyone in the ER would undergo an antibody test to see who has already been exposed to Covid-19 and has recovered.

We'd find out that Ross (George Clooney), Carter (Noah Wyle), and their nemesis, Weaver, (Laura Innes), all had caught Covid-19 but were asymptomatic. They'd be on the front lines since it's unlikely that they'd contract it again. They'd have their typical triage arguments, the electricity would go out, and they'd all take turns bagging patients together, since the generators are being used in the ICU and OR. Of course their personal stories would come out as they're sitting together huddled over patients, bagging them. We'd see Ross and Weaver hand-in-hand saving the patient and they'd reveal something deeply personal to each other (you'll have to watch the episode to learn their secrets!).“

I guess he forgot about the monkey pox.  Wish that I could.

[Growsonwalls]

On 4/1/2020 at 10:50 AM, Danny Franks said:

Definitely dysfunctional. But a walk in the park compared to Lee Adama/Kara Thrace.

There's just something so dispiriting about Carter's character journey in E.R. He goes from that wide eyed, bouncy puppy of a med student to a sad, lonely man too scared to reach out to his wife in case he has to come to terms with the fact she doesn't care. I guess it all started to go downhill with Abby.

What could have been, if Maria Bello had stayed, or if they'd cast and written Lucy better. Or if they'd just let Carter and Chen get together.

Looking back season 6 was the last season where ER believed that beloved characters deserved nice things. Like Mark's dad's storyline was an example -- Mark made peace with his dad, his dad got to live out his life in a way that made him happy, we all cried and everything was good even though Mark's dad died. Carol got the feel good ending with Doug too.

After that the writers just stopped believing that TV audiences wanted to see good things happen to their favorite characters. Nothing good happened to Carter, Mark (duh), Peter, Luka, Kerry, Abby, Sam, Rocket Romano, etc. To this day I don't get why the writers wanted so many calamities to pile on top of each other. Why did Romano have to face The Attack of the Helicopter ... twice? 

The only nice thing was the final season had more of the optimism that was a hallmark of the early ER seasons. The finale had some optimistic threads. Rachel Greene was going to be a doctor at county. Peter and Lizzy seemed to want to start things again. Carol and Doug were doing well. 

[marceline]

16 hours ago, Growsonwalls said:

Looking back season 6 was the last season where ER believed that beloved characters deserved nice things. Like Mark's dad's storyline was an example -- Mark made peace with his dad, his dad got to live out his life in a way that made him happy, we all cried and everything was good even though Mark's dad died. Carol got the feel good ending with Doug too.

After that the writers just stopped believing that TV audiences wanted to see good things happen to their favorite characters. Nothing good happened to Carter, Mark (duh), Peter, Luka, Kerry, Abby, Sam, Rocket Romano, etc. To this day I don't get why the writers wanted so many calamities to pile on top of each other. Why did Romano have to face The Attack of the Helicopter ... twice? 

You're so right and it's really jarring since I'm just letting episodes autoplay. There's a real difference in the version of Abby that shows up in S6 and the one in S7 onward. I'm still confused at the purpose of Malucci. What was he supposed to bring to the table? Then there's the utterly dreary Cleo, the pitiful relationship between Weaver and Legaspi, and I had completely forgotten that Abby and Luka's first date ended in manslaughter.

[readster]

1 hour ago, marceline said:

You're so right and it's really jarring since I'm just letting episodes autoplay. There's a real difference in the version of Abby that shows up in S6 and the one in S7 onward. I'm still confused at the purpose of Malucci. What was he supposed to bring to the table? Then there's the utterly dreary Cleo, the pitiful relationship between Weaver and Legaspi, and I had completely forgotten that Abby and Luka's first date ended in manslaughter.

Yeah, I felt that ER really fell into the "writing by the seating of their pants" that has been doing on for decades from books to TV. Where they have an idea for a character, really only have the basics and then just see "where it goes." Malucci was a prime example and so was Weaver and Legaspi. Both were also influence by actors other committments to other TV Series/Networks. Same with Stanley Tunchi later on during the last two years. All of a sudden it was: "Well this doctor show got cancelled, let's grab Stan. Then it was: "Well, now he is getting a bunch of movie deals, and he wants to pursue them, so let's just see how we can end this on a dramatic note." I also thought them making Abby and Luka more miserable as time went on just a joke. From Luka wanting to leave the show to Tucci who went on twice with Abby about how affairs are the death of everything including his wife having one that ended his marriage, to then being a hypercrict and doing it with Abby and ruining her marriage and then later saying how it helped his wife and him get back together because of their son's bipolarism. ER seem to be transfixed on mental disorders after they killed Lucy. 

[marceline]

On my current lockdown rewatch. I'm watching "Dear Abby" and listening to Bill Withers's "Use Me" playing while Abby works triage. (RIP, Bill Withers).

How did ER manage to keep the rights to so much original music for streaming?

Edited April 10, 2020 by marceline

[marceline]

Watching "Impulse Control."

Sam and Abby talking about their abortions was "ER" doing what it did best.

At the same time it seems like the season was obsessed with pregnancy and babies. Kerry & Weaver, Carter & Kem, Lewis & Chuck, and that's before getting to the multiple patients who were pregnant or pregnancy-adjacent.

[PamelaMaeSnap]

I've JUST started bingewatching all of this ... I watched it sporadically over the years but due to my work/life commitments and hours during its run, never on a regular basis, so being #stayathome AND retired with not much to do except knit and read, having 15 seasons of this is a treat. 

But I do have a question that I am hoping someone could answer (did a quick Google with no luck and don't want to read the 83 pages of this thread, not because I'm lazy but because I don't want to get spoiled on my remaining 12-plus seasons, so hope someone can help!

Was Omar Epps' run as Dr. Gant at a point in his professional career where it was specifically planned as a short stint as a "special guest star"? Or was there a point where he may have been supposed to have a longer run and they cut it short because of other professional obligations? 

Definitely a gut punch moment (no pun/irony intended). 

Thanks in advance for any insight! I'm trying to parse out the episodes in small doses to make it last but I have minimal self-control ...

 

 

[doodlebug]

12 minutes ago, PamelaMaeSnap said:

I've JUST started bingewatching all of this ... I watched it sporadically over the years but due to my work/life commitments and hours during its run, never on a regular basis, so being #stayathome AND retired with not much to do except knit and read, having 15 seasons of this is a treat. 

But I do have a question that I am hoping someone could answer (did a quick Google with no luck and don't want to read the 83 pages of this thread, not because I'm lazy but because I don't want to get spoiled on my remaining 12-plus seasons, so hope someone can help!

Was Omar Epps' run as Dr. Gant at a point in his professional career where it was specifically planned as a short stint as a "special guest star"? Or was there a point where he may have been supposed to have a longer run and they cut it short because of other professional obligations? 

Definitely a gut punch moment (no pun/irony intended). 

Thanks in advance for any insight! I'm trying to parse out the episodes in small doses to make it last but I have minimal self-control ...

 

 

Omar Epps was always meant to be a guest star.  He had done some decent roles and was not unknown but his biggest parts came after he appeared on ER.  He worked on ER in 1996-97.  Probably his  biggest role was on House which didn't premiere until 2004; well after ER.

[PamelaMaeSnap]

2 hours ago, doodlebug said:

Omar Epps was always meant to be a guest star.  He had done some decent roles and was not unknown but his biggest parts came after he appeared on ER.  He worked on ER in 1996-97.  Probably his  biggest role was on House which didn't premiere until 2004; well after ER.

Thank you SO much for the clarification! I really like him a lot, so was happy to see him and then sorry to see him killed off so quickly ... Should I add House to my watch list??? I do love medical "soaps" (huge fan of Grey's as well, and loved St. E back in the day) ... 

 

[doodlebug]

6 minutes ago, PamelaMaeSnap said:

Thank you SO much for the clarification! I really like him a lot, so was happy to see him and then sorry to see him killed off so quickly ... Should I add House to my watch list??? I do love medical "soaps" (huge fan of Grey's as well, and loved St. E back in the day) ... 

 

I'm not a big fan of House or really any other medical shows.  I did enjoy St Elsewhere.  I've never seen an episode of Grey's.  I have seen New Amsterdam and The Resident among the current crop of medical shows.  I couldn't make it past the first 15 minutes of The Resident and I only watch New Amsterdam to complain about the ridiculous plots.

The first 4 seasons or so of ER are the standard by which I compare medical dramas and I can't say I've found any that compare favorably.

[MVFrostsMyPie]

House is the only other medical show** besides ER that I really liked (although the last couple seasons were not great, but that's how it goes with most shows). "it's never lupus!"

Plus it had some pretty recognizable faces through the years.

**ETA: medical *drama* that I really liked (Scrubs is my other favorite medical show)

Edited April 16, 2020 by MVFrostsMyPie

[jewel21]

I've been re-watching House and I love it. He's such a dick, but an amusing one. You can definitely give it a try. I also watch The Resident. 

[doodlebug]

9 hours ago, MVFrostsMyPie said:

House is the only other medical show** besides ER that I really liked (although the last couple seasons were not great, but that's how it goes with most shows). "it's never lupus!"

Plus it had some pretty recognizable faces through the years.

**ETA: medical *drama* that I really liked (Scrubs is my other favorite medical show)

Forgot about Scrubs, that was a great one!  Also far more medically accurate than the vast majority of medical drama shows.

I work in health care and, while I can deal with shows taking liberty with the details in order to provide entertainment; so many of them resort to completely ridiculous storylines that bear no resemblance to reality.  Take me right out of the story.

Edited April 16, 2020 by doodlebug

[ShortyMac]

House is one of my favorite shows ever. ER is #1, though.

[Dr.OO7]

On 4/4/2020 at 11:44 AM, marceline said:

I'm still confused at the purpose of Malucci. What was he supposed to bring to the table?

From the way he acted in his very first episode, I'd say he was intended to be one of the two Suspiciously Similar Substitutes to Doug (Luka being the other)--brash, impulsive, problems with authority, rebellious, clashes with Weaver, womanizing, a Berserk Button about abusive parents that seemed to stem from his own experiences, etc., as well as be the comedic relief character.

Unfortunately, it failed miserably precisely BECAUSE he was so similar and therefore never really got his own identity, and them never using him in Season 7 certainly didn't help. I still remember one episode where all we saw of him was when he was leaving for the day.

[readster]

20 minutes ago, Camille said:

From the way he acted in his very first episode, I'd say he was intended to be one of the two Suspiciously Similar Substitutes to Doug (Luka being the other)--brash, impulsive, problems with authority, rebellious, clashes with Weaver, womanizing, a Berserk Button about abusive parents that seemed to stem from his own experiences, etc., as well as be the comedic relief character.

Unfortunately, it failed miserably precisely BECAUSE he was so similar and therefore never really got his own identity, and them never using him in Season 7 certainly didn't help. I still remember one episode where all we saw of him was when he was leaving for the day.

They also kept throwing Malucci under the bus every time they could. Then when he was being fired, Weaver goes into Mark saying how much he had so many reprimands from other hospital admin and had failed TWO rotations before he was on the show. Then they threw in he "had a daughter to support". Never clarified or even brought up. 

It just showed they had no real plan outside probably the original show notes for the character. We had much, much better character work on Luka and apparently more of a "love" for the actor than Dr. Dave. 

[Hiyo]

I never really saw him as any type of replacement for Doug.

To me he was the show fuck-up who never got better at his job (according to what we were told) and truthfully, I never felt like he really brought much, so I wasn't too sad to see him go.

[readster]

15 minutes ago, Hiyo said:

I never really saw him as any type of replacement for Doug.

To me he was the show fuck-up who never got better at his job (according to what we were told) and truthfully, I never felt like he really brought much, so I wasn't too sad to see him go.

Right and unlike the cliche tv "screw up" he actually eventually got himself fired. 

[doodlebug]

1 hour ago, readster said:

Right and unlike the cliche tv "screw up" he actually eventually got himself fired. 

I think at least part of the problem was that the show brought on a busload of new characters in Season 6 and, at some point, TPTB decided that Abby was the breakout star of that crop and everyone else's stories were backburnered to give her screentime.

I think there was a story and a character arc for Malucci's character that simply never played out.  Partly, I don't think the actor was all that talented, but mainly, the show decided to shift focus away from the ensemble and onto just a couple of major characters.  ER had a history of interesting villains from Dale the smarmy med student/resident to Carl Vucelich to early days Romano and even Kerry.  Malucci could've been a character who exhibited growth and maturation just as Doug's character had, but he never got the screen time and, by the time he left, nobody cared anymore.

[marceline]

Another "what was the point of...?" question: Sara Gilbert's Jane.

From the moment she shows up she's just wallpaper. They even make a point of how nobody listens to her. She was on the show for three years (I looked it up) and the only story she got that was about her is the weird S&M relationship with Crenshaw which lasted one or two episodes and was obviously just done for comic effect. I don't get it.

[readster]

16 hours ago, marceline said:

Another "what was the point of...?" question: Sara Gilbert's Jane.

From the moment she shows up she's just wallpaper. They even make a point of how nobody listens to her. She was on the show for three years (I looked it up) and the only story she got that was about her is the weird S&M relationship with Crenshaw which lasted one or two episodes and was obviously just done for comic effect. I don't get it.

Oh I know and really never brought anything to the table outside of Lela needing to make a few references to her story line and then leave. Same with Kirsten Johnson's Nurse Manager, they seem to be planning something with her and even her putting Morris and other cast members in their place when they did stupid stuff. Then *poof* she was gone. Another waste of a character that could have been pretty interesting. 

[Growsonwalls]

I liked Malucci. I thought there was a good person in there somewhere. I'll always remember him reading a family's goodbye to a man who was going to be taken off life support. 

But he entered ER at a time when they didn't seem to know what to do with any new characters other than Luka and Abby. 

[ShortyMac]

1 hour ago, Growsonwalls said:

I liked Malucci. I thought there was a good person in there somewhere. I'll always remember him reading a family's goodbye to a man who was going to be taken off life support. 

But he entered ER at a time when they didn't seem to know what to do with any new characters other than Luka and Abby. 

And he did it after the patient died. Stood next to him and read it.

[BooksRule]

Each morning, I've been keeping Pop Channel's airing of 'ER' episodes in the background (in the next room) as I work from home.  I see from looking ahead in the TV guide that episodes next week will include Mark's Hawaii episode ('Somewhere over the rainbow' gets me every time) and Romano's first helicopter encounter. I'm not sure if I'll watch those or not. 

[readster]

1 hour ago, BooksRule said:

Each morning, I've been keeping Pop Channel's airing of 'ER' episodes in the background (in the next room) as I work from home.  I see from looking ahead in the TV guide that episodes next week will include Mark's Hawaii episode ('Somewhere over the rainbow' gets me every time) and Romano's first helicopter encounter. I'm not sure if I'll watch those or not. 

1. The problem with Romano losing his arm is it does several things very stupid. 
2. Romano acting like has never been by a helicopter 
3. Romano acting like everyone is so stupid in how they are getting the patient onboard
4. Romano acting like his bosses and best doctors in the hospital are idiots trying to save him and his arm
5. Later that he is killed by one too from apparently a pilot who never dealt with a change in wind

[Hiyo]

Quote

But he entered ER at a time when they didn't seem to know what to do with any new characters other than Luka and Abby.

I think that was because it might have just been easier to slot them into pre-existing conceived roles. Luka was initially a replacement for Doug, and Abby was a med-student who drifted until they slotted her into Carol's head nurse position.

 

[BooksRule]

Oops, I read the TV guide wrong.  Mark's Hawaii episode just aired. I didn't watch it (it was on the background in another room), but I did hear 'Over the rainbow' just now. 😞 

[TigerLily20]

7 hours ago, BooksRule said:

Oops, I read the TV guide wrong.  Mark's Hawaii episode just aired. I didn't watch it (it was on the background in another room), but I did hear 'Over the rainbow' just now. 😞 

I caught this episode this morning and proceeded to cry like a baby while painting a room as soon as that song started.....gets me every time....

[Gigi43]

On 4/15/2020 at 9:13 PM, PamelaMaeSnap said:

Thank you SO much for the clarification! I really like him a lot, so was happy to see him and then sorry to see him killed off so quickly ... Should I add House to my watch list??? I do love medical "soaps" (huge fan of Grey's as well, and loved St. E back in the day) ... 

 

 

I love House. One thing I always credit House with, where ER failed, I think House and Wilson, as screwed up as they were, have a much more believable friendship than Mark and Doug ever did. And on the topic of TV doctor messed up friendships, House and Wilson are much better than Sean and Christian on Nip/Tuck. 

 

Anyone is welcome to argue with me, but my mind has been made up for years. 

Edited May 2, 2020 by Gigi43

[Danny Franks]

I never watched House, but I agree Doug and Mark weren't very convincing as friends. They seemed more like 'we've worked together for years, so we know each other and get on well' but they were too different in their outlooks and attitudes to truly be friends. Were they supposed to have been at med school together, or had they just met at County?

Doug and Susan were a much better match as long term buddies. They both had that mischievous sense of humour and cynicism, while Mark was very milquetoast and oddly naive about a lot of things. I could easily see them as med school friends, who maybe hooked up once or twice, but had realised that they didn't like each other like that.

But whenever I rewatch the first couple of seasons, I find myself wishing that Susan had been the keystone that the rest of the show was built around. Sherry Stringfield is so much fun, and so full of life and energy.

Edited May 2, 2020 by Danny Franks

[Bastet]

11 minutes ago, Danny Franks said:

But whenever I rewatch the first couple of seasons, I find myself wishing that Susan had been the keystone that the rest of the show was built around.

Yes!  Susan was a good doctor, and a good teacher (in the first season, there are numerous examples - just little things, almost in the background of scenes - of her being the one to make sure Carter gets to learn something), so I'd have preferred her in the "Mark" role of the ER.  (Also, it would have been nice having a woman in that role.)

 

[WendyCR72]

3 hours ago, Danny Franks said:

But whenever I rewatch the first couple of seasons, I find myself wishing that Susan had been the keystone that the rest of the show was built around. Sherry Stringfield is so much fun, and so full of life and energy.

Good to know others liked Susan. I did, too! (Well, Version #1. Version #2, Abby had Susan's old schtick family-wise so they made her sort of a party girl or whatever.) I was so excited when she came back, but the newer crop of writers had no clue how to write for her. Sigh.

[Hiyo]

Quote

They both had that mischievous sense of humour and cynicism, while Mark was very milquetoast and oddly naive about a lot of things.

I don't know, I can't remember Doug and Susan interacting all that much unless they were working on a case.

We did see Mark and Susan occasionally having fun, I do think she brought out his more relaxed side.

 

Quote

But whenever I rewatch the first couple of seasons, I find myself wishing that Susan had been the keystone that the rest of the show was built around.

Or at the very least, that SS didn't leave the show in season 3.

Edited May 3, 2020 by Hiyo

[marceline]

The last of my "Why?" characters...Simon Brenner.

There's a lot about the show in the last two seasons that needs to be chalked up to the WGA strike but I really don't understand the why of Brenner.

He's basically a bootleg version of Romano: he's an obnoxious bigot from the moment we meet him. (Although if I'm honest, every character showed up from S10 on had an obnoxious introduction.) He crushes on Neela the same way Robert crushed on Corday.

Then the show tries to rehabilitate him through tragedy. With Romano it's the helicopter, with Brenner it's childhood sex abuse.

 

 

[Danny Franks]

10 hours ago, Hiyo said:

I don't know, I can't remember Doug and Susan interacting all that much unless they were working on a case.

We did see Mark and Susan occasionally having fun, I do think she brought out his more relaxed side.

 

There were a few times when Susan and Doug made fun of Weaver behind her back, and those are the scenes that come to mind when I think about the, interacting. They had that mean-spirited side to them that Mark really didn't have.

I do agree that Susan and Mark seemed like real friends as well, even if it was always clear that Mark held a torch for Susan. Because he did lighten up around her, whereas he always got more judgy when he was dealing with Doug.

[doodlebug]

On 5/2/2020 at 6:12 PM, Danny Franks said:

I never watched House, but I agree Doug and Mark weren't very convincing as friends. They seemed more like 'we've worked together for years, so we know each other and get on well' but they were too different in their outlooks and attitudes to truly be friends. Were they supposed to have been at med school together, or had they just met at County?

Doug and Susan were a much better match as long term buddies. They both had that mischievous sense of humour and cynicism, while Mark was very milquetoast and oddly naive about a lot of things. I could easily see them as med school friends, who maybe hooked up once or twice, but had realised that they didn't like each other like that.

But whenever I rewatch the first couple of seasons, I find myself wishing that Susan had been the keystone that the rest of the show was built around. Sherry Stringfield is so much fun, and so full of life and energy.

Mark went to med school with Peter.  Doug knew Kerry from somewhere else, I don’t remember if it was med school or residency.  There are obviously multiple med schools and residences in the Chicago area; so people can cross paths in all sorts of ways.

Mark and Doug always struck me as work friends, not everyday life friends. Mark married young and Rachel was born while he was still in med school as I recall.  Jen was in law school for much of Mark’s residency.  With a busy wife and a young child, I don’t picture Mark having much in common with Doug apart from work and certainly not interested or available for the sort of social life Doug favored.

Edited May 4, 2020 by doodlebug

[Dr.OO7]

On 5/4/2020 at 7:46 PM, doodlebug said:

Mark and Doug always struck me as work friends, not everyday life friends. Mark married young and Rachel was born while he was still in med school as I recall.  Jen was in law school for much of Mark’s residency.  With a busy wife and a young child, I don’t picture Mark having much in common with Doug apart from work and certainly not interested or available for the sort of social life Doug favored.

Those two always struck me as the clichéd scenario of "polar opposite best friends secretly envy each other's life".

[RedbirdNelly]

On 5/1/2020 at 9:00 AM, BooksRule said:

Oops, I read the TV guide wrong.  Mark's Hawaii episode just aired. I didn't watch it (it was on the background in another room), but I did hear 'Over the rainbow' just now. 😞 

I cry every time. 

On the topic of Doug and Mark's friendship and whether that is believable--I get the arguments being made on why it doesn't add up. I can't disagree but it had never occurred to me and I think that is a function of strong overall show writing and the good acting. On weaker shows (cough Chicago Med cough), the less realistic points just shout out at me all. the. time.

 

 

[Growsonwalls]

Eh I think work friends often are opposites in personality. I think Mark and Doug were believable as friends. Maybe because George Clooney and Anthony Edwards had good chemistry. But also because I believe that someone as dour and square as Mark probably wanted someone fun to chew the fat with during residency. 

[Dr.OO7]

23 hours ago, Growsonwalls said:

Eh I think work friends often are opposites in personality. I think Mark and Doug were believable as friends. Maybe because George Clooney and Anthony Edwards had good chemistry. But also because I believe that someone as dour and square as Mark probably wanted someone fun to chew the fat with during residency. 

I thought they were too. As stated, their chemistry made it believable despite them being polar opposites in personality.

I absolutely hated Mark by the time Doug left, but when he declares, "I love him like a brother", I completely believed it. And I believed his getting choked up when he followed that up with "But I can't do this anymore." Doug himself declaring "I've probably lost my best friend." was equally heartbreaking.

Edited May 10, 2020 by Camille

[Dr.OO7]

I just realized that today would have been Carol and Tag's 25th anniversary had they married and had it lasted. 

It really says something for the show's quality that his anguished breakup speech could make you feel sorry for him, a Bland Perfection Disposable Fiancé who we're not even supposed to care about.

[WendyCR72]

3 hours ago, Camille said:

I just realized that today would have been Carol and Tag's 25th anniversary had they married and had it lasted. 

It really says something for the show's quality that his anguished breakup speech could make you feel sorry for him, a Bland Perfection Disposable Fiancé who we're not even supposed to care about.

I liked Tag. Granted, I wanted Doug and Carol to find their way back to each other, but I wouldn't have been opposed to Tag sticking around. Of course it helped that Rick Rossovich was easy on the eyes. LOL!

Speaking of which, even usually bland Tag had a good line or two. I remember when that pizza driver had some sort of attack and drove through the ER. Tag walked by, saw the car, and quipped, "Did somebody order a pizza?"

I know the actor went on to play a police Lieutenant on Pacific Blue on USA Network.