Spoiler Discussion: The apple was poisoned?!

[YaddaYadda]

And someone should explain them that you can have drama and yet include little sweet moments of domesticity.

 

This is what I find interesting.  Rumple and Belle will be shown on their honeymoon, last year, you had that scene for Robin/Regina in front of the fire place having a glass of wine, Snow and David have had something here and there (and one scene in bed to boot), so I'm not really sure about Emma and Hook.  I actually enjoy little scenes where the characters are doing something else.

[Shanna Marie]

I love how they keep talking about what they'd like to see happen. Aren't these the people who are writing the show and can make it happen? Or is this proof that the writing fairies come in during the night and produce the scripts?

 

And are you required to come across like a twelve-year-old girl full of squee over every relationship in order to be an entertainment writer?

[retrograde]

I'm a bit surprised that David is the one having a bit of a hard time with Emma and Hook together. Guess he doesn't really remember what he said around that camp fire. I'm actually looking forward to that.

It was hard to tell from the way that was written whether that was actually what A&E told them or if they were just riffing off Josh Dallas's quote.

[Anakerie]

Rumple comes into possession of the hyenas from "The Lion King" and gives them to Belle as a wedding present. She actually said she wanted more high heels but he misunderstood. 

[FabulousTater]

I'm sure he does remember that conversation, but you also have to remember that she is his daughter. I'm sure he is probably a bit aprehnsive about a pirate dating his princess -- no matter how noble the pirate has become. Although I'm sure it would be that way with any man with his daughter.

Ha. Except for the guy that got his underage daughter pregnant, abandoned her, and sent her to prison! No, that guy The Charmings name Emma's brother after him! Sorry, but not sorry. IMO Charming lost his "Dad Card" privileges for that one (and Snow lost her Mom Card). If Charming doesn't like that Emma is dating Hook, Charmz can stick it where the sun don't shine. 

 

I would pay big money if that conversation went more like this:

Charming: I swear, Hook, if you hurt my daughter, I'll...

Hook: You'll what? Name your son after me? Have at it, mate. That's "Killian", two "L"s. "K-I-L-L-I-A-N".

 

(And no, I will never let that go (shut up, Elsa!) I will forever hate Charming and Snow for naming their son after the douchebag who screwed over their daughter. Haaaate. They will take this grudge away from me when I'm cold and dead in my grave. Or when the writers realize how twisted it is that The Charmings named their son after the guy who screwed over their daughter and rename the Snowflake to something else; Lancelot, Leo, Stealthy, Pongo, I don't care. Anything unrelated to the douchebag. )

Edited September 20, 2014 by FabulousTater

[Shanna Marie]

I'm a bit surprised that David is the one having a bit of a hard time with Emma and Hook together. Guess he doesn't really remember what he said around that camp fire.

Or that he encouraged Emma to take Hook as backup when confronting Zelena. Or that he was perfectly okay with Hook going to talk Emma out of her "I'm going to New York" freakout panic snit. I can see there being a bit of cognitive dissonance with realizing that "Charles" and "Leia" were Hook and Emma, since they didn't look the same to David, but if he remembers at all, and he seemed to, since they ended up in the storybook, he should be well aware of the lengths Hook will go to for Emma. Just the fact that he followed her into the portal should mean something, even if he doesn't remember. The guy who'll jump into a time portal or break into the Evil Queen's castle for her has to be a better option from a dad's point of view than the flying monkey spy or the guy who knocked her up as a teenager and then vanished from her life, leaving her to serve time in jail for his crime.

[stealinghome]

The guy who'll jump into a time portal or break into the Evil Queen's castle for her has to be a better option from a dad's point of view than the flying monkey spy or the guy who knocked her up as a teenager and then vanished from her life, leaving her to serve time in jail for his crime.

"Better" still doesn't mean "good," though.

[Amerilla]

Or that he encouraged Emma to take Hook as backup when confronting Zelena

As canon fodder.

[sharky]

Knowing A&E, it'll end up being some dumb passing throwaway line. Yet here we are desperate for spoilers.

[retrograde]

Apparently this is a BTS shot from in the studio. The actress also says:

 

Once Upon A Time...there were extensions, eyelashes and gowns...and a VERY happy actress

[Shanna Marie]

Knowing A&E, it'll end up being some dumb passing throwaway line.

It'll probably be like the "I'm going to stop chasing after this woman" line they teased as though it meant Hook was going to give up on Emma, and it actually meant the exact opposite. So it will be just a joking line after David acknowledges that he remembers what he said to "Prince Charles." Just a clap on the shoulder and something like "I know you'd do anything for her, but hurt her and ..." To which Hook would likely reply something like, "Frankly, mate, I'm more afraid of Emma than I am of you. I know better than to hurt her."

[KAOS Agent]

I should know better than to read any A&E interviews. They just piss me off. Apparently, Emma's a life ruiner now. Regina has the love of her son, a wonderful home, no worries about money, a wary acceptance from people she'd previously terrorized and cursed, but a bump in her romantic life (a life she wouldn't have had had she not murdered her boyfriend's wife) and her life is ruined. Ruined, I tell you!

 

I'm also less than impressed with David being unhappy about Hook/Emma. David's assessment of his daughter's boyfriends seems pretty messed up to me. He actively encouraged Emma to go on a date with the man who'd knocked her underage self up, set her up and ditched her deal with it all alone in prison. The same one she'd actually wished was dead because it was too painful to deal with it all again. Emma is an adult who raised herself and can make her own decisions about what she wants, so really David should just stay out of it. 

[Serena]

I love how they keep talking about what they'd like to see happen. Aren't these the people who are writing the show and can make it happen? Or is this proof that the writing fairies come in during the night and produce the scripts?

Eddy ALWAYS talks like that. I remember at PaleyFest, mid-season 2, when they asked about CS and he said he'd "like to see it happen". Duh. 

 

I think it would be much more interesting if Snow were the one to have a problem with CS. Clearly, David will be portrayed as wrong and unreasonaable (and/or it will be just a quick comedic moment), but it would make a nice storyline instead if Snow were having problems with CS because it doesn't "fit" her definition of TL. 

 

Every time they say that Regina's life is "ruined", they undermine their own writing about how Henry is just the MOST IMPORTANT THING IN THE WORLD to her. Whatever. Emma's life wasn't ruined when she lost Graham, Neal, when she was at odds with Hook, etc, because she still had Henry. When CS inevitably go throught sweeps drama and break up, nobody will be claiming that Emma's life is "ruined". That's really pathetic.

[Crimson Belle]

If your life can be ruined over a guy you've been with for 2 days, then you need to get a life.

[Amerilla]

Well, Regina hasn't gotten any since she murdered her sex slave, so I can see her being more than mildly put out (so to speak).

[NotBothered]

Apparently this is a BTS shot from in the studio. The actress also says:

Looks like there's going to be some snow involved in whatever that is.  Although I guess snow is not really much of a spoiler these days...

[Dani-Ellie]

Since Once is now snagging the cast of Army Wives (Sally Pressman is known to me as Roxy Leblanc, who was awesome), I'd like to put in my vote for Brigid Brannagh as a grown-up Merida.

[Serena]

I had this thought while reading the "Questions" thread with people talking about Regina's vault: wouldn't it be interesting if Regina and Henry's "operation" were going after all the people whose heart Regina took and giving them back? That's something Henry would think needs to be done, it would advance Regina's redemption, give them time together, and it could even be funny with a little bit of a procedural element (Regina did say she took so many she basically forgot, so they would have to investigate, discover clues, etc to find out whose heart belongs to which person. Plus, how do the people react?)

[stealinghome]

Serena, that's a genius idea. We often talk about how much more humor Once needs--that could bring the humor in spades! (While also being touching and actually doing good things for the Regina character.)

 

I doubt it will happen, though. As far as I can tell, the show has totally forgotten that Regina still has those hearts and ought to return them.

Edited September 20, 2014 by stealinghome

[Shanna Marie]

I'd like to put in my vote for Brigid Brannagh as a grown-up Merida.

Oh, she'd be perfect! Her hair is just right (and I would be rather outraged if they ever do a live-action Merida with a wig or with a curling iron because the movie actually got the curly hair right, for a change, and they didn't straighten it as part of a makeover transformation -- curly girls represent!).

 

Emma is an adult who raised herself and can make her own decisions about what she wants, so really David should just stay out of it.

I loved it when Hook pointed that out -- that it wasn't for David to decide whether or not Emma got with him.

 

But really, if they were encouraging Emma to be with the guy who knocked her up and got her sent to prison as a teenager, then I can't see how they'd have any room to object to the guy who has traveled multiple times between worlds for her, traveled in time for her and gave up everything he owns to reach her and then reunite her with them. They wouldn't even have Emma in their lives now if it hadn't been for Hook. They'll come across as awfully petty if they keep objecting.

 

If Rumple and Hook are going to be at odds again, I hope Rumple starts it because so far, Hook has been pretty mellow about him. Even when Zelena was making Rumple attack Hook, Hook didn't seem too upset about it and didn't take it personally from Rumple, and when he encountered Past Rumple he didn't show any animosity, even when Rumple tried to kill him. So it would take something pretty major for Hook to get riled up at Rumple again, like Rumple doing something else to him or to someone else.

[YaddaYadda]

I hope whatever objections David has regarding Hook will bring about some kind of a discussion that's NOT off screen between him and Snow.  Let's lay the cards on the table, shall we and know once and for all how those two feel about everything.  You know one of those scenes A&E seem to hate so much because they're too domestic or have too much depth for their pea brains.  It's fine that David has objections, I mean other than Emma having grown up without her parents which is something neither he nor Snow wanted, I understand him wanting what's best for her. 

 

But as a viewer, I don't want a no, they shouldn't be together, then a slammed door and it ends there.  I want an explanation...

[l star]

I didn't read the spoiler as David being dead set against the relationship. I just read it as him having reservations. Since Hook will be the first boyfriend he has actually been around, I'm not surprised he wouldn't be all for it. I don't think it will be about Hook at all. It will be about David seeing Emma in a romantic relationship for the first time.

I would love for Regina and Henry's new mission to be returning her hearts! It would also tie into Henry's work at Rumple's shop with all of his stolen prizes nicely.

[stealinghome]

Well, also, absolutely Hook has done a lot for Emma--but he's also the one who just last week was lying about the kiss curse to Emma and her family, let's not forget, and who's done some real shit to them in the past. (And who also doesn't have a job, and who may not have many transferable skills [he may, but we don't know], and who maybe seems to drink a lot.) Frankly, I'd think Charming was insane if he didn't have reservations about Emma dating Hook.

Edited September 20, 2014 by stealinghome

[kili]

I'm curious about that new building they are building in "Storybrooke". For a production that seems to like to green screen so many of their sets (unless it is a frequently used set like the interior of Grannies or Snows) or use existing buildings, why are they going to so much trouble to construct a temporary building? It's two stories high and built to simulate a brick building (of course, it's just plywood with a great paint job). Geographically, it's being constructed behind the "Rabbit Hole", but that doesn't mean that it is where it will be portrayed as being. The location where the building sits is only being rented until September 25th, so it will be torn down. Do they need a really specific looking building or do they need to be able to damage it?

 

Updated with recent pictures (side and corner)

Edited September 20, 2014 by kili

[RadioGirl27]

I hope whatever objections David has regarding Hook will bring about some kind of a discussion that's NOT off screen between him and Snow.  Let's lay the cards on the table, shall we and know once and for all how those two feel about everything.  You know one of those scenes A&E seem to hate so much because they're too domestic or have too much depth for their pea brains.  It's fine that David has objections, I mean other than Emma having grown up without her parents which is something neither he nor Snow wanted, I understand him wanting what's best for her. 

 

But as a viewer, I don't want a no, they shouldn't be together, then a slammed door and it ends there.  I want an explanation...

I would love to see a scene of David and Snow (I refuse to call her Mary Margaret) talking about Emma, about Hook, about anything really, but we know this writers. They prefer to show the characters running around like headless chickens either that showing them having meaningful conversations.

 

 

Well, also, absolutely Hook has done a lot for Emma--but he's also the one who just last week was lying about the kiss curse to Emma and her family, let's not forget, and who's done some real shit to them in the past. Frankly, I'd think Charming was insane if he didn't have reservations about Emma dating Hook.

If they hadn't pushed Emma towards Neal and even called their son like the guy who knocked up her underage daughter and sent her to jail for his crimes, I would agree with you. But, at this point, David and Snow don't have the right to say anything.

 

 

I'd like to put in my vote for Brigid Brannagh as a grown-up Merida.

Who is Merida? Because everytime I read that name I think in the Spanish city.

[Dani-Ellie]

Merida is the main character in Brave. (Here's Brigid Brannagh's IMDb page, just for kicks. :) She's basically been in everything.)

 

 

 

Oh, she'd be perfect!

 

Wouldn't she just?? Now I really want this to happen, haha.

Edited September 20, 2014 by Dani-Ellie

[RadioGirl27]

Merida is the main character in Brave.

Oh, I haven't seen it.

 

New interview with A&E, now in Variety. Nothing really new, but

 

Emma bringing back Marion in the finale obviously threw another wrench in her relationship with Regina, but as you said, Regina has also evolved. What can you preview for their dynamic this season?

Kitsis: I think the relationship is tough because Emma decided to save a life, and that life kind of destroyed Regina’s happiness, and so they may have been at it at the top, but one of the things we’re excited to explore is, you know, what does Emma think about Regina? How does she look at her now, and how does Regina look at Emma now? And there’s going to be an entire episode devoted to just that relationship and how they feel about each other.

Oh boy! I'm so skipping that episode.

[Serena]

‘Once Upon a Time’ Showrunners Talk ‘Frozen,’ the Charming Family’s Challenges and Regina’s Evolution

 

An entire episode devoted to how Emma and Regina feel about each other? That won't create wank at all. Also, I doubt they're gonna do that in an emotionally honest manner (taking into account the fact that Regina is responsible for Emma's crappy childhood). But I guess they've taken into account the people saying "Emma being all 'tralala' about a sibling who gets everyone she missed out on is ridiculous" and they're doing that.

[Rumsy4]

I'm not surprised to hear that Charms may have some issues with Hook dating Emma. If the writers treated any of them as real characters, the show would be completely different. OUAT thrives on upping drama by introducing conflict. IMO, the idea was always Hook and Emma to be endgame. That's why Charms had a problem with Hook right from the start--so that their truce after Good Form would seem all the more dramatic. Neal and Emma were never meant to be endgame, (and god knows the writers shy away from writing FOR Emma), it is no surprise that they didn't want to "waste" their already crowded screentime for Neal/Charming scenes. Remember, the dwarfs were side-eyeing Charming right after he had woken Snow up from the Sleeping Curse with freaking True Love's kiss? So, of course, David's all going to go into daddy!Charming mode over Hook and Emma's fledgling relationship. How much that translates into actual screen-time is a different story. 

 

Read the article above. If I hear the writers accuse Emma of ruining Regina's life or destroying her happiness one more time, I may start throwing things at the wall. And Serena, I would LOVE for you to be right about Henry and Regina's Operation Cobra being about the hearts.

 

And the promised Emma flashback in Episode 5--is it the whole episode, or just about five minutes long? 

[KingOfHearts]

Kitsis: What we’re really excited about is that we’re going to explore an Emma flashback to her days in foster care in episode five.

 

Yay! Emma flashback.

 

But also, Emma’s going to have some new responsibilities in town, and as far as Charming, he’s going to continue to be a great dad to Emma.

New responsibilities for Emma? I thought they were for Snow. Maybe it's a mistype.

 

This is not about Regina reverting to be being The Evil Queen from season one. She can’t; she’s come too far

Thank God. I hope they're actually right.

 

what does Emma think about Regina? How does she look at her now, and how does Regina look at Emma now? And there’s going to be an entire episode devoted to just that relationship and how they feel about each other.

Is this Swan Queen bait or something?

Edited September 20, 2014 by KingOfHearts

[stealinghome]

Is this Swan Queen bait or something?

No, it's just their massive permaboner for Regina coming out as usual.

 

imo, Adam and Eddie are stuck between a rock and a hard place on this, because the show was always written to have Emma-Regina be the central relationship in Storybrooke. I don't think it's fair to accuse them of queerbaiting (although I'm sure they will be) because they're continuing to write Emma and Regina as weird frenemies/co-parents.

[Jean]

I think Snow and Woegina was always the central relationship, even in S1 and in Storybrooke.

That interview just zapped all my enthusiasm for 4A. Dollars to donuts its just more Woegina asskissing and it'll be a replay of Bleeding Through with Emma. And it's probably the episode with Emma's flashback. We'll find out teen Emma was a brat like her mommy and her life was so good compared to poor poor Woegina. Damn I really hate that Mary Sue succubus.

Oh well at least Jane E is writing Charming's centric. That's something. And how the hell did Variety get away with asking so many questions and getting answers about Emma and the Charmings?

[RadioGirl27]

I just think it's stupid to devote a whole episode to the "relationship" between Emma and Regina, when they haven't dedicated one to the relationship of Emma and her parents. And, really, we know the episode would be Emma apologizing to Regina for "destroying her happiness" and kissing her ass.

Edited September 20, 2014 by RadioGirl27

[KingOfHearts]

 

I don't think it's fair to accuse them of queerbaiting (although I'm sure they will be) because they're continuing to write Emma and Regina as weird frenemies/co-parents.

I wasn't accusing them of queerbaiting, but I do find it as a lure for Swan Queeners to some degree.

 

 

I just think it's stupid to devote a whole episode to the "relationship" between Emma and Regina, when they haven't dedicated one to the relationship of Emma and her parents. And, really, we know the episode would be Emma apologizing to Regina for "destroying her happiness" and kissing her ass.

Is Emma and Regina's status really a mystery, anyway? We saw it in 3B in multiple places, but most prominently in Witch Hunt. We haven't had a clue what Emma's relationship is like with her parents right now.

Edited September 20, 2014 by KingOfHearts

[Emma]

I was just thinking today about what I needed in my life. And realized it was an hour dedicated to how Emma and Regina feel about each other. NOT. Lots of alcohol will be consumed that night.

Is it really too much to ask that they do right by the Emma character just once this season??

[retrograde]

I think if you asked Emma at the end of last year ‘how do you feel about your parents having a baby?’ she would say, ‘that’s fantastic.’ But then you’re like… ‘well, why would I be jealous? Why would I care?’ But then seeing your mom get to cradle a baby and give them all the things that you didn’t have, it starts bring up things that you never thought were inside yourself. We all have thoughts and feelings and emotions that we aren’t aware of until something triggers them.

This is good, I think. I know people were annoyed that those issues with Snowflake weren't explored earlier, during the pregnancy, but I actually agree with the writers that it is probably more realistic for them to hit her once the baby is actually born and out in the world. But I do hope this is an ongoing thing, not just contained within one episode where Emma makes some pouty faces then hugs it out at the end of the hour and everything is forgotten.

 

Given they've specified episode 5 as an Emma-foster care flashback, I guess that puts a damper on speculation that her issues with Hook involve her magic going back to her childhood (unless she only explains it, and we don't actually see it). Because that's supposed to come out episode 3, right?

[KingOfHearts]

I hope the Emma flashback isn't just to display how horrible her childhood was. Though we haven't seen that onscreen yet, I'd much rather it be about something significant that happened during that time that directly relates to whatever's happening in the present.

[Serena]

405 is the one directly after the disastrous date, right? Maybe whatever goes wrong gets her to think back on her foster homes.

[MaiLuna]

Quote

 

And, really, we know the episode would be Emma apologizing to Regina for "destroying her happiness" and kissing her ass.

 

Most likely. It makes me mad. Actually, Emma should just say "screw you" to Regina since she tried to kill her, caused her be alone for 28 years, emotionally abused her son and tried to kill her parents multiple times. And let's not forget that about 24 hours before Marian comes back, she witnessed her mother getting burned by her and she herself was in the dungeon to be executed after being called a street rat. If it ends with something like Emma thanking Regina because without the curse, Henry wouldn't exist, my blood pressure will go through the roof. The worst part is, I can totally see  it happening.

 

 

I think the Emma flashback may tie in with her feelings about her newborn brother. Or is episode 5 too late for that? I guess it depends on how much time goes by between the 4A episodes.

[Jean]

Well episode 5 is called Breaking Glass. I don't think they're touching real life child abuse what with all the new Frozen fans they're trying to get. It's one thing to have a kid eat a poisoned apple because that's still in the fantasy realm, it's another to seeing someone get belted.

I had my money on her magic wreaking havoc but would that be too close to Elsa? I don't know if Disney would want an exact clone of Elsa side by side. Similarities is one thing but this might be a case of too close for comfort. I have a feeling it's going to be a case of "attachment disorder." We'll see that some foster home did try reaching out to her but she's the closed off one. Kind of like a replay of the finale where Emma was shown to be the one in the wrong because she's closed off. That will still be related enough to Elsa and Anna except obviously Elsa was given the sympathetic portrayal. I'm not sure Emma will fare as well.

[Serena]

I mean, if they try to paint an abused teenager as the one in the wrong because she doesn't want to get close to people before they've proven themselves to her, I may have to break something. Breaking glass indeed.

Edited September 21, 2014 by Serena

[NotBothered]

I'm curious about that new building they are building in "Storybrooke". 

It looks distinctly municipal to me.  Do we have a well established exterior for the Sheriff's office?  And where did all the city offices move to after the fire in S1?

 

My guess is that they are building it to damage it, but I'm surprised they're not doing it on a lot somewhere. 

[FurryFury]

Oh well at least Jane E is writing Charming's centric. That's something.

 

Well, she also wrote Bleeding Through, so...

 

I think Snow and Woegina was always the central relationship, even in S1 and in Storybrooke.

 

No. It didn't drive the show the way Emma/Regina used to. It was the central relationships in the flashbacks, though.

 

I wasn't accusing them of queerbaiting, but I do find it as a lure for Swan Queeners to some degree.

 

So what, they should just stop having Regina and Emma interact so SQ fans wouldn't consider it queerbating? Teen Wolf writers actually did that with their non-canon slash couple, and it looked weird (I don't ship them, but I've noticed).

 

However, I'm definitely not looking forward to this episode because it's, like, 99% certain to be all about Regina's woes and Emma-blaming.

[Souris]

However, I'm definitely not looking forward to this episode because it's, like, 99% certain to be all about Regina's woes and Emma-blaming.

 

Yeah, that spoiler made me want to hurl, because I know they won't be honest and realistic about how Emma SHOULD feel about Regina. Emma should dislike her at the VERY least, and be wary and distrustful. But I'm sure they'll have Emma telling Regina how much she's changed, how much she admires her, and similar other table-flippy things.

[ShadowFacts]

 

Yeah, that spoiler made me want to hurl, because I know they won't be honest and realistic about how Emma SHOULD feel about Regina. Emma should dislike her at the VERY least, and be wary and distrustful. But I'm sure they'll have Emma telling Regina how much she's changed, how much she admires her, and similar other table-flippy things.

 

Table flipping came right to my mind, too.  Emma should be keeping a close eye on Regina, maybe in a keep your friends close and your enemies closer kind of way, but not be cheering her wondrous light magical being.  Regina needs Dr. Hopper in a big way.  There's an underused character if ever there was one.

[dassala]

So, anyone have any evidence that this 7 minute clip of 4x01 exists? I haven't been able to find a single person who has accessed it.

Source: http://www.spoilertv.com/2014/09/once-upon-time-episode-401-tale-of-two_21.html?m=1

[SilverShadow]

We've been discussing this in the media thread. Consensus seems to be Spoilertv announced too early and the clip's not up yet.

[RadioGirl27]

Per Adam's twitter, the episode devoted to Emma and Regina's "relationship"  is one of the first 6. I hope it's the premiere and we can forget about it soon. But then I fear they are going to destroy Emma's character, so it better be the sixth one.

[Serena]

It's totally the episode with Emma's flashbacks, 405. Which will make even more ridiculous that Emma's feelings for Regina aren't "this heinous bitch ruined my life and all the abuse I went through *insert flashback* is because of her crazy ass"

[Rumsy4]

I bet Emma's crappy childhood will be made out to be her own "fault" due to latent magic or whatever.