Spoiler Discussion: The apple was poisoned?!

[Shanna Marie]

18 minutes ago, Rumsy4 said:

Do they assume the WW will disappear after a while?

That may be it, that it only sprang into being at the time the Evil Queen made Emma's wish, and it will disappear when Emma leaves. But then isn't there at least a little pang about it disappearing and essentially ending the lives of all those people? Even on Star Trek, they had huge moral dilemmas about alternate timelines and those people ceasing to exist if they changed things. Here, it's like no big deal.

[Rumsy4]

"Were Bluebirds Fly" is apparently a Radiohead cover of Somewhere Over the Rainbow with the lyrics rendered incomprehensible. It's quite possibly the episode where Zelena dies. Maybe Red and Dorothy will show up to adopt Pistachio. 

Edited February 3, 2017 by Rumsy4

[ParadoxLost]

@XrystalPond  Did they mention what Robin's backstory is that he's unencumbered to just leave with Regina?  He never met Marian?  She died?  Regina succeeded in killing her because Emma/Hook didn't time travel? 

I suspect this is going to be one of those baffling situations where Robin is Regina's perfect version of him.  No past ties.  And somehow, he's going to be the love of Regina's life without actually caring that original recipe Robin has kids, including one with Zelina.

39 minutes ago, Rumsy4 said:

Do they assume the WW will disappear after a while? None of this makes a lick of sense.

Now that you mention it, it doesn't make sense that you can travel from a wish realm where its ok to kill people because they aren't real to a real realm.  Shouldn't they have ended up in a wish version of the land without magic?  Seems that traveling between them makes it real.

Edited February 3, 2017 by ParadoxLost

[Souris]

44 minutes ago, Kktjones said:

It seems that I'm alone in my disdain of August, but this sounds like such a major retcon.

Also, did Emma go see him alone? So after being away from Hook & her family, and with her would-be killer on the loose, she just ditches everyone to head over to August's house and say 'hey'? Just UGH.

Of course. Just like her ditching Hook to go have shots with Regina.

And I am right there with you on the disdain for August. Can't stand that guy or this retconning. He's in the same cesspit as Neal to me -- and with the same BS hero retconning on the show.

[PixiePaws1]

7 minutes ago, Souris said:

Of course. Just like her ditching Hook to go have shots with Regina.

And I am right there with you on the disdain for August. Can't stand that guy or this retconning. He's in the same cesspit as Neal to me -- and with the same BS hero retconning on the show.

Count me in, too...

Teenage girl......PRISON...!!!!

2 Old dudes making the decision......!

No way should August be counted a friend let alone a hero!

Mention of Wooden Man Child....do you think Blue will de-age Gideon or will have Black have countered that already?

[Rumsy4]

23 minutes ago, ParadoxLost said:

I suspect this is going to be one of those baffling situations where Robin is Regina's perfect version of him.  No past ties.  And somehow, he's going to be the love of Regina's life without actually caring that original recipe Robin has kids, including one with Zelina.

It seems like it, doesn't it? This Robin apparently has part of original Robin's soul somehow. But that part doesn't have any ties with Roland, Marian, or Pistachio. To me, it seems like they're bringing back Robin for good. Except A&E say he's not back for good. So--Regina is now going to lose an even more perfect version of Robin Hood? The whining is going to be off the charts!

[RadioGirl27]

2 hours ago, Rumsy4 said:

I get that having the original versions back home gives Emma a different perspective. And yet, it seems ridiculous to me that she was so ready to believe that the wishverse copies were "fake".

Yeah. This two episodes have been really damaging for Emma as a character. Because the truth is that she didn't know for sure if the wishverse copies are fake or not, and yet she showed no compassion for any of them, her parents, her son or her sort of roommate. And the "she was trying to go back to the real ones" makes no sense, because she didn't know if there was something to go back to.

Really, everything about this two episodes is beyond stupid.

2 hours ago, Kktjones said:

Also, did Emma go see him alone? So after being away from Hook & her family, and with her would-be killer on the loose, she just ditches everyone to head over to August's house and say 'hey'? Just UGH.

Well, spending time with his fake version probably made her miss him, he is her BFF#2 after all (Regina would be her BFF#1). She saw her fake parents dying, her fake son orphaned and her fake sort of boyfriend as a pathetic clown, but who cares about the family and the sort of boyfriend? Emma clearly not.

Edited February 4, 2017 by RadioGirl27

[Rumsy4]

58 minutes ago, RadioGirl27 said:

Because the truth is that she didn't know for sure if the wishverse copies are fake or not, and yet she showed no compassion for any of them, her parents, her son or her sort of roommate. And the "she was trying to go back to the real ones" makes no sense, because she didn't know if there was something to go back to.

She did know there were people to go back to becasue Regina told her. But it is really jarring that Emma had no compassion or empathy for all those "fake" people. Her acceptance of their essential "fakeness" just because Regina said so is idiotic. But the REC turns everyone in a 5-mile radius around Regina into morons. So, no surprise there. 

Quote

 He says he only takes money, etc. For himself.

This version seems to be Regina's perfect Soul Mate. lol 

Edited February 4, 2017 by Rumsy4

[ParadoxLost]

23 minutes ago, XrystalPond said:

He told Regina Marian died before they could marry so no Roland. He didn't seem to have the Merry Men either. Regina finds him at a tavern and sees the lion tattoo. She flashes back to Tinkerbelle saying he is her soul mate. She walks in and everyone runs, jumps out Windows, etc. Robin thinks she is there to get back her necklace. She calls him Robin Hood and he gets confused and says that's not him.  He says he only takes money, etc.

Well, that proves it.  A&E hear criticism.  They don't take it and use it in a constructive way, but they hear it.  They just erased every argument against Robin being insta in love with the Evil Queen that was put to them. 

Robin Hood stole from the rich and gave to the poor.  He wouldn't be so understanding of and see himself as no different than the Evil Queen.   Nope, he's just a thief.

But Marian is his true love.  Nope, dead.

But Regina killed her.  Nope, she didn't.

Now its set up for Robin to be just a thief and Regina gets to be the good woman that changes a bad man.

Edited February 4, 2017 by ParadoxLost

[PixiePaws1]

1 hour ago, ParadoxLost said:

 

Now its set up for Robin to be just a thief and Regina gets to be the good woman that changes a bad man.

Yeah...well on the plus side ..Emma didn't have to change Killian..he did it himself...so at least that's one thing of Emma's that Regina doesn't get.

[Shanna Marie]

48 minutes ago, PixiePaws1 said:

Yeah...well on the plus side ..Emma didn't have to change Killian..he did it himself...so at least that's one thing of Emma's that Regina doesn't get.

Until it gets retconned under the REC, if it hasn't been already. Icky old Hook could be taken as a sign that without Emma influencing and inspiring him, Killian wouldn't have changed, since he didn't change in the wish world in spite of Rumple getting dealt with. I do think that there's a difference between being changed by someone and changing because of someone's influence, but I don't expect these writers to get that subtle.

[Watt]

I've read the last page of this but no further back- I haven't seen many episodes this season, because I'm just like ugh. But can anyone tell me if there's anything even remotely positive re:spoilers regarding Hook & Emma because that's all I'm here for anymore.
 

Is this last season, then?

[PixiePaws1]

I am putting this link here because it is a person's personal thoughts of what they took from watching 6.11...she comes across as relatively fair in her observations...at least to me.

http://acrobat-elle.tumblr.com/post/156775376791/a-few-other-little-things-about-the-episode-and

On 2/3/2017 at 3:59 PM, Souris said:

 

This whole thing makes me think back to that link somebody posted here about A&E insisting they're comedy writers. Yeah, not so much based on the "comedy" they've included in Once. Their humor seems to run to personal insults, which I almost never find funny.

I just read something by hellowherearemypeople on tumblr i think is relevant to the discussion on the reaction to wishrealm!Hook. 

'Wondering if people would find it as funny if Hook met an overweight AU  version of Emma and then joked about needing to cut off her supply of grilled cheese and hot cocoa when he got home'

OMG... she makes a point...can you imagine the escalation in Hook hate??!!!

Edited February 4, 2017 by PixiePaws1

[KingOfHearts]

5 hours ago, PixiePaws1 said:

I just read something by hellowherearemypeople on tumblr i think is relevant to the discussion on the reaction to wishrealm!Hook. 

'Wondering if people would find it as funny if Hook met an overweight AU  version of Emma and then joked about needing to cut off her supply of grilled cheese and hot cocoa when he got home'

OMG... she makes a point...can you imagine the escalation in Hook hate??!!!

Sexism is alive and well, I see. This show's got plenty of that.

[Serena]

Yeah, it's a double standard the writers have already proven they have a problem with. And I mean, the fat jokes about Hook aren't even remotely the worst example, since we have not one, but TWO examples of men being raped by women in the show and it being completely glossed over.

But I actually saw a picture of Old!Hook and my problem is that they didn't even try. They slapped a fake belly and some old clothes on Colin and called it a day. His face looks the same, he doesn't even have a double chin!

[RadioGirl27]

10 hours ago, Watt said:

But can anyone tell me if there's anything even remotely positive re:spoilers regarding Hook & Emma because that's all I'm here for anymore.

Based on filming spoilers, no. They haven't filmed together since 6x13. In fact, Colin hasn't filmed with any of the regular cast since 6x14. They are sending Hook in a solo adventure with a bunch of guest characters, while Emma stays in Storybrooke with her new BFF Gideon.

If you believe what A&E have to say, then yes. They are having an adventure filled with passion.

[Souris]

It's 3+ episodes now of Hook being separated in a different realm from Emma and the rest of the group. (Various posts about it here.) What good CaptainSwan-age that is! Eddy is a lying liar who lies. How many more eps do you think they'll keep them separated? The rest of the season? Then there will be a 6-second reunion where Emma punches Hook in the stomach and tells him he's put on weight so he's going on a diet. Swoon!

So no, there is nothing remotely positive regarding Hook & Emma in 6B, unless you believe A&E's lies.

My guess is Hook proposes in 6x14 and Emma says no, so he goes off on some pointless side mission.

[RadioGirl27]

3 minutes ago, Souris said:

My guess is Hook proposes in 6x14 and Emma says no, so he goes off on some pointless side mission.

If he proposes and she says no, I hope he leaves and never comes back. I doubt she would miss him.

[Kktjones]

18 minutes ago, RadioGirl27 said:

If you believe what A&E have to say, then yes. They are having an adventure filled with passion.

This is what I'm having a hard time reconciling. Adam proactively teased that "the two of them" would go on an adventure full of romance, danger, and passion, Eddy said that the second half of the season has a lot of good Captain Swan-age, and even Leaf Lady Sarah said "GOOD things will happen." Yet, the filming spoilers tell an entirely different story. There is no confirmation they have filmed together since 6x12 (although it appears they were shooting together in studio on his birthday) and there have been NO concrete spoilers about a storyline for them. They just had Colin & Jen at a panel and didn't tease even one real thing about the second half! So if they're lying, it's because they know people love the couple and want good things for them. I guess they just don't care. And I'm starting to not care either :(.

[RadioGirl27]

1 minute ago, Kktjones said:

This is what I'm having a hard time reconciling. Adam proactively teased that "the two of them" would go on an adventure full of romance, danger, and passion, Eddy said that the second half of the season has a lot of good Captain Swan-age, and even Leaf Lady Sarah said "GOOD things will happen."

Well, they were lying. They know this season is a total failure, even if they aren't doing anything to try and solve it. And, even if they don't care about the characters or the fans of said characters, they need to keep the CS shippers watching, because, no matter what other portions of the fandom think, CS is the most popular ship. Season 7 seems far away, and if they loose this part of the fandom, it wouls be impossible. Hence the lies and the"Lots of good things are coming for your favorites, keep watching!". But the truth is that there is no adventure, no passion, no romance. At least not for Hook and Emma together. Just Hook sidelined in a D-Plot adventure of his own with some guests and Emma in Storybrooke with Gideon.

11 minutes ago, Kktjones said:

(although it appears they were shooting together in studio on his birthday)

They were at the same place at the same time, but it doesn't mean that they were filming together. It was his birthday, she probably went to see him and wish him a happy birthday.

[Souris]

23 minutes ago, Kktjones said:

This is what I'm having a hard time reconciling. Adam proactively teased that "the two of them" would go on an adventure full of romance, danger, and passion, Eddy said that the second half of the season has a lot of good Captain Swan-age, and even Leaf Lady Sarah said "GOOD things will happen." Yet, the filming spoilers tell an entirely different story. There is no confirmation they have filmed together since 6x12 (although it appears they were shooting together in studio on his birthday) and there have been NO concrete spoilers about a storyline for them. They just had Colin & Jen at a panel and didn't tease even one real thing about the second half! So if they're lying, it's because they know people love the couple and want good things for them. I guess they just don't care. And I'm starting to not care either :(.

Just because they were in the studio at the same time on his birthday doesn't mean they filmed together. We know Hook is still elsewhere, so why would they be filming together? Heck, Jen could have come by the studio just to wish him a happy birthday because she wouldn't see him otherwise. They couldn't tease anything real and concrete because there IS nothing real and concrete to tease. They're stringing along CS fans and using them for ratings to get a S7 at this point, nothing more.

I think you're spot-on -- they know CS is loved, so they put out vague teases in a deliberately misleading way to get CS fans excited, but that's as far as it goes. They're not actually writing anything to back that up because of -- take your pick of reasons: 1) They have no interest in CS anymore; 2) They took the CS hate from last season to heart and are writing to please those folks; 3) They're undermining CS's importance because they don't think Jen will be back next season but Colin is still contracted, so they're preparing for a S7 with no CS. Part of the latter would be doing things like having Emma fat shame Hook or say no to his proposal, so CS fans would be mad at Emma and not care if CS ends and Hook is on his own.

Edited February 4, 2017 by Souris

[PixiePaws1]

Jen made a specific comment during the panel that i found interesting about CS not being separated despite being split up and brought back together a few times and we'd see relational issues coming up (maybe turning down the proposal??)....seemed really weird phrasing. Can't tell if it's a backhanded compliment/thank you to A&E for splitting the characters up for continuous eps but they're still a couple or she's having a dig about them always being kept apart with short reunions while still trying to tease audiences into thinking there is a CS together adventure  (Jen always seems honest and earnest so i can't believe she'd out and out lie....).

Would love some other's thoughts.

Maybe CS film separately but because Emma has magical x-realm mirror Skype abilities (remember those from 3b?)...Emma keeps in touch with Killian that way..they wouldn't have to film together for that.

[sharky]

Although let's be fair. This is just speculation based on a few photos from Twitter and such. They've been filming in the studio a lot -- their first time in Steveston in a long time was last week. And even then we didn't get that much info. So I'm not too worried yet. Plus we do know there's a scene coming up with Hook asking David for permission to propose. 

[PixiePaws1]

How about Gideon needs a wand to counter the Black Fairy's magic in order to be the Saviour for the Dark Realm...maybe it has to be made from CS's True Love Sapling because Emma is a Saviour and the product of True Love. But they've met so many 1st times in so many places that it could be anywhere, so Killian is traveling to all these different realms to find it while Gideon holds Emma hostage.

Just a theory of mine....

[Kktjones]

22 hours ago, PixiePaws1 said:

Jen made a specific comment during the panel that i found interesting about CS not being separated despite being split up and brought back together a few times and we'd see relational issues coming up (maybe turning down the proposal??)....seemed really weird phrasing. Can't tell if it's a backhanded compliment/thank you to A&E for splitting the characters up for continuous eps but they're still a couple or she's having a dig about them always being kept apart with short reunions while still trying to tease audiences into thinking there is a CS together adventure  (Jen always seems honest and earnest so i can't believe she'd out and out lie....).

I really like Jen and I appreciate her thoughtful responses in interviews (and the fact that she doesn't bait or pander), but I found her answer about the CS arc at this panel to be really disappointing. I went back and listened to what she said at NYCC and the answers are very similar. It just feels like she doesn't have anything specific to tease, so she's falling back to the SDCC & NYCC talking points. "We're going to see the ups and downs, and nuances of a real relationship, blah blah blah." Except we're not seeing the nuances of a real relationship. Anyway, I just don't think you can read too much into what she's saying. I think she just means that this isn't one of those relationships where the couple break up, get back together, rinse & repeat.

3 hours ago, PixiePaws1 said:

How about Gideon needs a wand to counter the Black Fairy's magic in order to be the Saviour for the Dark Realm...maybe it has to be made from CS's True Love Sapling because Emma is a Saviour and the product of True Love. But they've met so many 1st times in so many places that it could be anywhere, so Killian is traveling to all these different realms to find it while Gideon holds Emma hostage.

I would LOVE for this to be the storyline! I think it would be clever and would tie into things we've seen before on the show. Which probably means it won't happen. Also, I highly doubt they will ever mention Emma & Hook's true love status again b/c that would upset other factions who still think Emma will end up with their favorite. I was thinking that the only way I would like the "Hook on a solo adventure" is if he's off in search of the thing that can save Emma or that they need in order to get married/live HEA/etc. That's the only way they could actually define this as "romantic" when the two of them are not together. 

[RadioGirl27]

4 hours ago, Kktjones said:

I really like Jen and I appreciate her thoughtful responses in interviews (and the fact that she doesn't bait or pander), but I found her answer about the CS arc at this panel to be really disappointing. I went back and listened to what she said at NYCC and the answers are very similar.

Well, she can't talk about something that doesn't exist. CS had no arc as a couple in the first half of the season and it's obvious that they are not going to have an arc this second half. Emma at least has a half-assed arc this season, Hook doesn't have even that (A&E couldn't even answer a question about what's next for Hook in Atlanta). 

4 hours ago, Kktjones said:

Also, I highly doubt they will ever mention Emma & Hook's true love status again b/c that would upset other factions who still think Emma will end up with their favorite.

Look at the way they were "confirmed" TL, in a terrible scene open to interpretation. Of course the supposed TL status is not going to be addressed ever again.

Hook's solo adventure is just a way to keep him away from Emma and the main storyline for the second half of the season.

Edited February 5, 2017 by RadioGirl27

[legaleagle53]

It's official:  Once is doing a musical episode.

[ParadoxLost]

9 hours ago, legaleagle53 said:

It's official:  Once is doing a musical episode.

That came out of the panel last week where A&E confirmed.  I do chuckle a bit about EW ending with a quote of Kitis admitting that they don't know how to do a musical.

I don't think we've heard yet whether they got someone that knows what they are doing or not.  Just that all the songs are originals.

[KingOfHearts]

Quote

Just that all the songs are originals.

I very badly want Alan Menken on this...

[Free]

4 hours ago, ParadoxLost said:

That came out of the panel last week where A&E confirmed.  I do chuckle a bit about EW ending with a quote of Kitis admitting that they don't know how to do a musical.

I don't think we've heard yet whether they got someone that knows what they are doing or not.  Just that all the songs are originals.

Certainly not the only thing.

1 hour ago, XrystalPond said:

I hate that it appears the musical episode will be filmed after the Aladdin/Jasmine stuff. Karen David singing is one of my favorite things about her.  

Wasted opportunity.

[Curio]

1 hour ago, XrystalPond said:

I hate that it appears the musical episode will be filmed after the Aladdin/Jasmine stuff. Karen David singing is one of my favorite things about her.  

Wait, do we know for sure when the Aladdin/Jasmine plot is finished? There's still a chance they could appear in the finale, right? Has Karen David mentioned she's done filming for the year? 

[KingOfHearts]

52 minutes ago, Curio said:

Wait, do we know for sure when the Aladdin/Jasmine plot is finished? There's still a chance they could appear in the finale, right? Has Karen David mentioned she's done filming for the year? 

The way they've been handled, it feels as if they're going to be around forever... they just never leave!

Edited February 7, 2017 by KingOfHearts

[Writing Wrongs]

On 2/3/2017 at 2:31 PM, RadioGirl27 said:

I don't think alcoholism is something to make fun of and, as someone with some weigh problems, I'm never going to find fat shaming funny, but maybe it's just me.

It's not like she called him a fat fuck and a drunk. Geez. 

[Curio]

2 hours ago, Writing Wrongs said:

It's not like she called him a fat fuck and a drunk. Geez. 

Well, no. That wording would never get past the ABC censors.

[daxx]

2 hours ago, Writing Wrongs said:

It's not like she called him a fat fuck and a drunk. Geez. 

Everyone has things that bother them to different levels and I wouldn't personally ever mock someone for that.

I get serious cringes when Neal talks down to Emma in the back half of season two but I know not everyone feels that way. 

[kitticup]

For me, I won't care and take it as funny if the writers treated all the characters with respect and integrity.  Instead the wish world is only for Regina stans.  I am tired of the REC which has tainted too much of the show that I don't find it funny when other characters are treated as non-entities, without respect or belittled. 

[orza]

12 hours ago, Curio said:

Wait, do we know for sure when the Aladdin/Jasmine plot is finished? There's still a chance they could appear in the finale, right? Has Karen David mentioned she's done filming for the year? 

Last time she wrapped in Vancouver she tweeted that she would be back in about a month. 

[Curio]

5 minutes ago, orza said:

Last time she wrapped in Vancouver she tweeted that she would be back in about a month. 

Just in time to film a musically themed finale, perhaps...

[Souris]

1 hour ago, Curio said:

Just in time to film a musically themed finale, perhaps...

Yeah, I bet her return will coincide with the musical ep. Gotta have someone for Hook to sing with. (It obviously won't be Emma.)

Edited February 7, 2017 by Souris

[Free]

14 hours ago, KingOfHearts said:

The way they've been handled, it feels as if they're going to be around forever... they just never leave!

The writers are meandering with everything, nothing seems to be planned out especially for this season.

[Hookian]

8 hours ago, Curio said:

Just in time to film a musically themed finale, perhaps...

It's not gonna be the finale.

Edited February 8, 2017 by Hookian

[Curio]

23 minutes ago, Hookian said:

It's not gonna be the finale.

Source?

[Kktjones]

IIRC when Karen tweeted that she'd be returning to film again, she gave a timeframe that allowed people to figure out it would be around the time they began filming 6x19. I wouldn't be surprised if that is the musical episode b/c at the panel last week they mentioned that they would begin filming it "very soon". I'm really interested to see what they do with that ep. Will it actually move the plot along or just be a fun, throwaway episode...  

ETA: I think it was this tweet where she mentions being back in about a month (which would be around Feb. 16).

Edited February 8, 2017 by Kktjones

[Hookian]

1 hour ago, Curio said:

Source?

Common sense. They're not gonna have a musical be the finale. It's way more likely it's 19 or 20. 

In other news Natalie was on set today, JMO, Colin, Lana, and Bex were tagged. So I assume they were there.

[Souris]

2 hours ago, Kktjones said:

IIRC when Karen tweeted that she'd be returning to film again, she gave a timeframe that allowed people to figure out it would be around the time they began filming 6x19. I wouldn't be surprised if that is the musical episode b/c at the panel last week they mentioned that they would begin filming it "very soon". I'm really interested to see what they do with that ep. Will it actually move the plot along or just be a fun, throwaway episode...  

They can't even move the plot along in nonmusical episodes!

[Kktjones]

So I just saw that Bex has been posting pics on Snapchat of her in full green makeup. I'm starting to wonder if 6x18 is Oz/Zelena related and maybe she dies. As others have mentioned, she's certainly been getting the "Neal/Robin lack of screen time" treatment this season, so maybe it's leading up to this...

[Souris]

It does seem like Zelena is getting focus in this ep. I'm not sure I believe they're planning to kill her off (I more believe they'd send her back to Oz), but if they are, I'm sure it will be presented as just another horrible thing that's happened to poor Regina.

[RulerofallIsurvey]

If they kill Zelena off, wonder who will take care of Pistachio?  Will she be sent off to the Enchanted Forest to live with Roland and Little John?  (At least she'd have a happy ending that way.)  Or is it giving the show too much credit to even think about the baby?  

[Curio]

11 minutes ago, RulerofallIsurvey said:

If they kill Zelena off, wonder who will take care of Pistachio?  

Regina and Robin were completely content on raising Pistachio by themselves when Regina sent Zelena away in the tornado the first time around.

[Rumsy4]

8 minutes ago, Curio said:

Regina and Robin were completely content on raising Pistachio by themselves when Regina sent Zelena away in the tornado the first time around.

Yeah. But fake!Robin doesn't have those emotional or blood ties to Pistachio. Besides, didn't A&E say fak!Robin is not sticking around? My vote is for Ruby and Dorothy to suddenly reenter the story and adopt Pistachio.

Edited February 8, 2017 by Rumsy4