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S14.E02: Episode 2

chitowngirl

By chitowngirl
in Call The Midwife

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caitmcg

caitmcg

The bipolar woman abandoning her lithium was telegraphed as soon there was a discussion about unknown effects on the fetus and baby in the clinic, even before that news was given to Arlene by the doctor at St. Cuthbert's. 

Was it just me and my middle-aged eyes, or did the initial young man diagnosed with gonorrhea in the clinic look way too young to have been towed along to a brothel for his brother's stag party? (And won't his new sister-in-law be thrilled to learn about that.)

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MissLucas

MissLucas

Heartbreak for Rosalind as expected. This was never going to end well, girl. But it was a harsh episode for her - not just because of Cyril but also because she wasn't able to help the former window dresser. 

The lithium plot was also heartbreaking. For me it was less about the individual plot but more about how the approach to mental health in that period was handled. Pills will make everything better (greetings from mother's little helpers) and in the enthusiasm about finally finding the supposed holy grail the poor woman was more test subject for lithium than patient. I hope Trixie does write that letter so that at least midwives will be better prepared for such cases.

The gonorrhea cases were depressing for all sorts of reasons. I did appreciate the wife reading her husband the riot act.

Overall a quite a downer episode even the Buckles - normally purveyors comic relief or at least something uplifting - were riddled with a bleak plot.

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Orcinus orca

Orcinus orca

On 4/1/2025 at 6:02 PM, MissLucas said:

Overall a quite a downer episode even the Buckles - normally purveyors comic relief or at least something uplifting - were riddled with a bleak plot.

Yes, this one was hard to take.  Not too many smiles or feel-good moments.  I wonder if Cyril will return with news that Lucille wants a divorce or something.  Although I do not see any chemistry between him and Rosalind.  More like siblings.

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iMonrey

iMonrey

40 minutes ago, Orcinus orca said:

Yes, this one was hard to take.  Not too many smiles or feel-good moments.

No. But I sort of cracked up when Phyllis explained to Zeta (wife with gonorrhea) that she could only have gotten it from her husband, and Zeta insisted he hadn't been with anyone else. Phyllis gave her this look like "Bless your heart dear."

Also kind of got a kick out of Miss Higgins at the brothel. She looked like she was walking through a haunted house and waiting for someone with a chainsaw to jump out at her.

Seemed like Arlene was bipolar, but I'm not sure "bipolar" was actually diagnosed in 1970. (Too lazy to look it up, I trust someone here will.) Lithium is in fact what they give to people who are bipolar but I know the condition originally was called "manic depression" and I'm not sure sure it was entirely understood even then.

I didn't get what happened to Ted, the homeless guy who designed the flower arrangement. Did he just up and disappear?

I wonder if Cyril is gone for good. His continued presence on the show after Lucille went back to Jamaica never made a lot of sense to me. 

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libgirl2

libgirl2

On 3/29/2025 at 4:52 PM, caitmcg said:

Was it just me and my middle-aged eyes, or did the initial young man diagnosed with gonorrhea in the clinic look way too young to have been towed along to a brothel for his brother's stag party? (And won't his new sister-in-law be thrilled to learn about that.)

In the late 80s, I worked at a doctor's clinic in the lab. We had a case of a guy who came back from his honeymoon who was tested for gonorrhea. Sure enough, positive. Seems there was a bachelor party and things got out of hand with the "entertainment". That was the first thing I remembered seeing this. 

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Mermaid Under

Mermaid Under

Quote

I didn't get what happened to Ted, the homeless guy who designed the flower arrangement. Did he just up and disappear?

I thought it was just me, missing something when I flipped between channels, but this might have been a PBS cut.

In the old days, before email, texts, and patience privacy rights there used to be one guy they called VD John.  I guess he worked for the county, and I don't even know if his first name was John.  He was in charge of ensuring patients who tested positive for venereal disease - mostly gonorrhea - got treatment, and for tracing their "contacts" .

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libgirl2

libgirl2

12 minutes ago, iMonrey said:

How did Miss Higgins recognize the prostitute? I think she called her Mrs. Rowntree? Have we seen her before? Or was she the woman in line behind Arlene at the beginning of the episode - the impatient one who asked what was taking so long? 

I am pretty sure that was her. I would have liked to have gotten more background on her. How did she end up at the brothel? 

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proserpina65

proserpina65

Despite some very heavy subjects being the focus, this episode felt really flat to me, other than Shelagh reading the riot act to the factory foreman who was taking his employees to the brothel.  Idk, maybe it's to the point where most of the stories have been done before in some variation and fail to move me much anymore.  Maybe I'm kinda over CTM?

13 hours ago, iMonrey said:

Seemed like Arlene was bipolar, but I'm not sure "bipolar" was actually diagnosed in 1970.

Looks like doctors started using the term in the early 80s.  From Healthline: "The term first appeared in the American Psychiatric Association's (APA) Diagnostic and Statistical Manual of Mental Disorders (DSM) in its third revision in 1980."  So yeah, I think that was quite anachronistic.

6 hours ago, JudyObscure said:

Well, I may be the only one, but I'm very much into the Cyril and Rosalind romance. Lucille has abandoned her husband and really doesn't deserve him anymore.

Cyril definitely deserves to be happy.  He's a good person and didn't do anything wrong.  Not sure how I feel about him and Rosalind, though.

1 hour ago, iMonrey said:

How did Miss Higgins recognize the prostitute? I think she called her Mrs. Rowntree? Have we seen her before? Or was she the woman in line behind Arlene at the beginning of the episode - the impatient one who asked what was taking so long? 

It took me a moment, but then I realized that it was the impatient woman from earlier in the episode.

I have to confess to having some sympathy for the husband with gonorrhea since it sounded like he'd only gone to the brothel once, and only when he thought he'd never see the woman he loved again.

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mmecorday

mmecorday

Quote

Also kind of got a kick out of Miss Higgins at the brothel. She looked like she was walking through a haunted house and waiting for someone with a chainsaw to jump out at her.

Ha ha! Perfect description! 

This episode was like one of those VD films shown in high schools 50 years ago. Jim thought he was going out for a night of fun. But The Clap is nothing to applaud. 

One of my favorite songs from that era played during this episode -- "I'll Never Find Another You" by The Seekers. I'm so grateful to my mom for playing good music when I was growing up. 

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Sarah 103

Sarah 103

(edited)
On 3/29/2025 at 5:52 PM, caitmcg said:

Was it just me and my middle-aged eyes, or did the initial young man diagnosed with gonorrhea in the clinic look way too young to have been towed along to a brothel for his brother's stag party? (And won't his new sister-in-law be thrilled to learn about that.)

He was on the young side, but not impossibly too young. I've heard stories from the 1960s about 16 year olds going to the Playboy clubs with older male relatives. (not the same as a brothel, but not too far removed).Today there is no way on earth he would have been allowed to go the bachelor party but it that time and place it seems like the absolute verge of plausible. 

10 minutes ago, mmecorday said:

One of my favorite songs from that era played during this episode -- "I'll Never Find Another You" by The Seekers. 

It's a great song. I heard and thought "that's the music budget for the season." 

15 hours ago, Orcinus orca said:

I wonder if Cyril will return with news that Lucille wants a divorce or something.

Lucille is far too religious to ask for a divorce. She was opposed to giving some of the local girls relevant, accurate, medical/health advice based on her religion (which is the exact moment I turned against the character harder than I have ever turned against a character on this show or any other). There is no way she would ask for a divorce or be open to the idea of a divorce.

The writers either need to write Cyril out (which would be a shame because I like him), or kill Lucille off. Him visiting her is the perfect time to do it. "There was a _______. It was horrible, but I got to say a last goodbye to her and tell her how much I loved her." He is then free to return to London, grieve, and then continue on with his life. 

Edited by Sarah 103
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JudyObscure

JudyObscure

It's the religious side of Lucille I can't figure out.  What about the directive to forsake all others and cleave to your spouse? What about "whither thou goest I will go?"  Yeah I know Ruth was talking to her mother-in-law, but still it's often said in regard to sticking with your husband even when he gets sent to the other side of the world.

 

2 hours ago, mmecorday said:

Jim thought he was going out for a night of fun. But The Clap is nothing to applaud. 

 

LOL

Dr. Turner made me laugh, too, with his, "Sometimes when you get lucky, you get unlucky." 

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txhorns79

txhorns79

17 hours ago, iMonrey said:

Phyllis gave her this look like "Bless your heart dear."

I wonder how many times Phyllis has heard something like that from a patient.  

 

4 hours ago, iMonrey said:

How did Miss Higgins recognize the prostitute?

In a past episode it was explained that Miss Higgins was once known as the premier Madame in Poplar.  Her girls were the best, and she ran an upscale joint during the war called Miss Higgins' Goodtime Girls.  After the war, as things went back to a peacetime setting, her business dried up and she became a secretary for Dr. Turner, as one does.  (And yes, I completely made this up.)   

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libgirl2

libgirl2

(edited)
6 minutes ago, txhorns79 said:

In a past episode it was explained that Miss Higgins was once known as the premier Madame in Poplar.  Her girls were the best, and she ran an upscale joint during the war called Miss Higgins' Goodtime Girls.  After the war, as things went back to a peacetime setting, her business dried up and she became a secretary for Dr. Turner, as one does.  (And yes, I completely made this up.)   

Lol! You scared me, I thought I had somehow missed an entire character arc! 

Edited by libgirl2
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eel2178

eel2178

6 hours ago, Sarah 103 said:

Lucille is far too religious to ask for a divorce. She was opposed to giving some of the local girls relevant, accurate, medical/health advice based on her religion (which is the exact moment I turned against the character harder than I have ever turned against a character on this show or any other). There is no way she would ask for a divorce or be open to the idea of a divorce.

The writers either need to write Cyril out (which would be a shame because I like him), or kill Lucille off. 

My prediction is Cyril and Lucille will return to Poplar together, but Lucille will be played by a different actress.

iMonrey

iMonrey

8 hours ago, proserpina65 said:

Looks like doctors started using the term in the early 80s.  From Healthline: "The term first appeared in the American Psychiatric Association's (APA) Diagnostic and Statistical Manual of Mental Disorders (DSM) in its third revision in 1980."  So yeah, I think that was quite anachronistic.

They didn't actually use the word bipolar in this episode, so I didn't mean to imply it was anachronistic. Nor did they use the term "manic depression." But lithium is indeed used to treat bipolar disorder so I was wondering what exactly they had diagnosed Arlene with. When they were reading her file they mentioned only depression. But she was definitely in a manic state. Just curious if they were diagnosing manic depression in 1970.

(Turns out it can be traced all the way back to the 1850s!)

4 hours ago, Orcinus orca said:
Spoiler

Same for Helen - she is not in every episode this season. but is in several later on.

Who's Helen?

1 hour ago, eel2178 said:

My prediction is Cyril and Lucille will return to Poplar together, but Lucille will be played by a different actress.

Recasting a role would be a first for this show, I have doubts they would do that.

dancingdreamer

dancingdreamer

Poor Arlene, my heart went out to her, many people  still take lithium  with no side effects. There are some mental  health problems,  that still can't  be helped, except  for medication 

I loved how Millicent had everything  in order, for tracking down who had gonorrhea,  and who they had been in contact  with. All that is so much easier today. I felt sad for Rosalind. 

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Notabug

Notabug

(edited)
8 hours ago, dancingdreamer said:

Poor Arlene, my heart went out to her, many people  still take lithium  with no side effects. There are some mental  health problems,  that still can't  be helped, except  for medication 

I loved how Millicent had everything  in order, for tracking down who had gonorrhea,  and who they had been in contact  with. All that is so much easier today. I felt sad for Rosalind. 

Based on what we saw of her manic state, it is pretty obvious that Arlene needed treatment.  Lithium was the best drug available at that time and it worked wonders, allowing many bipolar individuals to lead productive lives.  It has a lot of side effects, though, and has since been replaced for the most part by other drugs.  People who are manic are not likely to deliberately harm themselves or others but they have disordered thinking and often are careless.  Leaving the stove on, driving recklessly, leaving the house in winter without a coat, etc.

Lithium, BTW, has since the time of the show, been found to cause serious birth defects including a heart defect, Ebstein's anomaly, which requires major surgical intervention, if taken in the first trimester.  It sounded like Arlene wasn't taking it in the first trimester, though.

Edited by Notabug
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JudyObscure

JudyObscure

1 hour ago, Ancaster said:

I hated this and thought Dr Turner's "wink wink, nudge nudge, boys will be boys" reaction, complete with cheesy grin, was completely out of character.

I sort of  agree.  I laughed, but  partly out of surprise.  He may have been trying to put the young man at ease and make sure he didn't feel judged, but you're right, the Dr. Turner we know would not think visiting brothels was a cool thing to do.  After all, he married a nun after waiting a long time for her.

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Orcinus orca

Orcinus orca

36 minutes ago, Ancaster said:

I hated this and thought Dr Turner's "wink wink, nudge nudge, boys will be boys" reaction, complete with cheesy grin, was completely out of character.

Don't forget that this was more than 50 years ago when "boys will be boys" was considered the norm, there was no protection for women regarding sexual harassment in the workplace, there was no such thing as marital rape, and a woman in the US couldn't even get a credit card in her own name, and the "Me, too" movement would have been laughed out of existence.  

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Ancaster

Ancaster

(edited)
On 4/8/2025 at 10:28 AM, Orcinus orca said:

Don't forget that this was more than 50 years ago when "boys will be boys" was considered the norm, there was no protection for women regarding sexual harassment in the workplace, there was no such thing as marital rape, and a woman in the US couldn't even get a credit card in her own name, and the "Me, too" movement would have been laughed out of existence.  

I'm well aware of all this, but the very nature of "the norm" means that not everyone falls within it.  I maintain that this was out of character for Dr Turner.

Edited by Ancaster
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libgirl2

libgirl2

1 hour ago, JudyObscure said:

I sort of  agree.  I laughed, but  partly out of surprise.  He may have been trying to put the young man at ease and make sure he didn't feel judged, but you're right, the Dr. Turner we know would not think visiting brothels was a cool thing to do.  After all, he married a nun after waiting a long time for her.

I'm like you, while it is out of character, he just might have been trying to do as you said. The guy was fairly young and a serious approach might not have been comforting. 

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Badger

Badger

My VPN was being wonky, so I didn't get a chance to do a deleted scene thing, but I remember there was part of a scene cut out between Joyce and Trixie where she tells Trixie she has a letter from America.  Trixie opens it up, reads it, smiles, and tells Joyce that Matthew has sent her a lock of Jonty's hair.  She says she must miss him terribly, and she says she does.

Anyway, I think that helped inspire Trixie to take some of Arlene's baby's hair to give to her.

 

 

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Doublemint

Doublemint

19 hours ago, Orcinus orca said:

Don't forget that this was more than 50 years ago when "boys will be boys" was considered the norm, there was no protection for women regarding sexual harassment in the workplace, there was no such thing as marital rape, and a woman in the US couldn't even get a credit card in her own name, and the "Me, too" movement would have been laughed out of existence.  

Yes,  it was considered "normal" for boys to be boys.  Dads would be proud of their sons for being manly.  It's hard for younger generations to understand this, but this is the way it was for millenia.   I remember this very well.  You can't take  Doc Turner out of his generation.

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iMonrey

iMonrey

23 hours ago, JudyObscure said:

Dr. Turner we know would not think visiting brothels was a cool thing to do.  After all, he married a nun after waiting a long time for her.

I did not get the impression that Dr. Turner was validating or approving of the kid's behavior in any way. It felt more didactic and judgmental to me. The kid thought he was "getting lucky," as Turner put it. He wasn't. 

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JudyObscure

JudyObscure

4 hours ago, Doublemint said:

You can't take  Doc Turner out of his generation.

That's a good thing, too.  I wish they would keep the midwives inside their generation a little bit better.

In all the cases of unmarried or cheating mothers the only one who seemed the tiniest bit disapproving was the young woman several years ago  who told Sister Julienne she was disappointed in the woman who had got pregnant by a married man because she and the other woman were both teachers and she just hadn't thought a teacher would do something like that.  Sister Julienne then came down hard on her just for being honest.  

The midwives have always treated the men much worse than the women.  Remember the woman who got pregnant by a black man while her husband was at sea?  Compare how kind they were to her with  the man  last episode who had gone to a prostitute when he thought he would never see his wife again.

I think they should be non-judgmental to everyone, but to keep the midwives inside their generation I expect them to be a little bit more disapproving when they're among themselves. I think it would be so disheartening to have desperately poor women showing up at the clinic for their fifth or sixth pregnancy.  I would be talking about birth control all the time.

Cotypubby

Cotypubby

On 4/8/2025 at 12:59 PM, JudyObscure said:

I sort of  agree.  I laughed, but  partly out of surprise.  He may have been trying to put the young man at ease and make sure he didn't feel judged, but you're right, the Dr. Turner we know would not think visiting brothels was a cool thing to do.  After all, he married a nun after waiting a long time for her.

He didn’t know the boy had gone to a brothel during that scene. Dr Turner probably thought it was someone the kid’s own age. The boy revealed it was from his brother’s bachelor party later in the episode.

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