Chit-Chat: What's On Your Mind Today?

[ParadoxLost]

California got simultaneously hit by a hurricane and an earthquake?

[kristen111]

1 hour ago, peacheslatour said:

I married for love. We still love each other. Other than citizenship, tax advantages or the merging of kingdoms, I don't really see any other reason to do 

[Bastet]

4 hours ago, ParadoxLost said:

California got simultaneously hit by a hurricane and an earthquake?

The tropical storm hasn't reached us yet - it made landfall in Mexico - but it's been raining all day, and then around 2:40 there was an earthquake.  Lots of "What's next?" jokes on NextDoor.

Edited August 21, 2023 by Bastet

[kristen111]

Just now, kristen111 said:

1 hour ago, peacheslatour said:

I married for love. We still love each other. Other than citizenship, tax advantages or the merging of kingdoms, I don't really see any other reason to do 

My distant woman relative married for money.  Her husband was worth millions.  He died after they were married for ten years.  He left everything to her, nothing for his two boys from his previous marriage.  I know she coerced him.  There are bad women in this world.  His boys could have used the money.  I know everything for a fact.

 

 

 

[Laura Holt]

19 hours ago, annzeepark914 said:

I've watched a few Dateline shows and was so horrified by the evil in some humans that it haunted me for several days (especially the women who murdered their kids as well as their husbands). 

I try not to watch or read about this kind of thing because I can't stop thinking about it afterwards.  That said, I was just on the BBC website looking up something else and came across a story about a neo-natal nurse named Lucy Lethby who has just been convicted of murdering IIRC 7 babies. She's going to be sentenced tomorrow and the expectation is a life sentence with no parole.  Anyway even though I didn't want to I ended up reading more about her.  Sigh.  Evil truly can come in a mild and gentle seeming form.

[annzeepark914]

39 minutes ago, kristen111 said:

I married for one reason, and one reason only .. LOVE.  The continuation of this same love has sustained us for many years. 

Me too but I had to wait a looooong time until I *finally* met Mr. Right-For-Me.  People told me I was too picky. Yup. I was. Could've been married several times but each one of those guys eventually bored me and/or got on my last nerve. 

 

 

[kristen111]

3 minutes ago, annzeepark914 said:

Me too but I had to wait a looooong time until I *finally* met Mr. Right-For-Me.  People told me I was too picky. Yup. I was. Could've been married several times but each one of those guys eventually bored me and/or got on my last nerve. 

 

 

Did you know he was for you right away?

[annzeepark914]

Just now, kristen111 said:

Did you know he was for you right away?

Just about. Smart, nice dresser, attractive, good job, nothing weird about him. And he thought I was hilarious (he's from the Midwest & laughs at my NY-isms). As Ina would say, "How bad could that be?" 😁

[Browncoat]

I know a woman who got married because she was of a certain age, and believed that that was what you did when you were of a certain age.  The person she married was not a great option, but he just happened to be who she was dating at the time.  We couldn't talk her out of it, even though she knew he was not a great option.  They're divorced now, partly because he was directly responsible for the death of one of her dogs (he frightened the dog for a laugh, the dog then crashed through the screen door out of the house and into the street, where it was hit by a car).  All that to say that people get married for a lot of reasons, and sometimes, to paraphrase Tina Turner, love doesn't have anything to do with it.

 

 

[Laura Holt]

5 minutes ago, Browncoat said:

I know a woman who got married because she was of a certain age, and believed that that was what you did when you were of a certain age.

One of my closest friends from high school married at 18 because she didn't want to go to university and she didn't like the job she found.  No one could talk her out of it either, she really felt like there was no other option left to her.  Marriage lasted 5 years. 

[kristen111]

8 minutes ago, Laura Holt said:

One of my closest friends from high school married at 18 because she didn't want to go to university and she didn't like the job she found.  No one could talk her out of it either, she really felt like there was no other option left to her.  Marriage lasted 5 years. 

Courtship with someone you care about is the best feeling ever.  

[ECM1231]

25 minutes ago, Browncoat said:

They're divorced now, partly because he was directly responsible for the death of one of her dogs (he frightened the dog for a laugh, the dog then crashed through the screen door out of the house and into the street, where it was hit by a car).

😳 How heartbreaking! 

[Annber03]

1 hour ago, Laura Holt said:

I try not to watch or read about this kind of thing because I can't stop thinking about it afterwards.  That said, I was just on the BBC website looking up something else and came across a story about a neo-natal nurse named Lucy Lethby who has just been convicted of murdering IIRC 7 babies. She's going to be sentenced tomorrow and the expectation is a life sentence with no parole.  Anyway even though I didn't want to I ended up reading more about her.  Sigh.  Evil truly can come in a mild and gentle seeming form.

There's been quite a few stories of that sort, with doctors and nurses killing patients. The elderly and babies seem to be the most common targets in those kinds of situations. The reasons can vary (though much of the time it's some kind of twisted "hero complex" situation), but yeah, those are truly scary cases.

1 hour ago, annzeepark914 said:

Me too but I had to wait a looooong time until I *finally* met Mr. Right-For-Me.  People told me I was too picky. Yup. I was. Could've been married several times but each one of those guys eventually bored me and/or got on my last nerve. 

Ha, I definitely think being "picky" is a big reason I've not settled down thus far. Honestly, though, for me the biggest reasons are that there's just not a very varied dating pool where I live (I've tended to live in smaller towns where it's not as easy to find people in my age range, let alone ones that aren't already single and without families of their own and whatnot), and I've had other stuff going on over the years to where dating just got put on the back burner in general. 

But yeah, I'm not in any rush. I figure it'll happen if and when it happens, I don't want to try and force it. 

[theredhead77]

1 hour ago, Bastet said:

The tropical storm hasn't reached us yet - it made landfall in Mexico - but it's been raining all day, and then around 2:15 there was an earthquake.  Lot of "What's next?" jokes on NextDoor.

At least 3 different people I know posted they filed a copyright on "Hurriquake". I am certain none of them will be the first to file or win that copyright.

[Gramto6]

Re the discussion above about not reading as much any more...

This made me think of the Twilight Zone episode where the man loves to read, I think if I remember correctly, he couldn't read as much as he really wanted. Something happened (memory is foggy on this part) and he ended up the last person on the Earth and he was thrilled because there he was at a library chock full of books and he had all the time in the world to read...then he dropped his thick glasses and broke them.... the look on his face was heartbreaking and then screen went dark.

[Annber03]

2 minutes ago, Gramto6 said:

Re the discussion above about not reading as much any more...

This made me think of the Twilight Zone episode where the man loves to read, I think if I remember correctly, he couldn't read as much as he really wanted. Something happened (memory is foggy on this part) and he ended up the last person on the Earth and he was thrilled because there he was at a library chock full of books and he had all the time in the world to read...then he dropped his thick glasses and broke them.... the look on his face was heartbreaking and then screen went dark.

A nuclear bomb went off and literally left him the sole survivor. 

But yeah, he wanted to read any chance he got and nobody would let him or mocked him for doing so (his wife even blacked out entire pages of his books, which...damn). And then when he finally gets the chance...yeah. That happens :(. 

Funny thing, Burgess Meredith, who played the main guy in that episode, apparently said once that of all the roles he'd had over his lifetime, that "Twilight Zone" appearance was the one he got the most comments for from fans. Something about that episode and his character in it really struck a chord with a lot of people, and rightly so. 

[oliviabenson]

For true crime shows fans I recommend Deadly Women…

 

[annzeepark914]

1 hour ago, Gramto6 said:

Re the discussion above about not reading as much any more...

This made me think of the Twilight Zone episode where the man loves to read, I think if I remember correctly, he couldn't read as much as he really wanted. Something happened (memory is foggy on this part) and he ended up the last person on the Earth and he was thrilled because there he was at a library chock full of books and he had all the time in the world to read...then he dropped his thick glasses and broke them.... the look on his face was heartbreaking and then screen went dark.

I didn't watch this show much but I remember this episode. ☹️

[partofme]

47 minutes ago, oliviabenson said:

For true crime shows fans I recommend Deadly Women…

 

I used to watch so much true crime, but I never really liked deadly women, the show is definitely well done from an entertainment perspective, but they only spend 20 minutes on each case (and with commercials it’s closer to 15 minutes each), and I feel like they leave a lot of information out, and if it’s a case where there was any element of self defense it’s left out all together.  
 

Also there are so many more men killers and it bothers me that there are so many show like this and Snapped a s Wives with Knives that focus solely on women killers. 

Edited August 21, 2023 by partofme

[Bastet]

30 minutes ago, partofme said:

Snapped

I had never heard of that until Kathleen Madigan did a bit about it in her latest comedy special.  Not at all my cup of tea, but her description of it was funny.  (There have been some exceptionally well done documentaries, but in general I find "true crime" programming exploitative, sensationalist, fearmongering, and grossly over-simplified.)

As for tropical storm Hilary -- she's heeere (in southern CA; the center isn't to me yet).  I cannot believe how much rain is coming down in August, thanks to this weird tropical storm.  It's been such an odd feeling all day, for it to be warm, yet dark and rainy.  I'll be fine in terms of water; my area is not at all prone to flooding even during such oddities.  My only issue will be if the winds knock out power, not just for the usual inconvenience but also because my cat's medication has to be refrigerated.  But I have exponentially more rain than wind in my area still; the night is young, of course, but I'm not in an area likely to get more than this crazy rain.

But people in other areas, especially where there have been recent fires - which means the water doesn't penetrate, but runs off the dirt like it's concrete - could wind up with serious problems.  There are desert areas projected to get a year's worth of rain just from this storm!  Evacuations, floods, mudslides, etc. are already happening.  LA's entire school district canceled classes for tomorrow (it is still so weird to me kids are back in school already). 

 

[shapeshifter]

54 minutes ago, Bastet said:

My only issue will be if the winds knock out power, not just for the usual inconvenience but also because my cat's medication has to be refrigerated. 

Do you have an ice chest with ice “at the ready”?

[theredhead77]

Welp my patio flooded because of the poor drainage from the cover. I just spent the last 30 minutes digging drainage trenches and hoping I didn't destroy anything beyond my yard, or create a sink hole. I probably should have left it alone to evaporate. I bought a gutter extender but it was too big and the drain part was basically against the ground I couldn't have slid it under if I wanted to.

[Bastet]

1 hour ago, shapeshifter said:

Do you have an ice chest with ice “at the ready”?

No; I've never had an outage last long enough to be a problem.  I don't anticipate that happening this time, either.  If it did, I could go get some.  Despite all the manic headlines, we're not lacking in supplies -- while some are going to suffer terribly, the worst this is going to be in my area is an inconvenience.

10 minutes ago, theredhead77 said:

I just spent the last 30 minutes digging drainage trenches

I did that about ten years ago after a good storm.  I keep things sloped away from the house, but extra rainfall revealed some places where I'd wind up with standing water.  So I maximized the sloping where necessary and created a couple of trenches for handling excess.  No problems since.  As long as you didn't screw someone else over with how you routed the water, you should also be good.

Edited August 21, 2023 by Bastet

[theredhead77]

They're basically giant holes in the lawn area. The lawn is already dead. Some are right next to the cement where the water was pooling. It's supposed to be back to hot tomorrow so hopefully it all dries out. I guess I'm escalating my landscaping plan..

Edited August 21, 2023 by theredhead77

[shapeshifter]

4 hours ago, Bastet said:

I could go get some.

About 5 years ago I risked driving through non-life-threatening flooding which “only” damaged my car (the weight of the water) which was covered by insurance, but was still slightly terrifying to drive through and very stressful (for me) to deal with.

Since then I freak out a little if my GPS warns of possible flash flooding on my route home from my daughter’s.

I’ve also had scary snow storm drives home, so I tend to stock up on things like I’m preparing for a Laura Ingles Wilder Long Winter, heh.

I don't consider myself to be a "prepper," but am I? LOL

I think Mom & Dad shopped a bit that way too, having moved from the city to the burbs, and having endured The Great Depression.

And who among us hasn’t had our shopping habits permanently altered to some degree by supply chain shortages and health risks of crowded public places of the pandemic? 

Edited August 21, 2023 by shapeshifter

[PRgal]

Saw a little girl wearing a smock type dress that looked like something I wore when I was her age.  I asked the mom if it was vintage and she seemed offended. I think it might be a cultural difference.  I asked my dad and he said some people in Asia think wearing something old means others think they’re poor.  I wonder if the mom would have been offended had I NOT been Asian?

[shapeshifter]

1 hour ago, PRgal said:

Saw a little girl wearing a smock type dress that looked like something I wore when I was her age.  I asked the mom if it was vintage and she seemed offended. I think it might be a cultural difference.  I asked my dad and he said some people in Asia think wearing something old means others think they’re poor.  I wonder if the mom would have been offended had I NOT been Asian?

My guess is that if the person took offense because of a cultural norm, it initially would not much matter whether the person making the remark was of the same ethnicity or not. 
However, had you been white or another seemingly non-Asian background (such as African American), maybe the offended mom would have later had her own dad (or mom, aunt, etc.) explain to her that "vintage" means "cool" or "hip" to "those people," especially if that person works with "those people." 

Just to add to the confusion, there is a lot of discrepancy among just English speakers about what is meant when someone uses the descriptors vintage, antique, retro, or classic. Here's one opinion: https://antique-marks.com/vintage-vs-antique-vs-retro-vs-classic.html

I am often thinking how I could have worded things differently, or how I may have misinterpreted someone else's remarks. If you cross paths with that person again, there could be a chance to make it clear you were trying to be friendly. But if she's the kind of person who is always ready to be offended, being her friend would take some work. 

[annzeepark914]

Same words, same country, different meaning. When I moved to NC, I felt as though I'd moved to a different country. I was working with a volunteer on a project and she referred to her adorable 6 year old daughter as "a mess". I was stunned. Where I came from, a mess was someone strung out on drugs, maybe living on the streets...the absolute worst. I can't remember all the other words that had a different meaning, but this one was unforgettable 😁.

[SuprSuprElevated]

I lost some coffee on this one, lol. 😆

[Laura Holt]

4 hours ago, shapeshifter said:

And who among us hasn’t had our shopping habits permanently altered to some degree by supply chain shortages and health risks of crowded public places of the pandemic? 

It's hard to break the habit now.  I never used to "stockpile" non perishables but got into the habit of it during the pandemic and now I admit I like seeing the pantry full.  And it's not just food if anyone needs dish soap or hand soap I can hook you up...

[kristen111]

12 hours ago, oliviabenson said:

For true crime shows fans I recommend Deadly Women…

 

I’m sure you all have read books by Sidney Sheldon.  I couldn’t put them down.  I still remember stirring spaghetti on the stove while reading.  Any good authors lately?  It’s been awhile.  I usually order them from the library, then just pick them up.

[PRgal]

1 hour ago, shapeshifter said:

My guess is that if the person took offense because of a cultural norm, it initially would not much matter whether the person making the remark was of the same ethnicity or not. 
However, had you been white or another seemingly non-Asian background (such as African American), maybe the offended mom would have later had her own dad (or mom, aunt, etc.) explain to her that "vintage" means "cool" or "hip" to "those people," especially if that person works with "those people." 

Just to add to the confusion, there is a lot of discrepancy among just English speakers about what is meant when someone uses the descriptors vintage, antique, retro, or classic. Here's one opinion: https://antique-marks.com/vintage-vs-antique-vs-retro-vs-classic.html

I am often thinking how I could have worded things differently, or how I may have misinterpreted someone else's remarks. If you cross paths with that person again, there could be a chance to make it clear you were trying to be friendly. But if she's the kind of person who is always ready to be offended, being her friend would take some work. 

I don't know if the mom's husband would have understood the term "vintage" as being hip/cool if the mom didn't.  What's weird is that East Asians seem to have an obsession with, say, vintage wines and cars, but when it comes to kids' clothing, it's something bad?  They also love their history.  I guess the 80s was such a nasty time when it comes to clothes, that it's bad to be vintage from that era?  But still, it's more of an LOL thing than "geez, that woman is crazy!"

[theredhead77]

Yay. All water has dried / drained. The yard is a mess but I should be able to put the dirt back this week.

I uncovered a bunch of random roots thick enough to be from trees. I'm not sure where they are from since there are no trees or bushes anywhere near where I was digging but hope I didn't damage them.

[shapeshifter]

1 hour ago, Laura Holt said:

It's hard to break the habit now.  I never used to "stockpile" non perishables but got into the habit of it during the pandemic and now I admit I like seeing the pantry full.  And it's not just food if anyone needs dish soap or hand soap I can hook you up...

I think it's some part of our so-called "lizard brain" that makes it hard to stop stockpiling. I've been doing it for decades now, mostly from when I lived 10 miles from the grocery store. 
When I visited my daughter in her tiny NYC apartment in the early 2000s I left her with at least a few months worth of toilet paper. When the pandemic hit I had plenty.

[oliviabenson]

I used watch snapped a long time ago! Loved it!

[stewedsquash]

Yep “a mess” is good in that context,  “messy” not so much. Messy is sneaky, conniving, etc. 

3 hours ago, annzeepark914 said:

Same words, same country, different meaning. When I moved to NC, I felt as though I'd moved to a different country. I was working with a volunteer on a project and she referred to her adorable 6 year old daughter as "a mess". I was stunned. Where I came from, a mess was someone strung out on drugs, maybe living on the streets...the absolute worst. I can't remember all the other words that had a different meaning, but this one was unforgettable 😁.

@PRgal perhaps the mother did understand what vintage means and was offended that you thought the clothes were hand me downs or thrift shop? If you had asked if retro it would have been a different context, not used or old. 

[PRgal]

3 minutes ago, stewedsquash said:

Yep “a mess” is good in that context,  “messy” not so much. Messy is sneaky, conniving, etc. 

@PRgal perhaps the mother did understand what vintage means and was offended that you thought the clothes were hand me downs or thrift shop? If you had asked if retro it would have been a different context, not used or old. 

Probably.  My dad says buying second hand is considered bad in Chinese culture.  Which isn’t how I think (and probably why I have issues with the current diversity/inclusion philosophy.  But THAT is something not for discussion here!).  When my son was a few months old, we put him in an outfit that I had when I was a baby (so we’re looking at late 1979/early 1980 back in 2018/2019).  It was pretty frilly, and I kind of joked that he was ready for Baby Drag Race.  I know.  I was a mean mom.  But he WAS cute! 

[SuprSuprElevated]

I'll leave it to someone more capable than I, to put this into a usable context. Still mindblowing.

5 MB of data on 62,500 punch cards in 1955.

Edited August 21, 2023 by SuprSuprElevated

[shapeshifter]

12 minutes ago, SuprSuprElevated said:

I'll leave it to someone more capable than I, to put this into a usable context. Still mindblowing.

5 MB of data on 62,500 punch cards in 1955.

Better pay than knitting?

[shapeshifter]

42 minutes ago, PRgal said:

 When my son was a few months old, we put him in an outfit that I had when I was a baby (so we’re looking at late 1979/early 1980 back in 2018/2019). 

This👆made me flash back to when my first daughter was born in 1979 and my aunt sent me a package of frilly, 100% cotton, baby dresses from her daughters, circa the late 1950s, maybe to the early 1960s.
Being a homemade granola kind of person, I was delighted to have something for her that wasn't polyester that I didn't have to sew myself. 
However, at that time, if someone had said something about the dress being vintage or whatever the term was at that time, I would probably have side-eyed them too. OTOH, if someone said something like, "Ooo. Is that a 100% cotton dress? It's so cute!" I would have thought that person was one of my people, regardless of any trait or age or physicality of that person.

ETA: 
Are kids' clothes valued for being "vintage" like adult clothes are? 
I should probably ask an old work friend I haven't talked to in too long who is into buying pre-owned clothes as a commitment to not supporting industries that take advantage of low-wage or enslaved laborers. Her kids are about 3 and 5 years old now.
Probably not relevant (but maybe?), her parents are from East Asia.

Edited August 21, 2023 by shapeshifter

[PRgal]

17 minutes ago, shapeshifter said:

This👆made me flash back to when my first daughter was born in 1979 and my aunt sent me a package of frilly, 100% cotton, baby dresses from her daughters, circa the late 1950s, maybe to the early 1960s.
Being a homemade granola kind of person, I was delighted to have something for her that wasn't polyester that I didn't have to sew myself. 
However, at that time, if someone had said something about the dress being vintage or whatever the term was at that time, I would probably have side-eyed them too. OTOH, if someone said something like, "Ooo. Is that a 100% cotton dress? It's so cute!" I would have thought that person was one of my people, regardless of any trait or age or physicality of that person.

ETA: 
Are kids' clothes valued for being "vintage" like adult clothes are? 
I should probably ask an old work friend I haven't talked to in too long who is into buying pre-owned clothes as a commitment to not supporting industries that take advantage of low-wage or enslaved laborers. Her kids are about 3 and 5 years old now.
Probably not relevant (but maybe?), her parents are from East Asia.

If your work friend was born/raised in a western country, she probably won't care that it's vintage and may even find it cool (especially if she's a millennial or GenX).  Her OWN parents might find it weird.  I think the issue lies more with getting wearing vintage from other people - strangers - than getting hand-me-downs from relatives.  I guess there's the "what if someone DIED in that outfit?" going on.  I don't know. 

[JustHereForFood]

19 hours ago, annzeepark914 said:

People told me I was too picky. Yup. I was. 

I always think back to Clueless.

"You see how picky I am about my shoes and they only go on my feet."

[Cloud9Shopper]

Just did myself a huge favor and deleted my Reddit account and left a Discord server with a bully mod. 

I was pushed over the edge on Reddit this morning when I posted in a sub where I am a regular, and I said I was going to turn down a job offer I got. People raided my account with downvotes and so many replies about how I should not complain about my job ever again that you’d think I’d kicked the hiring manager’s dog or that my turning down a job somehow hurts a bunch of online strangers personally.

In Discord, a mod was offended by my “oversharing” about my problems and ordered me to not discuss my personal life in the server anymore at all. I am almost 40 years old; I am not going to be policed like that by someone who is likely in their 20s or early 30s. I wouldn’t even be IRL friends with someone who tried to police what topics I could discuss with them! I’m not going to put up with it from someone who doesn’t even know my real name or wouldn’t recognize me if they saw me at Starbucks or something. I would never treat someone like that if I ran a server and noticed someone going through a hard time. I’m not going to hang out in a place where my personal struggles make people “uncomfortable.” I mean, too bad? So, I left the server and basically told the mod to piss off. Felt good. 

I am losing my patience for the chronically online thin-skinned crowd, whether they are loony fandom shippers, easily offended at everything or think they can tell me how to manage my life and problems. I am allowed to turn down jobs and have bad days, after all. 

Edited August 21, 2023 by Cloud9Shopper

[peacheslatour]

Quote

Just did myself a huge favor and deleted my Reddit account and left a Discord server with a bully mod. 
 

What sub were you in?

[Bastet]

10 hours ago, shapeshifter said:

About 5 years ago I risked driving through non-life-threatening flooding which “only” damaged my car (the weight of the water) which was covered by insurance, but was still slightly terrifying to drive through and very stressful (for me) to deal with.

That wouldn't have been the case here; if I'd needed to go get ice due to a power outage, I could easily walk.  If I'd needed to drive a little way to get a cooler, there would have been no danger.  I do keep little ice packs in the freezer, so if the power did go out I'd be able to put her medicine in between those and it would be fine in the closed refrigerator for the time it would take to be restored; we don't have situations here where power is out for a day (or more), it's only hours.

It was a really easy night, though; we never got strong winds here, so no power issues.  The rain water has already been absorbed, and it's a beautiful sunny day.

[Bastet]

A friend just sent me a link to a post on her unharmed neighborhood's NextDoor, that applies equally to mine.  It talked about assessing the damage from yesterday's storm, and how we can rebuild, with this picture:

 

[oliviabenson]

[theredhead77]

Is anyone else following the insanity over on WDW Info?

[Cloud9Shopper]

3 hours ago, peacheslatour said:

What sub were you in?

I was in several and don’t want to say which one this occurred in so as not to give away my identity. (I tend to use different usernames everywhere.)

Honestly I was just so upset and embarrassed. I get what people were trying to tell me about the job offer (I won’t detail it so to stay on topic here), but at the same time, it was weird that people were acting like my wanting to turn down a job also made me the worst person ever who had no idea what I was doing. All I said was that I didn’t want to go from a job I wasn’t in love with to another “just OK” job where I’d also be making less per hour and then have to spend more in gas money too (long commute three days a week) when gas is near $4 a gallon. Somehow everyone thought that was a reason to brigade me in downvotes and attack me. 

[PRgal]

9 hours ago, Laura Holt said:

It's hard to break the habit now.  I never used to "stockpile" non perishables but got into the habit of it during the pandemic and now I admit I like seeing the pantry full.  And it's not just food if anyone needs dish soap or hand soap I can hook you up...

TP for our family!!  I’ve gone back to food shopping three or four times a week.  It was twice, both times delivery during the pandemic