All Episodes Discussion

[12catcrazy]

14 hours ago, Lsk02 said:

Charlene was smirking throughout most of the interview and Josh was correct that there was no remorse. Wonder what she talked to her lawyer about that convinced her to finally turn on the crocodile tears. 
 

I was wondering about that child abuse charge. She filmed her husband slapping his daughter and showed some friends, who ended up turning it in. Which makes me think she had no problems with the abuse. Not surprising knowing she ended up helping kill 2 people, but ugh. She was evil long before. 

I wondered about her videoing her husband slapping his daughter and then showing it to people.  Was she going to use this when she planned to dump his ass, but it wound up backfiring on her when she lost HER kids?   Who the hell would video that and show it off nowadays unless you want to get the person doing it in trouble?  Maybe she wanted the guy's daughter out of the home and didnt bank on it affecting her kids?  Just stupid and puzzling.

[Annber03]

2 hours ago, iMonrey said:

The only thing that kept me guessing was whether or not she was in jail at the time of the interview because she seemed to be wearing civilian clothes. Then at the very end of the episode she stood up and you could see she was wearing orange jumpsuit pants. So it's almost like there was a deliberate misdirect by the show by giving her a regular top to wear for the interview so we wouldn't know right away she was in jail.

Yeah, I was wondering about that, too. I was like, "So help me, if I find out she got some kind of deal or something to keep herself out of jail...". 28 years still doesn't seem like quite enough. 

[walnutqueen]

1 hour ago, Ohmo said:

Dennis, not Josh, although I would have been very curious to see what Josh's reaction to Charlene would have been.

Oh, I already know what Josh would do.  Raise one eyebrow, place finger alongside cheek, and then ZING her.  Much like Dennis did when he called her a monster.

[JudyObscure]

3 minutes ago, Supagirl said:

“I’m not sure what remorse looks like but I’m pretty sure this isn’t it.”

I liked that, too.  The only time her story seemed tinged with pain was when she told about Tim's car breaking down in Kansas and how the phone rang at four o'clock in the morning!"  Poor Charlene's sleep was disturbed, y'all.

I'll never figure out these people who love their children so much that they'll kill to get custody, but don't mind putting those same children through the pain  and fear of losing a parent through murder.

[Boop1977]

I actually was born and raised in Sunray and even though I don't live there now, I have family that lives there so I still go there from time to time.  This is the biggest thing to ever happen there.  The thing I don't understand is why he called the cops instead of a tow truck.   Or realize what a bad idea it was and just go back home.  Now those poor kids have no parents.  Such a sad situation.

[walnutqueen]

11 minutes ago, Boop1977 said:

The thing I don't understand is why he called the cops instead of a tow truck.

Because criminals are often dumber than cops?  ;~)

[Lsk02]

Just thought of something else. I hope someday Charlene’s son doesn’t see this interview where she talks about him crying about not wanting to live in New York and that’s when she knew she had to do something. Those poor kids are already going to be messed up, but the last thing he needs is guilt and thinking he was the catalyst in all of this. 

[Ohmo]

3 hours ago, iMonrey said:

The only thing that kept me guessing was whether or not she was in jail at the time of the interview because she seemed to be wearing civilian clothes.

Her clothes weren't what gave it away for me.  It was the room.  It was like Dateline purposely made the background fuzzy so you couldn't focus on details, but you could tell that she was sitting in front of some sort of bulletin board.  Since a school seemed an unlikely place for an interview since she had no connection to education, jail/prison was the next most likely location.

[walnutqueen]

20 minutes ago, Lsk02 said:

Just thought of something else. I hope someday Charlene’s son doesn’t see this interview where she talks about him crying about not wanting to live in New York and that’s when she knew she had to do something. Those poor kids are already going to be messed up, but the last thing he needs is guilt and thinking he was the catalyst in all of this. 

Like Dennis posited, she's a monster.  Fortunately (or, unfortunately, depending how you look at it), children are resilient and are able to survive living with monsters.  Sort of.  I mean, there is damage, but many are able to overcome it without repeating the monstrosities.

[cooksdelight]

55 minutes ago, Boop1977 said:

Now those poor kids have no parents. 

No, but they have loving, caring family members taking care of them. Best thing that could have happened to them since their birth parents weren’t up to the job.

[TVbitch]

Who fucking calls 911 to report they drove into a ditch on their way to commit a murder. That is a new level of stupid.

I'm gonna cut Dateline some slack, y'all, cuz of course they are going to try to make a mystery out of it best they can. At the end of the day, they are making true crime entertainment. 

I thought Denis was awesome. Whatever bullshit she said about being human and making mistakes, he kept bringing it back to the fact that she was a remorseless killer who murdered two people. Can you imagine if Andrea got that interview? She would show up in skinny jeans and 4 inch heels and be like, "What did you think when Tim called you at 4AM, were you like, oh my god!" :)

Why would any lawyer let that chick do an interview? 

[walnutqueen]

10 minutes ago, TVbitch said:

Why would any lawyer let that chick do an interview? 

Because lawyers are often as dumb as cops and criminals?  ;~)

[Annber03]

4 minutes ago, TVbitch said:

Who fucking calls 911 to report they drove into a ditch on their way to commit a murder. That is a new level of stupid.

That bit reminded me of a "Deadly Women" episode I saw the other night. A woman had murdered her husband-she'd tried to bash his head in with some piece of cement or something, but that didn't kill him, so then she smothered him. She then tried to light the bed he was in on fire....but then the fire started getting out of control and she realized she didn't want her house to burn down. So she put out the fire....and then called the fire department to report it. Didn't take long for her to be arrested for the murder after that. People like that might as well just walk around with neon signs saying, "ARREST ME!"

Quote

I thought Denis was awesome. Whatever bullshit she said about being human and making mistakes, he kept bringing it back to the fact that she was a remorseless killer who murdered two people.

Agreed. He was not having any of her BS.

2 hours ago, Boop1977 said:

I actually was born and raised in Sunray and even though I don't live there now, I have family that lives there so I still go there from time to time.  This is the biggest thing to ever happen there.  

You know, if I were those townspeople, I'd be demanding some changes to how their local police force hires people or something, too. Such a small police force, and yet they've had two local officers arrested for a role in a murder plot. Not a good look .

[EtheltoTillie]

2 hours ago, Lsk02 said:

Just thought of something else. I hope someday Charlene’s son doesn’t see this interview where she talks about him crying about not wanting to live in New York and that’s when she knew she had to do something. Those poor kids are already going to be messed up, but the last thing he needs is guilt and thinking he was the catalyst in all of this. 

I thought of that too. Poor kid.

I pegged this as another custody battle at the beginning, but then I was fooled by the lengthy interviews with Charlene. Come on, Dateline. You hadn’t done one of those orange pants reveals in a while. So we saw that coming about two thirds of the way through. 

[thejuicer]

Charlene: Conducts the whole interview in a smug, punchable demeanour. 

Dennis: "Do you have remorse?"

Charlene: Talks to her lawyer off camera, comes back crying the fakest tears I have ever seen. "Of course I feel bad!" *Thinks about making parole early*

[Boop1977]

1 hour ago, Annber03 said:

You know, if I were those townspeople, I'd be demanding some changes to how their local police force hires people or something, too. Such a small police force, and yet they've had two local officers arrested for a role in a murder plot. Not a good look .

No it is not a good look.  Problem is that Sunray is so small, the pool of candidates are very limited.

[Boop1977]

And what they didn't say is the story was that Charlene had another boyfriend in Sunray too.

[Boop1977]

4 hours ago, walnutqueen said:

Because criminals are often dumber than cops?  ;~)

That's true.  But he is a cop and a criminal so you would think he would know what and what not to do.  What an idiot.

[walnutqueen]

Sorry to say, but many, if not more, people join the police force to exert their need for authority rather than joining for the purpose of helping people or providing a service.

I hate to say this, but there is a certain type that often gravitates towards a career in law enforcement, and it is not a benevolent, public service minded citizen; it's a type that likes power and authority over others.  Just sayin' the bar isn't set particularly high.

[LittleIggy]

9 hours ago, biakbiak said:

This is why I always fast forward until just after Lester’s intro because they give so much away in the first minute, same with the bumpers before the commercials.

I could never ff Lester! I have such a crush on him. 😏

[cooksdelight]

3 hours ago, walnutqueen said:

Sorry to say, but many, if not more, people join the police force to exert their need for authority rather than joining for the purpose of helping people or providing a service.

I hate to say this, but there is a certain type that often gravitates towards a career in law enforcement, and it is not a benevolent, public service minded citizen; it's a type that likes power and authority over others.  Just sayin' the bar isn't set particularly high.

Yes, I see it all the time in the small town I live in. We’ve got one city cop who I have seen screaming at a woman he pulled over. Short fat guy, go figure. There’s also one who likes to always be the first on the scene and will endanger other people by leading high-speed chases on 2-lane country roads. Sheriff’s dept has a womanizer who hits on every woman he encounters. And if you don’t respond, look out... he will threaten you. 

Nothing anyone can do about it, they all stick together and cover each other’s backs.

[Coffeewinewater]

On 10/12/2019 at 12:53 AM, Lsk02 said:

Charlene was smirking throughout most of the interview and Josh was correct that there was no remorse. Wonder what she talked to her lawyer about that convinced her to finally turn on the crocodile tears. 
 

I was wondering about that child abuse charge. She filmed her husband slapping his daughter and showed some friends, who ended up turning it in. Which makes me think she had no problems with the abuse. Not surprising knowing she ended up helping kill 2 people, but ugh. She was evil long before. 

Yes, this.

I was wondering did she secretly recording him to turn him in? Or was she just recording him slap the hell out of child for kicks? Clearly it was for kicks.  Wtf?

I'm not a violent person but damn I wanted punch her in her smirking face. I knew it was her from jump, a woman that takes that many perfect looking selfies isn't going on tv with that fried looking hair, just saying.

Yes, Sunray, TX must be proud of the representation of their police department 🙄.

Edited October 13, 2019 by Coffeewinewater

[Coffeewinewater]

13 hours ago, Boop1977 said:

And what they didn't say is the story was that Charlene had another boyfriend in Sunray too.

She did? Damn. I thought  they just mentioned the guy in New York.  

She killed this couple when all she had to do was go through with the divorce.  She wasn't in a committed marriage anyway.  If she had actually divorced him she probably would have gotten the children back.

[Lsk02]

5 minutes ago, Coffeewinewater said:

She killed this couple when all she had to do was go through with the divorce.  She wasn't in a committed marriage anyway.  If she had actually divorced him she probably would have gotten the children back.

She wanted them back right away. She asked the judge or lawyer (can’t remember which) if she’d get custody if she divorced her husband and was told they’d revisit it at the end of the school year. She just couldn’t stand to wait. And again, ended up taking all the parents away from her kids instead. 

[ridethemaverick]

Her dark roots and split ends gave it away for me.

So much stupid in this episode but you guys have covered it all. 

[Minivanessa]

Note to self: program the DVR to record the new episodes of Dateline on NBC Friday nights. I didn't, and decided after reading here that I'd like to see this episode. So I pulled it up On Demand. And, urgh. They've disabled the FF function for this episode On Demand. And the pace was so  . . . crawly. I gave up. At least if I've DVR'd it, I can FF through the commercials, and recaps, and fluff. Because IMO Dateline usually dragggsss out a story into twice the time it should take. Sigh.

Edited October 14, 2019 by Jeeves
Not isn't note

[walnutqueen]

6 hours ago, Jeeves said:

Note to self: program the DVR to record the new episodes of Dateline on NBC Friday nights. I didn't, and decided after reading here that I'd like to see this episode. So I pulled it up On Demand. And, urgh. They've disabled the FF function for this episode On Demand. And the pace was so  . . . crawly. I gave up. At least if I've DVR'd it, I can FF through the commercials, and recaps, and fluff. Because IMO Dateline usually dragggsss out a story into twice the time it should take. Sigh.

I DVR everything, and ff through all the ads and boring shit.   I am now watching a bunch of stuff on Hulu before my subscription expires next month, and I have to move my remote out of reach, because I automatically grab for it to ff thru ads, which you can't do on my cheapo subscription (99 cents/month - thanks Cyber Monday deal).  This means I also can't mute ads, because my autopilot hand can't remember the difference between ff and mute.  Sigh.

On topic, I often record a Dateline rerun featuring Keith Morrison so I have something to turn on when I feel sleepy.  His voice is like a lullaby to me.  Only problem is that he manages to make the story interesting, so it has to be a 2 hour episode I've seen more than once.  

[EtheltoTillie]

12 hours ago, Jeeves said:

Note to self: program the DVR to record the new episodes of Dateline on NBC Friday nights. I didn't, and decided after reading here that I'd like to see this episode. So I pulled it up On Demand. And, urgh. They've disabled the FF function for this episode On Demand. And the pace was so  . . . crawly. I gave up. At least if I've DVR'd it, I can FF through the commercials, and recaps, and fluff. Because IMO Dateline usually dragggsss out a story into twice the time it should take. Sigh.

Yeah so annoying. All the major network shows disable fast forwarding for on demand. 

[iMonrey]

Quote

So I pulled it up On Demand. And, urgh. They've disabled the FF function for this episode On Demand. And the pace was so  . . . crawly. I gave up.

Watching these live would be excruciating. I've never timed it but it feels like Dateline is just laden with commercials, more so than other shows. Especially the 2-hour ones. I swear I can get thru them in about an hour and 15 minutes by FFing all the commercials and the "coming up" segments.

[pigs-in-space]

On 10/12/2019 at 8:02 PM, thejuicer said:

Charlene: Conducts the whole interview in a smug, punchable demeanour. 

Dennis: "Do you have remorse?"

Charlene: Talks to her lawyer off camera, comes back crying the fakest tears I have ever seen. "Of course I feel bad!" *Thinks about making parole early*

I thought she got upset that he wasn't believing her, and that was what caused the tears. I'd bet the only remorse she felt was that she was caught.

I think she should have gotten a longer sentence but at the very least she has lost her children for the foreseeable future. Maybe when she's out and they are grown they will choose to have a relationship with her, but she won't get that chance for a long while.

[cooksdelight]

She also won’t get the chance to influence them to her way of thinking, possibly instilling criminal intent into their minds.

[iMonrey]

The Pink Skirt Plot - another one that should have been an hour. Honestly, you knew it was the wife within the first five minutes. Why do they stretch these things out? It was just an hour and a half of the authorities chasing down this woman. I can't remember the last time they covered a case that actually merited two hours' worth of airtime.

[LittleIggy]

Poor Adam apparently had business smarts but not people smarts. In this day and age, why would a man marry a woman because she said she was pregnant. 🙄 Did any of his friends try to clue him in on Aria? His dad was a champ. He never gave up.

[UsernameFatigue]

1 hour ago, iMonrey said:

The Pink Skirt Plot - another one that should have been an hour. Honestly, you knew it was the wife within the first five minutes. Why do they stretch these things out? It was just an hour and a half of the authorities chasing down this woman. I can't remember the last time they covered a case that actually merited two hours' worth of airtime.

I thought they gave it away with the name of the episode alone. Then of course within minutes when they said that Adam's wife had a restaurant called The Pink Skirt (stupid name) it was a given that she was the person responsible. 

I am shocked that the guy who worked at her restaurant was convicted based on one person's eyewitness ID, and no other evidence what so ever. Wow. 

[biakbiak]

I had somehow missed this story in the past so I didn’t mind the two hours because the story wasn’t really about if she was involved but rather would she be brought to justice.

[TVbitch]

Adam --so smart yet so dumb. First he can't discern a gold-digger? Then he falls for the convenient pregnancy con and gets married without even verifying it. Then after hiring a bodyguard because he was afraid for his life from this woman and her family, he chooses to go out with her alone ...to talk about finalizing the divorce. Whuh? 

I'm glad the dad saw justice, but if Adam was not super wealthy and hanging out with the elites, no way would that much expense and effort have gone into it. The FBI guy said as much.  

[BusyOctober]

I missed some of the beginning...did Aria have the bar with the stupid name before or after she married Adam?  Either way, if I were Adam, once I heard “Pink Skirt” as her business’s name, would’ve know I wasn’t dealing with a very bright woman.   Her “Pink Skirt” would’ve been signal to cut bait and get the fuck outta that situation.

It’s too bad Adam’s family and friends weren’t able to influence him away from that cold hearted sociopath. How many lives she made worse by being on the planet! Adam’s, his family, his friends and coworkers... Not to mention her 3 children!  It’s a shame her mother is raising the youngest one.  I hope the Italian father of the twins erases all traces of Aria from their memories.  

[LittleIggy]

8 hours ago, biakbiak said:

I had somehow missed this story in the past so I didn’t mind the two hours because the story wasn’t really about if she was involved but rather would she be brought to justice.

Yeah, I thought the second hour about how they manage to finally get her back to PR was fascinating.

[12catcrazy]

On 10/19/2019 at 10:08 PM, BusyOctober said:

I missed some of the beginning...did Aria have the bar with the stupid name before or after she married Adam?  Either way, if I were Adam, once I heard “Pink Skirt” as her business’s name, would’ve know I wasn’t dealing with a very bright woman.   Her “Pink Skirt” would’ve been signal to cut bait and get the fuck outta that situation.

I believe that Adam had bought her the bar after they got married.  

[LizBug]

Adam might not have thought to verify the pregnancy story but someone in his family (probably his father) was smart enough to insist on a prenup.  Unfortunately, that prenup ultimately lead to his death.

But ... did Aria ever get any money from his estate?  Seems that the money was tied up or she couldn't get her hands on it.  And, when things got hot in PR, she went to Italy.

[OpalNightstream]

I Completely lost interest in the case with Aria. It went on entirely too long. I just couldn’t get into it. 

[Minivanessa]

12 hours ago, OpalNightstream said:

I Completely lost interest in the case with Aria. It went on entirely too long. I just couldn’t get into it. 

Same here. I DVR'd it but even the FF key couldn't save it for me.

[JudyObscure]

Anyone watch, The Box?  I thought it was  very interesting.  I'd like to know what happened to Ben's father  and if we're still sure about what happened to Ben himself.

Montana has Marshals.  Cool.

[cooksdelight]

I honestly didn’t suspect the wife right off the bat. Not until later in the story.

[Lsk02]

Did they purposely leave it up In the air as to whether Noah believed his mom is innocent? I really could not tell based on his answers at the end. 
 

I’m wondering if the other brother Matt was more of a suspect than the story told? They gave very little information on him, but him being there, and the body being moved, had me thinking there was more to him. 
 

I was all in with mom doing it until the defense brought up the coffee and him possibly eating the leftovers the next morning. My spouse eats weird leftovers for breakfast, too. But those letters, emails, and internet searches kept me away from full “reasonable doubt” I think. And they did have his initial time of death within the timeframe of right before or after they left that morning, so probably not likely he woke up and ate a full meal. I think. 

[JudyObscure]

9 minutes ago, Lsk02 said:

I was all in with mom doing it until the defense brought up the coffee and him possibly eating the leftovers the next morning.

It gave me pause for a minute, my husband would have eaten all those leftovers in the morning, too,  but I remembered all the other things that have caffeine like tea, chocolate and Mountain Dew that he might have had at night.  The chance of a man coming in to kill him, out in the middle of nowhere, stealing nothing, and then leaving was just too much of a stretch. 

Mainly, I asked myself why she would spend two years setting up the Arkansas woman  if she wasn't planning something.   That poor Arkansas lady, I'm glad Keith was so nice to her.

Noah did say he thought his mother was innocent but qualified it by saying he had to, she was his mother.  So sad for all three boys. 

I'll always wonder if part of the reason Ben committed suicide was that he knew about his mother's dark side.

[Annber03]

I'd heard that story on a couple other shows years ago-I want to say "Snapped" did a story on it once? I remember that one because it always struck me how lame her attempt to hide the evidence was. Her husband's dead and it's just her in this fairly rural house, ('cause her kids are away for much of the night), so it's not like she's at much risk of any witnesses seeing her. She could've tried to hide the gun in any nearby wooded areas or something, or hell, she could've taken the clothes and the gun, stashed them in the trunk of her car, and discreetly disposed of them the next day somewhere on her trip to Missoula, things like that,..

...but instead she shoves the clothes in the washer and the gun in the side pocket of a motorcycle in the freaking garage. Just...what? To say nothing of how, if she'd initially intended this to be a suicide, she forgot to put the weapon next to his body. Kind of an important detail, that. 

I don't know that I heard that bit about the flower before, though. Of all the things... That was hilarious, as was the fact her DNA was on the seal of the envelopes. Gotta love those forensics. I also liked seeing her face as the interrogators were letting her know that they had evidence pointing to her. You could almost see the wheels desperately turning in her head as she tried to come up with new explanations. It always amazes me how a criminal can come up with such an elaborate plan, only to trip themselves up on the little details. 

2 hours ago, JudyObscure said:

The chance of a man coming in to kill him, out in the middle of nowhere, stealing nothing, and then leaving was just too much of a stretch. 

This. And a random burglar probably isn't going to think to stick a gun they had on them in a pocket on a motorcycle in the garage.

2 hours ago, Lsk02 said:

I’m wondering if the other brother Matt was more of a suspect than the story told? They gave very little information on him, but him being there, and the body being moved, had me thinking there was more to him. 

I thought about that possibility, too. Some aspects of her plot seemed like the sort that would require another person's aid, like the weird tapping noises and stuff.

2 hours ago, JudyObscure said:

I'll always wonder if part of the reason Ben committed suicide was that he knew about his mother's dark side.

Interesting question. I agree with the comment made at one point that there was a very deep-running anger here, to come up with that kind of nasty scheme. I think it's almost too simple to say the affair and/or the money were her motive for killing her husband-they definitely played a part, I think, the affair may have even been the final straw, but yeah, I think she clearly had some hatred towards her husband for a good long while before that. You have to really despise somebody to want to torment them that badly. So if that's the case, that may answer your question some. 

[JudyObscure]

On the up side we got to see her cuffed and charged.  I thought her reaction was hilarious.  After hearing all the evidence they had against her she was still completely surprised and shocked that they were actually going to arrest her.  At first she just put her foot down and said, 'No!" over and over, and then struggled with them.  I guess this woman was just so entitled and spoiled she really didn't think the police would ever put her in jail.  She's so pretty and well-to-do!

[Annber03]

"I've never been in trouble before!" Well, there's a first time for everything, isn't there? 

I loved the one interrogator saying something like, "If I were you, I'd stop talking right now."

[UsernameFatigue]

5 hours ago, cooksdelight said:

I honestly didn’t suspect the wife right off the bat. Not until later in the story.

I actually suspected the wife right away. Partially because I thought at first that it was a repeat of a case that was almost the exact same scenario, where the wife goes shopping in the morning with a kid leaving hubby sleeping, and comes home to dead hubby, Supposedly. 

When I realized it wasn't the same case, I still thought it was the wife. When women kill their husbands, it always seems like they have to make sure the cops know that they had sex with their husbands just before hubby was murdered, A red flag for me.

When the cops first entered the house and found the body, right away I said to myself that it wasn't suicide because if someone was going to commit suicide, why bother taking off clothes? And I would imagine even men would not like the thought of being found naked.

I also thought the defense lawyer saying that the hubby had left overs for breakfast was laughable. So he wanted a "last supper" before he blew his brains out? Got up, stayed naked apparently, went to the kitchen, ate, and went back to bed to shoot himself?  All this after his wife left at 8:30 ish? Or better yet, got up, dressed, went to kitchen to eat leftovers, then returned to bedroom, undressed, got in bed and shot himself. Sure. Bringing in the sons as the ones possibly who hid the gun after their dad committed suicide was despicable. 

It is really too bad that the sons did not cut their mother out of their lives. I honestly don't understand that type of blind devotion, and she certainly doesn't deserve it.