walnutqueen May 30, 2015 Share May 30, 2015 Holy inappropriate smiling, Batman! That daughter was far too pleased with herself for being the "star" in a TeeVee show. There was something completely "off" about her. 6 Link to comment
Ohmo May 30, 2015 Share May 30, 2015 (edited) The season and episode number are impossible to keep straight for Dateline, so I'm not doing it. :) The title will have to be enough. I know that 48 Hours did this case, but it was several years ago before Paige's body had been found. Lester was a suspect, but he was unable to be arrested at the time. Paige certainly seemed like a nice person, but she unfortunately put herself in a very dangerous situation that cost her her life. Her children and her parents are going to rue the choice she made for the rest of their lives. I especially feel for her father. Edited May 30, 2015 by Ohmo 4 Link to comment
woodscommaelle May 30, 2015 Share May 30, 2015 Why was there only one set of footprints in the snow (I think they belonged to police or a detective)? Shouldn't there have been two other sets: the two 'ladies' who killed her? And were the gloves they had on the same brand that the 'good' daughter bought at the store? 1 Link to comment
editorgrrl May 30, 2015 Share May 30, 2015 When a single mother of three suddenly vanishes, her family organize a massive search. As police investigate, they discover she was living a dangerous double life that leads them to multiple suspects. This story originally aired Dateline NBC on July 6, 2008: http://www.nbcnews.com/id/25559428/ns/dateline_nbc-crime_reports/t/secret-life-soccer-mom/ 2 Link to comment
editorgrrl May 30, 2015 Share May 30, 2015 (edited) Season 24, Episode 45 May 28, 2015 Josh Mankiewicz reports. Successful businesswoman Peggy Nadell is found murdered in her Rockland County home. With no forensic evidence, police use wiretaps and data analysis to search for her killer. Investigators follow the faint trail of an “untraceable” late night call and are led to someone very familiar. Edited May 30, 2015 by editorgrrl Link to comment
Ohmo May 30, 2015 Share May 30, 2015 Then Dateline must have added an update. Last night's episode talked about as recently as November 2014. They're getting ready to go to trial, it seems. 2 Link to comment
Morbs May 30, 2015 Share May 30, 2015 It's so annoying when an episode airs before the trial, but I realize they are hard up for good cases to profile. 1 Link to comment
tobeannounced May 30, 2015 Share May 30, 2015 I knew I had seen this story before, but it was definitely a new take because they hadn't found the body on the one I saw. I was thinking it was Disappeared that did the story though. I'm sure the kids would have much rather had their mother than that house with the huge mortgage that she had to resort to prostitution to pay for. That was just so odd to me. I mean, if something ever happened to my marriage or husband and I had to sell our house, the house my kids have grown up in, it would be heart-wrenching, but I wouldn't resort to a life of crime to keep it. (I didn't say prostitution because that ship has sailed - lol) 11 Link to comment
JudyObscure May 30, 2015 Share May 30, 2015 There were questions I wanted them to ask, but I understand, in a case like this, they have to tip toe around some issues to keep from sounding judgmental. I wanted to know why she didn't just sell that big house and move into a smaller place in the same school district. Of course she didn't want to uproot the children anymore than necessary but people move all the time and the little ones do just fine. Why didn't she get a real nine to five job? It didn't sound like she had finished college but she would have had no trouble getting a nice office or banking job. Nobody can support a family selling cook ware to their friends and "dance" lessons to their children. It seemed so incredibly dangerous to go out nights into such a dangerous world and bring that risk into her children's lives. It was lucky the sicko she attracted didn't come to her house to vent all that rage. 8 Link to comment
editorgrrl May 30, 2015 Share May 30, 2015 (edited) Paige wasn't just putting herself at risk of STDs, battery, or worse at the hands of her clients. If she was arrested for prostitution, she might have lost custody of her kids. According to the link I posted above, Paige worked as an exotic dancer during her first marriage. And her second husband discovered her "clothes designed for erotic outcalls." I knew I had seen this story before, but it was definitely a new take because they hadn't found the body on the one I saw. I was thinking it was Disappeared that did the story though. You're right. It was Disappeared season 1, episode 2: "A Mother's Secret," which originally aired January 11, 2010. Also a 2008 episode of 48 Hours, "The Secret Life of Paige Birgfeld." Edited May 31, 2015 by editorgrrl 5 Link to comment
Ohmo May 31, 2015 Share May 31, 2015 (edited) Why didn't she get a real nine to five job? It didn't sound like she had finished college but she would have had no trouble getting a nice office or banking job. Nobody can support a family selling cook ware to their friends and "dance" lessons to their children. I have heard of women supporting children as Pampered Chef reps, Thirty-one bags reps, and reps for any of those other types of "at-home party" businesses that grew out of the success of Tupperware and Mary Kay. Of course, in the instances that I've heard about, women are reps for more than one company, and they aren't making $6000 a month. I agree that there was no reason at all to keep that house, but, based on what editorgrrl mentioned above, it seems like Paige had a taste for sex and danger that went as far back as her first marriage. Maybe Paige publically said the choice she made was about keeping her house because that was a more socially acceptable answer for her family and friends, but it seems less and less likely that her situation was actually about that. One thing that I noticed is that her parents never mentioned that she asked them for money or even that they offered and she didn't take it or she asked and they didn't have it to give to her. Paige and her family seemed close, so I'd think if she were in serious financial straights, there would at least be a discussion with her parents about money. That leads me to wonder if, even though she was in financial difficulty, this was actually less about money and more about the fact that Paige had a taste for a dangerous lifestyle. The expense of the house was just socially-accepted cover for Paige. ETA: You're right. It was Disappeared season 1, episode 2: "A Mother's Secret," which originally aired January 11, 2010. When 48 Hours did it, Paige's brother and his wife were part of the story. I think he was a doctor in another state (Washington maybe?), and he and his wife came and stayed in Paige's house with the kids for months after she disappeared. I don't remember the details of how it all happened, but I think the brother and his wife eventually adopted Paige's children. Edited May 31, 2015 by Ohmo 8 Link to comment
zxy556575 May 31, 2015 Share May 31, 2015 It also occurred to me that Tracfone is getting a lot of unwanted publicity from Dateline lately. Like, I almost feel guilty for having one now. I stupidly bought mine online with my own credit card and have continually added minutes, so I'm sure the police will be busting down my door any time. 11 Link to comment
zxy556575 May 31, 2015 Share May 31, 2015 It took me until maybe 10 minutes in until I realized I'd seen this profiled before. Different presentations, indeed. I agree with everyone that Paige should have sold the damned house (which, btw, wasn't all that palatial, other mommy group friend). Nor do I believe that, upon meeting her, people were blown back by her beauty. A little overboard with the hyperbole, folks. She must have been getting some spousal support from her second ex, right? I don't imagine that even high end hooking would have brought in the $10K+ a month she would have needed. If the guy who killed her was typical of her regular clientele, how much could she have been charging anyway? Sad story all around. Her parents and brother were indeed very dedicated. 5 Link to comment
editorgrrl May 31, 2015 Share May 31, 2015 It also occurred to me that Tracfone is getting a lot of unwanted publicity from Dateline lately. I had never heard of Tracfone until this episode. Then it was in the very next episode I watched, "The Secret Life of a Soccer Mom." But hey, free publicity. 4 Link to comment
ChristmasJones May 31, 2015 Share May 31, 2015 I found myself thinking about this episode while I was wide-awake with insomnia last night. This is a case where I found myself feeling angry at the victim. This woman had three young children. For her to put herself in such a dangerous situation, as a mother, well, I do judge her for that. I can't imagine what her children are going to feel as they get older and realize the reason she is gone. Agree with others who said this doesn't seem to be about the money, either. In those videos they showed of her at the party at her house, she seemed like someone who enjoyed the attention for her looks. Maybe that was her achilles heel in life. Sad. 4 Link to comment
walnutqueen May 31, 2015 Share May 31, 2015 "Tracfone : your resource for nefarious activities*". * Cash only. Videotaping in progress. 6 Link to comment
editorgrrl May 31, 2015 Share May 31, 2015 I can't retain the brand name from a toilet paper commercial, but I remember Tracfone. I even know the spelling, because Dateline oh-so-helpfully showed the packaging. You can't buy that kind of publicity. 3 Link to comment
walnutqueen May 31, 2015 Share May 31, 2015 Tracfone is missing a GOLDEN opportunity if they don't hire Keith Morrison as their celebrity spokesperson! 9 Link to comment
ridethemaverick May 31, 2015 Share May 31, 2015 You know, I like to consider myself liberated and progressive and live and let live. I think women should be able to escort if they want to. But then I see the reality. There was nothing glamorous about Paige's profession. Her clients weren't rich, older, distinguished men who took her to dinner before closing the deal. Those guys were oily and gross. How enjoyable could it have been for her? And she could have gotten a small 2 or 3 bedroom ranch house and a 9 to 5 admin job and been ok. Why the need to resort to that? I guess I'm not as progressive as I thought. Additionally, I can see how she stood out in that neighborhood. I've been in a few mommy clubs and honestly, most of them were frumps who pretty much stopped showering and brushing their teeth when the babies were born, never mind putting on makeup and cute clothes. Paige was cute and she had a boob job and kept herself up. Of course they thought she was a dazzling beauty. I feel so bad for her friends and family. I feel for her too, and I really wish I knew what drove her to that. I think I'd feel better if I knew she did enjoy what she was doing. 4 Link to comment
Enigma X May 31, 2015 Share May 31, 2015 This is not really for or against how Paige chose to make her money. It is more a commentary on how constantly I keep seeing statements such as this: And she could have gotten a small 2 or 3 bedroom ranch house and a 9 to 5 admin job and been ok. In May 2014, I received a masters degree. I have been applying like mad to positions. I am changing careers and still have a current professional job that I have been at for 10 years. I started out only looking for jobs within my masters field. I then thought, since my current job does not pay that much money, to look for jobs within the field that I work in now, in my masters field, and for a plain supplemental weekend and/or after hours position (nothing skeevy--think bookstore, bank, etc...) I have found absolutely nothing. All I am saying is that the possibility did exist that she looked for something else but could not find it. 2 Link to comment
ridethemaverick May 31, 2015 Share May 31, 2015 That's a good point, and it's definitely possible that she looked and found nothing. As I said, I generally don't have an issue with escorting but after getting a look at two of her clients, I thought surely there was a better way. Webcam models make pretty good money and they never have to interact with the clients personally. 1 Link to comment
Intocats May 31, 2015 Share May 31, 2015 I thought it was interesting that the photo the family chose for her obituary definitely downplayed her glamorous looks. http://www.legacy.com/obituaries/gjsentinel/obituary.aspx?pid=156983539 Paige certainly seemed like a nice person and in no way did she deserve what happened to her. But I agree with posters upthread that maybe it wasn't about the money. Surely she could have downsized her living situation if she had wanted to. Perhaps there was a facet to her personality that craved "living on the edge". If she had been a single person with no kids that would be tragic enough, but I feel for her poor children, as well as her parents. What a nightmare. 4 Link to comment
editorgrrl May 31, 2015 Share May 31, 2015 On Sunday, May 31, 2015, they reran 2013's "Shattered." http://www.nbcnews.com/video/dateline/52406989 Justine Abshire, kindergarten teacher and newlywed, was found dead on a rural Virginia road an apparent victim of a hit and run, but little about the accident scene made sense. 2 Link to comment
Ohmo June 1, 2015 Share June 1, 2015 All I am saying is that the possibility did exist that she looked for something else but could not find it. True, but if that were the case and she looked and looked and couldn't find anything, then the next logical choice is to give up the $6000 a month house. Then maybe she COULD have afforded to live on her Pampered Chef, baby sling, and dance lesson earnings. Paige and her children needed a dwelling to live in. That dwelling did not have to be a house with a $6000 mortgage. It could have been a smaller house, a condo, or an apartment. Even her friends said that most of them did not live in that large of a house. I don't think they would have cared if Paige had had to change her living situation. They were her friends. I understand what you're saying, Enigma, I do, but I think, in Paige's case, she didn't appear to be making choices based on the fact that she couldn't find anything. I'm just going to say it: Paige was appearing to make choices based on a love of sex, money, and danger (in whatever order anyone personally wishes to place them), only no one wants to actually say that because she was murdered and she was "so nice." There's a difference between want and need, and I think Paige wanted a certain amount of sex, danger, and money in her life, but she hid that "want" behind the "need" of a house that she didn't actually "need" to be in. She just wanted to be. 6 Link to comment
zxy556575 June 1, 2015 Share June 1, 2015 (edited) It also occurred to me that she probably could have gone back to stripping, which I understand can bring in fairly decent money. But that would have been out in the open and it was evidently more important to her that she maintain her "well-off suburban mommy" facade. In her head, how long could she have kept this up? It's not really a life for 50-year olds with children in college. From all accounts she was a good person, albeit one with bad taste in husbands. I'm not blaming her and sincerely feel bad for her, her kids, her family and friends. I'm in no way passing judgment on sex workers in general. But when I try to understand her choices, I just can't. Edited June 1, 2015 by lordonia 4 Link to comment
zxy556575 June 1, 2015 Share June 1, 2015 (edited) It has made me wonder about all those "burner phones" constantly referenced on crime shows. Even if you pay cash, the phone indicates where it was purchased? And what store doesn't have video surveillance these days? I wonder if there's a secondary drug dealer market for untraceable phones. Edited June 1, 2015 by lordonia 4 Link to comment
biakbiak June 1, 2015 Share June 1, 2015 There definitely is a secondary market for burner phones. Because of their use in crime they aren't as untraceable as they used to be. 4 Link to comment
JudyObscure June 1, 2015 Share June 1, 2015 I really didn't think they had enough evidence to convict Eric Abshire, but I hated him so much I didn't care. 5 Link to comment
ChristmasJones June 1, 2015 Share June 1, 2015 She is of course not to blame for some asshole deciding to murder her. But she is responsible for making super risky choices. And since she wasn't single... her choices had huge repercussions. Had she moved from a home with a $6,000/month mortgage to a much more modest home/apartment, I would feel a bit more sympathy for her. But to decide to keep living in that home, and not being willing to downsize.... I can't be as sympathetic to that. Her perspective on finances was warped, to say the least. For me, what is most troubling about this particular murder, is that it seems like it was so .... avoidable. And that does not mean blaming the victim. Victims and perpetrators cross paths in very complex ways....each of them making choices that lead them to that point where their actions intersect in a moment in time. 3 Link to comment
Lovecat June 1, 2015 Share June 1, 2015 There was a Tracfone commercial during one of my murder shows (Uh, I watch a lot of them) the other night. I about fell off the couch laughing. Then there was this exchange with my boyfriend during Dateline: Dateline: [references Tracfones] BF: Where *would* someone buy a Tracfone, anyway? Me: Walmart, duh! Are you new?? Dateline: ...and then investigators discovered this footage, of the suspect purchasing a Tracfone at a Walmart store... Me: SEE??!?? 8 Link to comment
jenkait June 1, 2015 Share June 1, 2015 Paige seemed pretty dynamic to me, like a person with lots confidence and energy. I guessed that she figured the escort business could keep her afloat; maybe she thought she'd get married again (I don't mean to a customer, just a new man) and could continue her lifestyle, living in the house? I did wonder why she didn't downsize too though, a 6,000 square foot house is huge! Aside from the mortgage, there would be a lot of maintenance costs (looked like there was a pool there, etc) and then there's food, bills, kids' stuff...YIKES. I tend to see escorting as a lack-of-options type of job and I don't blame people for doing it, but like you said Christmas Jones, I know I would've tried to cut costs first! I felt bad for her parents, for her death obviously (the poor dad worked so hard to find her, and seemed so heartbroken) and also because I'm sure she never meant for them to find out about her side job. The "blame the victim" thing is always hard to parse, because it can sound like blaming the victim when it may not be the intention. It's like you'd tell your teenage daughter not to go walking alone in a short skirt in a bad part of town at night; she absolutely should be able to wear anything/go anywhere she wants of course...and definitely it's not her *fault* if she's hurt, it's the 100% the perpetrator's fault! But we're talking about avoiding risk. We do blame people for taking risks, ie "What was she thinking?!" and I think it can come off as victim blaming. It is kind of a fine line, and I don't know how to really resolve it... I guess in society we just need to chose our words carefully and talk in terms of risk, which I see we're actually doing here. As far as escorting goes though, I would think an escort would run the risk of being raped or getting an STI more than being murdered by some lunatic! I suppose psychopaths could be trolling those sites looking for victims. 3 Link to comment
walnutqueen June 1, 2015 Share June 1, 2015 One look at him and I thought he was guilty! 2 Link to comment
Tunia June 1, 2015 Share June 1, 2015 (edited) Tracfone is missing a GOLDEN opportunity if they don't hire Keith Morrison as their celebrity spokesperson! If he's smart, KM wouldn't take the job. Have you ever read the reviews for Tracfone? Scroll through...they're a riot! http://www.consumeraffairs.com/cell_phones/tracfone.html Edited June 1, 2015 by Tunia 1 Link to comment
birdmom June 1, 2015 Share June 1, 2015 I wonder if the guy murdered her because he couldn't afford her rates. Didn't they show her website asking for $1000 a night??? Link to comment
psychoticstate June 1, 2015 Share June 1, 2015 I'm so glad I'm not the only person who thought the daughter was a complete nutter off her rocker. Her mother had only been gone a year and she was smiling and giggling throughout that interview. And yes, EVERYONE knows you DO NOT pull a knife out of a stabbing victim. For ANY reason. I can see running to her mother but she even said her mother was cold. At that point, you back away, you get the eff out of the house and do not touch anything. And yes, I'm sure her mother would most definitely have wanted her to go and buy a sportscar with some of her inheritance. Immediately. Diana was evil but she was also stupid. Does no one watch these shows? (well, besides us.) 8 Link to comment
ChristmasJones June 1, 2015 Share June 1, 2015 I thought the mortgage was $6,000 per month.... or was the house 6,000 sq ft? 1 Link to comment
tobeannounced June 1, 2015 Share June 1, 2015 I caught this one before, and what really stood out for me was how sad Justine looked in her wedding pictures. It must have been so hard on her family and friends to have to stand by and watch this slow-motion disintegration. 7 Link to comment
editorgrrl June 1, 2015 Share June 1, 2015 I thought the mortgage was $6,000 per month.... or was the house 6,000 sq ft? Paige Birgfeld's mortgage was nearly $6,000 a month. According to a 2007 article in the Grand Junction, Colorado, Daily Sentinel: The home off 25 Road is valued at $909,330, according to the Mesa County Assessor’s Web site. 2 Link to comment
jenkait June 1, 2015 Share June 1, 2015 Sorry! My error. I knew the mortgage was $6,000/month, don't know how I got the idea it was 6,000 sq'. Link to comment
ChristmasJones June 1, 2015 Share June 1, 2015 $6,000 is a lot of money. $72,000 a year. Plus all the other costs associated with owning a home. Did we ever hear how much child support she was getting? Link to comment
editorgrrl June 1, 2015 Share June 1, 2015 Sorry! My error. I knew the mortgage was $6,000/month, don't know how I got the idea it was 6,000 sq'. No, you're right on both counts. According to the internets, the house is 6,371 square feet with 4 bedrooms and 6 bathrooms. 1 Link to comment
SunnyBeBe June 1, 2015 Share June 1, 2015 I missed the second half to this one. And I can't see how to watch the full episode on their website. What's up with that? Link to comment
biakbiak June 2, 2015 Share June 2, 2015 I really wished it had been Keith who did this story because the world is a less good place without him talking about parade float builders! 7 Link to comment
Stampiron June 6, 2015 Share June 6, 2015 Good news! For fans of the episode "The House on Sumac Drive," (Russell Faria was convicted of stabbing to death his cancer-stricken wife Betsy, when it was obvious that she was killed by her friend Pam Hupp, who had just been made the beneficiary of Betsy's life insurance) Russell Faria has just been granted a new trial. His conviction was vacated and bail has been set at $500,000. The new trial is slated for Nov. 2, 2015. http://www.stltoday.com/news/local/crime-and-courts/judge-orders-new-trial-in-controversial-lincoln-county-murder-case/article_8d31c0e9-cd2a-5b5f-9d61-52ea93db060d.html http://www.nbcnews.com/watch/dateline/the-house-on-sumac-drive-part-1-195545667711 8 Link to comment
walnutqueen June 6, 2015 Share June 6, 2015 Good news! For fans of the episode "The House on Sumac Drive," (Russell Faria was convicted of stabbing to death his cancer-stricken wife Betsy, when it was obvious that she was killed by her friend Pam Hupp, who had just been made the beneficiary of Betsy's life insurance) Russell Faria has just been granted a new trial. His conviction was vacated and bail has been set at $500,000. The new trial is slated for Nov. 2, 2015. http://www.stltoday.com/news/local/crime-and-courts/judge-orders-new-trial-in-controversial-lincoln-county-murder-case/article_8d31c0e9-cd2a-5b5f-9d61-52ea93db060d.html http://www.nbcnews.com/watch/dateline/the-house-on-sumac-drive-part-1-195545667711 It's about time. I wish they could nail Pam Hupp. 4 Link to comment
biakbiak June 6, 2015 Share June 6, 2015 So sweet of her to the two daughters each 1% of what their mother left her! 2 Link to comment
tobeannounced June 6, 2015 Share June 6, 2015 Thanks for the update, Stampiron. I hope he gets a decent lawyer for his retrial. I only read the first article, but that was really poorly written. "A judge here Friday ordered..." 1 Link to comment
ButterQueen June 7, 2015 Share June 7, 2015 Anyone see "Dangerous Liasons"? Abigail Simon is a sick, lying woman. 3 Link to comment
ButterQueen June 7, 2015 Share June 7, 2015 Did they say why the Dad didn't come for his children when she went missing? Link to comment
Ohmo June 8, 2015 Share June 8, 2015 Wow, I'm almost afraid to admit this given everyone's reaction in this thread, but the daughter didn't seem that strange to me. I did think that it was odd that she mentioned the money off the bat, but the rest of it I just put into context. That context being the daughter said that she lived in a suburb of New Yoor City. Her husband is in a blue-collar profession, and her accent seemed very familiar to me. Her mother had money. She did not (yet.) At least not the level of money that her mother had. Without knowing specifically where the daughter lives, I can only speculate, but I have relatives that live in some of the blue-collar suburbs of New York City, and they sound and act a lot like the daughter. Some of my relatives are a bit "rough around the edges." When I last visited some of them many years ago, we got incredibly loud, like screaming at each other, only we weren't fighting. It was just general conversation, and as odd as it sounds, I bet the daughter didn'r even realize that she was as smiley as she was. If she lives anywhere in the area that I'm thinking, New Yorkers from that area get very animated when they talk...about anything. They don't even realize they're doing it...and then you start to do it too when you're part of the conversation. I'm surprised her hands weren't going a mile a minute. Honestly, the 911 didn't strike me as odd either. She sounded EXACTLY how I've heard some of my relatives talk in stressful situations. As to some of the ideas that she had and taking the knife out of her mother instead of leaving it in?....that would not be atypical behavior for some of my relatives. It's not stupidity, but there's a "rough and tumble" kind of impulsivity that exists. Unless there was a real curve coming somewhere, I was waiting for it NOT to be Suzanne because everything else read "she's just like the relatives" to me. Since I know I don't come from a family of murderers, I didn't give Suzanne much more of a thought than that. I was actually thinking "That's just New York stuff" when the cops were talking about her behavior and her theories. I'm glad she turned out not to be involved. 2 Link to comment
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