S01.E06: Cherished

[AnimeMania]

(Season Finale)

Cornelia finally confronts the man who killed her son and new revelations come to light. Love both lost and found determines a final showdown with irreversible consequences.

Premiere Date: November 10, 2022

[Zaffy]

I quite enjoyed the series which I watched in a day!
Cinematography was amazing, the story interesting and the acting mostly superb.

This is a story about the dark side of "wild wild west", although I am not sure if there was any other side.. (as much as series like "Little House on the Prairie" sugarcoated some of it).
What white men did to the native Americans was horrible, to say the least.

However, I am not sure if the motives of the main villain were racist or he was just a sociopath. I lean to the latter.
The big villain is the only issue I had with the series: he was a bit like an evil caricature and the actor played him like one. He was just impersonating Tom Hardy' crazy acting and it was utterly frustrating. I know that his character is supposed to be insufferable, but his acting was so over the top... it was awful.
The way the did the massacre scene was brilliant. Just listening to that machine gun noise and showing the murderers covered with blood after was just enough. You don't need to show graphic details to experience the horror of violence.

My only other issue was they didn't show how TT died. Just a mention, to the point I thought he survived and he would come back.
 

[Mr. R0b0t]

Enjoyed this quite a bit despite the slightly convoluted plotting.  All of the actors really nailed their parts. 

[nomodrama]

2 hours ago, Zaffy said:

This is a story about the dark side of "wild wild west", although I am not sure if there was any other side.. (as much as series like "Little House on the Prairie" sugarcoated some of it).
What white men did to the native Americans was horrible, to say the least.

Absolutely. I was telling the husband while watching this that I am so glad we were not born during this time period. We ended up dubbing this show The Most Extreme Version of Oregon Trail Ever Played. 

That poor Mennonite family. It's sad to think of all these immigrants children who had no choice but to follow their families to these new places and if they survived they were often orphaned and had to witness horrible atrocities. I guess its even sadder that not much has changed in all of these years. 

[magdalene]

I was very confused by Thomas Traffords death. I thought it was a narrative mistake not to show his end. Also, they should have had Cornelia and him meet, not to reunite or anything like that but for the story's sake. That felt like a missing link.

The best part was definitely the acting - Emily Blunt and her leading man were wonderful together, such chemistry,  and the gorgeous scenery.

I agree that the villain was completely over the top. To me he was both a racist and a complete sociopath.  I also watched all 6 episodes in one go, unusual for me as I am not a binger.

I am going to re-watch the whole series. My highest compliment.

[Zaffy]

3 hours ago, magdalene said:

I was very confused by Thomas Traffords death. I thought it was a narrative mistake not to show his end. Also, they should have had Cornelia and him meet, not to reunite or anything like that but for the story's sake. That felt like a missing link.

It was like if they run out of budget or the actor had to leave the filming. Which it was a weird decision, since they built a lot around him (and till some point they made us think Cornelia was there for him) and then "poof! gone!".

Edited November 13, 2022 by Zaffy

[Affogato]

I watched one episode with a friend, a couple on a plane trip home, and the rest the next day. Really didn't go where I expected it to go, and I am delighted that happened.

I think the theme is, in fact, 'you can't always get what you want, but if you try sometimes, you can get what you need'. Thomas' death was part of that, I thought she did originally plan on seeing him again and finding closure that way, and when she heard he died she wanted the body to bury, but that she did learn what happened to him and that had to be enough closure. In the same vein she clearly wanted to have a relationship, a ranch, and maybe raise the boy with Eli, but she got to know that he felt the same way and did get to go to his future, and she got to see the boy grow up to be an adult, and know he remembered her.

I agree that Melmont was a fairly simple villain, but to her, he probably was someone with no redeeming characteristics. Certainly he was a racist, I'm not sure if he was a 'sociopath' or simply a man of his times, in a situation where he got to do whatever he could get away with in pursuit of his goals and pleasures.

[Snazzy Daisy]

I rarely watch anything Old West but decided to watch The English once I saw its trailer and also because of Emily Blunt. I love it! ❤️

Quote

“It cannot be that this whole country is only full of killers and thieves!” 

- Lady Cornelia Locke

Cinematography - Stunning with many gorgeous landscapes that look like a painting. Some indoor scenes are too dark, literally.

Plot - A bit convoluted at times. Some flashbacks are a bit confusing. Scenes to illustrate the massacres of the Native Americans have been done delicately. Violence scenes are brutal and some are too graphic (the murders, shootings, hangings, branding, scalping etc.). Scenes involving horses getting hurt/killed are very unsettling.

Twist - Sad backstory re Cornelia’s son. We finally get an answer re her gloves’ mystery. Never see that coming. Feeling a bit devastated that Eli and Cornelia can’t be together. 

Characters:

• Great chemistry between the leads. I love how Cornelia always remembers some of Eli’s best advices and casually re-quotes them back to him.
• No satisfying closure for Thomas Trafford’s character, abrupt ending off screen.
• David Melmont is too unhinged and demented as the villain. Saw some comments online re Rafe Spall copying Tom Hardy’s Alfie Solomons from Peaky Blinders. Cannot comment on this as I never watch that show.
• Nichola McAuliffe as Black Eyed Mog is terrifying AF.
• I recognized Chaske Spencer from the Twilight movies, didn’t pay much attention to him back then. He makes the calm, reserved but strong Eli Whipp interesting. Eli doesn’t say much, he doesn't have to. Some of his strong emotions are conveyed through micro expressions. So riveting.

Eli Whipp is my latest tv crush! 😍😆

Edited November 16, 2022 by SnazzyDaisy

[dubbel zout]

I thought this had the usual good and bad points of Hugo Blick's work.

The good: Strong female character(s), interesting story, very well cast, high production values.

The bad: The story is both under- and overwritten. I know it was necessary for plot purposes, but Melmont running around spreading syphilis on two continents was a bit much. I also think that he wasn't in the dormant stage at all—his increasing madness was very much a symptom. Maybe he didn't have the physical signs, but the mental ones were clear to me.

Eli was a bit too enigmatic at times for me, though I thought Chaske Spencer was a riveting screen presence.

[magdalene]

Am I the only one genuinely upset Eli and Cordelia couldn't have a happy ending?

Generally I am more of a pragmatist and a firm believer that having chemistry and being in love is not enough to overcome big cultural differences and backgrounds long term, etc..    But these two were actually very well suited temperament wise and could have made a go of it on that farm of his. Dammit.

[Zaffy]

13 hours ago, magdalene said:

Am I the only one genuinely upset Eli and Cordelia couldn't have a happy ending?

Generally I am more of a pragmatist and a firm believer that having chemistry and being in love is not enough to overcome big cultural differences and backgrounds long term, etc..    But these two were actually very well suited temperament wise and could have made a go of it on that farm of his. Dammit.

To be honest I did not get why they didn't leave together..

[dubbel zout]

4 hours ago, Zaffy said:

To be honest I did not get why they didn't leave together..

Cornelia having syphilis limited how intimate their relationship could be, and I think that mattered to her a lot. Also, she might have felt she'd get better medical care in England, though that wasn't ever mentioned.

[BonnieD]

Quote

To be honest I did not get why they didn't leave together..

Ditto. It is possible to have a relationship without sex. But maybe she didn't want to burden him with her increasing deterioration, or have him see her as she knew she would be toward the end.

[magdalene]

I had meant that I didn't want her to have Syphilis period, they had so much chemistry and were well matched, I wanted a happy ending for them. It still would have been a happy ending with plenty of problems. Given the dangerous country and having to face plenty of people objecting to them as a couple. I found the Syphilis to be over-kill.

[Affogato]

On 11/21/2022 at 8:03 PM, magdalene said:

I had meant that I didn't want her to have Syphilis period, they had so much chemistry and were well matched, I wanted a happy ending for them. It still would have been a happy ending with plenty of problems. Given the dangerous country and having to face plenty of people objecting to them as a couple. I found the Syphilis to be over-kill.

I agree it was tragic and that the actors had chemistry,  but I thought it was a worthy solution to all of the things she went through and a unique reason why she had come to the West. Without it the show would have been a fairly pedestrian one.

[Fake Jan Brady]

I was confused at the beginning but won over by the way the information regarding Cordelia's backstory was parsed out over the course of the season.

Rafe Spall needed to take villain lessons from Ciaran Hinds, who was a lot more terrifying in a few scenes than the several that Rafe chewed his way through [and what happened to his accent at the end?]

Emily Blunt is always excellent and Chaske Spencer was a revelation.

I can't say I enjoyed it due to all the gruesomeness but I did appreciate it and was quite moved at the end.

[MissL]

Shoot. I’ve been in a MOOD and peaked in this thread because I needed to know if there was a happy-ish ending coming. So now I don’t know if I’ll finish anytime soon. Maybe after the holidays.  I’ve enjoyed the show to an extent. The acting is very good but there were times when even I who likes to think I’m ok with dialogue heavy shows and don’t need action (I loved the west wing for goodness sake) was thinking…good god quit talking is anything going to HAPPEN? This show is DARK. I just need a little fluff right now.

And count me disappointed to find out Victoria and Albert never cross paths on the show. (Really hope someone gets why I’m calling Trafford and Cornelia that.)

[Quickbeam]

Excellent finale. I thought the syphilis content was handled well. There was next to nothing that could help and children born to infected mothers were generally deformed and blind. I was glad I was spoiled as it helped make some of the earlier content easier to understand.

I also thought Melmont was in the grips of syphilitic dementia.

[pasdetrois]

As Melmont waited for the final showdown, he was shown poking the tops of his booted feet with his cane, and then moments later doing a little hop off of the platform instead of walking down the steps. I wonder if these quick images were meant to signal advancing syphilis. Years ago an MD friend spotted a man walking oddly and commented that he appeared to have the "syphilis shuffle."

And yes, what happened to Melmont's pronounced accent, which dominated so many of his earlier scenes?

Edited December 11, 2022 by pasdetrois

[dubbel zout]

1 hour ago, pasdetrois said:

And yes, what happened to Melmont's pronounced accent, which dominated so many of his earlier scenes?

I wonder if he felt he no longer needed it? That had to be a deliberate choice by the actor.

[Hava]

On 11/17/2022 at 3:09 PM, magdalene said:

Am I the only one genuinely upset Eli and Cordelia couldn't have a happy ending?

Same here. I was devastated and heartbroken by their ending. I found their romance so beautiful and so magical that it seemed unfair to end it there. 

Despite some flaws pointed out here (like the scenery-chewing of Melmont), the story between Cornelia and Eli was enough to elevate these show to one of my favorite ever. I was thoroughly captivated and enthralled.

Can someone tell me if syphillis can be contracted through kissing?

Edited December 14, 2022 by Hava

[Rickster]

I didn’t need a traditional happy ending for Eli and Cordelia, but while the series was well done, I found it so depressing I’d be hard put to recommend it to anyone,

[Kirsty]

I enjoyed the show but I didn't love the finale. There was no reason for Eli and Cornelia to go their separate ways! And given that she had said in a previous episode that she was already dead, I expected Cornelia to go out in a blaze of glory in this episode. I think I'd have preferred if she and Melmont had fought and killed each other.

Quite a dark, brutal story with beautiful cinematography and some great performances.

[Hava]

I wonder why Cornelia didn't live out the rest of her life with Eli? Even if they couldn't be intimate, why not just be with him? HIs character didn't seem to be the type to abandon her at her worst.

[BAForever]

Agree with posts. Beautiful scenery, great acting, awesome chemistry between leads, a bit convoluted story line, reading comments here helps.

A few thoughts

1.Malmont was a caricature. He needed to twirl his mustache.

2. Want to see Eli succeed- want a sequel or a prequel 

3. Cornelia couldn't save her son, but she saved Jed (Jeb?) and No Trouble. So happy he remembered her.

[BAForever]

On 12/6/2022 at 8:35 PM, MissL said:

Shoot. I’ve been in a MOOD and peaked in this thread because I needed to know if there was a happy-ish ending coming. So now I don’t know if I’ll finish anytime soon. Maybe after the holidays. 

The ending satisfied me- although you couldn't call it happy. It's like the song and the title of epi 1. Sometimes you get what you need.

You should finish it MissL 

[Hava]

I just watched the series for a second time, and I am in a puddle of tears. I rarely (if ever) cry at TV shows. I don't know why this series has affected me so deeply. 

[Valny]

Man that was a sad ending. Had me wiping some tears away mainly from the Eli/Corneli a storyline.    I am really glad she went back to England if she couldn't be with him. The old West was really rough and frightening the way it was depicted here.  Geez, was there any GOOD Decent folks around?!!      What was that item Eli gave to Cornelia? I wasn't paying attention well enough and didn't quite know what it was when he got it back from the other Indian. 
I was talking to me sister before I had seen the finale and I said Melmont better get his after all the evil things he's done. Man I hated him so much!!  And finding out what he did to Cornelia made me hate him even more.
The old crazy lady with the nasty eyes and skinned head was one of the most frightening characters I have seen in a while!  So that was her in the black veil later on at the side show,she didn't die?
I too wanted Eli and C to get together, I was rooting for them since the beginning.  but I am glad they at least kissed and later got a nice big hug at the end.
Was Trafford the good looking English guy?  There were so many character names, I didn't always follow.
 

Quote

 

November 16, 2022 (edited)

I rarely watch anything Old West but decided to watch The English once I saw its trailer and also because of Emily Blunt. I love it!

 

Same here, usually if I see a series/movie that is a Western, I run the other way.

Blunt was really good in this series, especially this last ep.  She actually was nominated for a SAG award for Outstanding Performance by a Female Actor in a Television Movie or Limited Series.  Happy she was recognized for this.

Edited January 27, 2023 by Valny

[Shermie]

On 1/26/2023 at 10:19 PM, Valny said:

The old crazy lady with the nasty eyes and skinned head was one of the most frightening characters I have seen in a while!  So that was her in the black veil later on at the side show,she didn't die?

That was Cornelia in the black veil at the side show. She was talking to the young Native boy (sorry, don’t remember the name) that she and Eli saved; the boy grew up and joined the Wild West Show that travelled around England. Cornelia even asked him why he joined since it was just a circus.

The crazy old lady had been scalped and her eyelids had been cut off, hence the sunglasses. Undergoing that makes her hatred somewhat understandable. Not sure you can actually survive/function without eyelids, especially in the dusty old west. Is thought I heard her comment that it happened when she was only 21 and that was 20 years earlier, so when she died she was only 41! And she did die in the cabin.

[paramitch]

Oh, man, this was really lovely. Confusing, but beautiful, and very moving.

I absolutely salute the show for its care for history and its careful eye and respect for the Indigenous people. I loved that we had actors who were all of varying tribes and who spoke their languages, and I appreciated that the show always attempted to balance the violence we were shown -- and the fact that it really began as violence by "The English," and that it was the Indigenous people's violence that was simply a reaction (and often a defense) against that.

I know I'm in the minority, but I thought Melmont was a fun villain. Sure, he's over the top, but as others have stated, he's showing signs of syphilitic dementia. And I actually liked his character as a villain because he's such a good metaphor -- what he did to Cornelia is what "The English" did to the Indigenous of America on the larger scale. It's incredibly tragic and an obscenity on so many levels. I also liked that Melmont starts out much more still and silent until his trip West. It's like I said in a previous post -- something has been unleashed in him, and he's enjoying every second of that ability to express himself with cruelty.

For me, the core was Cornelia -- she was an incredibly cool, strong character, and I loved Blunt's performance. I wrote in an early episode thread that I didn't understand why Cornelia was so casual about her constant danger in the first few episodes. But then I understood -- she didn't care. She was already dead to herself. Until Eli made her remember she was still alive. 

The fact that Cornelia was able to truly love her child of rape was so moving to me. Sometimes people are not able to separate themselves like that, so I appreciated that she truly loved her baby and did not inflict negativity on the poor little thing for what its father had done to her.

But what a terribly sad thing to have happened to her. I mean, this poor woman. She's a virgin, she's raped, infected with syphilis, impregnated, robbed, and then she is ostracized and isolated from her family, gives birth, and the child is born infected and lives a short life in pain and disfigurement. She then has to face a future of pain, sickness, isolation, without touch or sex, possible insanity, horrific disfigurement, and early death. It breaks my heart.

So -- all this rambling is simply to say how much I loved her incredibly rich and poignant relationship with Eli. They are truly soulmates. And it is devastating to me that they didn't remain together, that they only had those few days and moments together, the few small intimacies. I was angry at them for separating -- why not take the few days of happiness they could get? Life is short. I feel they wasted their chance.

But it was beautifully done, and when they parted and he once again sang to her in farewell, I did cry. (I wish he had told her she was "cherished" in a quieter moment. Not from afar.

On 11/13/2022 at 6:52 AM, Zaffy said:

This is a story about the dark side of "wild wild west", although I am not sure if there was any other side.. (as much as series like "Little House on the Prairie" sugarcoated some of it).

What white men did to the native Americans was horrible, to say the least.

The irony to me is that while the "Little House" books were heavily sugarcoated by Wilder (accomplished possibly in conjunction with her daughter) but now more than ever, we can see how much racism and thoughtless support of genocide and abuse is still present. Pa and Laura do show some genuine feeling for the Indigenous and people of color they encounter, but meanwhile, Ma Ingalls? Total racist. The worst is Little House on the Prairie, where they are invaders illegally squatting on indigenous land (Laura glosses this over as Pa "getting a head start" on the rush), etc. It's really incredibly sad to realize. I still love the books (aspects of them), and think The Long Winter is superb, but oh, man. It was an eye-opening reread for me as an adult, and a sad one.

What's interesting is that there are letters from Rose to her mother (acting as her editor) where she cuts out a lot of the darker stuff Laura was originally including, like rape, murder, theft, etc, because she felt it was too dark.

And I have to say, this show honestly is even darker than McMurtry or even "Godless" (Netflix), which was still pretty fricking dark. Sheesh.

On 11/13/2022 at 11:41 AM, magdalene said:

I was very confused by Thomas Traffords death. I thought it was a narrative mistake not to show his end. Also, they should have had Cornelia and him meet, not to reunite or anything like that but for the story's sake. That felt like a missing link.

The best part was definitely the acting - Emily Blunt and her leading man were wonderful together, such chemistry,  and the gorgeous scenery.

I agree on both counts.

On 11/17/2022 at 11:56 AM, dubbel zout said:

The good: Strong female character(s), interesting story, very well cast, high production values.

The bad: The story is both under- and overwritten. I know it was necessary for plot purposes, but Melmont running around spreading syphilis on two continents was a bit much. I also think that he wasn't in the dormant stage at all—his increasing madness was very much a symptom. Maybe he didn't have the physical signs, but the mental ones were clear to me.

Eli was a bit too enigmatic at times for me, though I thought Chaske Spencer was a riveting screen presence.

I didn't mind the syphilis as a plot, but all the constantly shifting bad-guy groups and loyalties had me confused, since they kept sort of separating, overlapping, and reforming.

On 11/17/2022 at 3:09 PM, magdalene said:

Am I the only one genuinely upset Eli and Cordelia couldn't have a happy ending?

I really think they should have. I think their separating themselves was the wrong decision, and not just for sentimental reasons. They are soulmates. They should stay together. Yes, she faces a terrible future, but all the more reason to live now.

I think what stopped her was the virulence of the syphilis (80%) with maybe 20% her not wanting him to see what she becomes. But before the age of antibiotics (and sometimes even after it), syphilis is a terrible thing and incredibly, cruelly, contagious.

On 11/18/2022 at 8:47 AM, dubbel zout said:

Cornelia having syphilis limited how intimate their relationship could be, and I think that mattered to her a lot. Also, she might have felt she'd get better medical care in England, though that wasn't ever mentioned.

I think this too. And I agree that she would have had better medical care in England. But STILL! Oh, I loved Cornelia and Eli together.

On 11/21/2022 at 4:37 AM, BonnieD said:

Ditto. It is possible to have a relationship without sex. But maybe she didn't want to burden him with her increasing deterioration, or have him see her as she knew she would be toward the end.

I think the kicker is a relationship without TOUCH. Which is what they would have had to do. Syphilis could be spread by sex (any sexual contact at all, so any penetrative sex, as well as oral sex, by kissing (if less frequently), and even (although it was rarer still) by simple touch. It's so sad.

On 12/11/2022 at 6:04 AM, pasdetrois said:

As Melmont waited for the final showdown, he was shown poking the tops of his booted feet with his cane, and then moments later doing a little hop off of the platform instead of walking down the steps. I wonder if these quick images were meant to signal advancing syphilis. Years ago an MD friend spotted a man walking oddly and commented that he appeared to have the "syphilis shuffle."

And yes, what happened to Melmont's pronounced accent, which dominated so many of his earlier scenes?

That's so sad (and fascinating) about the walk. I thought there was a reason they showed that too.

I thought Melmont's accent was just slightly less strong, which made sense to me after 14 years in America.

On 12/14/2022 at 12:15 AM, Hava said:

Can someone tell me if syphillis can be contracted through kissing?

It is relatively low risk, but yes, people can get syphilis and other STDs simply from kissing or even touch. It's so unfair. Poor Cornelia and Eli!

On 12/24/2022 at 6:55 AM, BAForever said:

3. Cornelia couldn't save her son, but she saved Jed (Jeb?) and No Trouble. So happy he remembered her.

I loved that too, and was very moved when White Moon ("No Trouble") gently saw her face and kissed her in the end. Although I was also yelling because he could actually get infected from that. AGHGHG.

On 12/27/2022 at 8:49 PM, Hava said:

I just watched the series for a second time, and I am in a puddle of tears. I rarely (if ever) cry at TV shows. I don't know why this series has affected me so deeply. 

I thoroughly enjoyed it and the core relationship was so beautiful. I wish the story had been more that stuff honestly -- more conversations and moments between Cornelia and Eli than we got. But a strikingly beautiful show.

Edited June 17, 2023 by paramitch
fixed a very important missing word!

[Rebecca berkowit]

On 11/18/2022 at 7:42 AM, Zaffy said:

To be honest I did not get why they didn't leave together..

Um, lots of reasons.  First, she had syphilis.  They could never have had sex.  It would literally kill him.  She wasn’t in a latent phase. (It’s nice to imagine they might’ve had a chaste romance, but not too realistic.  He’s noble, but. It THAT noble.).  Also, she was going to become horribly disfigured and die.  Also, after the bad guy was killed, Eli was a wanted man.  He couldn’t settle on a farm, as long as he was alive, they would have hunted him down and killed him, because a white man was killed, and he would’ve been blamed.  Not fair, it was actually the white woman who killed the guy, but that’s just how it was.  (Also, Eli said he was willing to take the blame for her.  That’s why the other lady and her son left with the sheriff’s people, so the incident wouldn’t be traced to them.)  If Cornelia had gone with Eli, they probably would’ve killed her, too, when they found him, whether in purpose or just because she was in the wrong place at the wrong time.   The sheriff at the end told Eli that he would tell everyone he was already dead so they wouldn’t look for him, but that in order to make that work, Eli would have to basically go into witness protection, go somewhere where nobody knew him and never look back.  He couldn’t go to start a farm back where he was from with other Indians who might have known him.  Etc.  I, too, am a romantic, but there’s no way this story was going to end up with them together. 

Edited July 3, 2023 by Rebecca berkowit

[Rebecca berkowit]

On 12/14/2022 at 3:15 AM, Hava said:

Same here. I was devastated and heartbroken by their ending. I found their romance so beautiful and so magical that it seemed unfair to end it there. 

Despite some flaws pointed out here (like the scenery-chewing of Melmont), the story between Cornelia and Eli was enough to elevate these show to one of my favorite ever. I was thoroughly captivated and enthralled.

Can someone tell me if syphillis can be contracted through kissing?

No.  

[paramitch]

On 7/3/2023 at 10:31 AM, Rebecca berkowit said:

No.  

Not true. Syphilis can be spread by kissing.

Here are some links:

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4998817/

https://www.healthline.com/health/sexually-transmitted-diseases/std-from-kissing#cmv

https://www.verywellhealth.com/std-from-kissing-5271771

https://www.nyc.gov/assets/doh/downloads/pdf/std/std-syphilis.pdf

 

Edited September 18, 2023 by paramitch

[Affogato]

On 9/18/2023 at 3:12 PM, paramitch said:

Not true. Syphilis can be spread by kissing.

Here are some links:

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4998817/

https://www.healthline.com/health/sexually-transmitted-diseases/std-from-kissing#cmv

https://www.verywellhealth.com/std-from-kissing-5271771

https://www.nyc.gov/assets/doh/downloads/pdf/std/std-syphilis.pdf

 

It is spread by contact with an open lesion which can be on the mouth. You probably need a break in your skin as well, but nothing major.