S04.E10 I Wasn't Invited

[gingerella]

Micah bartends at his friend's art show, where things heat up with Antia (as she desperately throws hints that she's definitely DTF, it's like an anthropological documentary on mating habits in LA). Meanwhile, the rest of the family reunites with Barry in Cairo (to celebrate the birthday of rheir long dead baby bro, fun times), but Kim is excluded because Ethan and Olivia do not want to see her (and who can blame them, I mean.we.dont want to see her either so....).

Edited July 20, 2022 by gingerella

[gingerella]

I can't tell of Barry is trying to play both sides to curry favor from Lim with his guilting the kids about excluding her from their farm GTG. This episode and this season is so dark and depressing and really shows just how badly Kim and Barry damaged their older kids. It's njt interesting or fun anymore at all. The older kids are so.emotionally damaged, only Micah seems to have escaped unscathed.

[Gharlane]

Quote

Micah bartends at his friend's art show, where things heat up with Antia. Meanwhile, the rest of the family reunites with Barry in Cairo, but Kim is excluded because Ethan and Olivia do not want to see her.

I am definitely losing interest in this show because I barely paid attention to it this week.

• Micah was serving fruit punch and shots, not bartending.
• I'm wondering if Micah is sexually experimenting? Please don't say "gender fluids" again. 🤢
• Barry continues to annoy me. and continue to not care about he and Kim's marriage. I just realized he reminds me of Beavis and Butthead's hippy teacher. 🤣
• Kim (or was it Barry?) said something that made me laugh. 🙄
• It struck me as rather weird and creepy to celebrate the birthday of the child Kim ran over with her car. 🤷‍♂️
• What farm were they talking about? I thought the house we saw was their farm. 🤔

Edited July 21, 2022 by Gharlane

[toomuchtv]

As terrible as Kim is, I think excluding her from the entire family getting together in remembrance of their dead sibling (and her child) is kind of cruel. It looks like she does get invited in the end and I think it is something Olivia should sit out if being near Kim still makes her so upset and hopefully Kim would respect Ethan’s not being ready to be around her and they could be in the same area without directly talking to each other.

Micah… had a conversation with the artist friend about the dating scene in LA having too many options then went to him talking about being open to all the types of people and sexuality… did I miss that Artist friend was gay? Or I’m just jumping to conclusions from how that was put together. Hopefully Artist friend was ok with that allusion if he didn’t say it outright (maybe I missed it). They said he came from a similar background to Micah

[scorp01]

I agree with everyone that's said this season is kind of boring.  I don't really care about Kim and Barry and their divorce, and this episode had way, way too much of that topic.  If I had to pick sides between the two of them I suppose it would have to be Barry because he comes off as trying a little (on camera at least--it could be just a show), whereas Kim strikes me as being selfish and delusional.  Barry took her for granted all those years, Barry dictated how she should behave, etc etc.  But she's always seemed to be the one in charge, the "neck that turns his head" so it doesn't quite jibe with the words that come out of her mouth.  It feels like Kim is trying to say all these deep, meaningful things to show just how hurt and damaged she is, but it hasn't portrayed her in the way she's hoping. 

One thing Kim said that really stood out to me was that Ethan was upset at her because he was homeschooled.  Like, what??  She truly believes that Ethan wants nothing to do with her over homeschooling?  See?  Delusional.

I usually like seeing Micah and his friends' segments but the art show was kind of lame and I fast forwarded through the part with the flirty girl.

Thankfully there was zero Lydia in this episode, so there's that.

[Gharlane]

6 minutes ago, scorp01 said:

Thankfully there was zero Lydia in this episode, so there's that.

I got the feeling someone locked Lydia in her prayer closet.

[Back Atcha]

8 hours ago, Gharlane said:

I am definitely losing interest in this show because I barely paid attention to it this week.

• Micah was serving fruit punch and shots, not bartending.

The "art show" was just as professional as Micha's bartending.

8 hours ago, Gharlane said:

What farm were they talking about? I thought the house we saw was their farm. *thinking*

The house we saw on the first seasons was their farm ... they had horses, chickens, animals.  Then they moved to the city ... that's the house we see on current seasons.

[Shelbie]

Kim’s journey to being single again has zero interest for me. She wants to deflect any blame onto Barry as if she wasn’t there trying her hardest to control everything around her.  She is desperate to be seen as deep and thoughtful while still trying to deny she was ever in the wrong.
Barry is absolutely complicit in how the children were raised but I think he has less interest in playing to the camera and gets a gentler edit.

[luvmylabs]

Ethan is a big child.  What does he do?  Plays with motorized planes and works on cars and motorcycles.  Olivia, who actually has a job, should dump him.  Sorry...can't keep Kim away from her baby's grave.  I can't imagine the guilt and grief she carries around with her about that tragedy.  She has a right to be there.  Go home Olivia and Ethan.

[Back Atcha]

9 hours ago, luvmylabs said:

Ethan is a big child.  What does he do?  Plays with motorized planes and works on cars and motorcycles. 

Ethan is depressed and REPRESSED.  I feel very sorry for him...and, therefore, Olivia.  Kim should be ashamed of herself.

[Mr. Miner]

I'm so impressed that Moriah can wear a headband as a tube top.

I loved that apartment above the dance studio.

[Gharlane]

2 hours ago, Mr. Miner said:

I loved that apartment above the dance studio.

I had to declare "shenanigans!" about that apartment above the studio Kim claimed they'd be renting out. I think that was for her, not for renters, who would be hearing activity in the studio all day and would presumably have to walk thru it to enter and leave.

[gingerella]

2 hours ago, Gharlane said:

I had to declare "shenanigans!" about that apartment above the studio Kim claimed they'd be renting out. I think that was for her, not for renters, who would be hearing activity in the studio all day and would presumably have to walk thru it to enter and leave.

I thought the same thing when I saw that. Also, Kim, if you think Barry is so horrible then stop asking him to do your moving for you! Hire some fucking strangers to do it. Oh wait, then you'd have to pay them from your own pocket using Barry's money. Sorry, I forgot about that. As much as I still loathe Creepster Barry, Kim is just awful. No accountability for ANYthing. It's everyone else's fault that she's lonely and feeling unloved. BooEffingHoo. She made her bed but now she doesn't want lie in it. And I can't believe I'm saying this but Lydia is right. Kim made Lydia into the image she wanted her to be and now she's decided she wants the party life again so to hell with her religious doctrine, or whatever it is that guided her in isolating her children to the point that they're stunted in every way. Lydia is the personification of what Kim wanted all her children to be, and now she sees she created a monster. What I want to know isn't the sordid little details about Kim and Barry, I have zero fucks to give about that or them, what I want to know is what Kim and Barry each think about the supposed religious doctrine and teachings they used to prop up their weird lifestyle and isolate their children. That's what I want to know about. No more Kim opining whilst chewing whatever it is she seems to always be chewing in her 'dance' studio. I want real answers. Then again, this is The Lying Channel so we wont get real content.

[charmed1]

I think the TLC producers purposely ask very leading questions of Micah to push the fish out of water, Beverly Hillbilly narrative. Maybe to get him to admit to some experimentation.  Maybe to get him to say something that could be perceived as homophobic. Either way, I’m glad he didn’t give them the satisfaction. They purposely played Micah’s answer right after Michael jokingly said they went on a date together. I also think they along with Kim are the ones pushing Barry to get Ethan to talk to Kim on camera.

I think Kim has a boyfriend. She seems almost disgusted by Barry. Every time she  has these “talks” with him, it’s always, “remember how you’ve always been a total dick to me and I’ve been an innocent suffering wife?” And Barry’s always like, “Yes, you are correct ma’am. I am trash.” In all the footage I’ve seen of Barry, he’s been completely deferential to Kim. I keep wanting to see this controlling, uncaring beast she makes him out to be. 

ETA: autocorrect keeps changing Ethan to Ethanol 😂.

[Gharlane]

1 hour ago, charmed1 said:

I think the TLC producers purposely ask very leading questions of Micah to push the fish out of water, Beverly Hillbilly narrative. Maybe to get him to admit to some experimentation.  Maybe to get him to say something that could be perceived as homophobic. Either way, I’m glad he didn’t give them the satisfaction. They purposely played Micah’s answer right after Michael jokingly said they went on a date together. I also think they along with Kim are the ones pushing Barry to get Ethan to talk to Kim on camera.

I've noticed that as well! Something else I can no longer stop seeing is Micah's eyebrow acting.

[Mr. Miner]

So, Kim does not want custody of the younger kids?

[Salacious Kitty]

4 minutes ago, Mr. Miner said:

So, Kim does not want custody of the younger kids?

Sure doesn't look like it.

[Calibabydolly]

I cannot be the only one to notice Barry's red lip in his chat with Kim @ the studio! Was that a cold sore or was he biting his (non existent) lip so hard he broke the skin and made it bleed!? Personally, I would have postponed the interview until that lip healed. I actually felt sorry for him there!

I have to agree with the above poster that Kim must have a boyfriend. I got the vibe when she was talking with Lydia that she was ashamed of something. Moriah is overboard (revolted) with Kim's upbringing and Lydia has taken it completely the opposite way and became a robot or Stepford wife! Kim now sees what she has created.

Speaking of Mariah, I think TLC has told her to wear the most skimpy outfits because that's probably the only thing drawing viewers now! The bikini on the beach with her brother was bad enough but those shorts (underwear!) she wore to the family home was gross! So her younger siblings could see her butt cheeks along with her dad!? 

[bichonblitz]

3 hours ago, Calibabydolly said:

I cannot be the only one to notice Barry's red lip in his chat with Kim @ the studio! Was that a cold sore or was he biting his (non existent) lip so hard he broke the skin and made it bleed!?

I don't know but Barry is a very unfortunate looking man. Kim the frump with the downturned lips is no great beauty, either. How they managed to birth such good looking kids is a mystery. Genetics are a funny thing. 

[Back Atcha]

6 hours ago, bichonblitz said:

Kim the frump with the downturned lips is no great beauty, either.

But she loves those lips SO MUCH that she makes sure her lipstick extends above the top lip, below the bottom ... and just a little extra at each corner.  Always has, always will (I guess).

[Back Atcha]

12 hours ago, charmed1 said:

I think Kim has a boyfriend. She seems almost disgusted by Barry.

I don't know if Kim has a boyfriend per se...but she has her eye on some poor schnuck.  Now that she's so slim, beautiful, alone, and "yearning," all the brave men in town will be hopping up those stairs to give her a little sympathy.  Poor Barry.  He doesn't know it yet, but Kim's leaving is the best thing that will happen to him and their kids.

[Back Atcha]

15 hours ago, Gharlane said:

18 hours ago, Mr. Miner said:

I loved that apartment above the dance studio.

I had to declare "shenanigans!" about that apartment above the studio Kim claimed they'd be renting out. I think that was for her, not for renters,

Yep!  Shenanigans, all right.  She'll keep using "their" money and family members' brawn to help furnish "the rental," to match the bed she's in love with.  Then she'll suddenly determine that it's less expensive to live above her "studio," than to rent elsewhere.  She's a genius!  Wonder what the townsfolk think about this stuff...these shenanigans. 

I bet there will be A LOT of financial discovery for any property settlement before there can be a divorce.  It will be a slow process. Will she expect to receive HALF of their money and property...leaving Barry with the children?  Get thee to a bastard attorney, Barry!

[applewood]

On 7/20/2022 at 12:48 PM, scorp01 said:

I agree with everyone that's said this season is kind of boring.  I don't really care about Kim and Barry and their divorce, and this episode had way, way too much of that topic.  If I had to pick sides between the two of them I suppose it would have to be Barry because he comes off as trying a little (on camera at least--it could be just a show), whereas Kim strikes me as being selfish and delusional.  Barry took her for granted all those years, Barry dictated how she should behave, etc etc.  But she's always seemed to be the one in charge, the "neck that turns his head" so it doesn't quite jibe with the words that come out of her mouth.  It feels like Kim is trying to say all these deep, meaningful things to show just how hurt and damaged she is, but it hasn't portrayed her in the way she's hoping. 

One thing Kim said that really stood out to me was that Ethan was upset at her because he was homeschooled.  Like, what??  She truly believes that Ethan wants nothing to do with her over homeschooling?  See?  Delusional.

I usually like seeing Micah and his friends' segments but the art show was kind of lame and I fast forwarded through the part with the flirty girl.

Thankfully there was zero Lydia in this episode, so there's that.

I was shocked that she said that. Ethan wants nothing to do with her because Kim almost destroyed their marriage among other things.

I don't know if Kim has a boyfriend but she seemed a little too friendly with that realtor guy.

[Back Atcha]

On 7/22/2022 at 9:13 AM, applewood said:

I don't know if Kim has a boyfriend but she seemed a little too friendly with that realtor guy.

Just a bit desperate.

[BAForever]

Team Olivia from the start. She's made some really bad decisions in her relationships with in-laws, however, Kim and, to a lesser extent,  Barry were the adults in the situation and should have done better. That being said, not sure what is going to happen at the gravesite (from previews), but Olivia  never met or knew the child (Jacob?), and even though I detest Kim, if the choice is between Kim or Olivia at the grave site,  back away Olivia. 

[Salacious Kitty]

The previews seem to indicate that's what may happen when they actually go to the gravesite. But previews can also be misleading. I do hope Olivia backed off. 

[lightninggirl]

Kim: I honestly don't know why Olivia has a problem with me.

Uh, maybe that you were pretty much ready to schedule Olivia's exorcism? I think that telling someone they had a demon inside of them might be a hot tip there, Kimmy.

Seriously, when I heard that, I nearly choked on my drink. Unreal.

[Katie111]

I think Antifa and Micah make an odd couple.  She’s cute and seems fun but her voice sounds like a man.  
 

How does Micah afford to fly across country twice a month but he has nowhere to live?  How long can he couch surf for?  

[Notabug]

3 minutes ago, Katie111 said:

I think Antifa and Micah make an odd couple.  She’s cute and seems fun but her voice sounds like a man.  
 

How does Micah afford to fly across country twice a month but he has nowhere to live?  How long can he couch surf for?  

I imagine production pays to fly him back and forth to appear in episodes where they feel his presence back in Cairo or Tampa makes for a better storyline.

I understand why Olivia doesn't want to be around Kim at all, but it seemed like Olivia was trying to make the day about her and her feud with Kim which distracted from their real purpose.  Either go to the cemetery and ignore Kim or don't go at all.  It's been something like 4 years now, if she's going to remain married to Ethan and be a part of his family, she needs a strategy that doesn't involve drama and making people choose sides.  Micah and Moriah were right in that it is unfair for Olivia to constantly want them to choose her over their mother.

I was glad to see Ethan calling Kim out on the lack of 'school' in her homeschooling.  It sounds like she took the path of least resistance and, since Ethan didn't love to read, she let him work on cars instead.  She claimed that she was allowing him to follow his passions but he rightly called her out and reminded her he was just a little kid and he needed her guidance and he now regrets that she didn't push him at all academically.  Seems like she has always ignored the kids' education in favor of taking the lazy way out.

[Katie111]

Are the “little girls” all homeschooled?  If so, by who?  The crazy religious sister who works full time?   Clearly Kim isn’t doing it.  She should learn from her mistakes and get the remaining kids in school if they’re not already. 
 

I think Eathan blames Kim for him marrying Olivia.  I think he loves Olivia but realizes he settled too young.  Also blames her as he has no real education and he will probably only be employable as a mechanic or a reality TV star. 

[magemaud]

2 hours ago, Katie111 said:

Are the “little girls” all homeschooled?

And are they all a package deal, always lumped together? I notice they’re rarely referred to individually by name.

[pnina]

Find this show so very hard to watch.  For the most part they all have a very flat affect, mumble their words, and never really seem to say anything meaningful. They all just seem to talk around the issues.   

[Notabug]

11 hours ago, Katie111 said:

Are the “little girls” all homeschooled?  If so, by who?  The crazy religious sister who works full time?   Clearly Kim isn’t doing it.  She should learn from her mistakes and get the remaining kids in school if they’re not already. 
 

I think Eathan blames Kim for him marrying Olivia.  I think he loves Olivia but realizes he settled too young.  Also blames her as he has no real education and he will probably only be employable as a mechanic or a reality TV star. 

The younger ones were still being homeschooled a couple episodes ago when Kim wasn't living in the house and we learned that Lydia helped them with their lessons during breaks at work.

I don't think Kim ever really 'homeschooled' her kids in that she seemingly didn't care if they ever learned anything or not.  From what Ethan said last night, he was allowed to do whatever he wanted and had no set curriculum or guidelines.  That being the case, Kim and Barry never did work very hard at educating their kids.  Many states have very loose guidelines for homeschooling and I expect Georgia is one of them.  Then again, there are kids graduating from regular high school who don't know how to read and write properly, so its not just homeschooled kids who can lack proper education.

Edited July 27, 2022 by Notabug

[BAForever]

10 hours ago, magemaud said:

And are they all a package deal, always lumped together? I notice they’re rarely referred to individually by name.

Reminds me of the "lost" Duggar boys. Could never tell them apart. 

[magemaud]

2 hours ago, Notabug said:

The younger ones were still being homeschooled a couple episodes ago when Kim wasn't living in the house and we learned that Lydia helped them with their lessons during breaks at work.

That made me wonder just who was supposedly teaching the lessons she was helping them with. I'm not familiar enough with the show to know if Barry works from home. If not, are they old enough to be left alone all day? My guess is they watch some kind of Christian based online school with strict parental controls.

11 minutes ago, BAForever said:

Reminds me of the "lost" Duggar boys. Could never tell them apart. 

You don't need to, they're all interchangeable. Just call them a name that begins with "J" and they'll all respond in unison. 

[Ms.Lulu]

All of the adults in the family seem reluctant to show emotion.  And it appears to have damaged all of the kids.

Edited July 27, 2022 by Ms.Lulu

[Madding crowd]

I think they learned to show no emotion because they were harshly punished for ever talking about their feelings, wanting to have friends, wanting to do normal things. I actually think the kids all seem like very kind people who will be fine with some therapy and life experience. I’m excluding Lydia from that because she seems like a religious zealot to a big extent. Olivia and Ethan are currently in Scotland. Wish I had money to travel the world but good for them.

[gingerella]

Wrong episode, oops!

Edited July 28, 2022 by gingerella

[Gharlane]

While watching a rerun of this ep, I realized that Kim is performing her "talking head"/confessional/testimonial in that bedroom above her dance studio we saw at the beginning. I wonder if she decided to stay there after the divorce?  🤔

[magemaud]

I don't play close attention, but what happened with Lydia's "special friend" that she got in trouble for communicating with? 

These kids remind me so much of the Duggars, they have to choose one person to "court", date them chastely, then they are expected to marry them and only them. Moriah and Max didn't work out so she feels that was her only chance EVER for a relationship, it was Max or no one. 

[Salacious Kitty]

@gingerella, I am pretty sure Hosanna married and moved away before Ethan was married. Also with the horrible courtship rules that Ethan followed. 

I hope Moriah figures it out like Micah seems to have. 

@magemaud, there hasn't been any mention of Lydia's guy this season. Who knows what's going on there, but production decided to focus on Kim/Barry and Ethan/Micah/Moriah this season.

[Back Atcha]

30 minutes ago, gingerella said:

Olivia needs to get the fuck over that shit and just be able to stand next to her husband, hold his hand, and just BE there.

Olivia isn't there yet.  Her descriptions of some of the things she was feeling sounds like panic/anxiety attacks.  She can't expect to be there for someone else during those particular times.

31 minutes ago, gingerella said:

But if you really still get that triggered by Kim then you need serious work with your therapist.

If she can't determine this on her own (see my first comment), then someone needs to lead her.  The therapist can't help things that aren't even remotely considered/discussed by the patient.

[Back Atcha]

4 minutes ago, Salacious Kitty said:

@magemaud, there hasn't been any mention of Lydia's guy this season. Who knows what's going on there, but production decided to focus on Kim/Barry and Ethan/Micah/Moriah this season.

It would be interesting if Production researched the guy and NO WAY was he going to be on the show...or ever mentioned again.  "Enquiring Minds Want to Know."

[Back Atcha]

38 minutes ago, gingerella said:

This poor schmuck was Kim's first 'experiment' with her whackadoodle 'parenting philosophy' and he probably bears the biggest scars as a result.

Would it be "first failed experiment"?  As for Hosannah (what a name!), we don't know if she came out of everything luckily unscathed.  Yet.

39 minutes ago, gingerella said:

And I may have missed it, but I did not see one time where she took much responsibility other than saying 'I could have done better'.

Kim also took after-the-fact credit for observing what her children's interests and strengths were and directing their education along their various paths.  BS!!  She said SHE's the one who noticed that Ethan was interested in old cars.  I doubt that.  The kid probably started tinkering with (and repairing) stuff that was around the farm.  Old cars came along when he had access and experience (probably) with smaller motors.  Kim will find a way to slither out of every area of responsibility and blame that comes her way--and Barry will receive the brunt of it.  I'm glad we didn't have to watch a "happily ever after" finish with Ethan and Kim.

P.S.  The mother-son conversation outside the pool hall.  Did anyone notice that Kim's shoes are two sizes too small?  Weird. Wonder if someone in production loaned her a pair for filming. 

[magemaud]

Thanks, @Salacious Kitty and @Back Atcha, I was wondering if I missed anything with Lydia's "friend." I thought he was supposed to come for a visit and meet them personally, but I guess that never happened. 

I'd be surprised if Production vetted anyone at all for this show but maybe they learned a lesson from other TLC franchises (looking at YOU, Sharp/90 DF) not to feature people who turn out to have skeletons in their closets like police records. 

[magemaud]

13 minutes ago, Back Atcha said:

As for Hosannah (what a name!), we don't know if she came out of everything luckily unscathed.  Yet.

and the way they pronounce it, "Hose-AN-na" instead of AH-na. She must have gotten away from Kim's influence early enough to forge a relatively normal life. Has she EVER been on the show? Besides an occasional mention, I could totally forget about "the one that [mercifully] got away."

I answered my own question. She has appeared in small "cameos" like at Ethan and Olivia's wedding: https://www.realitytitbit.com/tlc/the-oldest-plath-daughter-is-now-22-years-old-and-happily-married

Edited July 27, 2022 by magemaud

[Salacious Kitty]

Hosanna and her husband (whose name I've forgotten) have a music ministry. He's a very talented pianist, and they both sing. Her voice is MUCH better than Moriah's. She has at least one kid, possibly two by now. She lives in Ohio, and I have seen pictures of Kim visiting. 

[Notabug]

16 minutes ago, Salacious Kitty said:

Hosanna and her husband (whose name I've forgotten) have a music ministry. He's a very talented pianist, and they both sing. Her voice is MUCH better than Moriah's. She has at least one kid, possibly two by now. She lives in Ohio, and I have seen pictures of Kim visiting. 

Hosanna and her husband are definitely conservative Christians and, interestingly, both are professional musicians who tour doing Gospel music.  However, it appears, at the very least, that they are not interested in reality TV stardom as they've only rarely appeared in the background  at family events on the show.

As noted above, her husband is a really gifted pianist and she plays the violin and sings to accompany him.  Their website makes no mention at all to their connection to the Plath family.

https://www.timothynobleplayspiano.com/

[Salacious Kitty]

NOBLE! That's it! Thanks for jogging my brain. 😀

[Notabug]

1 hour ago, Back Atcha said:

Would it be "first failed experiment"?  As for Hosannah (what a name!), we don't know if she came out of everything luckily unscathed.  Yet.

Kim also took after-the-fact credit for observing what her children's interests and strengths were and directing their education along their various paths.  BS!!  She said SHE's the one who noticed that Ethan was interested in old cars.  I doubt that.  The kid probably started tinkering with (and repairing) stuff that was around the farm.  Old cars came along when he had access and experience (probably) with smaller motors.  Kim will find a way to slither out of every area of responsibility and blame that comes her way--and Barry will receive the brunt of it.  I'm glad we didn't have to watch a "happily ever after" finish with Ethan and Kim.

P.S.  The mother-son conversation outside the pool hall.  Did anyone notice that Kim's shoes are two sizes too small?  Weird. Wonder if someone in production loaned her a pair for filming. 

Even if Kim had noticed that Ethan had an interest and aptitude for repairing old cars; she still had a responsibility to arm him with basic life tools to help him achieve his goals.  If he liked engines, then get him reading books about them, have him learn math by calculating horsepower, have him write essays describing various repairs or the history of a car he liked.  There were ways to incorporate his interests into the curriculum to help him become well rounded.  As it is, he knows how to fix cars.  He seemingly doesn't feel he has the reading or writing or math skills to actually start his own business fixing cars. Kim was too lazy to bother helping him find ways turn his interest into a career.

Same thing with Moriah, really.  She seemingly doesn't know what she doesn't know about writing music and singing.  Taking a couple of classes in voice and composition at the local community college might've helped her either improve enough to actually develop a career in that area or helped her come to the realization that she just is not good enough for a professional career in music.

If you listen to them play, you'll notice that Timothy Noble, Hosanna's husband, has clearly had professional training and is a far better musician than her, although she is not bad.  I doubt Hosanna would've had the ability to earn a living in music had she not married someone who was a trained professional.