S07.E11: Adventures in Babysitting

[Demented Daisy]

While still dealing with their grief over Bobby's death, Dean turns to Frank Devereaux to help decipher Bobby's numbers, while Sam helps the daughter of a hunter look for her father.

 

 

Not a favorite, but Dean was pretty adorable being a geek with Chrissy.  ;-)

[catrox14]

Dean is just so great with kids and I think that is largely due to Jensen respecting them as little actors. He doesn't ever come across as patronizing with them at all. It's wonderful.

[AwesomO4000]

Not a favorite, but a passable episode for me here and one I watch whenever I rewatch season 7.

 

I like that they allowed Sam and Dean to grieve for a bit, and I like that Sam finally felt that he needed to investigate the case while Dean was wrapped up in searching for Dick Roman. That was consistent for them during this season.

 

I'm not sure I like Sam so easily getting caught, but I did like that he saved Krissy's father. And I generally do enjoy Dean interacting with kids, so that was good also. I also liked that Sam continued to be honest with Dean - as seen by the last scene - with no more stupid "I'm fines." That was also a nice consistency for this season.

[DittyDotDot]

I like so much about this episode. I like that they allowed Sam and Dean to grieve for Bobby and I like how they organically split them up. See show, they don't always have to have a big ole dumb fight, sometimes they can just have different ideas on what their focus should be and go in opposite directions but still be supportive and not total asshats to one another. Sorry, I seem to have a propensity for meandering this morning, let's see if I can get it back on track again...

 

Anyway, as I've said before, I adored Frank and his crazy and I loved his speech to Dean. I didn't really understand the need for that whole thing with the telephone repair truck and all...seemed like a total waste of screen time and filler, but after six years with this show, I'm really good at pretending certain things don't happen anyway. I liked Krissy (or is it Chrissy?) in this episode. She reminded me a lot of S2 Jo and what I liked best about Jo is that she knew of the supernatural, but didn't really know what the job entailed. There was a certain amount of innocence mixed with knowledge that I find interesting. And even though Sam got captured, I didn't feel like he was a total numskull in the way that he did get captured. I also thought it was interesting that if it weren't for Krissy (or Chrissy), Dean would've probably been captured in a similar fashion. It was a nice touch, kinda nodding at how both Sam and Dean were distracted with other issues and needed someone else to point out what was right in front of their faces (I thought that's what they were going for anyway). I also wish they had kept the deleted scene (easily would have taken it in lieu of the telephone truck nonsense) where they find Sam's hotel room and Krissy (or Chrissy) comments on how Sam and Dean have a secret language.

 

Anyway, I'm looking forward to this episode on re-watch, but I'm also admittedly rather strange. ;)

[catrox14]

Random thoughts after rewatching this last night.

 

I sort of missed a lot  before because I watch the reruns whilst I'm usually doing something else and it just is sort of there in the background.  But I sat down and really focused on it this time and I got so much more by watching Dean. It was some really fantastic subtle work by Jensen to convey Dean's grief and slow implosion and how it was affecting his ability to do his job.

 

Dear gods, the look on Dean's face when Krissy tells him Sam hasn't contacted her :(:(. I swear you could see the life drain out of Dean and panic set in and you could see him thinking "No, not Sammy. I can't take anymore".  as if Dean was already thinking it's time to off himself.  IMO that is what Jensen conveyed in a 5 second reaction.

 

I'm guilty of forgetting about Frank until he shows up and I think "Oh, yeah, I kind of like Frank.". And I especially appreciated him in this episode. I really liked the choice to have Frank give Dean the speech about holding it together by being a professional until the end of the week. To smile through it.

 

I don't think that speech  would have landed coming from Sam because Sam is too close to Dean and he's grieving too and it's his little brother and sometimes older siblings will reject any advice because "little sibling, you don't know what you are talking about thing" even if younger sibling does. It's not a condemnation of Dean as a bad older brother at all, it's just sometimes how those sibling relationships go.

 

Since it came from another professional, nuts as he was, who had no personal interest in Dean or baggage and whatnot, nor really cared about Dean other than as a hunter, it spoke to Dean's pride in his professionalism and competence as a hunter. You can strip everything away from Dean (except maybe Sammy) and he'll likely survive. But if Dean thinks his own competence and professionalism as a hunter are being compromised? Hell yeah, he'll take that in.  And I love the closing scene with Dean trying to fake smile like Frank told him.  That was some masterful work by Jensen, because the smile never got to his eyes. 

 

Fun Fact:  

The dark haired female monster was played by the same actress that was in the Dark Angel episode "The Beresford Agenda" with Jensen, as his love interest. And YES, if you love his work as Dean, you really MUST find that episode and watch it because HOLY SHIT, Jensen was amazing and he was all of 22. And no, IMO, you don't need to watch any other episode of Dark Angel IMO to appreciate Jensen's work in the episode.  And yes that was him playing the piano.)

[mertensia]

While the "Dean freezes and Krissy has to save the day" bit was just awful I like the rest of the episode. I like Krissy. I like that Dean wanted her out of the way because there might be things her dad doesn't want her to see. I like the Dean/Krissy interactions in general. I like that Krissy and her dad stay in nicer hotels- showing that not all hunters stay in fleabags. I like that the monster was something different.

[DittyDotDot]

Interesting about the hotel, @mertensia, I had assumed that was Krissy and her dad's apartment. Meaning, they didn't move around that much and he didn't drag her with him. She said he'd been gone for weeks, so I assumed she stayed there and went to school while her dad would take off on hunting trips from time to time and they only moved when things got too hard to explain to people. No you've got me thinking a bit differently about it...Hmmm.

[rue721]

Anyway, as I've said before, I adored Frank and his crazy and I loved his speech to Dean.

 

I really liked the choice to have Frank give Dean the speech about holding it together by being a professional until the end of the week. To smile through it.

 

[...]

 

Since it came from another professional, nuts as he was, who had no personal interest in Dean or baggage and whatnot, nor really cared about Dean other than as a hunter, it spoke to Dean's pride in his professionalism and competence as a hunter. You can strip everything away from Dean (except maybe Sammy) and he'll likely survive. But if Dean thinks his own competence and professionalism as a hunter are being compromised? Hell yeah, he'll take that in.  And I love the closing scene with Dean trying to fake smile like Frank told him.  That was some masterful work by Jensen, because the smile never got to his eyes. 

 

Did you guys think that was a legitimately good speech, like Frank was giving Dean advice that it was actually a good idea for him to follow? My reaction was that Frank, who was horribly isolated and messed up, was giving Dean a primer on how to make himself horribly isolated and messed up, too. In just few easy steps!

 

I liked Krissy a lot, somehow it did seem plausible both that she could save the day against some monsters, AND that she still had the chance to be a regular person and maybe go to college, etc. I also liked that Dean threw down Sam's college's ~brand name~ with her:  "he was at STANFORD." That was so braggy, it was really endearing imo. I also liked Dean yelling at Krissy's dad at the end, it could easily have come out hypocritical but he really sold it in a way that made sense, by saying Krissy's dad was setting her up for a short, unhappy life -- and that also seemed to me like a nice bookend for the opening scenes about the guys mourning Bobby.

 

Though my least favorite scenes in the episode were the first scenes of the guys mourning, though. Sitting around staring into space for a week? It just seemed cheesy. But YMMV.

Edited December 4, 2014 by rue721

[catrox14]

 

Did you guys think that was a legitimately good speech, like Frank was giving Dean advice that it was actually a good idea for him to follow? My reaction was that Frank, who was horribly isolated and messed up, was giving Dean a primer on how to make himself horribly isolated and messed up, too. In just few easy steps!

 

Was it "good" advice that was going to help Dean recover from years of trauma? No. But Frank is not his therapist. Was it a "good" advice to get Dean's head back in the hunting game so that Dean doesn't get killed or get someone else killed? 100% Yes.  IMO it was the kind of advice that someone like Dean would respond to.

 

IMO right now, Dean doesn't have the werewithall nor time after the loss of Cas, Bobby, Sam's mental state, the Leviathan threat, etc etc. to actually dig into the psychology of his trauma. It's a coping mechanism until such time that he is willing face whatever he needs to face. Who knows maybe Dean will never be able to do that. But this is what he needs right now to survive and ensure others don't die because of him.

[rue721]

Was it "good" advice that was going to help Dean recover from years of trauma? No. But Frank is not his therapist. Was it a "good" advice to get Dean's head back in the hunting game so that Dean doesn't get killed or get someone else killed? 100% Yes.  IMO it was the kind of advice that someone like Dean would respond to.

 

IMO right now, Dean doesn't have the werewithall nor time after the loss of Cas, Bobby, Sam's mental state, the Leviathan threat, etc etc. to actually dig into the psychology of his trauma. It's a coping mechanism until such time that he is willing face whatever he needs to face. Who knows maybe Dean will never be able to do that. But this is what he needs right now to survive and ensure others don't die because of him.

 

Oh no, I don't even understand how therapy would work in the context of the Constant!Apocalypse that is the Winchesters' lives! Now I'm getting visions of a therapist talking about "radical acceptance [of demons]" or something LOL. Plus, dunno how health care works in their world, but it seemed like Sam couldn't even

get a damn Ambien to deal with his nearly fatal insomnia, so I'm not too hopeful toward it altogether tbh :P

 

Frank's advice sounded like a recipe for disaster to me because: 

 

1. Frank's life was horrible! He's got to be about the worst person from whom to take advice about life choices, because who would want their life to turn out like his? In that context, it would probably make more sense to do the exact opposite of whatever he were to suggest.

 

2. What has Dean been doing THIS WHOLE TIME if it hasn't been to keep his game face on and do his job? I thought his desire to do that from the word go was why the "daddy's little blunt instrument" insult from back in the day even had any teeth. The problem now seemed to me to be not that he wouldn't still *want* to do that (I thought that his desire to do that was why he was All About Dick in the beginning of this episode, that he was trying to bury himself in that one mission to distract/numb himself enough to keep going), but that it was increasingly difficult for him to keep that up and he didn't know where to turn for relief or help. He'd said straight out that he'd be Sam's rock, so he wasn't going to turn to him, he was going to try and be "strong" for him (which was why he was kind of hard on him even imo, he was overcompensating). With Cas and Bobby gone, there wasn't anyone else for him to turn to. When Frank said to just put on a smile and keep going, I thought that was him basically telling Dean that he didn't want to hear it, either. But Dean treated it not like a brush-off, but like actual advice, and literally tried to put a smile on his face on Frank's say-so, so Idk.

 

3. Personally, I'm also just straight up biased against the advice for him to metaphorically wall off his soul and to put a smile on his face. Imo, you probably don't want to be that alienated/disconnected from yourself when you're constantly in mortal danger, just out of practicality. Soulless Sam even framed Dean's spirit as a big asset specifically for hunting, when he was trying to convince Dean to partner back up. And Frank's advice is so sad, too. If Dean felt alone and spent before, that was NOT going to help. Wouldn't Dean know that, isn't that how he'd been trying to get by for a long time? I guess I don't even think it's practical, I think it's misguided even in that sense. But ymmv of course.

[catrox14]

I don't think it was a brush-off by Frank. I think, right or wrong,Frank believed that was the best way to cope after he lost all that, which didn't sound nearly as bad was what Dean lost over the years.

 

Dean has been slowly falling apart and barely keeping it together up to Bobby's death which sent him over the edge.   I think Frank 'cared' enough to  give Dean any advice at all. It was all predicated on Frank seeing that Dean was becoming a danger to himself and others because he was so detached.  Dean went from sadness and grief to almost apathy about his own existence. If  he dies in the course of his life's work, meh. He doesn't care. But that lack of caring was leading to Dean being  off his game.

 

So for me, Frank could relate to Dean's depression and offered Dean what helped him to muddle through because he saw where Dean was headed. And Dean needed to find his professionalism again.

 

And I think that is what Dean needed in his own screwed up head, for now.

[DittyDotDot]

I still really like this one on re-watch and stand by my comments above. Something I noticed this time--the moment Dean finds that flask of Bobby's. Interesting the things one notices and all.

 

Did you guys think that was a legitimately good speech, like Frank was giving Dean advice that it was actually a good idea for him to follow? My reaction was that Frank, who was horribly isolated and messed up, was giving Dean a primer on how to make himself horribly isolated and messed up, too. In just few easy steps!

 

Actual good advice? I guess it all depends on how you look at it. It would definitely be healthier for Dean talk about his grief and trust issues, but that's not exactly the patented Dean Winchester way, now is it? Dean can either choose to hang it up or keep moving, he said he's not hanging it up so Frank gave him a way to keep going and hopefully not be dead in the process.

 

 

Though my least favorite scenes in the episode were the first scenes of the guys mourning, though. Sitting around staring into space for a week? It just seemed cheesy. But YMMV.

 

I didn't get the impression they had been sitting there for a whole week. I guess I assumed they took some time to burn Bobby's corpse and travel back across the country--I know they usually do this in lickity-split time, but it'd take a few days to travel from Jersey to Montana. I thought they'd just returned to the cabin and were still in a sort of shock and didn't know what their next move should be. I kinda liked how they showed they didn't seem to know what to do, but each found their own way to get moving.

[rue721]

I didn't get the impression they had been sitting there for a whole week. I guess I assumed they took some time to burn Bobby's corpse and travel back across the country--I know they usually do this in lickity-split time, but it'd take a few days to travel from Jersey to Montana. I thought they'd just returned to the cabin and were still in a sort of shock and didn't know what their next move should be. I kinda liked how they showed they didn't seem to know what to do, but each found their own way to get moving.

 

IIrc, they had a title card that said something like, "Week One," and the show did that time-lapse editing thing while showing the guys sitting there grieving -- so I think we were meant to understand that it was at least a few days passing, and they weren't just sitting there as part of a short makeshift wake or something. I guess the show was trying to convey how much Bobby had meant to the guys, that they were just going to sit around in shock for days after his death. YMMV, in theory I'm fine with what the show was going for, but watching it, it came off as too melodramatic for me. I was rolling my eyes instead of feeling empathy for them or sad for Bobby.

 

Maybe it would have worked better (for me, anyway) if the show hadn't just opened the episode that way, if it had built up to that scene a little. Maybe if the show had shown them in shock *while* trying to take care of Bobby's body and *while* on the road, rather than while just sitting around. It's not like life stops because something bad happens to you.

 

But maybe it also felt OTT to me because I binge-watched these episodes, and it would have come off differently with a hiatus in between this and Death's Door.

 

Actual good advice? I guess it all depends on how you look at it. It would definitely be healthier for Dean talk about his grief and trust issues, but that's not exactly the patented Dean Winchester way, now is it? Dean can either choose to hang it up or keep moving, he said he's not hanging it up so Frank gave him a way to keep going and hopefully not be dead in the process.

 

I don't think Dean needed to talk about anything or it would necessarily be healthier for him to talk about anything, because what was he going to say?

 

But Frank was basically telling him to divorce himself from his instincts, which seems really dangerous. Aren't those instincts part of what was keeping him alive? And then he *did* run into trouble later, which I thought proved that going through the motions wasn't going to be enough, given his "job," and Frank's advice wasn't going to work. But then Dean tried following that advice afterward when he was in the car trying to smile to himself, so who knows what it was meant to signify that Dean did a relatively poor job on his actual work through the episode.

 

Plus, it just surprised me to see Dean take that advice, because hasn't he been around that block before? What has he been trying to do his whole life if not being cheerful and keeping his feelings on lockdown? He's not ten years old or extremely sheltered, how new to compartmentalization could he possibly be? Lol, I thought that the lesson to be learned from Frank's advice was "don't bother Frank with that shit, he doesn't want to hear it and doesn't know anything about it anyway." So what surprised me wasn't what Frank said, it was that Dean listened.

 

Also, Idk how it fit in with Krissy's story. I guess in that even when her father was kidnapped, she kept her head in the game? She didn't lose hope? And then at the end, Dean made a point of telling her father that there was still hope for her, too (which he equated with her not hunting anymore and maybe going to college, which is reasonable but kind of depressing based on it being basically the opposite of his life choices). But I guess he figured there was no real hope left for him, so he'd just fake it and log his time?

 

She also had that whole thing of how she was actually a really good actress, etc etc etc. Maybe after getting something to eat and some coffee I'll be able to spin an actual theory out of how Krissy's "good" acting (and ability to kill) and Dean's inability to act (in both sense of "act" -- he has trouble playing along, even to the point that he doesn't want to go help Krissy in the first place, and he also freezes during the fight) connect with each other thematically (or, lol, maybe not!).

[DittyDotDot]

But Frank was basically telling him to divorce himself from his instincts, which seems really dangerous. Aren't those instincts part of what was keeping him alive?

 

I think Frank's telling Dean to stop going through the motions or else he'll be dead. Dean's already divorced himself from his instincts and is only being fueled by his need to get revenge right then. I think Frank's advocating that Dean needs to force himself to feel something and find a reason to keep going each and every day--believe in it and build on it. In many ways it's similar to Dean's "stone one" speech to Sam back in Hello Cruel World, to me.

[7kstar]

I think Frank's telling Dean to stop going through the motions or else he'll be dead. Dean's already divorced himself from his instincts and is only being fueled by his need to get revenge right then. I think Frank's advocating that Dean needs to force himself to feel something and find a reason to keep going each and every day--believe in it and build on it. In many ways it's similar to Dean's "stone one" speech to Sam back in Hello Cruel World, to me.

There is a belief that many that are depressed focus on the issues that only make them more depressed.  By faking a smile, you shift your body's attitude.  What starts out as fake turns real. Talking about the hurts may release some but in many actually re-traumatizes the person and just adds more depression.  So by teaching someone to focus on the positive, they learn how to move forward.  It is more complex than this but it does help...if that makes any sense.  So actually Franks advise does have a bit of sound advice....just because it's mixed with a bit of crazy doesn't mean it's all bad.  :)

 

I didn't think that Frank was telling him how he was so great, but sometimes the one who hasn't been successful has figured out what others can't see, but can't figure out how to get what they want either.  Frank told him how he got his butt back in the game and was trying to get Dean to listen to the fact that if he didn't change something he wouldn't survive.  Actually sound advice so it didn't bother me.

 

On rewatch I actually like this ep so much more and most likely would have fought for it a bit more because I really do like it.  Is it perfect...NOPE  but it has so much that I do like.  And at least it is moving in the direction to get Dean out of just being a drunk. 

 

The biggest difference this time and when Dean was four, he had lost too many and now was thinking that those that died, died because of him. 

It's the set up for I'm poison speech in season 9.

 

Although not a fan of how easily Dean got knocked out, I bought it because his head really wasn't in the game and that last scene is a killer. 

 

I think what also really got me tired of the Gamble reign was that Dean seemed so less competent during her time of being in charge and that part I really don't like.  But this ep sort of gives a reason at least better than the entire first part of season 6, which if someone really wanted to discuss belongs in the All season thread, but I think we've beaten that part down too.  :)  JMV

Edited December 28, 2014 by 7kstar

[rue721]

The reason I'm dubious is because I didn't think that Frank cared whether Dean *felt* better, I think he was trying to get him to *act* better. Namely, to act more respectful to Frank.

 

First, Dean comes in and complains that Frank is being unprofessional because he hasn't gotten back to him with the intel (or whatever) that Dean had paid Frank $15K (how?!!) to get.

 

Then, when Dean wakes up after his 36 hr sleep in the office chair (?), and he still is acting disgruntled, it seems like a flip switches in Frank and he "gets real" with Dean by talking about how, when he was 26, he came home to see his family slaughtered. And he schools Dean on how to act "professional," which to him (imo) is for Dean to keep a smile on his face and his feelings out of it.

 

I tried watching the scenes again to see if my interpretation would change in light of the discussion, but I really don't see where Frank shows any interest in how Dean actually feels -- for better or worse. He seems like he wants to be in charge, but Dean was being uppity/mouthy, so he put Dean in his place.

 

Dean was more-or-less fine with that, apparently. Personally, Frank would have gotten his name on my shit list right then, but hey.

 

The central argument between Dean and Frank, imo, was that Dean didn't feel that Frank was fulfilling his responsibility to him, namely, Frank wasn't doing the job he'd been hired to do -- but Frank resented getting called on that. So Frank flipped the script by having ~concerns~ about how Dean was doing *his* job and implied that it was Dean who was being unprofessional. Which, to be fair, was also the case. (But personally, I would have just blown it off as just a power play, not real advice).

 

When Dean told Sam he'd be his rock, he was promising that *he'd* do something, and Sam could count on *him.* When Frank told Dean to suck it up, he was telling Dean he needed to do something, not that Frank would help him out or that he could count on Frank at all. YMMV.

 

The reason I think it's interesting and/or important is because it worked in getting Dean to listen and act more respectful toward Frank. So obviously, whatever Frank said to Dean worked as far as getting Dean to do things Frank's way. But after getting that advice, Dean's actual work went from (well, relatively)

bad to worse -- it's not like he suddenly was able to keep his head in the game in Slice Girls. If anything, he froze up *more* and was *more* tempted to do what felt best rather than what was smartest

So I would say that the advice itself clearly failed to be useful or helpful to *him,* it mostly succeeded in drawing him closer to Frank.

 

That's also in contrast to the advice that Dean gives Krissy's dad at the end of the episode, which is for Krissy's dad to put her happiness first. I don't think Krissy is meant to "mirror" Dean, but I think that Dean's SL in this episode has him in the "student" role with Frank, and then flips him into the "teacher" role with Krissy -- so I think the first half of the episode only really makes sense in the context of how it contrasts with the second half.

 

A slightly different sentiment than what Frank was saying, but that I think would have been better -- and this, imo, should have been the theme song for the episode:  Tupac & Scarface, "Smile."

 

ETA:

Re-watching those scenes, though, I laughed out loud when I saw Sam come onscreen with those ridiculous sideburns. When I watch a bunch of episodes in a row with him looking like that, I guess I get used to it, but DAMN. Who in the world thought that was a good idea?! Idk how Jared dresses or does his hair in his real life, but it's got to be loads better than Sam, because Sam has some of the worst styling on TV imo. Can he not have a ~talk~ with someone about what would look better on him? And this S7 "look" is better than the following season, imo, when for some reason he gets ombre highlights yet somehow also looks straight up dirty and disheveled. SIGH. JP is gorgeous, so why is it apparently so hard to style Sam in a way that's not distractingly bad? The hair styles and the too-big-below-the-shoulders clothes (especially those suits! how can they not find a suit that fits him?) are the worst.

Edited December 29, 2014 by rue721

[Goldmoon]

Did not really care for this ep, but like the sideburn discussion.  I was just noticing how pointed they are. Dude!  What is up with that?

[Dobian]

Dean's interactions with Krissy made the episode for me.  I wish she could be his sidekick now and then.

[Hanahope]

I always wondered how their suits are so nicely pressed and tailored when they lug around backpacks and duffle bags.

I liked  Krissy , but she did seem a little bit Mary Sue, with her being able to memorize a whole wall of info, pick a lock, act scarred and stupid, and then have the right weapon and know exactly how to kill the monster.

it did provide a good contrast to both Sam and Dean who did not have their heads in the game and nearly got them all killed.  Frank was right, they need to move on and keep their eyes on the goal.

what makes that one piece of land so important?  

[DittyDotDot]

5 minutes ago, Hanahope said:

what makes that one piece of land so important?  

Oh...you'll see. ;)

[RulerofallIsurvey]

On 12/28/2014 at 8:41 PM, rue721 said:

Re-watching those scenes, though, I laughed out loud when I saw Sam come onscreen with those ridiculous sideburns. When I watch a bunch of episodes in a row with him looking like that, I guess I get used to it, but DAMN. Who in the world thought that was a good idea?! Idk how Jared dresses or does his hair in his real life, but it's got to be loads better than Sam, because Sam has some of the worst styling on TV imo. Can he not have a ~talk~ with someone about what would look better on him? And this S7 "look" is better than the following season, imo, when for some reason he gets ombre highlights yet somehow also looks straight up dirty and disheveled. SIGH. JP is gorgeous, so why is it apparently so hard to style Sam in a way that's not distractingly bad? The hair styles and the too-big-below-the-shoulders clothes (especially those suits! how can they not find a suit that fits him?) are the worst.

I agree with this so much.  As for suits - it's called a tailor.  I know Sam and Dean probably can't afford a good one, but then Dean's suits look like they usually fit pretty good.  

[Pondlass1]

11 hours ago, DittyDotDot said:

what makes that one piece of land so important?

This actually fell flat for me.  Bobby writing the number as he dies and Frank trying to figure it out.  It  just didn't seem such a big deal when we find out about the land.  I thought it might've been a Levi portal or something.

(I think they changed hair stylists.  Sam's hair is definitely cleaner and shinier these days).

[Pondlass1]

23 minutes ago, RulerofallIsurvey said:

 As for suits - it's called a tailor.

I think we're due a scene where they're fitted for FBI suits, argue over ties and just once could we see the suits hanging from the hook at the back seat.

On 6/14/2016 at 0:44 PM, Dobian said:

Dean's interactions with Krissy made the episode for me.  I wish she could be his sidekick now and then.

I wasn't keen on Krissy, but I did like her dad.  I thought the character was well-acted and written.  Krissy was too much over the top.  They get way too carried away when presenting females as hunters on this show.  It's too much in your face.

[catrox14]

13 hours ago, Hanahope said:

I always wondered how their suits are so nicely pressed and tailored when they lug around backpacks and duffle bags.

My head!canon is they roll them up as tight as possible. It's a packing trick I learned a long time ago. Roll up shirts etc to prevent wrinkling. And/or they have another secret compartment under all the hunting stuff in the trunk:)

[Jeddah]

39 minutes ago, catrox14 said:

My head!canon is they roll them up as tight as possible. It's a packing trick I learned a long time ago. Roll up shirts etc to prevent wrinkling. And/or they have another secret compartment under all the hunting stuff in the trunk:)

I think we've seen them rolling their clothes up while packing. Maybe in Dead Man's Blood? I don't know if that strategy works for suits though.

 

2 hours ago, Pondlass1 said:

I think we're due a scene where they're fitted for FBI suits, argue over ties and just once could we see the suits hanging from the hook at the back seat.

I agree!

[RulerofallIsurvey]

4 hours ago, Pondlass1 said:

I think we're due a scene where they're fitted for FBI suits, argue over ties and just once could we see the suits hanging from the hook at the back seat.

Yeah, I'll second this!  Should we start a petition?  ;)

[Jeddah]

On 6/30/2017 at 0:57 PM, Jeddah said:

I think we've seen them rolling their clothes up while packing. Maybe in Dead Man's Blood? 

I'm rewatching Season 1 and I have to correct myself. Dean rolls his clothes while packing in Nightmare, not Dead Man's Blood. 

[Hanahope]

So while rolling up clothes can work in many instances, I just can't see it working for a man's suit.  

[DittyDotDot]

On 6/29/2017 at 9:27 PM, Hanahope said:

I always wondered how their suits are so nicely pressed and tailored when they lug around backpacks and duffle bags.

I'd actually prefer them if they were a little less-pressed and I actually appreciate when the suits don't fit quite right. It's more in keeping with the show and the characters, IMO. They live on the road, their suits shouldn't be perfectly tailored and they should have a few wrinkles; I think it would actually sell them as real working FBI agents to local law enforcement too. I kinda miss the days when the guys were allowed to get dirt under their fingernails and still be effective; it's not the suit that sells the con, IMO, but the boys ability to do the con.

Edited July 17, 2017 by DittyDotDot

[bettername2come]

On 8/15/2014 at 0:33 PM, catrox14 said:

The dark haired female monster was played by the same actress that was in the Dark Angel episode "The Beresford Agenda" with Jensen, as his love interest. And YES, if you love his work as Dean, you really MUST find that episode and watch it because HOLY SHIT, Jensen was amazing and he was all of 22. And no, IMO, you don't need to watch any other episode of Dark Angel IMO to appreciate Jensen's work in the episode.  And yes that was him playing the piano.)

I hate that we don't get some kind of flirtatious scene with Dean and that monster as an homage to that episode. 

"Gwyneth Paltrow is not a leviathan." Bwahahaha.  "You think it's easy to see this deep into what's real and also be bipolar with delusional ideation? There is no pill for my situation, sweetiepop." Between that and Frank's chilling telling of his hunter backstory, I'm thinking I may have underappreciated this character.

Sam needs to stop getting kidnapped. Or not. It is one of my favorite repeated patterns. I like him pissing off the monster so she'd feed on him instead of draining the dad.  

I like Krissy. She had good reason not to trust Dean to do this on his own. And she described Sam as the size of a car. I like Dean trying to get her to do the fistbump so much more than I should. Even knowing it's a trap, Jensen just seems so adorkable trying to convince her the first time. 

[RulerofallIsurvey]

Is Krissy's dad 

Spoiler

Ishim from Lily Sunder?

As I said, I think in All Seasons, the Week 1 shot of the boys sitting in the cabin staring into space - and looking at each other but not when the other was looking back - was very poignant.  So by week two, they are investigating possible meanings of the numbers.  By Week 3, seems like they're back into the swing of things a little more. 

Did Bobby get a hunter's funeral?  I just realized we never saw it.  I don't think.  I don't remember seeing it, which is weird.  I mean, Death's Door was a great send off for the character, but a little odd that Sam and Dean didn't give him a hunter's funeral.  It makes sense for the plot developments, but odd from Sam and Dean's POV.

Aw, I just realized: when Sam got to Krissy's apartment, he's probably thinking: 'her dad's on a road trip and he hasn't been home in a few days.'  Gutsy of Krissy to let big ol' Sam in through the door.  I mean she was like, half his size - litterally.  I'm going to presume that she'd heard the name 'Sam' (and probably 'Sam and Dean) from Bobby via her dad before, and that's why she let him in.  

I like the Dean and Frank dynamic.  

I don't blame the monsters for grabbing Sam.  They were probably thinking "he's so big, we could feed on him for weeks!"

Krissy has a point about Dean not updating the info about the vitala in John's journal.  If Sam was away at college at the time, and Dean hunted the two by himself, that means he also didn't share the info with John.  Which seems odd that Dean, back then, wouldn't do.  

Shades of SoullessSam there telling the lie to Sally about cutting up her sisters.  

I like the Dean and Krissy dynamic too.  Basically, apparently I just like it when people snark back at Dean.  ;)  I don't like the 'Krissy saved Sam and Dean' rhetoric though.  If Krissy hadn't come charging in, Dean would have killed the blonde vitala.  Sally was already on the floor, she would have been next.  

[Wayward Son]

6 minutes ago, RulerofallIsurvey said:

Is Krissy's dad 

  Hide contents

Ishim from Lily Sunder?

 

Did Bobby get a hunter's funeral?  I just realized we never saw it.  I don't think.  I don't remember seeing it, which is weird.  I mean, Death's Door was a great send off for the character, but a little odd that Sam and Dean didn't give him a hunter's funeral.  It makes sense for the plot developments, but odd from Sam and Dean's POV.I

 

Shades of SoullessSam there telling the lie to Sally about cutting up her sisters.  

I like the Dean and Krissy dynamic too.  Basically, apparently I just like it when people snark back at Dean.  ;)  I don't like the 'Krissy saved Sam and Dean' rhetoric though.  If Krissy hadn't come charging in, Dean would have killed the blonde vitala.  Sally was already on the floor, she would have been next.  

Taking to season 7 all episodes thread since my answers involve spoilers. 

Edited October 16, 2017 by Wayward Son

[Iju]

i don't like the kid. i just don't like rebellious teens in gener. they just irk me. and honestly, i feel that dean would have wouldn't have cared much more than saving the father, since he's still extremely fresh off of bobby. i i knew i certainly wasn't feeling a rebellious edgy teen after something so soon. this should have been more on sam's mission tbh.

[The Companion]

On 12/4/2014 at 4:49 PM, rue721 said:

Oh no, I don't even understand how therapy would work in the context of the Constant!Apocalypse that is the Winchesters' lives! Now I'm getting visions of a therapist talking about "radical acceptance [of demons]" or something LOL. Plus, dunno how health care works in their world, but it seemed like Sam couldn't even

We did have that one scene where Sam was trying to get information about the abandoned asylum and then seemed to benefit from therapy. Sadly, the long term relationship required to really delve in is not happening. Lol.

They seem to have fake insurance info or accounts, if I recall from prior episodes. Earlier this season Bobby lied about lapsed insurance (committing a fairly serious EMTALA violation if it had been real) to get Sam out of the hospital and I recall mentions of insurance previously. Add it to the list of fraud.

On 6/30/2017 at 11:11 AM, catrox14 said:

My head!canon is they roll them up as tight as possible. It's a packing trick I learned a long time ago. Roll up shirts etc to prevent wrinkling. And/or they have another secret compartment under all the hunting stuff in the trunk:)

This is actually taught in the military to allow everything to fit in a pack. John was in the military, so that might be a nice continuity point.

This episode was competent and enjoyable, which is to say I am not dying to see it again but I liked it well enough. That is enough of a rarity on the one off episodes this year to be high praise.

I really liked them splitting up to divide and conquer. It made more sense than having them split after a fight, I think.

I also like that they got it wrong. So often we see them say something like: oh, it's a *insert random obscure monster.* I fought one before and *insert a bunch of generalizations based on one encounter.*

The monsters are people adjacent (heeee). Their behavior may not always be subject to generalization and the lore may be off. 

Overall, it was entertaining and interesting. That's enough for me.

[gonzosgirrl]

40 minutes ago, The Companion said:

We did have that one scene where Sam was trying to get information about the abandoned asylum and then seemed to benefit from therapy.

Heheh, yeah he got helped right into murdering the brother he resented (thank heaven for unloaded weapons).

[ILoveReading]

13 minutes ago, gonzosgirrl said:

Heheh, yeah he got helped right into murdering the brother he resented (thank heaven for unloaded weapons).

And Dean's instincts. 

This episode has one of my favorite all time scenes and some of the best non verbal acting I've ever seen.  Dean practicing smiling.  Never before have I seen such a sad, heartbreaking  smile.  Jensen has this unique ability to seemingly turn his eyes on and off and none of them ever reached his eyes.  They remained completely dead. 

It also made me sad that once again the advice Dean got for dealing with his issues was suck it up and fake it.  

Edited December 17, 2019 by ILoveReading

[Myrelle]

1 hour ago, ILoveReading said:

And Dean's instincts. 

This episode has one of my favorite all time scenes and some of the best non verbal acting I've ever seen.  Dean practicing smiling.  Never before have I seen such a sad, heartbreaking  smile.  Jensen has this unique ability to seemingly turn his eyes on and off and none of them ever reached his eyes.  They remained completely dead. 

It also made me sad that once again the advice Dean got for dealing with his issues was suck it up and fake it.  

😭

[The Companion]

1 hour ago, gonzosgirrl said:

Heheh, yeah he got helped right into murdering the brother he resented (thank heaven for unloaded weapons).

It's not . . . a perfect system. 😆

[gonzosgirrl]

1 hour ago, ILoveReading said:

And Dean's instincts. 

This episode has one of my favorite all time scenes and some of the best non verbal acting I've ever seen.  Dean practicing smiling.  Never before have I seen such a sad, heartbreaking  smile.  Jensen has this unique ability to seemingly turn his eyes on and off and none of them ever reached his eyes.  They remained completely dead. 

It also made me sad that once again the advice Dean got for dealing with his issues was suck it up and fake it.  

That scene was so haunting. It really does suck that 'genre' shows (at least on CW/network television) are ignored by the awards circuit. Jensen should have at least a couple for SPN.

[gonzosgirrl]

1 hour ago, The Companion said:

It's not . . . a perfect system. 😆

Especially for people named Dean. 😜

[AwesomO4000]

5 hours ago, gonzosgirrl said:

Heheh, yeah he got helped right into murdering the brother he resented (thank heaven for unloaded weapons).

Now to be fair, that was actually his father the ghost. ; ) The original psychiatrist (? or therapist?) did seem to be helpful in that Sam seemed to benefit from having him to talk with / vent to if nothing else.

Of course that Sam then was different from the one we got in this season. Season 7 Sam is a bit more chill and zen. I'm guessing getting pissed off and trying to vent rage on a much more powerful being like Lucifer and getting smacked down a few hundred times eventually just drains the piss and vinegar out of one, and issues like Sam had in season 1 in retrospect seem pretty small in comparison.

That's how I reasoned Sam's zen attitude. "At least I've got all my crazy under one umbrella," actually does make a weird kind of sense for Sam in this season. For Sam, he really did think it could've been worse.

[MagnusHex]

Another filler episode with some very light "character development," so who cares? Dean sucking up to be a professional does nothing for me because it feels like treading on familiar grounds of the brothers dealing with their CW-branded angst.

On the other hand, I do like the name-drop for the monster of the week (not so much the adaptation of said mythological monster, which might as well have been a vampire). SMT and Persona fans should recognize the name easily. Here's some history on them from the SMT wiki:

"Vetala are evil spirits from Hindu folklore with varying shapes and forms who haunts cemeteries and takes demonic possession or control of corpses and are constantly plotting their return to the realm of the living or attacking humans until they are mangled. Their eyes glow with a dull light.

Legends say that the Vetala wield secret arts and can raise the dead by chanting mantras. They make their displeasure known by troubling humans. They can drive people mad, kill children and cause miscarriages. There are spells to utilize them to manipulate the dead. They suck the blood of their victims and bend them to their will, even controlling their movement like puppets.

Vetala are considered the greatest of all evil spirits but were also known as vampires or leaders of ghosts. They were also known as Preta as the most dangerous of them.

In Buddhist tradition, they are called Kondara or Metara."

The only part the episode got right was the "vampire" part. No secret arts of necromancy or puppet masters here, which is a shame, because Christ, that would have been a far more interesting episode.

2/5

Edited May 26 by MagnusHex