S04.E18: No Ifs, Ands or Buts

[secnarf]

Quote

Max orchestrates a plan to get Dr. Fuentes terminated from New Amsterdam once and for all. Helen confronts her medical complication. Iggy helps two patients deal with a breakup, which forces him to consider his own marriage. Bloom and Dr. Castries reach an understanding.

Original air date: May 3 2022

[SunnyBeBe]

More about the old boss lady…..good grief they won’t let that die.  Enough already.   😩

[Driad]

Sharpe's struggle reminded me of a relative who had a stroke that affected his speech. Once he tried to tell someone how to do something, got frustrated, and swore fluently. He recognized the irony and laughed.  I have heard of people who can't speak fluently but can sing.

[Cloud9Shopper]

It was a better episode than the hot messes that have been lurking since S3, but I was just…bored? I guess. Even with Helen’s thing (and I have said it over and over that I love Sharpwin so it’s not that) I was just like OK enough already of this storyline. Her frustrations are sad and understandable, but the fallout of the drugging thing has gone on so long it seems like. Luckily she is talking normally in next week’s promo so hopefully we won’t have to hear about it anymore. (I sound awful, I know.) 

The most interesting plot to me was Iggy working with the non-empathetic little girl. I don’t care about Lauren trying cupping or having a come to Jesus with Dr. Whackadoodle. (She does know modern, traditional medicine saved her when she almost died, right?) Yawn. 

I can’t imagine why we need a two-parter over two days next week. If this show were actually riveting and weren’t on its way out the door, it might work. But I’m not sold. 

[KaveDweller]

1 hour ago, SunnyBeBe said:

More about the old boss lady…..good grief they won’t let that die.  Enough already.   😩

Seriously. The Good Doctor got rid of their evil boss lady weeks ago now, and they showed up at the same time. 

I am at least glad having evil boss lady buy the clinic is part of the plan and not Max being an idiot by blabbing to her.

I guess Helen having a breakthrough at the end means she is just going to be cured right away? Not that I want to spend weeks watching her struggle, but what was even the point? Not to mention, there are people who never fully recover after a stroke.

I didn't get Floyd's storyline. Why was he having to cold call doctors? New Amsterdam doesn't have enough surgeons on staff? I know he was trying to save money for the patient, but wouldn't they have to pay the new doctor?

I kind of liked Lauren story with the holistic doctor.

Iggy, Iggy, Iggy. Don't encourage the potential sociopath girl to date the boy who must have some issue to be living in the psych ward. That is clearly not going to end well. Maybe encourage them to work on themselves instead of being a matchmaker?

[preeya]

26 minutes ago, KaveDweller said:

 

Iggy, Iggy, Iggy. Don't encourage the potential sociopath girl to date the boy who must have some issue to be living in the psych ward. That is clearly not going to end well. Maybe encourage them to work on themselves instead of being a matchmaker?

His professional case of the day always has to mirror his personal struggles.

[SunnyBeBe]

A lot of this episode didn’t make sense to me. Like normally, surgeons have rights to operate at certain hospitals. I never heard of some random doctor just waltzing in last minute to a hospital that he has no connection with. Maybe, there’s an exception for extreme cases.  
 

I won’t pretend to know the struggles of a stroke patient, but people struggle with chronic and frustrating conditions all the time.  It seemed like she didn’t understand the process, even though she’s a doctor and it was explained to her.  
 

 

[Frisky Wig]

I have mixed feelings about Helen’s storyline. I’ve had a speech impediment my entire life, I speak with a stutter and Freema’s performance seemed… hmmm. I don’t want to say “mocking” because there wasn’t any malicious intent but I can’t think of the word I’m looking for. It’s weird to see someone fake a speech disorder. However, it’s good that they’re raising awareness of this issue. I don’t know what it’s like to be a stroke victim but I could really relate to Helen’s frustration at not getting words out. 

[babyrambo]

6 hours ago, Cloud9Shopper said:

It was a better episode than the hot messes that have been lurking since S3, but I was just…bored?

Me too. It had hints of seasons 1 and 2 but without the wholesome slant that made those episodes enjoyable. I like these kinds of episodes more than the ones with extreme dramatics though, I guess. 

BLOOM: Lauren and Leyla and that Soprano-ish meet in the cafe, LOL. Leyla slid the money over like she was asking for a hit. All that was missing was a guarantee that her target would be whacked and swimming with the fishes by midnight. It was all very mafia and the paper bag was hilarious. I mean, if things weren’t transactional before, the straight faced cash exchange has certainly changed that! I still don’t get the point of any of this, Lauren keeps pining and Leyla seems to be completely over them; everything circles back to money when they could’ve gone literally anywhere else with them. Maybe this is another roundabout way to end things? I don’t know but if so, Lauren and Dr Woo Woo would be interesting together, if only for a one night stand. I wasn’t a fan of her but since they’ve toned her down she’s grown on me.   

FLOYD: Now that his girlfriend and third are out of the picture, he's gone back to amazingly dull; they really don’t know what to do with the guy, huh? 

IGGY: with the iffy advice, as usual. Juliet is one of his more interesting patients but talk about heavy handed. I’m hoping Martin actually leaves and they work out something healthy for the kids but that may be wishful thinking.

MAX: It’s too bad Veronica is so exhausting now because the actress is doing a great job. I’d definitely watch her play a calculating, unpredictable lead in something else—something with a lot more depth, better writing and better character work—for sure  

As it is, I’m just waiting for her to walk off that set for good. Her and Max have done this dance for so long that at this point I almost want Veronica to win so London would’ve been worth it. But an end does seem near, so hopefully things fizzle out in next week’s two parter. Which, to me, seems more like a way to quickly wrap up the season than anything else but I guess I’ll have to just watch and see.
 

Edited May 4, 2022 by babyrambo

[Rammchick]

Ok, I'm confused.  Isn't Floyd a cardiac surgeon, or am I mixing him up with another medical show I watch?  I couldn't understand why he was doing a tumorectomy.

[jabRI]

2 hours ago, babyrambo said:

MAX: It’s too bad Veronica is so exhausting now because the actress is doing a great job. I’d definitely watch her play a calculating, unpredictable lead in something else—something with a lot more depth, better writing and better character work—for sure  

She's a good, solid actress.  I've been wathching her with interest since her Star Trek NG days.  She had a small role in the first season of 'The Killing', very good show.

[Madding crowd]

If Iggy’s patients are ill enough for in-patient care why in the world are they allowed to be dating or kissing? They should be focusing on getting better. Too much of alternative medicine lady.That stuff helps with stress but it has to be adjacent to modern medicine. These surgeries with secret doctors would never happen and are just silly now.

Edited May 4, 2022 by Madding crowd

[jabRI]

This episode was really uncomfortable for me to watch.  I felt so bad for Helen, Max's constant cheerleading was just horrible.  Like let her be frustrated and have a bad day.  She needs to chill out, let it come back when it can.  I"m not saying don't do therapy, but it felt like people were forcing it on her.

[SunnyBeBe]

I get how Iggy’s husband is upset, but how long does the anger and resentment last and when do you mend the problem?  I realize emotional infidelity is hurtful, but holding on with the silent treatment isn’t helping matters.  If he can’t forgive, he should say so and plan their separation.  Also, involving the kids isn’t ok.  They shouldn’t be part of the blame game or exposed to a spouse’s hostility.  
 

The in-house wing for children is confusing too.  I guess they created it so Iggy could do work with kids without leaving the facility.  It just seems like it’s not operated very well.  Are the children living there long term?  Where do they go outside to play?  
 

I’m so over Bloom.  I have no interest in her at all.  

Edited May 4, 2022 by SunnyBeBe

[cathmed]

12 hours ago, SunnyBeBe said:

More about the old boss lady…..good grief they won’t let that die.  Enough already.   😩

Ikr!   The devil's handmaiden should have been gone episodes ago (or never been at NA in the first place).  I hope Max takes her down once and fall in next week's episode.  Enough already!

[Cloud9Shopper]

8 hours ago, Frisky Wig said:

I have mixed feelings about Helen’s storyline. I’ve had a speech impediment my entire life, I speak with a stutter and Freema’s performance seemed… hmmm. I don’t want to say “mocking” because there wasn’t any malicious intent but I can’t think of the word I’m looking for. It’s weird to see someone fake a speech disorder. However, it’s good that they’re raising awareness of this issue. I don’t know what it’s like to be a stroke victim but I could really relate to Helen’s frustration at not getting words out. 

The acting felt very forced to me too. I didn’t want to comment because I’m not a medical professional or any kind of expert in that area. I usually do like Freema’s acting too (she and Ryan deserve better than what they’re given, really) but it felt like she was trying to make something work that wasn’t there. 

It was also totally weird that both Casey and Whackadoodle were back at work with no follow up or explanation of how they were doing and how their recovery went. I figured that this episode was meant to be set several weeks after the last one, but the show spent so much time on their plots only to not even have a one-off line about them in this episode. 

[cathmed]

11 hours ago, Cloud9Shopper said:

It was a better episode than the hot messes that have been lurking since S3, but I was just…bored? I guess. Even with Helen’s thing (and I have said it over and over that I love Sharpwin so it’s not that) I was just like OK enough already of this storyline. Her frustrations are sad and understandable, but the fallout of the drugging thing has gone on so long it seems like. Luckily she is talking normally in next week’s promo so hopefully we won’t have to hear about it anymore. (I sound awful, I know.) 

The most interesting plot to me was Iggy working with the non-empathetic little girl. I don’t care about Lauren trying cupping or having a come to Jesus with Dr. Whackadoodle. (She does know modern, traditional medicine saved her when she almost died, right?) Yawn. 

I can’t imagine why we need a two-parter over two days next week. If this show were actually riveting and weren’t on its way out the door, it might work. But I’m not sold. 

Agreed - a bit better episode and glad to see (next week's episode) that Helen is somewhat back to "normal" e.g.,  speech has returned.  I was already tired of "how long will the writers drag out this storyline?

I actually like Juliet (the little psychopath); she's a good actor and her storylines are interesting.  Too bad Iggy helps no one but obviously, Juliet's "problem" with the boyfriend was the catalyst and parallel issue for Iggy to finally seek a therapist (acknowledging his faults).

I think they may be doing the back-to-back episode due to the 2 hiatus (Olympics and then that 6-week show).  There are probably 5-6 episodes remaining in S4 which probably ends around May 24.

[bybrandy]

All the things that happened in the kids in patient facility absolutely would happen except for the bit where Iggy was encouraging it.   /I was in an inpatient facility for a couple of weeks as a child and that place was a SOAP OPERA of romantic drama..  OMG.  So much romantic drama but I don't recall any adults ever actively encouraging it... ad that place was wildly unprofessional and was sued and shut down for basically admitting every patient who was evaluated in for an inpatient stay if their insurance would cover it.   (My mother was told that I was incredibly angry and violent because I played with a punching bag toy during my assesment...  It was a weeble style thing.  I'd never seen one before and I very clearly remember trying to work out how it worked that it kept getting back up and trying to figure out if there was a way to tip to a degree or in a direction that would overcome its ability to right itself.  There was no violence or anger just a genuine wish to figure out how it worked)

[circumvent]

7 hours ago, jabRI said:

She's a good, solid actress.  I've been wathching her with interest since her Star Trek NG days.  She had a small role in the first season of 'The Killing', very good show.

Watch her on Durham County, Canadian show from a while ago. It is a heavy, dark show but the acting is superb

[KaveDweller]

9 hours ago, Madding crowd said:

If Iggy’s patients are ill enough for in-patient care why in the world are they allowed to be dating or kissing? They should be focusing on getting better. Too much of alternative medicine lady.That stuff helps with stress but it has to be adjacent to modern medicine. These surgeries with secret doctors would never happen and are just silly now.

They have shown other people in in-patient care dating, adults, I believe. Iggy tried to discourage it initially and then changed his mind because they were "good for each other."

With the kids, I'd imagine it's hard to keep them from experimenting, but Iggy should not be encouraging it. He is such an awful doctor.

[izabella]

Iggy shouldn't be encouraging a lying, manipulative sociopath to "date" anyone.  He especially shouldn't be encouraging one of his patients to date a sociopath, either.

[txhorns79]

13 hours ago, cathmed said:

I hope Max takes her down once and fall in next week's episode.  Enough already!

I know she's portrayed as a villain, but it feels like the sum total of her villainy is *gasp* trying to keep the hospital operating by making money, and not creating multi-million dollar programs based on whatever whim Max has in a given week.

[bros402]

IT's time for WORST DOCTOR OF THE WEEK

PREVIOUS ON NEW AMSTERDAM

IGGY RUINS HIS RELATIONSHIP WITH HIS AWESOME HUSBAND

EVERYONE WAS DRUGGED WITH MAGIC ROOFIE

SHARPE CAN'T SPEAK WELL SO THEY HAVE A PLOT REASON TO KEEP HER IN NYC, when they could have just as easily broken her leg, or injured her in a not-TBI way

so she is going to be almost cured by the end of the episode, right?

OH MY GOD HER PRETEND APHASIA IS OFFENDING ME AND I DON'T EVEN HAVE IT, IT SOUNDS LIKE SHE IS MOCKING SPEECH IMPEDIMENTS

at least Sharpe's actress doesn't have a lot of dialogue to remember?

iggy, why go to stamford to counseling when NJ is right there? or someone on Long Island?

Floyd, you have a car? Is this here so you/someone else can get injured? Or so you can give it to someone? oh, it belonged to your dad?

That's 1k? is that 1k all in ones or somethng?

uhh, Dr. Whackadoodle did a surgical procedure (fecal transplant) on a patient? pretty sure whackadoodle's aren't allowed to do surgery in NYS

oh hey it's little sociopath

oh it'sfuentes

and of course she told the board about a case that was covered by an NDA (also, why would the NDA expire after ~18 years?)

is iggy going to repair his marriage by talking to a sociopath?

ok so the last bit, Whackadoodle was somewhat likeable - they've reversed all of that

are they going to dethrone fuentes through billing practices

um fuentes he isn't projecting slander, the word you are looking for is libel - slander is spoken

the sociopath and her boyfriend made up, iggy you should not be making noise commentary - that could set the kids off

wait, it took that long for poop guy to have anaphylactic shock? At least an hour or so has passed! Well, enough time for them to get calzones and start eating them, and for him to switch rooms, since that is a different room

oh bloom I did not know you were a neurologist who can instantly go "I DON'T THINK IT IS MS!"

so uhhh, is this SLP just seeing Helen all day? She spent two hours with her earlier, and now she has an afternoon session?

um iggy if she dumped that kid in front of the entire group, how didn't you hear until after he didn't show up for art class?

i'm surprised reynold's patient's insurance has so many vascular surgeons in network

Bloom, you are an ER doctor, you do not have to figure out a diagnosis. Dr. Whackadoodle, you are not a treating physician, you are alternative medicine, that is why you are dr whackadoodle

wait uh how did they confuse celiac for MS

what kind of crappy doctors did he see holy crap

um, iggy

HOW DOES A SOCIOPATH GET BETTER

what was with the camera angles during the board meeting, some fo that just seemed weird, especially the zoom in on fuentes' face

oh hey it's board lady, why weren't you at the meeting, was it part of a master--

yup it was part of some convoluted master plan

is doc whackadoodle just goign to do every single of one of her things to try help Bloom with her addictive personality

oh hey iggy is finally seeing a therapist

max why do you have to read the text from Sharpe all stilted, word by word? She wrote a full thing, no-need-to-read-it-like-this

is the magic no ifs, ands, or buts going to cure Sharpe?

hey look she's magically better!

she just needed magic max and his helping self

The worst doctor has to go to DR. WHACKADOODLE - she did SURGERY ON A PATIENT and according to this site, NDs in NY cannot currently diagnose or treat any disease

[circumvent]

For once, there were good things in the episode but as usual, not very well explored.

The story with Floyd's patient is a call out to the surprising bills that people receive when they are seen/treated for doctors that are about of network and the patient has no choice, don't even get the information. There is a law now that eliminates that (in theory because in this country the "care" industry manages to get away with literal murder all the time). 

As a PSA for anyone who cares, and I might have mentioned this in this forum already, the book Never Pay the First Bill teaches us to deal with all the assault by billing and collection agencies. There is rampant fraud in the whole industry. I was victim of some of those when the billing agencies sent 3 of my payment plans to collection, which they cannot do, one of the plans already paid off.

The whole Fuentes story is so ridiculous. That's not how a board of directors behaves, cowed at the simple mention of money, not demanding proof, documentation, studies. There is not minutes taker, there is not enough people even. NA is a public hospital being taken over, but still a public hospital. I believe the meetings are open to the public, at least some of them. I think that any entity that receives government funding is required to do so. Max should have rallied people to join the meeting - usually it is done via phone call, in this case they could have invaded the meeting for dramatic purpose. But the whole thing seems to be to wrap up as Max being the hero and savior, once again.

Can Lauren just go away now? With Iggy? Please? Ant take Lauren's holier than thou girlfriend too

[SunnyBeBe]

Is the little girl the same one who tried to kill her brother some seasons ago? 

[circumvent]

1 hour ago, SunnyBeBe said:

Is the little girl the same one who tried to kill her brother some seasons ago? 

I believe it is the same character but not sure if it is the same actress. The one on this episode seems to have very visible strabismus, which didn't call my attention in the previous plot

[yourmomiseasy]

On 5/4/2022 at 6:18 AM, Madding crowd said:

If Iggy’s patients are ill enough for in-patient care why in the world are they allowed to be dating or kissing? They should be focusing on getting better. Too much of alternative medicine lady.That stuff helps with stress but it has to be adjacent to modern medicine. These surgeries with secret doctors would never happen and are just silly now.

The surgeries aren't secret anymore.  I think they are in Max's clinic which is in New Amsterdam, which also seems kind of unlikely that his clinic would have a surgical suite, but whatever.  I think Floyd was calling around to find a surgeon that would donate their time, but it was not clear. 

On 5/3/2022 at 9:09 PM, SunnyBeBe said:

A lot of this episode didn’t make sense to me. Like normally, surgeons have rights to operate at certain hospitals. I never heard of some random doctor just waltzing in last minute to a hospital that he has no connection with. Maybe, there’s an exception for extreme cases.  
 

I won’t pretend to know the struggles of a stroke patient, but people struggle with chronic and frustrating conditions all the time.  It seemed like she didn’t understand the process, even though she’s a doctor and it was explained to her.  
 

 

Given my experience as a watcher of shitty TV medical dramas, you can get emergency privileges, but the CEO/head has to issue -- maybe it was Max that needed to sign-off and he would totally do it without any due diligence.

I haven't had a stroke, but I had a physical injury with a long hard recovery, and there's a difference between what you know and the utter frustration and hopelessness you feel when you are working your ass off and it seems like you are actually getting worse.  Helen rang true to me.

 

11 hours ago, circumvent said:

For once, there were good things in the episode but as usual, not very well explored.

The story with Floyd's patient is a call out to the surprising bills that people receive when they are seen/treated for doctors that are about of network and the patient has no choice, don't even get the information. There is a law now that eliminates that (in theory because in this country the "care" industry manages to get away with literal murder all the time). 

As a PSA for anyone who cares, and I might have mentioned this in this forum already, the book Never Pay the First Bill teaches us to deal with all the assault by billing and collection agencies. There is rampant fraud in the whole industry. I was victim of some of those when the billing agencies sent 3 of my payment plans to collection, which they cannot do, one of the plans already paid off.

The whole Fuentes story is so ridiculous. That's not how a board of directors behaves, cowed at the simple mention of money, not demanding proof, documentation, studies. There is not minutes taker, there is not enough people even. NA is a public hospital being taken over, but still a public hospital. I believe the meetings are open to the public, at least some of them. I think that any entity that receives government funding is required to do so. Max should have rallied people to join the meeting - usually it is done via phone call, in this case they could have invaded the meeting for dramatic purpose. But the whole thing seems to be to wrap up as Max being the hero and savior, once again.

Can Lauren just go away now? With Iggy? Please? Ant take Lauren's holier than thou girlfriend too

I had a 5 year period where I had anywhere from 4-9 medical appointments per week and had a surgery thrown in there too.  Someone with the same name as me (different middle initial and different DOB) goes to the same medical group and they kept confusing our records and my insurance was paying her claims and denying mine.  It was horrible and exhausting trying to fight the bills while also being in chronic pain.  I made headway with some, but I was drowning.  Luckily for me, my boss noticed I was losing it and asked me what was going on and once I explained, she had someone from our corporate office HR team fix it all for me (I worked for a Fortune 500 company and we were self-insured but had insurance companies to administer everything).  I can get my Karen on with the best of them, but I don't that I would have persevered without intervention.   

[Madding crowd]

The surgery was secret in that Floyd didn’t have it set up in a regular operating room where an on call vascular surgeon would be available. Of course the hospital wouldn’t set up a surgery for free and no way would the free clinic have an operating room.  I am sometimes confused by how this works as this is a public hospital but apparently the patient didn’t go thru the right channels or didn’t qualify for some reason.

[bros402]

8 hours ago, circumvent said:

I believe it is the same character but not sure if it is the same actress. The one on this episode seems to have very visible strabismus, which didn't call my attention in the previous plot

Okay, I thought I was just seeing things - so her eyes were off a bit?

According to IMDB, it is the same actress

[yourmomiseasy]

On 5/5/2022 at 2:29 PM, Madding crowd said:

The surgery was secret in that Floyd didn’t have it set up in a regular operating room where an on call vascular surgeon would be available. Of course the hospital wouldn’t set up a surgery for free and no way would the free clinic have an operating room.  I am sometimes confused by how this works as this is a public hospital but apparently the patient didn’t go thru the right channels or didn’t qualify for some reason.

It was implied that the clinic had an operating room and for the first surgery Floyd participated as a consulting surgeon from New Amsterdam -- he was consulting because the clinic and the hospital are separate entities.  IDK, it doesn't make sense, but like nothing on this dumb show does so whatever.

[possibilities]

The billing issue is a real one, and even with the new "no surprise billing" law, I've found that when I make appointments, no one in the process is willing to tell me what anything will cost or guarantee it's covered, because they simply do not know. The practitioners don't know. And the billing dept won't tell you because they say they can't predict what the practitioners will order. The entire system is fubar.

I am refraining from a wholesale condemnation of Helen's acting, because it's not my particular expertise, though she didn't look or sound like any of the people I've personally known who had speech-related disabilities, and my gut reaction was to be really angry about the portrayal.

I would love to see a show that represents someone with a speech disability as well as they represent Dr Wilder's deafness.

Rehab is very tiring and frustrating and at some point people do get to decide that they are fine the way they are and their loved ones need to stop pressuring them to "get better". I don't know how long it's been since Helen's stroke, but if she had told Max "yes, I'm giving up on rehab, deal with it!" and then they showed her using assistive tech to communicate for now on, I would have found that much more interesting than the breakthrough that fixes everything through the magic of Max's love or whatever they were showing tonight.

Just don't do disability stories with able-bodied actors through an AB normative lens, okay?