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The Ultimatum: Marry Or Move On - General Discussion


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I binged all 8 episodes released so far today. I still have some trouble keeping the names and original/remix couples straight. And Alexis was not going to get anybody to pick her, so I guess she dodged that. 

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Im just on episode two, but it’s honestly so nerve racking honestly watching from the outside, and seeing someone choose someone who has made them their second choice. 

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(edited)

Yeah, and Madlyn is not covering herself with glory either. They deserve each other.

Did Jake lie to Rae when he told her his mother liked her? Because the part of the family visit I saw, his mother was singing April's praises right to Rae's face.

Of course everybody got along great for 3 weeks with the people they just met!! 

Alexis is quite the shit stirrer. I guess she had to make up for all the screen time she missed by getting engaged in the early episodes. She's probably still mad at Colby for saying he just wasn't into her. Very high maintenance.

Edited by NeenerNeener
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I'm only a couple episodes in, but I wish there was some more establishment of the ground rules. It seems like it would be fairly easy for some people to have been willing to choose like 3+ of other people, or for people to have zero interest in dating others, particularly if the person started off thinking that they had already found their life partner.

It seems like there were three remix couples that had voluntary chemistry but would they have forced April/Colby-style pairings on the rest if people hadn't opted out?  

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4 hours ago, NeenerNeener said:

Alexis is quite the shit stirrer. I guess she had to make up for all the screen time she missed by getting engaged in the early episodes. She's probably still mad at Colby for saying he just wasn't into her. Very high maintenance.

If someone told me that they weren't attracted to me, I'd probably hide from them, not confront them. When she did that, she said that she resembled his girlfriend more than anyone else there. I wondered if she meant white. Because she does not resemble his girlfriend in any way. 

I did wonder if anyone was going to pick her. None of the men seemed into her. But her boyfriend's proposal was really sweet. 

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1 hour ago, TrixieTrue said:

If someone told me that they weren't attracted to me, I'd probably hide from them, not confront them. When she did that, she said that she resembled his girlfriend more than anyone else there. I wondered if she meant white. Because she does not resemble his girlfriend in any way. 

I did wonder if anyone was going to pick her. None of the men seemed into her. But her boyfriend's proposal was really sweet. 

In fairness, in terms of the six women there, Madlyn doesn't really look like Alexis, but there's a closer resemblance physically IMO than to Lauren (who is also white it seems to me), April (who I'm not sure about her ethnicity -- she seems like she could be white, Latina, Asian or biracial) and of course Rae (who is biracial white and black) and Shanique (who is black).

But when you factor in personality, Alexis did seem super high-maintenance and unpleasant.

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(edited)

Both of those couples that got engaged early on are dumb. They did nothing to fix what was wrong with their relationships. They just doubled down out of fear.

Who knew that these people going out and talking to other people not involved with the show would cause more issues than the actual show?

Doesn't bode well for your relationship when you can't even stop cheating or talking with other people the second you are "single".

Edited by Racj82
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2 hours ago, Racj82 said:

Both of those couples that got engaged early on are dumb. They did nothing to fix what was wrong with their relationships. They just doubled down out of fear.

Who knew that these people going out and talking to other people involved with the show would cause more issues than the actual show?

Doesn't bode well for your relationship when you can't even stop cheating or talking with other people the second you are "single".

It's at least plausible that after a week of thinking about things that Nate decided, "Hey, I'm willing to compromise on having kids if it means that I get to be with the woman I love" and/or "I have no interest in going through the motions of pretending to be into any of these other women for three weeks" and/or "I don't want to run the risk of one of these other dudes plowing my old lady or have to put up with the jealousy and annoyance of waiting for the other shoe to drop." 

It's also possible that producers goosed things some and because one would think there are only so many swapped couples that they might be able to follow in the time frame that they had.

And it also seems possible that Nate was like, "Wait a second, I got cockblocked from my first couple of choices, I might as well love the one I'm with."

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So far it looks like the couples that went through the swap are splitting up. Based on how Love Is Blind works, I expect one of the couples to get back together again in the finale next week, and at least one couple to really break up. My vote for permanent break up is Colby and Madlyn, only because it should happen. She's no day at the beach, but he's evil and she doesn't deserve that.

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15 minutes ago, Chicago Redshirt said:

It's at least plausible that after a week of thinking about things that Nate decided, "Hey, I'm willing to compromise on having kids if it means that I get to be with the woman I love" and/or "I have no interest in going through the motions of pretending to be into any of these other women for three weeks" and/or "I don't want to run the risk of one of these other dudes plowing my old lady or have to put up with the jealousy and annoyance of waiting for the other shoe to drop." 

It's also possible that producers goosed things some and because one would think there are only so many swapped couples that they might be able to follow in the time frame that they had.

And it also seems possible that Nate was like, "Wait a second, I got cockblocked from my first couple of choices, I might as well love the one I'm with."

Six couple seem to be their sweet spot so I highly doubt the amount of people were the problem. They already had the number of people they were comfortable with set.

Yes, all of that is plausible and I'm not buying it. 

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17 minutes ago, NeenerNeener said:

So far it looks like the couples that went through the swap are splitting up. Based on how Love Is Blind works, I expect one of the couples to get back together again in the finale next week, and at least one couple to really break up. My vote for permanent break up is Colby and Madlyn, only because it should happen. She's no day at the beach, but he's evil and she doesn't deserve that.

Colby and Zay deserve no one right now.

I'm waiting for someone on the show to acknowledge that Colby and April hooked up. I guess that's what the reunion is for. If Madlyn and Colby don't break up on the finale, they will be dust by the reunion.

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This is so trashy that it was pretty perfect as a reality show. I do not believe any of the remaining couples should actually get engaged, although I could see Rae and Jake forming viable couple out of this. Maybe Randall and Madlyn could as well... hard to say with all of the editing shenanigans that went on.

I feel for Zay, but I think it was good that Rae and Zay broke up. I hope they stay broken up and find new people.

Colby is one of the strangest personalities I've ever seen on reality TV. He doesn't seem malicious, but more like he's genuinely existing in a different version of reality than the real reality. Madlyn needs to trust her instincts and run!

We didn't see enough of Alexis or Hunter for me to have thoughts on them. I think they're probably real, but that Alexis also really wanted screentime. It was interesting to me that Alexis was willing to do the bachelorette party but Lauren wasn't (unless Lauren/Nate ended things shortly after leaving).  I would bet most of Alexis's shit stirring behavior was about making sure she wasn't edited out of the show. 

I wonder what things would have been like in alternate world where Shanique chose Nate.

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This is a trainwreck! One that I binged in one day!

I wonder if the creators of the show considered that the first week of the 2nd trial marriage with the original couples would be such a sh!tstorm?  One flaw in this premise (among all the other flaws) is that 3 weeks is a short time and those relationships are likely very stress-free and fun. The new couples are playing with house money.

Then you go back to your original mate. The relationship must have been a bit flawed (at least) or the couple wouldn't have been on "The Ultimatum". AND, I don't care what anyone agrees to -- jealousy is going to rear its head when your girlfriend/boyfriend is dating and sleeping in the bed with someone else for 3 weeks. The first week of the second trial marriage is set up to be turbulent and ugly. And it was.

I guess that's what we want to see, right? 

18 hours ago, Zuleikha said:

This is so trashy that it was pretty perfect as a reality show. I do not believe any of the remaining couples should actually get engaged, although I could see Rae and Jake forming viable couple out of this. Maybe Randall and Madlyn could as well... hard to say with all of the editing shenanigans that went on.

I agree with this. History seemed like the main reason for any of the original couples to stay together. At least Rae got a backbone. I wonder if she was hoping that Jake might come back and choose her?

On 4/7/2022 at 7:31 PM, Chicago Redshirt said:

It's at least plausible that after a week of thinking about things that Nate decided, "Hey, I'm willing to compromise on having kids if it means that I get to be with the woman I love" and/or "I have no interest in going through the motions of pretending to be into any of these other women for three weeks" and/or "I don't want to run the risk of one of these other dudes plowing my old lady or have to put up with the jealousy and annoyance of waiting for the other shoe to drop." 

Ding, ding, ding...

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I have so many thoughts, but I don't know where to begin. 

Wtf, Alexis. How many times and ways does a dude have to tell you he's not into you?  I give props to Colby for telling her the truth about not being attracted to her. That doesn't mean I like Colby; he's definitely a gas-lighting and manipulative possible sociopath. Yike. 

On 4/7/2022 at 4:44 PM, Chicago Redshirt said:

In fairness, in terms of the six women there, Madlyn doesn't really look like Alexis, but there's a closer resemblance physically IMO than to Lauren (who is also white it seems to me), April (who I'm not sure about her ethnicity -- she seems like she could be white, Latina, Asian or biracial) and of course Rae (who is biracial white and black) and Shanique (who is black).

Jake's mother said that April was a "spicy Filipina", so I'm going to assume she's at least part Filipina. 

I was HERE for Shanique coming down on Zay about staying out until 8:30 AM, and then expecting everything to be Ok with Rae.  Wtf was that? Idk if I would divorce my husband if he did that, but we would have a LOT of problems. And Shanique was absolutely correct in saying that Zay uses his past as an excuse for a lot of shitty behavior. Get some therapy, man. 

I would do soooo poorly on a show like this. I'm a childfree Atheist, and it seems that everybody on these reality shows wants at least 2 kids, and prays before every meal.  I felt so badly for the woman who didn't want to have kids. Colby had one conversation with her, and thought that he changed her mind? She probably just didn't want to be the odd one out with nobody picking her. I hope she doesn't compromise on her decision with her asshole fiance.  He was sooooo shady not getting his 2 choices, and then hastily proposing to cover up his humiliation. 

I found April super irritating. She's 23, and she already NEEDS to have a ring on her finger, and a fetus in her uterus? Settle the hell down, girl. Jake is so cute, and it seems like he wants to spend the rest of his 20's having fun and traveling, which he should DEFINITELY do.  This is probably really mean to say because of April's apparent fertility issues, but he is damn lucky that she hasn't gotten knocked up yet.  It's almost like he's tempting fate...thinking "ok, if she gets pregnant, I'll stick around". Or he's just as A-hole who is delighted that someone will let him raw-dog. Either way. 

I like Rae a lot. I think she's too good for both Zay and Jake, and I loved her father. 

I have other feelings, but I'm still processing. 

 

 

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Randall is the only one worthy of coming out unscathed. 

Colby is a calculating, manipulative shitbird, as evidenced most by Madlyn’s mom’s assessment of their first and second encounters.  I appreciated that he was direct about not wanting to be with Alexis or April, but based on their reactions and his tendency to lovebomb up front and then be evil, I suspect there was some footage left on the floor where he perhaps led them to believe he was interested. Madlyn seemed high as hell during her first fight with Randall. She reminds me of a B-list actress but I can’t think of her name.

Shanique. Whoo she is a lot, her reactions are wildly immature. I felt so bad for Randall trying to get her to communicate and hear him while she stomped her feet and stormed off.

Rae, I don’t know, she seems ok.  Zay is a jerk and their break-up is for the best. I had the hardest time trying to discern what he was really trying to say when he was trying to convey complex thoughts…so many filler words and no real message.

I wanted to like April but then her third-person elevator soliloquy sent me down the elevator shaft so….

The child/childfree couple…pfft, they’re both idiots. That is a dealbreaker full stop and they’ve only set themselves up for misery.

Alexis is insufferable. I hope they end up getting married in an excruciatingly expensive wedding and then file for bankruptcy and divorce within six weeks after she’s gotten pregnant and he’s had an affair with a crunchy granola bartender from 5th Street who is also pregnant.

As to whether the people on the show were locals from Austin, not sure. One was wearing scrubs to head off to work but she could have been a traveling nurse as those were/are in high demand these days.

The editing looks like all the original couples break up, so I’m sure every single one of them will get engaged and head off into a fabulous life together…

As always I find these shows fascinatingly trashy, a reminder that I am a terrible judge of character, and an opportunity to identify similar behaviors in myself that I can try to change.

 

OH!!! I am TOTALLY fascinated with the omnipresent stainless steel wineglasses that were everywhere. Definitely makes drink levels one less thing to worry about when it  comes to continuity and editing!

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1 hour ago, Toodleoo said:

OH!!! I am TOTALLY fascinated with the omnipresent stainless steel wineglasses that were everywhere. Definitely makes drink levels one less thing to worry about when it  comes to continuity and editing!

That's their goal.

3 hours ago, Zima said:

I was HERE for Shanique coming down on Zay about staying out until 8:30 AM, and then expecting everything to be Ok with Rae.  Wtf was that? Idk if I would divorce my husband if he did that, but we would have a LOT of problems. And Shanique was absolutely correct in saying that Zay uses his past as an excuse for a lot of shitty behavior. Get some therapy, man. 

I'm tired of people using their past to excuse away their present.

I can't say I had nothing but bad examples for relationships but I had bad examples around me. This includes my Dad who cheated on my mom a lot and ruined our family.

Things like this made me want to be a better man. I saw my mom hurt. Crying. In pain. I would never want to put a woman or anyone I care about through that type of hurt. Even if you had shitty examples, you also got to see why they were bad. Because someone stayed in a bad relationship doesn't justify anything or make it good.

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On the third episode now.  Yeah, the two proposals clearly had separate intentions behind them.  For Hunter/Alexis, it seemed like Hunter proposed to save Alexis the embarrassment of not being selected.  Whereas Nate totally proposed to Lauren to save himself the embarrassment of not being selected or worse, being rejected.

Hunter putting Alexis' needs ahead of his own clearly shows that they have a stronger (and probably legitimate) relationship.  Actually, I can't think of anything objectionable or even note-worthy that Hunter said/did over the first two episodes besides the proposal.  Makes me wonder if him and Alexis going on the show was one big ploy to get Alexis more Instagram followers.  I'm willing to bet that if Colby was cool with Alexis, her and Hunter would have ridden the show train to the bitter end.

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6 hours ago, Toodleoo said:

 

Colby is a calculating, manipulative shitbird, as evidenced most by Madlyn’s mom’s assessment of their first and second encounters.  I appreciated that he was direct about not wanting to be with Alexis or April, but based on their reactions and his tendency to lovebomb up front and then be evil, I suspect there was some footage left on the floor where he perhaps led them to believe he was interested. Madlyn seemed high as hell during her first fight with Randall. She reminds me of a B-list actress but I can’t think of her name.

 

That reminds me! My husband I are both convinced that she's gotta be abusing Xanax or something. She seems high as hell allllll the time. 

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On 4/8/2022 at 10:31 AM, Chicago Redshirt said:

And it also seems possible that Nate was like, "Wait a second, I got cockblocked from my first couple of choices, I might as well love the one I'm with."

Not if you add in how disappointed he looked when his two top choices chose some other man, and then after Hunter ruled out Alexis by proposing he mouths across the table to an incredulous Madlyn, "I'm going to choose you," twice.

Then moments later, he proposes, ha!

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Where do I start? Oh yeah, they're all so damn young! What's the urgency? 

I did google to see that they do all live in Austin so at least logistically, any pairing should work.  I often wonder about filming over the course of the show. Obviously, they moved them into one apartment building yet they all still go about their lives.  It's different from other shows that are filmed on location because these couples had the flexibility to show as much or little of their real lives as they wanted. I do wish they wouldn't have allowed any couples to immediately get engaged and back out. I think the show suffered a bit by losing four people right off the bat. 

I liked Rae, Jake, Lauren (really wish she would've stayed if only as someone upthread mentioned because she wants different things). Madlyn and April were entertaining and at times endearing but April was just too much and so damn young, while Madlyn was so wishy washy. I feel like we really didn't get to know Randall. Colby is a narcissist. Zay's a player. It bothered me that he couldn't understand why Rae reacted differently to arguments they he did.  I also couldn't really figure Shanique out but feel like she & Zay are must better suited because they argue the exact same way and apparently both need that fire to feel loved. 

Finally, I haven't heard that much talk about boners since sixth grade class trip! 

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10 hours ago, snarts said:

Where do I start? Oh yeah, they're all so damn young! What's the urgency? 

I did google to see that they do all live in Austin so at least logistically, any pairing should work.  I often wonder about filming over the course of the show. Obviously, they moved them into one apartment building yet they all still go about their lives.  It's different from other shows that are filmed on location because these couples had the flexibility to show as much or little of their real lives as they wanted. I do wish they wouldn't have allowed any couples to immediately get engaged and back out. I think the show suffered a bit by losing four people right off the bat. 

I liked Rae, Jake, Lauren (really wish she would've stayed if only as someone upthread mentioned because she wants different things). Madlyn and April were entertaining and at times endearing but April was just too much and so damn young, while Madlyn was so wishy washy. I feel like we really didn't get to know Randall. Colby is a narcissist. Zay's a player. It bothered me that he couldn't understand why Rae reacted differently to arguments they he did.  I also couldn't really figure Shanique out but feel like she & Zay are must better suited because they argue the exact same way and apparently both need that fire to feel loved. 

Finally, I haven't heard that much talk about boners since sixth grade class trip! 

I think in terms of the urgency, a lot of people just don't want to sit in long term relationship without eventually going to the next step. For them, staying in a relationship for five years and never getting married feels like a waste. 

Some of these couples also have fundamental differences that they need to figure out whether these differences are too much to keep going. That's something you want to deal with now instead of later.

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On 4/9/2022 at 5:26 PM, Toodleoo said:

As to whether the people on the show were locals from Austin, not sure. One was wearing scrubs to head off to work but she could have been a traveling nurse as those were/are in high demand these days.

<clip clip>>

OH!!! I am TOTALLY fascinated with the omnipresent stainless steel wineglasses that were everywhere. Definitely makes drink levels one less thing to worry about when it  comes to continuity and editing!

Perhaps not Austin, but definitely (Central) Texas. I spied my college ring (very distinctive ... IYKYK) on one of the ladies. 

And YES! The stainless steel wine glasses were so strange.

Edited by grammarista
Because spelling is important to me.
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1 hour ago, grammarista said:

Perhaps not Austin, but definitely (Central) Texas. I spied my college ring (very distinctive ... IYKYK) on one of the ladies. 

And YES! The stainless steel wine glasses were so strange.

The producers of this show do the same thing on love is blind. It's not really all that mysterious. It's exactly what you think it is. They use those glasses to disguise breaks in continuity during filming. A lot of other reality shows have issues with it because everyone has eagle eyes now. 

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4 hours ago, Racj82 said:

The producers of this show do the same thing on love is blind. It's not really all that mysterious. It's exactly what you think it is. They use those glasses to disguise breaks in continuity during filming. A lot of other reality shows have issues with it because everyone has eagle eyes now. 

Yes, I know, it was just hilarious that they were every. fucking. where. At home! In multiple restaurants!  At ya momma’n’em’s home! In the studio!  I’m surprised they weren’t in the bathrooms for continuity of teethbrushing.

I wonder if there are anodized ones available. If you’re gonna go samesies with distracting drinkware everywhere, go all out and make them pretty at least. Or color code the couples to see if the viewers can analyze which ones will last by the color of their glasses, in the manner TLo did in analyzing Mad Men costumes.

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10 hours ago, Toodleoo said:

Yes, I know, it was just hilarious that they were every. fucking. where. At home! In multiple restaurants!  At ya momma’n’em’s home! In the studio!  I’m surprised they weren’t in the bathrooms for continuity of teethbrushing.

I wonder if there are anodized ones available. If you’re gonna go samesies with distracting drinkware everywhere, go all out and make them pretty at least. Or color code the couples to see if the viewers can analyze which ones will last by the color of their glasses, in the manner TLo did in analyzing Mad Men costumes.

I don't know why they settled on this specific design. The gold ones for love is blind look better visually. As long as people are drinking, they have to have them around.

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This might be an unpopular opinion, but I sincerely dislike Madlyn. She looks completely drunk all the time and I really can’t understand what people see in her. I hate listening to her and watching her. She pressured Randell into getting physical because that is how she is expressing herself. Seriously? The night she got together with the girls she was a mess. I also hated when she brought Colby in that meeting with her gfs. She should be able to decide for herself what she wants to do. It was just an ambush. I am not taking Colby’s side, but if he is so horrible just dump him. Don’t make a mockery of a “trial” with your friends as judges! Shanique is soooo immature, she never listens and she thinks her opinions are the best. She also got physical with Zay, just because she was mad at Randell. Nate is simply horrible. Just because he wasn’t picked twice and started to get afraid that Lauren might fall in love with Colby, he decided to propose. Not agreeing whether to have kids or not is a deal breaker. I really hope Lauren breaks up with him. April is too much. I seriously don’t understand the rush in getting married and having kids at 23. She is also sharing too much about their sex life and the unprotected sex. That moment at the bachelorette party when she said she can’t drink alcohol was just to show Rae that her relationships with Jack is solid. I liked Randell, Jake and Rae, but I still have some episodes to watch. Alexis is not worth mentioning. She was horrible…

Edited by GeorgiaM
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I kinda wished they had a different system for creating the new pairings rather than the awkward dinner conversation.  It wouldn't have to be complicated.  Maybe something like each person rank the remaining women/men (i.e. everyone except their real-life partner).  Then if two people rank each other first, they would obviously be paired up and so on.

I think this would prevent some of the early engagements, at least initially.  Plus it would be good drama to see someone like Lauren get her first pick while Nate gets his last pick (which probably would be Alexis lol).

Edited by zenithwit
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18 hours ago, zenithwit said:

I kinda wished they had a different system for creating the new pairings rather than the awkward dinner conversation.  It wouldn't have to be complicated.  Maybe something like each person rank the remaining women/men (i.e. everyone except their real-life partner).  Then if two people rank each other first, they would obviously be paired up and so on.

I think this would prevent some of the early engagements, at least initially.  Plus it would be good drama to see someone like Lauren get her first pick while Nate gets his last pick (which probably would be Alexis lol).

They can't do the choosing sequence the same way again. It blew up the experiment. They didn't plan for that at all. The look on Vanessa's face told you all you need to know.

There really wasn't any structure. What do you do when Vanessa arbitrarily chooses you last to pick someone and there is no one there you want?

We saw with April and Colby that it causes even more problems (potentially). Now, you have people chillin and single going out and getting attention from a bunch of people.

Also, try to get some people in their 30s. Make the stakes less superficial.

Edited by Racj82
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Randall & Shanique got engaged. Not a big surprise. 

April and Jake split permanently.

Jake and Rae are going traveling so it looks like she's not getting back together with Zay.

Colby and Madlyn got married. I take back what I said about her not deserving all the shit she's going to get while she's married to him. She asked for every nasty thing he's going to do to her. 

ETA: The Reunion show...Madlyn is preggers! And they gave her a silver baby goblet as a gift.

Edited by NeenerNeener
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The Reunion was more interesting than the finale.  Madlyn is pregnant.  Jake and Rae never went on their holiday.  Rae has a girlfriend now.  Randall and Shanique broke up and got back together but are not engaged. The two couples that got engaged at the beginning are still engaged. April has a new older boyfriend.

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1 hour ago, LakeGal said:

April has a new older boyfriend.

My guess is that to her "older" means 35, not 75. 

So Jake and Rae never went on vacation because she was still dating Zay for awhile.

Another reunion show where the guys aren't wearing socks. I'm starting to think it's part of the initial questionnaire for guys applying for the show: "How do you feel about wearing shoes without socks?"

ETA: According to Distractify this might be April's "older" boyfriend:

https://www.instagram.com/p/Cb8SPKLPfsY/?utm_source=ig_embed&utm_campaign=loading

If it's true, Bravo, April! Living well is the best revenge.

Edited by NeenerNeener
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I didn't like April or Shanique's hair.  I noticed April's nail polish matched her dress.  Madlyn had the same nail polish.

Alexis is still annoying.  She really wants attention.

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Ew, I did not see Madlyn saying "I do".  And I do not believe that everything is perfect for them now that they're married with a kid on the way. I feel sorry for that kid. 

Ew, Lauren and whatever her fiance's name is. He got her to compromise and say she'd have "one kid for now". She looked dead in the eyes. 

I'm disappointed that Jake and Rae didn't wind up as a couple, but happy that she's happy with her girlfriend, and SUPER happy that Jake turned April down. 

I don't know if I buy that April is with some dude who tells her he wants to marry her every day.  If that's the case...why aren't they at least engaged? Seems like she's trying to have something to brag about.

Zay has a lot of issues to work out. I'm glad he's staying single for awhile. 

 

 

Edited by Zima
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I can’t believe Randall was blaming himself for their communication difficulties, going so far as to call himself selfish. And Shanita’s last remark about the olive oil being a good lube really was ott insensitive and inappropriate. 


I actually think Madelyn and Colby are going to make it and I don’t think it was so bad that he had a long term (3 week) texting relationship while he and April were together. He certainly didn’t try anything with her. Funny that Nick and Vanessa never brought up Madelyn’s efforts to get Randall in bed.

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The reunion points out how bad the LiB/Ultimatum production company is at editing shows that let us understand what the f-- is going on with these couples. 

Madelyn and Colby were so glowy and sweet and who the hell would have guessed that? I feel cheated that we got so little insight into the positive side of that relationship. Madelyn was edited like she hated him and just needed a push to break up with him, but clearly that was not true at all.

Jake and April clearly disintegrated, and the editing did not show that well. From the clips they showed  at the reunion, it sounded like their 3 weeks together were a nightmare. I actually feel for Jake. It seems like he fell into inertia with April and then had his world shaken when his friendship/proto-relationship with Rae made him realize how poorly things were working with April. I wonder if he and Rae may have actually worked if they'd had more space between their relationships. Hopefully, Jake will learn to be less passive in his life. 

I felt terrible for Rae. I also feel terrible for Zay. But Zay needs effective therapy to process the damage from his truly terrible childhood, and I think Rae got caught in that crossfire. I'm seeing a lot of confusion about Rae's explosion, but I understand how she felt having him hold her sexual energy against her while he was effectively cheating behind her back. It did seem like he was about to attack her when she melted down on him and cut him off. It sounded like Rae's not with her girlfriend any more, but I hope Rae is able to find a healthier relationship. I also hope Zay does as well.

Randall and Madelyn's trial marriage seems like it was more of a friendship with some sexual energy than the emotional entanglement that it was portrayed on the show. Both of them left it confirmed in their choice of original partner and seemingly without any true hesitations about it (but also without real negativity towards each other). I wish the show had been clearer about that. 

Edited by Zuleikha
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I had a hard time focusing on their relationship status during the reunion because most of them looked so bad.  Jake's hairstyle? No, it made him look pale & sickly. too much scalp showing. April & Shanique going blonde was a mistake for both.  Even Rae's wet look was a poor choice. I guess Madlyn & Colby win by default, they both looked better than they did originally.

For timing purposes, the show was filmed in Austin in March-April 2021 and the reunion was filmed in LA this February.

Edited by snarts
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Another editing fail was when the original couples started their three weeks, Jake dropped the bombshell that April was texting other guys during the trial marriage with other people and seemed super upset and angry about it. But during trial marriage, the editing showed us that Jake was practically in love with Rae and was barely thinking about April, much less upset about anything. Jake and Rae's story was about their super awesome chemistry and luv. So I was confused when Jake said that he was mad about April texting other people. Or else maybe he was just trying to cover his own guilt for having a connection with Rae? He seemed to really hate April. I'm not at the reunion yet, can't wait to see it.

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2 hours ago, snarts said:

For timing purposes, the show was filmed in Austin in March-April 2021 and the reunion was filmed in LA this February.

Thanks for the timeline. I was wondering about when Madlyn got pregnant when she said she was 7 months along and Jake claimed it had been six months since the show finished. Jake's sense of time is out of whack and Madlyn was probably not pregnant when she said yes to "never-my-fault" Colby.

Edited by NeenerNeener
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2 hours ago, KeeperOfTheIce said:

This show would have been a bit more interesting if the participants were older and in longer relationships.  Come on now.....23 year olds giving "ultimatums" to their partners of 2-3 years is crazy.  

I dunno if it's any more crazy than ultimatums inherently are. If you've spent nearly 10 percent of your life dating someone, it seems like that's enough information to decide whether you want to spend the rest of your life with them.

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6 hours ago, LeDucDiableBleu said:

Another editing fail was when the original couples started their three weeks, Jake dropped the bombshell that April was texting other guys during the trial marriage with other people and seemed super upset and angry about it. But during trial marriage, the editing showed us that Jake was practically in love with Rae and was barely thinking about April, much less upset about anything. Jake and Rae's story was about their super awesome chemistry and luv. So I was confused when Jake said that he was mad about April texting other people. Or else maybe he was just trying to cover his own guilt for having a connection with Rae? He seemed to really hate April. I'm not at the reunion yet, can't wait to see it.

I'm not sure what one thing has to do with the other. He never said he didn't have a strong connection with Rae. There was also history with April that couldn't disappear just because of chemistry. They can call people their ex all they want during the trial marriage. That's still there significant other. You won't be happy with your person hooking up with randos potentially. 

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16 hours ago, Zuleikha said:

The reunion points out how bad the LiB/Ultimatum production company is at editing shows that let us understand what the f-- is going on with these couples. 

Madelyn and Colby were so glowy and sweet and who the hell would have guessed that? I feel cheated that we got so little insight into the positive side of that relationship. Madelyn was edited like she hated him and just needed a push to break up with him, but clearly that was not true at all.

Jake and April clearly disintegrated, and the editing did not show that well. From the clips they showed  at the reunion, it sounded like their 3 weeks together were a nightmare. I actually feel for Jake. It seems like he fell into inertia with April and then had his world shaken when his friendship/proto-relationship with Rae made him realize how poorly things were working with April. I wonder if he and Rae may have actually worked if they'd had more space between their relationships. Hopefully, Jake will learn to be less passive in his life. 

I felt terrible for Rae. I also feel terrible for Zay. But Zay needs effective therapy to process the damage from his truly terrible childhood, and I think Rae got caught in that crossfire. I'm seeing a lot of confusion about Rae's explosion, but I understand how she felt having him hold her sexual energy against her while he was effectively cheating behind her back. It did seem like he was about to attack her when she melted down on him and cut him off. It sounded like Rae's not with her girlfriend any more, but I hope Rae is able to find a healthier relationship. I also hope Zay does as well.

Randall and Madelyn's trial marriage seems like it was more of a friendship with some sexual energy than the emotional entanglement that it was portrayed on the show. Both of them left it confirmed in their choice of original partner and seemingly without any true hesitations about it (but also without real negativity towards each other). I wish the show had been clearer about that. 

But what if the production company is deliberately doing a misdirect? If I had given my predictions a couple of episodes in, I probably would have guessed that only Randall and Shanique would get married. If they gave enough background that everyone would be able to accurately predict what happened it wouldn't be as fun.

Re: Madelyn/Colby, I'm trying to remember any time where Madelyn seemed like she did more than tolerate Colby and coming up blank. Now maybe that is a function of my having watched things at 1.5x speed, my sometimes spotty memory, a function of her having the hots for Randall/being upset about Colby's shadiness or something else. But I don't even remember a talking head or anything in which it seemed like she really wanted to be with him.

I think there was enough material broadcast to suggest Jake/April were not in it for the long haul. But they put in enough stuff to suggest that maybe Jake would propose. Maybe he was more ambivalent about that possibility rather than the "Hell no, I'm not proposing" attitude he seemed to have at the reunion. 

One of the things I feel cheated about is that the show didn't make clear how physical the various couples got.

It seems like Shanique and Zay "got physical" but does that mean that they just did the making out we saw on camera, scored multiple home runs or what? I think someone upthread said something about Colby and April hooking up, but did that happen? Jake and April apparently were sleeping together when they got back together, but what about the other couples?

What was actually done and the extent to which people forgave or didn't is an important part of the ultimatum.

Maybe things are very different with this generation, but I have to think that to a greater extent than was brought up, race mattered in some of these swaps. I cannot imagine Shanique didn't think that race didn't factor into jealousy of Madelyn, for example. 

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2 hours ago, Chicago Redshirt said:

But what if the production company is deliberately doing a misdirect?

It's not an interactive game show or a mystery. We're all different in what we watch for, but I want to have some idea of the actual story of what really happened. There was plenty of drama without needing to hide Madelyn's genuine love for Colby. 

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April does come off poorly but Jake looks like sour grapes to me, imo. If he was so in love with April, why did he fall for Rae and go so hard on the show? Why didn't he propose at the table like the other guys or at the end like Randall? Colby was clearly madly in love with Madlyn and he went through all the show shit, while Madlyn literally said that she didn't want to marry Colby, and after all was said and done he never wanted anyone else but Madlyn. And, if April is so bad, why isn't he happy to be free of her and dodged the bullet?

I'm applying some of my past experiences here, but I think Jake is competitive and immature. He wanted to "win" in their relationship and didn't want to give April the ultimate thing she wanted or else April would be the winner. He has this vibe like he wants to tear apart her character and punish her. "Everyone look how bad April is!" kind of deal. Even though she's a mess and annoying and the most high maintenance person I've ever seen in my life, I think she deserves to be with a guy who actually likes her. I'm probably reading too much into it but that's how I felt.

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