SATC vs AJLT: Compare & Contrast….what were they thinking?

[Scarlett45]

A place to compare and contrast the original Sex and the City  with the And Just Like That revival. 
 

 

[ifionlyknew]

They weren't thinking. That is the problem.

[PRgal]

SATC: YAY!

AJLT: NAY!

 

Final answer.

[Bookish Jen]

They certainly didn't think of hiring talented and competent writers. My cat could do a better job.

[RealHousewife]

SATC to AJLT = WTF

[PRgal]

3 hours ago, Bookish Jen said:

They certainly didn't think of hiring talented and competent writers. My cat could do a better job.

The writers are probably all high 

[Ms Blue Jay]

SATC Me:  I hate Steve!  I hate Steve!  Here's a 10 paragraph essay as to why!

AJLT Me:  I am passionately and vociferously defending Steve as if this is a court of law and I am his lawyer.

-----

SATC Me:  I don't know, I'm like 50% Samantha, 50% Miranda?  I'm Carrie in Season 2?  

AJLT Me:  Miranda is Satan!  Aliens have taken over Miranda's body!  Miranda is a nightmare! 

-----

SATC Charlotte:  I don't (whispers) go down on anybody.  For anything.  At any time.

AJLT Charlotte:  I just love blowing my big cocked husband Harry while all my kids are outside the door!

Edited January 22, 2022 by Ms Blue Jay

[Scarlett45]

My friend sent me this from Instagram and I thought it was perfect for this thread. 

[ifionlyknew]

1 hour ago, Scarlett45 said:

My friend sent me this from Instagram and I thought it was perfect for this thread. 

I'm having a  hard time thinking of a rom com that had the main character cheat on their spouse with no remorse whatsoever.

Even Carrie who cheated had remorse.  But Miranda is so self absorbed in what she wants she has no regard for how this affects anyone else.  

At first I thought Cynthia Nixon was playing Miranda as someone who was kinda manic perhaps because of the drinking and/or because she was doing something so far out of her comfort zone but now I get the feeling CN is playing  her that way because she thinks this is all good.  

I don't think I will ever be able to articulate clearly enough to describe how much I hate this story. But this comes close.

[Scarlett45]

1 hour ago, ifionlyknew said:

I'm having a  hard time thinking of a rom com that had the main character cheat on their spouse with no remorse whatsoever.

Even Carrie who cheated had remorse.  But Miranda is so self absorbed in what she wants she has no regard for how this affects anyone else.  

At first I thought Cynthia Nixon was playing Miranda as someone who was kinda manic perhaps because of the drinking and/or because she was doing something so far out of her comfort zone but now I get the feeling CN is playing  her that way because she thinks this is all good.  

I don't think I will ever be able to articulate clearly enough to describe how much I hate this story. But this comes close.

I know. Not a second of thought to how this would effect Steve- her husband and father of her child. Even when they were dating back in the SATC Season 2 days, Miranda wouldn’t have done anything intentionally to hurt Steve. When they broke up the second time, she realized it wasn’t working BUT thought about the fact that they lived together and she didn’t want Steve living in a shit hole even when they were broken up. 
 

She was so GIDDY when she said “I met someone.” Like gee golly Miranda!

[Ms Blue Jay]

That's so true.  When they weren't even dating - and Steve was dating someone else - Miranda gave him a roof over his head.

[Scarlett45]

27 minutes ago, Ms Blue Jay said:

That's so true.  When they weren't even dating - and Steve was dating someone else - Miranda gave him a roof over his head.

I know! Miranda wasn’t cruel. She has boundaries but she did try to be considerate of others. 
 

Not a SINGLE LINE about Steve or how he would feel. At least they allowed Steve as a character to keep his dignity. 
 

Chatting with my friend about this, she stated (and I agreed) that Miranda felt she married beneath her when she married Steve so she was extra incensed by his cheating, as in “you should be happy I am here, how dare you” (very similar to Charlotte’s little “do you know how lucky you are to have me” speech to Harry**). Steve was right- he was never good enough for her. Now Steve could be immature (hence his breakup with her in Season 2) but by the time they GOT MARRIED, Steve had his shit together. He owned a business, he was a responsible parent and dog dad- and she chose him! I want Steve to live his best life, eating ice cream and having another dog, and woman who wants him.

 

**but I think Charlotte grew more as a person and actually was sincere in her apology to Harry, especially when she said “you don’t ever have to marry me.”

[ifionlyknew]

11 minutes ago, Scarlett45 said:

Chatting with my friend about this, she stated (and I agreed) that Miranda felt she married beneath her when she married Steve so she was extra incensed by his cheating, as in “you should be happy I am here, how dare you”

I never thought they should have got married.  I never thought Miranda genuinely fell in love with Steve.  If not for Brady they wouldn't have ended up together.   But they did and it was what it was.  When Steve cheated (which I will forever think was just a plot contrivance to enable Miranda to have more time to be with the girls and also lazy writing because apparently it's so hard to write for a happy couple) his reason was he wasn't getting any at home.  Not defending that but when Miranda told the others how long it had been since they had sex you could see the shock on their faces.  So I do think Miranda thought she was the alpha in the marriage and she didn't necessarily have to work too hard at it.  

Edited January 24, 2022 by ifionlyknew

[Scarlett45]

34 minutes ago, ifionlyknew said:

I never thought they should have got married.  I never thought Miranda genuinely fell in love with Steve.  If not for Brady they wouldn't have ended up together.   But they did and it was what it was.  When Steve cheated (which I will forever think was just a plot contrivance to enable Miranda to have more time to be with the girls and also lazy writing because apparently it's so hard to write for a happy couple) his reason was he wasn't getting any at home.  Not defending that but when Miranda told the others how long it had been since they had sex you could see the shock on their faces.  So I do think Miranda thought she was the alpha in the marriage and she didn't necessarily have to work too hard at it.  

You and I are on the same page with that one. 
 

Miranda thought she was top dog (rather than a partnership)- which still doesn’t explain the 6month with no sex. She didn’t want to have sex for six months?? Excepting a medical issue or a forced absence (like for work) that makes no sense- she always said Steve was a good lover. SIX MONTHS??? And why did no one mention this when Miranda was going on and on about Che? Why not mention her and Steve’s last dry spell?? 
 

Again- the writing is POOR. 

[NotMySekrit2Tell]

One show sprang naturally from its moment. The other laboriously and self-consciously documents its moment. Guess which one was enjoyable? 

Of course there are things about SATC that haven't aged well. We don't need the writers of listicle sites to find them and rank them 1-10 for us, although I'm sure they have. Other TV comedies that "sprang naturally from their moment" have elements that haven't aged well too: I Love Lucy, All in the Family, Cheers, Friends. People are able to notice those things because they have enough fondness for the shows to revisit them many years after they stopped production. This is one problem I don't see in AJLT's future, whether it runs one season or six.

[ifionlyknew]

8 minutes ago, NotMySekrit2Tell said:

One show sprang naturally from its moment. The other laboriously and self-consciously documents its moment. Guess which one was enjoyable? 

That is it exactly.  This show wants so badly to be heralded as some bastion of wokeness that is has forgotten how to tell stories that are relevant to the characters.  

10 minutes ago, NotMySekrit2Tell said:

Of course there are things about SATC that haven't aged well. We don't need the writers of listicle sites to find them and rank them 1-10 for us, although I'm sure they have. Other TV comedies that "sprang naturally from their moment" have elements that haven't aged well too: I Love Lucy, All in the Family, Cheers, Friends. People are able to notice those things because they have enough fondness for the shows to revisit them many years after they stopped production. This is one problem I don't see in AJLT's future, whether it runs one season or six.

I'm not sure there is any show that doesn't have things that hasn't aged well.  I am re watching Facts of Life and even that has some things that make me cringe a little.  Does that mean the show is garbage?  No that means I am older and see and hear things differently.  I have made progress.  I don't think it's up to any show to lead us. I think it's up to the viewer to find their way.

[txhorns79]

2 hours ago, ifionlyknew said:

When Steve cheated (which I will forever think was just a plot contrivance to enable Miranda to have more time to be with the girls and also lazy writing because apparently it's so hard to write for a happy couple) his reason was he wasn't getting any at home.

I don't recall Steve saying he cheated because he wasn't getting any at home.  My thought was the lack of sex was just a symptom of larger problems between he and Miranda.  I think that kind of has repeated itself with AJLT.   

[RealHousewife]

3 hours ago, Scarlett45 said:

I know! Miranda wasn’t cruel. She has boundaries but she did try to be considerate of others. 
 

Not a SINGLE LINE about Steve or how he would feel. At least they allowed Steve as a character to keep his dignity. 
 

Chatting with my friend about this, she stated (and I agreed) that Miranda felt she married beneath her when she married Steve so she was extra incensed by his cheating, as in “you should be happy I am here, how dare you” (very similar to Charlotte’s little “do you know how lucky you are to have me” speech to Harry**). Steve was right- he was never good enough for her. Now Steve could be immature (hence his breakup with her in Season 2) but by the time they GOT MARRIED, Steve had his shit together. He owned a business, he was a responsible parent and dog dad- and she chose him! I want Steve to live his best life, eating ice cream and having another dog, and woman who wants him.

 

**but I think Charlotte grew more as a person and actually was sincere in her apology to Harry, especially when she said “you don’t ever have to marry me.”

Yes! Charlotte was like "I'm a pretty little princess! How dare you not have proposed to me by now when I'm clearly out of your league?!

Miranda's attitude was like "I'm an attorney with a lot of stress. You get what you get from me Steve. You're lucky to be with me in the first place."

Also with Miranda wanting more excitement now, when she wasn't meeting the other ladies to have meals together, wasn't she at home eating Chinese takeout during SATC? I don't recall her being adventurous. I guess there's that getting older crisis thing, but I wonder if they will address that Miranda appears to have changed in AJLT. 

[Ms Blue Jay]

19 minutes ago, RealHousewife said:

Also with Miranda wanting more excitement now, when she wasn't meeting the other ladies to have meals together, wasn't she at home eating Chinese takeout during SATC? I don't recall her being adventurous. I guess there's that getting older crisis thing, but I wonder if they will address that Miranda appears to have changed in AJLT. 

Yeah, Miranda was always a homebody and always had to be begged, coaxed by Carrie to come out.

That's why Miranda and Aidan are potential soulmates.  HA AH HA 

Steve was the one with the nightlife and Miranda was the one who had to get up at dawn!

Carrie dating somebody who owned a bar would be a lot of fun for her, but I don't know if she would deign to seriously commit to somebody as lowly as Steve.  LOL

Edited January 24, 2022 by Ms Blue Jay

[ifionlyknew]

1 hour ago, txhorns79 said:

I don't recall Steve saying he cheatineted because he wasn't getting any at home.  My thought was the lack of sex was just a symptom of larger problems between he and Miranda.  I think that kind of has repeated itself with AJLT.   

For me I thought that was the implication.

And you are right it seems to have happened again and this time it's Miranda who sought it elsewhere.  So why does she get to think she is in a rom com when she excoriated Steve for only straying once and not even emotionally investing in someone else like she has?

[Lethallyfab]

Having recently rewatched it, the original series benefits heavily from giving each episode a self-contained throughline tackling the issues - are we sluts? What constitutes cheating? Are twentysomething women friend or foe? - in a way that was mainly intended to be humorous with dashes of insight and self-reflection, that could switch to being serious if needed. Carrie’s voiceover tied it all together.

Now, everything is serialized and there’s no voiceover.  There are actual DRAMAS that try to tackle less but AJLT wants to let you know that it is NOT frivolous, damn it!  Now this is a SERIOUS show and we will tackle important things like alcoholism, non-binary gender representation, the dissolution of a marriage, etc. and we will UNDO every single criticism that was ever lobbed at the original show!

I think of things like Charlotte’s infertility and it stood out because it was a serious issue amongst the humor, (the baby cut-out!  I still can’t!) which made it more affecting, to me.

Now, Nya’s infertility is just another serious plotline that the show has to tackle in the most serious way possible.

Have the writers been replaced by SNL’s Debbie Downer?

For frick’s sake, the original show had an episode devoted to a subplot where Samantha worried that she was HIV+ and even *that* had the writers mining a few laughs from it.

[ifionlyknew]

4 minutes ago, Lethallyfab said:

 

 

For frick’s sake, the original show had an episode devoted to a subplot where Samantha worried that she was HIV+ and even *that* had the writers mining a few laughs from it.

I still literally laugh out loud whenever I watch that episode and Samantha starts to faint when the doctor asks to see her in that room.

They did tackle serious subjects and injected humor without minimalizing the seriousness of things. They also would show the heartbreak of things without it being too depressing.  Miranda’s mom dying and Charlotte's miscarriage come to mind.

AJLT doesn't do any of that. And honestly they aren't even trying.

[Ms Blue Jay]

17 minutes ago, Lethallyfab said:

Have the writers been replaced by SNL’s Debbie Downer?

For frick’s sake, the original show had an episode devoted to a subplot where Samantha worried that she was HIV+ and even *that* had the writers mining a few laughs from it.

That's very true.  I think I said earlier that the sex scenes on AJLT depress me and make me uncomfortable.  Whereas everything on SATC was light and comic enough that nothing bothered me.

Kim Cattrall is a genius.  One of the things she did was so easily ride the line between comedy and drama.  It's one of the genius things SATC accomplished as well. I never felt uncomfortable watching SATC.  

Edited January 24, 2022 by Ms Blue Jay

[RealHousewife]

32 minutes ago, Ms Blue Jay said:

That's very true.  I think I said earlier that the sex scenes on AJLT depress me and make me uncomfortable.  Whereas everything on SATC was light and comic enough that nothing bothered me.

Kim Cattrall is a genius.  One of the things she did was so easily ride the line between comedy and drama.  It's one of the genius things SATC accomplished as well. I never felt uncomfortable watching SATC.  

Kim is so talented. Playing someone like Samantha isn't easy. She made it look easy. 

[Scarlett45]

4 hours ago, txhorns79 said:

I don't recall Steve saying he cheated because he wasn't getting any at home.  My thought was the lack of sex was just a symptom of larger problems between he and Miranda.  I think that kind of has repeated itself with AJLT.   

Steve said he cheated, one time, with someone (so not a long term emotional affair first)- "you and I had not had sex in a really long time". I do think the lack of sex was a symptom of a problem between he and Miranda (because they always had great sex before they were married), but if I remember the timeline from the 1st movie, they hadn't had sex for 6 months, but Steve didn't get upset until they were having sex and she said "lets just get it over with" and THEN they didn't have sex again for a long time after that and he cheated.

 

3 hours ago, ifionlyknew said:

For me I thought that was the implication.

And you are right it seems to have happened again and this time it's Miranda who sought it elsewhere.  So why does she get to think she is in a rom com when she excoriated Steve for only straying once and not even emotionally investing in someone else like she has?

That is exactly what I have been saying! We are in agreement.

 

[Black Knight]

8 hours ago, Lethallyfab said:

Now, everything is serialized and there’s no voiceover.

I think this is a great point about TV shows in general; everything is serialized nowadays. So many books are now being adapted into TV shows where before they would have been movies, and of course awards always have tended to go to the serialized shows that packed more of a punch because storylines built over multiple episodes. Outside of pure network sitcoms, there is no such thing as a non-serialized show anymore.

I can understand, consequently, why AJLT chose to go in that direction. What else is there on HBO (or any other cable or streaming) anymore that's not serialized? Standalone is dying. But the execution...eh...

I think one of the other issues is a question of stakes. When SATC started, all four of the women were single. Charlotte and Miranda's marriages occurred late in the show. Samantha/Smith was also late in the series. SATC Carrie/Big did not have their happy ending until the series finale. It's easier to have standalone stories in such situations. Samantha/Smith broke up during the movies, but AJLT (foolishly, IMO) waited for the actual series to end two of the other marriages. Big/Carrie was acceptable because of death. But they should just have had Miranda/Steve be a divorced couple by the premiere. I know they didn't want to do that because it's more dramatic to actually show Miranda and Steve's dissolution and to have an affair and cheating thrown into it, but ugh. Obviously those of us who never liked Miranda/Steve 2.0 (manchild version) would have been fine with the divorce, and even Miranda/Steve fans might have admitted it wasn't implausible that eventually they decided to divorce at some point between the second movie and the start of AJLT. They were never a rock-solid couple. The closest to that in the SATC universe is Charlotte/Harry.

[Jillybean]

For me (close in age to the three remaining main characters), SATC had many relatable themes, plotlines, etc, while AJLT has none.

[Scarlett45]

3 minutes ago, Jillybean said:

For me (close in age to the three remaining main characters), SATC had many relatable themes, plotlines, etc, while AJLT has none.

I wonder why they aged down Brady and Lily? Is having college aged kids not interesting enough? I would’ve liked to see Miranda & Charlotte deal with the transition between parenting minor kids and trying to guide kids 18-21, and Rock would still be young enough for school related stories like with LTW. 
 

I know Carrie doesn’t have to worry about money in retirement, but why not have her focus more on her next book venture. If they wanted to do a podcast have her host her own. 
 

I didn’t mind the additions of the new ladies- LTW, Naya and Seema are all very different but could be really interesting if written better. 
 

Also more sex- I know Carrie has recently been widowed, but write something steamy for Miranda and Che (if we were going to have her cheat) not that trashy allude in the kitchen. Sara Rameriz is SEXY- they could’ve seduced Miranda and written some conflict. Remember when Miranda was seeing that super hot guy in season 2 (or maybe 3) who said she was sexy and she drank too much during the date- that was FUNNY.   

[ifionlyknew]

31 minutes ago, Scarlett45 said:

I know Carrie doesn’t have to worry about money in retirement, but why not have her focus more on her next book venture. If they wanted to do a podcast have her host her own. 

I think having Carrie do the podcast was just a way to introduce Che.

31 minutes ago, Scarlett45 said:

I wonder why they aged down Brady and Lily?

As so many others have said if they wanted to have Brady still living at home they could have just had him home from college because of Covid or it was cheaper than living in the dorms.  As for Lily I don't know what the writers were thinking.

31 minutes ago, Scarlett45 said:

I didn’t mind the additions of the new ladies- LTW, Naya and Seema are all very different but could be really interesting if written better. 

If I was writing this show I would have made LTW, Nya and Seema friends already but without Carrie, Charlotte and Miranda knowing that and have them just happen to all run into each other.   Honestly I think if LTW, Nya and Seema were friends I would rather watch them.

31 minutes ago, Scarlett45 said:

that was FUNNY.   

Funny has been hard to come by on this show.  I might have cracked a smile but I know I have not laughed out loud once watching any episode.

40 minutes ago, Jillybean said:

For me (close in age to the three remaining main characters), SATC had many relatable themes, plotlines, etc, while AJLT has none.

I'm also in their age range and on SATC I definitely related to Samantha and Miranda and Carrie on my worst days.  But on this show I don't find anything relatable.  

On 1/24/2022 at 11:58 PM, Black Knight said:

Obviously those of us who never liked Miranda/Steve 2.0 (manchild version) would have been fine with the divorce, and even Miranda/Steve fans might have admitted it wasn't implausible that eventually they decided to divorce at some point between the second movie and the start of AJLT. They were never a rock-solid couple.

As someone who never liked them together I find it plausible their marriage isn't working anymore.  It's just the way they have written it.  Miranda is spiraling but Steve doesn't see it. Miranda chooses to have an affair and only tells her husband when her lover says she has to.  So much of this could have happened before the show started.  Did we really need to see Miranda be such a hypocrite?  Even if she gets a giant dose of comeuppance her character is ruined for me.

On 1/24/2022 at 11:58 PM, Black Knight said:

The closest to that in the SATC universe is Charlotte/Harry.

If they ever broke them up I think that would be my deal breaker.  They have been my favorite couple since Harry proposed.

Edited January 26, 2022 by ifionlyknew

[PRgal]

On 1/26/2022 at 8:50 AM, Scarlett45 said:

I wonder why they aged down Brady and Lily? Is having college aged kids not interesting enough? I would’ve liked to see Miranda & Charlotte deal with the transition between parenting minor kids and trying to guide kids 18-21, and Rock would still be young enough for school related stories like with LTW. 
 

I know Carrie doesn’t have to worry about money in retirement, but why not have her focus more on her next book venture. If they wanted to do a podcast have her host her own. 
 

I didn’t mind the additions of the new ladies- LTW, Naya and Seema are all very different but could be really interesting if written better. 
 

Also more sex- I know Carrie has recently been widowed, but write something steamy for Miranda and Che (if we were going to have her cheat) not that trashy allude in the kitchen. Sara Rameriz is SEXY- they could’ve seduced Miranda and written some conflict. Remember when Miranda was seeing that super hot guy in season 2 (or maybe 3) who said she was sexy and she drank too much during the date- that was FUNNY.   

I don't think Lily was aged down that much - maybe a year or two.  She looked like she was under 1 when she was matched with Charlotte and Harry and that was 2004.  She should be around 18-19 and she's 17 on the show, I think.  Brady should be 20 and is now 17 (I don't get it.  Miranda upset at Brady smoking weed would still apply since you have to be 21 in New York.  Plus they were smoking indoors). 

[Scarlett45]

34 minutes ago, PRgal said:

I don't think Lily was aged down that much - maybe a year or two.  She looked like she was under 1 when she was matched with Charlotte and Harry and that was 2004.  She should be around 18-19 and she's 17 on the show, I think.  Brady should be 20 and is now 17 (I don't get it.  Miranda upset at Brady smoking weed would still apply since you have to be 21 in New York.  Plus they were smoking indoors). 

Charlotte said Lily was 15 in the last episode (when referencing the instagram account). If she was born in 2004 (the same year she was matched with her parents) she would be turning 18 this year, you're right, for some reason I assumed she would be 20 but I was thinking of Brady.

[Scarlett45]

@luna1122 and @Ms Blue Jay brought up that Nya is the Trey, and Andre is the Charlotte in “pursuing parenthood”. 
 

I never thought Trey was weird or selfish. Of course Charlotte was our main character and we were to sympathize with her, but she never lashed out at Trey or anything like that. All she said was that she didn’t feel she should have to give her dream of motherhood up (somewhat like Andre did).
 

Andre and Nya have been married a lot longer though which might change the dynamic between them. In the original series we had Samantha and Carrie be childfree, with Carrie being partnered and Samantha single. Seema is now our never  partnered, childfree character (which I dig), and I selfishly want childfree black people on my screen. 
 

I just feel bad for Nya in a way I did not feel for Trey. 

[RedHawk]

10 hours ago, Scarlett45 said:

Andre and Nya have been married a lot longer though which might change the dynamic between them. In the original series we had Samantha and Carrie be childfree, with Carrie being partnered and Samantha single. Seema is now our never  partnered, childfree character (which I dig), and I selfishly want childfree black people on my screen. 
 

I just feel bad for Nya in a way I did not feel for Trey. 

A spinoff show based on Nya and Andre would be cool. We'd learn about their background and education, how they met, what jobs they've had and more of their current careers, what their first years together were like, if they discussed being childfree at that time, how the previous IVF affected them, etc.

Being childfree by choice puts women in a situation that's relatable. They don't want children for reasons and that does cut down on the number of men (or women) they can pair with. The woman may want to focus on herself and/or her career and sees childrearing as a huge impediment to the life she wants to live. And sometimes a guy is all "Hey, you're enough for me, I don't need kids" in the early part of a relationship but as he gets older and his pals are becoming dads, then he wants them too. These characters intrigue me now, the only problem is that they're not integrated into the show. They're peripheral and yet they pop up with their deep issues, so it's jarring. 

[Scarlett45]

11 minutes ago, RedHawk said:

A spinoff show based on Nya and Andre would be cool. We'd learn about their background and education, how they met, what jobs they've had and more of their current careers, what their first years together were like, if they discussed being childfree at that time, how the previous IVF affected them, etc.

Being childfree by choice puts women in a situation that's relatable. They don't want children for reasons and that does cut down on the number of men (or women) they can pair with. The woman may want to focus on herself and/or her career and sees childrearing as a huge impediment to the life she wants to live. And sometimes a guy is all "Hey, you're enough for me, I don't need kids" in the early part of a relationship but as he gets older and his pals are becoming dads, then he wants them too. These characters intrigue me now, the only problem is that they're not integrated into the show. They're peripheral and yet they pop up with their deep issues, so it's jarring. 

I agree, they do not feel integrated. I like them, but its like I am watching a different show.

Perhaps I feel badly for Nya in a way I didn't feel for Trey because 1. the biological and social reality is that having children is a much greater investment for women than men (Nya was the one that went through the physical trials of IVF, Andre got to masturbate), and even if they adopt, socially child raising/care is still primarily a woman's responsibility, and 2. being a black female childfree lawyer myself, who is heterosexual (but not partnered or looking to partner) I can identify with Nya on a personal level.

I guess a part of me thought that even though Trey was disappointed the marriage didn't work out, he would be just fine emotionally at the end of the day (Charlotte I wasn't sure about), but life and statistics being what they are, if Nya and Andre break up because they cannot come to terms on this, Andre will be fine- he will meet a woman and have kids with her (either bio or adopted or using a sperm donor- I am not assuming their problems concevieing are due to Nya), but Nya is going to be BROKEN HEARTED. Again, for the record, I am not insinuating Andre is a bad person or a bad husband for wanting to be a father, but gosh darn it I feel for Nya here.

[ifionlyknew]

11 minutes ago, Scarlett45 said:

I am not insinuating Andre is a bad person or a bad husband for wanting to be a father, but gosh darn it I feel for Nya here.

Like you said if Andre doesn't have a child with Nya and it is something he really wants he can divorce her and have a child with someone else.  And Nya will be left to feel like it's her fault because everything is always a woman's fault.  

One thing I did appreciate about SATC is Samantha was unapologetically child free.  Carrie ended up being child free but I always got the vibe if she was a man who wanted a child she might have considered it.

I didn't have a problem with Miranda having Brady but I think a lot of women in her position would have chosen not to.

And I was brokenhearted when Charlotte had a miscarriage. Also brokenhearted when that couple told them they were keeping their baby.  Cried with her when she saw the pic of Lily and when she gave birth to Rose.

 

[Scarlett45]

18 minutes ago, ifionlyknew said:

Like you said if Andre doesn't have a child with Nya and it is something he really wants he can divorce her and have a child with someone else.  And Nya will be left to feel like it's her fault because everything is always a woman's fault.  

One thing I did appreciate about SATC is Samantha was unapologetically child free.  Carrie ended up being child free but I always got the vibe if she was a man who wanted a child she might have considered it.

I didn't have a problem with Miranda having Brady but I think a lot of women in her position would have chosen not to.

And I was brokenhearted when Charlotte had a miscarriage. Also brokenhearted when that couple told them they were keeping their baby.  Cried with her when she saw the pic of Lily and when she gave birth to Rose.

 

Me too, we are on the same page. (which often happens)

I think if Carrie had met Big when she was younger (and he had chosen her 5-10yrs earlier) and he had wanted a child she would've been game for 1 or 2 kids.

 

[Ms Blue Jay]

I admit I really really  like Andre and feel for him.  But he and Nya just can't work together.  Based on my knowledge of this couple, which IS UBER LIMITED.  They just need to break up.  

[ifionlyknew]

28 minutes ago, Ms Blue Jay said:

I admit I really really  like Andre and feel for him.  But he and Nya just can't work together.  Based on my knowledge of this couple, which IS UBER LIMITED.  They just need to break up.  

Well clearly that is what the writers are going to do. So then if there is a season two she will be single.  So why even have her be married this season?  Just so they can reference IVF and have tension between the two of them?  We don't know them well enough to care as much as I think they want us to. And why should we care when you are going to break them up anyways?

 

[RealHousewife]

I agree with everyone that while I have nothing against Nya or Andre, they do seem like they're on a totally different show. I'm also not a fan of their storyline to be honest. Nya isn't much younger than the OG cast and not particularly interested in having kids. The fertility storyline was more interesting when it involved a character we watched for years who was younger and desperately wanted a family. Not someone who can start menopause anytime and would only have a baby to please her husband. Andre seems quite sweet, but for right now, not too invested in the character. Maybe we need more scenes of them with the original three. I do think they will likely split up and will get another single character to watch date and whatnot. I'll probably enjoy Nya more at that point. I do like the scenes with her and Miranda, when they're not too cringe due to Miranda.

Che's actually grown on me. I guess I find their storyline more interesting because they're different from anyone we saw on SATC. When Miranda brought up not knowing the right adjective to describe Che, I actually cracked up. I keep wanting to describe Che as beautiful, but is that even appropriate? I do personally refer to both men and women beautiful, but I know some people solely describe women as beautiful. Still not a fan of how Miranda and Steve are being written though. I wish Che were a friend or at least written in a way that was more respectful of what Miranda and Steve had. I think Sara is a talented actor and can only do so much with the writing. I find kind of bad about all the hate they're getting. It can't feel good. Helpfully the money they're getting from their work on the show helps with that. 

I actually really enjoyed Charlotte this last episode. She felt like SATC Charlotte. She cracked me up when she was in the bathroom with Lilly. It is also nice getting more Lilly. I thought we might only get scenes with Rock.

I never hated Carrie as much as some others on here do, but AJLT Carrie is definitely more likable. SATC Carrie could be rather charming and likable, but she could also be quite annoying and horrible. We're getting Carrie at her best in AJLT. You can see her as a heroine. 

I feel like I would like the character of Lisa Todd. Just need more. Nicole is so beautiful, I never get over her face. It's a work of art. 

Continue to enjoy Anthony. No Samantha, no Big and no Stanford, it's nice seeing a familiar face, and he's so funny.  

I wish we'd get more Brady without him just being inappropriate or just kind of there. How does he feel about the shocking revelations regarding his mom? He was just a baby on SATC, and I feel like we barely know him now. The only child of a main character should really have more story on AJLT.

Edited January 28, 2022 by RealHousewife

[Cementhead]

2 hours ago, ifionlyknew said:

So why even have her be married this season?  Just so they can reference IVF and have tension between the two of them? 

Going by the caliber of writers we are dealing with and their laundry list of issues they are juggling to "fix the show," I think the answer is right there in your question. 

'New Character with a fertility problem.'  Box: ☑️ 

Viewers:  But why are we getting this story line again when we already went through it with Charlotte?

Writers:  Because we are talentless and lazy.

29 minutes ago, RealHousewife said:

Nya isn't much younger than the OG cast and not particularly interested in having kids. The fertility storyline was more interesting when it involved a character we watched for years who was younger and desperately wanted a family.

Exactly!

Edited January 28, 2022 by Cementhead

[RealHousewife]

5 hours ago, Ms Blue Jay said:

I admit I really really  like Andre and feel for him.  But he and Nya just can't work together.  Based on my knowledge of this couple, which IS UBER LIMITED.  They just need to break up.  

Agree. Nya needs to be with someone who's happy to live life as a duo. There are many men who do not want children. Andre needs to find someone on the same page regarding kids. There are many women who do want children. 

[RedHawk]

3 hours ago, RealHousewife said:

Agree. Nya needs to be with someone who's happy to live life as a duo. There are many men who do not want children. Andre needs to find someone on the same page regarding kids. There are many women who do want children. 

Double agree. It's heart-breakingly sad that Andre wants kids now after 15 years together, but that can and does happen. Life can throw a lot of curve balls at seemingly happy relationships. Nya doesn't want to try again and is relieved that she didn't get pregnant, for many valid reasons. Andre feels the yearning and it's kind of a biological thing he can't and doesn't want to deny. It truly sucks that it likely means the end of the marriage, but he should have his chance to fulfill that need. I don't think Nya wants to be a mom at all, so adoption is not the answer.  I do wonder where they'll go with this, although I wish they had their own show and weren't stuck as peripherals in this mess.

[Surrealist]

On 1/24/2022 at 2:48 PM, ifionlyknew said:

They did tackle serious subjects and injected humor without minimalizing the seriousness of things. They also would show the heartbreak of things without it being too depressing.  Miranda’s mom dying and Charlotte's miscarriage come to mind.

They also did this when Samantha was diagnosed with breast cancer.

[Baltimore Betty]

All this talk about Nya not wanting to have a baby and her husband does want one...how are we not talking about that horrible royal blue wicker hat he had on, talk about birth control.

 

[Scarlett45]

Quoting @RedHawk from the episode thread:

Quote

Charlotte was putting a lot of pressure on a man who'd only recently been able to have actual sex with her. And I was never convinced that Charlotte really had a yearning for a child, something deep down, unlike Andre whose paternal instinct is kicking in hard. You can see he wants and maybe needs to be a father. 

I disagree with this. As I said before, I never thought Trey was “bad guy”, but when he and Charlotte got married parenthood was something they both wanted. Trey had every right to change his mind (especially when it wasn’t simply going to be “have sex, ~40 weeks later baby”) but I really think Charlotte’s desire for children/motherhood was genuine. And she and Trey both wanted this when they got married, it’s good Trey was as honest with her as he was, because I could’ve seen him being cowardly and stringing her along another 5yrs with her hoping every month to be pregnant. 
 

She told Harry about her issues immediately and got that out on the table before they got serious. And I think if someone goes through the trouble of the financial/emotional work of adopting a child from another ethnic group- they actually WANT to be parents.** It’s not about their “super special DNA”, it’s not about “image”, it’s about getting to love and nurture a child who doesn’t have a home. 

With Nya and Andre it’s different- they’ve been together a long time, from what I gather they agreed on no kids at first, and Nya went through TWO rounds of IVF for him (again that was physical work for her, he got to masturbate). I think if Andre isn’t happy with no kids he has every right to leave just like Trey did, but my heart will break for Nya more than it did for Charlotte in the same situation for the reasons I stayed up thread.

Side note- I think a lot of hetero women value motherhood a lot more than being partnered with a man. From what I have seen, the man is a way to give them the child(ren) they want and get these children raised (assisting in the financial, physical and emotional work of raising the children). How many hetero women seem to have no more interest in men when their children are grown? Again- there’s nothing wrong with that, but I think it’s something people aren’t very transparent about. 
 

**of course there are evil twisted people out there, I’m talking about “regular people”. 

[ifionlyknew]

55 minutes ago, Scarlett45 said:

I was 

Side note- I think a lot of hetero women value motherhood a lot more than being partnered with a man. From what I have seen, the man is a way to give them the child(ren) they want and get these children raised (assisting in the financial, physical and emotional work of raising the children). How many hetero women seem to have no more interest in men when their children are grown? Again- there’s nothing wrong with that, but I think it’s something people aren’t very transparent about. 
 

**of course there are evil twisted people out there, I’m talking about “regular people”. 

I was a single mother for the first six years of my son's life.  Mostly by circumstance but not entirely unexpected.   I wanted a child and the man I was with said he did as well.  But then he decided he didn't want to be around so he wasn't around.  If I hadn't thought i can do this on my own I never would have gotten pregnant.

I do not think Charlotte would have ever gotten pregnant or even adopted a child if she wasn't married.   I do think she had always wanted a child but more for her belief that her family was going to be her a husband and kids and less an overpowering maternal urge.

[RedHawk]

1 hour ago, Scarlett45 said:

Quoting @RedHawk from the episode thread:

I disagree with this. As I said before, I never thought Trey was “bad guy”, but when he and Charlotte got married parenthood was something they both wanted. Trey had every right to change his mind (especially when it wasn’t simply going to be “have sex, ~40 weeks later baby”) but I really think Charlotte’s desire for children/motherhood was genuine. And she and Trey both wanted this when they got married, it’s good Trey was as honest with her as he was, because I could’ve seen him being cowardly and stringing her along another 5yrs with her hoping every month to be pregnant. 
 

She told Harry about her issues immediately and got that out on the table before they got serious. And I think if someone goes through the trouble of the financial/emotional work of adopting a child from another ethnic group- they actually WANT to be parents.** It’s not about their “super special DNA”, it’s not about “image”, it’s about getting to love and nurture a child who doesn’t have a home. 

With Nya and Andre it’s different- they’ve been together a long time, from what I gather they agreed on no kids at first, and Nya went through TWO rounds of IVF for him (again that was physical work for her, he got to masturbate). I think if Andre isn’t happy with no kids he has every right to leave just like Trey did, but my heart will break for Nya more than it did for Charlotte in the same situation for the reasons I stayed up thread.

Side note- I think a lot of hetero women value motherhood a lot more than being partnered with a man. From what I have seen, the man is a way to give them the child(ren) they want and get these children raised (assisting in the financial, physical and emotional work of raising the children). How many hetero women seem to have no more interest in men when their children are grown? Again- there’s nothing wrong with that, but I think it’s something people aren’t very transparent about. 
 

**of course there are evil twisted people out there, I’m talking about “regular people”. 

I'm cool with your disagreement. It's been a long time since I've watched the Trey and Charlotte episodes so my memories are more like vague impressions.

I also will feel much more sadness for Nya if they break up over this issue.

As an older woman I do agree with your Side Note. I've known several women who pushed their husbands away after having children, and it wasn't because the men "didn't help" by doing their share of childcare or household chores. Never liked seeing that.

[Scarlett45]

9 minutes ago, ifionlyknew said:

I do not think Charlotte would have ever gotten pregnant or even adopted a child if she wasn't married.   I do think she had always wanted a child but more for her belief that her family was going to be her a husband and kids and less an overpowering maternal urge.

Interesting theory. Kinda bringing what you were saying earlier @RedHawk.

I think if Charlotte had hit 40-42 and wasn’t partnered she may have adopted as a single woman. I could also see her marrying and older guy with kids and being THE BEST STEP MOM ever. When she and Trey divorced she was ONLY 34 (felt old for her but not that old). Nya and Andre are in their late 30s/early 40s? (Karen Pittman- Nya, is only 35, she just has a mature face). 

[RedHawk]

1 hour ago, Scarlett45 said:

Interesting theory. Kinda bringing what you were saying earlier @RedHawk.

I think if Charlotte had hit 40-42 and wasn’t partnered she may have adopted as a single woman. I could also see her marrying and older guy with kids and being THE BEST STEP MOM ever. When she and Trey divorced she was ONLY 34 (felt old for her but not that old). Nya and Andre are in their late 30s/early 40s? (Karen Pittman- Nya, is only 35, she just has a mature face). 

I thought Nya looked younger than she is maybe supposed to be on the show, which is in her early to mid 40s? I was guessing that Andre is in his late 30s. For all the shouting out of ages for the main characters, I don't think the ages of either of these has been stated. It seems like Nya is supposed to be about 10-12 years younger than Miranda, who is 55, if you hadn't heard.

Edited January 29, 2022 by RedHawk

[TooMuchRealityTV]

9 minutes ago, RedHawk said:

I thought Nya looked younger than she is maybe supposed to be on the show, which is in her early to mid 40s? I was guessing that Andre is in his late 30s. For all the shouting out of ages for the main characters, I don't think the ages of either of these has been stated. It seems like Nya is supposed to be about 10-12 years younger than Miranda, who is 55, if you hadn't heard.

I wish the show had been more clear about Nya's age. I was assuming she was in her early to mid 40s. They stopped doing IVF, but still tried on their own a few episodes ago. That seemed like a hint that she was younger than Miranda. (Yes, some women do get pregnant doing IVF at 50, but it usually takes donor eggs. Very, very unlikely to happen on their own.)

If they are 35-ish and Andre seems to have changed his mind and now wants kids. That would not be all that unusual in my opinion. He may be ready to settle down and have a family. It happens. I don't think 35 is an unusual age for that change to happen. Some people focus on their careers or relationships when they are younger, and only think about kids as they approach 40.

It also happens that some people just aren't all that interested in having kids. It's not something that will ever change. And that's more than okay as well.

I don't see these two as compatible anymore. It's unfortunate.